 Felly, roeddwn i ymddangos i'r gweithio ar y Cymru. Felly, wrth gwrs, fel y ddechrau o'r Cymru o'r Cymru oedd 2021 oed yn fwy o phwy o'r 22 yma. Byddi'r cyacio wrth gyda'ch rymogol, o fe wnaeth yma mae Gweithiau a oedden nhw. Mae wneud yma yma ysgol Llanichtsredinol a'r Cymru o'r Cymru o'r Cymru o'r Cymru. Efallai yma, mae gwylenderydd cysylltu am gymuned cysylltu Peta Ffeyr. Bydd fydd wedi bod ni'n bwysig o gilydd symud o dromwg.ethon ni'n ei ddweud ffrifoedd eich falch ddo fallyll iawn. Mae'r cwest tablesau oherwydd werth i'ch cwmddysau'r gweithio'r cwest, ei ddaeth yn gweld yn cymaint o'r mi. Mae'r cwest tablesau oherwydd werth i'ch cwest fel yr eich d widthio, mae'r cwest tableau i ceisio ar gyfer gweld'r cwest teimlo ac dyma. A wedi gweld yn cyddiadisiau'r cwest tableau, ddweud hynny oherwydd i'ch cyddiad iawn i'ch cymaint ar gyfer gweld. Mae'r gweithiau sydd chi yn ei ddweud yn gweld yn cwmddysau'r cwest, yn ddiddordeb i'w mêl daeth, mae'n homo'r cyflwystechol am y cheimlo maeth yn f restrafio ddau sydd wedi'u cyfewdd yna hwn i'w wneud yn dweud oraz yn ddiddordeb i ddiddordeb i'w mêl ddiddordeb i'w ddiddordeb i'w ddiddordeb i'w ddiddordeb i wneud am y gweithreith i ddiddordeb i ddiddordeb i ddiddordeb i wneud i ddiddordeb i wneud, oherwydd sy'n bwysig yn ein cyfleu bod yr amlwg gweithio. y cwmplec yma hwn o'n dweud yr dysgu llyfr yn y blaen iawn. Felly, yma yma ydych chi'n gweithio ar y ddweud ac mae hynny'n gweithio o'r eich ddweud. Mae'n ddweud bod y bobl yn dal. Mae'r gweithio ar y cael ei ddefnyddio'n gweithio'i ddweud o'r ddweud o'n ddweud o'r ddweud. Mae'r ddweud o ddweud o'r gweithio ar y gweithio. Felly oedd ymwneud eich tuad â'r gyda'r gyflwrau ac mae'n ei hunain. Yn gyffin i, mae'n hollegiaeth gwahanol. Maen nhw'n hollegiaeth yn ymdweud? Maen nhw'n hollegiaeth yn hollegiaeth gwahanol rhywbeth yma ar y cwynselyd Ysgolwyr Michael Atkins, Henry Batsula, Paul Berthrack, Sarah Tryn Johnson, Libby Earle, Bill Handley, Alex Mallion, and Councillor Bridget Smith. Thank you. Thank you. I understand we may also have apologies from members in your group. So Mark Howell, and also from our group, I understand Will Jackson Wood. Aidan? Annika Osborne as well. Annika Osborne as well. Annika Osborne, okay. If I may check, Councillor Bill Handley is online, but he's having trouble with his audio, so he just sent a message in the chat. And also, I understood that Councillor Libby Earle was likely to be taking part online. Can I just check if Libby Earle is online? Nope, doesn't sound like it, not at the moment. Okay. Item two is declarations of interest. So, do any members have interest to declare in relation to any item of business on this agenda? If an interest is subsequently becomes apparent later on in the meeting, please, would you raise us at that point? Would anybody got any interest at the moment? Councillor Heather Williams. Thank you, Chair. In relation to the item on the GCP item 13, I sit on the Greater Cambridge Partnership Assembly. And item three, standing item, register of interest. This is important, members, as your responsibilities change. Please, may I remind members that you need to keep your register of interest up to date and that you should inform democratic services of any changes. Thank you. So, item four is the minutes, which are on pages one to ten of our agenda papers. Members are asked to approve the minutes of the meeting of the council held on the 21st of July, 2022. Can I just clarify if we're happy to approve or would you like me to go through them page by page? Are there any amendments that members wish to make? No, I can't see any hands. So, members, are we happy to approve these minutes by affirmation? Sorry, yes. I'm happy to second the minutes. Thank you very much. Okay, thank you. So, having had that approval by affirmation seconded by Judith, can we just formally confirm that we do approve the minutes by affirmation? Thank you very much. Okay. And anybody wishing to vote against that? Or abstain? No. Okay. So, the council therefore agrees the approval of the minutes of the 21st of July 2022 as a correct record by affirmation. Thank you. Item five is the announcements. The first one is that I would like to announce finally my chair's charity. Apologies for the delay members. Somebody may suggest that they should all turn their phone phones on and ring each other to maximise the income to my benevolent fund. I'm going to choose the trust or trust again. Members will remember, older members will remember that ex-councillor Delacy, past chairman Delacy, chose the trust or trust. I'm happy to do the same again this year because we know that residents are suffering, facing such anxiety with regard to the cost of living, cost of fuel and providing their families with food. And I note just one item of data. May 2022, the Cambridge Food Bank provided 1,205 people with an emergency food parcel just in May this year. So, that's my trust, my charity for this year. And remember, members, if you want to pay into that, I must obtain for you the sort code and account number from accounts, but I can do so very quickly and I'll send it to you by email. Thank you. Right. Deputy Leader, do you have any items to announce? Okay. Thank you. I have some really exciting news and I'm sure you all wish Michael Atkins, Councillor Michael Atkins and his wife, Becky. Congratulations and the best wishes. Their daughter was born on Friday, just gone, and she's called Lucy Elizabeth. Are there any announcements from members of the cabinet? Can't see any. Head of paid service? Nope. Okay. So, members, there is a public speaker waiting to speak to us today, Councillor David Sargent, who is a Member of the Parish Council at West Wickham, who will be, sorry, should I say he was part of the neighbourhood planning team, who will make a statement in relation to the item on the making of the West Wickham neighbourhood plan. And as has been our practice on previous occasions, it would appear appropriate to hear his statement at the point when we consider the item on the neighbourhood plan. And accordingly, I propose that we move the order of business on the agenda such that we allow item nine to be considered immediately after item six, which is public speaking. So, may I now call for a seconder to that? Councillor Hawkins, I think I do second that. Thank you. Thank you so much. Does anybody wish to vote against that change of the agenda? Good. Okay. And anybody wish to abstain? Thank you. So, we agree that motion to move the position on the agenda. Thank you very much. So, item six is questions from the public. We have two public speakers, and there is a question from Mr Daniel Clarke and the statement to be made by Councillor Dave Sargent on behalf of West Wickham Parish Council. And details of these can be found in the second supplement agenda pack, which was issued to us on the 16th of September, I believe. So, is Mr Clarke present in the room, or is he online? Mr Clarke, Daniel Clarke, are you online? You may be muted because we can't hear you. Hello. Ah, hello. Hello. Is that Daniel Clarke? It is, yes. Sorry, I'm sitting in a lay-by, so I apologize. You're in a lay-by? One doesn't matter. You're a wee bit quiet, so if you could speak louder. Is that a bit louder? That's better, thank you. So, Mr Clarke, I hope you're safe in your lay-by. Would you like to ask your question? Yes, please, thank you. Thank you, Chair, for taking the question. Thank you. My question is about four-day working week trial. I'm mindful that the council has its own language and words, and I've read various documents, and I might use different words and phrases which are not council speak, but hopefully my question will make sense. I guess if the public sees anything about the scheme, it's via local newspapers and public messaging, neither of which really disclose a great deal, hence my questions, as this is a huge moment for any employer, particularly for one that's got legal service responsibilities. As the Chair would know, another in attendance might not know, I submitted a number of questions about the scheme. I'm grateful that a democratic service manager, I think I've got that title right, has passed the full list on to officers for them to reply, which is fair enough, and I appreciate these replies are not made public, but I don't mind if they are. I fully accept that staffing is a huge issue, and that sitting still is not the answer, and I applaud the council to actually start thinking differently. I might have a slightly different opinion on what the answer could be, but I'm not party to the inner workings and pressures of Falcans, although I think I'm probably right in framing the scheme, part of the issue is dealing with your equality elements of your pay scale. Would you like to get on with your question, please? I'm almost there. The premise of the trial is to attract and retain staff, and I do get that. My first question is, does the four-day week apply to all desk-based admin staff, including the chief executive, section 151 officer, and other senior team members? Thank you, Mr Clarke. So, that question needs to go to the Deputy Leader. Thank you. Thank you, Mr Clarke, for your question. The four-day working week is in the process of planning currently, and will be trialled, as you've mentioned, for office-based staff only in the first instance from January to March next year, and that is from the full range of office-based staff. Much of their work goes way beyond admin tasks, but it's principally work that is carried out out of desk. As a council and as a picture nationally, we are facing difficulties in recruitment and retention, which means we are spending £2 million a year on 23 full-time or equivalent agency workers to fill gaps where possible. Clearly this is not ideal, not efficient, and we have to pay the agency fees, and also this cannot always provide the continuity of service that we believe is important in serving our residents. To do nothing and not to trial this innovative approach is not an option. We live in an area with high employment levels where housing is expensive and cannot compete with the private sector on salaries. That Cambridgeshire District Council has to offer something different to attract more permanent staff. Importantly, if those 23 positions were filled by our own employees rather than agency workers, that would cost the council £1 million less, which would mean that extra million could go towards grants and services to support our residents in the difficult times ahead. Thank you, Deputy Leader. Mr Clark, do you have a supplementary question? I do, thank you for that. We could spend a long time arguing over the million quid and other things, but I have read all the documents that are available, and obviously the outcome of the trial is to reduce the actual working time for each employee. I understand that, but I'm commenting on the output side. This is what the service user sees, is what I see. So by default, the trial reduces the total resource available to be applied to each service. In simple terms, if you're a planning officer and you have four-stand days instead of five-stand days. So my follow-up question is, of course I want the scheme to work. I'm not commenting on trial length, I'm not commenting on the effective 20% pay rise for three months. I'm not commenting on the impact you have on other councils and services. I'm not commenting on the inconsistencies in the announcement. My follow-up is to cover the output as experienced by a resident. So my guess is the amount of council work staff will face will not decrease by 20% over such a short period. Either the resource will need to generate an increase in productivity, or users of the service will have to accept a slow response, or some services will not be serviced at all. So my question is, with the same unambiguous confidence that the council said there will be no financial cost implications of this scheme, can the council confirm that there will be no drop-in service outcomes as experienced by residents across all services having reduced the resource to provide those services by 20%? Thank you very much Mr Clarke. That's the deputy leader. I think I've caught the gist of your question, if not every single word. This is a trial, as I've said, and there will not be a drop. If there is a drop, this will not go ahead. It's going to be carefully monitored by key performance indicators, which we use as a method to analyse the performance of the council. The hope is that it will actually increase the productivity because I've been able to work more efficiently and also with happier, more better health and well-being that always puts out a better product in the end, and that's the idea behind it. So not endless hours of work but more productive hours of work. The whole premise of the scheme is 100% of the work in 80% of the time, 100% of the pay. This has been monitored extremely carefully by officers, and I'm quite sure my colleague on Cabinet, Peter McDonald, will be looking very closely at those key performance indicators in the initial trial. Thank you. Thank you very much, Deputy Leader. Thank you for your questions, Mr Clark. So moving on, then, as we agreed to item nine, which is the proposed making of the Westwickam Neighbourhood Plan, this is on pages 19 to 122 in our agenda pack. Is now exiting. Thank you. I believe Mr Sargent is attending in person. Good afternoon. Yes, thank you. Oh, great. Thank you. So, Mr Sargent, Councillor Sargent, may I ask you to make your statement, please? Good afternoon. On behalf of Westwickam Parish Council, we obviously welcome the adoption of our Neighbourhood Plan. We think its policies will help to ensure that future development in Westwickam meets the needs of the community, is environmentally sustainable, and protects the character of the parish. Developing our plan has taken countless hours of volunteer time, and they gave their time freely and enthusiastically, and the parish council is enormously grateful to them. We also benefited from the broad engagement of the wider community, and it's clear that our parishion has cared very deeply about where they live, and they are very thoughtful in the complicated issues that face planning decisions in very small villages like ours. We have been very well supported while we've been developing our plan, not only by our district councillor, but also by the officers in the planning policy team at the shared planning service. I'd particularly like to express my thanks to Alison Torkington, who's worked with us from right from 2015 until her recent retirement, and she continually gave us enormous levels of support and technical assistance. Our plan gained over 90% support at referendum from those that voted, and fundamentally that's because it was able to offer a vision for the future of the village that matches what people want. We were only able to achieve that in our plan because the local plan has a sustainable vision for the very smallest villages in the district. So we really look forward to seeing a new local plan emerge compatible and continues to work well with our neighbour plan over the next decade by continuing that theme of sustainability really at the core of the very smallest parishes. Thank you. Thank you very much indeed councillor sergeant and for all your hard work. So councillor Dr Tumi Hawkins, I believe he's going to present the report and move the recommendation. Yes, thank you very much chair. Just to say today in my view is another good day in the journey of neighbourhood plan making in South Cambridgeshire district. We have so far made five neighbourhood plans and today we have the pleasure of bringing forward hopefully the sixth. You have heard councillor sergeant talk about some of the journey getting to this stage and I want to thank him and all the members of the working group and those who took part in it to get it to this stage. There's a lot of hard work when we bear in mind that West Wickham was designated as a neighbourhood area way back in November 2015 and of course following all the work that we've done it came back to us in December 2021 for the formal adoption stage to start. And I think you see from the report that the referendum that was held on the 11th of August had a turnout of 30% of the residents. Which is good. And a resounding 91.59% voted for it. Which was even I think higher than the last one that we did. And since we had to adopt the plan within eight weeks of the referendum it's why it's coming to you today. And mostly I was quite impressed with the vision that was expressed in the neighbourhood plan and I'll refer you to page 43 of our report of our papers. Which summarises it as the ambition to enhance the lives of the current and future residents by protecting the rural character of the parish, the balance of built, natural landscapes and its diverse wildlife and tranquility. And of course this vision is underpinned by two objectives. The first one is to protect and enhance the natural and historic environment of the parish. And the parish is one of those beautiful linear settlements that's along the range and it's got slopes down the side. So yeah, has its own unique facilities there. And that particular objective is being supported by eight out of the eleven policies so it's quite important. And the second objective aims to sustain a diverse and thriving community with policies that support and facilitate improvements in the provision of community facilities and to deliver a housing mix that meets the need of Westwicken. And I think those are for smaller units as well. Just one thing that I wanted to highlight actually is the policy WWK Stroke 6. Which states that development proposals which include external lighting will only be permitted if the night sky is protected from light pollution. And this is to allow new development to be in keeping with the only nature of the village and protect it and protect the tunnel wildlife. So again, it's not just the character it's also biodiversity. I mean, I always learn something new with each of the neighbourhood plans that we've adopted and this is no different and it's why our district I think is one of the most survival places in the country. So on the plans once they're made which is the word for adopting it I don't know why that is it becomes a part of our adopted local plan and carries statutory planning weight when it comes to decision making on applications that come forward in that area. And this today if we adopt it will help us and our development teams work in future on applications in Westwicken. Now at this stage I wish to acknowledge and thank Alison Torkenton who's been the planning policy officer responsible for neighbourhood plans for as long as I can remember she retired last month. We're going to miss her but just to say the work the excellent work that she's doing is carrying on being done by members of the planning policy team. So at this point chair I heartily move the recommendations in paragraph 4a and 4b on page 19 of our agenda papers and ask members present to please fully support the making today of the Westwicken neighbourhood plan. Thank you. Thank you very much councillor Dr Tina Hawkins. May I call for a seconder? I would second, thank you. councillor Jeff Harvey Would you like to speak now or reserve your right to speak? Yes I'm speaking now if I may. Thank you. Well this report runs to more than 90 pages and I think it's just a beautifully presented report apart from anything else in terms of its contents and of course it has to be very carefully constructed because I think the way it meshes with the local plan takes a local plan forward and also down to a local level is sort of testament for why the neighbourhood plan process is such a good one and because of the amount of work involved it really has taken a huge time and commitment from also to be by councillor Hawkins to talk about all the input that's come from our officers I'd like to talk a bit about all of the commitment over a huge period of time from residents in Westwickham but I'd like to say thank you to Dave Sargent who's here this evening and as councillor I've witnessed his monthly updates on the progress of the neighbourhood plan and all of the hurdles and procedural process that has had to go through and over that period the others probably I should mention also Trevor Hall previously also Janet and Andrew Moorish perhaps councillor Alex Shulunberg and before him but for a large part of this process and I think it's just a fantastic piece of work and I want to congratulate all the residents of Westwickham on this, thank you Thank you very much councillor Harvey so having been moved and seconded we're open for debate if anybody else would like to raise please raise your hands but if I understand councillor Heather Williams would like to speak Thank you chair very brief I think congratulations to everybody that's done all the work on this all we have to do today is just say agreed I think so I think the honour should be with those involved in it very much though and I'm sure all planning committee members are looking forward to using and applying it and actually a thanks from us on planning committee help if we have a steer from the local community in such a way that we can lean on and give weight I believe chair is what we'd be told to do so thank you for making our lives a bit easier actually Thank you very much councillor Heather Williams so I also would like to congratulate all those people who've worked hard in the village of Westwickham for producing this neighbourhood plan and let's move to sorry because I know how much work it is in my own village in my own ward they take years to do and a lot of commitment from people who give their time freely so thank you very much to everybody so can we take this by affirmation or do we need to go to a vote affirmation agreed is anybody wishing to vote say against or abstain no okay great so with that then I note that we have accepted and approved the that we make the Westwickham neighbourhood plan thank you very much for attending Mr Sargent that's great okay so with that happy move we move on to item 7 which is petitions and no petitions have been received so item 8a is on page 11 of our agenda back to page 11 folks which is the 2021 provisional housing revenue account out term and may I call this is the recommendation of the 12th of September 2022 and may I call on councillor John Williams the lead cabinet member for finance to present the report and move the recommendation so councillor John Williams thank you chair I'd like to remove this report it's the annual report on the HRA revenue and capital account and I will draw members attention to the table on page 12 which gives the revenue account against the budget and as you can see there is a slight difference but by and large it was on budget and then if you look at table on page 13 that gives the capital out term and as you can see there was some slippage and some 2.7 million variation due to slippage and that was mainly down to strawberry farm Great Abingdon which is there in our housing programme and unfortunately the contract was not agreed as expected so that has slipped into the next financial year but otherwise a very satisfactory situation and I do hope the council will approve it thank you very much councillor John Williams may I call for a seconder thank you councillor John Bachelor would you like to speak now yes I'll speak now please thank you councillor thank you very much thank you John that was all good news a budget surplus I'd like to stress so the access of £2 million and the point I'd like to make there this is the account for £21.22 and it's against the background of all the challenges of Covid so I think this is to get so close to our budget out turn is a compliment to all the stuff involved in that I'd also like to make the point that the budget for housing is met exclusively from the rental income so new build the repairs the repayment of debt all these things are met through rents exclusively and this again is a huge achievement and I think we should all note that a particular achievement I think was the maintenance of our new build projects even with Covid and with a number of the projects running over into £22.23 is still achieved a record £89 completions this is well done to Kirstyam Donaldson and her team who have delivered for us in very challenging circumstances so thank you to them thank you Lee thank you very much councillor John bachelor it has been drawn to my attention that there is a correction that we just need to note in paragraph 14 thank you councillor Carla Hoffman for this in fact it refers to external wall insulation at Musgrave Way in Tewisham but Musgrave Way is in fact in Fenditon so we just need to correct that I know that because it's in my ward and I planted our jubilee tree there so if we could just change Tewisham to Fenditon thank you so can we open for debate then would anybody like to speak on this oh only me then with no requests to discuss then can I suggest that we're content to take this decision by affirmation and does anybody wish to vote against that proposal or abstain so therefore this council agrees this motion by affirmation thank you very much members so I note with pleasure that councillor Susan van der Ben has just been able to join the meeting and I just wanted to ask you councillor van der Ben if you have any interest to declare in any items on the agenda no okay if anything occurs to you later do say right so the next item on the agenda is item 10 which is appointment to the declaration panel and this came in the supplement that was issued on the 16th of September good afternoon so thank you can I just call upon the chief I was just getting my paperwork sorted out so it's on the supplementary agenda pack pages 1 to 12 and thank you Peter I'm delighted to call upon you chief finance officer Peter Maddock to present the report thank you Peter thank you so the report itself recommends the appointment for a three year term from the first of October 2022 of two members to the independent remuneration panel the regulations that govern this require that the council establish a panel of at least three members and traditionally we have had three members and the purpose of the panel is to make recommendations in respect of members' allowances and the council has a duty on it to have regard for those recommendations that are made the current chair Graham Jagger his term is due to expire at the end of this month and he notified us a few weeks back that he was unable to seek renewal of his term the current allowance scheme that we have in place actually ran out at the end of the last financial year so it is actually necessary for a full review to be undertaken this year and preferably as soon as we possibly can so in order for us to be able to move ahead with that as quickly as possible we carried out a short notice recruitment exercise and that was to replace the vacancy that has arisen so those interviews were carried out week commencing the 12th of September and there were three candidates that were interviewed and of the three two of those were suitable and it was felt that in order to increase the resilience and capacity and the fact that time was of the essence in relation to the review it would be best to appoint both members to the panel for the reasons that I've just stated and as I say this will enable us to complete the review as quickly and practically as possible so that it can feed into the budget process 2324 thank you thank you very much Mr Medic I am going to second this proposal to retain its independence so would anybody like to speak on this item oh yes sorry sorry I do apologise I believe Councillor John Williams is will move this recommendation sorry apologise for that thank you chair, yes I'm formally moving this because obviously the chief financial officer as an officer cannot move this recommendation but before I do so I would like to thank Graham Jagger the outgoing chair of the information panel Graham has had five years of management consultancy experience both in public and private sector organisations including NHS and is actually appointed by this council to its independent remuneration committee in September 2008 and he became chair of the panel in 2011 so he has done this great service and he has ensured that the panel has made an annual recommendation on members' allowances to this council and assisted in the recruitment process where new members of the panel were needed to greatly thank and I'm sure you will join me in thanking him for his service to this council I would then go on to formally move the recommendation in the report Thank you very much Councillor Williams and now I second the proposal Members, would anybody like to speak on this? Thank you Councillor Heather Williams Thank you chair and I'm just leading from the comments from the lead member for finance I think he said about us all echoing I'm sure you will echo our thanks for such a long period of time Given it's an independent panel chair I don't know if it's appropriate but perhaps as chair on behalf of all of us you could thank my letter to thank for all the support that's been given over the years. Thank you chair Thank you It was my I see no one to thank also Graham Jagger for his long service and we look forward to the new panel members taking their roles but no further debate does anyone wish to vote against that recommendation? So are we happy that we take that by affirmation? Agree and no one wishes to vote against that proposal? Or abstain? No Good So this council therefore agrees the motion by affirmation Thank you very much members It's item 10 Item 11 is the review of proportionality and allocation of seats on committees which is also in this same agenda pack published on the 16th September starting on page 13 May I call on the Democratic Services Manager Rebecca Dobson to present the report please Thank you Thank you chair The political proportionality on the council requires a review of the allocation of seats to the political groups as soon as practicable after a change in the composition of the political groups on the council therefore following the notification from Councillor Dan Lentell to the proper officer of his resignation from the Liberal Democrat group a review of political proportionality was required So this report refers to that review It sets out the order in which the principles laid down in the relevant legislation apply regarding the allocation of seats as you can see in paragraph 6 and importantly the overall allocation of seats based on the proportionality has to be allocated to each political group on the council So moving down that report you will see that the number of seats with that change results at paragraph 9 showing Liberal Democrats 36 seats Conservatives 8 seats and the unaligned member the independent member 1 seat and as the political balance of the council needs to be calculated by basing that proportionality on the grouped councillors so 44 councillors that gives a set out in paragraph 11 the proportions for the Liberal Democrat group of 81.818% and the Conservative group 18.182% Moving through that report it obviously sets out the allocation of the 62 seats on the committees applying that proportionality across all of that allocation of 62 seats the Liberal Democrat group is entitled to 51 in all and the Conservative group to 11 seats totaling 62 the allocation is then applied across the committees and in order to ensure that the aggregate amount is reflected correctly you will see in the appendices at the end of that report first of all figures in brackets in table 1 showing the exact calculation per committee based on that proportionality and as a result you can see that if you added them up by rounding up everything it would come to the slightly wrong allocation therefore as stated in the report it's necessary to confer across the groups and to base the ultimate decision on the recommendation from political groups table 2 therefore sets out the proposed committee seat allocation showing the recommendation of the political groups that one additional seat be on the scrutiny overview committee allocated to the Conservative group and this reflects the fact that the figures would have been either way an additional seat or fewer seats across two committees licensing and scrutiny and overview committee so to make that very clear I hope in table 2 the allocations that are recommended are set out there and you will see for the licensing committee that that will stay the same on the Liberal Democrats allocation of 12 and the Conservative allocation of 2 but on the scrutiny and overview committee rather the Liberal Democrats allocation is now 11 and the Conservative one is recommended to be 3 moving down to the final appendix for this it sets out the names of those members to whom it is proposed that these seats be allocated thank you chair thank you very much Miss Dobson so are there any this would anyone like to raise any issues about that can't see any requests so members then can I bring to you then recommendations on page 13 oh sorry yes need to collect my brain sorry so proposing this so that I propose the recommendations which is set out at page 13 of the supplementary pack and are elucidated in paragraph 3 of that page which refers to appendix A and appendix D at E B may I have a seconder seconder chair thank you very much so members are we content to take this decision by affirmation anyone wishing to vote against or to abstain thank you so therefore the council agrees the motion item 11 by affirmation thank you so item 12 then is the Cambridgeshire and Peterborough combined authority report which is on page 1 2 3 to 1 2 8 of our paper and the council is invited to note the report on the work of the Cambridgeshire and Peterborough combined authority as outlined in the agenda so firstly do our representatives on the combined authority have any comments that they wish to make Councillor Judith Griffith deputy leader let's just make a short brief statement okay our representative on the combined authority Councillor Bridges Smith could not be here today have mentioned or but several other people involved in the work of the combined authority are here so we'll be happy to respond or attempt to respond to any questions the work on the improvement plans progressing well under the new chief executive and governance officers the authority had to return funding to government for two programmes to improve the environmental performance of homes we have been working to make sure that appropriate lessons are learned from this experience as you will have heard stagecoach has announced that to fit several vital bus services are to be cut despite the efforts of board members to work with all parties to maintain a basic service to the main towns and villages in the county so did any members have any questions to raise of our members on the combined authority can't see any questions sorry sorry sorry the format is to put your hand up okay so anybody who would I can see Councillor James Hopper would like to speak and I'll come back I have a question about bus services stagecoach's recent devastating announcement of its intention to abandon 18 bus services across Cymru chair has caused extreme distress and anxiety for thousands of South Cymru residents who stand to be affected one example of this is the 915 which connects Royston to Cambridge by Melbourne, Sheporth, Falmyr, Foxton, Haarston and Trampton Park and Ride and provides vital links for everyday life people use it to get to essential medical services jobs for their livelihoods and to apprenticeships and training and to carry out caring responsibilities there is particular concern for those who absolutely depend on travel with a concessionary bus pass or who live with mobility or visual impairment some residents are asking whether they can continue living in their current homes so my question is this will the leader be asking the combined authority to intervene to restore these services Councillor Hobro the leader do you want to respond yes please I was both extremely disappointed in fact angered and indeed shocked to learn the cuts to these services which will impact users across the county and will affect detrimentally the lives of many of our residents in South Cambridgeshire Stagecoach have broken their unwritten social contract with communities by removing their independence to get around in their daily lives as you point out people in some cases will simply not be able to access jobs, education services and amenities the public purse has subsidised buses for the pandemic and this is a real kick in the teeth our board member Councillor Smith and her deputy Councillor John Williams have been urgently working with the other board members and the mayor on the immediate measures to replace those services that are being cut I understand that the mayor issued a mayoral decision notice yesterday and tenders are now being put out in the longer term the combined authority needs to progress as fast as possible plans for bus franchising or other ways of increasing public control over the broken bus system Thank you Councillor I believe also Councillor Doctor would like to speak Yes, thank you chair So people have started panicking in Cambridgeshire as they have come to know about the withdrawal of these buses especially 18 the parents, the teachers, the students of the converted village college those who live in Cambridgeshire have started panicking and I have received emails and messages and lots of messages I have received the question how can they continue their journeys what answer should I carry from this council to my residents and I also have another question what emergency support or alternative support can you provide as a council to the residents of the south Cambridgeshire Thank you Thank you Councillor Doctor what answers can this council provide and what other solutions are there As I've just mentioned in my statement I think the solutions are really working with a combined authority to put something in urgently and also in the longer term to be looking at while progressing the bus franchising so there's a little bit more control over what happens because obviously currently stagecoach are a private company and there isn't any sort of say so from an authority on where you put your roots and what you do and I completely sympathise with the point you're making Thank you So then we have councillor Leona Neto Thank you chair Thank you councillor Ryfyr for those comments Sorry I can't see You can hear me I learned from my last time chair so it is very disappointing that we find ourselves in this position because surely the discussions took place months ago this administration I believe plays a big role on making sure that the combined authority is delivering the best transport services for our residents and communities so I would like to know what has the leader of this council and the representatives of the combined authority done to make sure that the combined authority allocates sufficient funding for the services across rural communities So what has the leader done to ensure CPC has assigned enough funding for it to replace the services Aside from what I've already mentioned in answer to councillor Bata Ciarw his question I don't really have anything else answer Perhaps the Chief Executive or indeed councillor John Williams may have a little bit more information since I don't sit on the I'm not the representative for from this council on the combined authority Councillor John Williams would you be able to answer that? Yes I wasn't part of the last meeting of the board that was attended by councillor Smith but so far as what the combined authority is doing now it is using its emergency powers to tender for those services that are being withdrawn or changed Clearly State Coach gave the statutory 56 days notice to the traffic commissioner for the withdrawal and changes to these services and until that happened the precise nature of the changes were not confirmed So the combined authority is having to work in a very short space of time in order to tender for those services that now know is that I have been councillor rerouted and we wait to see what we wait to see the response to that tendering process Thank you very much Thank you councillor for your comments I would like to reassurance that those attending and representing our communities that this local authority the combined authority are going to make sure that this does not happen again and that they do everything in their power to secure and put any kind of procedure system in place to make sure that our communities don't go through this situation because people are heavily distressed and they shouldn't be going through this We should be doing everything that we can to make sure that our residents don't suffer I completely agree with you that the situation we're in is as a result of dereguration of the bus services which was made back under Margaret Thatcher means that we have very little control over the bus services 95% of bus services in the county are operating on a commercial basis and stagecoach operate most of those bus services and unfortunately no one has the power to force stagecoach to operate a commercial service it is down to stagecoach how it operates that service in terms of fares and the timetable that is the situation that has been given us by the government so we have very little control over the local bus services and I hope therefore we have your support to bring in franchising for our local buses so that we do have control over what happens I look forward to conservatives supporting that because that's the only way we will avoid this happening again in the future Thank you councillor Williams councillor Dr Timmy Hawkins you're next Thank you chair Perhaps I should declare an interest because my son actually goes to Long Road which I'm going to mention now Your interest is noted Thank you Of course the news came as a shock but it was even more of a shock because whilst we there was a list that said these are the list of bus routes being drawn what stagecoach seems to have also done is change some routes like the city forward and removed the service not just re-routing it removed it and what that means is that villages from who's born codicot, hardwick and down the mudily rise now do not have a service because city forward now just goes from Cambon straight into So what I would like to actually ask our representatives is to find out if the measures that the combined authority has exercised in tendering for the withdrawn routes actually includes routes like city forward Thank you Your point being that that's an exchange because it's not listed as a removal exactly correct and what that means is children like my son and his friends and those from other villages who go to Long Road and Hills Road now have no means of getting to school Thank you Thank you councillor Just to answer that there is a meeting of the board on the 4th of October and clearly things will be a lot clearer following that board meeting at the beginning of October At the moment we don't have that detail to be able to answer that question Depechelyda, did you want to come back? I'm just going to add that as soon as that detail is available a written answer will be sent to councillor Dr Hawking Thank you very much A written answer Yes So I just took a quick turn I think the board meeting is on the 19th of October but you may be talking about Transport Committee but we will certainly contact the chief secretary of the combined authority today and try to get an answer as quickly as possible Picking up on that point it takes quite a lot of scrutiny to pin down routes that have altered in the way that councillor Dr Tumi Hawkins mentioned where the route is apparently still present but in fact has been altered in such a way that it has the effect of leaving out some villages So I wondered if we could have a list that refers to all routes that have been altered So people can actually look at the look at the routes and see how they affect them because otherwise they don't know they're not alerted if the route is still there and the surface looks the same they wouldn't know to look for such things as councillor Dr Hawkins has found Thank you So councillor Dr Ellington What's the next one? Oh sorry That's Ellington Who will supply with such well educated people amongst whom is councillor Ellington Thank you I think we're doing an awful lot of hand bringing which is entirely appropriate I'm sure but I'm very much one for thinking okay so what does this council have that is special and that is councillors in all our villages can identify how such very simple changes in routes have affected and can I suggest as a council we collate from our district councillors the specific issues that are affecting their residents in Swavesy the village is a mile long you can say we've got the guided bus but if you live at Boxworth End it's still a mile to get to the bus and they are taking off the number five bus which goes through Overham Willingham it means that the people who live in Boxworth End and anybody through the village really cannot get to the over doctor's surgery where they have there are a very large proportion of people from the village so it affects my village particularly and I just feel that with the added concern around congestion charging people do not want buses to be taken off that we're taking them into Cambridge at a cheaper rate so I suggest with the other thought that was in my head was our community car service can we build it, support it and give it more oomph because there are a number of villages thinking of Lowell which never has had a bus service and still doesn't Thank you Thank you cancer Ellington and I've just spoken to Liz Watts who said if members would like to send the details of the way that the alteration in the bus route has affected people in their village she will collate that data as our So Liz will share that information with the CPCA so members, thank you very much for that suggestion We'll add you to the bottom of the list so cancer Ellington Thank you chair and I have to say from quite an easy way to say about changes for most of my villages because most of them don't even have a bus which is a subject in itself I'm sure would agree so I'm going to seek some reassurance and I hope with the gift chair that I'm going to focus on the politicians of the day not decisions from before I was born on this subject as the least member referred to because it's not going to be particularly helpful Other local authorities have managed to not have this situation and what we have seen is money not going to the combined authority because of a lot of issues that have been going on in the present today at late so I would like to know from our board representative all their substitute if very clear answers chair if that's doable for do we think that this is having an impact in the fact that franchising has been possible all this time and yet it doesn't seem to be progressing and there has been clear support I think from different parties on franchising to clarify the earlier comments and also is this not ringing alarm bells for the administration that buses might just not be the answer to everything particularly when they're considering having that as the only alternative for congestion charging chair Thank you very much I will answer that as far as I can in a way you could also say this has at least highlighted the situation and addressing it and brought it forward and made it very relevant and pertinent at this time to grapple with this and absolutely understand the best way to do this again that's really me in a nutshell on that one I wondered if councillor John Williams who might have anything to add on that which is why I was asking John Williams if he could Yes I totally agree with councillor William who are where we are but we are where we are because of present government policy which gives us no power over our local bus services and Yes it's been a name of the CPCA to look at introducing franchising but that doesn't happen overnight there's a long process and some people may feel that it should happen overnight but unfortunately if you look at elsewhere it's only been introduced outside of London and actually it's only been introduced in Cornwall and Manchester so far and it has taken years to get that done because the bus operators are very much against franchising for obvious reasons so we are where we are I currently agree with you and where we are at the moment is that we have no control over what stagecoach does we can only react to its decisions and we are the combined authority and I assure you is now reacting to stagecoach's decision and at the moment it's too early to say the outcome of their efforts Thank you very much I have a part of my question I'll answer Would you like to say what the project was and whether our representatives feel that the current issues of the combined authority have led to partially not being able to progress things like franchising and helping to avoid the situation because as I say plenty of other places seem to have been able to manage this situation far better than what we are seeing Thank you Okay And clearly Councillor Williams doesn't look at local news because if she did she would realise that this isn't just happening The the counsellation of bus services I want to answer Councillor Williams' question Will you listen to her question and then come back Point of person explanation I do read the local news and watch it and therefore any accusation they'll buy co is inaccurate You may retract it if you like Thank you I'm pleased you do If you did you would recognise that in Milton Keynes that in Northampton, in Bedford and in Norfolk and in Suffolk and right across this country bus companies are withdrawing bus services If you go to Bedford only last month the stagecoach announced drastic cuts in its services in Bedford you go to Milton Keynes there are drastic cuts in bus services happening Milton Keynes This is a problem that is happening right across the country outside of the metropolitan areas Royal bus services are under attack and is very little that local authorities can do about it because we have not got the powers from government to stop it happening So if Councillor Williams wants to help us she can go to her government and ask them to change the powers that local authorities have so that we have greater control over our local bus services Thank you Did you wish to make Yes Point of information to our government chair as you normally remind but also that bus service improvement plan allocations have been in Blackburn form of Christchurch Brighton and Hove Central Bedfordshire City of York, Cornwall, Derbych City, Derbyshire, Devon East Sus, Grace and Manchester Hartfordshire, Kent and a lot more We hear your point If you actually want to resolve it you might want to think of something more up to date than Thatcher Point of order Can I move us on Point of order We need to address our question to the chair Point of order One member of the council has consistently broken the order, sending orders in addressing other members Thank you I have on my list 1, 2, 3, 4 people who are and I'm not going to take any more questions on this so councillor Dan Lentel councillor Adrocharia councillor Brian Milms I'll take those questions and then we're going to move on So councillor Dan Lentel Can I ask you to keep your questions under your answers Promet, please Thank you chair The reason I'm sitting here is I have lost confidence in the leader of this council to represent the needs of our residents across the stakeholder map My question to my colleagues my once and perhaps future party is this Isn't it time that we took our candidate the chap I voted for the mayor last time Isn't it time we took him off the naughty step and sent him into bat as our representative because what this council needs is better representation proactive representation and my question is a very simple one How can we expect change if we don't make the change start with us Thank you Deputy leader, would you like to It's not the funny answer that's such a personal sort of question to somebody I don't think it's position of us we're doing that It doesn't actually get us anywhere Okay, the next question we have is Dr Shreben of our tutorial Thank you, I'm a bit confused on mathematics What type of mathematics or the mathematical equation is this Firstly, asking the I mean firstly taking the public buses off from the routes and then asking people to pay the congestion charge How can this two system fit together take the buses off and then you ask for the congestion charge I think the point is that two different authorities have done those well, one authority and one operator have done that I still need a I still need a valid answer to give it to my to my residence because I'm constantly getting the messages and emails We hear your question but you've raised that point earlier and I think you may wish to raise it under a different item in the agenda Deputy Leader, did you want to pick that up? I was going to say a different agenda item really and also there are a number of questions to follow on gender in 2016 So, I think it's a that's the answer that Deputy Leader has given So, moving on to cancer Brian Milne's Thank you, Chair So, under the current circumstances we've had debates about what we can do as a council and what the combined authority can do Now clearly we've seen limitations from both the previous mayor and the current mayor in terms of progressing franchising which we generally agree although it's an imperfect system is the only way that we can involve ourselves in more control over other services and we whether or not we think they're the perfect vehicle excuse the fun for delivering transport services to our population they are the only option that we have right now and we should and I'll ask here that we ask our mayor and combined authority to expedite franchising it's being thought about for too long we have worked in circumstances where Boris Johnson's built bus pack better which was originally funded to the amount of 3 billion was slashed in half by the Treasury we've had a situation where in Manchester the franchising had to be delayed while stagecoach took the court and it lost their argument to not be franchised so it's going to be a difficult process so I ask the leader if we will make representations to bring franchising forward as soon as possible thank you thank you very much it's kind of being covered in my statements I think thank you thank you we'll draw it from now and I'll leave it until we've got the debate thank you very much okay so and remember those were only questions for our representatives on the CPCA to take to the CPCA thank you so in the similar light can we be careful how we frame our questions for the next item which is 13 Greater Cambridge partnership we're invited sorry before we go ahead I'll take it then that we've noted the report so item 13 Greater Cambridge partnership we're invited to note any report but since there is no GCP Executive Board report available for this meeting because it's next meeting is the 28th of September an update will be reported at the next meeting but members did you have any questions for our representatives on the GCP Councillor Graham Cohn thank you thanks for that chair I know I've raised this point on a number of occasions but given that the Cycle Greenways project was brought up on the 8th of September at the GCP meeting I was wondering if you could or through you chair ask if I could have an update on the full-born to Cambridge route and some timescales on that because the timescales in the document alluded to 2025 on nearly the whole route without any detail as to when bits of that route are going to start where the problems are whether they're staff resourcing issues and I have asked this of the GCP before but had no detail at all and as local member my residents deserve to know what is going on with that route it's a huge population on the fringe of Cambridge that could have a very different modal shift in the city if this project that was commissioned in 2016 was to actually move forward thanks very much thank you very much I just want to take a moment's legal advice so okay I'm just thinking that that's really you're seeking an update from the GCP which I'm suggesting that we ask our representatives on the GCP to ask at the next meeting and bring back yes thank you very much so Councillor Brian Mills yes I think the delivery of the Green Wings project is a concern for all of us and it's taken rather longer than anyone would be happy with so I'm quite happy to make sure that we have a written answer that is in more detail as Councillor Cun requests thank you and I apologise did you want to the same thoughts as regard of each Green Wings myself and my ward colleagues are pushing for that I'm sure you are and I'm sure Councillor Mills will raise that one too thank you right item 14 sorry oh sorry Councillor Williams did you have a question thank you chair and probably more of an observation as we don't have a reporter question on what one of those is that even when we do all agree when we do all agree we still don't seem to be able to get anywhere on this because Green Wings has been supported from everybody so if our board representative could reinforce the exhaustion of the subject for residents and councillers alike welcomed by all I'd also chair and I have raised this with officers and I think this is something more about how the GCP supplies information but on the combined authority we do receive reports from Audit and Corporate Governance and the scrutiny panels for the GCP we only get the board obviously the received assembly as well so I'm just putting a plea to you chair if you could look into how we can make sure that that's balanced correctly and fairly across the outside bodies I personally don't see any reason why the reports from the assembly don't come to us as well as the board but that could just be an oversight I will find out not to you I don't know it's interesting because I have often been concerned about minutes but I'll ask so moving on to item 14 we have the update on the Oxcam arc which is on pages 129 232 of our agenda so I invite Deputy Leader to speak to this thank you As we have discussed previously we are waiting an indication from Government about the strategic plans for the arc it is important that we remain engaged with work in this area because it could have a large impact on our district for good or for bad and I am happy to attempt to answer questions on this thank you very much would anybody like to answer Heather Williams thank you chair so the arc has been something that we have debated in this chamber on this item quite a bit and one of the things previously that has been by myself and colleagues pushed is the transparency around the meetings that are there previously it has been said to us that it is a government initiative and the government side but the government have pulled out this this is now being led by the leaders of this area and even when the government was in control allegedly of this I called for our leadership our inclusion into this to be based on transparency and a requirement of that to be to see minutes of the meetings because I have to say I have sat in this chamber we get four page a few bullet points and asked and asked and never had a response as to what actually the vision is here from our representative there what is self candidature pushing for and unless we can actually see there is nothing in here that says what the vision of the administration is and how we are being represented at that meeting and I think it is about time chair that we saw so is there my question is is there any chance of us seeing or knowing what at all is going on thank you thank you a couple of points hopefully to answer your question as we said this is a new reiteration of it and we are in the new government new prime minister and new secretary of state waiting for that to be here as well but I think you make a fair point possibly about the agenda minute and come and take that away to look at okay so we come on to yes yes and we note the report thank you so we come on to item 15 which is on pages roman 2 to 3 of agenda papers this is the members of committees and outside bodies and the purpose of this item is to note and endorse any changes in the membership of committees which have been made in accordance with the wishes of the leader of the political group to which the seat has been allocated as well as to agree any changes required in membership of outside bodies so coming to 15 I firstly we council is asked to note that councillor Sinita Hansraj has replaced councillor Dan Lentel as a member of the grants advisory committee and that councillor Peter Sandford has been appointed as the first substitute member of that committee so we'll council just note that the second item is that council is asked to note the appointment of councillor Peter Fane as substitute member on the civic affairs committee and on climate and environment advisory committee roman 3 we are next asked to note any other changes in membership or substitutes in respect of any other committee so councillor Williams did you want to raise thank you the appointment of myself to scrutiny the third spot that we now have following the political reapportionment that comes slightly later down the agenda that later on so I'm just saying that's the only change or appointment I need to make that bit I'll hand over to legal advisor it's actually not that complicated but thank you it was done previously when we considered proportionality it was a panic speaker thing to the report thank you thank you very much but you didn't have any other changes that you wished to make thank you and then 15 roman 4 members we're then asked to note the appointment of substitute members to the joint local planning advisory group and as stated on the agenda at page 3 nominations received from the conservative group are councillors Heather Williams and Graham Cohn and so councillor Dutryff with other nominees for substitute members from the Liberal Democrat group yes there are the first substitute is councillor Peter Sanford and the second one is councillor John Lovelock thank you very much and under item 5 are there any other changes to memberships of any other joint bodies I can't see there are none and are there any changes to appointments to outside bodies there are none okay thank you very much so under 15 Roman 7 finally we're asked to endorse the appointment of councillor Sue Ellington as vice chair of the grants advisory committee and I propose that we endorse this appointment may I call for a second up I don't think it's causing sorry I've said I propose that we endorse this appointment sorry thank you councillor Dan Lentell that's fine thank you so we do need I think we need to vote for this one can we do that? right so are we agreed to do this by affirmation agreed anybody against so members we therefore agree those changes by affirmation thank you very much so moving on to item 16 which we have listed on page roman 3 members you're reminded that a period of 30 minutes is available for questions this includes those questions notice has been provided as set out on the agenda and if there's any time remaining after the questions with notice have been dealt with we'll deal with any other questions which have been notified to democratic services manager before the start of the meeting so we're going to and I'm going to invite councillors to ask their questions in the following order so firstly councillor Dan Lentell thank you chair does the leadership of this council share my concern that the inclusion of the hospitals at Edinburgh in the GCP's proposed congestion charge scheme is likely to derail the wider proposals and sink any chance for better public transport in Cambridgeshire thank you deputy leader as you point out these are proposals not decisions which will in all probability go out to consultation this autumn obviously dependent on the decision of the board on 28 September it is essential that as local members we encourage as wide a demographic as possible to take part in that consultation to inform the debate and to make the scheme as equitable as possible it's essential that we remember that the sustainable travel zone within which there would be a road user charge is to help fund a much improved bus service as you indicate in the premise of your question equality of access to medical care is essential some patients and visitors do not own a car either because they can't afford to or they can't drive sometimes due to a medical condition presently not all of all of those residents have access because there isn't a cheap, reliable and frequent bus service equally for many residents who come from further distance such as Adam Brooks currently the car would be their only option this is why the consultation process is just so essential thank you Councillor Lentell do you have a supplementary question this is my supplementary question which is why on earth was Adam Brooks ever included in these proposals from day one and this is exactly the kind of policy shaping from the start that we need to have representatives of our people representing our people to the wider stakeholder map rather than the wider stakeholder map to our people this is looking down the wrong end of the telescope why was this ever included for on day one thank you I just want to emphasise again though obviously the boundary is a difficult area always going to be complicated where this is actually for the boundary but there is a consultation process probably about to start and the inclusion or otherwise whichever that becomes whatever way it goes is also thinking about who can access there and we need to think about those people who do not have a car who probably can't access it currently because of the lack of the bus services to get there and additionally also may have a car but with escalating fuel costs and the car parking it's not about just about those people who can afford to drive there it's also about why the demographic being able to access places possible and so it is in there and please can we ask as many people as possible when the consultation comes to really respond and put forward their views because it's not just about obviously us in this room it's about everyone who lives in this area and also lives beyond this district thank you moving on our second question is from Councillor Graham Cohn would you like to ask your question thanks very much chair so my question is what does the leader think is the fairest way what is the fairest way to stop those that can least afford paying the congestion charge given the proposals indicate and exemptions for those with low incomes thank you and to ask and to answer this it's a little bit more detailed and he is all over the detail thank you thank you chair thank you councillor Cohn amongst those who can least afford it are some 20 to 30% of the resident population who don't have a car and so are very reliant on a very unreliable bus service and boy have we seen how unreliable that's going to become very shortly in my inbox this week we've already seen tales from students being left in the lurch because the driver's shortage means that a state coach decided to just remove without notice for three hours of vital bus service and students being left unattended or unserviceed the impending cost of the living crisis has underlined the urgency of creating a reliable affordable attractive and sustainable public transport system without that people on low incomes may well be excluded from access and we've seen today in the earlier debate how immediately the loss of those bus services has become this proposal looks to increase the frequency reliability and reduce the cost of the services so I think the proposals do include as you say a discount for low earners so this proposal is looking to look after at least well off in the Have you finished? Thank you Thank you, Councillor Cohn. Wait, was that too quick? You didn't indicate that you've finished so that's alright. Councillor Cohn, do you have a supplementary question? I do chair, thanks very much to that Councillor Milne so really the point that I was getting at was how is this going to be administered because I think you're right to say that there are a lot of poor people in South Cams and the wider area that don't have access to a car there are also a lot of poor people that do have cars and they drive into the city or the surrounding area to undertake work that isn't very highly paid and they really rely on their vehicles to do that but really the premises of the question was it's a Liberal Democrat led GCP Have you thought about the fact how is this going to be administered is it people on certain incomes is it certain that it's fair how is that going to be administered do people have to apply for the exemptions I've got residents that are writing to me that are very worried on low incomes asking will I be exempt will I not be exempt and they're worried about it in a cost of living crisis that they want to know how is it going to be administered will they be exempt and there's no detail at all in these proposals that have been put forward Councillor Mills do you want to answer that yes I do chef thank you it's fair to say that the less well off actually the proportion of their income going into looking after and fueling a car a personal car is disproportionate to those who are better off so it's important that we look after as many of those people as possible you're right in terms of lack of exact detail at the moment but bear in mind these are proposals that are going out to consultation so these issues of how we administer the schemes are well you're saying you haven't seen them but they are under consideration but haven't been brought forward but the consultation that we're likely embarking on may well inform those details sorry this is a question and answer thank you would you allow Councillor Brian Wells to give his answer the consultation is to take into account people's views on all of these issues and they will be germane to the details that come forward so it is something of a course and cart issue there thank you under 16c I've received notice this morning from Councillor Richard Williams that he's withdrawn his questions so we move on to question 16d which is from Councillor Carla Hoffman would you like to ask a question Councillor Hoffman thank you can the leader explain to residents how they can ensure that they have their legitimate concerns about the city access proposal which is regionally launched by the GCP heard and responded to thank you and I think probably to leader we'll try to that one is Councillor Milne Councillor Milne over to you thank you Councillor Hoffman you bear in mind that the series of consultations that we've already done with regard to these transport strategies going back five or six years or so now and include such examples of the citizens assembly which try to reach a much wider demographic than we've previously done and we can perhaps take models from the Greater Cambridge share planning service who did that public consultation in the corn exchange which reached a lot of people and clearly the city access is actually a separate programmed from the current proposals for a charging bus improvement program but the city access talks about how those busses and other transport are going to get around the city so there is a linkage between the two so there will be significant amounts of opportunity to consult and clearly we will get a broad picture of people's concerns which we can then act on and particularly concentrate on those issues that are most important to most people and that's the purpose of that consultation exercise and we certainly will in all of this we've already had discussions at the board about the consultation process and make sure that it doesn't look like some tick box exercise that it really gives people ample opportunity to express their views and in terms of the city access there are groups of people that clearly whether you're pedestrian whether you're a bus user whether you're a cyclist are a maximum concern to you and we will hopefully get some sort of resolution to as many of those concerns that our residents have so I hope that we'll encourage people to take part in those consultation exercises Thank you Councillor Mild and can I remind members I know it's difficult for members who are straight ahead of me but if you could continue to address your questions and answers to me because then we can hear you through your microphone so Councillor Hoffman do you have a supplementary question? I did but he's actually answered it so I withdraw the second question I was going to say it was a very full answer thank you very much Councillor Hoffman so moving on Councillor Visalianne Hart then Thank you chair we've had several mentions already this afternoon of the GCP so my question is can the leader explain the democratic processes that exist in the running of the GCP which ensure that residents of South Cambridgeshire have appropriate influence over the decisions that are made by this body Thank you Thank you for your question The Greater Cambridge partnership was set up as the governance part of the city deal to address the issue of transport connectivity and access to Cambridge bearing in mind a buoyant local economy and high predicted economic growth The three decision makers on the GCP Board are senior elected representatives from each constituent council Cambridge City Cambridgeshire County Council and South Cambridgeshire District Council ourselves There are two non-voting members one from the University of Cambridge and one from the combined authority business board to add a broader expertise and input into discussions The joint assembly has an advisory and scrutiny role which further strengthens and broadens the democratic process At the last meeting which took place on the 8th September I watched a morning session online when the city access agenda item was addressed There was to me, I felt a democratic and open debate in the public meeting with questions from both councillors in areas and from members of the public This part of the structure helps to ensure the GCP is both transparent and accountable Thank you, Deputy Leader And Councillor Hart, do you have a supplementary question? Thank you chair, I do I'm really hoping this wasn't answered in the answer we were just giving I apologise I'm just really thinking in terms or with reference to the current governance model within the GCP Can the leader remind me when the GCP was established? The GCP was set up in June 2014 and was established and it actually opened, I think started work in June 2016 before I was councillor here with the government as one of the signatories to its establishment Moving on Our next question is from Councillor John Lovelock Thank you chair Can the leader please explain how the residents of the health of Cambridge as a whole will benefit from the city access proposals recently announced by the GCP Thank you very much Councillor Brian Wills, will you be building that one? Thank you chair So the population of Southam average we know live in this donut that works around in the city will be among principal beneficiaries of the scheme and this is along with the wider travel to work area which reaches as far as Boysden, Ewingdon, Eileen and Haverhill The city access proposals are about delivering an internal structure within Cambridge city that will allow the sustainable travel zone to operate properly because without that we might for example get a bus conjection and so Southam is critical because of those rural villages of which we are largely comprised as well as the new towns will need to have services that can reduce reliance on individual use of motor vehicles I think I don't want to repeat too much that I have in an earlier answer but if you bear in mind that the GCP's proposals for city access are following and are aligned with the EU aspiration and policy documents of reclaiming city streets for the people chaos or life and that's what we're facing where pollution is responsible for the death of 100 people a year then we need to do something about our city streets thank you and Councillor John sorry, Councillor Lovelock do you have a supplementary and could I ask that members try to keep their answers brief, thank you Councillor Lovelock thank you for that answer coming from Cottenham you very much realise looking at the proposals that they're very good at providing radial routes but so far I haven't seen any proposals in this conferential across the village for example, Ramplam still has nothing, no bus at all in the proposals and Cottenham has two buses now and none to the train station at Water Beach or the guided busway I just wondered if the leadership thought that these were important aspects to bear in mind in providing good linkage which gets people out of their cars to catch a bus into Cambridge and go back out again thank you very much I know that Councillor's heart and Hale's have left thank you, Councillor Mills I think this is a conferential routes issue is one we've pondered and is clearly we've seen today profitability bus service and what you can do on a reasonable cost basis so demand and response transport is something that we're experimenting with in hunts at the moment and seems to be quite popular so that may be part of the answer I'm not sure that right now I can tell you any more than that other than it's a significant part of the conversation and you will have seen that at one time there was a proposal for circular routes joining up the parking lights for example as we extend that so there's proposals going to come forward for extending and even moving new market road there's planning application already in for a new parking light by the west of the junction on the M11 to improve those parking light services then that would be potentially part of that solution thank you so moving on councillor Heather Williams thank you chair as on the old paper so I think absolutely you're trying to yes sure thank you for your question any organisation really work itself has to look at its efficiency and the skill sets it requires indeed as part of being responsible organisation especially when taxpayer funding is directly involved furthermore it would indeed be helpful if the government could commit to providing funding certainty to ensure we have the people and resources we need to deliver vital services without needing to make savings however projected changes to the implementation of a fair funding review will certainly result in significant reductions in funding to us council in future years we are having to plan for how we might manage these reductions but we have committed to do all we can to avoid redundancies in the future where possible we will work closely with officers and unions to achieve this but we must be honest with our people and it will not be honest to guarantee there will be no redundancies in the future when this might be outside of our control I can reassure members and officers within this organisation that if any redundancies are considered in the future they would be subject to a full consultation process I do thank you chair my supplementary is whether taking on board what has just been given as an answer whether the administration is happy with the following that was sent to all staff as we have often spoken about there was already a need for the council to make financial savings in future years this offer related to the pay off that was being made would add in a requirement for further significant savings on top of that we of course remain committed to working with colleagues keeping informed and minimising any reductions in post wherever possible I will write with a further update once further talks with the unions have taken place if I was an officer chair I read that don't take your pay offer if not we'll have more people made redundant and would have influenced decision making so my question is is the administration happy with that wording that was sent to all staff or were they not aware Cersler have the will to remind us the date of that correspondence it's on insight chair still there I believe 19th of July but it might need to clarify the date it's publicly available on insight I'm not sure that insight is publicly available I think it's only available to members and councillors and staff thank you I'm going to I'm going to be honest I haven't seen that but that's probably my mistake for not having it to insight enough so I don't feel I can answer that because I haven't actually seen it so I think I'm happy to take written response if that helps as to where the administration is happy with that right okay we'll try and sum up a written response for you thank you the next item councillor Mark how is happy to receive a written response as he's not able to be present to ask his questions so we'll move on to item 16 little I from councillor Sue Ellington and it's on the order paper so Deputy leader you're being classed no chair about the answer to this one is short and the answer is no do you have a supplementary councillor Ellington yes maybe somewhat frivolous but I note that there is a very large sign picture sign in reception which identifies all the cabinet members and their roles it must cost a bone to produce so I hope we don't have too many changes because it will cost council a fortune thank you councillor Richard Stobart your question is next thank you chair so my question can the council leader please explain why seeking the support of residents when making radical changes to current transport practice is fundamental to the success of those changes thank you councillor Stobart and I would remind members we've got four minutes left so your answer is short thank you I'll try and whisper through this as well as being the legal requirements clearly important to seek the input of residents when making such significant decisions and actually have them genuinely deal that they've been part of the decision making process why the consultation is such an important factor no I'm sure all of the members like myself have been approached by the public with a variety of genuine and real concerns about the proposals as published unfortunately not all of them have been informed on that representation of those proposals but that is part of the process that we will have to address if there's one message from today we shouldn't forget this linkage between those road charging with significantly reduced fare structure of whether one hand or two hands for generally and the linkage is between those reduced bus fares and increased bus services which of course are directly impacted by what bus services will inherit after today's announcement from Stage 1 Thank you So Councillor Stobart do you have a supplementary? I do but I think it's better to move on to the next question Thank you very much So Councillor Lisa Redger your question Do you want to take your tears on the paper so we can get the answer? Thank you very much So Councillor Melons are you going to respond to this one? Yes thank you So Councillor Redger's question raises an important issue impacting our ability to meet our own local zero carbon targets There's an inherent problem with the supply of electricity both from the national grid in terms of the generation of enough electricity as well as local distribution companies like UK Power Networks so we should advise that there will be significant constraints In fact in the case of our own record service and trying to electrify our vehicle fleet there wasn't enough capacity in the local grid to charge more than three of those lorries and that clearly gives you an indication of the sort of problems that we'll continue to have to address I think we're looking at prime pumping building of two additional substations to improve local grid capacity but of course what we're doing of water breach is bringing forward a proposal to have our own solar plant which will provide capacity for 30 vehicles also to be charged and the more generation that we can do gives us much more resilience against the vagaries of the utility market Thank you Thank you Councillor Melons and I'm going to call a halt there because miraculously we've got through all the questions forgive me Councillor Redrup we're almost certainly out of time I had it as 06 so I'm going to call a halt there I'm also going to call for a five minute break come for a break oh there we are and it's if by magic so so I suggest we pause the live stream and let people know we're having a break and come back at oh gosh can we manage five minutes or are we let's say ten so can I say quarter past that we return into the call thank you Thank you Thank you so welcome back members to the council meeting on the 22nd of September so we're at item 17 notices of motion and you're reminded that a maximum period of 30 minutes is allowed for each motion to be moved seconded and debated including dealing with any amendments at the expiry of the 30 minute period debate will cease immediately and the mover of the original motion or if the original motion has been amended the mover of that amendment now forming a substantive motion will have the right of reply before the motion or the amendment has put to the vote so we start with 17a the motion from councillor of Halings which is on page Roman 5 and 6 of our agenda papers and councillor Halings would you please move your motion Thank you very much chair and through you so I don't think it's any surprise that I'm bringing this motion that we just had the driest July on record for 20 years which is in the definition that we've got a water supply crisis but also just recently the most shocking results of the levels of fecal bacteria E. coli in the waters of the chalk streams of south Cairnbridgeer and that includes downstream waters from Hazlingfield sewage treatment work so that's from local monitoring so here in south Cairnbridgeer I've got this perfect storm of a water supply crisis that's leading to low river flow which means that any of the sewage and pollution that goes into the water is higher concentration level so that's this perfect storm so the motion's got four distinct but interrelated actions so it's the legislation brought in last year around water companies and the storm overflow discharges with heralded as resolving the problem but the environment agency just in July has shown that this isn't working so in the annual environmental performance assessment for 2021 which looks at the nine water and sewage companies in the country said that this was the lowest performance overall since the beginning of environmental performance assessment that's in 2021 after supposedly all of the measures to actually improve this and make it better so the chair of the environment agency said that there are a poll and that it's the company directors that are letting this happen so the fines are not having an impact and in fact they're just costed in to the budget so they're just not creating the change that's needed and Anglia and Water one of the worst polluters on record in England got a two star rating in 2021 a two star rating and that's the same time when the boss was handed over 330,000 bonuses part of a 1.3 million pay package this year so we're just not incentivising disincentivising the right way so we should support the calls to the chair of the environment agency to increase criminal liability for CEOs and boards for liability and responsibility but we've also got to look at what are they liable for and that's why we've got to increase the ambition so just this August there was a new plan from the government which is the storm overflow discharge plan and under that by 2037 we'd have 50% of all of the storm overflows improved so this is the new sort of tighter controls and I think what we've got to look at is short term and medium term targets to actually say no more dumping of raw sewage in rivers and short streams that's what we've got to aim towards not to an improvement of the ways in which we do the storm overflow and the dumping and how will we know this is happening this is the next element of that well the reason that Angliaw Water is being investigated through an enforcement procedure by off what is because of the poor quality of the monitoring that they're doing and that's monitoring that tells us about the water quality so when I mention the hazing of the field fecal bacteria, that's done by a volunteer organisation locally by Cam Valley Forum so they are being held up for not having the monitoring of their own sewage dumping monitors for the water quality but actually they are working with rivers in other parts of the area to create bathing status now under that bathing status that means that you get guaranteed water quality that's safe and under the new plan by the government they will only be monitoring those that have got bathing status designation all sites of special scientific interest so where but our area with the precious short streams should have that status they actually want this status they want to work with the local authority to get that status because that will enable them to invest in the monitoring those within Angliaw Water that really want to work on this and then finally and unambiguously we know that because of this low river floor because of the water supply crisis because of the limits that this is going to impose on us being able to provide the services and the new housing that our communities need the STAN Tech Water Report said that we need the regional infrastructure for water supply now and we need a government to act on that and that's why we are asking for this public private investment in that regional it needs to be accelerated brought forward to deal with that crisis so I just hope that you will support this mention thank you Thank you very much and do you have a second up Thank you Do you wish to reserve your right to speak to the end I will speak now If I may So in July I was at my daughter's graduation ceremony where the guest speaker was there to accept his honorary doctorate was the CEO of Angliaw Water and picture the scene there he was dressed in a ceremonial robe and a sort of floppy cap actually rather in the style of Henry VIII addressing a very large auditorium and he said don't believe everything you read in the press about water companies he was telling the next generation of teachers, health workers, lawyers engineers and scientists water companies are champions of our environment but actually you don't need to read it in the press because almost as he spoke an update on the environment agencies annual assessment was being published on the government website and in the forward by Emma Howard Boyd the chair of the environment agency she said and this is in her opening remarks the sector's performance on pollution was shocking much worse than previous years she writes and repeat offenders can now get criminal prosecutions where once the environment agency would have used civil powers we would like to see prison sentences for chief executives and board members whose companies are responsible for the most serious incidents we would also like to see company directors being struck off so they cannot simply delete illegal environmental damage from their CV and move on to their next role so I think to see that kind of invective in the introductory comments on a government agency website on the government's own website just shows the magnitude of the problem so when you think about the CEO's comments to a captive audience with no right or reply against that background of a damning assessment by the environment agency it does rather seem that the CEO of Anglen Water is at the very least in denial but perhaps you might say cynical and the same cynicism is evident when Anglen Water attempts to infer that this is somehow all due to climate change and that's what's created the problem with storm overflows but storm overflows per se they claim are no longer fit for purpose but in reality storm overflows only should be in operation in storm conditions and isn't actually the underlying reason that the FFT as it is called I'm going to have to call you to a halt you have three minutes to second the motion okay, yep so there is a lack of capacity in the smaller sewage treatment works themselves and a joint statement by the chief medical officer Chris Whitty, EA chair and Offward chair has assessed the dumping of raw sewage in a joint statement saying this is a serious public health issue for government and regulators and regulators and it is clear that the water companies are not doing enough thank you, thank you very much I understand there might be an amendment to this motion because it's been seconded so I understand there might be an amendment sorry, we're just putting that on the screen because it's been received in a far level place, Ms Dawson thank you so there's the amendment I'm going to read that out if anybody is listening that given the serious the water stress status in our region I think that should say the council's call for the leader to write to Cambridgeshire MPs to urgently seek the support necessary for a sustainable water neutral approach to development to make sure that all new developments don't abstract more water than what it is already planned sorry, there's some tidying up that needs to be done there for that area and offset the remaining Apologies, I think when I was talking to Rebecca we didn't deal with that so we're going to deal with that which part of the motion are you seeking to amend whereabouts on the amendment are you seeking to make the amendment so this is an amendment to the last bullet point okay so that currently reads that given the seriously water stress status in our region the CEO and leader will call on Cambridgeshire MPs to urgently seek the government support necessary for investment in the regional scale water supply infrastructure called for in the integration of water study evidence base for the draft greater Cambridgeshire local plan so I understand that's what you're trying to do yes, so you'll delete government and you'll include public and private investment so you want to insert the wording in blue no that needs to be deleted so it will then read that given the seriously water stress status in our region okay so there's some wording that's extraneous in there moving on the CEO and leader will call on Cambridgeshire MPs to urgently seek the what the support necessary oh the support necessary okay we've got the word government crossed out so the support necessary but there's no amendment as I understand it if we put into red public private so they've taken out the amendment is suggesting take out the word government and add in public private before investment if you put that in red then you'd see that that's the change in that paragraph and then you have an addition to the recognition to overcome through river pollution partnerships that's an additional paragraph sorry thank you given the seriously water stress status in our region the CEO and the leader will call on Cambridgeshire MPs to urgently seek the public private support okay sorry somebody mentioned public and private sorry the support necessary for public private investment in the regional scale water supply infrastructure called for in the integration of water supply evidence base for the draft get a Cambridge local plan and then the additional words this council recognises that to overcome river pollution partnership work between the local authorities is critical so we need a comma between river pollution to overcome river pollution comma partnership work between the local authorities with key stakeholders is critical because pollution takes place from multiple sources what I suggested that that is inserted before at the end of the last paragraph before this council agrees because that's a statement of recognition and then we go into this council agrees thank you right okay now this finally got that right I just want to check whether the mover of the motion accepts that amendment I do thank you very much also Halings so that then becomes the substantive motion right so would anybody like to speak to that okay so we'll go to the vote then members so thank you chair I just wanted to be very brief so I welcome this motion for the changes to it it is very important that we protect our chalk streams from pollution and as we all know this work has already been it was kick started by RMP Anthony Brown and he has been pressing government on the local water company to strictest targets in government has included also amendments on the environment built on storm flows following the concerns raised so it is being already established and it's great that we keep on pressing because there is more that we that we can do I also welcome the call for further funding on regional scale water supply infrastructure but I also believe that this local authority has the duty to protect our precious chalk streams and we can achieve that but making sure that all new homes are built to the highest sustainable standards making sure they are future proof and ready to be retrofitted so that in the future we can successfully implement water neutrality and the action is required now and I know that Peppa has mentioned that she fully supports water neutrality so I look forward to working with her on this Thank you very much we also had a request to speak from Councillor Martin Carn I think you put your hand up Oh, before we vote certainly we can do that and Councillor Dan Lentol Thank you chair and I'd like to congratulate the councillors for this excellent motion I have one point to to suggest from my time in the oil and gas pipeline sector which is that when company executives became criminally liable for malpractice it utterly transformed the sector suddenly training became a lot more important and suddenly knowing how to be compliant and how to exceed compliance a lot more important to the people making the big decisions so I think this is a step in the right direction to councillor Haling's point number two about the formal application for an inland bathing water stretch along the river Cam I think I'm right in thinking that only two such inland bathing stretches currently exist in the UK and perhaps we could actually double that number by having not just a stretch on the Cam but a stretch on the river Grey Two's the most beautiful stretch of which flows just to the north of Over and Willingham and perhaps even a site of special scientific interest next to RSPB U's Fen which if you've not visited it yet I can strongly suggest you do because it is Europe's largest post mineral extraction nature reserve northern Europe's largest reed bed and it's right here in our district and it's an absolute jewel in the crown of the River Grey Two's basin, thank you Thank you councillor Lentel, I'm sure if you want to suggest that as a subsequent time that will be welcome at that point, thank you so councillor Heather Williams did you wish to speak? Thank you chair I'm very pleased to see that the motion and amendment has been agreed so thanks to both Councillor Nieto and Halings for that discussion earlier I think we have tried on that practice or if it's something environmentally then we give as much cross-party support as possible and I'm really pleased that we've been able to achieve that today because these issues will transcend generations as well as political parties it's something that affects us all and I welcome that what's been before us today some of the previous motions and indeed the work from our MPs and I think if we are united on that then we will have more success if we look for division on environmental issues then we will not be successful so I'm pleased to see that that's carrying on and I think it's really important that we look at this in everything we do as well which will only be achieved if everybody pulls in the same direction for the same purposes of trying to make what we should all be here to do is to make the world a better place for where we live so I hope that this emphasis on water protection will be looked at as well because there are things that we can do as a council and government needs to play their part as well everybody does and I hope that when members of this council take housing figures and other things into consideration and concerns are raised that they will be treated respectfully and that it's something that we need to be really sensible about as we move forward so please that we can show united front today and my thanks go to everybody MPs, councillors that are working on this issue Thank you very much and councillor Brian Mills I found myself in a strange position of wanting to refer back to Maggie Thatcher I just relate to the privatisation of the water companies and there was a famous TV interview which you will probably not remember of not having been born yet and she said we can't put rocks to regions of the sea I see, yes we do She was astonished and we had years of membership of the EU where the number of blue flags that we got increased dramatically and we made real progress in terms of water quality and it's just sad that we are now not under the same remit and we've already seen changes being made by the government that have diminished our ability to keep our water clean so I briefly would like to wholeheartedly support this motion and thank you for bringing it to this room Thank you very much so I'd like to go back to councillor Halings to sum up, thank you and this is of course now the substantive motion with having accepted the amendment so thanks very much and I thank everybody hopefully they will now vote for this motion seeing as we seem to have that kind of cross-party support and that is what's going to be absolutely critical we do thinking back to what councillor Brian Mills has just said and also what councillor Jeff Harvey noted I am really really concerned because as we came out of the EU we had to absorb all of our environmental laws into UK law the water framework directive is what provided us with the water quality indicators two months ago that was removed as a water quality indicator was removed from our national auditing on environment we no longer use water quality as an indicator for the state of nature we've removed 17 out of 24 environmental indicators in our state of nature report this year water quality being one of them and that's why it is so important to consider things like locally the bathing status because that will give us some powers because it will require the monitoring but it doesn't mean therefore that we're going to be able to ensure that all of our waters that don't have that status have the monitoring that's necessary and we can ensure people that are safe for use by humans and that will provide the habitat for the wildlife that we need I am very very worried that we are going backwards and that at the same time there is a cynical behaviour by the water companies now I know that there are very good people within the water companies that are trying to do the right thing but at the CO level when it gets to the board and CO level it's a bit like the stagecoach thing it's all about the profitability of where it's going but we have to make sure through this motion and through the environment agency support them to make sure that we've got a proper regulated market if that's the way we're dealing with at the moment but I have to say the August plan for the, if you look at surface against sewers and everybody who's been campaigning on sewage discharge the August plan just released by the government sets out that by 2037 we'll have 50% of those storm overflow discharge systems as being improved and no target yet for zero dumping of sewage so we need to continue the work that began that's been mentioned but we absolutely need to to make sure we don't lose ground on this and stop it to stop the dumping of raw sewage thank you very much that's the hailing so of the speakers so I'm going to move us to the vote members so the proposal is on page 5 and 6 of our papers we're going to conduct an electronic vote on this no, if everybody's happy and we're cross party are we happy to take this by affirmation members would anybody like to oppose that or abstain no, okay so members we accept that motion approve that motion from Councillor Pippa Halings and that motion is carried thank you very much so we then move on to item 17B which is the motion originally from Councillor Bill Handley it's on pages Roman 6 and 8 of our agenda papers in the absence of Councillor Bill Handley I believe Councillor John Williams will present this motion Councillor John Williams I invite you to present the motion thank you chair yes regrettably Councillor Handley can't be worse today so I'm sure that I would move this motion on this behalf I do hope that we all agree in this chamber that it is at cost of living crisis I hope that there is no one here who doesn't believe that our residents are facing great hardship this coming winter and in fact it could go well into next year as well I was interested to see that the Bank of England this afternoon has already suggested that we are in recession so those on low incomes in our district are having a terrible time and will have an even greater terrible time I know that the government is proposing a mini-budget tomorrow but all the indications are from that that it's not going to be targeted at the lows on low income it's something called trickle-down economics which has never worked has not worked in the US and hasn't worked here and so unfortunately I don't have much faith that it's going to improve the lot of those on low incomes this winter and going forward into next year so this motion is in two parts first of all it's what we as an administration would like to see the government do to support our residents particularly with their energy bills because it's energy that's driving to a large part the recession and the increase in inflation and the second part of this is what we can do as a council the powers that we have to help those in the most dire situation on the first part it's clear that we believe the government isn't doing enough and is unlikely to be doing enough with its mini-budget and we set out in this motion what we as Liberal Democrats would like to see the government do and we believe that's that what we would like to do is in the best interest of our local residents hence this is why we believe this council should be promoting those policies to the government on the second part of things that this council hasn't waited for this motion at this council to already take action and there are things that we have already done over the last few weeks to help those facing hardship and people who are in despair as to how they're going to meet paying their bills this winter and I don't hear anyone actually disputed that that is going to be the case there is no one on either side of political divide who is actually who is actually saying no that's not going to happen I think there is a general consensus in this country that it's going to be a very tough winter for those on low incomes even the new prime minister has acknowledged that so we need to we need to make sure that as a council we are doing all that we can to help those people so already we have given advice in the council magazine we are providing a dedicated page on our website and we have already started working with Cambridgeshire Acre and with the county council on the provision of warm hubs in the district and I understand that next week Cambridgeshire libraries are going to come forward with a plan to provide warm places in their libraries and then it goes on to what we can actually do to council so I do hope that you agree with these proposals and we can move forward and give every support that we can to those people who are going to be suffering this winter, thank you Thank you very much and is your motion seconded? I believe for council holdings seconded, thank you Do you wish to reserve your right to speak or speak now? I'd like to make an amendment Okay I can reserve my right to speak to the amendment Okay so if you wish to do it, I do second Thank you Secondly, would you like to make your amendment? Is it possible to put on the screen the amendment? I have that So yes, first of all I'd like to think both Bill and Councillor Bill Handley and Councillor John Williams for bringing forward this critical motion and declaring a cost of living emergency and in a reason I've been speaking to charitable groups running food banks from Haarston to Camborn and they're seeing an increase and they're seeing an increase not only in the number of people coming there but also the families that are coming there and some of those are young families that were during Covid were helping out with food banks and now turning to the food lamps for help because of the increase in rent the increase in food bills and obviously in energy and so when we're talking about energy we just like to make an amendment to the motion which was that Sorry, could we just clarify that is a replacement of point Roman 5 at the bottom of page Roman 6 on the agenda so it's the whole section which currently said council the October Energy Prize so replacing it with this new one Could we just give the members a moment to read it if you wouldn't mind So can I explain that Yes I have a question myself If I can explain that Obviously many many families are relieved with the energy prize freeze which has been announced and that is helping a lot of families but we can't ignore the fact that a 2500 bill that everybody is facing is double the amount that was in the October was capped last year and we already know that many families struggled with that decision to either heat the home or feed their families over last winter so 1200 was already very high and we've got to think that the October this energy prize freeze to 2500 is for those who have gas in their homes for heating so there are those who've got bottle gas there are those that don't pay for their homes and there are also those in South Cambridge who are reliant on oil for home heating and the government has announced a £100 one-off payment support to those families across the country who rely on oil for home heating so we've found the research just shown us that in South Cambridge we've got 17% of the population rely on oil 1350 families they're looking at a 1500 price increase in their oil bill so the 100 pounds is it's kind of not even touching the sides it's a drop in the ocean when they're facing that and they face it as a payment full to fill the tank so it's not spread out over the year so that's the first item there second item is about the fact that there is no about food banks I think food banks have become the safety net that before the welfare benefits system was we've now need this targeted support for those who cannot afford the 2500 or anywhere near it and we're suggesting that we double the warm homes discount to 300 pounds and it's for everyone on universal credit and pensioner credit because at the moment it's limited and then don't get me started on insulation because that's how we actually properly make sure that these bills are affordable in the long term okay so members we have an amendment so let's just speak just a moment sorry yes are you saying that you accept the amendment chair yes I accept the amendment sorry right whenever you like to speak to the amendment so I have councillor Lovelock councillor Drew thank you chair I totally support the amendment except a number of people in my ward and others who you live in park homes rely on bottle gas and the oil is a special case I think bottle gas is also another case and I'm not sure how it's covered by the current government proposals so I think oil and bottle gas I'd like to see but I'm happy to take any comments on that my impression was that bottle gas was mentioned in the amendment nope okay right I mentioned it in my words chair because I said that it's not in the amendment but both prepayment schemes and bottle gas should be looked at thank you and councillor Drew just to be sure am I speaking now to say that I support the motion as a whole or am I speaking specifically to the amendment because I want to speak to the motion as a whole so I may have put my hand up at the wrong time but if you wish to speak to the whole motion once we've agreed on the amendment then you can wait if you wish to speak to the amendment now you can speak now sorry councillor John Williams I know you're going to say it's been accepted so we don't need to speak to it separately so should we move into general debate then members in which case so in which case councillor Drew would you like to speak now well yes thank you very much I am struck in relation to all of this by feeling a bit of a shame really and I mean a sense of national shame that we are in this position it's fantastic that working at county level and district level that we are doing warm hubs absolutely fantastic absolutely wonderful it shows the caring the compassion the support and it shows all the things relating to the motion that's there but what a shame that that is necessary what an appalling situation to be in and fundamentally what this motion is surely pushing for is the fact that it's not necessary there is no fundamental reason why this should be happening and food banks are mentioned I always recall a comment from the now government minister for business who fundamentally explained that we should be proud of the number of food banks that we have well as somebody who donates the food banks in a regular base support it I don't feel proud of the number of food banks that we have I feel ashamed I feel ashamed of the number of food banks we have and every time I walk into Morrison's in Campbell and I pick up one of the green bags that are there and I buy one of the green bags and put it in my shopping I feel a sense of shame so actually I totally support the motion I totally support what's being called for but actually we should not pretend that this is necessary we should not pretend our country should be here this is a choice that we are here and our government could be doing fundamentally more and for district councils at our level to have to be putting motions such as this and asking our CEO to write to the government to basically ask them to show a bit of humanity and to behave in a decent fashion I will use the word again I call shame Thank you councillor Drew councillor Williams, Heather Williams Thank you chair I submitted an amendment to democratic services obviously that's on the original motion but I would accept that we were actually trying to take out the same bullet point so if we don't worry about that part of the amendment chair Sorry did your amendment cover anything else as well So could we see that on the screen please Happy to speak or wait until people have had time to digest Waits to you Okay Okay so we are in the text initially above the first bullet points so I'm just going to let you read that and absorb it before I ask for your bullet points So coming to councillor Williams Are you to accept that amendment? I can't accept the whole amendment I can accept some of it in parts but not the whole amendment so I don't know how you want to play that If I can't amend the amendment then no I don't accept the amendment We take one amendment at a time so in this case just one moment please No exactly So you've proposed it Do you have a seconder? I do chair Councillor Coe Thank you and would you like to speak? Thank you chair I'm not quite sure what the process is for what councillor John Williams wants to do If you want me to So we're working on the base of what's there in front of us So part of the reason for bringing this amendment I'll take it in step by step if that makes it easier for people This is a politically and will be politically charged letter so we do feel that that's an inappropriate position to put the chief executive in second and therefore we believe it's right that the political lead of the council should write to government We are asking for the word consider because we do feel it is a little irresponsible from our point of view to ask for these things we're having no idea of the consequences of where the money will come from because we know that there somebody described it recently that we've got really even at the councillers trade-offs you know we can't magic more money so I'd be very uncomfortable saying yep we're going to do all these things until you know exactly where that money will be coming from because otherwise it's a pointless exercise The reason in relation to VAT now I can understand the motivation around that decrease but I don't think it actually addresses the problem and I'm going to go a bit accounting so I know our chief executive will stay with me but nobody else does, apologies VAT is a tax on luxury items and I think there is a definite that's the definition it is on luxury items and this is why that's a definition not my view definition and that's why I'm saying about reassessing the VAT rate goods and services fully support that sanitary products in my view should not have VAT they should be zero rated however if somebody wants to go and buy a Maserati sports car that is a luxury item so why would I give a 2.5% decrease on the sale of that car if you re-value the goods and services on a case by case basis you can then define what is zero rated exempt 5% or 20% but I think to do a blanket is actually you know if a comment is made earlier this would add to it I'm going as quick as I can chair so that shows that it might have some questions on VAT that would be interesting chair if we could take it on to the next part and this is the most important reason for the amendment is that what we should be debating in this chamber we don't even know what the government is doing and yet we are already hearing speculation and we are trying to act before the horde has even you know got up at the paddock but the end of the day this council does have responsibilities it does have a way of dealing with things when we sat the budget this year budget setting process our group fought hard and was refused to do a council tax freeze with the lead man for finance stating that we should never not put up council tax that was the attitude yeah and residents will be paying that this year so I have to say if you're going to freeze the council tax I'm going to welcome that of course I am but you've already gone against that and if you look going further down the things that we're adding on are real things that have a ring of control of this council and I think before we start throwing stones what other people are doing we should be getting our own house in order and putting congestion charging on top and I do agree it's a cost of living crisis I've referred to that myself it's in the amendment about congestion charging chair that's why I'm referencing it I think the introduction of that is really irresponsible at this time so if we are going to criticise others our own house should be in order first and that's why I am moving this amendment thank you chair happy to take any VAT questions so firstly can I ask councillor John Williams so would anybody else like to raise any questions councillor Hans Raj sorry I just wanted to correct other Williams about sorry about there's no more tax on sanitary products it was abolished in 2021 and also recently products are available personal explanation chair so I used that as something that hasn't been removed at zero rated so it does fall in a rate boundary I was using that as an example of something that shouldn't be as opposed to that's exactly what I said that chair that has been misunderstood what I was saying councillor Williams we understand the principle thank you people wish to debate on this councillor Halings this is debating the amendment yes we are correct and correct we are debating councillor Heather Williams's amendment thank you if we scroll down so I would like to ask something on this point 2 which is about council housing rents the cross party group and board within the LGA has just signed a letter with the national housing federation asking the government that is about proposing a cap on social housing rent and cross party it has said that if the cap is brought in without any additional funding for local authorities and councillor John bachelor mentioned this morning about housing we would be absolutely hobbled so we must help residents with their housing rents but I think what we have to be very very careful about here is if local authorities are not supported with additional funding on this we've got something that looks quite innocent here about helping residents but the government policy at the moment would hobble local authorities that they couldn't maintain the housing to the standards that everybody deserves as any kind of tenant and it would mean that they we wouldn't be able to continue to provide the critical services that are being for tenants and residents that are being mentioned here so I just want us to be aware and alert of there's a lot behind that thing about council housing rents and it's not in the local authorities hands because all local authorities represented by the local government association have all agreed to ask the government to deal with that one so just so that it's not only in our hands that one Members, thank you very much we've only got seven minutes left six minutes left to sort out this amendment and take a vote on the whole thing yes, on the whole thing so you are next Brian Mills please would you keep it short Yes, I've got your message Thank you I just want to check on a point of order that we have to accept whether we have to accept the amendment in full or not It has to be as it's presented and I will be asking shortly whether councillor John Williams accepted or not I think he's already said and I agree with him We need to take a vote on that too, yes Can we move to the vote? Yes, that's what I was about to do, thank you I know I know I'm trying to get there I have a missed here six minutes councillor Mills, councillor Cole who seconded it You seconded it Yes, sorry I don't nail him I'm happy to say no more on this I think it's pretty clear what our motion suggests it's focusing on things that we can deliver at the council and I'm happy to support it Great, thank you very much Given that councillor Williams, do you want to speak any further? You said that you didn't want to accept the motion Yes, thank you chair I don't accept the motion but there are three things lots of things why I don't accept the motion but just three things very quickly I do not want to accept the amendment of three things but the amendment not the original amendment first rule on that re-evaluate goodbye, it's going to take years that is not going to happen we put council tax up this year by 10p a week the government took away 20 pounds a week from the poorest families so I don't accept that our 10p a week increase has a huge problem perhaps the government should get back the 20 pounds it took from those in universal credit that would make a difference and finally nice try but your last point about the congestion charge we cannot prejudge the outcome of the congestion charge consultation We need to go to a vote on whether to accept this amendment can we conduct an electronic vote please mark the blue person to say you are here and green if you accept the amendment red if you refuse the amendment yellow if you abstain 19 has everybody voted 21 26 26 26 1 more 1 more 1 person hasn't voted 1 person hasn't voted is it Corrin have you voted now councillor Garby no no vote one no vote Can we go ahead on the basis that that falls on the basis of 21 against and 5 in favour? Okay. Oh, we've got it now. 21 against. So that amendment falls. So members, can we revert to the motion which is now the substantive motion, including the amendment by the original amendment from the behalings? Oppose on the second to move to a vote. Thank you very much. Okay. So let's move to a vote on the substantive motion then, which is basically all those things to do with writing to MPs etc. So again, if you could vote on that members, press the blue button to indicate that you're present, and green if you agree, red if you oppose, yellow if you abstain. So again, we should be 26 in total, and we've got that, I think. I know there's one person up. Yes, there we are. Okay. So that motion is carried with 21 votes to 5. Thank you very much. Good. I understand that we're 26 seconds remaining. So you'll forgive me if I got slightly stroppy there. Okay. Moving on item 18 is the chair's engagements. I was delighted and pleased and sad to attend the act of remembrance. The chair's engagements are there on the table, but also on the 18th of September I also attended the act of remembrance on behalf of the District Council at Great St Mary's Church in Cambridge. And members, the date of our next meeting is on Thursday the 24th of November at 2pm, and I look forward to seeing you at that time. Thank you, members.