 Now, Sean. Okay, I call this meeting to order. This is the Board of Assessors of Amherst, July 15, 2020, Wednesday. And we have two of the three board members here, along with Assessor Elizabeth Duffy. The first order of business is to approve the minutes for June 18, 2020. And I think both board members have some things to say about those minutes. Lee, you want to start? Yeah, the first thing I noticed, Liz, that we're missing a list of attendees for that meeting. Well, yeah, I just want to go, I think it was, I don't Liz, I think these minutes are not really They're not really actionable as minutes. First of all, my the copy I got says agenda at the top, which looks to me as though somebody was going to type in minutes and Typed in something else. And there's no list of attendees and I'm a little, I get the sense that somebody just sort of transposed the agenda from the last time without making any adjustments on it. So I think it's not This was, this was typed up by by Teresa. So I'll share your concerns. Well, you want a list of attendees and What other, what other modifications do you want? Because I'm up for modifications. Having minutes actually reflect something if someone didn't attend, they'd get the just of our I actually, I actually think that there wasn't much care taken in preparing is I don't know what happened, but they're not really, I don't think they're really approvable as minutes right now. Okay, are you looking, are you looking at them, Liz? Are you looking at them? I am looking at them and I'll be honest with you. At the top it says E agenda. What are the same ones that you have? Maybe I, maybe I don't. I got the It says the E agenda. I got the set that was sent to us the first time. I believe it was July 7th from Teresa. Teresa then sent an updated agenda, but no updated minutes. So, which I Maybe that was her intention. I'll be honest with you. She's been flat out trying to get ready to go out. I fully understand. I fully understand, but This is my fault. I should have looked at them with a really, because I was in attendance. The other question I would have is it seems to me that we took a number of actions in that June 18th meeting and I don't know Where the public record of those actions is, but it's not in, it's not in the minutes. It's not in your packet. No, it's not in the minutes. Right. I hope I hope and I think it was the meeting was recorded. So it was. Yeah, so a more complete set of minutes is still available. If we could access that it isn't that, you know, people have to go back in memory. But like Richard says, I mean, there's no detail there of what we actually So we want a list of attendees. We want detail. And is there any other things that you might want in those minutes now and in the future? I mean, we reviewed quite a few proposed abatements or actions on abatement requests. I'm wondering whether that is supposed to be included in the minutes. Yeah, I would say so. So anything actionable or any recommendations should have been included. All right. So I moved to table the approval of minutes for the next meeting. Okay. The minute I'm sorry, I moved to a to table the approval of minutes for the June, June 18th, 2020 meeting to the next board of assessors meeting. Yeah, second that. Okay. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Okay. Okay. You've got the only I left there. So and now we, I think you have the floor lives for motor vehicle abatement reports. Yes. We have, I assume you all have the agenda in front of you for today's meeting. Yeah, I had one thing I wanted to add to the agenda Liz. Okay. And Richard. And that is the status of your administrative support. Well, okay. I think that's coming in the principal assessor update, I think. And remember what you can't add to the agenda unless it's posted first. So. You can certainly ask me to, to provide that in my update. And I didn't. Okay. All right. Okay. Okay. Okay. So let's get to it. I do. Are you able to. Post paperwork on the screen? Yes. Okay. All right. Let me see if I can do it. I'm going to try to go to the big picture here. Let me see if I can. There we go. Okay. Liz, what is that backdrop of yours there? I'm that's Brantford. I lived in Brantford. Okay. I was the chairman of the board of assessors. I'm sorry that I'm not providing some sort of similar. Hey, you know, I, I just. Seen behind me. Having just the run of the mill. I had. I know that. I know that Lee is providing the backdrop from his old days on the tonight show. Yeah, right. Okay. I like that idea. All right. So I have. The door to the deck. Your door looks a lot better than my door. Sorry. This is going the right direction. So that we don't. And once again, we are. Lee, I know Lee. I can't speak for Lee, but I know that I am not in a rush. So. However long it takes you to manipulate the technicalities here, Liz. I'm good into about 1215. Okay. All right. Okay. Well, right now I am just trying to get this. Make sure this is the right direction. It is. Okay. So here's our first one. Why it's doing this stuff. I don't know. Is Sean still paying attention to this? Or is he gone? Yeah. Okay. I'm still working with my, um, I'm trying to get the, the dangle of the angle of my new Adobe. Um, Adobe program that was part of my staff updates, but let's see if I can do this. I know I've broken my personal record for being on zoom this week. Have you really? Yeah. Oh my goodness. Various meetings. All right. Let's see if I can share this correctly. And. I've got a number of them to share. The town council members are really good at this stuff. Yeah. Well, but you know, the better you get at it, right? Yeah. So, um, hopefully this works out well. And I'm a little more prepared than I have been, but I also don't have any secretarial staff, which I'll get to that report. Um, let's see. So share. And we want to look at. The screen. And let's make it a full screen. This is our first actual agenda. This is, um, When we didn't do public participation, I have asked Theresa to put that in our. Well, we don't have anybody. We don't have any public, but, um, I think it's regulation that you should have an opportunity for the public to speak. I don't know if that's. You're in this state. If that's true or. Well, we have not, we haven't been doing it prior to your arrival. Okay. We do not have. I think when there are people who are present. In the meeting, I think the, the, the, then I think after the call to order, there should be a request for that. There should be a. Some sort of opportunity for them. Yeah. Without anybody on online right now. It's a new point. It's a new point. Okay. They did know. At least I know one of the two was aware that we were meeting. Well, yes. And I guess there's a way to get into our meetings from the Amherst website. Yeah, it is published. Yeah. It is published. However, we did not in this particular agenda, although we did in the abatements. Allow for public participation early on in the meeting so that if someone wanted to add some kind of verbal comment. Or somehow in part there, they're passionate about the appeal. They would get that opportunity. But it isn't on this agenda. So. I thought I'd mention that just in future. I'll make sure that it is. Okay. So the first thing we have here is. Sign motor vehicle abatement reports for June 3rd to the 19th. The first one is for $1425 and 99 cents. So can you, can you show the paperwork? Yes, I can. So let's see if this is working here. Have it on another screen. So maybe I have to drag it over. Yeah. So when you, because when you go to share it, you, you choose which application you share. So if you hit share screen, it should give you the option. She'll list a bunch of, so you can share your screen white board, but then below that you should see. One of the options should be Adobe acrobat. Then that's going to share your, just your acrobat. It won't show. It won't share your whole desktop. Okay. So, so how do I do that? I know where I want to go. I just don't know. Yeah. So down at the bottom, you should see the, I have the share screen open. Yeah. Okay. And then you should see. Do you see different applications? So you should see like your email. But basically whatever you have open. Okay. So. No, wait a minute. Yeah. So you're sharing. Yeah. So you're sharing your whole desktop, which is okay. Yeah. If you want to see my whole desktop. I don't. I didn't think. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So if you want to hit stop share. We get your sharing out just the, okay, okay. Let's see if we can get this way. Yeah. So when you do. This is the document I'd like to share. So how is it? Share screen. You should. Put a window pops up and you have. You have some options showing. Screen whiteboard. And then below that it should list out some applications that you have open. So if you had word open, it would list out word. Okay. So. If I want them just to see this scan document, it should be an option. In this, I have basic advanced and files. Okay. So down below basic, you should see like screen and white board. Yeah. And then down below that, you should see all the applications. So there's the Adobe that I was looking. Yeah, perfect. Yeah. There we go. Gentlemen. Thank you, Sean. Yeah. No problem. And so the way this should work is. You have that open and then any other scans that you open up, we'll open up in Adobe and then you'll. Right now you're sharing your whole Adobe application. So as you open up additional things in Adobe, it should continue to share and it's just going to change to whatever, whatever tab you're clicking on up top. Very good. Okay. Well, this is our first agenda item. And as I recall, these are people who have got rid of their car during the, during the years that right? Yes. Yes. So this is the rebated. This is the rebated amount of their excise tax. Is that? That's correct. Okay. That's correct. I don't think I don't like about this report is it really doesn't give you a reason why. Or when they actually disposed of the vehicle. So I'll see if I can't work on this report. Well, under reason. I see. You see a bunch of acronyms, but it's, it's a very little leaning to you. Layer code. Legend. Do you know what T O and SC means? I, I, what, what is. Hmm. Honestly, no, I don't know what those acronyms stand for. So in the future of what I'll do, and I know that there's only a few actionable items that we will, we are allowed to make an abatement for. So basically the general criteria is the cancellation or transfer of the registration. The sale, the disposal or destruction of the, of the vehicle in question. They have to prove that the vehicle transferred title or was destroyed. Or registered out of state. So I can assure you these were vetted correctly. And that they, they did have to substantiate those, those actual items. Okay. And what is the mechanism that we're going to use to, to sign these. What you need to do is approve them in this meeting. And then we have your stamp to sign them. If that's okay with you, if that's not okay with you, I have no objection running them to your home or at least home to sign physically. I'm okay with the last time, Richard. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Before we did. We did some kind of a. I made a motion for your signature to cover for all of us. Yes. No, I did not sign anything from the last meeting. I think we use some kind of electronic signature or. We used a stamp. Okay. And the education that I recently received. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm not sure if it's concerning this matter. It was determined that if a vote was taken. In the actual meeting. And it was reported. Then it is okay to use. The signature stamps or electronic stamps. Okay. So, so I take it to cycle date means that's the, that's the date of the excise tax bill. The cycle date. Okay. Let's see where I'm looking here. I'm just as they, they all have. Yes, that's when they were built. All of them except to have February 28th. Right. Because some of them might be a supplemental bill or something for vehicle purchase. Okay. All right. So I moved to approve those 18 abatements. The week. During the period, June 3rd, 2020 to June 19th, 2020. Okay. So we can go to the next one. And then we have to, we, we have to approve your signature. The use of the stamp, right? I don't believe you have to. I believe what I was instructed was as long as you approve. The action. Then we can sign on your behalf using the, you know, whatever amount that I could sign for you. But it's a matter of getting it approved in the meeting. Minutes and having it recorded. Okay. Well, I'm, I'm dependent on your, um, your, your, uh, determination as to what is legally. Sufficient. Thank you. So the approval. Is also includes the use of the stamp. Is that what we're saying? I think that's what we're saying. Yes. Yeah. That's the standard practice, I guess, um, that's been adopted. And, um, Because the last time Richard, um, we, we went through each one and improved your signature on each one. But that's okay. I mean, let's, let's, let's, I think the vote did it. Yeah. Yeah. We're doing this time. That's fun. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So we go to June 23rd next. Okay. So our next one. Let's see if I can get this right. See if it's going to come up correctly. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Okay. I didn't think about that when I was scanning these things. All right. Are you seeing my skin or do I have to share a screen again? I think you have shared the screen again. Okay. Sorry about that. This is our second one. Um, this one is, uh, an abatement of 479. 32. Okay. Nature to the ones before. Now the only problem is that when I, uh, when you share the screen that I have to, okay, I've taken your, I've taken your screen. I've taken your screen. Okay. Okay. Okay. Thanks for joining us. All right. He's on mute. Okay. Ken, can you speak? You're muted. Can you take yourself off mute? Sean, is that something you have to do? No, that's on. Ken's end. It looks like he may not have any audio connected. No. Okay. Ken, if you don't have a speaker on your, um, computer, what you can do is actually call in on the phone number provided. Do you have the phone number provided, Ken? No. Let's see what we can do there. Um, Hmm. I can resend the email to Ken if that helps. Yeah. Would you do that just so that he can get that? Ken, we're going to resend the email to you. So you have the phone number to dial in if you don't have audio through the computer. Okay. Thank you, Sean. I appreciate that. No problem. In a minute. Settle back in. I don't know whether he's, uh, Yep. So Ken, you should have. You should receive an email. It'll show as coming from Angela Mills, I believe. Okay. You know, you don't make a great substitute Angela, right? Not as pretty. Your handsome. Don't worry. You get to keep that. Thanks. She has more hair. All right. So, um, the second item on our agenda. Is for $479 and 32 cents. Again, we have, um, eight abatements. Uh, it is, uh, in the February and one in April, uh, cycle date. And, um, Is there any questions on this one? Yeah. No, I just, in the future, would like to know what the, uh, what the, what the codes are for the reason just, you know, I agree with you. I mean, I'm, you know, I'm in year four now. And I probably got to know stuff like that. Yeah. Good question. Um, okay. I would think SC would be sold. Old car. What do you think TC? TC might be total car. Total car. Yeah. Okay. I'm just usually only a couple of, uh, options when it comes. Yeah, those are. Those are good guesses. Yeah. Uh, so I moved to approve those eight abatements from, uh, the date, June 23rd, 2020. Okay. Second. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Um, can it be like, you can always put a thumbs up. I'll take that as an eye. I can see that. His screen is up, but I cannot hear him. Which is unfortunate. Okay. All right. Well, we've still got a quorum. So we do. We do indeed. Okay. Let's get to our next item. Okay. So we got those two done. Okay. I'm sorry. I have to spin these as I bring them up. I didn't think about rotating them. Uh, you have to, you have to turn them on the screen. Yes, unfortunately. I didn't really know. Okay. I wouldn't, I wouldn't know how to do that. Well, you know what? Need is the mother of necessity or whatever. Yes. Yeah. Well, we've got his chest. We've got his chest now. That's good. At least his chest is here. Oh, there he is. Okay. Okay. There we go. Still no sound. All right. Gentlemen, are you seeing what I just said? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. There we go. Still no sound. All right. Gentlemen. Are you seeing what I have on the show? Or if I have to expand. You have to share it. There we go. Well, at least I don't feel idiot. I don't have it sideways. Okay. Our third. Yeah. And I just have to figure out how to do this. The screen sharing comes in behind the pictures. Okay. Here we go. Okay. Okay. Okay. All right. We have 18 abatements from. From the period June. 25th to June 30th. And. Once. Okay. All right. I moved to approve those 18 abatements. Second. All right. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Ken, we lost your picture. Here we are. There is. Hi, Ken. Yeah. Yeah. We can hear you. We have some screen sharing going on. Ken, can you see that? Yeah. Sure. Again. Would you like to agree or disagree with this abatement for 1793. Yeah. I'll agree. If everybody else has. We already have. Yes. Okay. Yep. Okay. Okay. So that's the third one. We, we now move to the, and Ken, just so you know, we tabled the approval of minutes. Because the minutes didn't appear to be in. In. Attic for the last meeting. Didn't appear to be in shape for approval. Okay. All right. I don't know whether you've looked at them or not, but they didn't seem to be quite right. Okay. Okay. Let's go to. I would agree. Let's go to. July. July 8th. There we go. Are you getting good at this list? I'm getting better. I wouldn't call it good. That was quick. Now are those two different totals or, or is that a running total? I can't tell. I believe. That's a running total that we're, we're looking at is $2,094. And 42 cents and all. Okay. We're looking at. There's a total of nine abatements. Now, why are for New England charter service? Now, why is the year 2019 on those? Because that's from a different tax fiscal year. Now. Okay. 19. Okay. 20. And that's why these three were isolated separately. Now, why, why did it take, I'm just curious. And if, you know, if I ask. Why are we addressing this? Okay. I'm assuming that these were. You know, Validly. Adjusted because it looks like an adjustment, not a wipe out. Okay. So they've been, I don't know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Why did it take, I'm just curious. And if, you know, if I ask, why are we addressing three from 2019 that are just coming up on July. 2020. Why is that? What's the, do you have any idea? Okay. So they might have, they might have sold the cars and for some reason. Yeah, I just don't know what our, our stands for, you know. I think it's total car. Do we know what New England charter services in here in Amherst? Nope. I don't. But I mean, I can look it up real quick if you like. I'm assuming that they are transportation service. Yeah. Okay. You know, of some sort. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Perhaps there were distribution service. Yes. Next time we reasons would tell us all the answers. Yeah. You know, I, that's one thing we discussed earlier on. Ken was, um, I'd like to have the legend. For this available to you to go with this report. Cause it's not as meaningful without the legend. Just as a map is. Okay. All right. So I moved to approve those nine abatements. I'm sorry. Period. On the date, July 8th, 2020. Okay. I moved to approve those. Second. All those in favor. All right. Hi. Okay. So that's 2,094 dollars and 42 cents. Okay. See if I do as good with this next one. So how does this work? The, the, the town then issues a check to those folks. Um, what happens is, um, you know, I'm not sure if this is a good idea, but. Um, I think it shows for finance, I think, and then they make approvals to cut the check. And sometimes I think some things could avoid some of the bureaucracy, But, you know. Okay. And our last one is a small amount for July 9th. That's correct. So share this. Okay, that looks like one year 2020. One car. And we're inferring maybe that SC stands for sold car. It makes sense because it doesn't look like they've adjusted it completely off, which sometimes indicate that they, you know, didn't have it or wasn't here or something. All right. I moved to approve that amount. $34 and 23 cents for that abatement. Second. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Okay. All right. Okay. So now we're getting on to the real estate abatements. These are the ones that were granted at the last session, I believe in June. These is, we've already. Actually, I'm sorry. Granted appeals. Let me bring those up. So we've already reviewed and approved these. Yes, we have. So I'm, I'm, so I'm a little. I'm, I'm trying to get my sense of procedurally of what, what happened on it. This large amount. Let me just get this right side up. So it'll be. What you need to see. So this is going to show us the listing. And I have to hit share screen again. I'm sorry. Okay. So here's the first couple. There's a summary. 51,943. Okay. I'm, I'm completely. I really don't understand what, what this is. Don't worry. It gets better. Okay. Okay. So. Overvaluation. These are the abatements. These are the ones that you have. I'm trying to recall. Did we meet, did we meet on June 23rd? Yes. Okay. So June 23rd, you approve the abatements. And these are the adjustments accordingly. Okay. So I guess what I'm trying to find out is figure out is, what are we doing looking at them again? I believe that she put them on here. She said sign real estate abatements. Okay. Okay. Okay. I have, I got a feeling. The past we've never seen like this. We approve them and then we're done with it. It's my feeling. I know it does seem redundant, doesn't it? Yeah. And then you just verify when you get this from a controller that you verify that what we approved is the same thing. And I don't think we've ever voted on this before. Yeah. That doesn't seem to make sense. I think what she was trying to show to you is that these were just, I don't think it's an actionable item, but she said here, sign real estate abatements. That doesn't seem to make sense. Who signs you or us for. Sign real estate abatements for, granted appeals, granted exemptions. So don't think that's quite accurate because I don't think you need to sign off on it twice. Report form or not. I think we looked at these already. I don't think it's an actionable item. But it's nice to share the report and it's intact. And it's totality to show you exactly what you, who actually, you know, have reviewed and the adjustments and how they, all right, is there, is there a signature line in this document? I'm going to move your pictures for a minute. I don't see where this matches anything. It does have sign this on the word. But I think this would be more appropriate if this was presented in the actual meeting, but that would be presumed that you agreed to them before we presented them. Yeah. I'm, I'm trying to remember, was this in the set of documents that I, that I, that was delivered to my house that I signed? Probably. Yeah. Yeah, it was probably. Yeah. But this is what you, what you would end up signing off on. But basically from my, my education recently, you don't need to sign these things. All you need to do is vote on them in the meeting and then they can be processed as, as being. Okay. Let's go on that assumption unless you get back to us and say that won't work. I think that's the case. So for any of these that we're looking at these, these three, it says right here that you've granted the fields, you've granted the exemptions for 1854 and 1030. So I think it's a new point for you to go over those again, since you've already reviewed them. Okay. But did we, did we meet on those dates, June 16th and June 17th? We didn't meet on those dates. So what are those dates correspond to? That's a good question. I did actually ask her. I'm going to have to get back to you on those, you know, but that does obviously say that they were granted. And when I'm looking at these reports that she's provided to us, I think we met only once in June, didn't we? We met twice. Yeah. But they weren't, it wasn't two days apart. It was a week apart. Yeah, it was a week apart. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. As I remember the process. We approve, but then they have to go to finance. And finance sends us a document, which is the total of the actions that they are going to take. And so we have to finance is doing what they do. Oh, is that how it works? Well, that's what I remember. That seems rather redundant. Yeah, it does. But that's what I remember that we did. Okay. I don't know if it's a checks and balances. Maybe the auditors are looking for, but. Do we need to approve signatures on these things? Well, that's not my call really, but I would say that no. Granted. But I guess what there's what they're asking is there. They're asking you to look at this and see if this is what you agreed to. All right. I think I'm going to move to approve signatures on these three items. Okay. So they can. In case. Yeah. Is everybody comfortable with approving our signatures? That's fine. This one that's up now does match the amount of the second item that's listed for June 16th, where we, if you look at the bottom, you'll see the number right there. Yeah. 1854 does match. Okay. All right. All right. So I move that we approve signatures for the three items under, on the agenda. That indicates sign real estate abatements. I have that we approve signatures. For those. So Liz can submit those. Right. Second. Okay. I just a man that after Liz checks these to make sure that's, these are the things we approved. Yes, absolutely. Yeah. I agree with that. That's fine. I agree with that. I agree with that. And as long as she's comfortable, this date makes sense. It's probably, it looks like an entry date. I mean, they might even, they might even be listed in our minutes. Right. That's why if we had a detailed minutes, we could make, make, make the. Yeah. You know, I, I really want to have a conversation and say, you know, I like the minutes to be informative so that if someone was not in attendance, I would have a conversation with them. Yeah. And we met on the 11th and 18th. That's why I'm trying to. Like you fund. What's the day here? The 11th and the 18th of. Of June. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Oh, that's right. We didn't meet. That's right. We didn't meet twice. This, which is why it's odd that the, the dates are. Different than our meeting dates. Yeah. But maybe that's when the reports were issued. Yeah. We're going to enter. Yeah. All right. Okay. Cause they're, they're, they're not long after the date. Cause this is the 17. This is after the 11th, but before the 18th. Okay. All right. All right. So that makes sense. I guess in general, I'm, I'm fully on board of. We have to sign where we have to sign, but we don't want to sign more often than we have to sign. That's something I was, I was discussing with the board. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was recently at some educational offerings by M M M. And what they said is that in one of our workshops, that if it is approved in the minutes, then you do not have to physically sign them. We can actually. We believe it up to you to check. All right. And now, and now we have these recordings, which we didn't have before. That's correct. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Oh, let's not live on forever. Make sure you're a dapper cells, right? Right. Okay. So now we move on to signing the warrant to the collector. Yeah. This is the big, big kahuna. This is the approval to collect taxes for this coming. Fiscal year. Correct. Yes, it is. Yes, it is. Okay. Okay. And you've presented it so I can actually look at it. Wow. Wow. It's great. I'm speed reading here. Yeah. Well, I'm sorry if I'm, I'm flashing. This is, this is the, this is the general boilerplate language that we approve. Right. That's correct. Now this says 19th day of June. Obviously it's not the 19th day of June. I guess that's. That's the warrant date, right? Yeah. Okay. All right. So because you're giving her permission to institute the warrant. Okay. I move that we approve the, the, the warrant to the collector. Of 27 million, 213,000. That's correct. Now this says 19th day of June. Obviously it's not the 19th day of June. I guess that's. That's the warrant date. Yeah. Okay. So, so, okay. So now it says 13,821 in $20 cents in real estate taxes. For fiscal year 2021. Second. All those in favor of approving the warrant. Please say, I, I. I, Okay. That's approved. Now we go to the, the CPA tax, which is essentially the surcharge on the real estate taxes for the community preservation act. Right. I'm giving you credit. Okay. So here's the warrant. Here is the warrant to collect that amount. Yes, it is. I always forget how the calculation is done. It's I think the first hundred thousand dollars of real estate value is exempt. And then what's the percentage after that? Three percent. Three percent. Okay. So this is the, I take it that this is the amount that corresponds to the the act, the real estate that was taxed in the first amount, right? That's correct. Okay. All right. That's the correlation that goes. All right. I move that we approve our signatures on the warrant to the collector for CPA tax fiscal year 2021, 616,675 dollars and 91 cents. Second. All those in favor please say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. All right. Okay. Third item is the personal property tax. And I'm trying to remember now from my, from my time at the school, what the personal property tax tends to, what those items tend to be, what that property tends to be. I'm trying to remember now. And this is everything. This is real estate tax as we discussed. So this is the personal property tax. Where's the warrant for that? This is the CPA. What is this considered? Where's the warrant for that? That's the notice of commitment. Okay. So let me see. Did I miss one? There it is. There it is. No, that's the, that's the last time I saw it. Where's the personal property tax? That one we already saw. This is all that was there. Honestly. Well, I guess we can take a vote on the amount that's showing up. And the amount is 988, 731, 37 for personal property. 988,731 and 37 cents. So we approve the amount. And then when you find your warrant, you can have it signed. Yes, that amount. Yes, it is. What if they got stuck together? It would think it'd be right in between the two. Yeah, yeah, no. I just have the real estate here. And then I have the notice of commitment. And that's what we're looking at now, is the notice of commitment. And then, oh, you know what, for the Rowan, they have the personal property. And I'll show you. Here we go. So we did not miss something. And they're maybe out of order for some degree. This one, they did this one. Notice of commitment. I had to remember to be sure to label these before I have to do this. There we go. Yay. I found it, John. It's in pink. This is the warrant for the personal property. And this is for the 988, 731 and 37 cents. Okay. And I'm trying to, I have no sense of these amounts relative to other years. Any sense of, any sense of whether this is a higher amount, a lower amount than last year or? I can certainly guess. So these are mostly cars? These are mostly cars? This is businesses. And this is only for businesses that exceed $10,000 in value. Okay. They're business assets. That's furniture fixtures and equipment. Okay. Electronic equipment, everything. I, you know, I did ask David when we got here about like the apartment complexes and things like that. And that's incorporated in the real estate. It makes it kind of tough, actually, when they have a $10,000, first $10,000 is exempt because it makes it hard for me to kind of tease out who's being honest and who's not. They all expected to do a form of list. But I have to look into it further to see how, how we police this correctly. That is our commitment. Okay. So I, I moved to approve the warrant for personal property tax for fiscal year 2021 in the amount of $988,731 and 37 cents. Necky. All those in favor, please say, please say aye. Aye. Okay. Next one. Anonymous. Yes. All right. Next amount is the pro red attacks. I, I have no idea what this is, Liz. A pro red attacks is basically for, let's close the back side, by the way. Okay. A pro red attacks, just so you know, is basically, it is for a portion of the year, not the complete tax period. So in this case, let's see. It's only $7,770. And this was for property 6B89. Let me look that up so I can give you an idea of who we're talking about here. This is Omega star child seminars, Inc. at 45 overlooked drive is 6B89. And years. So that's not something recent. Um, pro red attacks is usually for only a portion of the year. And this is for real estate. When I'm looking at this particular parcel, it looks as though they had some improvements done, and they're only for a portion of the year. So that's why it would be pro rata. So a change status. Yes. But it's only for part of the year. I think this might be for exemptions though. I think this is something that might have been exempt or is exempt. And they're doing it for a portion of the year. Let me see if there's more detail with this document. Um, this is the document. Have I shared it with you gentlemen? Not yet. Okay, so let me share the document with you that I'm looking at. This document is the warrant with fiscal year 21. And see anything further on this. It seems like you should have more detail to them. Yeah, there wasn't anything else with this. 6B89. There's one behind it for 171 for the same property. Yeah, that's the CPA surcharge. Okay. That's the CPA surcharge on the property. I'm assuming. 6B89 is this particular parcel. And let me show you what that looks like. So 6B89 is the, is the, um, the, oh, okay. All right. That's the nap and lot. Let me share that, share what I'm looking at with you. Sharing screen. We'd stop sharing this one and try and do this new one. I'm trying to show you. So this is a property up in Amherst Woods. Is that right? I think it was Amherst Woods. Well, I thought you gave me an address. I thought it sounded like Amherst Woods. Oh, maybe. Let's see. You're all better at this than I am. It's 45 Overlook. It's in that neighborhood, but I don't look. Yeah. So I guess that's where's Overlook, Lee, but I'll make a star child seminars. That's North. That's North. That's North Amherst. I think so. Yeah. Okay. All right. The only thing I don't like is, um, I like to put notes in the, in the property for why we're doing anything. Yeah. I would like to try and see why we would be doing this on our records for anything, really, you know, when someone does an abatement or, or, you know, they're feeling that they're having an intimacy. Can you tell when the action was taken, what the date was early in the year? This one says the, um, so this sounds like a, um, sounds like the bill on a house lot, but why it got, why it got separated out? I don't understand. Yeah. I'm not sure why it was separated out. Maybe it was missed. That's the only thing I can think of. That's maybe it was a late addition. But then why, why is it referred to as pro rata? A pro rata means that it's only a portion of the tax period that they're being taxed. You know what I think this is, is possibly an apportionment. Because, um, I know we've had a request for an apportionment, but it wasn't a recent sale, and it doesn't indicate that it's a recent subdivision. If you likely can table this until I know more about it. I don't think we can vote on it without knowing what it is. But I'm assuming, I'm inferring that the CPA is simply the surcharge on that property that corresponds to the, corresponds to the addition of that. You know what I can do that might help us resolve this and get this done with is, um, I might be able to just ask, um, Jennifer, you know, if she's aware of this particular one, so she can give me some insight. She was only around the corner if you want me to ask her. Okay, we're running out of, yeah, we, uh, Lee's got about 13 more minutes. Okay, let me, let me ask her because she's right in front of me. Okay. And that's the last thing on our agenda, other than the report. Okay. Okay. Just a second. Yeah. How are your knees doing? Better. But they, they're weird. I'm doing my, my, uh, weighted squats with 45 pound weights. I'm doing my leg press machine. Um, but, uh, I have some pain in the left one and I don't know what that's about. Uh, that I noticed when I'm in bed, uh, and other than that, um, they're coming along. I'm interested, I'm hoping that I can actually, even with COVID get to go up there and, and talk to my surgeon in August, which is the one year anniversary. Okay. Um, but, um, climbing mountain still seems a little, uh, distant. Well, some might, my wife, she, she still has the original needs, but they, she's had a lot of trouble with them. Her climbing mounds is no problem for it. It's walking on flat concrete roads. Oh no. For me, it's all, it's all about going down downstairs and down, and I'm better. I'm better now. And they, you know, they feel sturdier. There's just no doubt about that. But, um, All right. This is on me gentlemen. I forgot. Okay. Um, honestly, there's a follow up document that goes with this. And I just didn't realize it goes with, um, this document. And I typed it up. So I'm losing my marbles. What can I tell you? Uh-huh. Still got enough. I sure hope so. Let's get to it. There we go. So this is what's going on here. I'm going to just hit share. And we'll get to it. So that was my word documents, going all, where is the word document? Are you still in Adobe, Liz? Um, this particular document's words. So that's why I'm questioning why it is not letting me have that as a function. Oh, you know what though? It is in Word by Scanda. Screen sharing has failed to start. The window you selected is invalid. Okay. Well, how did I do that? Let's write that again. There it is. Yay. I did it. Good job. This is for closing. That's what this was about. So they are looking for the apportion taxes for July 15th is today, right? That's correct. Okay. And basically what happens is the closing is happening. So they're trying to apportion the taxes. Okay. That's what this is about. They're trying to remove the first 15 days of July from the taxes. Is that, is that based? Yeah. The first 15 days of the, of the fiscal year. Correct. All right. Okay. All right. Wow. This is great, Liz. Yeah. Well, I like doing spreadsheets like this because it helps to explain it to me. I even put the statute that way. All right. Wow. This is, wow. This is great. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Good job. And so this is much for me as it is for you to be honest with you. And as you can see, I couldn't make heads of tails of those other two documents. Okay. There's the CPA. All right. Okay. So, okay, I moved to approve the warrant for this particular property for the pro rat attacks. FY 2021 for, for six B dash 89 in the amount of $7,700. 7,770. I'm sorry. Excuse me. Excuse me. 7,770. Thank you for the correction, Lee. No problem. All right. I moved to approve that. I'm out. Second. All right. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. And then I also moved, I also moved to approve the CPA tax for that same parcel for FY 2021 and the amount of $171.73. Second. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Okay. So we're taking care of that. Thank you, Liz. That was great. Yeah. Oh, you're welcome. Hopefully I'll get better at this as time goes on. We only had one parcel that that happened in the entire town. Right. Right now. All right. Okay. All right. Trust me, there's lots of closings going on. What was the exemption for? Do we know? It was a group home. Oh, it was a one. It's going into a taxable status. Okay. All right. From exempt to taxable. Correct. Okay. All right. Do we have anything to do executive session on? We do. We do. We have two abatements to discuss. And I believe we can announce them before we go into executive session. We don't have the attendees, right? We don't have anybody on. We don't have anybody attending at this point. Okay. All right. Okay. Okay. So basically, we have two, one of them came in late. So we will not be able to discuss this, I believe, because Mr. Greg Baskham and Bonnie McCracken didn't file theirs until June the 30th. So I believe you cannot hear them because it is exceeded the time to hear them. So, and that was for property at 8 Chadwick Court and Echo Hill. And so they were late by how long were they late by? A couple of months, actually. A couple of months. Okay. All right. So there was a filing deadline and they missed it. Yep. All right. And have they been informed of what the deadline this was for an abatement on their property? This is interesting because it says here that they were applying for a senior application for tax relief. And they were late in applying even with the extension, unfortunately. Okay. There was a COVID-19 extension? We did have COVID-19 extensions. Okay. So they missed that too? Yeah. All right. Okay. All right. That's really unfortunate. So there's nothing for us to act on there. Is that right? Unfortunately, no. Okay. All right. There's nothing more that we can do. So that was an application for an exemption, right? This is an application for its senior exemption. Okay. And that's under Massachusetts statute 59 subsection 5. And that is for seniors. Okay. And they have a bunch of criteria that they have to meet in order to be eligible. Right. And the extension was to June 1st, right? Right. And this is coming in at, you know, June 30th, so they're well beyond the extension date, unfortunately. I think the only time that they would be eligible to appeal it, and they certainly can't appeal it as if they had extenuating medical conditions and so forth, and they can certainly appeal that. Okay. Okay. All right. Anything else? We do have an executive session for the property that was appealed by the Montgomery Mills, and I'll bring up that appeal. Do we officially have to move into executive session to be real? There's no one here. I'm just looking in the future. Is there a process we should be going through? There is. There is. There is. Ken, you're right. There is, and I need to get up to speed on it. Okay. The property we're going to consider is 134 Montague Road, and this is owned by W.D. Coles. Oh, hold on just a second. Sean, are you still there? Sean, he does seem to be here. Yeah, I want him to cut off the access from the outside since we're in executive session. Okay. I might be able to do it. You might be able to do it. I wonder how I do that. Okay. There's nobody there, but that's the point that access should be cut off when we're in access. Yeah. And it's still, somebody could pop in at any time at this point. Allow panelists to start video. I'm suggesting we go ahead and just watch to make sure nobody comes in, because if somebody comes in, we have to stop. Understood. Understood. You know what? Unfortunately, I've really got to learn a little bit more about this, but I think I can open a waiting room so that they have to get permission to come in. I'm looking at my time. So if we can. That's all right. Yeah. Okay. So let's get to the matter and, you know, this particular property is very complex. As you know, there's North Square, and then there's the commercial element below it. This is in North Amherst, on Coles Road and Montevue Road. You know where that is. Yes. The new high-rise apartments that are there, they're just now getting occupied, and they had Atkins there, and they had the commercial that was being built below those apartments. And, you know, based on the appeal that they've given us, is they have, you know, they're saying, well, hey, you know, we're losing our ad content, we're not making the profit we had anticipated at this juncture. But, you know, I asked David to bail this. The appeal that they gave us, as they said. And who is they? This would be W.D. Coles. And this would be Cinda Jones and her representative accountant, Ron Hite, Pell. I met with them. I reviewed the properties and so forth. You know, and I can see some of it as being genuine, but actually not for this appeal period. It would be for the next appeal period. You know, because one of the things that David pointed out to me is this is the determination of the land that got increased, not for the new construction. And that's where it gets really confusing for both the taxpayer and anybody, really, because we're determining the value as of January 2019. 2019. January 1, 2019 is what we're charged with establishing the value. And the value was established based on what they were getting for lease rates from the tenant, which would have been Beacon, who developed the apartments. And the introduction of COVID and the vacation of Atkins didn't even have any bearing at that point. So, you know, they're only when would the land be revalued? Does is it revalued every year? The land gets revalued. Well, you know, if it has more than a 10% fluctuation, and in this case, it's actively under construction, it's going to be looked at again for next for January 20. And even at that point, COVID and still not on the scope at that point. And, you know, they haven't stabilized the rents. Not only what happens with something that's under construction, just so you have an idea from an appraisal standpoint, we usually use the cost approach. But in this case, we're looking at land and the impact of the lease on the land. Now, as I recall, this came up in a meeting yesterday, didn't it? Yeah, I did. And somebody asked the question about this, how you value based on the state. And I did get a brief explanation. Normally, we use the cost approach to values for something that's under construction. I'm trying to remember the context in which it came up in a meeting yesterday. Basically, the contribution of what that apartment complex was going to bring to the area into the tax dollars. But they asked how we how we derive the value. Yeah, you use the example of a house with four bedrooms, if the kids move out. Yes. Well, yeah, remember that, Richard? I do remember that. Yeah. And I believe this came up in the context of Council member Shane, right, asking about the big complex there. Right. Yeah, because they're saying, hey, you know, with COVID, you know, having these apartments filled is going to be probably not happening right away. Yeah. And you know, still, we still have a wait and see kind of climate right now, what's going to be January's value. But January 20 is going to be what's going to be issued next year at this time. So what's your recommendation? Well, right now, neither the rent has been stabilized nor the we don't know what the expense information that we gather. I'm sending out income and expense information gathering for all these rental unit type properties so that we can get a clear understanding as well as the retail so that we can get a clear understanding of the impact of COVID. But in actuality, that won't even happen until not next June, but the following June. How much of an abatement did they ask for? They asked for, they said the value on their taxes was $2,669,100. They want $2,141,000,000. So that's quite a difference. I guess I'm confused. Is this subject to the lease that Beacon has on it? That's right. This is a clear increase based on what their lease agreement was with Beacon and how it impacted the land value. Because remember, they're keeping the land. Beacon only owns the structure, but they have a considerable lease period. But they're still going to have the land after all it's done on set. And the land is only worth what they can lease it for, basically. Excuse me, folks. I'm going to have to leave. I think this is another meeting or another call. They're asking for just so you have an idea, it's $528,100 in reduction. Thank you for attending. So this is for fiscal year 2021 that they're asking for this? This is for this, yeah, for this tax period. Okay. I'd like to see more. You'd like to see more. What is it you would like to see? Well, I just like... I can show you what they presented to us. So you're recommending a denial of this, right? Based on what David said to me, it does seem clear that they're only being taxed for the land and the land is based on what they were receiving for income. So yes, I would recommend denying it. Because I think what they're pointing out to us is for consideration next year, not this year. Well, but they're asking for, they're asking for this year, right? They are asking for this tax period to be reduced. This tax period, the bill in itself is actually gone to Beacon. It hasn't even gone to WD Coles. I'm completely confused. Yeah, exactly. And I wrote it down so that I could decipher what David said. Basically, this is what he said. Are you seeing the word document I have? So this is not... This is a... These are notes from David. These are summary notes of what I gathered from David's conversation with Coles and with their accountant. He said he doesn't think they're getting it. It's really two parts to this commercial property. There's the structures and then there's the land. The land is owned by the WD Coles Corporation and Ms. Jones, and that's the property that they're going to retain even after Beacon has started their apartments and so forth. However, the apartments and the rental units are not actually incorporated in this value. This value is only concerning the increases due to the only emblies, and that's what David had said. And he said the Ackens building value is based on January of 19, and the current difficulties have no relevance. Let me back up for a minute. And they just filed this in the last 30 days or months? Oh no, no, no. They filed this in February, February 3rd. Okay, so they filed it in February, and when do we have to... Yeah, before COVID. Okay. And when are we supposed to have responded to this by? We have extended the time, and they've given us that extension. So what's an extended extension? They are expecting a response. Let me show you their actual appeal in its entirety. What's an extended two? What date? They did not give us a particular date in which to respond. However, I think if they want to appeal to the Appellate Tax Board, we're going to have to give them some kind of response. Let's see here. Wow. Let me get to their abatement so you can see the physical abatement that they supplied. Okay, so I can share that's with you. Okay, so this is their physical abatement document. As you can see, they said 134 Montague Road. And, you know, they did give me an update. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Oh, sure. I'm so sorry. Here you go. The 1956 Hemloir Crane Billion. It's out of date and it's limited. But that's for Cottage Street. So you've already made the abatement on that one. Oh, yeah. So that's why I'm looking for the one that I'm holding in my hand is 134. This is for Cottage Street. Cottage Street. It's a little confusing. Sorry. Let me see if it's the other one. Because I do have, this is it. This is it. Can you see this, gentlemen? Yeah. Okay. So it says 134 Montague Road plus 116 Montague Road, 113 Poles, 75, 85 Poles, 125 Sunderland Road. Okay. All right. And that's all, all that property is under the beacon lease? All that property? Well, no, I think we made adjustments to everything but the 134 Montague Road. So we got apples and oranges here, then. Yeah, they threw everything in here. Um, but they're saying the value of the property for WB Poles has not gone up beacon ohms North Square buildings, which I just reiterated to you for another year or two when we received the 22,000 square feet as commercial condos. So that those commercial condos will remain with the, the Coles Corporation. And we will be leasing commercial for a dollar a year until then. So, you know, basically they are not paying on that commercial space. They're not paying on that, they're not paying on the apartments. Okay. I think where I need to start with this, you need to give us a breakdown of what the original value of all these things were before we increased it this last year. And then another column of all the items, you know, the increases, what the increases on all these different parts, because I'm confused where all these parts go. Okay. And so we could see what it spoke, you know, where is the big increase on what part of it? It's the land. It's only to the land. There was no structures. Okay, but it sounds like it's more than one piece of land. No, it's all one land. It's all one piece of land. It's all one piece of land. It's all one piece of land. This is the current record. Yeah. And as you can see, there is a residential component. And that's the land and so forth. That's portion to the apartments. And then there's a commercial component. But the land is actually the amount that actually got increased. So the land is... Stay, I don't see an increase here. I think that's... This is the new card? This is the new card or the old card? This is the one they're appealing on. Okay. I can bring up the one that they had last year so you can see where it varies. Let me bring up the number four. I guess I need to have the two cards broken out on the parts they're talking about. It looks like just two parcels of land here. Is that right? It's one parcel. It's just broken up between its uses. It's one parcel, yeah. Because they consider apartments as residential. Okay. Okay. Even though commercial appraisals rule saying... Okay. So the appraised land here says $572,400. Is that what they're questioning? That value? Questioning the increase in the property. Yeah. I don't think that they quite understand that the building didn't go up. It was the land that went up for the lease that they have with Beacon. And that's really what's driving the train. Because the structural values won't increase until next year. And that's going to be Beacon's anyway. We need to see a breakdown of all the what it was and what is now. Because I'm confused where they're asking for a half a million dollar reduction in the land shown here is only $572,000. Understood. And I'm actually bringing it out for you so that you can see what it was before it ended up here. I'm going to bring up the 19 card so that you can see that one. I don't know if I can fit the two of them on the same screen. That's the only thing that's got me baffled. Let's see if I can do it this. This is the 19. And it's $2,141,000,000. And that's what they're asking us to go back to. So they're asking us to go back to the assessment they had last year. Okay. Then that's more than the land then. It's not just the land because the land is only $572,000 on this. All right. Are you saying the one from 19 that I'm on right now? No, I'm seeing the other one. Okay. Let me bring up the one from 19. Let's see. I don't know what I'm going to do. I'll do those without messing things up. Someday I'll get better at this, I hope. I also think we're seeing the whole card. I mean, we're seeing in one card, but I think there are more than one card to this property. There's multiple structures, but there's only one piece of land. That's the difference. And I have it up here on the screen if I can figure out how to... All right. I'm going to stop sharing for a moment. Yep. I'm going to try and do that so that we can show you what I'm looking at here. So this is the old property card. Okay. And you see that card? Yeah, the land is 190 here. So you can see that $2,141 is where it was last year. Hang on, I'm still trying to follow. Where's the 190 figure Ken that you're talking about? A praised value summary right below the screen there. $198,000. Okay. All right. Okay. And then the current card is like $500 something. Yes. Okay. $572,000, right? Yeah. Something like that. So Les, you're saying that's the number that has changed. That's the only thing. That's correct. It's a land number. So we're focused on that. But they seem to be appealing the structural value. Wait a minute. You just said the land is the only thing they're talking about. But the land is the only thing that increased from last year to this year. But their appeal seems to be about the structures and their vacancies. You understand? Yeah. Remember, we're going back to January 1st of 2019. I need, I think the best thing is do a spreadsheet and give different year columns. And so we know what we're talking about. And then I guess looking at the land, how did we get up? How did we get the $198,000 back in 2019 on that card? How did we get that? How did we arrive at that? The $192,000 that they had prior. Yeah. Are you talking about, because I have the land at, you know, I don't like the way this is descriptive. Look down in the summary, down in the summary there. The land, well, I don't understand the summary. How does the praise bet land value of $198,000? What is that? We're up above. Okay. These are all previous. So don't look at the previous. No, I'm looking down below appraise value summary right below that. You're talking about this. Yeah. That says land is $198,000. What is that? I have no idea. That says building appraised land value building. That kind of oxymoron, to be honest with you. I think that's telling you that that's the land, the building sitting on, the building site. So it's irrelevant, really. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Go back up to the top then. Go back up to the top. So this has to do with the apartment. Anything that says residential has to do with the apartment. What it's demonstrating is this is the prime site, the 362, 300. But talk to us about the land. What is the land number there? What land value are you talking? The land value we're talking about here is 2,141, that is the land value. That's all just land. I know it says commercial and it does say residential. That's why I'm saying those descriptors are not very descriptive. Okay. That's all land. That's all land. And what, okay, what did the current year say? I forget. Current year, okay, and this is a map. Can you see the map that I'm bringing up? Yeah. Okay. So when you're, when you're looking at this map, North Square building is this, this is the pocket we're talking about here. Okay. And then these buildings in purple were not on it for this period, this cycle that they're being built for. That's, that's the point. And I think that's where Cinda and Ron are having difficulty understanding. And I had difficulty understanding it too because we're going all the way back to January. Yeah. But tell me what's the 2,001 in 2019, what's the land value for the current 2,002,005 now? For our current value, let me just bring that up. It's probably easier staying in this because you can see it, correct? So here's the land. I don't see any numbers. It's 2,669,1. Okay. You need to, we need a breakdown by columns on how, what changed and why it changed. I mean, that does seem like a huge increase if it's just, it's not just, it's not, not an abnormal increase. So why? And probably because not many people get a substantial lease like this. This is a substantial lease that they got from beginning. But 2019, didn't that show the lease value? No, no. That showed the model value for the commercial property. It didn't show the increase attributed to the approvals for the apartments and so forth going in. So the 2019 land value had no lease connected to it at all? No, that just had the model from the apartments and the commercials that we had in place. So you just took a cost approach, what land sells for in that area and put it together? Actually, that's more of a model that's put in the mass appraisal when we do a revaluation. But this had to substantiate where they were in that process at that time. So January of 18, they had the value for the, was it 2 million one? Okay. You know what I'm saying? And then they got approvals in place for the building of the apartments. And as you all know, approvals are worth a lot. If you get approvals on a piece of land and you sell that land, it comes with those approvals. So that includes the value. So that's where we got the information. We got the lease information. They actually received the payment for the commercial dollars already. Did the lease have anything to do with this except for they stole the land? They didn't sell it. They leased it. Okay. So are we doing an income approach on the income rent they're getting to value the land? Um, the amount of contracted lease or the land had an impact on the value. You understand? And when you executed the lease, which happened for January of 19, okay, that that predicated the increase to value. Okay. So we need to, at least I need to understand what happened, how the 2019 numbers came about. And then how do we move from those to the 2020, you know, what, assume you're valued by some kind of cap rate, the lease payment rent? No, because the cap rate wouldn't play a role at this point. I don't think that they would do that. It's based on the, nice, I'm going to give a good explanation of this. I suppose it is on the income approach to some degree. Well, if you consider the lease, I would think you'd have to be. But if you don't consider the lease, then it wouldn't. The lease definitely played a role in executing it, but, you know, it's based on, you know, what can you sell that property for with those approvals in place and the lease in place? Well, if it's subject to the lease, the only thing you're selling is an income stream then. Well, yeah, it is. And therefore, you have to capitalize that some way to come up with a value. The only way to capitalize it is to have sales of light property, you know, it's kind of tough. So, basically in a nutshell, they want us to go back to what the value was in 2019 before the execution of the lease. Yeah, I guess we just need more information on how the 2019 numbers came about, and then how the 2020 numbers came about. Okay, so, you know, I know that I did not do take part in this calculation. I'll research the information and see if I can get more concise. Yeah, no, I mean, I'm sure David was pretty much involved some way. Oh, I'm sure he was. I'm sure he was. Yeah, I mean, you might need, how's he doing? Um, you know, he's been suffering. He really has been suffering. So, he still has surgery on schedule or not? Yeah, he's still trying to do that, but you know. And at July. Like they say, you know, if you get older, you don't. It's not for wimpy people, is it? No, surgery is tough. I don't know which is worse, the tests of the surgery, and all the way, you know, hurry up and wait, you know. So, I feel for him because he's been really showing up. He's been trying to support the office and the town. And he's not always doing his best when he gets here. Yeah, he certainly operates in a professional manner. He never lets you know that he's hurting, but you can tell, you know. Okay, well, I guess I'm available when you think you have the information together, you get back together on some kind of call. Okay, so basically what you're saying at this time is we need, you need more information in order to make an. Right, for the two years, you know, how we did 2019 to come up with the land value and then how, what changed and how we arrived at the 2020 land values. Okay, so. Where I think that's a wrap game, except for now I have my report. And I'm sorry to keep you all falling on. But, you know, basically. Anybody else still on? No, I'm having a double of a time following. I need to see the paperwork they submitted. And so I can follow exactly what it is that they are, we're appealing. So, well, the paperwork they submitted. That's what I was showing you there. But I can store copies. I'm saying we can do this at a future date. I just, I need to think through this in an orally fashion. I don't think this was done. I assume that they felt they had a reasonable basis to make this request. So I'm just trying to understand it. That's all. Oh, absolutely. As a matter of fact, I have an email I'd like to share with you. And actually I'd also like to have Lee involved in it too. Sure. So the three of us, so the three of us have reviewed it and understand it. And right now I have to say Ken has helped a bit, but I don't really understand it. So I want to share this with you before we close. This was a letter to me. Is Ron held, is Ron held their attorney? He is their account manager. Accounting manager. Okay. Yes. Yeah. And I will say we have a great rapport. You know, anytime I have questions, I can pick up the phone and ask him questions. And David's been wonderful explaining this. But I'll be honest with you, when I first heard the explanation, I had difficulty grasping this because it is like a 99-year lease. And they received a lump sum. And, you know, from what David said, the lease predicated the increase for fiscal 2020. And that's what they're appealing. But this is, you know, I asked Ron if they had anything further to present with their appeal. And this is what he sent me. He said, hi Liz, I reviewed the abatement application for 134 Montague Road. I know we've discussed numerous things along the way. Things that were discussed in one form or another would include the status of the building at 75 to 85 poles, the commercial space still owned by Beacon. You understand? So that commercial space is those structures are being built to Beacon because they own those structures still. And only partial completion, which is true. They're only partially complete. None of the space is built out and no prospective tenants outside of our general store after the build out, as well as 113 poles recently developed that the tenant is vacating and no prospect for tenant. And that's the Acons property. Acons, Acons parts property. But these buildings, as he stated in his own statement, belong to Beacon. Yeah, I guess I'm thinking out just back a big picture. It's really important. I think that we all get this off on the right foot because this could be around for a long time. And it's a very, as you pointed out, Liz, it's a very complex situation with the lease and everything involved. And you thought about maybe asking the consultant that we use to come in and help you overlook this to get it off the right start. Because David had intimate knowledge in this, I felt that he would have a pretty good understanding. But I would feel good about getting the cap rates and so forth that were utilized in this. And when I go to the income streams on this field part, it's hard for me to discern what he utilized as part of it. When I go to the assessment history, usually they tell you whether it says it's using the cost approach. Oh, no, I'm sorry. I'm on the wrong one. Let me go to the right one. So Beacon has a 99-year lease on the property? Yeah. Okay. All right. On the ground. It's a ground lease. Yeah. So I think he really, I mean, talk to David too to think, but this is one of the most complex structures we have in town. And it might be worth, I'd strongly look at bringing the consultant in to work with you. Because it's not just going to be a one-time thing. It's going to be several years. Right now it's, it'd be easy part because we're on the land. Yeah. But it's going to be a, yeah. Well, it's important I think for the board to understand it. Yeah, absolutely. And I, and I actually, I actually think all three members of the board should understand it. Sure. So, so we have to sort of be taken through this, I think. Would you like me to try to get a, like a narrative from the consultant to try to explain this? Yes. Okay. Yeah, I think it's, it'd be worthwhile. I mean, get David's input, but I think you really need to bring the consultant in to be able have on call because Dave's not going to be on call all the time. No, I understand that. This is going to go, this is going to go for years before you get this settled down. Well, and eventually I'll have more familiarity with you. Now, when you, Ken, when you say, when you say it's going to go for years, you mean, what do you mean by that? Well, until they get stabilized income and, you know, it's, they, until they lease departments up and they know what kind of income stream they're presenting, that's going to be a year or two away probably. And then it's going to change. Yeah, yeah. Because January of 2020, they hadn't been leasing. I was out there. It was still empty apartments and they hadn't even finished pouring the floors on the commercial space. And the commercial space calls owns, right? I'm sorry? The commercial space calls owns. No, no, at that point it was owned by Beacon and it's, and it was recently turned over. Okay, but in the future, you're going to be sending a bill to calls for the commercial space. That's right. Okay, that's going to be entirely income stream. And that's going to be an income approach. And so the apartments won't, you won't do anything with those because they're not, they're Beacons. Well, yeah, Beacon will be the ones that will be able to appeal if they wish to. Yeah. So it's, I'd strongly recommend you bring a consultant to give an overview and a proposal on how you'd look at this and share with the board. Sure. I will say that they were very forthcoming. They provided income and expense information, but the income and expense information that they provided were not retroactive to January of 19. That's one thing that's a little bit difficult. And it doesn't mean anything right now because it's doesn't mean anything to this appeal. But if they choose to appeal in future, yes. And unfortunately the they really So feel free. I mean, the consultant can kind of join us on a meeting too on this one property here. Sure. And you know what I'll do is I'll invite Ron or Cinda to join us perhaps. No, I don't think so. Not until we have a better understanding. No, I don't want to just demonstrate my ignorance at this point. Yeah. No. Well, I certainly don't think you're ignorant first of all. No, I'm not, but I'm having trouble following this one. We're only in the dark about a few things. So I would like to go to the second Thursday in August. Second Thursday in August, okay. Unless there's a time sensitivity with this that we have to be aware of. Well, they do have, they do have an opportunity to appeal to the ATB. All right. And that and that's triggered by what? There's like you deny their appeal. Yeah. But the denial then creates a There's the time frame. Yeah. If we don't respond, basically what happens is if you take no action on this and what I'm asking is when I'm asking is what is the deadline for our decision on this? Well, in a normal year, it's already passed because you only have three months to make a decision. But what they've extended allowed us to extend it. What is the date now? Or is there no date really? There is really no date that's that's been that coals is allow us to extend to. But, you know, we wouldn't want to exceed their opportunity to appeal to the tax board. What is that? Take no action on this. They have what? What is that? What is that deadline for their right? I don't want to affect their right to appeal either. I'm just trying to figure out how long we have to think about this. Well, let me see what Teresa sent out with our appeals because it gave an explanation. And I do have a copy of that. Let me see if I can find that because it explains the time frame that they have to appeal. I'm not even sure if it's that accurate because of all the extensions the governor has given us. I guess I'm I'm is the 7585 coals. Is that a different parcel from the 134 Montague Road parcel? Um, I'm just completely 7585. Yeah, it's a different property. Okay, so I guess I'm I'm going to try and bring up the map. I guess what is the relevance? Let's wait. Let's I got to run here. I can't let's not go back to the map. I mean, okay, let's what we need to know if they're running a date for appeal because I'm with we don't want to let them not have the chance to appeal. That's right. That's exactly that's my concern is is is you know, you know, I don't want to cut off their right to appeal. Um, it says you have, um, you may appeal to the disposition of your application to the pump tax board, or if the application to the county commissioners, the appeal must be filed within three months of the date of assessors acted on your application. Okay, fine. So that so our action triggers the the amount of the appeal time the time they have to appeal. Yes. Okay. So, so, um, but in that same breath, the paragraph says the assessors have three months from the date of application to file an act on or unless agreed in writing before the expires, which they did, if the assessor do not act on your application within the original or extended period, it is deemed denied. So what did they agree in writing to what date? Let me just go back to that because I believe they just said that we could continue until we they'd allow us enough time to to act on it. But let me just double check with Ron here. We've gone back and forth a lot on this. I'll be honest. So I guess if you talk to Ron and say Ron, is there already if we extend this until August 20th? I'm sure he'd give us that time. Well, it would be August 13th is the second Thursday. I'm just I don't want the same date. They're meeting need more discussion after the meeting. Oh, I see. Okay. All right. Yeah. So just pick a date like August 20th. I don't know what they pick a date later than our meeting though. So we have more time to talk if we need to or and get it back in writing from them. Okay. And then and then I guess I'd I'd say let's have a make sure you can do this with the consultant to have him get up to speed and be able to do this in the next month here. Okay. To help help you build a recommendation that we can fully understand. My presumption is you're going to deny the application, right? Are you that's that's what you want to see. Based on what David has shared with me, it feels relevant. Okay. So so that means we have to make sure that we give them the opportunity to appeal. After we understand why we're denying it. Exactly. Exactly. I see what your point is. Sure. Okay. Sure. Absolutely. You know, and I'm trusting David has provided, you know, the the right assessment based on the information that I bet he has to. I just want to make sure I get it. I want to know it myself. So, yeah, honestly, gentlemen, I'm in a similar position as yourselves. I'm curious to see how the least impact. Okay. All right. Okay. I'm running out of time too. But I, yeah, I still have a consultant come on board on this. It's just too complex a deal that's going forward. It's not just one time. Look at it. Okay. I'm, I'm moved to, I'm moved to, I'm moved, I moved to adjourn to August 13th. Okay. Okay. All right. You're great. Okay. We got it. Okay. But we're available if you need to contact us before then. Yes, we are. Okay. Basically, I just wanted to give you my, my update because, you know, we've had some movement. I did both my opinion that I felt that our office, you know, cutting our office at this point would be difficult. And they heard me. They really didn't hear me. Okay. The problem we have right now is Teresa is going to be out four to six weeks. Once that start struggling health wise, and he's going in for surgery. And she's already out. She's gone. Oh, yeah. She's gone from the next four to six weeks. So are you the only one you think enough for Teresa? You might want to offer a line because it's pretty scary surgery. So who is doing your support work? No one. Oh my God. Yeah. So yeah. Have you talked to somebody about sharing somebody? Well, that's the thing that the reason I try to put some oomph to it, if you will, because we've been asking a leisure services to give us back. Stephen Casey, he's the gentleman that was at central services. And I think he's a great candidate to train, do some support services. Teresa's made it clear that she's going to be retiring when she's, when it's possible for her. And we were talking only a couple years here. So I'm going to be me, myself and I, and I'm not going to have enough support to get out to 4,800 places to inspect for 2023. And I'm also going to try and do a lot more to increase your your coffers, if at all possible, from the state. And just not going to have enough, not enough of me to go around. I'm putting in extended hours now. And, you know, at some point I'm going to run out. So yeah, the, you know, Sean is great. He understands the situation. He's been reaching out to Jen and Cheryl to find out what we can get from the collector's office. They extended Stephen, except Stephen was parts out to the leisure services. The leisure services is reluctant to leave it to, you know, to lose this valuable employee as well. So they keep pulling him back to be either at the golf course or Pumper's pond. And they're saying, hey, no, he needs to be here full time to cover the assessor's office. So what do you need from us? You know, basically what I'm, what I'm looking at is, you know, when they're talking about cutting the assessor's office in any way, shape, or form, elected, like to see members show up, you know, to at least hear what's going on and support the office. 13 people in inspection services all doing data entry that filters through this office. There's four people or five people in the collector's office. There's three full time people in the town clerk's office. There is at least five or six in finance. And I've got one and she's out. Yeah, that's not going to work. Um, but David did recommend. Have you talked to Paul? Is Paul, um, you know, I talked to Sean because he's my immediate supervisor. Okay. Dr. Sonia, because she was the interim finance director and she's far, she's a controller. I made my position pretty clear in it. And actually Evelyn, the HR director agreed with me. She felt that, you know, they were leaving me short. But it was David's recommendation to cut it down to half time. And her position hasn't been filled since December. Yeah, but you don't have anybody now. That's not, that was not in the works. I got nobody. Yeah. I mean, can you, can you? Steven, I have to train from the round up. He has no training. Yeah. I mean, what is there things that can take off your plate? Well, shut down your office as far as people coming in from outside. And there is no people coming in from outside. Okay. So nobody bugs you. No, no. And Teresa was being put on the central service counter two half days a week. And on his backup for a full day every week. So three days out of the five days, I wasn't even getting her. It didn't leave me a lot of time to work on the things I have to work on. No. You know, but I guess what I'm asking, what is on your plate? You can just say, we can't do that anymore. Um, I think the problem I have is it's very difficult for me to try to schedule inspections without having office coverage to service the people now. Wait a minute. What are those people servicing? Phone calls, emails, letters, the forms, the application forms that go out to the public and they have to come back and get processed, all those things, transfers of title, changes of address, all that stuff is stuff that's going on every day. Yeah, a butters list and the list goes on. And we're a college community and a college community has a lot of communication with the taxpayers because you have a number of students that don't stay in one place, do they? They move and they transfer their cars to another state or they move out of state to take on their occupations. So we get a lot of folks that are saying, hey, I don't live here, change my address. Hey, I don't owe this whole bill. I need to get it adjusted. So that creates a lot of volume and we have almost 40,000 people. I look, Liz, anything you can take off your plate, talk to your manager about taking it off your plate because there's nobody else that can do valuations. And I'd lay the groundwork of you're going to have to hire a lot of outside inspection work coming down the road. All right. And that's one of the things that David had recommended was carrying the consultant fee into the next fiscal year so that we could utilize his talents. But when I talked to him, that's one of the things that was a little disturbing. He said he didn't like the new version of the mass appraisal system we were going into. And that it would cost us more to have data entry into that system. So it makes sense for us to try and get in-house staff to learn how to do this data entry so we don't have to pay a higher level of cost. Sure, but if you don't get the staff, there's no option. You've got to pay the higher level and go outside. Pay the higher level. Okay, take a breath. I'm still very glad to be here. And I'm glad to be with the people of Amherst. We don't want to see you burned out either. You know, my daughter said, why didn't they give me the passcode? Okay, thank you very much. Well, thank you. And is this meeting adjourned? All right, this meeting is adjourned to August 13th. I'm assuming you have somebody to prepare the paperwork for August 13th. Yes, I will make sure it's prepared for you. Okay, all right. As far as anybody to do it, I'm not sure about that, but I'll make it. All right, thank you. Bye-bye. Good afternoon. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Is this a good question? I'm not even sure how to end this. I'm hitting leave meeting. Yeah, I'm having a hard time hitting the leave thing. Let's see. I've got so many windows open at this point that I have to kind of close them down to see where I can hit the leave thing. Okay, there we go. Sean, you all set?