 Today we're excited to welcome someone who inspires entrepreneurs everywhere. Jason Pfeiffer joins us to talk about his podcast, his book, and his role as editor-in-chief of Entrepreneur Magazine. This is School of Hustle, the show where we find advice and inspiration from people who are making their own way. I'm Shannon, the VP of social here at GoDaddy, and I live and breathe the hustle of business. Today we're filming from the hustle of it all at the WeWork Times Square in New York City. Everybody, let's please give Jason a big warm welcome. Alright! Hey, thanks for having me. I am so happy to have you here. I'm happy to be here. The last time I saw you was on the panel at the Interim Free Party in New York City. That's right, and the microphones stopped working and we all had to just yell to the audience. You were the perfect person to do that. You're so great at public speaking. Thank you. I mean, you're fantastic. What is it about public speaking that you love so much? It's clear that it comes natural to you. I come from a storytelling background. I started as a journalist, as a newspaper reporter, and then I got into magazines, and I kept redefining what it was that I do. And then I came to this realization, which I think is an important realization for anybody in their career, which is to identify the thing that is so core to you that you can express it in any number of ways. That every job you have can revolve around this core thing. It's not just being a writer or a specific kind of writer. For me, it's about being a storyteller. And once I realized that, I wanted to excel in every kind of storytelling that I could do, which is why I stopped just thinking of myself as a writer and started being a speaker and a podcaster and a novelist. I just wanted to extrapolate as much as possible. Tell us about your podcast. What is it called and what is it all about? Okay, well, I have two of them. Okay. So one of them is called Problem Solvers. And if you can believe it, it is about entrepreneurs solving problems in their business. I make that one for entrepreneurs. And so that's a weekly show. And then number two is called Pessimists Archive. And that is a history show about why people resist new things. What is one of those things in your podcast that people were shocked and resisted the most? One of my favorites is recorded music. So when recorded music technology first dawned, here was one of the arguments against it. This came from John Philip Sousa, who was a famous composer at the time. We know him now as the guy who made all the marches. Like that's John Philip Sousa. So he argued that when you bring like a record player into the home, it's going to replace all forms of live music in the home, which means that mothers will no longer sing to their children. And because children grow up to imitate their mothers, the children will grow up to imitate the machine. And thus we will have created a generation of machine babies. An actual argument that he made against recorded music and he was not alone. But this is the thing. This is the thing. People are afraid of new inventions. They're afraid of the way that it creates change. I think John Philip Sousa was afraid of his livelihood disappearing because he was a live music conductor. But over time we can move past that. And we can realize that in fact it adds. It integrates. There's a time for recorded music and there's a time for live music. And that is the essence of embracing innovation, is to understand that you don't just lose, you gain. How do you go about building out your show? And how do you know whether or not your plan was successful or not? Well that's a really good question. You have to know what success looks like. And success can mean so many different things. And I think for podcasting because a lot of people want to get into podcasting and they have to understand that success in any measurable way comes very slowly. Like podcasts are very, very difficult to gain audiences for. And so you have to start thinking what is your version of success? Because success for me when I first started podcasting was simply make a podcast. Learn how to do this. Learn how to talk on mic. Learn how to write scripts in this way because I wasn't used to writing scripts to be read aloud. I was used to writing articles that would get just read in your head. And how did you go about learning that skill set? It was trial and error. It was a lot of revisions. It was talking to people who do it. I think that people often overlook the value of just seeing what's out there in the world and then trying to understand it. And so when you read or you listen and you think very critically about how are they pacing this show? How did they structure this show? How many acts is it in? And once you see the architecture of it and you can understand how the great people who create these things are doing that, you can start to replicate it. And I'm sure when you listen to yourself after the fact you learn a lot that it's self-critiquing, right? Do you do that? All the time. All the time. I listen over and over and over again to everything that I do. I go through it over and over again. And I found, especially in my early career when I was writing for those first few community newspapers that just having written something and then seeing it in the paper the next day was the most helpful process. Once it's like a finished product and you can't go in there and change it, you can see all its flaws. And then I think it's just up to you to be able to swallow that and say, okay, I can appreciate that yesterday wasn't as good as I want tomorrow to be. I love that advice. It applies to so many things. Yeah. Not just podcasts. That's right. It applies to everything. It does. We always have to be okay knowing that we are not as good at something as we would like to be. You do write, like you said, and you wrote a book with your wife. I did. And it's called Mr. Nice Guy. Yes, it is. I have to ask, is Mr. Nice Guy about you? You know, I have gotten that a lot. I would flatter myself to say that I think I'm a nice guy, but no, it wasn't. Because it's a romantic comedy. So it's not a nonfiction book. It is a story about, I love explaining this at like entrepreneurship conferences because everyone expects that I wrote a business book. I wrote a romantic comedy with my wife about two people who each week sleep together and then critically review each other's performance in a magazine. That's what that book is about. And so it's set in the magazine world. It is definitely drawn a lot from our own experiences dating in New York and making our way through our careers. But it is a complete work of fiction. That's just hilarious. In addition to these things, you know, you're so creative and such a strong storyteller. You have a pretty serious day job. Yes. You're the editor-in-chief of entrepreneur magazine. I am. Can you tell us about your journey to earn just such an impressive role and title and such an impressive publication? Yeah, thank you. So here's the most important thing I think that anybody who's looking at anybody who has like a cool job should understand which is that that probably wasn't their path. At least it wasn't their anticipating path. Right? I could have never told you at the beginning of my career or frankly right before I got this job that the thing that I would end up doing is being editor-in-chief of entrepreneur magazine or any business magazine or possibly any magazine. It just wasn't part of the path. I have learned over my career that the most important thing to do is to just learn and put yourself in learning environments and move forward and not be concerned with a very narrow idea of what your goal is and how to get there. I took a job at the right time as executive editor of a magazine and then the editor-in-chief left and I was the guy who was like first in line to pitch myself as the guy to get the job and I got it. But all the other stuff is what got me to that moment and gave me the skills that I could present to entrepreneur and say look I'm the guy for you. Wow. Thank you so much for opening up and sharing all of that. Of course. It's what I'm here for. I think you're going to be really good at this next part. Okay. It's called a puzzle time. One thing you want in Desert Island with you. An iPhone. Chardonnay, yay or nay? Nay. Favorite pastime music or movies? Music. First place you visit when you retire? Australia. Early bird or night owl? Night owl. Coffee or tea? Tea. Favorite part of your day? The morning. Best part of your workout? I don't do that. Personal trainers. Too much cash. Great. Yay or nay as a flavor? Yay. New York or London? New York. Ideal fix-it day. Ideal fix-it day? Yeah. Saturday? Would you rather visit Likers Castle or Peppermint Forest? I didn't hear that. Peppermint Forest. M&M's or Skittles? M&M's. Favorite workout arms, legs or abs? Abs. Favorite New York State course attraction? The Island. Time it takes to get ready in the morning. 20 minutes. Peanut butter, Keppster M&M's? M&M's. Would you rather have more time or money? Time. Favorite breakfast food? Granola. Number 10's tricky to pass your driver's test. One. Last person you texted? My wife. If a genie granting you three wishes, what would you wish for? Ah, those are three things. Time, money and vacations. Large-shox or lap dogs? What did I do? Large-shox or lap dogs? Oh, lap dogs. Okay. What was it? What was the count? 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 20. Favorite part of the day is whenever I'm talking one-on-one with entrepreneurs. That's, like, way more exciting for me now than writing for a mass audience is actually just specifically having a conversation and helping one person. Best piece of advice you've ever gotten? I got this job and everyone started asking me for interviews and then they started talking to me like I was a thought leader and they started presenting me like you did at the very beginning. We're like, he inspires lots of people and that totally made me uncomfortable at first because I had never been talked about that way and I tried to reel it back in. My takeaway is, like, give yourself permission. Like, just whatever the situation is, you don't feel like you're there but people want you to give yourself permission. Worst piece of advice? If somebody gives me that advice, I just forget it. I just don't listen to them. I have no idea what the worst piece of advice was. How do you use your career to inspire others? You know, can I say, I get a lot of pitches from people who want me to write about them and their reasoning for why they want me to write about them is because they have done something inspiring and they want to inspire other people. And I always think that's garbage. You want the attention. You don't want to inspire people. So I feel a little awkward answering that because I feel like how do I, because I'm successful, I inspire other people. I don't know. But what I have done is I've thought a lot about what makes successful people successful and I've tried to communicate that and really engaging in entertaining ways and I hope that inspires me. Have you ever felt like walking away? No. But I have gone on vacation and realized while I was like, like my wife and I took a month from Asia before we had a baby. And while I was there, I realized I don't think I would need to come back. Like, like if something changed and I needed to stay here in Japan, I think I could just do it. One thing you need to learn. Coding. It's gonna be really helpful to know coding. I don't know it at all. What do you want people to learn from you? That there are a million ways to do something. I think that people stick themselves on singular paths and the message that I have over and over again, whether it's entrepreneur magazine or pessimist archive, is that change is inevitable and that the greatest thing to do is be able to embrace and use that. What's next for you? Good question. I don't, you know, I mean, I don't know. I used to think I need to stay in magazine. I don't think that anymore. I'm really happy to be at a magazine brand, but I don't need it the way that I used to, and that's very liberating. Who inspired you? I'm really inspired by the people that I meet all the time, and I feel like I'm a real collector, so I don't look to individual people. I look to, like, the collection, and then I take what's useful. Who challenges you? My kids. I'm sure that's a very common answer, but it is definitely true. I thought I was a more patient person until I had kids, and then I realized that I'm not as patient as I thought I was. Well, we let everyone in social know that you were coming. Yes. And we have some questions. Great. Okay. Now, Sophia is a past guest on School of Hustle. She's with Silly Chili Hot Sauce. I know her. A lovely person asks, how do you motivate employees who are not fulfilling their tasks? You know, that's a very good question. The answer, I just went through this recently with somebody, is to be super direct and honest with them. Like, just be open. Here's the thing. I think that people recognize when they're screwing up. I think they do. I mean, we've all been there. The times where I've had a job and a boss sat me down and said, basically, you suck at this, but in nicer words, I knew I sucked at it, right? But I just didn't step back. There was no reason for me to reorient. And so I think it's really helpful to just have totally open, honest conversations and say, listen, this clearly isn't working for one reason or another. Let's talk about why it's not and see if this is still something that we both want to be a part of together. Absolutely. Chandon asked, I was in search of an internship. Can you get me one in your firm? Okay, wait a second, Chandon. In your firm tells me that that is not a directed inquiry. Nobody would call entrepreneur your firm. So here's what I would tell you, Chandon. Be specific. Reach out individually. Get to know the place that you're reaching out to. Think about how you can bring value to them and then show them the value that you have to offer. Because when people see value, they want it, and then they will give you what value you're looking for. Well, there's one last piece of advice. The advice we've all been waiting for. Yes. For Noodle. Our resident hug. I mean, I think Noodle has been waiting for this most. Noodle, you were a large dog. Yes. Noodle. Oh my God. Yes, you're a big Noodle. We like to call Noodle entrepreneur. Hi Noodle. He runs his own influencer business on Instagram. He stars in School of Hustle. He gives Jonathan a real run for his money. What advice do you have for someone who wants to master more than one business at a time? Well, first Noodle, I would say, you know, don't take on too much at the same time because you don't want to overload yourself. You have to really focus on what it is that you're doing and do it well before you move on. Noodle, will you look at me? I'm giving you advice. Noodle. Noodle. I know that this is difficult to hear, but you need to really listen if you're going to pick up this information. So I would say that Noodle, what you need to do is you need to break out the tasks so that they feel manageable. Build out your day or your week or your month in a way in which you can devote the right amount of time, manageable amount of time to everything that you're doing so that you can really tackle things and not feel like you understand everything at 25%. Because that is a way, Noodle, that is a way to build a house of cards that falls down. That's really great advice. We like to close with a final quote. Can we read three quotes? And I'd love you to tell me which quote inspires you, resonates with you, that you like the most? Sure. And one. Okay, number one. Yes. A comfort zone is a beautiful place, but nothing ever grows there. That's true. Number two. Persistence can change failure into extraordinary achievement. Number three. The only real mistake is the one in which we learn nothing. Mmm. These are all very good. I agree with them all. I'm going to go with a comfort zone as a beautiful place, but nothing ever grows there. Because the thing that I see over and over again with successful entrepreneurs is that they are always willing to push themselves out into uncomfortable places and then do it so often that the discomfort becomes comfortable. That they're so used to being uncomfortable that it doesn't register as uncomfortable anymore. And at that point, you're free to do anything. That, that is freedom. Well, thank you. Thank you. I enjoyed this. I enjoyed it. Noodle, did you enjoy it? Oh, you enjoyed it. Yeah. I didn't know everyone else did too, and they probably want to follow you, your podcast. One horse. Tell folks how they can find you on social and see more. Sure, sure. So you can find me on social at apifr at h-e-y-f-e-i-f-e-r on Twitter or Instagram. You can also go to jasonpifr.com where you can get links to my podcasts, problem solvers, and pessimists archive, as well as sign up for my newsletter, The Pfeiffer Five, which is the five insights on entrepreneurship that you need to know that much. I would do all of that. And I would also follow Go Daddy and Cross Social too because we are bringing fabulous entrepreneurs like Jason into the fold every week. So we're bringing more inspiration, conversation advice, and all that good stuff every week. Thank you so much for watching. Thank you. And here's more time next week. Bye.