 Hello and welcome to NewsClick. Today we are going to discuss the topic of demonetization and we have with us here today Mr. Venkata Chalam, the General Secretary of AIBEA, All India Bank Employees Association. Sir, RBI has been giving different figures on demonetization during between, since the day the demonetization has started until December 30th, it has been giving various figures which did not match with each other and after that it totally stopped giving figures. Now we don't know how much of the money has come back into the system. So, can you tell us about it? Sir, you are right, they have been either avoiding to give figures or they have not been informing the people what exactly it is. Now, I think before the parliamentary committee have stole some 9 lakh crore but the fact remains that the acute shortage of cash in the branches which normally we were getting in the past before November 8th, we don't have that. Sir, so there is on one side the demonetization that people need cash, there is also on the other side the demonetization part that how much of the old currency that RBI has with it now because it has stopped releasing figures, there are various figures being quoted in the press that 97%, 95%. So, can you tell us about it? See, they said that the 500,000 rupees notes that constitutes about 85% of the total notes printed by them, that is about 15 lakh crore. And now we find that everything has almost come in, they say 96, 97% everything has come to the banks and banks have kept it in the currency chest. So, it is wrong to say that we are counting, the Reserve Bank need not count. All the 4000 and 10000 currency chests are held by the banks on behalf of RBI. The moment I remit to the currency chest 10 rupees, online Reserve Bank will know that some bank has remitted 10 rupees in their account. So, they know it now. So, they are simply doping the people saying we don't know 95%, 97%. And the main point is that they said about 56 lakh crores will not come back because they are all black money. Now, that's not true. According to the term, the bulk has come already. So, where is the black money? That is the objective of the whole demonetization. I think the whole purpose is not served. It's defeated. So, do you think that Reserve Bank is deliberately withholding the data? See, it appears Reserve Bank is caught in between. Reserve Bank has to oblige the government. They are no longer independent. And whatever government wanted, they are doing, but they are not able to fully justify. Somewhere they also said we never wanted the demonetization. We have been telling them despite that government have decided. So, I think unwittingly now RBI has become the villain of the piece. Sir, you also mentioned about currency chess. We have heard in a lot of times in the newspapers that RBI has not kept track of the currency that has gone from currency chess to the bank branches because of which a lot of money has been caught. We heard in the news that money has been caught. But we don't, that money could not be traced to any bank branch because Reserve Bank has not kept track. So, is that a normal thing or is it something unusual and unique that happened this time? See, in the banking system, the banks dispense with the cash. Number one, the branch where the customers have the account. We give them cash. We accept checks and give cash. That's one. Second, we have the currency chess on, we have the RBI, but within the bank, they deal only with the branches. They don't deal with the customers. So, whenever branches want cash, their currency chess of that bank on behalf of RBI will supply cash to the branch, but they don't, they are not empowered to dispense cash to any public. The third point is RBI itself. RBI dealing with the public, RBI is also dealing with the banks. So, whenever we want any currency chess wants, RBI will give cash. That's the third point. There is a fourth element, the ATM filling contractors. That's a new one. So, these people can draw money from the bank or they can draw from the Reserve Bank of India. Most of the banks have outsourced these ATM maintenance. So, they simply give a letter. The ATM contractors go to the Reserve Bank of India, take huge bulk cash and what they do with that, they are supposed to keep it inside the ATM. Many ATMs are not working. So, maybe they are leaking out the cash, but Reserve Bank will know because these are all not small amount, huge amount, 50 crores, 80 crores, 90 crores, 40 crores like that. So, from where the money has gone out, they'll be easily able to tell. Sir, there was an argument for the demonetization that the money that comes back from demonetization will help recapitalize the public sector banks. So, how true is that argument? It is totally wrong. People do not know what is recapitalization. Whenever we do more business to cover that risk, so we need capital and to some extent the government is giving, to some extent the banks are going public and they are doing demonetization, money has come in that has nothing to do. That is an illegal money. So, that money it is Reserve Bank of India. Bank has nothing to do. Government on its own have to give some more money as capital. That's a different one, but it has nothing to do with demonetization. It's a wrong understanding of people. We have heard from in the newspapers that the credit of take-to-small-scale industries has been affected due to demonetization. So, how true is it? It is true partially because there is no demand because of demonetization, there is cash shortage. So, people have no cash and so, naturally the retail business, the small-scale industry, the rural sector, everywhere there's a cash crunch and the business is totally affected. So, when there is no money to purchase, money is with the bank, but the people are not having money to purchase. So, they have no money to purchase. So, they do not demand. When there is no demand, they don't want to manufacture. Many factories are going only one shift, two shifts or three shifts. So, naturally they don't need money. What they will do with the money taken from the bank because they can't produce and sell. So, that is why credit of take is not there. Sir, in the initial days of demonetization, the Prime Minister has declared that demonetization is to fight the black money. But later the whole agenda has shifted to cashlessness, that demonetization will bring cashless economy. See, going cashless or digital is a laudable objective anyone can welcome. Even if you don't want, it will overtake because science and technology cannot be stopped in any society and India is no exception. So, that's okay. But what is the speed? What is the process by which we can achieve that objective? As of now, it is 97% cash driven economy. So, we can slowly, slowly increase digital and reduce cash. But it cannot become zero overnight. See, even now we have about 2.5 crores of credit cards and about 60 crores of credit card. The usage is not much because people do not know much and there is a lot of vulnerability, a lot of frauds are taking 3 months ago. So many frauds have taken place. The result banks had to at least some few major banks, they had to withdraw the cards and reissue new ones. So, that risk is there. First, you guarantee safety of use of cards and point of sales. There is also some commission involved, somebody. So, why should either the bank or the consumers lose out? So, these are all big issues involved. And for example, we say Modi government says, make in India. But all these swiping machines only by some special multinational companies from abroad, not a single swiping machine is produced in India. So, there is a shortage. So, without swiping machine, how can you use your card? It is not possible. This digital banking, cashless banking is only an afterthought because without envisaging what is going to happen, they withdraw money and they are not able to pump in enough money. So, to hide it, they are telling no, no, our purpose was to go for cashless. But originally, when they demonetized, they said it is true and at black money. So, that is a failure. This is going to be more cumbersome and more problem. And people are going to find it extremely difficult. India is not ripe for 100% cashless economy. Maybe 5, 10% more we can try. That too, where the swiping machines are there, system is okay, all these frauds are prevented. All these things are there. Sir, in the context of demonetization, what are the demands of AIBEA, the All India Bank Employees Association? See, that is why from the beginning, from All India Bank Employees Association, we have been pointing out that this scheme is creating more problem for the banks, for the government, for the people. And still, the government is trying to avoid or ignore these problems. Now, right at the moment, because I am fed up, because the problems continue. There is enough money is not there. There is huge shortage of cash. The Reserve Bank is not able to supply cash to us. So, we are suffering. Customers are suffering. There is a lot of tension in the branches. At the same time, an impression is getting gathered that as though bank employees, we are responsible for everything, where the money is found outside. So, let there be a CBA investigation, and some people have died, employees and officers and also some customers and public have died in the middle, on account of heavy rush, no compensation. Even for employees who have worked extra night after midnight, banks are not giving any overtime. So these are all issues. So, on these matters to highlight and to draw the government attention, we are given a call for all India strike on 7th of February. All India Bank Employees Association, All India Bank Officer Association, Bank Employees Federation of India, three major unions, we commend about more than four lakh employees and officers, will be observing a strike on 7th of February, so that the government will know, the public will know, everybody, people want to know what's happening. Otherwise, they think that bank employees are the villains. We are there to serve the people, but the serve bank must come clean, RBI must tell the people what exactly is going on, and government also must consider. That's why that's our demand now. Thank you for giving us your time. That's all the time we have for today. Thank you for watching Yes, Click.