 So ladies and gentlemen, thank you for coming and I'd like to start the session very soon because time is limited in Davos and I'm very happy that we talk about Europe and when we think about Europe our continent One has the impression Europe had a very long downhill roller coaster ride in the recent years We just think of the euro crisis we think about the Russian aggression towards Ukraine if we think about the refugee and migrant Problems which are cured so there are a lot of topics and we also have to mention populism and nationalism so but now for the moment we have this feeling and Maybe it seems like it's going on this roller coaster uphill again Well, we don't know yet where we will land and this is something we will discuss now in the next hour and I'm very happy to introduce the panel With us is Mark Rütte. He's the prime minister of the Netherlands Timothy Snyder historian and author Cecilia Maldstrom, she's commissioner in Brussels for the EU the prime minister of Ireland Leo Vardekar and Mr. Costa prime minister of Portugal, so I would like to Tell you that there is the possibility to follow all this also on Twitter. There's a hashtag It's renew Europe So if you want to go there, please don't hesitate and if you have a question Which you want to ask you can also put this on Twitter and if we have time kind of promise it We also give you the chance to have this asked here and Afterwards if we have the time we also have the possibility of two or three questions out of the auditorium So let us start with one question prime minister Rütte Do you still believe in an ever closer union? No, I have never believed in an ever closer union. I believe in a European Union Which is basically providing two things first of all by working together by pulling together and being embedded in the European structure We create a collective sense of safety and security, which is crucial in a very unstable world and people do understand this That we cannot survive on our own, but that we have to pull together And secondly by working on very pragmatic things like the internal market free trade agreements Defending our outer borders and dealing with migration that we collectively work on those issues Which as individual nation-states we cannot do but I don't believe in the European Union as a sort of unavoidable End state in 10 20 or 30 years time. I think it's a very pragmatic project Which is crucial for the member states and which is under threat in two ways at the moment first of all because of Brexit Which is bad news for the UK, but also bad news for the European Union because it is the UK who is the loudest voice for liberal Free trade agreements the internal market and to drive all of that and by them leaving We will lose the biggest voice on this and we already sense this with the macro sewer Free trade agreement and the difficulty we have in closing that And secondly we have an issue I think with the fact that so many people are talking about risk sharing and transfer unions I don't like that. I believe that we should all do what is necessary at a national level To get our economies growing and then to deliver on the basic promise of the euro Which was that collectively by each of doing us doing what is necessary by collectively Being more successful and at the moment. We are not delivering there. So Antonio, so What about the ever closer union is it dead also in your view and? Mark said that transfer union is not something which is on his mind. What do you think about it? Well, I love me to enter in French. Yes, you okay Yeah, I think that in a union We need to take into account the needs of our citizens and the priority for the time being in the case is to increase Confidence of citizens in the European Union, which means so that it's important that citizens understand That value added of the European Union is needed in order to be able to meet the major Challenges which exist today, for instance immigration terrorism globalization And I think that what I believe in all these areas It is impossible to do better than the European Union You know, you can't have everybody just doing things for themselves I think it's only together in the European Union that we will have the strength in order to Impose the implementation on the Paris Agreement on climate change and that we can have a trade policy which Doesn't close our borders But which ensures the protection of a social protection model with a high level of environmental social protection food security as well and Which also allows us to be more competitive on international markets and Also to have more cohesion in our societies So I think that what we need to do is to have a union which is capable of providing answers to all these questions I think people are frightened of terrorism, of course, but is the question to be answered by saying closing our borders We need to have Cooperation between our legal authorities. I think that there are always questions of risk But the right answer to those risk is to really have a defense security Defensive security policy and I think that the European Union provides us with that added value And that's also why we ought to strengthen the European Union. I believe I Also don't believe in a single Union I think that if we want to strengthen the European Union you need to have a solid basis And if you want to achieve that you need to consolidate what we have and we've got to really Have a project with the most ambitious project which we've established Which is the euro and to have a stability for the euro we need to strengthen convergence In order to achieve that we need to have rules We need to have discipline, but we also have to have the resources to ensure that Countries can catch up and that economic and social catching up will take place, which is the Pillar for the stability of the euro zone It doesn't have to be a transfer union, but we need to have a budgetary capacity Which is based on the system in the European Union where financing exists Not to finance waste or to Finance public expenditure, but to ensure that we can finance a structural expenditure, which is recommended by the European Union itself So it's not a permanent transfer we're talking about but it's a question of ensuring financing with a very clear objective Quantifiable objectives with specific deadlines to achieve Also to the proposals of President Macron and and what they mean for these questions, but Leo what is your country is quite affected by the discussion about Brexit and what kind of Europe is going to be so What do you wish would kind of Europe should come out after this hopefully going uphill again? Yeah, well as you say Ireland is I say the only country that is More affected by Brexit than Ireland is is the United Kingdom itself, of course and it's Not our policy, but we have to deal with the reality of it But no matter what happens Ireland's place is at the heart of Europe at the common European home Which we help to build and we're founder members of the euro founder members of the single market And we want to be at the heart of all future or at least almost all future European developments I think in many ways when you spoke about the ever closer Union That's very much the language of the Treaty of Rome and even then was aspirational I don't think anyone ever believed that we would Bring unity in Europe to the extent that we all became the one country or cease to be nation states I don't think anybody ever really envisaged that But there are lots of areas that we can Deepen integration marks already mentioned Realizing more benefits from the single market We've all signed up to a greater cooperation in defense through PESCO recently and there are many more things That we can do and actually I find the debate about a transfer union quite interesting because in many ways We've already always had a certain element of a transfer union within Europe Largely around structural funds and for most of the period of my country's membership of the European Union We were a net beneficiary and we used structural funds to build our infrastructure And by building our infrastructure, we were able to unleash the economic potential of our country And now there were net contributors. We don't want to pull back from that We want to say to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe We want to invest in your countries too and help you to unlock your economic potential Because that will actually make us better off as well So we have elements of a transfer union already and one I think that we could develop further Is the whole idea of a banking union guaranteeing people savings and deposits across Europe And reducing the risk for individual nation-states But if we enter into that we absolutely need to be careful and be precautionary That every country is up to standard in terms of its financial regulation and the help of its banks And I come from a country that knows a little bit about that. I remember having put it right We want to make sure that's the case across Europe. Good Cecilia. You're responsible at the European Commission for Trade and What is in your view is the more to the European Union than a free trade zone I suppose but where are you want the European Union to go and you get as a commissioner a lot of critics out of the member states So are you always the wrong person to blame in this European discussion or is it unjust to blame the Commission? What do you think of the role of the Commission and what shall be the path into new Europe? It's partly Part of our paycheck to be criticized by member states so that goes with the job But I actually feel that we have very good cooperation with member states sometimes we disagree But that that's how it is but but I feel a strong support in the general Issues and as has been said by several of the the prime ministers now What we need to do is to focus on European common projects Defence has been mentioned a few other things as well digital Europe fighting inequality security Migration issues trade is such an issue. We cannot do trade 28 countries or 27 countries alone, but we can do and now we see also that there's a space in Europe to do trade because many countries are Puzzled a little bit about the lack of leadership from the United States They are disengaging from the global scene that leaves place open for the European Union to show that we can do good trade agreements They can be sustainable transparent mutual beneficial We can promote European values through that and we can create alliances Friendship with a circle of countries across the globe with Japan with Canada with the Mercosur countries with Mexico with Australia New Zealand Chile etc Building on this circle of friends to stand up also for multilateralism and there Europe has a very strong role today And I think we we can do it This is one area not the only one area where we could do and it will also contribute to Consolidating the growth and job creation in the European Union. So but we have a very good cooperation I think it's better now than it was a year ago on when it come come to trade then of course We have disagreements countries have different priorities, but overall I feel that there is a good cooperation Timothy when you listen to this and you look as an historian to this Europe which we see now and What could be the best outcome of the next discussions about Europe and what can United Europe be and what it doesn't look like and because when you see all the from Habsburg to to to whatever happened in Rome in the 50s and all attempts to reunite Europe And now there is hope for another one Which which maybe is more solid towards nationalism and populism than it has been before what what is your view of Europe now? Right, so since you mentioned the Habsburgs I will I will go all the way back to 1918 because in all sincerity when I think about the achievements or the Profundity the profound character of the achievements of the European Union I tend to think that even today's Europeans don't see them From a historical point of view what the European Union is is the solution to the great European problem Which is the end of imperialism the century the 20th century in Europe is the century of the end of Empire This begins with the first World War when the Habsburgs the Ottomans the Roman offs and the German Empire falls apart It continues in the second World War when the German attempt to establish an empire inside Europe itself Fails and the project of European unity is before all things a project of failed Failed mercantile empires to reestablish a large zone of economic cooperation now on the continent And what it takes from Empire is that large economic zone where it's different from Empire is the predominance of the rule of law Indeed the exaggeration of the idea that our partners are are equals That's the magic of Europe and it's something that Europeans tend entirely to take for granted the European Union of 2018 is the peace settlement of the first World War The first World War tried to establish nation-states on the basis of failed empires this failed in Europe completely This means that the historical stakes of how Europe does in 2018 Tend to be high tend to be higher I think than Europeans themselves realize the European conversation tends to be about some version of Europe versus some version of the nation-state But since the nation-state never actually happened in European history not for the Dutch not for the French Not very briefly for the Irish the Swedish or more of an exception, but in general there is no nation-state to go back to Above all there's no British nation-state to go back to So there is no historical choice between Nation-state in Europe the historical choice was between Empire and Europe and one likes to think that that choice has already been made So I my own broad position is that Europeans should understand that what they've done is create a political novelty Something entirely new and whatever its relationship is to the state what it's done has been to enable the state To enable the European state to make it possible because the nation-state in the old style hasn't proven to be possible in Europe Now from my point of view then as a historian what I worry about is that each year that we go away from 1918 Each year that we go away from history each year that the talk of Europe is always about the next new thing is Another year where young Europeans Grow further away from understanding what the project is already about the big gap in European integration Is history there is no European history as such and I tend to think that has a great deal to do with the fact of the Of the alienation of younger people from Europe. There's no European younger generation encounter with Europe as as such and What makes this worry greater for me is that I know that there will never be a year of history, right? There can be a year of blockchain At Davos this year everyone has to say blockchain every panel, so I've just done it there can there can be a year of blockchain At disruption or but there will never there will never be a year when we say there has to be history But I tend to think actually that's that's the missing piece that that's the missing piece well, thank you the thing is with the We don't have a European public opinion and we don't have We only have national public opinions And so I think this is also something which is lacking but keep this aside for the moment and look at France and Germany because We have a president Macron. He's very active and We are we're hoping for a government in Germany. I'm hoping to I mean it's nicer to have a government You can criticize as journalists, but then to have none So when these both get and on track, which we hope then we'll have another probably well-meant Franco-German attempt and normally everybody's in Europe Saying we have to have this motor with Franco-German motor if it's not going people complaining when it's going they say Well, they shouldn't dominate us. So what is your feeling as let's say? Coming from countries which are not as big as France for instance, so Do you see the fear of domination or is there a good interaction on what track is going to be so mark? Well, in Europe, we have the freedom to meet and come together So also the French president and the German chancellor have to freedom to sit together and to take decisions There is no problem with that And we all have our meetings and our ways of getting this whole thing going the question Of course is what is a sort of common agenda on which we will try to agree in the coming years and I very much hope that will be a gender to first of all Complete the single market. We still can add twice the size of the Dutch economy to the European economy That's almost that is more than a size of the Spanish economy one point four one point five trillion euros By implementing the digital single market Implementing everything which is there in the services directives Everything which is there in the capitals union and in the energy union and that's crucial for a million jobs At the moment we are not doing that the internal market is only there for goods Only 30% of the European economy is part of the internal market. So this thing is failing us at the moment So there's a huge opportunity there secondly I think we have to focus on the question. How can we stimulate countries to to take the necessary steps for reforms? There is this talk about about shock absorption The Netherlands has a debt South of 60% so we can if necessary. I don't hope it will happen I don't expect it will happen But if there would be an asymmetric shock we could go to the market and borrow 20% or 30% of GDP Which is about 200 billion to save the banks or whatever is happening in such a scenario And I think each of the 19 countries in the eurozone needs this capacity to do this on their own to be able To go to the market and say we country X Y or Z We need to do this we can only do that if everybody has put in place all the necessary measures Also when the sun is shining today when the economy is doing very well has put in place a necessary form So we have to discuss how can we stimulate countries to do this one of two ways is To make sure that your cohesion funds and all the payments in the common agricultural policy Etc. Are dependent on the question whether you have implemented the country specific recommendations from the Commission that you have really done What is necessary? And by doing that you stimulate countries to reform and that's crucial So whatever the access between France and Germany or we are working together now with the With the Benelux in the Baltics and the scan digs to keep this voice of free trade This voice of the internal markets to keep that alive when the UK is leaving us Whatever the sort of country sitting together. I I very much will plead for an agenda Which is focused on free trade completion of the single market and Encouraging almost forcing all the countries to do what is necessary within the stability and growth back So there is no fear on the panel that the Franco German, whatever access or whatever you call it Better working together will leave you behind for instance I suppose I'd make I suppose I'd make three very brief points The first is that those of us who believe in Europe and believe that Europe on balance is a good thing for all of our countries Can only welcome France and Germany cooperating becoming an engine for Further development in Europe and Europe at its best was that period when me to run was president of France and coal was President in Germany under the DeLore Commission driving forward things like the euro Like enlargement like European citizenship those things wouldn't have happened without that Franco German engine and that Franco German Alliance. So it's something that I welcome but I am also cautious about because The Europe of the past the historical Europe if you like was a Europe not just of empires But Europe's of Europe of large states that went to war on occasion very often overran small states And on occasion would come together at various conferences the big countries Decide what was best for Europe and would inform the small countries afterwards and we definitely don't want to see that We don't want to see you know meetings in Paris and Berlin that only countries with more than 40 million people are invited to attend And the smaller countries being told afterwards what's good for Europe So the spirit that we need is very much one that I think was encapsulated by that great German Foreign Minister Hans-Dietrich Genscher And during that period he said that every day he would ask himself the question What did the small countries think and if Germany in particular in France as well operate on that basis? I think that engine Come I think we can be in that car to put it that way of that With that engine in it, but if they don't then I think difficulties will arise Finally with the departure of the United Kingdom those change things that is going to be a different Europe without the United Kingdom there a country that Was it was very much part of the the free market the free trade lobby? They currently wish to lead the single market, but in many ways they were the architects of the single market in the 1980s And that's why Those countries who are free traders free enterprise believe in low taxation Generally speaking We'll need to work together and build new alliances and that involves countries like Ireland the Benales countries Nordics Baltics Also, some of the states of Central Europe that actually are very pro-enterprise as well and some of the Mediterranean countries So it is going to change that power dynamic, but it's up to us to influence it Cecil what is going to change in this new Europe without Britain in the balance? Well, first of all is going to be more boring Because we enjoy the body was boring the last yes, because the Brits have a specific No offense to the rest of you. I know you're also very funny But but the special weight and the special sense of humor that the Brits have brought to the European Union I am going to miss it and many others and then of course as the Prime Minister of Ireland said I mean that they have been the driving forces But what we need now to really fully recover from the economic crisis the internal market services a free trade openness the transatlantic relation and They also very active lately on on on environmental issues and and so on so we are going to miss them We'll have to handle it. We will we'll find a way and so it will be a different Union But that's why we need now to focus on You know getting these common projects going we need to make sure that Europe can add Value when it comes to security the fight against terrorism the inequalities the youth Employment unemployment that is still there the Environmental climate challenges that that that we have there and that I think we need to focus on on these Things so that people can see in their daily life that Europe is delivering and of course we need to discuss for the future How should you Europe work should we change the way? We are making decisions, but I wouldn't go into a big institutional reform now Let's make sure that we work and that we consolidate and that we can show our citizens that Europe is working That we are delivering Trust has actually increased in the European Union. We thought that it would go down It was a lots of of anxiety But after Brexit trust in the European Union among the citizens went up in basically all countries. That's a good thing But let's preserve it. Let's show that we We deserve it sure if you look around at the rest of the world is not always convincing what happens happening over there So maybe this is a chance for Europe to Antonio, do you think that? austerity politics will have an end or will it continue in the next years to come in Europe I Think that in this crisis which Has affected the different countries differently and different countries have come up with different solutions to face up to those difficulties But over the last couple of years, I think that we have understood that We have common objectives, but we've got to allow people to be free to have Democratic sovereignty and to see how they want to achieve a particular objective two years ago when I was appointed Prime Minister Mark was and see to the presidency and the idea was to reduce the deficit to reduce the debt and We were caught upon to meet our commitments to the European Union But fortunately we are now out of this deficit reduction program We have deficit of about 1.2 percent of the city I think we've paid the last installment yesterday of the loan With the additional bonus to the IMF I think that we need to turn the page now of austerity and we need to change our policies But let me just come back to your earlier question That is to say the question about France and Germany being motor. There are two aspects to this I Think it is clear that to today. There is a new energy that has been Unleashed to to drive things forward in Europe, and I think that that is a reaction to Brexit I think that Europe of 27 have united have come together to make an effort to find solutions in order to get Europe moving forward and I think that the Commission has played a very important role in this with the white paper which was presented with the state of the Union which Mr. Yonker presented to the European Parliament and now with the election of President Macron European is moving forward much more than it was in the past, but we have to continue. We mustn't stop there I think that this energy is very important today Europe is not what it was at the time of coal and meteorites more diversified And I don't think it's not enough to have an agreement between France and Germany to have an agreement between the 27th The second point Are we afraid that somebody might be sidelined I? Think that we need to learn lessons of Brexit I think that one of the important lessons of Brexit is that we have to respect the decision of people and you've got to countries a certain margin of maneuver What does this mean? If we can move forward at the same pace in the Europe of 27 that's best But if we cannot move forward as a union of 27 at the same time Then I have no reason to say why not have a different speed For Europe Provided that everything is open to the people who want to participate and there's nothing new to that look at Schengen It's already a multi-speed system the euro is also in a similar situation Victor Orban sometimes I says with his normal frankness that there is one thing That I you must enforce me to follow if you go down a particular path So should we stop just to respect Mr. Orban's desires or should we also say we have to respect our own decision to go faster in a group of countries now And I think we need to reach to my next question because mentioning Orban means also that we haven't talked about the let's say middle and Eastern European EU members and Timothy Sometimes we have the feeling they see in Europe and the European Union another project then the people sitting here around our present Macron and Could you could you briefly tell us why this is so and why there is so much? well division for the moment between in some certain points, especially the refugee crisis between The Middle European Eastern countries and and the rest of you so you you put me in a difficult position because one one of the things which is striking about this conversation and not only this conversation is the absence of member of representatives of those member states and I can't of course as an American historian adequately represent their position I can only make a couple of remarks One of them is that I am as an observer. I'm deeply concerned that Poland doesn't understand the stakes of a two-speed Europe I'm not sure whose job it is to make that explanation clear But from from reading the Polish press and listening to representatives of the Polish government I'm not sure they realize at least as I see it. What a disaster a two-speed Europe would be For them. I'm not sure those consequences have been spelled out Now looking at Europe from their point of view. I have to first introduce a qualification Poland is a deeply divided Society much like the United States sometimes elections go one way sometimes they go another There are many people in Poland who are deeply attached to the European Union So we have to be very careful when a government changes not to dismiss an entire society How does this government see it this government sees the European Union? as Germany I Simplify because I'm allowed to because I'm not a diplomat they see the European Union They associate the European Union with Germany and they associate Germany with the traditional historical threat to their sovereignty The political the particular political tradition which is in power and Poland now is more obsessed with Germany than than with Russia So they look at the European Union their skepticism about the European Union has to do with questions of sovereignty. I Think they have it exactly backwards I think the European Union rescues the European state rather than threatening it I think if you are a fragment of a European land empire like Poland the way to preserve your proud national traditions Is to combine them with a large market with the rule of law like the European Union, but that's that's how they see it They see it in terms of as the Prime Minister mentioned They see it in terms of a history in which larger countries seek to dominate smaller countries. I think they're making a mistake I think they're taking a gamble. They don't fully understand, but that's how they see it Well Timothy, thank you very much. We have also questions on Twitter. I said I would just get one in It's coming from Peter Komornik and he asks The question how can Europe claim a global role when it's so focused on its internal issues Smart question. So who wants to answer? Okay, Timothy you're the fastest who who are the other candidates, right? I mean it's a it's a photo Mia photo Mia Especially in the range of values that the Chinese are determined not to associate universal values with their projects the Americans are determined to distance themselves at least for the time being from what had been our Universalist values. I think that this is Europe's chance that it's not as though There's someone else out there who is seeking to project universal values It's a chance also in the sense of European power projection This is what you can do at the moment that no one else Can do and to push the point even further It's actually rather important for the United States of America that you do it I might say I think I think there are two ways that the first is trade at a time when The United States is stepping back from free trade agreements Time when the United Kingdom is leaving the largest trading block in the world and We have an opportunity to Connect to other parts of the world to our trade agreements and we've done that already very successfully with Canada with CETA good agreements in place with them a Kind of I can't doing her job for you. I'm praising you here by the way And also, of course, of course, Japan and South Korea and if we can get it right with with Merkiser depending on one various sensitivities there, of course, I think that's the way we can actually Project our power as Europe, but also also bring bring good things to the world And the second I believe is very much through our commitment international development where we as Europeans Could and should do an awful lot more and one of the ideas that people talk about a lot Is the idea of a Marshall plan for Africa and after the devastation of the Second World War? America made sure that Western Europe was rebuilt And it's in our interests. I believe for us to come together as Europeans and try to do something similar for Africa We've already seen the consequences of Libya failing as a state a small country four million people medium to high income and When it failed as a state there were enormous humanitarian consequences for people in Libya and a very negative effect on Europe and if much larger African states were to go the wrong way Imagine the humanitarian crisis and imagine the impact on Europe So it's very much in our interest to make sure that Africa succeeds in the 21st century that it becomes politically stable and that Over the next decades a bit like China and East Asia their economies become ones that we want to Trade with rather than send aid to but we've responsibility to make that happen And I think those are the two areas where Europe could show real leadership in the world Short yeah, it's very very short to build on what Leo is saying and it all depends on the issue in many cases It will be the individual member states who will conduct a foreign policy of their nation But on other occasions like the free trade agreements like what is now happening with Africa to take out the root causes of migration As part of a step-by-step approach to control the migratory flows take the What we did was turkey At the heart of the Syrian refugee crisis it took four days from the south of Turkey to get into Berlin or Amsterdam And then in February March, we were able with Turkey to come to conclusions together a deal which basically secured reception capacity in Turkey For the Syrian refugees and therefore being able to control that migratory flow And that was something we did as a collective as a European Union. So it depends on the issues But Iran issue is an example of the Iran issue Iran issue has shown the leadership to preserve the agreement and there was Friderica Mogherini in a leading role So I think this is good and the old saying of Kissinger I want to have one phone number whom to call in the European Union and now in his days He had six now he would have 28 Well, it will depend on the issue. I think the other one if I may intervene again is is our own neighborhood In terms of enlargement. We have in the Western Balkans Albania Serbia Montenegro Mastonia a number of countries Which which which could become destabilized and the best way that we can Look after our own neighborhood like the Western Balkans is to assure them that there is a pathway towards towards membership Enlargement hasn't finished. Yes, and that's one of the areas where I think We can actually do the right thing as Europeans Yes, I think I mean as a DG of Deutsche Welle with this Germany's global broadcaster I can assure you and you know it itself that European model is quite attractive for a lot of people around this world So one should maybe not be too Critical about them you're one selves But also see see the attractiveness of the model and the rule of law and all these kind of things But now we have also another guest here in in not on this panel not a surprise guest He's not not arrived yet. So also just cool down. So The US president has landed in Davos and everybody's a bit excited for different reasons I presume and Tomorrow he will be on this stage exactly here. He will hold his speech to to to all of us here in Davos and Now to all of you if you have one wish to Have one idea to write down in his speech For tomorrow, what would this be? That he mark you stop well that he will acknowledge that for the United States being the leader of the free world Being the biggest economy in the world by far that it is crucial to maintain the international legal order to keep on investing in the UN in NATO in the WTO and That you cannot run the world in on a bilateral basis and I think we need to have that dialogue with with the American president and to convince him of the necessity of the United States With its leadership capacity and capability to keep on investing in this international Legal order. It is crucial for the Netherlands. We are one of the three most internationally connected countries in the world We are in absolute terms the fifth biggest exporter And for many other countries in the European Union and all over the world This is crucial to maintain that order and we need to us as a champion Leo. What would be your thoughts for the speech? Oh, I wish I could write that one But I don't think I'm going to be given that offers but to give to give you a hypothetical answer to a hypothetical question It's actually very similar to marks. It is perhaps an acknowledgement that what makes America great Is actually American values? This is a country That by and large has been a force for good in the world down the centuries It's a country that made itself great by trading with the world It's a country that made itself great by accepting migrants from all over the world Including from from my country took the best brains and the hardest-working people from all over the world And they built America and also it's a country that by being involved in the world Saved the world from fascism and then from communism thereafter And when America disengages from the world When it doesn't live up to those very American values, the world becomes a more dangerous place and a lesser place Antonio Well, I think being adviser to mr. Trump is probably a very high-risk task No Let me just to say that the European Union has to understand that there is a new framework That some of the new administration thinks have changed and there is a big opportunity for the European Union Particularly in the field of free trade we can take a Leading role and I think it's up to the European Union to maintain Those values which have made so many millions of people around the world to dream about Freedom respect of the dignity of human beings the freedom to have a free trade The rule of law all those values are the values of the European Union and I think we need to spread those values So the European Union cannot afford to waste time For example in the negotiation with Microsoft that is a key Negotiation for transatlantic relations because on the other side of the Atlantic. It's not just the United States It's not just Canada Central America South America, and I think that Microsoft is an essential negotiation It is ten times more important that one we've done with set up So mr. Mastram Please hold To your line and try and negotiate an agreement with Microsoft as quickly as possible and with our partners on the other side So Cecilia you had no time to think about the whole speech with mr. Trump to write it down So what would be your thought? Well, I've actually rewrote it in my head. I would have lots of messages That I hope that the president would say but the fact that he's coming here is a signal It's always better that you talk with each other than about each other now He has managed for the whole Davos to talk about him now Let's see if we can talk with him as well, and but I fully agree I hope he comes with the message that your US wants to engage with the world that a strong stronger America is Is Crucial to have a stronger world and and we can only be strong together So multilateralism international organizations I hope he will announce that he was only joking when he annulled America's participation to the the climate agreement in Paris And I hope that that he will engage with us in in in building a better world because there are issues that he brings up That where we can share his criticism against others and so what we are well willing to work with him But it has to be within the established order of the multilateral Global rules that we together have agreed where they have taken a lead all these institutions that we talk about America founded them And it has been good for the US. So I hope he comes here with the message of engagement Whether that happens or not. I don't know and then I would have a lot of internal messages. We know that for the American audience Timothy before I give you the last word which is I think great so position of power and I would ask you in the In the room if you have Two questions. I would take two questions if you want. Okay. See one over there and Please introduce yourself and a good question is not longer than 20 seconds I'm Steve Howard. I'm a Brexit refugee living in the Netherlands And Desperately trying to hang on to a sense of humor commissioner Is it possible that our friends in Europe can actually Offer a choice to Britain to come to stay in with a twin-track Europe David Kramman failed to negotiate any sort of outcome But I think just a small olive branch might tempt people over the line Okay, who wants to answer? I think Cameron Negotiated an excellent package and even the Eastern European countries were able after some considerable pressure to accept it including an emergency break on On people moving from the Eastern part of the European Union into the Western part of the European Union at the commission level And I think it was an excellent result And the debate went very well in the UK as long as it does about the economy But as soon as the debate shifted to other issues like values and sovereignty and migration The thing started to a collapse with the results. We have seen what now is necessary is for Theresa May to decide what she wants We cannot have a situation in which we have to decide for her What the future relationship with the European Union will be she has to decide and she knows that Single-market means free movement of people customers Union or other arrangements means certain obligations And and yes, if if the UK is not willing to do anything you will end up in a free trade agreement What I desperately hope of course is that they will At least partly come back to the decision and be able to somehow stay connected to the internal market and a customs union okay, so I think this was this is it and Tim your last thought to words our discussion and maybe also what you would write into the speech of your president That's that's more intimacy than I would wish So the with with Europe my one thought my concluding thought is The mechanisms of European identity have been the idea that economics leads to politics leads to economics leads to politics That's true to an extent the second mechanism of European identity was we will remember the war That is wearing itself out When I think of institutional renewal in Europe I think first of all of Institutions that would allow the young of Europe to have a moment of encounter with Europe While they are young to make it meaningful for them some passage through Europe. I think that's very important when it comes to Mr. Trump, I will spin this a slightly different direction not being European and not being a diplomat or a politician Mr. Trump is a very skilled entertainer At the end of the day. He has an audience of one Everyone else is a moving prop in his production It's very important not to get yourselves too involved in his story Whether that's as a way to motivate yourselves to do good things or whether it's as a hope that he will come around Just don't get involved in the story. His audience in the end is only himself It's very kind to hear these these words of praise about the United States of America They apply to a country which has 50 states numerous cities countless non-governmental organizations 300 million citizens in all kinds of ways to engage the United States will need European Engagement we will need it in much the way Europe has needed our engagement in the past So this is it