 Hi. Oh hello. Are we here? Are we doing it? Yeah that's that's the intro that's it that's all you get. Apologies because it's so cold in here that I can actually see my own breath. But such I can and it's quite distracting but such is the cost of living crisis. I'm not putting my heating on for no man so I'm a bit wonky sorry. Well let's get things heated up in the metaphorical sense and then hopefully it goes into the physical. So it's it's very good to have you on. You've been on the list for a while. You're a fantastic podcast host. You were excellent on stage at MCM earlier this year so it's fantastic to get to talk to you on the show properly. Thank you that's that means a lot and I have been on many lists for a while. Well we can strike you off this. No dodgy ones I should clarify. Yeah you did make it yeah very good. I didn't make that sound weird didn't I? Sorry I'm very tired but I'm very excited. Good well let's crack on with the first question then. So who knew a fantastic fantastic Doctor Who podcast. Very simple first question is when and why did you start it up? That's a very good question. I ask myself that very often usually mid complicated edit. Why did I start this? Basically I sort of I've always been a Doctor Who fan but I'd never really been involved in the fandom as such like in terms of online and then lockdown happened and I decided to watch all of Classic Who from the start. So then that led to me tweeting about it a bit and then a few people started tweeting me back and then very gradually I fell into the Doctor Who Twitter rabbit hole and which spiraled into like just making Doctor Who threads and stuff and joining the watch alongs in lockdown which were great fun and then like a little later on in the year I'd wanted to do something like this like a YouTube channel or some kind of podcast for years with multiple failed attempts mainly because it failed because I wasn't doing it about the thing that I cared about the most which is Doctor Who. So what were they before? And I just thought well one was music I used to surprisingly I used to be a musician when I wanted to be a musician when I was a teenager so it was like me singing with a guitar was one YouTube channel. Is that available to view? I'm going to say no and then by the time this goes up they'll all have been erased from the internet but they are there they are somewhere and also they're very ropey I was like 14 at the time so it's not the best singing voice and then I also started a film YouTube channel called Roughly Cut which lasted for three videos and then I gave up but yeah there's been a few little attempts but then in lockdown well it was after lockdown really it was like October September October time 2020 I was just messing around with the idea I had the idea of the corridor of fame first and I wanted to make that like a website like and sort of like a or like a blog or something and I didn't I was like then when the idea of the podcast came along I was like that could be a feature and then I could do the same thing with episodes and have it be like a DVD collection so those ideas came first and then I came up with a name and then I made the logo and then I was in I was like oh this I have to make this now as soon as I made the logo I was like I am I'm in and Jess made me a mug Jess ordered me a mug with the logo on which is next to me but I can't reach it but she made me a mug with the with the logo on and basically said you've got a mug with the logo on now you have to do this did you then continue to say I have to do it now you bloody mug yeah very nice very nicely played but yeah it was it was basically it wasn't really with the intention of a anything coming of it or it actually going anywhere or it lasting incredibly long it was sort of just a vehicle for me to chat to people like you like other people in the fandom and maybe some people who've been involved in the show in some loose way it was basically just a vehicle for that yeah see that was yeah that was another question I had because obviously you've had some amazing guests on which I will talk about later on but was the idea to get those people on like for example Sophie Audrid was that ever in the initial plan or was it like that would be nice no no no it was I wrote a lit that another thing was like when I just started to make it based because I wanted it to sort of be us in the same way that the community show is sort of a celebration of the people of Doctor Who and how creative they can be and I was like well let's see if there's enough guests to get that off the ground right so I started writing a list and within about three or four days I completed a list which I still have on my phone which has over 350 people on it oh wow of where I thought they could they could be a fun guest and I was like oh wow but I ranked it in terms of like definitely would come on someone that I know someone that I speak to and would definitely be up for it uh sort of maybe and then never it was it was titled never gonna happen even then you were like trying to figure out yeah curbing your own enthusiasm yeah and the two top of that list were Katie Manning and Rob Shearman so and wouldn't you know which so yeah I mean I I'd had both of them on by episode 13 so wow was it that soon I knew it was soon it was that soon Katie Manning was episode 10 and then Rob Shearman was episode 13 and I had a lot of other incredible people that I never would have thought would have said yes and we will definitely be getting on for them spiralled very quickly absolutely it spiraled very quickly definitely yeah staying on a similar topic with sort of the origins of the whole thing you mentioned your other podcast as well one named Roughly Cut which is a fantastic name for a film podcast thank you as is who knew for this so where did the name come from I don't really remember I wrote a few names um there was a few names I wonder if they're still on my phone because I could maybe get an exclusive let's delve into the archives I wrote I wrote like a little short list and I think I just went for who knew because it was snappy and I said it to Jess and she went oh I like that that's good there wasn't really a thought process behind it I wanted it to be I wanted who to be in the name yeah and I thought that'd be fun I know one of them was knowing me knowing who which was very very close it was very close to be in the name of the podcast I'm not gonna lie I made a logo for knowing me knowing who because which would I mean it does work it works almost better as a name than who knows does who knows who knew shorter or it's snappier and the logo look better um I wonder if I wonder if it's on here sorry I know this is no no I can I can cut this down oh no I don't I don't have any we'll just make some up now oh oh no no no that's that's potential names for a different thing um yeah no I don't have it but knowing me knowing who that was a fantastic one like who's probably something like who's line is it anyway but with the who like that but that's literally the name of the other thing um there was a lot of question ones um just ones that like who knew but yeah I don't know why I settled on who knew I think it was the logo that made it it's a fantastic logo no doubt thank you thank you I was going for um 80s chat show vibes no totally fits and I like how we both have squared logos like I didn't make mine but it's I like how it ended up that way because they just works for a doctor's logo as well yeah there was a lot of little east like it's gone through a lot of iterations that logo it went but but I did I did arrive on it quite quick but yeah I've I think I'm quite proud of the logo because it's very easy to change as well I've done a couple of variations on it like for flocks and for part of the doctor I did like the reng versions thank you thank you very much um and having the little the little time vortex in the background in the diamond means that you can switch up a bit which is fantastic now pivoting away from the podcast briefly I want to talk about our shared experience because we are both we both have very specific thing in common here which is that we've both hosted a doctor who panel at MCM we have not a clue exactly not a clue I mean you've got one on me you've got I do I have one up on you just but actually no because I've technically I've I mean I've been a panelist but that was with you oh that's true I mean very nice for having me on so I've been on on the stage three times that's true okay so technically even technically yeah technically you've had three times as host so you take that well that's yes it is I love maps um but um I want to know because I'm sure other people they they look at you or me up on the stage and they just go how so let's answer that now how on earth did you get up on that stage for the hosting gig um in terms of physically get up there no idea because I wanted to throw up at every moment beforehand yeah and um I get I get questions like this a lot and it's I hate I don't really it's not that I hate the question I hate the answer that I give because people always ask me with who knew as well which is like how what's your secret for getting guests and like what's your secret for convincing all of these people to come on well I'm not I'm not the master like I don't hypnotize people are you sure I just ask I'm sure I'm sure Jack I'm sure okay yes I am also sure but everyone's like what's why how do you get so many yeah I don't fucking know can I swear on this sure but like okay I'll rephrase it I'll rephrase it slightly how what was there like an applying process for MCM specifically for me yeah I I had I I assumed did you go through like the panel application thing I did yeah because I did that and was unsuccessful so congratulations but uh so my my panel application didn't really work because also it's it's hard with with who knew because I've had so many creative people on already and I need someone I I want to like pin it down to one guest that I've not had on already that I can get a 50 minute panel out of and they also have to be free to do karmacon so basically what I yeah so what I did it's it's it's difficult it's a complicated thing to arrange so what I did instead I was like I got in touch with someone at MCM I managed to find an email I don't know how um and I just said do you know of any Doctor Who guests who are coming along um that I could maybe approach to do who knew it didn't really work out but then the the the woman who arranged it basically said we do have this Dalek panel this was for me we do have this Dalek panel where the guys who build Daleks at home um who are drive-around comic-ons if you've been you'll have seen them the guys at Project Dalek yeah they're incredible they are so so good and so cool um but yeah they basically just said we we're doing this panel anyway um but I think they had a host who they were just looking for someone who with a bit of Doctor Who knowledge to host it oh so they were actively looking for someone as well I don't know if they were actively looking I think they just thought when so did the panel happen before you the panel was gonna about the panel was gonna happen with me either way it's without me like it they've done that panel for years um for the past couple of years yeah with different hosts but they just I think basically someone just said there's a Doctor Who panel there's a Doctor Who man let's put them together fair enough and then that's sort of how the the the panel this last week came about as well yeah so dumb luck is your strategy it's complete look I I wish that I could tell people there's some secret kind of formula I mean I like I'm I've been very very very lucky I've just been very lucky I just asked people and if they say yes then I think also what people don't see is the spectacular hit rate of nose that I get what okay tell you all right let's pivot then give me a few examples of those who have outwardly said no because I've had a few noses as well I mean I don't I don't I don't know if I want a name and shame okay fair enough there's there's I mean it's not a shame at all because I've never really had anyone who's been horrible I mean or even a bit arsey about it everyone that I've spoken to has been so lovely um but there's some people there it's just not their cup of tea like they're very nice I mean like one person who I just want to say because they were incredibly lovely about it I have spoken to Rachel tell her about coming on which would have been incredible I would have loved it like you put one of her episodes in in the dvd collection I did yeah and like she's one of the she's probably the greatest director of new who possibly even the greatest director the doctor who has ever seen um but she basically just said she doesn't really like doing podcasts it's just not really a thing and that's that's absolutely fine like I I don't really push it with guests I'm not pushy if someone says no I mean if someone gives me like a maybe next year or something I'll shot and make a little note and I'll email them next year if someone says no flat out I'll just I could just get over it really absolutely uh okay so basically if you want to host an mcm panel either go through the application process and get very lucky or email whoever the hell you can find the email of and hope to god it's all luck at the end of the day even to the application process like I did it's dumb luck if you'll get in I mean this is this is the thing though I was incredibly lucky but you got in with a fantastic panel pitch that's how you got in I don't know it was pretty rudimentary like the first time I applied only two episodes of the show was actually out so and those first two episodes were rough who they weren't they were great anyway I don't say that I was in the first one well okay yeah you weren't a guest but yeah I did show I wasn't a guest but you did mention the edit and me as a human were very rough so the fact that they've chosen me as a bloody miracle but um keeping on the mcm theme I'm not going to say how you did it but you of course got to do a panel even though it was short with Peter Davidson Paul McGann and Colin Baker which I do believe you're hopefully getting the footage of at some point possibly I have no idea I know you're on the list because I also was tagged in that email but yeah so really all I want to know not a clue I don't I don't know it's fine if not because you know I get that these things come okay but if I do get the footage I will post it wherever I can I would love to say they changed a lot this year and I was livid they changed a lot they did yeah because usually like I always get the speaker pass right you had the press because oh lucky you but I always get the speaker pass and usually that gives you entry to all three days but this time they changed it without telling me so I turned up on Saturday being like oh yeah I've got my speaker pass and they say no you don't you only have it for tomorrow I'm like oh Saturday was already sold out so I was like oh god that's a whole other kettle of fish but really really all I want to know about about this panel in particular is just how was it you know how shaken were you by the whole experience oh it like it came completely out of the blue as well I shot this is another you told me the story that I shot my shot I sent an email and I basically I got to know because they they'd already saw it all the panels and everything and it was all done I was like oh okay that's fine I wasn't expecting anything from it anyway and then two weeks before MCM I just got an email saying uh we're doing a panel with three doctors uh you're in as the host if you want it I was like okay so I hyperventilated I had a panic attack and I nearly threw up at my work um and then I just ran around and then I was like that for about two weeks understandable I think I do the same until the moment I got off stage was basically I was just in a constant two-week-long panic attack yeah but it was it was honestly one of the best days of my entire life it was incredible and like you said it was quite a short panel um just because it was the end of the day and things were yours was the very last panel going on it was the very last panel of the day and things just it was the very last panel of the weekend um so things were about to wrap up a bit quicker than I would have liked um not that I'm I'm not bothered about it being yeah it was in for about 50 minutes I managed to do about 20 minutes if I'm honest I probably would have thrown up if I was on that stage for any longer so it's probably good that it was it was trimmed down a little bit um it just meant that we didn't get to do as many audience questions as we'd like um because the queues at the size of the stage was so long I get like Gemma sort of elbowed me at one point like oh you should try and get a question and I'm like I know how this is going there's no way yeah you're never you're never going to get to the front never going to get to the front um but yeah it was just it was absolutely incredible and like I pinch myself every every day since I've just had a little moment where I've just maniacally laughed to myself about the fact that it even happened and like it was really it just felt it was a very big moment for me as well in terms of I like I've I've then I've always had some self-confidence issues um and this podcast has helped a lot but like about 10 minutes before the Dalek panel in May I was in the bathrooms having a full-on panic attack like I was I was freaking out and I was telling Jess I am not going on that stage I cannot do it I like I cannot move like I just couldn't physically move my body to the stage um and this time I was I was better but it was a much more daunting experience because I was speaking to three people that I deemed to be Godlike yeah um but it was just mental it was it was absolutely mental I don't know how else to describe it really it's a bit of a it's a bit of a daydream I don't really well as someone who is as someone who is very fortunate to be attending both of these panels I mean the first time I was very casually sat on the floor and the other time I was very casually stood at the back but as someone who was only viewing it I I do have to say that you did fantastic work on both of them I was I'm incredibly proud of you for getting through those fears and even with those fears absolutely smashing out of the park I mean like you say if I if I got to be on that stage with Paul McGahn Peter Davidson and Colin Baker I brick it I run into the crowd just going ah yeah it changed a lot it changed a lot in the build-up as well so originally it was two so originally it was two doctors it was Paul McGahn and Peter Davidson and then they went oh it's three doctors because Sylvester McCoy is going to be there now um and then it was four doctors because Colin Baker was going to be there as well so well one point I was going to be interviewing four doctors at once um and then unfortunately Sylvester had to drop out the Sunday he was still there on the Saturday but he dropped out the Sunday um so yeah and then it went back down to what you what actually happened on the day which was was Peter, Colin and Paul uh we're on first name terms now yeah yeah you're bestie he takes each other on the weekends please that's what Jess Jess said that was the funniest thing about it was she was sat in the audience and just seeing me go yeah she was like she said just watching you go um and Paul what do you think of that like just so casually like it's such a weird thing like these people are that's how you gotta do it though it'd be really awkward if you just stand there like hello Mr McGahn Mr McGahn a big fan of the of the doctor who well um I've got two more sort of quick questions to wrap up um I was thinking of asking a very unfair question which is a favorite guess but that's cruel and I'm not going to make you do that so what I'm going to say instead is counting only the podcast so I'm not counting on stage stuff who has been a sort of standout appearance so not necessarily like your surprise or or you were lucky to have them like from just talking to them is there any sort of standout pods you'd recommend should we say yeah yeah there are um like I said I don't have favorites I thought what were you gonna say was who's your least favorite which I would the only answer I could give would be you I mean it's correct I'm joking you were yours was a great pod and you dropped the sea bomb twice I'm a very I hide it online the first and the first and you don't hide it online because it was on it he was in a podcast they're online just in case because it's for the community but who knew it was a free for all and I big them both it's fine um but you are the first and only guest so far to have dropped a sea bomb say damn right you've done it twice damn right um no my episode with you is great I love the Christmas ones which you've also been on a Christmas one I was very lucky to join the Christmas one yeah you you were not lucky I was I felt like he intoxicated I was so drunk I go I finished that podcast and I went downstairs what the hell have you been doing oh my god you stink that's why everyone needs another half like that yeah I am told yeah it was a tough time and but it was a very very fun podcaster of course and the Christmas ones are always fun and like the little round tables that I do for episode reviews but in terms of like the main episode of the podcast that I'd recommend um Rob Shearman is my always my go-to answer for something like this because he's an absolute joy um and we yeah we we went very in depth about a lot of things we went in depth about the target novel for Dalek um and talking about big finish and talking about Dalek itself and what it's like to be a writer and also anxiety and dealing with anxiety as a writer or someone and how how doctor who helps with anxiety is one of my favorite chats I've ever had I I am a little cry at the end of that podcast not a lie because I was like that that was just I thought that was an incredible episode um for funny um I think my episode with Matthew Jacobs who wrote a tv movie yeah Vanessa Yule is a really funny podcast Matthew Jacobs especially is one of the funniest people I've ever interviewed he's hilarious um what are the ones what what I'm going to put you on the spot now what ones do you like well I always tend to gravitate to the Sophie Aldred one just because well A that was the first one I personally listened to and you were always attached to the first of anything but it was also just fascinating to listen to also I do like how now as we're recording this it's just after both Rastlon Productions and an awful lot of running podcasts both announced her as a guest at nearly the exact same time but you're the trailblazer you can say you've got there first but also she knew about power of the doctor at that point I am 99 percent sure she knew oh yeah it was it was May it was no it was July 2021 she knew oh 100 percent and I am so oh I just wish I'd have teased something out of her oh imagine that imagine just one slip up that's all you need just working with tea wait no shit well she did she did slip up with Mr Tardis because she she talked about what it's like to be on set for modern Doctor Who and he never picked up on it that's so funny it was so good and seeing him tweet about it after the fact was common cold hilarious um yeah Katie Manning Sophie Aldred ones they were obviously both incredible because speaking to Commandians Douglas McKinnon was a really good one as well director I'm naming too many here you okay oh well I'll cut you off with one final question one question that I'm sure as a podcaster I mean I get this a lot for community show guests but who is your dream guest who is the one that by any means necessary you you're desperate to talk to on the podcast and you can't just say any of the doctors if you say a doctor you have to pick one yeah that's what I was gonna I'm gonna discount doctors okay I'd love I'd love a modern companion I've always thought fremer adjomon would be really fun to have on um in terms of like Russell or Steve or Chris Chibnall I would love to speak to Chris Chibnall I have so many questions if anything like because Russell and Steven are so open there's like less that I could ask them that's true yeah Chibnall's always been so secretive yeah Chibnall's been really secretive and I feel like there's so many stories behind that era and like he's now started to do a few interviews and they've all been really interesting so yeah I think Chris Chibnall is genuinely high up on that list no good choice my friend and Jodie I just think Jodie would be a who but obviously she's a doctor so yeah you've discounted her you've said discounted her um yeah that is the end of my questions for you um thank you very much for coming on it's about damn time that you uh came on the community show proper it's been an absolute pleasure it's been a hoot it's all I can ask for so uh I'm going to make the robot lady say