 Today's episode of the Bitcoin Show is brought to you by Mt. Gox and Thank You Economy Book and MemoryDealers.com. Hey, everybody, and welcome to the Bitcoin Show. I'm Bruce Wagner. As I'm sure you know, today we have a very interesting new Bitcoin venture represented and it's called Feed the Birds. My guests are Ira Miller and Eric Voorhees, co-founders of Feed the Birds. Welcome, guys. Hey, how are you doing? Thanks for having us, Bruce. Sure. So Ira, you're in Denver? That's correct, yeah. Okay. And Ira, if you don't already know, is involved in many little entrepreneurial ventures and small and large. Bit Munchies is the first major one and BT Sinch and a couple other little, you got a lot of projects going on, don't you? Yeah, well, there's a lot to be done in the Bitcoin world. And Eric, where are you joining us from? I'm in Portsmouth, New Hampshire, but I'm from Colorado originally. Oh, okay. Okay, cool. But you guys didn't meet in Colorado? No, it's just a coincidence. I met him at the New York Bitcoin conference a couple months ago. The Bitcoin conference in rural Bickel. In that very office where you are... Oh, right here in the office. Oh, okay. Cool, cool, cool. All right. Great. So, when did this idea of Feed the Birds come about? Who came up with the idea? I came up with the idea, I think it was about a month ago, and I'm not really a huge Twitter person, but I use it occasionally, and I have a couple, I have like 100 followers. But obviously, Twitter has sort of taken over the world in the same way that Facebook did a few years ago. And it's just very fast and quick, and obviously catching on, it has a few hundred million users, and so it just, something clicked, and I realized that people advertised through Twitter, and there's various ways of doing it, but none of them are very efficient. And combining Bitcoin and Twitter works really nicely. So when I figured it out, I have absolutely no development experience, so I don't know how to code anything. So I went to Ira, because I knew that he was very skilled at this stuff, and he liked the idea too, and so he busted it out in a couple weeks of development. And so now it's released in an open beta, and it's less than a month after I think I contacted him about it. Okay, so, and now the idea behind, it feeds the birds, or Zee birds, feed F-E-E-D-Z-E birds dot com, and the idea behind it is basically paid ad tweets. So if you're a Twitter, you only have 100 followers, I mean, don't you get more than that when you create a free account? Anyway, I'm just teasing, but no, when you have a few more after today. I know, I'm just teasing. What is it, at Eric Voorhees? Yeah, at Eric Voorhees. Oh, there you go. So you just got 10,000 followers right there. So, but anyway, but the idea is, and I've seen this before a while back, where if you have lots and lots of followers, it's like any other media, you can actually insert an ad, a paid tweet, so you get paid to tweet. I know like Ashton Kutcher probably would get, you know, $10,000 a tweet. I'm sure they would offer him at least that, too, because you have so many followers. But you, so advertisers can put in an ad campaign, and what, they set the price per tweet, or price per view or something? Yeah, they basically have control over how they want to do it. So just as in Google's AdWords, where an advertiser can set a budget, and they set how much they want to pay per click, same with feeds of birds. The advertiser just makes his ad campaign, puts as many Bitcoins in it as he wants. There's no minimum or maximum. And then he sets his CPM or cost per meal, which in this case is the price he will pay per 1,000 people that see the message. So if one Twitter user has 1,000 followers, he will tweet the message to those 1,000, and he gets the full CPM figure. And it's all set by the advertiser. So basically they can choose how much they want to incentivize people to send out their message. Okay, so I'm looking at the site now, and how do I, is the number up here, and obviously the thing that's unique about this is that it's in Bitcoin. So it's not through dollars and banks and PayPal and all that stuff. It's actually Bitcoin, so it's much more versatile. You can be in any part of the world and do this without any government or banks permission or anything else. So is this number up in the corner of each campaign? It says 0.09, 0.09 Bitcoin. Is that the price per 1,000 or is that the total budget for the campaign? You want to answer, Ira? Well, if I'm looking at the site right now and I see, I guess these are ad campaigns, right? The number of Bitcoin in blue, what does that represent? You're on the front page, right, Bruce? Yeah. And you're logged in? No, I didn't log in. If you're not logged in, you're seeing the cost per milli. If you do log in, it will count the number of followers you have and calculate what you would get paid. So in your case, you've got about 12,000 followers, so you would get 12 times the cost per milli. Oh, I got you. Okay, okay, so that's the cost per milli. And then when you're logged in, it'll calculate however many, based on your followers. Okay, cool, cool. Now, I did try this the other day. Oh, I didn't tell you, Ed, but I did. I logged in and I took one of these and I tweeted and, I don't know what, I made like three or four bucks or something, right? For a tweet, yeah. That was my lunch. That was a slice of pizza. That's cool. So how long has the site been up? First of all, Eric, when did you come up with this idea? About a month ago. A month ago. And then you told Ira about it right away. He came to mind first. Yeah, because him and I had worked on a couple smaller projects and so we knew each other from the New York conference. So I knew I could trust him to build something quickly and at a really high level of quality. And so the key was seeing if he liked the idea also and he did. So then it just moved very, very quickly. So Ira, how long did it take for you to code this from the time he told you the idea until the time it was launched? Week and a half, two weeks development time. And as Eric said, we're still in an open beta. We actually opened up last Wednesday night. So less than a week that it's been open. Why did it take so long to develop it? A week and a half, two weeks to be pretty short. It's over time. You must not have been working overtime. That's pretty cool. So has it received much traction yet? I mean, have people been entering new campaigns yet? Or am I the only one? No, you're definitely not the only one. There have been a few people that have put in campaigns. We've put in a few of ourself to help seed it. And we have quite a consistent number of new people joining the site every day. And so the way that the site will work is that as people tweet these messages out, new people who have no idea about Bitcoin or this website will see it. Some fraction of them will be drawn to the site, and then it'll sort of grow organically. So right now, as of right now from last when we launched on Wednesday night, 200,000 beaks have been fed. We call beaks just our fun little key word for followers. So 200,000 people have seen messages retweeted from people through the site. That's 800 retweets and about 250 average followers per person. So far, 50 Bitcoins have been paid out to the people who have retweeted. And that means at least 50 Bitcoins have been paid in from the advertisers. Cool. Cool. Now, if I want to be an advertiser, I can advertise almost anything, anything acceptable, I guess. And it's not targeted by the audience, right? Because it's just by number of followers and number of tweets. It's not specially targeted to any hashtag or anything like that, right? Yeah. We're relying on the users to target as they wish. So people's Twitter lists are somewhat personal in that they don't want to just spam them with things. So people will send what messages they feel comfortable sending to their own audience. And so we let our users basically filter out for us. If we see a sponsored ad that we think is just completely outlandish or inappropriate, we'll just delete it. So we don't let just anything on the site. But for the most part, we let people pick and choose and distribute what they feel is good. OK, so it's kind of self-regulating. So you pick what you're going to tweet. You're not assigned it. And it doesn't take over your account and automatically tweet for you on your behalf. That's an important point, because that's a real uncomfortable feeling when you give some automated system access to your account. You don't know what it's going to spew into your account. But you actually have to do it manually and initiate the tweet each time, right? Yeah, and there are services out there, not for Bitcoin, obviously, but for normal fiat monies that will let you get paid for your tweets. But often they will send things automatically on a routine basis, and you don't really have any control about it. So this really puts all the control both in the sponsor and in the user. And when their interests meet, the exchange will occur. And I don't think it's possible without the Bitcoins. You can put in any budget amount you want and any cost per meal or what you call it, like cost per 1,000 views or tweets, whatever you want, right? Is there any minimum? No minimum, but it's a competitive market. So as it builds, people who put in a small cost per meal will end up on the second or third or fourth page. And obviously, they're not incentivizing people to send their message out. The higher you pay, the more likely someone is going to send a message to their followers. So it is competitive in that sense. And we think that it lets lots of different advertisers work. If someone has a message that they think is super interesting, they may not need to pay much at all to have it retweeted out, and people might send this out and just earn a couple of little, tiny fractions of a coin. And that's something that you can do with Bitcoin and you can't do it with dollars. OK. Now, I noticed the tweets. Do they always have to contain the hashtag feeds the birds and the link? Is that required part of the content of the tweet? Yeah, Ira, you want to say something? Yeah. Right now, we're putting in probably more hashtags to identify our campaign tweets than in the long run we'll want to. And that's just to create. So people know when a tweet is ours and that they know to look at the campaign and really just get used to the format of these retweets rather than a normal tweet. Right. But I mean, as an advertiser, do I have to have all those hashtags in there? Or no? Yeah, the system adds them. So the way that creating a campaign works is you've got 77 characters out of the total 140 that Twitter allows you. We fill in the rest with the URL to link to your campaign so people can check whether it's got funds, general hashtags labeling it as a retweet for Bitcoin, that sort of thing. And then those 77, you fill in with your ad text. Your ad message. OK. Yeah. And we call it the boilerplate. And so it's appended to each tweet as it goes out. And as Ira said right now, it's more extensive than it will be in the future. We'll trim it down because we realize that with Twitter, every little character is important. So we have a few ways to trim it down a bit as we progress. But for right now, it's important that we explain things more clearly. So that's why we're using more space with the boilerplate. Yeah. Later you can trim it down to hashtag FZB or something, three letters, as long as there's a way for people to figure out what it is. Or a short link, something that's shorter, to give them more characters. That seems like a good idea. If we really try and push it, we can probably get the boilerplate to just about half of what it is now. But there will always be a boilerplate there. And that's what helps virally spread these out. Right. OK, cool. So you guys who are watching live, if you happen to be watching live right now, you can send your questions for Eric and Ira and I to email feedback at onlyonetv.com. All spelled out. Feedback at onlyonetv.com. Right now live on the air, and we can answer your questions. Or you can send an SMS text message to the USA number, plus 1-646-580-0099, you see it right there on the screen, 646-580-0099. If you're watching live, you can send the message right now, and we'll get it and answer it live. If not, if you're not watching live, then send us a question. Maybe we'll try and address it on the next show. So let me take a break real quick now and thank our sponsors, who we appreciate very much for sponsoring the Bitcoin Show and bringing us to you every day. And they are Mt. Gox, the number one Bitcoin exchange site, the automated exchange site where you can buy and sell Bitcoin, 24-7, completely automated from any place on Earth. From the comfort of your easy chair, just go to mtgox.com, mountgox.com. They deal in more than 16 currencies. So it doesn't matter if you're using US dollars, Euros, Canadian dollars, doesn't matter what it is, Japanese yen, you can deal directly with mountgox.com, buy Bitcoin there. You can sell Bitcoin there. Of course, it's the de facto place we look to find out what the value of a Bitcoin is today. They have super sophisticated security with they call it two-factor authentication with this thing called a UB key. It's a tiny little USB dongle. You plug into your computer and it gives you a password. Good for two seconds. So very, very secure. Check it out, mountgox.com. Thanks for sponsoring the Bitcoin Show and the Thank You Economy by New York Times bestselling author, Gary Vaynerchuk, otherwise known on Twitter as Gary V. He's a serial entrepreneur, very famous in the world of social media and speaking of Twitter and Twitter, Facebook and all that. And this book is his second book and it's about, it's basically the Bible on how to use social media, web 2.0, all these new technologies to bring your business back to an era of personal, hand-holding customer service like the good old days. And it's scalable. So it doesn't matter if your business is small or medium-sized or large, how to do social media right. Everybody knows the value of social media and they know they should be using Twitter to help their business, but 99% does it wrong. They just don't know what they're doing. So read this book. This really is the Bible on that. It's called, you can go to thankyoueconomybook.com and check it out. And memorydealers.com, our buddy, Roger Ver is the founder of memorydealers.com. I call him Bitcoin Jesus. He's a huge Bitcoin evangelist. Yeah, I'm sure you know of him. Memorydealers.com is famous also for having the largest inventory of fiber optic network devices, routers, switches, cables, mining gear, all types of memory and peripherals you can imagine. So check it out, memorydealers.com. Thanks, thanks Roger Ver for supporting us. So, Roger's also got an ad on Feeds of Birds. So if you want to tweet that and get some money. Oh, okay. He's got an ad on there already, perfect. See it's everybody supports everybody. I love that. That's great. I didn't see that. So he's got one on there already. Very, oh there it is, the very second one. Roger Ver is fantastic, Bitcoin interview, Libertarian news. Yeah, that's right. He was interviewed on the radio network that he buys ads on. So, actually I'm not sure if that one is placed by him, but that's about him, but he had one for the physical Kassaskis coins that he's selling on his site for the credit card. So that one might have run out of funds now. Oh, okay. It's ever changing, cool, cool. Ever changing. So the, do you think that this has a potential of becoming a huge thing? Well, we have a maximum user base of a few hundred million people. But of course we're limited to the number of people who understand and use Bitcoin. So we see it as, in the near term, it's only gonna be useful for people who already understand what a Bitcoin is and enjoy using them and spending them. But we're hopeful that as these campaigns are tweeted around, some fractional people will be curious and if they see the Bitcoin word around, they'll click on the link and they'll see that they can earn these things if they retweet and that might help drive a little bit of Bitcoin adoption. You know, them being able to see this thing that they can do with Bitcoin that they can't do with normal dollars. I can see also people wanting to learn about it because of their location. For example, we have a virtual, not virtual, it always calls him a virtual employee, but he's actually a real employee, you have a remote employee who lives in Namigan Uzbekistan. So if you live in Uzbekistan or somewhere Tanzania or something where there's a difficulty with banking or currency or, you know, like there there's the only currency that's legally allowed to be used is the Uzbek Psalm. So there could be issues like that. It's difficult to earn money on the internet. If you have access to the internet, all you need is an unlimited internet account and you can sit there and create a Twitter account, create a Twitter following, you know, be a Twitter journalist or whatever it is. And, you know, like there's a lot of people who've done that. There was one called, what was that one called? Something like younggeek or something, youngnerdgeek.com or something like that. Anyway, just somebody in Asia who just, you know, created this microblogging empire really just by being a Twitter journalist. And if you build a big following, you could actually do this. You could actually take these ads and, you know, tweet them. And it's fair game in that you are labeling them as paid so their following knows that they're paid so there's nothing misleading about it. It's full disclosure. They are getting paid for that. But so what, you know, everything has ads. You know, they're not paying to read the quality content. So anyway, the point is you can make a business out of this and in countries, especially in countries where there are banking or currency issues and it's hard to get a job anywhere else. Yeah, in Nigeria there's a company called niratweets.net and Nigerians can tweet their sponsored messages. So in a way it's a little similar to feats of birds, but because of all the problems with normal currencies, this company has to pay out with like reward points and prizes from the website and still they have like tens of thousands of people using their system willing to earn some of these rewards from the site. So clearly people, you know, enjoy having access to a way to sponsor their own content, whether it's an advertisement on their own blog, which lets them earn money from the content they put out or an advertisement in their tweets that lets them earn money from the content that they put out through that channel. Bitcoin really allows it to work a lot more smoothly. Yeah, in other countries like that, circumstances are very different than they are here. They may have cell phones with unlimited SMS and they can use Twitter that way and they have all the time in the world, but they may or may not have internet or sketchy internet or their current season. What's the name of the site you just mentioned in Nigeria? It's niratweets.net Nairatweets.net, we'll put that in the show notes so that people searching for that will also find this show and find out about feats of birds because that's the thing. It doesn't matter if you're in Nigeria or Uzbekistan, you can set up a Bitcoin account. You can go to mountgox.com. In fact, I'm going to do a little how-to video, how to buy and use Bitcoin 2.0, which basically means set up a mountgox account and use that as your wallet for now until the next generation will be these new apps. But anyway, if you go to mountgox.com and create a new account, you're done. You have a Bitcoin wallet that's online and secure. It doesn't matter where you are. BT-Sinch is another good one. BT-Sinch, of course. BT-Sinch too. I know, there's so many now. But yeah, that's right. So anyway, it just takes two seconds. You set up with a Bitcoin account and on these sites, like BT-Sinch and mountgox, they can convert them to the currency of their choice if and when they need to without a whole lot of banking pain involved. It seems like a really good... You might get most of your audience, like most of your tweeters could come from these second and third world countries and marketers can be from anywhere. To another interesting feature, I think that this site, you're absolutely right. We might get people from second, all sorts of countries around the world. You also actually don't need to have a wallet set up to use Feeds of Birds for the first time because it's plugged in to BT-Sinch, it uses it for payouts and also to fund campaigns. You can actually get paid out via an email address. That's right, I forgot. If you stumble on this from Twitter and just are curious about it and sign in with your Twitter account and enter your email address, you can retweet and get paid without ever first learning what a Bitcoin address is and how the transactions work. And then you've got some in your account, it's like I gave you a quarter, now you are motivated to learn what a quarter is. What can I do with it? Right, exactly. That's right, I forgot. Because I did test this out with you the other day and I noticed, because it says no account on file and you can click change and then it says enter your Bitcoin address or your email address, which is brilliant because of course if they don't know what a Bitcoin address is, then they do know what an email address is. So I put in my email address and then of course, BTCinch sends me an email saying you have Bitcoin. So it just sends it out through BTCinch, right? Yeah. So it's integrated with that, which is great because that helps promote BTCinch as well. And that's so, so easy because you just follow the link and boom, now it's in your BTCinch account and you can do with it what you may. That's very, very clever. And now I can, now, is there a way to redeem it directly for munchies? Well, you know, that's the beautiful thing about money. Once it's in your account, you can spend it on whatever you want. You can, you know, go to Bit Munchies and buy yourself some popcorn or whatever you like. Directly from BTCinch. Do I get a discount if I use BTCinch Bitcoins as opposed to generic Bitcoins? We're actually working on a 10% discount for people who check out with BTCinch funds versus... Oh, there you go, there you go. So, yep, they can tweet for Fritos in Nigeria. Or... Yeah, to give you a little idea of how popular this is just in a country like Nigeria, the site, Naira Tweets has 580,000 Twitter users signed up with them. 580,000 Twitter users? 580,000 in Nigeria using Twitter using this service. So... Wow. That's what I'm going to ask you. You said they don't pay in money, they pay in prizes or something? What kind of prizes do they give you? You sort of earn like, you earn like credits with their store and then you can swap it out for some prizes or it's kind of confusing. Are they listing the names of the Tweeters? Are there other Twitter handles there? Yeah, if you go to the site, it shows there's a little roll on the bottom that has some of their recent people and you can go and... Okay. So I'm going to give you an idea, Eric, and then you can give it to Ira and in a week and a half he can have it done. You need to suck in all those Twitter handles into your database and then spew out one by one a welcoming message and at reply to those Tweeters and say, if you like this site, try Feed The Birds because we pay actual money. The largest obstacle, obviously, is just people who have no idea what a Bitcoin is. So we will at all times be limited by the extent of the Bitcoin marketplace, but hopefully we can help push that out further as it grows will benefit. I think the way that the system is set up is really ideal for people getting their first Bitcoin. You know, all you need is a Twitter account and an email address and you've got your first Bitcoin or however much. But it allows people to get their hands on it with no technical knowledge. Right. Well, the barrier of entry, you've just dropped it away completely. So it's just basically custom nothing to try it. The thing is that once they try it, they have to be able to get that converted into something that they can spend for food or something. You know what I mean? And that's actually a good question. So if I'm in Nigeria and I tweet full time for a living, which really that is enough for possibly for a living over there. If you're tweeting for a living in Nigeria and you're getting paid in Bitcoin in my BT Sinch, how hard or easy is it gonna be for a Nigerian to get Nigerian money from Bitcoin? That's an obstacle right there. The first smart Nigerian will set up an exchange in Nigeria. There you go. And then the second. BT Sinch needs a branch there. You need to open up. What's that? You know, we use exchanges as metal men. So I guess crypto exchange needs a branch there. Yeah, the other guys do. Somebody, anybody, just as long as there's some, actually any entrepreneur in Nigeria who's watching this set up an exchange site. You've got 100,000 people who could use it. Actually, I think crypto exchange can already send out withdrawals in Nigerian currency to a Nigerian bank. They do? Are you serious? I think we're kidding. No, crypto exchange can send out over 120 currencies to basically any country that doesn't have a US embargo. Wow. Sorry, North Korea, but almost every other country crypto exchange can send out to. So I don't know if the Nigerian currency is included in that 120, but it may well be. And in that case, someone in Nigeria who had accumulated some of these Bitcoins with the tweets could absolutely sell them for dollars and then withdraw as Nigerian currency to their Nigerian bank. So maybe the Nigerian exchange is already obsolete. So this is a question for crypto exchange, I guess, for Ken over there. But the, which you're involved in that too, Eric, right? You're involved with crypto exchange. Yeah, definitely. That's why you know so much about it, of course. Yes, I took about a month ago. Okay, so they send it to these other countries as a bank wire to that bank in that country. Is that how it works? It's not technically a bank wire, but it goes to their bank. So you can think of it like a bank wire. Mm-hmm, okay. There's a $15 fee to do any withdrawal to any bank and that replaces the wire fee or EFT fees, that kind of thing. Okay, so do they have to have an account at that bank or they can just walk in with an ID and retrieve the funds? Whatever, if the Nigerian has a normal Nigerian bank account, it's likely that crypto exchange can send Nigerian currency to that bank. Directly to that bank. If it's one of the 120 currencies that we have supported right now. Okay. Which I'm not sure of. Okay, you hear that, everybody in Nigeria? Now you don't have to do those spam fraud emails anymore, you switch over to tweet marketing. You probably need more money anyway. We also need to get in contact with Kim Kardashian because she's kind of like the biggest tweeter in the universe in terms of what she can pull in. So if anyone out there knows her personally, we'd love to have her as a spokesperson or something. But she makes probably like, I don't know, 20 grand on a tweet. Wow. So you go to sponsoredtweets.com. We need to have a really big campaign in order to appeal to her though. Because we have a- You're reaching a few million people though. Yeah, so actually you're right, it would have, we just had a big budget for a campaign. Because one tweet would wipe it out unless you've got that much in there. So, okay, Roger Ver Memory Dealers, you have to put a $100,000 campaign in there and then we'll get Ms. Kardashian to one tweet. Boom, it's done. Yeah, I'm not sure her followers are our main target market right now, but certainly that would boost the business. If you go to sponsoredtweets.com, they're kind of the biggest people in this field. And they have a lot of the celebrities that send out these sponsored tweets. And these people have 10 million followers and they pull in five figures for a single tweet. So there's definitely money in it. Amazing. Sponsoredtweets.com, okay, cool. Sponsoredtweets.com. Yeah. But of course everything that that site does is held back by having to stick with dollars and bank accounts and they're limited to the US. So as well as they've done with getting celebrities on board, they're always going to be stuck in a dollar world and we'll see if they wake up and realize it. Yeah, the internet is a global network and so is Bitcoin if they go hand in hand. I mean, when I first heard this, I knew it was a good idea but it's actually a much better idea than I realized because of all these things. Like you say, the banking, PayPal, all that, those networks are so antiquated and limited and regulated and expensive. This is so much better. Completely independent of where you are. If you look at sponsored tweets, I believe they also use a kind of point system where you buy points or are paid in points for tweeting and I'm not sure how it works specifically with the celebrities but I think really the reason why all these places are using point systems is because they can't manage the funds in a scalable enough increment. So really what's allowing us to do this then the characteristic of Bitcoin that allows us to do this is micropayments. You can get paid out for four followers and it really opens this possibility of getting paid for retweets up to people who have a normal average kind of Twitter account versus somebody who's got millions and can get paid in whole dollars for a campaign. Yeah, if you have 200 Twitter followers, I don't think you can get paid through some of these main. That makes sense too. For the average everyday person, like Eric who only has 100 followers, you can actually get paid. Because yeah, it makes sense because the nature of Bitcoin, the eight decimal places, which if you got one 10,000th of a penny or whatever, it's not gonna be able to pay you anything. You're gonna have to do quite a bit, but you can actually get one 10,000th of a Bitcoin and send it to you and you receive it. Yeah, we currently have a minimum withdrawal of a 0.01 Bitcoin. So as long as you can get to one bit penny or bit cent, then you can withdraw. But there's no technological barrier to making it one single millionth of a Bitcoin or something, it's just a transaction to you. Well, you could go further with that if you wanted to. If I were to put a little bit more time into it. But a bit cent will go a long way in Nigeria. You know. You'll see. I mean, seriously, you can eat a meal, probably for what, a couple bit cent for real. I mean, people can really live on very little. They live a simple life and that money goes a long way in a country like that. So. Yeah, well, something as revolutionary as Bitcoin is gonna create lots of wealth in interesting places. They'll normally see it. And so, you could expect something like, some rural Nigerian who just has a little net book and something figuring out how to earn a huge amount of money. I can see, he'll be the guy who runs the exchange over there and he'll have like sweatshops with everybody running on a little $99 net books. Just tweeting, tweeting, 24 hours a day tweeting, you know? Just like the Chinese World of Warcraft gold factories, right? Yeah, like that, yeah, exactly. You know, you said a bit sense is actually, can be a lot. I was, at first, struck me a little odd, but you think about it, you know, there, what did you say, Eric, 400 million users on Twitter? It's like, it's between two and 400 million, I believe. Well, I mean, let's go with three. 300 million users, if each one of them gets one bit sent, that's three million Bitcoins that are now part, held by this Twitter Bitcoin consortium. So the potential to affect Bitcoin prices and demand is actually huge just because of the size of these markets that even with micro payments, it can have a real impact. Yeah, yeah. And even if you have, I mean, you know, like, you know, in some of these countries, you can get dinner for 20 cents, you know, US. So that would be, what would that be? 10, or whatever, five bit cents or something? Eight Bitcoins. Something like, yeah. So, I mean, the, every Bitcoin holder, no matter how small their account is another Bitcoin user, which has, you know, who contributes to the Bitcoin community in ways, I mean, maybe not financially as much, but in other ways because every user is a beta tester, every user has, you know, feedback and also is a person who is potential of word of mouth and spreading the word. There's a lot of benefits to having more users of Bitcoin. Yeah, absolutely. And the more they understand it, just one more person who understands how this works, even if it's a thousandth of a Bitcoin or one bit cent, when they understand it, they're like, wow, if I can send a bit cent, then I can send a Bitcoin. If I can send a Bitcoin, I can send a hundred Bitcoin. And like, and there's still no fee. I mean, you know, once they get it, it'll spread like wildfire. More evangelists are born. And someone in some rural place with a few thousand Twitter followers, they could very easily pay for their dinner by sending a tweet out. Yeah, absolutely. And this can very much be in the interest of the sponsor. You know, if he's trying to target some certain group, this is very beneficial for all the parties. At some point on our site, we're gonna need to categorize more by location and type. So there will be some segmentation eventually, but for right now, it's just kind of all on the homepage. Yeah, like if somebody in China has a million followers, but they're all Chinese and they read Chinese, but yeah, but anyway, for now, it's still good. The idea that, well, if they're in English, that's pretty much the universal language for the most part, but what was I gonna say? Just the idea that people work hard on their Twitter accounts. They tweet, some people take the time, like I try to say something profound, something really interesting and educational, and I do it in a spirit of sharing. This is really good information, and I wanna share it with the world, kind of in that way. And so if you put energy and thought and intention behind what you're tweeting, it's not just a machine to make money. Of course, I've never done sponsored tweets, so it's definitely not about money. But yeah, like I have 12 and a half thousand followers or something like that. So I think it's absolutely fair and justified to capitalize on that, to do a sponsored tweet once in a while. Your audience, as long as they know, that's what it is, there's nothing misleading. You don't wanna do an ad and then make it seem like it's not. As long as it's full disclosure, this is a sponsored tweet. That's important to me. But if as long as it's full disclosure, it's sponsored, then hey, that's the price of getting the good content. And it's a nationally balancing mechanism. So you write, people do work and spend time and effort to build up their follower list. It's something of value to have these followers. And someone who damages that privilege by spamming them with sponsored ads can only do that in the short term and people will start, because it's very easy to leave and not follow someone anymore. Right, yeah. I think with our site, probably a lot of people worry about spam and issues like that. But if you think about the incentive structure and how people will respond to someone who's spamming, those people will tend to lose followers. So there's always gonna be a careful balance that the user of the Twitter guy has to take care of. Exactly, you don't wanna overdo it. You don't wanna do too many, too often. But I love the fact that on Feeds of Birds, it's done manually. So I have full control over exactly what I tweet and how often and when and all that. So I don't really like the automated systems where it's gonna tweet automatically. Every few hours, I think my followers would really not appreciate that, especially if they have it set up to notify their phone and their phone actually rings. Some people do. I mean, literally I tweet something and they reply right away, always because you know, they have Twitter notifications on and they don't follow very many people. So literally when I tweet something, their phone rings. And you have to respect that. I mean, there are people like that, they just follow a few key people and they have notifications on. When somebody sends me an email or an ad reply, I'll get a notification. But anyway, the point is that some people do. They really, really care about what you say enough to have notifications on. So if they get notified of something that's a sponsored tweet too frequently, they are gonna unfollow you for sure. Because you don't wanna annoy them. Yeah, and also it's not just a question of whether you tweet a message or not, but you can choose which ones you tweet. That's right. Some of them will be relevant for a certain audience, but inappropriate for another. And people can choose to pick the ones that are relevant for their audience. Exactly, that's another thing I like about feeds of words because I can go there. If it's a message about like Roger Ver's, you know, Bitcoin interview, that's something I would tweet anyway. So I may as well get paid for it. So if it's something about Bitcoin or about Ubuntu Linux or Free Open Source software or Android or one of the many things that I do tweet about all the time, my followers already know that I tweet about these topics and they follow me because I tweet about these topics, especially if I can find something in there that I would probably tweet about anyway, that's perfect because then it just goes right in with what I would do. And there's also a very blurry line between just content and an advertisement because I've used this own system to send out like an article that I thought was interesting. And so I'll pay, you know, a few bit cents to place this on our site. And I'm not expecting any return from that, but it's something that I want other people to see. So I can put it on the site, I can set a low CPM number. And if other people find it interesting, they earn a little bit and it helps the message get out to thousands of people. So if you think about like, you know, a charity could do this very well and they can send out a message that they thought was important. We also have a method on the site to show the funding address for that campaign publicly. So people who see the campaign can see the address that they can fund it with. And that means that people can, people who see the tweet can visit that and say, oh, I support this message too, let me donate a coin to the cause. And then that all goes into the pool and continues to distribute it out. Oh, you mean it displays the Bitcoin address of the campaign? If you want, it's an option. It's just a check box, say, display the address publicly. And then anyone can pay in to keep funding the campaign. Speaking of charities, I mean, do you have any ability to, like what if somebody puts a sponsored tweet on there that says donate to the Red Cross or something, it's not the Red Cross? Do you, that's, you look for that, right? If it's a charity, you're gonna have to do some verification and make sure it's really that representing the real charity, right? Well, if someone puts an ad that we clearly see as fraud, we'll take it off. But people always need to take responsibility for their own actions on the internet. So if you see a tweet that says donate here to the Red Cross and you click it and it takes you to some Ukrainian URL asking for your money. First of all, the tweet is control. And second, yeah, don't tweet that. Bet these things yourself, always be careful of what you do. And if you see a Red Cross thing, in all cases, beyond just our site, you need to take care of it. Redcross.frod.ru, then probably that's not the right one. Yeah. We encourage, because we're using Twitter as our kind of publishing platform, if you find spam related to any of our accounts, or anything like that, report it to Twitter as well. Tell us and we'll do what we can to remove it from our system. But if you tell Twitter, then Twitter will also do what they can to flag that user. Right, right. And the advertiser also has to look clearly at the message and make sure that it's a message that they can stand behind, at least. Right, we, in our terms of use, we have a little clause there that says basically if we find an account that's clearly spam, and this is purely according to our judgment, we will simply cancel the account and we'll donate the funds that have been deposited to a charity or perhaps to the other sponsors or something. So what that does is it introduces risk for anyone who wants to rip people off. To fund the account on our site, they have to donate bitcoins. So that's their risk. If they do that and we catch them, they lose their money. So we think that that is another natural way that will act as a disincentive for people to put that stuff out. That's good, that's smart. Have you had any negative feedback from anybody that just is opposed to anybody doing any kind of commercial advertising on Twitter? Yeah, there's always people that are opposed to anything that has to do with profit, business, and advertising. And any system that forwards those initiatives will have critics. So I'm not sure we can do much about them. There are people who think that Twitter is sacred and there should never be any advertisements. They fail to see the purpose of an advertisement in society. It's not this evil plague that you have to deal with all the time. Advertisements are ways for people to get their messages out. And when you can monetize the content that you're putting out through Twitter, it encourages you to put out better content to grow your Twitter list because suddenly it's worth more. So while on the surface, we're all kind of annoyed to add some stuff. There's actually a very important purpose that they serve. And as long as people aren't abusing that, people shouldn't have a serious problem with it. Yeah. I mean, as long as, I've always feel like as long as it's clearly identified as an advertisement, you know, one thing that bothers me, one of my pet peeves is these, you know, the search engines, I forgot whether it was Bing or Google or one of them the other day, but I was looking at it and I was going, you know how they have the sponsored links at the top and they have them like in red or pink or something? I'm like, is that pink getting fainter and fainter and fainter? I have to like close the blinds and turn off the lights to tell, is that white or pink? It's almost like they're trying to make it blend in so you really can't tell which ones are sponsored and which ones aren't. And that bothers me. I think it should be clearly labeled advertisement, you know, and that's cool. I mean, if I want to click it, it's relevant, I'll click it, but I don't like it when advertising is disguised as content, that's one of my real pet peeves. But as long as it's full disclosure, I'm getting paid to tell you this message, you feel free to skip it, you know? Then I think it's fair game and the best content out there on any kind of media is monetized. Of course, it has sponsorship because, you know, the best content has value and why shouldn't the people who create it get rewarded financially? I mean, that's what capitalism is about, so. Yeah, and some people, there is value in seeing an ad that is relevant to you. There's value in knowing about a service that you didn't know about or a product that you might want. So people with Twitter accounts who send out these advertisements, the ones who do it effectively, will actually be sending information to their followers who may want that information. Yeah. So the responsibility lies with the person who controls their own follower list and if they abuse that privilege, their followers will tend to leave. Exactly, that's what I was saying what I would do is I'll be watching to see if I find things on there that I would probably tweet anyway, I'm just gonna go ahead and tweet them and, you know, why not, you know, why not get paid? Yep. Who says there's no such thing as a free lunch? It's possible. It could be a win-win. So, well, thank you guys so much. Bravo, I'm really congratulations on another smart venture for both of you involved in so many projects. They all overlap. I was saying this Bitcoin world is kind of this incestuous world where everybody gets involved in so many different things but it's all good, it's so exciting. Thanks, really appreciate being here. Sure. Thanks for having us, Bruce. All right, take care guys, thanks for joining us. All right, see ya. Thank you guys for joining us and we will see you same time tomorrow. Ciao.