 Hello everyone, welcome back to our podcast from the Kamasutra to 2020 where we look at everything to do with sex, sexuality and relationships. And today I am absolutely delighted to welcome a very old and a very dear friend, Vipula Devani. Vipula is the founder and the creator of Coaching Life. She's going to tell us a little bit more about that as we talk. And she is, and I love this absolutely, she's a conscious relationship coach and a spiritual practitioner. Vipula, it's so good to have you over here with us. Good to be here, Seema. Lovely to see you again. So Vipula, without any kind of delays or further ado, please tell us a little bit more about what you mean about being a conscious relationship coach because I know that your work is around bettering relationships through conscious self-awareness. And the self-awareness is being able to judge, engage one's own emotions and thoughts and patterns that keep coming up for us. And I say conscious because once they're in our consciousness, we're then able to process them. And that self-awareness then allows us to have better relationships outside of us because we're having a better relationship with ourselves first. And I use quite a lot of spiritual tools and modalities in order to do some of the interventions, which is why the word conscious into the relationships, yeah. You know, I think it's absolutely amazing because today, for instance, I was trying to do a little reel for Instagram about somebody said to me if I was going to teach sex ed, what would I start with? And I was saying that I would start by teaching people about emotions because sex is not just about the body. It's very much about what goes on in the mind. And if you can become aware of what's that mess of emotions in there, you will approach sex or any part of your intimate life with a lot more awareness. Yes, because I actually believe intimacy starts outside of the bedroom. And that's aware of where you're at, what it is that you require, how to even express it is a good starting point for all forms of intimacy, which is also the connections you form, not just the physical aspect of it, but also the connections through conversations, through goals, through shared values and through whatever else you wish to explore and desire. Yeah. But isn't it strange how we're never actually taught to acknowledge or understand our emotions? Why do you think that is? Is this just like a fear that society has about letting you be in charge of yourself? Yes, and I think essentially it does boil down. A lot of our programming happens in the formative years of our life. And as children, we're not, and it's in all honesty, it's through no fault of our parents, but if they have never done it, and they have 101 other things to do at the same time and not just one child and, you know, a whole gang of them to manage, you're just doing the best you can in, okay, zip up and get on with it kind of space or get your work done, get your education done, get the academia done. But the underlying factors are often ignored because they themselves don't know how to cope with it. And the children are then not able to process them properly themselves. It's a gray area. But giving children in those formative years, I believe the space to regulate their emotions to actually have conversations about them and how they're feeling, whether it's a boy or girl or any sort of gender or any, it doesn't matter, but being able to regulate those emotions and actually understand what's going on for them, I think, is imperative for healthy relationships later on in life. Giving them the space to say it and also validating it rather than saying, oh, don't be so silly. You don't be like that. And particularly I find for men it's hard to, because they just basically told zip up and don't cry over it, don't be, you know, a sissy over it or don't become too brash about it or, you know, too sensitive. And so it becomes harder for little children and then it shows up in our relationships later on in life. That childhood trauma does show up in our relationships later on in life because we then enact them. When our partners start mirroring those back to us. Yeah, it's a scary thought, isn't it? So tell us how did you get started on this? This is how long have you been doing this? And what are the, what are the bases, the foundations of what you're doing? I think I have been doing it my entire life in that sense. I didn't have the awareness of it until about seven or eight years ago. And only when I had the awareness of it did I then start processing that I had always had certain patterns in my life. I had always repeated them. But also I wasn't actually regulating my own emotions. I wasn't aware of half of them, although I took pride in the fact that I knew. And so it became a sort of a dichotomy at that point. I think it was I really doing it if the patterns kept repeating in my life. And I became quite introverted. I sort of I took on this process of learning, but also practically shut myself away, and just went within and started processing for myself through self learning, and then realize that I was equally to blame for everything that was wrong in my life. I started to take responsibility for everything that was going wrong, and then took responsibility for not just what had happened until that point, but took responsibility for creating the future I wanted. Because until that point I was still a victim to circumstances of victim to okay I didn't know what was going on. I was just allowing everybody else to have their say and priority over me. But the awareness for me personally is when it shifted. And that's when my relationships changed. That's when I had to process a lot of the triggers with with parents with siblings with children. Every relationship can be a trigger if, if you take it as a form of learning. So, it became a process of growth and fortunately I came across a mentor who helped me through that and a community of of like minded spiritual practitioners that helped promote that level of growth, and explore the spiritual modalities for me, I then became a tutor and assisted others along that process. I mean, I, we all have issues all of us. There's nobody who's a finished product. And that's, that is the beauty of it. That is the perfection of it. And on that journey someone is two steps ahead and someone else is just starting out and someone is 10 steps ahead and some. So all along that we just collaborating and helping the other one alone. That's how I see it. So someone's a few steps ahead and someone who's a few steps behind needs that helping hand to get ahead. And that's what my, that's what my journey has been about and that's what I still do to this day I still believe that someone's far ahead in other aspects and I can help somebody along along this particular niche, a couple of steps so that they can fly to and it's just such a beautiful way of putting it. Tell me something going back to this idea of becoming aware of your emotions, understanding how they motivate you how they drive you, how they trigger you. As a person who wakes up every day I mean we change every day you wake up every morning you're slightly different. How do you deal with the change and I mean today, how a particular thing makes me feel is going to be different tomorrow. Yes. What is your advice I mean like how do you navigate things like this, you know, for a person who is just buried in life doing stuff like how do you navigate emotions. So I, I wake when I wake up in the morning, the first thought in my head, and this is come. It doesn't come naturally. It's, it's a ritual now. A ritual. That's become a habit, but it's a ritual where I wake up every morning and I don't even write it anymore I just say it in my and I have three things of gratitude I have to be, I have to just come up with as soon as I wake up. And one of them is inevitably, I've got another day to show up. So thank you. And then three things that I wish to show up as in that day. And the qualities that I am going to embody for that day. Three things I'm going to be in that day, because that means I am now showing up in my day with intention. And by putting that down, I am sending the message to my unconscious mind that I have to show up like that I have to show up as someone who's empowered, I have to show up as somebody who is confident today. I might have something going on for me that day, which might actually be making me anxious or nervous or, you know, I say I have to present in front of a or gone a webinar or something that might actually test me. But the fact that I have set the intention that I'm going to be the best practitioner or the best coach that day for the highest good is one of my intention. So when I live through that day, I am living through it with the intention of being a certain person so that that person has the capacity to do the things that come up for her during the day. So really, really bringing the direct definition of conscious to your intentions, like literally saying, this is what I am going to be and I am conscious of it. And like you said, my goodness, that isn't an easy thing to do. No, because you're attacked by so many doubts along the way and there are many things that make you angry, which totally upset the balance of that, you know, because it's not a perfect world. Yeah, but because the intention is being set and our unconscious minds are very, very powerful, the intention is being set. What it does is it sends me a reminder. I am supposed to show up like this today. So suddenly, I'm not doing it unconsciously. I'm doing it with that consciousness that I am supposed to show up as this kind of person today, and I'm letting myself down. If I don't hold myself accountable to it. It's really interesting. Yeah, and that is very powerful. Yeah. And that in turn becomes my form of self respect, because I'm not letting myself down. Thank gosh, you know, it's all of these things we know them we think them we're somewhere I mean we encase these things in ourselves but till they're articulated. You don't realize them. Which is the conscious part right because you're bringing it into your awareness. And at the end of the day, I, I then sit down before mine. So it's my nighttime routine where I will sit down and I will evaluate my day very quickly. But did I hold myself accountable for the three things I was going to show us today or did my, could I have done it better. And always gratitude thank you for for allowing me to show up the way I did today. And if I could make it even 1% better than, can you please do that tomorrow. So it's all about living from that space of intention. You know, I often do this exercise with people where I say to them okay, for instance, so we do it particularly with jealousy or, you know, certain other emotions that are that strong that when you have an attack either panic attack or a jealousy attack. The first thing to try and see is what part of the body are you feeling it in. Yes. So that at its strongest, you can actually see are you feeling it in your gut, are you feeling it in your shoulders are you feeling it in your eyes, you know, everybody manifests it differently. Yes. And if you can figure out what part of your body you're feeling it in, then the next time, instead of going to that big huge thing of the jealousy, you deal with that part of your body. And it makes such a huge difference. Yeah. And it's one of the, to be honest, it's one of the interventions I use when it comes to releasing in a coaching session. And once we have brought it down to the part of the body. The client can actually even tell me the color it, it holds the shape of it, the structure of it is it smooth the texture of it, all those things suddenly it becomes something that's a lot more tangible for them. Which is, and that again that's part of the awareness right it's, you're right it's so it we hold it all in our bodies everything is every motion is held in our bodies and it will show up somewhere. When, if you ask the question, and I'm not afraid of the answers it shows it throws back. Yeah, I just wish that when we were younger this is something that we were taught to deal with just the emotions because that's the one thing where your girls are boys. You're told to not deal with the emotional side of it it's always about you know the physical thing of don't do this and don't do that and you know we've just done a podcast on clothes and how clothes can make you feel. Particularly somebody written into us about young girls from a slightly less protected or privileged background. You know who are more at risk, and if they end up wearing certain types of clothes how does it impact their own behavior. So it's not so much what other people are doing but like, what does it make you do. And we were saying how interesting it is that when parents say to their children, you know this is really what we should be talking about you don't say you know you can't wear that skirt it's too short. Ask them, what is it making you feel like, what are those clothes making you feel like and consider it before we come to the next thing. But yeah emotions are just so underrated Vipula, I'm glad that you're fighting a good fight to bring them back. Yeah, I mean I honestly think we will through awareness make better grandparents. We didn't do it for our children in the same way for the for the lack of awareness not from the lack of love. And then perhaps the awareness will make us better grandparents, where we allow the grandchildren and the new generations coming through to be able to have those conversations, and validate those feelings whatever they're feeling, and perhaps draw some sort of defining core And it does take time doesn't it because I mean now now I find like you know, our children went to school together yours and mine and you know them. And every now and then, one of them will do something that really annoys me and you know, my, your first reaction when you're especially when you're trying to do something else and one of them is bugging you, no matter how old they are, our kids are now what Varun and David are like, they never stop. Yeah, and you know, like in the back of your head, and, you know, I would get really annoyed and you sort of grit your teeth and the okay you know what I've had enough and I've now found the words to be able to say, Look, I am feeling really, really anxious on the inside about something else. And it doesn't take very long to say it, and say, look, can you just leave this be because it's really really upsetting me it's triggering something that I don't understand. And it makes a world of difference. I'm not saying that the kids will automatically understand it but it's only when you keep saying it that that language will permeate through to them as well, because we cannot live just as. Okay, I've decided to do this and this is how my world will be. Yeah, it's not possible. Yeah. I mean, I, I actually believe my children have been my greatest teachers, they have been because neither of them, they're both strong headed, but neither of them will let anything go. So it's almost okay if you're too busy right now but I'm not letting it go it'll come up again it's so you either deal with it at that point, but you know it's not gone. You're going to have those conversations you're going to because they're not going to let it go. So through those we've actually have quite a few conversations yes, and that part of letting go as a parent and learning from them. And you know stepping back and learning from them has perhaps been my greatest motivation. It's a huge learning curve really you learn a lot from your kids. Okay, I'm going to throw a curveball at you in the in the not really a curveball but I'm going to tell you about an email that came to me, which I am planning to do a response for but I'd love to get your idea on it because for me it's much deeper than just the surface of what it says. So basically the, the message that came was about this lady who said that she's been married for, I don't know 10 odd years, wonderful marriage fabulous husband. And then the other day, she catches him sneaking into the bathroom and her sister is having a shower and videoing her sister in the shower. And then she confronted him. She said he cried he apologized he said oh I watch it on porn porn made me do it you know. And she's finished by saying, I don't know what to do I don't want to end my relationship, but you know because I love him, and it has been a very good marriage but what do you do. And I went through this whole thing of saying, Okay, you know what. Yeah, like, you need to get him to do this you need to get him to do that. And then, actually I sat down yesterday and I thought, No, she's not going to be the one telling him, you need to go for therapy you need to detox. He needs to tell her what he's going to do to rebuild that trust. He has to take responsibility. Nobody is saying that the relationship needs to end, but for it to continue because it's not a small thing. They have both. I mean, this is huge and it's going to be in their minds for the rest of their lives. And they both have to deal with it. But it's going to have to be about what they realize they need from the other person to deal with. Yeah. But if you had this, I would say a similar thing in that is he not. If he's not able to voice what he is actually seeking in a relationship. Then it's a partnership right so is she making it comfortable enough for him to actually ask for what he wants and blaming porn. I hear that quite a bit but that's just an excuse it's just an escape it's the easy way out. Because then you don't have to deal with stuff that's happening for you, your desires, you don't have to voice them to the partner who hopefully is going to be open enough to be able to come to some sort of a compromise. Okay, let's explore this or let's try this or there's so many factors there's so in context it could be a lot of things. Is he just bored and is he seeking seeking something different. Is he not able to actually voice what he wants to her in which case does she make it open enough or non judgmental enough for her to have that conversation with him. Those are not easy conversations between couples. No, particularly conversations around sex are never easy conversations with couples. Yeah, and porn is a good escape. I'm not saying porn is wrong. It feels a need. But what does he actually want at home. I think unfortunately this is also one of those. It's a really popular video, you know, wife sister in the shower. It's a very popular porn theme. Step sisters step mothers all that they have. I understand but what is the what is the reality of it you know what is he actually going through what is he processing and I would actually ask her that are you able to have a conversation with him without judging him. Unfortunately, if it's a sister that he was sort of spying on is one thing but and yes if they will value their marriage and they've got to get past this. Yeah, so like, what would you recommend if you were talking to both of them what would you say to the guy. I would ask her what it is that offends her first of all with is it the fact that it's her sister, or is it the fact that it's her husband and the sister, or is it the fact that he's getting pleasure on something that isn't to do with her. What is it first of all that offends her. And for him, what is it that's driving him, I would actually do so the way I do couples therapy when I have relationship when we have relationship issues, or they do. I do each one separately. Okay, so I might because my process is a 13 week process I spend the first six or seven weeks with each one individually. It doesn't become about he did this and she did this. It becomes about what it was for each one and what the driving factors were for each one. I get each one to a space of self awareness first for themselves take that responsibility. Then I bring them into alignment and then the last four to five weeks, they have therapy together. They have coaching together. Literally, they then in the first six weeks, seven weeks, they're not living with each other saying you said this and she said this kind of space and then they're not taking it outside of the coaching session. But each one is doing their own awareness work separately. And the alignment, when I do when the alignment happens around the seventh week that is done separately to then they brought together for a coaching session. And by that point, each one is taking responsibility for their own driving factors. What is what is their motivation in doing that that is the one that then tells you more stories. Gosh, there's just so much more that we need to be exploring when it comes to our relationships, which we don't we push it under the carpet a lot of times because we're scared of what it might tell us. We're scared of offending the other person, because we're scared of losing them, we're scared of losing either their respect or we're scared of losing them. But my, my greatest achievements in a relationship for relationships for others through coaching have been when each one has decided they're happy to let it go. They've had the difficult conversations, they've had the difficult words with each other they've had, they've looked at themselves, thinking, this is rock bottom. And when they're willing to then have those conversations because they're willing to let it go is when they've had their greatest magic. Because suddenly it's not about the letting go it's about, I'm now being honest and open with you. Absolutely. Without offending, without feeling that I need to offend. You're making that connection with the other person, you're finally reaching out and actually holding hands, not just superficially like we're linked together with a handcuff. Yeah, and that level of honesty has very rarely drifted anybody apart. I haven't seen a single couple that it's, you know, it's where their relationship has been destroyed by that honesty. That's really interesting. I had another question the other day which comes to mind as you were talking about this lady who said that her husband is a sports person and he's decided that being a sports person he doesn't want to waste his energy having sex. So he has said to her, we won't be intimate together. We will just masturbate and fulfill our needs. And there are other things that we can do in life together. And for me, like, when you hear that question for me lots of different danger belts go off. It's a really, I mean, like it's the sort of, it's like almost a recipe for drifting apart, not because sex is essential. People can live without sex, but I think to deliberately take it out of the mix and replace it with something more clinical. I think, for me, it destroys a bond. How do you feel about this? Absolutely, I agree with you. Sex in a bedroom is only, like I said, it's, it's just the result of everything else that happens outside of it. So in this particular case, if the gentleman feels that the sport is taking up so much of his energy. And if you look at the act of releasing, how is that not releasing the energy? I don't understand how you can differentiate intimacy with the pure act of just sex. I think intimacy is a vital part of it. So when you've taken that out of the equation, it's just functional. To me, intimacy is what actually regenerates that particular bit of energy. The orgasm at the end, the ejaculation is literally just a release. It's, there is no resurgence. But yeah, I think that. I think, I know that in the spiritual sense, the woman is the receiver. And the man is the giver when it comes to the exchange of that kind of energy. So yes, when the man is releasing, he is releasing his energy. But it can be quite that that experience can be transmuted into greater energy. Especially for a sports person. I agree. So in Tantra, we say that the woman is not the receiver. She is the conduit. So the man gets his energy and each person needs a conduit. So the other partner becomes the conduit, which is when you then receive more of that back. Yeah, I think relationships are, they've been going since the world, the universe began since life started on this planet. And yet we know as little about it as we ever did. I mean, like, there is no, there's no conscious awareness of how to make a relationship perfect. You know, the Kamsutra says that if you're going to have your most people get very bored with their sex lives, it becomes monotonous, it becomes jaded, it becomes faded. And the Kamsutra says that if you want your, your intimate life, if you want your pleasure life to continue forever with the same person, you have to treat it like an art form. You have to consciously add to it, learn what to do. And I think relationships, even more so, you have to treat them like an art form. You have to feed them and nurture them. And there are so many different things that go into it because love as we term it is not as straightforward as a hallmark card saying I love you. No, there's so many aspects of it. It isn't that's just the idea of romantic love isn't it but once you get there you suddenly realize that you have to work at it. But that but to achieve truthful fulfillment in that space in a relationship through a relationship. It does require work. It does require a level of connection it does require. And like with every other connection it works in a spiral so every time you have you have another it goes to it just goes deeper. And it becomes more and more fulfilling. Intimacy is everything in my head it's everything outside of the bedroom bedroom is just the. Yeah, it's just the geography isn't it. But it's the intimacy of the conversation or being having that non judgmental space being taken care of each other. You know, all that comes well before. Tell me just to you know I this has been really wonderful and I hope that everybody listening and just takes so much away from this. But as a closing point is there something that you'd like to leave us with in the way of advice and what we should be like baby steps. What is the thing to work towards before I can get to the next step. Just to not be afraid to just not be afraid to actually enjoy a week. We become so serious in our relationships we've taken the fun out of it and the fun is not just the intimacy aspect of it it's actually having fun being with each other to actually enjoy each other. The company of each other to actually and I think that's where we need to have a few laughs together to have some fun together I think that's that's what I would say go get back that to me is the basic starting point. Start having fun again. Yeah, isn't that just such a wonderful idea it's such a simple thing to say. And yet, so difficult for so many people. Thank you just so much for being with us you know I think more and more, particularly post pandemic where are you know the world might have stopped but our minds our brains went on overdrive. And most of us have come out of it in a real jumble in our heads. And unraveling that jumble is, it's really difficult there's just so much going on in people's minds and their bodies the stress levels, it's just off the charts right now. Yeah. Yeah, there is a lot of anxiety overwhelm the back you know the backlash of having been shut away in all honesty, all the distractions being taken away and suddenly we've got to face. What we've been trying to avoid all along and absolutely. Yeah, I think that was the scary thing wasn't it. Yeah. To be shut in with your own thoughts with your own realizations I and with no get out it was a very very frightening thing. And I think for a lot of people just facing their own thoughts was so frightening so when we have people like you who say, actually those thoughts. This is the first step towards finding finding peace within yourself and being a better version of you gives people hope to think my thoughts are not toxic they're just, yeah, I just have to learn to convert them. Yeah, absolutely and and and actually make them useful for me how can they work for me, because every thought, every pattern, everything we have now served us at some point. It just doesn't serve us anymore, but that doesn't mean that it didn't when it was first established. And for that reason, we, we can, we can then realize that we can create new ones that serve us going forward. Yep, like we always say in the corporate sector that you know you can't change people's behavior can't change your own behavior but if you can become aware of it. You can manage it better. So, you know, maybe that's the way forward. Well, for everybody out there listening I hope that you enjoyed this session with Bipola. She is available if anybody needs to get in touch with her either for a coaching session or a consultation. She's available on her website which is Bipola.com, which is B-I-P-O-O-L-A dot com, but it'll be in the caption below so even if you didn't catch it it doesn't matter. Yeah, she's amazing and go see her if you're having problems. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me Sema. It's been wonderful catching up with you again. Indeed it has and here's to a lot more of these sessions. Good luck. Good luck with all the good work you do. Thank you. If anybody out there needs to get in touch with me, I am on info.sema.anand at gmail.com send your questions in over there and we will see how we can respond to you. In the meantime, like, comment, subscribe as always and take care of yourselves. Be safe. Thank you.