 My name is Tianwei. I'm a moderator and a host of China Global Television Network, but that's not important what is important is We are here to talk about our future Together, so it's my great honor to introduce to all of you our four distinguished panelists on the stage from the very left my great friend Nadia Huta galang good. We're ambassador from the United Nations Environment program UNEP based in Geneva. Thank you so much for being with us. Thank you. Thank you Marshall Smith's chairman and chief executive officer Asia Pacific head from the corporate strategy of Cargill Thank you, sir from the industry. Certainly. We want to welcome you Of course, we have our producer of this beautiful story Dmitry the freeze who up sorry keys Scully who of course is the director of a silver back films with the Also a cultural leader of the world economic forum. That's but certainly not least Dmitry the freeze a member of the managing board of a royal DSM from the Netherlands. We're coming from all over But we all watch this story If I can may I ask the two gentlemen who have not talked yet so far to give us some of the takeaways That they have particularly from an industry perspective Yeah, thank you. Thank you very much. I was afraid that Keith will bring me into depression with all these These these movie clips but the good thing is that he ended with a positive note and that there's still hope and I think it's also too late to be pessimistic And I'm an optimist and I represent indeed as you said the industrial companies and and royal DSM stands for In the past for Dutch state mines We were a coal mining company. So basically we were in the in the beginning in destroying our planet almost right And we've transformed ourselves because of optimistic hope and and what the message is From these fantastic movie Netflix series is that we need to take responsibility? I think Keith clearly explained that there is a very delicate balance and That balance will continue to destroy itself because we are out of balance and we need to take action and we feel that we should take the responsibility in Thinking differently from a business perspective We think that this balance should be people planet and profit and I think that could Go hand in hand and maybe that should transform into that should go hand in hand. All right But if you look at the audience today earlier when we were watching the movie, it's a full house Now when we're talking about solutions I'm afraid that we only have half of the house Of course people have different commitments that certainly is under both understandable at the world economy forum But this is the issue here that we do get alarmed. But when it comes to real actions, there could be a problem So what about that? Marshall I Actually think it's okay that we have half an hour house the Mr. Strong still sitting here with us what's what's happening in the in the food industry is at the end of agricultural supply chains you See consumers becoming enormously engaged around the subject of provenance and integrity of the supply chain And that is happening in all countries around the world People worry about food safety. They worry about where their food comes from they worry about antibiotics and what that's doing to the Biodiversity they're worrying about all these subjects and they are putting pressure on the supply chain as it integrates back all the way through the source I like the movie a lot because what it does it actually generates awareness with a target audience that Creates that consumer pressure So I'm not too fussed about the fact that people have left a room They've left a room they think something has to change and hopefully that changes their buying behavior And if that changes their buying behavior, then Everybody in the supply chain will have to react to it and and that will happen the other thing that I quite liked is the optimistic note I Think it's very important that we all realize that things can get solved and can get done What was just said is there is people planet and profit I think there is also something to be said for businesses are coming to realize yeah, that attending the needs of consumers in Respect of getting assurance around the integrity of the supply chain is a business opportunity It's not just the right thing to do But it is also a business opportunity and if that spreads then we will find solutions relatively quickly well said Keith As someone who's been doing productions about nature I'm sure you've been hearing the wow. Oh Very often when people watch your works How to still remain optimistic at The time when you repeatedly have to find the similar stories and tell them in the way Then many people will still go with wow. Oh, oh my god Keep on with that strength. Now. What makes me really optimistic is an even in this year You are seeing the changes you've talked about. We're finally seeing a shift In how people Consume you're finally seeing governments taking this issue seriously Even when we started making this series. I talk about a number of these issues four years ago And be laughed out of court now everyone is on the same page and we're moving very very quickly My worry is we have got so little time Because if you actually listen to this the hard scientific data the stuff that they don't really want to publish That's when you really realize that actually we're in a race against time if we can win that race We absolutely can do it. We absolutely know what to do That's the thing the scientists have worked it out. We have loads of the Solutions, they're all sorts of good ways forward. It's just that speed of transition But the speed is crucial. I have to say the speed is everything now and You know when I hear our government for example In Britain says we're going to go carbon neutral by 2050. I think that's fantastic that they made a statement But could it at least to being 20 30 your experience probably is very similar to Nadia Who has been doing the goodwill ambassador job for UNEP for a long time and certainly on the advocacy for 20 years If I heard it right or the other day when we're talking to one another What about this long stretch of time at vis-à-vis the urgency that has been beautifully demonstrated in this movie? Oh, did I hear alongside? Yeah, it has been it was a very lonely space to be talking about these things and I mentioned earlier It was kind of like the crazy lady sitting in the corner, but there is a lot more noise now And I think it is Critical and we need to act as Greta says like our house is on fire How many people in the room are parents Yeah, yeah, okay, so maybe half. Okay, and then so what are you gonna do about it? What are you doing about what you've just seen on the screen? It's our responsibility as human beings not only two and beings But especially if you are a parent to do everything that you can to make whatever changes you can you know in the world that your children are going to Are already growing up in interfacing with incredible challenges So it has to happen Immediately in whatever capacity you work You can influence and and make choices that have not one effects and that are beneficial for the community and the planet It's the human nature About only crying over this spilled milk Yeah, I think that is the key issue. I think there is a interesting psychological test Of of children who basically get a piece of candy that they are offered a second piece of candy if they can wait for two hours More than 60% of the kids take the one piece of candy. I see so we we are short-sighted as a human being And that is basically the risk because we're like a boiling frog In close to be boiled water and then we die, right? So I'm with Keith here I think the wake-up call the sense of urgency is slowly building up Remember we agreed on the COP 21 agreement, right? But we're lacking completely behind on action ability So I think this movie is a sense of urgency is an urgent call Not only to governments, but also to producers But all like you said also to consumers and all three need to go hand-in-hand to accelerate that change Otherwise, we are dead in the water. Let's ask our producer of this wonderful film Keith, what do you think? Who or which party is likely to be the leading factor for this round for the change? When you were trying to do this beautiful production with David What we which which group what the meaning whether it's the business the consumer the consumer or the politicians or International organizations or international platforms like the World Trade Organization which one this round at least I I think you can do Nothing if you haven't got business on your side a lot of a lot of conservationists and people Environmentalists have always seen business as the enemy. I don't come from that place At all I Embrace the partnership with this because that's the only way we're going to get it done politicians and governments Follow people and business. So let's let's let's sort that out. You have to build the trust with the audience You have to build Partnership with business and if all that happens Governments will follow. I do honestly though believe that government needs to take its Responsibility because it like in the case of the whales if you look at what some simple Intergovernment global deals can do Very very quickly. We're all saying about time But you can cut these deals in an away day. You really can you can impart a ban on something You can come to an agreement to control something So, you know, it is all free But at the center of it business Marshall saying it's all your business. No, I would I would I agree Consumers business. I think governments generally a reflection of what Voters and populations want and that's why I think the movie is so important because it creates general awareness and therefore creates pressure on politicians and and governments But meanwhile business and consumers are already doing a lot. Let me give you one example Okay, our cocoa and chocolate business sells cocoa and chocolate products under a sustainability certificate And there's a whole system underneath it that tracks The origin of the cocoa from Ivory Coast in Ghana with handheld lasers or handheld devices all the way to the chocolate bar That is sold in a store five years ago about five percent of our business was Sustainably sourced now that is 50 percent. We reckon that in three four years. That's going to be 80 percent So the speed with which the industry is changing and rising to the challenges is enormous That's the cocoa and chocolate story in the palm industry I think it's very good that you showed the example of the the forest and the palm The business community has made enormous progress in terms of making this palm industry more sustainable And the same is going on in the Saudi industry. So it's happening it's happening really fast and Those consumers that don't understand it yet Please watch the Netflix movie because I think it'll it will get everybody saying yep We we got a chime in it's an issue crisis But what about that timetable myself been talking about is that the timetable that you have when it comes to the urgency? I mean this is a gradual process and your company has been taking a lead in that regard But still it is a timing issue Yeah, I mean it is I think the most urgent issue is is about co2 I mean, I think that's the really is the ticking time bomb and I think we're really seeing that and obviously that's a that's a huge huge issue to kind of tackle But I think as the science is coming through with we're seeing that we've already run out of time on it so But I think the other It's food. They we've probably got a little bit more time there But I I think with with with the carbon issue. I I think it's caught us from behind I would like to build on that Mentioning that the co2 is the main issue Remember that most of the waste It has almost no price So people can just emit co2 without being Paying any cost to it. So a first step slowly, but surely also in today's role We are pricing co2 of your mid-co2. You have to pay for it I'm not saying that it's good to emit co2, but at least you put an incentive in In Europe today, the co2 price is already 25 euros per ton. We're building up globally It's a first start because we're spoiling the world because in our economic system is out of balance because you can waste stuff Without having even paid for it and that is creating an imbalance which we need to correct and carbon pricing is one of them We need more but a carbon price of around 40 to 50 euros a ton or dollars a ton Is changing that system Scientists have looked at it and interesting is two years ago in Davos There was a sort of opinion poll about business leaders, and they said a $50 a ton carbon price for us Is changing that system? So we are advocating for a carbon price of at least $50 a ton just to incur that change Of course, that's your buddy, but just to add to that you you then think that if if say you have a national park That is absorbing carbon and that money comes to you You don't have to get tourists to go to that national park anymore to keep it It's suddenly generating a revenue just by doing that service that changes everything Everything we have to stop this idea of wilderness just being there for tourists They have to be paid for providing the service I mean, you know the quicker we do that and then you once you change that dynamic Boom stuff happens. I think there's a common theme here talking about the demand side and the consumer side and the power of the purse The the consumer and it does need to be a multi-prong approach of course business needs to move But business moves when the consumers are choosing with their wallet And so that is sometimes it's underestimated the power of that But we really as consumers need to be educated know who to purchase from and those companies will have to change their Practices because they know that you're going to somewhere else to buy products that are more sustainable or have better sourcing Avenues of sorting so and also with the carbon Emissions and carbon offsets. I think another thing that consumers can do is push for airlines to include in their booking flow The simple a box to tick like some airlines do but not many do for a carbon carbon offsets, which don't cost you much as the consumer and and push for those offsets to be nature-based Carbon offsets like Keith was saying as we can sink that money and those offsets into habitats wetlands and peat areas to increase biodiversity, which is The ultimate carbon store Would you just say if you put a carbon price of $50 a ton in an airline ticket? It will go up tremendously. I have to remind all of our panelists that once again that Carbon price is only one of those solutions that we have been thinking about for a long time There are also many other solutions We can also discuss and present to everyone who everyone already knows So the question really is not about lack of solutions But rather what to do with these solutions whether we could unite ourselves with some of these solutions So what would be the one that could really unite ourselves? We see the debates at the climate change issue even whether it is an issue or not is being debated now So we are not taking two step forward. We are taking one step forward and three steps back I have to say as a Host of the program, I shouldn't say opinions But I do have that opinions and I have to say it here out loud because it's just a matter of fact So that is the issue that we are looking at. Let's not hide from the real issue The real issue is we know what's gonna happen, but people still Close their eyes and say well, it's not my business at least not for two years not for four years Dimitri That is the dark scenario Which is partly true. I think I think it's true partly true You also have a more brighter scenario and I think we've explained a few examples here I think in that sense we have developed products I think cargo just mentioned a few weird DSM have developed a few products Which we're learning from nature. I'll give you a quick example We've learned from nature that if you put enzymes into corn stows, you can make biofuels 70% of corn is just waste and By using enzymatic processes, which are copied from nature. You can reuse the waste like nature is doing anyway It's it's it's a waste. There's no waste in this whole planet. It's being used and reused We call that circular economy. It's a buzzword, but it does work and 9% of what we currently produce is circular means 91% is linear is wasted and 9% needs to go up to 99% right a lot of math going on over there But the question really is Nadia. You've been doing this You know it that When governments make their policy choices, there are priorities What are priorities are exactly what we are having as the theme of our discussion? It's a big question mark. So how are we going to make sure both from the business perspective and from Advocacy's perspective that priority will be about climate Will be about environment and will be about the future as you just said that how many parents are there in the audience The future of the next generation what about setting that priority how to make sure that priority is done? from the Advocacy's perspective You know it really is about the power of the people coming together with one one united voice I feel So you talk about the grassroot movement and the grassroot movements Yeah, and yeah grassroot movements and really people coming together like for example in the previous session I was talking about Greta the young girl from Sweden who is Is really one of the leading climate activists and she's the one who's been The one pushing for the climate strikes among the young generation she talked about how Does she brought up flight shaming so it's no longer plastic bags and straws its its flights and in Sweden now They've experienced a 10% drop in in airline Tickets in six months and that is spreading across Europe and then of course the airlines are afraid now and that's starting That it's going to spread across the world So it is through the consumer and the activists the business has to shift and also we can do the same with Policy as well if there's enough people who come together with a united voice find those people come together with a united voice I have a very clear and cohesive message and those numbers For example a movement called earth hour Many people know earth hour as the campaign that you switch off the lights for an hour and that's like okay Big deal so what everyone can come together and turn off the lights, but actually earth hour did create a movement where? It allowed people to just simply vote and they would get a million votes or two million votes And that would actually sway governments to have to change policy So if we can have more of these kinds of initiatives that are brought together by people who are Savvy and have a multi-disciplinary background In policy legal marketing being able to tell stories Then you have you able to create power and maybe if they can have single focuses for each of their outcomes They'd be more successful the power of stories also this time World Economic Forum invited Indonesian girl talking about buy-by-plastic backs Certainly that's also a grassroots movement that talking about throw away the plastics that Facing but from an industry perspective once again How to make sure this will be the priority on also the government's policy list well, I Would want to call out one thing that I think is highly relevant Many American companies of course have subscribed to the Paris Agreement goals Cargill is one of those companies And what you learn if you subscribe to the Paris Agreement goals, and that's no longer a policy issue because you know That's entirely voluntary what you learn is You actually take the company on a learning curve Tell us more about that. Well, what you do is you say, okay, we're gonna have to reduce carbon emissions by 10% The first thing that you then have to do is you have to start doing all the math in terms of understanding What your carbon emissions are doing that? Yes, and the Europeans are in a different Environment in Europe 50% of public companies Have now pay-related targets that are linked to environmental goals That's not the case in the United States in the United States You see lots of American companies Voluntarily adopt the Paris Agreement goals. We are one of those companies We initially did the math and said, okay, if we want to reach those goals This is about the amount of money that we have to invest for which we don't have an immediate business case Right, let's take that to our shareholders and then what happens then you get on the learning curve And half a year later you say well, but actually there is a smarter way of doing this And a year later you say no, there's an even smarter way of doing this So organizations get on to that learning curve of increased sophistication And you have to be willing to make some commitments before you have all the solutions and one more thing that I would say So you have to ask yourself why is it that so many American companies are making these commitments? Well, they do that because they understand that if they don't take these issues serious, they're gonna lose out in the talent market We are as an organization fortunate that we have a lot of initiatives in this space And it is one of the prime reasons why people join us so Let's be realistic in terms of business motives This is a survival issue. This is about wanting to do the right thing But it is also good business and it is the way of staying in business Which are saying myself very interesting because you're suggesting let's set the aspiration First and then we see what we can do what we can learn along the process The mutual is that the best way of course you're coming from the United States and maybe for the Europeans. Is it a big another story? I think I think we share the same approach also in Europe What I would like to add to it is that it also starts with taking responsibility and being extremely transparent not only on The financial profit and loss because we have all types of rules with US gap I have a rest but there's hardly any rule on how to present What you do for the planet or what is at the cost of the planet you need to report that and we do that via missions But maybe there's also value to it Keith was saying the ocean has a certain value So if you take from the ocean you need to report as such so we we try to convince the community Governments shareholders Employees consumers to go what we call for a holistic PNL which captures people planet and profit because then it shows What you do as a company who takes responsibility for being part of society at large? Is the CSR part of the work or setting a specific goal like China always do every five years You got a plan over there that would work Aspiration in what way keys to you as a producer of this film I Mean I was just thinking about this whole debate slightly did differently But go ahead and tell us about you the way you look at it though Well in terms of this urgency and and getting it across I think my industry the Communication industry has done an especially bad job. I have to say and I'm one of them And I'm one of them as one of those people I've been in the wildlife business for a long time and we still have crisis, so I can't have done a great job Trying to make amends now, but if you actually look at the way globally the media has Reported this it's been so down the food chain as an issue and When you actually accurately look at the science and how you're going to report on that science it just hasn't been given the prominence it needs and If you don't have your big media companies Push out the true story of the scale then how are you going to affect consumers? How are you going to affect business one? Have you so that's the other urgent thing? I think needs to happen is that we we've got a communication crisis and we need to Resolve that and we can do that very fast because that's just behavior How can we do it? We know we need to bring them to together and How to bring them together that is the well That's what you have for them like this do and and there are also other for it can happen But you need to somehow get the the science information The accurate science information in front of media companies so that they realize the importance of this and Scientists also have to play their role because so often they can't agree on What the issue is and they have to be really really clear now. We're in an emergency It must be resolved because the media will only take simple Things and part of the dollars we have to boil down the issue simple things It's like that's the story get it out there. Then the rest of it will follow. So I just think this is why Media business Population government needs to all be joined to solve this. It's not just the manufacturing industry and other industry But also the media industry itself on that point Natty I want to come to you because it seems that you're trying to advocate that the media should do a better job Which many of us would agree but the question really is About what angle because over the years you see particularly with the social media now people It tends to spread more emotion rather than information so I See this film. I also feel a lot of emotions So what would be the way that work? Would we spread emotions? Which is a beautiful film or would we spread? Information for people to analyze themselves based on the emotions that already have so this is really also a way of Choices as well Nadia again. I think it is I have two things one is about the question that you're asking me And also about CSR. Yes, so about Whether it's emotion or information Those two those those two things are great, but action is even more important, right? So we need to create vehicles where we deliver the information we Create the emotion and that that then engages somebody to want to take action like what kind of vehicles well we can use social media we can use Donation platforms we can tie everything together. We can tell a story for example our planet So if we aired our planet on Netflix then we work with Netflix who then partners with a giving platform that giving platform directly links to some Organizations who are working on causes that have been featured in the series So we take a multi-prong approach to be able to help resolve and give people People want to be able to do good give them the steps and to be able to contribute Meaningfully now CSR also as far as I'm concerned CSR is a bad word There's actually no there should be no such thing as CSR business just has to adapt or it will fail to exist and CSR Just is not it's ticking boxes and most of the time CSR is ticking boxes where the NGOs the nonprofits actually don't need those things right and it's not sustainable for the nonprofits or the the the The the the yeah the nonprofits to be able to operate meaningfully and plan Two three four year programs, so I just have an idea here that I'm going to throw out How about these big corporations instead of ticking boxes by doing CSR in-house? a NGO So the NGO who sets up their business sets up their Organization to benefit a particular cause whether it's community whether it's habitat whether it's species They can focus on their outcomes as opposed to having to do their HR legal Biz dev and all of those things where they don't have skill sets So the the organizations in house them the organizations can the NGOs benefit from the skills Within the organizations and the benefactors actually get what they need so that's just my two cents on CSR We've been having this huge apparatus of both From the companies and industries From international organization regional organization as well as civil society about Environmental issues protection issues about climate change issues But still Keith has to produce this film because we seem that we're still so much lagging behind Well, you could argue without that we probably wouldn't even lag behind even more But the issue it seems it's more about getting things done I was earlier talking to this Indonesian girl talking about bye-bye blasted bags and the teenagers are telling us I just don't know why your adults keep on sitting there and talk Why don't you just go out there go to the street and tell people don't use plastic bags use this alternative I got a cloth bag for you and that would work And I think that's a very cute but certainly a very sharp reminder of what we are doing right here Not the five of us, but rather what we together the adults have been doing right here So are we really having the issue in our mind or this just become one of those topics We want to keep on circling in the talk shops or elsewhere Not really get things done. I hope this could be the platform. We got things done I want to go to you about that. It's not the easy way So I'm not a behavioral scientist, but I do think that behavioral science will tell you that if you want to convince people Pouring an enormous amount of additional data into them is not going to change their mind That's why I think what Keith has done is so important Because I think the entry route into convincing people is actually emotion and The the downside that has to be carefully managed is the emotion creates room for Scientifically not accurate Narrative to go out there. So there is I don't think you're gonna be able to convince What is it that we currently have seven half billion people with well? Here's the scientific reports. Please read that and then come and help us I actually do think you have to enter into the emotional side of people The issue is then you have to be very Careful that you don't have too many false narratives popping up and false narratives do from time to time pop up And that's where ultimately science comes in and that's where the business community has a responsibility In these kind of forums right to keep talking about well This is where the scientific consensus is and this is what we all need to do I would much rather have a world full of Emotion and good intent to do the right thing and 20% false narratives Then a hundred percent accurate narratives that is adopted by absolutely nobody so I think that Keith has done an enormously valuable thing absolutely That is one tool we have in our hand Which is to tell the real story and tell it vividly so that people really feel it And on a public on a constant basis because people forget to when it comes to priorities But what about the other tools that we still have right now? Dimitri in our hands. What else do we have? Policy platforms what they work for example cup 25 are likely to be held in China next year or Later, there's the climate change summit at the UN Meanwhile, you have cup 25 UNFCCC every year which always creates huge debate and it's extended at that line So, you know everything that I'm talking about will these be tools? Absolutely and will there be one tool Will change the complete future no Because if that will be the case and that will be a simplistic modeling of how we're gonna solve these issues I think I think that the media and communication industry didn't do such a bad job I don't need to defend that job But I think I think it's out there the fact that we have a cop 21 agreement was partly based on emotions on climate Change and all these pictures. So it's a wake-up call where I shared the speed the clock speed where we need to change And that will not be one thing The unfortunate of the situation is that we need maybe Hundred things going to happen small initiative on on the millennials who don't take it right to grumbag who basically steps up governments who take the lead Industrial leaders who take the lead like Cargill in DSM where we where we basically agree on renewable energy and science-based targets That we get these these movies we get plenty of earth one two three four five I'm already changing my my wording because in in DSM we use the word if we don't adapt ourselves We will come the dinosaur of the future, right? I will now change that into walrus Because the walrus movie is far more Emotional impactful than the dinosaur right so it needs to be end-end-end. I can tell you I'm a father of four children They push me hard on what I do. They say oh you work for this Dutch state-mine company So hold that was a long time ago. No, what are you doing about the future? It needs to be a hundred small things and a certain moment in time when all these hundred things come together In the sort of a flow and synchronicity Hopefully we'll get acceleration on that point and we basically go just in time to turn the tide But just pick up on what you're saying about the the COP meetings We have to make sure that whatever is being asked at those meetings to agree is clear Yes, and we cannot afford them to fail and if everyone's got to get that in their head and the media has to know what must be agreed and That message needs to be out there so that the politicians have to agree to it Because with biodiversity the story has been time and time again Agreement has slipped through the net and people have found ways out of actually doing it about it climb But I think agree has been a great success because a clear target was spotted and clear action and clear media campaign Right, but there's all sorts of things so I do it all boils down to clarity What needs to happen and do not let any of these moments fail? Because we haven't got time you already see the energy of this producer when he's having his fist goes like this We only have two minutes left We can't go on for one hour with the advice anymore So if I could ask you ladies and gentlemen sitting on the stage if there's one Single picture in this movie That you watched just now That you think would be the best way for you to communicate with the others about the urgency and About your idea as to how to change it. What would it be keys? I'll save you for the last no So the military you want to go first? I already have explained the walrus So I'll take the opportunity to add another one and that's the whale because it's a sign of hope sign of optimist that if we if we shared The responsibility and that we jointly take action There is hope to recover what the planet Earth was all about Nadia Well, I'm I'm biased of course. I'm going to say the orangutan and the bird and you know actually when I watched that I watched that scene with the bird with my family at home and I was just like You know These are the things that we need we need to remind us of it Just of the incredible beauty that this planet has and what we stand to lose. So it really is, you know It's it's so critical that we immerse ourselves in nature So that we know we could what we have to protect. All right. Do you still being left with a lot of other choices? I Found the walrus hard to watch So Yeah You don't have to say no, so I found that very hard to watch you sit there and you think okay And I found the whales at the end important because I do think that we cannot Get things done Just by spreading negative emotion onto people. We also have to give people a reason to believe and Things can get solved and that problem can also get solved If you are here sitting the place where I am you will see this gentleman very firm about his determination That's but not least Keith No, I just keep that bird dancing Fusion just one phrase only our planet ladies and gentlemen. Thank you so much Thank you very much