 Hello and welcome everyone to our brief the growing climate workforce. How policies today could shape the jobs of tomorrow You know, it's been a while since we've done one of these and my mouse is a little bit more sensitive than I remembered it Being I'm Dan Berset the executive director of the Environmental and Energy Study Institute and welcome again to our briefing today The growing climate workforce how policies today could shape the jobs of tomorrow And it's been a while because most of us at ESI took a little bit of a break We took advantage of the relatively quiet and relatively as the operative word here Quiet time in August to take a break. It's really important to take a break now and then But then of course when you do the world keeps spinning and things keep happening and this year's been no different And of course we do a lot more than just briefings at ESI And so while we took a little bit of time away from briefings None of that other stuff really slowed down too much Speaking of what we do. Let me say a few quick words about ESI to those new to our briefings ESI was founded in 1984 on a bipartisan basis by members of Congress to provide Science-based information about environmental energy and climate change topics to policymakers More recently, we've also developed a program to provide technical assistance to rural utilities interested in on-bill financing programs for their customers ESI works hard to provide informative objective nonpartisan coverage of climate change topics and written materials and and so on social media All of our educational resources briefings like this fact sheets issue briefs articles Newsletters and podcasts are always available for free online And we're always posting new information just on friday, for example in the lead up to today We published a new fact sheet about climate jobs There are 4.1 million climate jobs in the united states In addition to coverage of the workforces that support energy efficiency renewable energy transmission storage and clean transportation We also added a new section about climate adaptation and resilience jobs Adaptation and resilience jobs are extremely important to track And as climate impacts increase in frequency and severity We predict policymakers will be more and more interested in this segment of the us climate workforce I'd like to say many thanks to our friends at the american society for adaptation professionals who helped us source this new data And I hope you'll take a moment to download our new fact sheet. I'm all about the current state of climate jobs If you miss that fact sheet, uh, well, it was just posted on friday So no worries about that and to keep up with everything we do at ESI You really absolutely must subscribe to our bi-weekly newsletter climate change solutions You can do that and access all of our resources by visiting us online www.esi.org And it also helps if you follow us on twitter at esi online and of course, we're also active on facebook instagram and linkedin Our briefing today is purposefully timed to coincide with the next phase of the debate around infrastructure and climate policy on capitol hill There is a lot in play much more than we can possibly cover during the next 90 minutes But there's a very good chance that if you want to learn more about climate issues related to provisions Up for consideration in congress. You will find a timely and relevant resource at esi.org of one sort or another A special note is the three part briefing series We organized back in june that explored how climate investments in our energy system infrastructure would deliver multiple benefits We also hosted a fourth briefing in june to learn more about how a national climate bank Could serve as a catalyst for clean energy job creation Again, you can watch archived webcasts of these briefings review presentation materials And read summary notes on our website www.esi.org There are many many proposals being discussed at this very moment that would deliver emissions reductions and help our communities be more resilient to climate impacts Our focus today is on a subset of these policies that would be very impactful in terms of growing and strengthening the climate workforce Which like I said already employs 4.1 million people So in just a moment we'll be joined by five panelists who will help describe how a civilian climate core The rural energy savings program clean energy tax incentives and the clean electricity performance program We create jobs and further adjust an equitable transition to a decarbonized clean energy economy The outcomes of the current infrastructure and climate policy debates in congress are important to understand because of how Multiple benefits would affect communities across the country But what happens in the coming days and weeks will also matter a lot at a global level We're a little bit more than one month out From the start of the 26th conference of the parties to the united nations framework convention on climate change known as cop 26 Every meeting of the cop is important But after this one was postponed last year The urgency feels greater than ever to have a productive and constructive meeting of leaders and international climate policy makers And to help congress keep up with the negotiations and understand the implications of cop 26 for the united states We're organizing a special briefing series that starts next friday So i hope you'll join us next friday october 8th at 11 30 a.m. Eastern for creating policies coalitions and actions for global sustainable development You'll be treated to a conversation with sir robert watson lead author of the un environment program for port making peace with nature Informer un framework convention on climate change executive secretary christiana fiederes You can RSVP for this and the rest of the briefing series by visiting us online www.esi.org And now for the panel today As usual, we will leave a little time at the end actually about a half an hour at the end of our session for discussion If you have a comment or a question, please let us know You can send us your thoughts by email and this is a new email address I've been warned not to mess this up like I did my intro You can send us an email and the email address is ask at esi.org. That's ask at esi.org Can also follow us on twitter at esi online and send in your questions that way We'll do our best to incorporate your input into the conversation And now it's my privilege to introduce our first two speakers back to back Hannah traverse serves as the communications manager for the core network and has served in communications and programming roles at the core network In the national association of service and conservation course for the past nine years Hannah is also the lead author of the book joined the crew inspirational stories of young adults in america's service and conservation course And hannah will be joined by danielle owens Danielle serves as director of government relations at the core network where she works to develop policy initiatives with a focus on conservation national service and workforce development And she has additional experience working on the hill and in the federal government Hannah danielle. Welcome to our briefing today. I'm really looking forward to your presentation Thank you very much. We're excited to be here. Um, as mentioned, we're from the core network the national association of service and conservation course We're going to provide a little bit of an overview of what the current landscape is around service and conservation course We'll specifically look at some of the exciting work that cores are doing around workforce development and climate readiness And then we'll also talk about the various proposals for a civilian climate core and what a new ccc could look like So Let's see first. What is a core? So cores are a service and workforce development programs They engage youth and young adults generally ages 16 to 30 and veterans up to age 35 in a term of service And that term of service could last from a few months up to a year And usually during that time core members as we call them, uh, those young people Are doing conservation focused projects. So that could be a lot of different things It could be serving on national parks and forests maintaining trails. It could be serving in in cities doing things like helping maintain urban tree canopy and increasing access to healthy food through growing farms and gardens Um, most cores are nonprofits. Some are operated by Units of state and local government. For example, a few states like california and main and washington operate core programs through their uh, like department of natural resources Cores Usually do through public private partnerships. They work with various agencies and nonprofits to Come up with those projects for core members to work on. So those are through different types of partnerships Cooperative agreements that they do things like as mentioned maintaining trails and campgrounds or You know doing things to help make cities more sustainable and green um so Some people might have as a reference point for the core model the civilian conservation core Which was a program created by president rose vault during the great depression It was a work relief program that put about three million young men to work Over a course of about eight years, I think And they accomplished a lot. They built a lot of park infrastructure that was still used today. They planted about three billion trees But one important thing to know is that the ccc the original civilian conservation core was not equitable It did practice segregation And today's cores are are obviously quite different So the core network who we are we're based in dc. We're the national association of service and conservation cores right now I believe we represent 139 different organizations. They are all across the us Every year they engage about 20 to 25,000 young adults and post 9 11 veterans in service and again that age range for the participants is about 16 to 30 And uh, what we do we help support cores through technical assistance doing, you know advocacy on their path here in dc and Yeah, again, they uh all our member organizations They are across all 50 states dc portorico the young people that they engage represent a wide range of backgrounds and As mentioned earlier, um our cores are doing public private partnerships with a range of different partners To do all sorts of projects across the country that are locally relevant So here are just some snapshot outcome numbers of some of those projects So, you know restoring habitat addressing invasive species planting trees restoring waterway And also there's a number up there over 20,000 industry recognized certifications were earned by core members So throughout their service they uh those young adults They have the opportunity to participate in job training. They can network with professionals with the partner organizations they're serving with they They have the the chance to gain hands-on skills through performing that service And again, here's a list of some of the certifications that cores help young people earn And they sort of fall into a few different categories. Uh, there are skills that core members gain in forestry and resource management tree care There are skills that core members can earn in energy efficiency and home weatherization, which is something that I'll talk about in a moment um and Another big area that I'll talk about in a moment is uh gaining skills in wildland fire Um and another thing the first bullet point there the public lands core hiring authority If a young person serves a minimum of 640 hours on public lands Including 120 I believe on federal lands. They have the opportunity to earn a non-competitive hiring authority So it gives them a pathway into a career with a federal agency So with a civilian climate core one area that we hope um and it makes sense to hopefully see some growth in terms of projects and training um cores are doing some disaster response and mitigation work right now and that includes wildland fire um, so Cores are doing things like maintaining storm rudder infrastructure and improving that um stabilizing hillsides planting native species installing living shorelines And then with wildland fire. There are a few stats there. Um over the past two years 2019 2020 uh over 860 core members earned red cards, which is a way that allows those young people to serve on wildland fires on public lands Uh more than 3,300 earned chainsaw certifications And they addressed over 32,000 acres of fire fuels and Few cores actually respond directly to fires. Um, mostly the california conservation core And so over 340 fires over that time period Um, there are some programs cores that are focusing on training military veterans For a transition into a civilian career in wildland fire And then there are some cores that are also working specifically to engage more women in wildland fire as it is A field that is mostly dominated by men Um, and just listed a couple programs there at the bottom that are doing a lot of work in this area Not surprising. They are programs out west. So california conservation core and then conservation legacy, which has several programs across the west And that's the ccc in the top photo and a picture of conservation legacy doing some chainsaw training in the bottom photo And another area that we hope to see again more workforce development. Um, there is a new ccc coming up Um, there are several cores in our membership that do work in energy efficiency and home weatherization Um, so in that top photo is picture of civic works. They're based in baltimore And they have a center for sustainable careers that trains young adults in different industry recognized certifications around weatherization Uh, same for the the program in the lower picture there sustainability institute, but these core members They gain skills and have the opportunity to go into homeowners Into low income homes in the neighborhood and they conduct energy efficiency audits and then actually go in and perform different weatherization Things to help make those homes more water and energy efficient um, so Civic works the picture in the top photo. They have a solar training program. It's three months long it is the first of its kind in maryland and um Again, those those young people leave the program with the skills to hopefully go into a job in solar and Since 2009, I think that program has had a 91 uh success rate in placing graduates in a job And then the picture in the lower half of the screen there is sustainability institute they're based in charleston and a similar model where the young adults have the opportunity to gain skills in home weatherization and uh, they get certifications in HVAC OSHA 10 building performance institute home energy auditor and have the chance to earn Earn a stipend americor award at the end of their service And I am going to pass it over to danielle to talk a little bit about what things look like for a civilian climate core Yeah, um, so I'll give a brief overview of uh, where we are congressionally with the civilian climate core. It's been an exciting year um, so far in this first session of the 117th congress we've had I think it might be exactly a dozen bills introduced at this point. Uh, we had a few more introduced a couple weeks ago um, we started off the year on uh, january 27th with the uh president's executive order on tackling the climate crisis at home and abroad um, pan has got the section there at section 215 of that executive order that called for the creation of a civilian climate core initiative and then we led into like I said about a dozen uh bills, uh that got at a civilian climate core in various different ways um And now we are in the mix of the budget reconciliation process um, so It's exciting times for all of us. Um, there have been surveys that indicate that half of all voters under the age of 45 would consider joining a ccc if I'll say when when it is created Then recently this july, uh, there was a bicameral letter to speaker polo c and leader schumer from about 80 members and senators asking for the creation of a ccc and just to I believe it was two weeks ago. There was a letter led by uh, congresswoman acacia cortez and congressman nagus That had nearly 70 house members Again asking for a robustly funded ccc And there were about 120 climate environment and national service organizations who also signed off on support. So we are seeing various Organizations and members of congress and the senate in support of this. So it's it's a good good moment right now And next i'll kind of go over Uh, you know the core networks vision for a ccc. Um, you know, we'd like it to be robustly funded We are looking we think 30 billion over the tenure reconciliation process. Uh, so 30 billion We think the ccc should start from strength and not from scratch. So as hannah said we have 139 Service and conservation cores that are out there already doing this So, you know, we think we should start with them. Let them be the backbone of the ccc and Then we need this funding for capacity building Start from strength not from scratch and then we can expand our capacity The way we see it structured it would be funding for project partners. So that would be The department of housing and urban development the department of interior the forest service through the department of agriculture Department of transportation We also think the department of labor should receive funding for workforce development And then also americor that will get to the national service aspects We also think the ccc should focus on equity We think there should be a priority for projects Um and enrollment from environmental justice communities And we need those career pathways of $15 minimum wage And also facilitate alignment and partnerships with strategic partners And I think that's our are a lot of time and there's our contact information and thanks for having us dan Absolutely. Thank you daniel and thank you hannah for an excellent presentation Um, there was a lot of good stuff in your slides And so I just wanted to share a quick reminder But if anyone in our audience would like to go back and revisit the presentation from hannah and daniel You can do that by visiting us online at www.esi.org everything Uh presentation wise will be there and if you give us a little bit of time Also some written summary notes as well. Um as well as the archived webcast. So thank you very much um our I guess third speaker our second topic Is going to be delivered by kate latour kate is the director of government relations at the national cooperative business association klusa international In this role kate leaves the advocacy efforts of ncba klusa To elevate the profile of the cooperative business model across all sectors of the economy and urge policymakers to center Coops as a policy solution to evolving social and economic challenges Including both domestic and international development kate. It is always so nice to see you I'm really looking forward to your presentation today about the rural energy savings program Thank you so much dan and thank you for having me is again always a pleasure to be with you um I will start with just a little bit of background on who we are The national cooperative business association. We are the apex association for all types of co-ops So across the sector. So I listed a few here That folks may be familiar with We'll be giving special emphasis today to our electric co-op sector As they are a big implementer of the rural energy savings program But just wanted to get folks thinking about particularly in the job space the many ways in which Cooperatives across the sector really invest in local development and then can really build these more resilient economies um I think what's really important in this conversation too is that the local ownership of co-ops, you know One member one vote also naturally makes them more invested in the long-term well-being of both its members and communities Which they serve? Fundamentally co-ops are about the people not the profits And that certainly manifests in a real resistance to short-termism And and look towards the long-term goals Next slide, please So again just to kind of provide the lay of the land one in three Americans is a member of at least one co-op So many folks if they're mutual insurance or they're a member of a credit union They're served by an electric co-op Are probably members of multiple Cooperatives so across the united states it accounts for 65 000 businesses And most often they are formed to meet a community need or fix a market failure and the electric co-ops they think are really Perfect case for that reasoning And have been a really critical tool for wealth building in rural america With the rural electrification administration and the foundation of electric co-ops Cooperatives which you know really were born out of the the skills and expertise of farmers in america Brought electricity to households in really remarkable time in less than a generation rural 10 percent of rural households had electricity and you know within just a couple decades Over 90 percent of households in rural america had access to reliable and affordable electricity What I think is particularly Noteworthy is that this was of course after Investor owned utility companies really declined to pursue These investments in rural america despite incentives from the federal government And so rural americans really said you know we could take it on ourselves and and built these lasting models Today there are more than 900 co-ops that handle generation and transmission as well as the distribution of electricity to rural households and businesses They account for 42 of all of the electric lines in the united states And actually serve over nearly 60 of the us land mass Um, and I think the Fundamental access to service that helped ensure that rural homes and small businesses could access some of the same Economic opportunity as other communities across the country as really continuing to play out today as many electric co-ops are also implementing broadband Where you know making sure that educational and economic opportunity isn't really defined by where you live And if it's like most of the other conversations, uh, I've had recently i'm sure broadband will come up more extensively in a bit so next slide please Just to again kind of give a little bit of perspective of the land mass on the left that electric co-ops serve it also Electric co-ops serve over 90 percent of persistent poverty counties in the united states So I think um, you know as we're talking about uh investments in in clean energy Making sure that those opportunities are afforded to all americans and really remove the barriers to participation Uh, we know that they are rural communities in general Our energy burdened they face higher bills than other communities um And the average, uh, you know, like I said those average utility bills far outpace Non-rural communities across the 200 or 2500 Counties that electric co-ops serve um I think the exact number is between 92 and 93 percent of persistent poverty counties. So they're really um compounding factors at play then the the lower quality housing stock then leads to higher energy usage And like I said those higher energy bills They are also very unlikely Subsequently to have the financial resources to make any upfront expenditures for home improvements that are geared toward energy efficiency So with that I'll cue the next slide and uh incomes the rural energy savings program This started out as a pilot program in 2010. I had bipartisan support in congress Um and was made permanent and then most recently reauthorized in the 2018 farm bill It has gone through some changes throughout but really at its core has maintained A 20-year loan for zero percent interest Electric co-ops like I said are one of the implementers though over the years that has expanded to some other entities as well To make it more participatory And then the you know in the case of the electric co-ops they act as a sort of intermediary Ultimately to implement Take the loan from usda and implement those energy efficiency improvements onto individual household and small businesses And and dan touched on it earlier, but really they've been doing such wonderful work at EESI on on-bill financing And helping electric co-ops set up those programs so that For either zero or very low upfront costs to consumers Those households then pay back the loan the cost of what it took to implement energy efficiency Measures onto their home is repaid through their monthly utility bills The repayment to the co-op has you know safeguards in place So that it is only used for covering the costs of the program and then towards some limited costs towards loan loss reserves Rural energy savings program loans can be used for an enormously wide variety of activities around Lighting eating and air conditioning windows water heaters the list goes on And and really both improving replacing some of these really critical aspects of homes the improvements Are are almost realized immediately by the consumer really So even though they're repaying the energy efficiency loan on their bill their monthly costs are often reduced by so much That's still Their their monthly bills are much much lower The usda estimates about 25 of savings monthly to the consumer But in reality that translates to hundreds of dollars In some cases for for homes that really need it So that is you know more dollars in the pockets of everyday people And hopefully more to kind of spend and recirculate through your local community Um the uptake of this program by co-ops and other implementers Um has been big and it's also growing which I think is really exciting. Um in the last four years has obligated over 180 million In loans to electric co-ops and the most funded states through this program are arkansas, texas and colorado um The improvement on the individual home costs Anywhere between around 1500 dollars to seven thousand dollars And so again thinking about those communities that electric co-ops are serving That's a cost that would really otherwise be out of reach for most people if um if the electric co-op didn't act as that intermediary And then just to be really specific about the jobs component since that's why we're here today Um without removing that barrier to participation these services wouldn't be needed in many cases since rest covers those upfront costs for households electric co-ops are able to Either build in-house expertise and have that good paying quality job within the co-op Or are able to contract with a company which most often is a is a local small business in their community um And then taking one step back of how we get there is the jobs are on manufacturing and construction to meet increased demand For these products that people are using um a quick kind of appropriations history the Which is is really exciting the in the president's budget this year as well as in The appropriations bill the committee's recommended increases to the program because of the success of the program and the Never having missed a payment by a borrower in this program. OMB actually downgraded the risk Which improved the Subsidy rate and so with you know really somewhat small appropriations Have leveraged a really high dollar amount to be able to lend So with About 22 million in budget authority could actually lend up to 400 million dollars Out to these co-ops to make these improvements Next slide, please So there's also really exciting movement within the Build Back Better Act that the house committee had the house agriculture committee included That goes even further to advance kind of the equitable participation and benefits of the program Ultimately it included 200 million dollars that would supplement the usual appropriations And expanding on the loans of this program the Build Back Better Act actually included a grants component That would For persistent poverty counties would be up to 10 percent and in other counties would be up to 5 percent of the loan amount and Importantly for the electric co-ops one of the eligible uses is for administration of the loan and grant Although they serve these vast distances many electric co-ops have a very few number of employees So, you know and and most of those are our line workers and folks in the field very few in house in the office So really important to have that support there and then also for the repairs and contracts to really bring the Very low quality homes up to you know kind of par so that they become eligible for the energy efficiency improvements Um And again, you know thinking about this is this is a high a relatively high number of homes. Um that Who are now able to participate in the program? Where otherwise it may be out of reach for for various reasons? And then as I wrap up just next slide, please Just one plug for kind of the cooperative business model Co-ops one of their unique features as they work on seven cooperative principles and principle six here is cooperation among cooperatives and This is just a very top layer because I think there's there's a great deal more here but um three sectors of cooperative community where I think there's particularly ripe opportunity for coordination and collaboration And really have a multiplier of good benefits Working together across sectors where we're kind of doubling down on local ownership The first is worker cooperatives Most fundamentally for a jobs perspective. There is um, there's a rise in the number of worker clubs across the country right now Which is really exciting And these are businesses of course that are owned and governed by the employees Many of them in the energy space right now happen to be solar But there are certainly nothing preventing other types of businesses becoming worker owned And I will say to kind of supplement this There is another provision in the small business section of the Build Back Better Act that would provide a co-op lending pilot program out of the small business administration, which could really Do a number towards unlocking access to capital The second is housing cooperatives At last measure about 15 percent of housing stock in electric co-op service territory is manufactured housing And that's compared to about six and a half percent as the national average Um Manufactured housing is the only form of non-subsidized affordable housing But in many cases the land underneath is not owned by the people who live there So there is a rise in the number of resident owned communities for the folks in the manufactured housing community Come together and purchase the land Which not only takes away the predatory aspect of land fees, but also Gives them as more wealth creation opportunity Um And generally kind of quality of life. It improves the upkeep of the communities Um, and then lastly is the food and grocery cooperatives There is a pretty thin margin for profits in grocery Um, and it's particularly challenging accessing rural fresh food in rural communities In part because many of the mom and pop kind of grocery stores corner stores Um, there is no immediate buyer and so many are saying We're ready to retire. We're going to close their doors. Um, and so having consumer owned food co-ops Is a really great way to maintain the access They have a higher job creation rates than traditional grocery stores higher reinvestment in the communities And higher percentages of local sourcing of food than again kind of the traditional grocery stores And I think these rural energy partnerships are a good opportunity to You know make sure that the refrigeration and the lighting and the HVAC at the Food co-op is you know as efficient and affordable as possible To make sure that again those assets are really building in the community ultimately, I think these these sectors and others Really add up collectively and affords people a higher quality of life in rural communities Really ensuring that there is from the basic access to a safe home And access to fresh healthy foods making sure that there is you know a workforce to match the companies in their community And keeping costs of you know having more people in the service area Can help spread across spread costs across the home to cross the service area And again ultimately um creating this generating this higher quality of life For more people and making it more accessible to more people. Um, so I think I will stop there and turn it back to dan Awesome, Kate. Thank you so much for your great presentation. Um, Kate brought up lots of great points So did Hannah and so did Danielle and so are our next two speakers Folks in our audience have the opportunity to ask them questions and you can do that in two ways One is you can follow us on twitter at EESI online and submit your question that way And you can also send us an email and the email address is ask ask at esi.org So feel free to ask questions and we'll do our best to incorporate them into our Moderated discussion that will start in just a moment Our next panelist is udai vera derajan. He is a principal at rmi, which is formerly Rocky mountain institute He focuses on how to use cutting edge data and financial policy and regulatory analysis To help drive a just transition to clean energy. Welcome to the briefing today. I'm really looking forward to your presentation Well, thank you so much again, Dan and Thanks again for the opportunity to chat about federal tax incentives in particular and I'm going to really focus a little bit at some of the maybe 30 000 foot level issues associated with The federal tax incentives in particular For clean energy that are in place today and talk a little bit about What it is about those incentives has they're currently constructed that do and do not work in terms of addressing The urgency of the need for climate action and in particular Doing so in a way that ensures that the costs of that climate action Are not on those least able to bear that energy consumers and communities Are not the ones bearing that risk And i'll then turn to talk a little bit very briefly about the specific proposals that are being considered as part of the bill better act and To address them both in the house and in previous senate legislation as well So first, I just want to get at the height pick the very big picture, which is at the end of the day rapid climate action Is going to require a pretty significant transition a very large energy intensive sectors of our economy In a very rapid fashion Particularly to 2030 for a happy if we actually are built are going to make a difference on climate We've got to move fast And in particular that means moving fast Well before assets communities And many workers would have otherwise been ready to move to a different industry And this In in particular is a challenge for customers and communities investors very often are protected themselves But customers and communities are often not very well protected reason for this is really imperfect competition throughout our economies Where investors have basically given themselves contracts or have regulatory protections that keep them from bearing the costs of moving rapidly while consumers Uh and communities often have no such protections And so there is a real risk here that consumers and communities might bear the cost of climate action So this is why fundamentally we need to have climate action Uh and climate policy Focus on equity and that means figuring out ways to protect energy customers and communities So why is this uh so important? Well, the problem is that if you don't have policy intervention climate action has the risk of being basically doubly regressive It is lower income states right now across the country that have far more communities that face Employment or economic risk from climate action And it's low income households that disproportionately might bear the burden From energy usage and i've got a chart here that kind of shows the energy burden By income percentile what you see is that uh, not surprisingly Energy burden is very very substantial for those in the lowest income percentiles as a fraction of their uh income uh writ large And there is real risk that climate action could fall on these communities Especially ones with undiversified fossil dependent economies and public policy really needs to work hard To protect these customers and workers Now the other uh Line on the left that you see in this slide shows the federal tax burden And what's fascinating is for most people energy matters more Than tax burden at least when we exclude payroll taxes which are regressive in the same way that energy burden is And for most people This is a significant issue and it motivates why and federal Financing in particular can play such an important role here effectively federal financing As a source of funding to enable transition Can help mitigate energy burden. We shouldn't be leaving these Energy burdens to customers. Otherwise, we end up really risking having a regressive outcome And federal financing can really help as well position to make sure that if we act on climate It's not those who are most vulnerable who end up paying for Uh, indeed. This is particularly true for communities and we uh, we see the reality Of this in the way that over the last decade and a half Utilities have actually shifted Uh in response to already changing economic circumstances in clean energy relative to dirty energy And what you've seen here what you see in this graph to the left is How utilities have invested in coal plants in particular and steam and fossil plants in general But in particular coal plants And what you see is the big red bars or how much they've invested in coal plants over the last decade and a half And what you see in the dark, uh, and gray lines is employment Numbers in those areas and what you see is Investors have invested more and more money and are making more and more earnings On coal and steam plants while there are fewer and fewer people employed At these plants and this is a risk that we face fundamentally that falls on communities in particular and our workforce That in the absence of action, there is a significant negative risk for employment in these communities Uh with continued investment in the existing coal assets still being possible and then not only that those costs Associated with the increasing investment in coal plants that we've actually seen over the last decade All fall on these same on customers in those same communities And this brings me back. Why am I talking about these costs? It's because this is what motivates a significant fraction of the public policy response and the build that better act To how to address climate change in an equitable, uh way and it's about using tax incentives And programs like the cpp to make sure That this story is reversed that these communities are invested in that low-income Consumers of energy are not the ones bearing this burden and it is possible with some reforms But let me just motivate very quickly what those reforms are. First of all, let's talk about where these risks are the biggest They're probably concentrated heavily in cold heavy southeastern and midwestern utilities That's where most of the existing coal and other fossil generation are And let me talk a little bit about health burden here as well because Not only are there cost burdens, uh from the emissions That affect or from associated with existing coal plants that affect vulnerable communities But let's not forget the enormous burden of mortality and morbidity risks associated with the actual Pollution from these plants, which are particularly born By by pocket low-income communities as well as by the elder All of this seemed suggest that there are significant costs from the existing system That are really already putting a burden on many communities that If we were to ask them to bear the cost of transition Would make that transition very challenging The reason we're optimistic is because in the long run the cost of reducing emissions in the u.s Electricity sector is dramatically improved over the last 15 years with Uh with costs for for example solar wind as well as in batteries coming down significantly Since uh 2005 Uh, however, those costs often do include at least current solar and wind federal tax incentives So they're an important part of the economics that makes this work That being said, uh, there are several features that I want to kind of motivate about the current Tax incentive system that make them unsuited to appropriately mitigate The burden on vulnerable communities, particularly the rate burden, but also the burden faced by energy communities And let me start with one, uh, a fact that I think is very Is not widely recognized as well as it should be which is under current tax law These tax incentives that have played an important role the production tax credit and the investment tax credit As well as incentives, uh notice 45 q tax credit for carbon sequestration these incentives that the federal governments provide are actually Not efficiently usable by the utilities that own the majority vast majority 80 percent of the remaining column the system Those utilities actually don't have tax liabilities or have very little in Tax liabilities coming in the next few years To actually use any of those tax incentives and efficiently pass them through in their customers to reduce the costs Of replacing their existing coal plants with clean energy options in fact Those utilities together across the country have enough tax liability to basically transition and mitigate the emissions and costs Associated with about one to two coal plants being a worth of generation being replaced Uh, and there are two kind of technical reasons that i'm not going to go into but that are part of what we need to address in order to mitigate this which is that effectively Most of the country's utilities really couldn't use these tax incentives themselves to begin with under current law Secondly as it turns out current tax law only focuses on a couple of clean technologies But often not on many complementary and emerging technologies As easily that might be needed to address Not just the energy needs but also some technical grid flexibility For instance during very cold winter spells in in certain parts of the country. It's rather difficult to rely on solar load alone and efficiency As well as other technologies like hydrogen and carbon sequestration and storage as well as nuclear can really help address those difficulties But you need the right incentives that are technology that are that give flexibility to address the the needs and ways that work for the grids of local In in various areas. So while climate action looks economic in the long run with current policy But there are near-term energy cost burdens issues associated with the weather risk And certain fossil community job losses and challenges that are likely inadequately addressed particularly in Utilities that can't use the existing tax incentives Some example here that I'm not going to talk a whole lot about but you can take a look at later looks at an existing coal plant And ask well, what if you did take an existing coal plant in the middle of the country? That's kind of representative Replace it with wind and solar with current policies alone And indeed there is a good tax incentive and in the long run that replacement looks very attractive Solar and wind really look like they're economic to replace for example many existing coal plants But if you do the math on how it would what what the customer cost today would be And how much of those benefits go to local communities near the plant and mine versus being Providing economic benefits in other communities that may not be local The picture isn't as rosy and those incentives aren't working as well as we'd like Focusing benefits on the communities that might be harmed And in reducing customer costs today and we as we saw in the previous slide about energy burden That really matters for customers and isn't an equitable act So what can you do well? It turns out that the current package of policies being proposed in the Build Back Better Act Particularly changes to the existing tax credits Are significantly aligned with mitigating many of the challenges that I've just mentioned And particularly when complimented by a couple of other programs that call out one Is going to be the the focus of the next discussion and cpp and second Something I can talk about further DOE loans can really help to address many of these issues Um, and let me just talk very briefly about exactly what those changes are that are in proposed in Both house and senate versions. We hope in the senate versions, but in the senate versions of previous bills One Is it turns out that many of the reasons that utilities cannot use or do not use the existing tax benefits can be mitigated with two big changes One is to allow the solar For solar installations to use the production tax credit, which is a lot better suited for utility For to allow utilities to make use of tax incentives than the current investment tax credit And there's another technical issue called tax mobilization that actually forces investor-owned utilities to keep more uh to keep some of the benefits of the tax credit to increase their returns rather than pass that through To their customers Fixing those can really make solar And other advanced technologies more attractive for utilities and their customers Secondly, it turns out we need to fix this issue of not allowing co-ops, munis and regulated utilities to Not be able to use these tax credit. There's a provision called direct pay that allows Essentially allows These utilities to utilize them regardless of existing and current tax status and pass as long as they pass that benefit Through to their customers and obey a couple of other basic the public good conditions third We need to make sure that All of the complementary technologies that might make sense for a local community that can work perhaps to Address both environmental and economic impact on local communities are in play So making the production tax credit with these other modifications And the 45 q tax credit for carbon sequestration available to Auckland generation technologies With direct pay for the 45 q can go a long way towards Making leveling the playing field to make attractive options that work locally to be available and finally We need to make sure that these incentives incentivize the broadest range Of potential options the ones that might be the lowest cost in the long run And that mitigate the greatest risk that customers and communities face And this includes demand side resources and resources that are about making our grid more resilient In the future storage transmission And indeed there are several different provisions in existing In the house bill as well as coming In the senate bill opportunities as well Moving forward to add this flexibility to our tax incentives to make them Better suited for mitigating the real burdens that customers face and to set up what Yvonne will talk about next which is an enormous jobs opportunity in replacing these resources with clean energy Cleaner energy options and investing in mitigation Of carbon across the country and finally I just wanted to end with an example of how Some of these provisions that in particular I didn't talk very much about a DOE loan This is also another important part of the policy how they can work together to take To in principle Make the transition from a solution to climate being Not necessarily cost effective to one that actually can work and lead to an equitable outcome And I'll take the example of carbon capture and storage at an existing coal plant right now It would it would be more costly than continuing to run an existing coal plant perhaps significantly so but If the 45 q tax credit can be made direct k You can significantly reduce that delta And moreover if there are DOE loans available to address some of the risks Mitigate those costs further particularly associated with existing investments that were made in pollution control equipment at many of the Existing coal plants the net result can be that a transition of an existing plant to Perhaps use Another fuel and or to capture and store the carbon for any carbon containing fuels that it Continues to burn can become significantly more cost effective In balance and this is where kind of combining A several different mechanisms can play a significant role in mitigating The challenges that we face in achieving an equitable outcome while still addressing the urgent needs of climate on a forward-looking basis Uh, well again, thanks so much for the opportunity to talk about it. And that's all I've got Well, thank you so much. Um, would I that that was excellent and you've made it sound like that wasn't a ton That was an amazing presentation And just as a reminder Would I his presentation his slides materials as well as notes will be available on our website? www.esa.org um a lot of Where you just left off leads us directly into our next panelist And so it's my privilege to introduce Yvonne McIntyre. She is the natural resources defense counsel's director of federal electricity and utility policy in this role She's responsible for the development and advocacy of nrdc's federal power sector Uh climate change clean air and clean energy policies Yvonne is a seasoned government affairs professional with a long time career advocating The federal power sector policies before congress the administration and regulatory agencies And now it is our pleasure To listen to what you have to say about the clean electricity performance program. Take it away, Yvonne Thanks, Dan Okay, I think everybody should be able to see my my um My slides here not quite used to doing this. So thank you for um, Give me the opportunity to come and present today on the clean electricity performance program So I'm going to go through a little bit about what exactly is it? Um, and then talk about um, you know, some of the the jobs and economic impacts that we have, um And a lot had analyzed um and with a report that was released a couple of weeks ago Okay, so what is the cleaning electricity performance program the cpp? um, so the cpp is you know, basically modeled on you know, trying to mimic the the results of what a clean electricity standard Could could get you so you know, what is it? um What kind of proposal that you can craft to fit within the reconciliation kind of parameters um, that will drive drastic transition in the power sector to um, to more clean electricity portfolios And so it is a federal investment program supporting study growth in carbon-free energy over the coming decade And it uses federal financial incentives To encourage suppliers of retail electricity to increase their share of electricity clean electricity from a certain baseline And so increasing four point four percentage points per year Starting in 2023 and running through 2030 and again, this is all um The proposal that is in the house energy and commerce committee's reconciliation package So suppliers that actually meet or exceed the four percent per year receive a grant from the department of energy That is to be used to protect electricity electricity customers and offset the cost of increasing the clean electricity supply And suppliers that fall short Have to make a payment for each megawatt hour that they're short below the four four percentage points um There is a there's formulas that that you know determine the amount of grant each Each supplier gets or the the payment that they they have to give and um So if The supplier increases by you know four percentage points or more um, the the grant determination is it's $150 um times the the percent the megawatt hours increases For that year But they actually don't pay it on the full four percent increase. They pay it on The increase above 1.5 percent And so again, it's 150 times A percentage increase the minus 1.5 percent The payments again, if you don't reach that four percent It's $40 times the um the The amount that you came in under the four percent So and what qualifies is clean? So the definition of clean in the proposal is a carbon intensity of 0.1 tons of carbon dioxide equivalent per megawatt hour So that includes all zero emissions or very low emissions resources. Um, so, you know all renewables nuclear hydro power And and coal and new excuse me coal and gas with with combined carbon capture and storage The baseline is established. I'm starting in 2023. It's the average of of um suppliers Clean electricity portfolio over the years 2019 and 2020 um And, you know, there's always discussions in any type of climate power sector climate program of, you know, how do you make it fair to The good actors of the ones that are very clean already. So Any supplier that has a 85 that is 85 percent clean Will not have to make any payments if they don't increase four percent a year But they will continue to get a payment if they actually meet that four percent increase and so it it It Again recognizes The good actors, but also encourage them to keep keep going And then there's also some flexibility and allowing resale suppliers to defer their their payments by two to three year increments. So if If a supplier says, okay, I'm not going to be able to meet that four percent this year But I know in the next year I'm going to be able to to to make that plus some because I have a big Clean electricity resource that's coming on or, you know, I know I'm about to sign a Power purchase agreement to bring it on they can defer But that as long as they Make up for not just what they were Below in the year that they defer, but, you know, also adding on four percent on top of that This goes back to a lot of what Uda was saying You know the whole point of this program is to again encourage a rapid transition to Cleaner electricity, but at the same time you know lessening the the cost that repairs and communities are going to have to to bear With this transition and so because it is a federal incentive that means that rather than You know passing through the cost of transforming The portfolio to to greater clean electricity resources This directs that the the grant the payment that the retail suppliers receive Has to be used exclusively for the benefit of customers. And so this could be You know helping reduce customer bills Investing in building or, you know, a new clean electricity resource or, you know Entering into a contract to purchase power from a new clean electricity resource worker retention programs worker transition programs And so these are all ways that This proposal has structured to again reduce the the impact on rate payers as well as on, you know, the Impact on the transition on workers and communities So about two weeks ago, September 9th the analysis group released a report on the economic and jobs impacts of implementing a Clean electricity performance program. This report was commissioned by NRDC and Evergreen Action and so what they determined what they found was that a CPP that is that drives to 80 percent claim by 2030, which is the goal of The house proposal and When the president biden's goals stated goals for the power sector Would expand the workforce by nearly eight million jobs over the next decade Grow the economy by nearly one trillion job Just trillion dollars increase federal state and local revenues by 154 billion dollars And then drive massive new economic development through the construction of new renewable and clean energy resources 600 gigawatts of new solar wind and other clean energy projects A little bit about background on how this study was done They used a macroeconomic model that Reviewed the level of investment in changes in power system operations associated with implementing a national CPP over the 10-year period And again kind of evaluating investments in an operation of eligible low low carbon and zero carbon resources This did not model exactly what the What what's in the house energy and commerce committee proposal because this came out before we knew what the specifics of the text of the legislation would be But it does reflect it's pretty close to What what the what the legislative proposal came out to be and so we think that this still is a very good approximation of What the impacts will be if something like the house package goes forward The other thing that it does include is Like related to tax credit that there's a 10-year extension of all the clean energy tax credits and That there are basically it's business as usual as far as any new state or local policies clean climate and clean energy policy So breaking down the jobs impact. So it's actually 7.7 million net new jobs net obviously means that as you're increasing your clean electricity resources deployment That means fossil fuel Will come offline or decrease in operations and so it is taken into account How many new jobs will be added in the clean electricity sector? But you know minus the the impacts on the fossil fuel sector So 125 new jobs in the early years of the program growing to 1.7 billion million jobs each year starting in 2030 And of course this means all kinds of jobs in you know the clean electricity sectors So electrical workers solar installers when technicians and all the other types of men construction jobs That that come with that Not going to like go into everything but the other thing is Because this proposal would be impacting every single retail electricity supplier across the country Um, you would see massive changes in the clean electricity deployment across the country And so these jobs would be coming into every state across the nation Again, some of the other details of this benefits arise from again direct investment and operation of the resources as well as all the other kind of related jobs that come along with with um, you know Bringing on new new clean electricity resources in the community Again, as I said, it's it's across the us. Um, and so we would not only drive You know greater jobs and and and building These electricity resources new electricity resources across the country, but the supply chain As well And so, you know, we are looking at a rapid kind of deployment of new technologies over the next 10 years So that, you know, will also hopefully force, um, you know, more Development manufacturing of the components needed to get these resources online um I know Would I touched on this? Um, but, you know, the the we believe that, you know, obviously the taxing tax incentives and The cepp complement each other and really both are are very instrumental in getting us to the 20, uh, excuse me 80 by 2030 goals for the power sector um You know already, um Do the cpp just the way that design will again relieve some of the burden On the rate pairs, but having the tax incentives also in place Helps reduce the cost of new electricity resources from coming online. And so, you know working in tandem It will help reduce the cost of this clean electricity transition And, uh, you know, again at the same time growing jobs across the country. And so, you know, we just think that these are two very key components, um, that will be Um instrumental and in getting us to our climate and clean energy goals And so as this process moves through, um, the Through congress, you know, we really hope to retain You know, some of the strong, um provisions that are in the house both for the cepp and the tax With that, um, and There will be, um, I know I've provided links or copies of the the The analysis group jobs and economic impact report. And so, you know, you'll be able to get those On ees ees i's website Thank you, Dan Thank you, avan for a great presentation. And yes for sure. Um, everything will be available. Um on the Briefing webpage and if you've RSVPed, um, that's a great way to ensure that you get all the follow-up materials Um, we are going to transition now to questions for the next 20 ish minutes Um, and to do that, um, I'd like to introduce my colleague amber tolough. Um, she will lead our q&a today Um amber is on our policy team. She's a senior associate and has worked hard Along with our colleagues on the policy team and on our communications team to bring this briefing to everyone today So amber, why don't I turn it over to you to lead our q&a? Thanks a lot dan and thanks to our panelists today Uh, so first question many of these policies already exist in some form They're already core across the country improving our environment clean energy tax credits and rest have helped accelerate clean energy Adoption and many states have their own version of a clean electricity standard So how could additional investments such as those proposed in the reconciliation? Build on existing efforts at the state and local level Um, and let's start uh with the original lineup. So daniel, um, how about you go first? All right, thank you. Um, I think the additional funding Down to the state and local level could help with the capacity building Um Could also you know from the core perspective, you know help, uh build more career pathways for core members And also for the cores it could help them to be able to engage more youth In the core movement Thanks, kate Yeah, I will echo capacity building. I think that's going to be hugely important. Um, I also think um, just really Building on existing efforts around making these programs more accessible. So um in thinking about the 200 million in the build back better act Um, that it's really helping that the lowest tier of housing stock get up to the grade it needs to be to be eligible So, um, I think those kind of compounding efforts will be really helpful Um, ude you know, I think um again the state and local officials are the ones ultimately particularly regulators who and those who oversee municipal utilities and those working on quants other ones who face the Uh, unenviable task of being the intermediaries who are responsible for figuring out how we execute On the transition of our economy in ways that still keep rates affordable and These are the particularly the tax incentives if they're made direct pay and cpp are going to be critical tools for those folks To give them the support that they need to basically make sure that we've got their back So that they can make this happen in ways that bring the benefits of clean energy and the jobs to their communities And yes, there are a number of states that have um rps or cES type policies and programs in place and you know, none of them Well, I know that there have been some that have been changing them of late But none of them had had been taking us out to the 2030 2035 timelines And the other thing is it's not across the entire country right now every state has an rps and rs And so this will be a national program. Um, that would drive every state to you know, move into a clean electricity Uh path and at a quicker transition than what what's currently um existing and You know, I worked in the power sector for 30 years before moving over to nr dc And I am heartened by the fact that you know, a lot of utilities have been making pretty, you know substantial goals and commitments But the fact of the matter is you can say, you know, you can make these commitments But don't have to move forward and actually achieve them. And so providing this financial incentive You know, they're going to get money to help with this transition to help with You know making the argument to their public service commissions to say, you know I have this this you know commitment this goal that I have I'm going to get some money from the federal government to help take us there And and you know reduce the impact on consumers. And so, you know, this will be something that's nationwide and take us there More quickly and at a less cost Thank you all. Um, our second question is How could investment into these programs contribute overall to improved energy? Affordability or other climate justice goals and let's start again with daniel Sure. So, you know that one of our goals with the ccc is for uh, those frontline communities the environmental justice communities to We would like to see a commitment A large percentage of them being the ones that are getting the project work that are getting the funding those communities You know, I don't know if you have anything Yeah, I think like you touched on also earlier, um, I mean the main way to promote climate justice is creating these job opportunities in communities Where there is work to do to fix past climate injustices So, I mean, there's just so much impact that can happen when you're empowering young adults with The knowledge and the skills and the recognition that they can make a difference in their communities and and do this work Um, and and as mentioned, there are already a lot of cores doing the work, um in communities right now You know training young people to go in and and weatherize homes and make our housing stock more sustainable Thank you both. Um over to Kate Sure. Yeah, I think maybe um tangentially to in in addition to the Kind of provisions from the rural energy savings program. Um, I also think a provision that will kind of help move the needle here is the rural partnership program um, really flexible dollars proposed um out of the build back better act that would Help local governments partner with nonprofits for profits and other entities Both to build capacity as well as carry out these projects. Um, so I think, you know, you can see how they would overlap with these various efforts and I think allow You know local states regional Either government or quasi government entities kind of take a little bit more holistic approach and Again, whether that is advancing Energy affordability affordability specifically through REST or taking it maybe a step back and looking at Kind of housing a little bit more broadly or small business a little bit more broadly. So I think it provides that flexibility Thanks, Ute Yeah, I think the connection is perhaps most clear with the tax incentives and cpp on this Uh, ultimately, uh, you know, it's that uh, it's that graph I'm just trying to show around energy burden versus tax burden And it's just uh, these programs are fundamentally about making sure that we're not financing Global action on climate and national action on climate On the backs of those who are least able to do it They are fundamentally designed to make sure that the financing is coming from those who can't afford it today To make sure those who can't afford it are not uh, uh are actually Having a chance to contribute by Instead having the jobs and lower energy costs that allow them to grow their local economies Uh and participate in this transition while giving those who are Better off an opportunity to really Invest their capital to make all of that happen rather than necessarily Be the ones who are receiving that funding. So I think it goes a long way towards that I'll just mention one other thing, uh, you know You can ask why isn't this all carbon linked? Why aren't you doing this with carbon taxes and part of the reason for that is that by focusing on clean energy and providing this Uh, you know, what is effectively funding to make sure that it's really clean everywhere And that the clean, uh, is given a good deal of, uh, you know, that anyone who puts in clean energy Gets the funding it it doesn't solely focus on carbon. It acknowledges the historical injustices associated with environmental impacts that are not carbon And he's providing that financing in communities that otherwise Uh, what many maybe perhaps would not be relevant from a carbon perspective But still have a good benefit from clean energy rather than necessarily the carbon emissions reductions alone Uh, and so there's there's an additional component to this. I think that was intentional that really is about making sure that we're not just Uh, uh focusing on the global benefits, but making sure that we're paying for what can really improve health on the ground And again reduce costs so that those communities Uh, who've historically been burdened are not the ones who are paying for this transition Yeah, but I'll I'll follow up more along the lines of what Uday was saying right there. Um, you know So the cpp is not an emissions reductions program per se But obviously you're going to get substantial emissions reductions as you increase your clean electricity resource deployment You're pushing out fossil fuel plants And so, you know, we have done and others have done, um analysis on on what that means and so, you know There was a study that NRGC and EDF did that Again driving 80 clean by 2030 will lead to Let's see I've got my figures right here. So sorry, but so you know substantial 80 almost, um, you know over 80 percent, uh Reduction in CO2 emissions from 2005 93% reduction in SO2 emissions and 76% reductions in NOx emissions Um, there was a clean energy future study that found that deploying clean electricity to achieve 100% Clean by 2040 Would lead to 1.8 trillion dollars in climate and public health benefits. And so, you know, this is You know, we go on we're going beyond just, you know talking about jobs and economic impacts We're also talking about health impacts, um public health impacts and and you know, just a cleaner environment across the board Thanks so much. I'll pass it over to Dan for the next question Great. Thanks, Amber. Um, lots and lots of questions, but um Avon you and would I have talked about sort of how specifically The clean electricity performance program and the tax incentives work together Before things that we've talked about today Exist in the same conversation Because of decisions that have been made on Capitol Hill Dictated in large part by the process that we're working the the constraints of the process But these are four things that don't naturally he all way you would you wouldn't think they would naturally go together in the wild Right. These are four things that have been sort of assembled in the conversation I'd like to start and I think actually starting Avon with you this time and then going backwards through the list Love to hear some additional comments about how these four separate policies Would work in tandem and complement each other specifically um, you know, how they would work together, but also How they might impact emissions reductions or climate resilience improvements In different sectors or across different sectors Um, you know for a staff person who's watching us today They may be primarily interested in one of the four things that we've talked about But I'd like to try to help them understand that oh if we make progress say on clean electricity performance program These are maybe some additional benefits that would accrue to other sectors or across other sectors of the economy So avon we'll start with you and then we'll go to udai and then we'll go backwards to well As we as we look outside of just the power sector, um, you know There there there are other um proposals, uh in in you know, what the house has put on the table, but You really, you know power sector is the key To driving, you know emissions reductions Economy-wide right and so as you look at policies to increase the amount of electrification in our buildings and transportation. So, you know Getting more evs on the road, you know, we we Those won't be clean if you're still just you know charging those evs with power that's made from fossil generation, right? And so, you know having a clean electricity Power sector is key to furthering our goals across the economy and you know Some of the other things and and how like, you know, the rural electric programs Will help and kind of work in tandem with the cpp tax credits, um, you know rural communities of rural rural electric cooperatives. So they're primarily fossil fuel fire They have a lot of debt and so, you know providing them You know funding and and you know financial means to help them with this transition and then help them then you know be able to Take advantage of a cpp. Um, it are very important. And so, you know, there's a lot of components throughout the the The reconciliation package that are focused on climate that all do work in tandem Um, but you know, we just think that you know power sector first of all It's the easiest one to do right now, but it's also key to kind of helping push Reductions and the rest of the economy Yeah, take it away Uday Sure, I'll complement what Yvonne was saying here with a little bit more detail on kind of The way in which the tax incentives and cpp work together, which is that You know the the cpp in many ways doesn't Provide additional benefits until essentially after a utility Uh has done kind of some basic investment in clean energy It's you can think of it as it cuts in after one and a half percent Of increase and in some sense what it's doing is it's really providing that extra incentive that extra push For utilities to go above and beyond to really do more than they otherwise would would have done with these With the existing incentives in place. We've had them around for a long time We're fixing some of the problems, but we don't yet know that they're going to be effective enough to drive a change as quickly as we need And we don't know that that change Especially Is going to be you know that the tax incentives alone are going to be enough to make sure that that change doesn't End up raising rates because customers have to keep paying for the old assets They already have in place which is that cold debt issue and the new assets that are going to be put in all at the same time And the cpp really helps with fixing that problem by kicking in to say if you go more rapidly We've got your back We're going to make sure that we cover you to address these additional costs The hit on your communities that needed to move earlier and that's what that cpp really is adding And when you uh, but but that's still kind of utility electricity sector focused alone We really also have a workforce that doesn't just need money, but needs Uh needs support and needs opportunities to dive in needs trading and that's where really, you know, we see the The core is being complimentary and finally This isn't just about you know utilities making investments alone There's a real opportunity for to improve the building stock improve You know the the all of the different pieces of our economy that could contribute in particular households and businesses In rural and disadvantaged communities need to be part of that solution But I think that's where you get the complimentary piece of making sure this isn't just utilities investing in big things But those investments are happening Thanks, Kate Yeah, I think just to add on or maybe put a finer point on Amplify Uda's point about that, uh, you know making sure that the tax credits are reaching Properly the the entity right so electric cops for example are not this is not true of all cough But electric cops are not for profit. Um, and so tax credits don't reach them the way it would a for-profit company um So I think that's you know really making sure that that those Pieces are kind of aligned. Um, but then also I think the thing that really stood out to me Got me excited at the potential was with what the core network was talking about around really improving the workforce development around licensing and skill building and You know, I think in a dream world could help form kind of worker co-ops, right? And have more people have those those ownership opportunities And and be that workforce that partners with the implementers of the rural energy savings program And Hannah and Danielle, I think that means the core network gets the last word Yeah, I think as folks have mentioned earlier I think there is an opportunity with as we switch to a more sustainable greener energy system There's a lot of opportunity to do some workforce training Um, it's something that cores are already doing in some areas to you know build and install that infrastructure Um, we do have different models out there that some of our cores are doing around pre-apprenticeships And actually working with different uh industry partners Um, we also, you know, especially in like rural communities where there might not be too many other job opportunities I think there's a huge opportunity There to do some workforce development. And I don't know if you want to add anything Danielle You got it. Yeah, we uh, I think we're a good pipeline to workforce development and you know, it'll I think the CCC has a great potential of Making that workforce look like the face of our country today. So I think it's a wonderful opportunity for all of us Thank you Danielle, and that's a great point to end on. Um, that brings us to about the 330 mark, which is the end of our time together Um, Amber, thank you very much for moderating our Q&A today Um, I would like to thank everyone in our audience for joining us today and thank you Uh, to our panelists Hannah and Danielle, Kate, Uday and Yvonne for four excellent presentations Um, and I really appreciate how you're able to help sort of tie these Uh, these policies and programs and investments together. Thank you very much for joining us today It's the start of a very busy and potentially very consequential week in climate policy in the united states So, um, I couldn't think of a better way to kick it off Um, and I forgot to mention in my remarks But one of the reasons why we decided to focus on the jobs aspect is because they're very real and they do in fact Materialize with these investments, but september is also workforce development Um, and so we've got to get that in there before the end of the month As well because it's a great time of year to um Make these points. So thank you so much for these great presentations reminder about slides if you missed anything You are welcome in our audience. Everything will be posted online I didn't mention this during my introductions because I didn't want to create Sort of the illusion of maybe playing favorites among panelists, but Danielle and Hannah Thank you for including a photo of a blower door test. Um, I'm an energy efficiency person So anytime we can get a blower door test image in a set of slides and an esi briefing It's brownie point. So thank you very much You want to go back and look at Hannah's and Danielle slides or Cates or unites or revans everything will be posted online as well as the archive of the webcast And eventually summary notes Thank you that uh for that. Um, I would like to say thank you to everyone. Um at team EESI to help Bring these briefings um to our audience That starts with daniel bryan. Um, I'd also like to thank omri, emma, amber, of course Savannah and Anna And I'd like to thank our fabulous fall interns isabella, roshni and valerie for helping with notes and live streaming and twitter and all of that So thank you all for a great effort today. Um, Dan oh, uh, we'll put up a slide in just a moment with a link to a survey We take this very seriously if you have if folks in our audience have two minutes and you're willing to click on that link Or copy it into your browser. Um, it really really does help us if you share your thoughts about What you heard today if there are any technical issues any video issues any audio issues any ideas for future topics? Commentary on what you heard everything is welcome. We read every response and we do our best to improve After we get the results of each survey after each briefing um So really really appreciate that Um, I've plugged the website a bunch of times, but that's because it's a great resource I'd also like to plug once again our bi-weekly newsletter amber is our editor climate change solutions It comes out every other tuesday, which means I think the next issue is tomorrow Um, and it's a great resource Um, also like to plug our upcoming briefing series that kicks off next friday with sir robert watson and christiana figueras to talk about To begin our discussions in the lead up to cop 26. Um, thank you everyone for joining us today I hope everyone has a great rest of your monday and it means a lot for you joining us. Thank you so much