 My name is Jessica Colligan, and I'm happy to welcome you on behalf of Fairfield's Alumni Relations Office. And I am just so excited to have all of you here tonight, and especially to introduce Katie Burke, who of course is the author of Urban Playground, What Kids Say About Living in San Francisco. And in addition to being a published author, she also writes Noe Kids, which is a monthly column for the Noe Valley Boys, featuring children who live in San Francisco's Noe Valley neighborhood. Katie has taught creative writing to both children and adults in Kenya, South Africa, and San Francisco. And she is also a law attorney and writes judicial and attorney profiles for San Francisco Attorney Magazine. Her other publications include Harper Collins, The L.A. Times, and KQED Perspectives. Katie earned her law degree from the University of San Francisco School of Law, her master's degree in counseling psychology at Arizona State University, and of course her BA in psychology at Fairfield in 1996. And I'm also excited to introduce to you a classmate of Katie's, another 1996 alumna, Nicole Rebarne, and she will in the second half of tonight's program be interviewing Katie. But I wanted to take a moment now to recognize and thank her and give you a little bit of her background as well. So as I said, Nicole is a 1996 alumna who graduated with a BA in writing from Fairfield. And in the last 24 years, she has spent working in Connecticut and New York as a journalist. She's most recently been documenting and protesting against abuse and exploitation of animals by the carriage horse, far and hunting industries, and also the Bureau of Land Management's mismanagement of America's wild horses. She has been doing this work with friends and animals since 2013. Prior to that, Nicole is a newspaper and magazine reporter and editor for 17 years, including six years as the editor of Norwalk Citizen News. So Katie and Nicole, I'm so thrilled to have you here. And I'm going to turn things over to Katie Cow to introduce us to some of the stars of her book. Katie, follow us. Hi, everyone. I'm Katie Burke, author of Urban Playground, What Kids Say About Living in San Francisco. And for this book, I interviewed 50 kids who were ages five through nine at the time, living in San Francisco about their lives here. That's where I am zooming in from. And we have four of the kids here tonight to read their stories. We have Lila, Bex, Sarah, and Travis. So we're going to jump right in with Lila if you want to unmute yourself, Lila. I will ask you first before you start reading any updates to your story since we published the book? Now I'm 10 years old. I got a cat named Apricot. A cat named Apricot? Yeah. Okay. And we are obviously staying at home and recording. Yeah. Okay. All right. You ready to read your story? Yeah. Nine years old. Nine-year-old Lila who lives in the Castro with her mom, dad, and older sister plays soccer and gymnastics. We don't really have positions yet. She says of her soccer club, the Vikings, but usually I play goalie keeper. Lila likes playing goalie. I prefer using my hands than my feet because I feel like I have more control over my hands than my feet. She explains. Vikings is not competitive, Lila says. Viking is more about equal playing time. It's nice to have everybody play equally she adds. My favorite thing about soccer is that you get to work with the team. And at the end of the season, there's a big part of it with snacks, cupcakes, and cake. But soccer is also a lot of work. It's really tiring sprinting across the field multiple time, Lila says. That's another thing I like about being goalie. You don't have to sprint around everywhere. When I was younger, the fields were much smaller. Now that I'm nine, the fields are huge. Another bummer about soccer, your team doesn't always win. I mean, it's not that bad, I guess. Our coast chews us up and get through it to get through it. It's not that great to see the other team sharing and jumping up and down. Lila enjoys watching professional soccer. Usually I watch Brazil games because my mom is pretty much from Brazil, she says, and she watches the World Cup. During the Women's World Cup, she says of 2019 World Games, we read Sonoma, USA won the Women's World Cup, and I'm pretty sure everybody puts bunched up on the couch when they want everybody started jumping up and down. As to identify a pro soccer player, Lila admires a soccer player named Alex Morgan. She's impressive and really fast, Lila says. Lila loves gymnastics even more than soccer. I think I'll be doing it for a while unless it gets boring or something. The best part of gymnastics, probably trampoline and tumbling, Lila says. And Sam's cartwheels. One of the most impressive things I can do in gymnastics is probably a headstand or one-handed round-off. Lila has seen professional gymnastics in person. I did go to the Olympics in Rio once, she says. That was cool. What does Lila think she will be hard about playing professional gymnastics? If you fall during a competition, she says, it must be really embarrassing and sad for you because you know that you're letting your team down. Okay, thank you, Lila. And then I will read a section that comes after each child's story called insights from the urban playground. And this is me speaking as the narrator. San Francisco is the wonderful place to play soccer and perform in gymnastics. Between the opportunities to learn from extremely skilled athletes and some groups' dedication to keeping sports non-competitive, kids in San Francisco can excel while earning their rewards for fun and teamwork. The city is full of people from other countries like Lila's mom. If you get the opportunity to see the Olympics, especially in another country, you should take it. San Francisco is also a good place to see girls advance in sports. So many girls like Lila are playing and watching professional female athletes compete. So now I'm going to read the five discussion questions that follow each child's story. I'm going to read the ones for Lila. And Lila's story already answered the question. I'm going to be asking the questions of the other three kids on the call. So I'm going to start with Bex. Bex, if you play soccer or if you ever did play, do you think it would be more fun to run around or defend your team's goal and why? Run around because I've played soccer before and that's what I usually do. Okay. And you know what, all three of you, all four kids, you can stay unmuted during this part. And what about you, Sarah? Question. I think I prefer running around and getting the ball. Travis. I would prefer being goalie because I mean, I'm a pretty fast runner, but it does get tiring. Okay. All right. Sarah, I'm going to start with you on this one. Do you think it would be more fun to play sports in a competitive way or as a team of people supporting each other? Or can it be both? This is what it is. I think it'd be funner. With a team of people supporting each other. Okay. What about you, Bex? I think it would be more fun to play sports in a competitive way or in a supportive way? Competitive way and supportive way. Both ways. Okay. All right. What's fun about the competitive way? Because. Actually, I don't know. Okay. All right. Travis. Both, like Bex, because I think if you're competitive, that's good. But if you're also supportive, that's good too. Okay. Why is it good to be competitive? Um, if you're, if you're, um, it's good to be competitive because it can, um, Sarah, um, what sport do you love to play and what's exciting about it? I like to do trails on horses. And what's really exciting about it is, um, while you're on the trail, you get to see the scenery. It's really cool. Okay. Um, what about, we'll go with, uh, we'll start with Travis this time. Oh, Travis, are you, are you with us? We'll go with Bex. Either one of you, whoever wants to answer. How about you, Bex? Um, I like playing baseball because I like pitching and, and batting. Okay. But you, Travis. I like to, um, do, uh, rock climbing. That counts as a sport. Yeah. Um, it's exciting because, um, once you get to the, um, Ty's part, um, you feel accomplished that you've done a really good climbing. Yeah. Do you do indoor rock climbing or outdoors? Um, both. I do rocks that are just in Glen Park. And I just do the Glen Park. Um, Okay. That's fun. Um, let's see. So for each of you, what would be more fun for you in gymnastics, trampoline or tumbling? Sarah. I think I prefer the trampoline. Okay. Why? Um, I like it because I really like jumping. Really. Um, I like to jump. Um, I like it because I really like jumping really, really, really, really high. Okay. What about you, Bex? I have no idea. Okay. You've never done either one? Okay. Uh, what about you? Trampolining or tumbling Travis? Um, I prefer, um, trampoline because I, I don't really want to fall on the base. Okay. Um, I saw your hand motions, Bex, trampoline for you too. Okay. All right. Um, Sarah, if you could see the Olympics in person in any country, where would you want to see the games? I would like to see them in Tahoe. Um, the spring Olympics. Mm hmm. Why? Um, the resort that I ski at, um, the, the Olympics were once there and I think it would be really fun to watch. Mm hmm. Okay. What about you, Bex? What country would you see the Olympics in if you could see them in any country? Um, Tokyo. Mm hmm. Why Tokyo? You want to go to Japan? Yeah. Okay. Why? Just want to. Okay. What about you, Travis? I could do it in. Yep. Because I can also double the trip as a type site scene. Plus Egypt seems really cool. So. Mm hmm. Egypt. That's a nice idea. Okay. All right. Um, let's go to Bex. Um, Bex. Are there any updates to your story? Um, since we published the book. Nine. You're nine. Okay. So your age is the only upgrade. Um, I don't do junior giants anymore. Okay. All right. Let's hear from your, let's hear your story. Eight year old Bex lives in portrayal hill home of goat hill pizza where he orders cheese pizza and spaghetti. Bex who lives at home with his mom, dad, and younger twin siblings or sister and brother. Also like sushi from Moshe Moshe a sushi bar and dog patch. A neighborhood near portrayal hill. His usual order there is a soup that has tofu in it. And an avocado. Well, but none of these is his favorite food. Bex says the best food is orange chicken from Panda Express. Second best, our baboos says, which he gets at school. They don't have the sauce I love that I get at home. Bex says at four years old, Bex took a cooking class at bay leaf cooking in the bay view bay leaf no longer exists. So Bex was lucky to learn and it's indoor and outdoor kitchens when he did. I really want to let to cook like they do on top chef. Bex says he regularly watches this show. They make desserts using different things like a black panther out of edible paper. If Bex could learn to cook anything now, it would be ravioli. I know my parents like ravioli, he spends. The first chicken dish I want to learn is chicken tenders because that's easy. He also wants to learn to make Pokemon and Lego cake. I would make a lemon cake of Pikachu. That would be chocolate. He says a Lego cake would be a Lego man looking at you with his hands up. His hat would be vanilla and his face would be chocolate. His body would be cookies and cream ice cream cake with hot chocolate inside. Bex prefers dining out to eating at home. At home I have to make something everyone likes, he explains. His parents also cook. Bex's mom makes chicken noodle soup and his dad makes pesto pasta. I'm excited for my sister and brother to learn to cook. Bex says starting with pizza, then cupcakes, then cookies. They just pretend to cook now, he adds using a fake button. Bex loves living in San Francisco. He plays baseball for the Junior Giants at Oracle Park. You get baseball cards every time you show up to practice. He says if you get all the cards, then you can get a golden or silver trophy. If you get a golden one, you meet Buster Posey and get a great Giants game ticket. Bex appreciates his neighborhood and it made him the wasp as filmed there. He says of the 2018 superhero film. And Christopher Brooks is the best bookstore. Hey, insights from the urban playground. A movie filmed in your neighborhood, that would be exciting. It happens in San Francisco a lot. Filmmakers say it is expensive to shoot movie footage in San Francisco, so not every movie team can do it, but many people in San Francisco have seen film crews in the city if they've lived here long enough. And the food choices, not only does San Francisco have Panda Express, which you can find in lots of other places, but it also has God Hill and Moshi Moshi, two wonderful restaurants you will only find in San Francisco. Bex has great taste. Okay, Lila. Where's Lila? Okay. Have you ever been to a sushi bar? No. No? What do you think it would be like? Well, I, if I was going to go to a sushi bar, I wanted to, I don't know if this is specifically sushi bars, but it's one with the conveyor belts that bring your food. You order on an iPad and they bring you food with the conveyor belts. That looks cool. I've never had sushi, but I may try it someday. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I think the conveyor belt system is cool too. What about, what about you Travis? Have you ever been to a sushi bar? Yes. I have actually been to the same place. Bex has been. Yeah. You and Bex live not too far away from each other, huh? I think we figured that out. What about you, Sarah? Have you ever been to a sushi bar? Yes, I have. I have been to gamma sushi and know that. Do you like sushi? Yes, very much. Have you ever been to one of those ones that Lila was talking about where you order on your iPad and it comes on a conveyor belt? No. No. Okay. If you, Travis took a cooking class, what is the first thing you'd want to learn to make and why? I would want to make cookies because cookies are good. Yeah. They're really good. That's a good reason. Let's see, Lila, what about you? I have taken a cooking class a few times, but if I, if I were going to do that, I would probably make something like pizza because I don't know. I just really like pizza. What kind of pizza? Well, I actually like my pizza without cheese. I think I would just the tomato sauce. Oh yeah. That's a good way to have it. That way. What about you, Sarah? If you took a cooking class, what's the first thing you'd want to learn to make and why? I think I want to make pasta because my whole family loves pasta. Okay. So that answers the next question too is what your parents like to eat? What about you, Travis? What are your parents like to eat? They like to eat a lot of healthy stuff. Okay. And Lila, what are your parents like to eat? Well, we, we have like meat. We love barbecue. We like to eat meat. We like to eat meat in general. Just like barbecue and meat and chicken. So yeah. Okay. If you could have any movie filmed in your neighborhood, which one would you want to come there and why Lila? I would either have one of the Avengers movies filmed here. Or one of the pitch perfect movies filmed here. Because I like the movies and I also want to meet the actors because that would be fun. Yeah. These are two good ones. What about you, Sarah? I would like the greatest film to be filmed in San Francisco because that's my favorite movie. Okay. And Travis. I would have Spider-Man Homecoming or Far from Home. Okay. I mean it's awesome. Okay. All right. So now we're going to move to Sarah's story. Sarah, are there any updates since we, on your story since we published the book? I am 11 years old now. And I have two peasants that are girls. Okay. And if you don't recognize it, everybody, Sarah's background is the book cover. That is so cool. Okay. Go ahead and read your story. Sarah, nine years old. Sarah, a nine year old girl in Noe Valley does not always sleep through the night. Her younger brother and roommate wakes her up to go to his parents' room. Her brother has a blanket that falls from his bed every night, which also wakes Sarah up. I have a sensitive sleeper, Sarah explains. What is Sarah's little brother like the best about her? The fact that I share with him, even though he doesn't always share with me. Sarah's favorite thing they do in San Francisco is probably go out to the park or watch a family movie on Friday. Maybe have dinner and chat, she says. I asked what she wishes her family knew about her, Sarah answered. They probably don't know that the last four-year-old dog hurts me way more than it hurts them. The family dog shadow ran outside when Sarah accidentally left the front door open. Strangers took Shadow in and accidentally fed her something she wasn't supposed to eat, which made her die. Sarah says lots of people explain to her that it's not her fault, but she still likes herself. Sarah who has three boy cousins and one girl cousin and her little brother wants the family of her own someday. She would have two daughters and a million pets, a dog, a guinea pig, horses, parrots, hamsters, and several fish. Sarah's family has a wolf and on Saturday morning, no one can go straight to the TV after waking up. Her mom, her dad, and her little brother must say good morning to each other before they can watch TV. Sarah says Sierra, the new family dog, was meant for her family. When they went to the puppy place to pick out their new dog, Sarah chose Sierra of two eligible puppies. She ran up to me and kissed me. Sarah says, the other puppy just started, I don't know, climbing me. When Sierra was a puppy, Sarah's bump family kept their independent side of their house. Well, golden doodles are known to be really smart, Sarah says. We have a camera at home, and the camera was placed right in front of Sierra's tent. Sierra would climb over it and she looked like a tiny person, rock climbing. Sierra is not allowed to sleep with Sarah anymore. When she was younger, Sierra chewed up more than just my bed cover, Sarah says. I met she would jump on my bed and I would share the house, sleepshare, searching, everything. Now Sarah has new covers and new wool. Insights from the urban playground. In San Francisco, siblings sometimes sleep in the same room. San Francisco is only seven square miles and holds more than 884,000 people. Many people share bedrooms. San Franciscans don't always know their neighbors. Someone can think they are being nice by feeding your lost pet, but they can't ask you whether the food they're giving them is safe. San Francisco has lots of animals who want a loving home. If you are unlucky enough to lose your pet, you will be sad, but when you are ready, many sweet animals would love to live with you. Okay, so for the other three, I'm just going to ask you one of Sarah's questions. Have you ever had a pet die, Bex? My goldfish. Your goldfish? Okay, who was your goldfish? We got the name. Okay, how long ago? How long ago did your goldfish die? I think when I was one. Okay. What about you, Travis? I had a dog and he died. I was like three. I was three. What kind of dog? I don't know, but his name was Romeo. Romeo? I like that. What about you, Lila? Have you ever had a pet die? Well, my friend's dog bit my guinea pig and it died. Were you there? No, I was at my birthday party. Oh, wow. When was that? Oh, my last birthday party in July. Okay. And me and my sister both had one goldfish. My sister's goldfish ate all the food and exploded. And my goldfish starved to death. A little imbalance there. Okay. What was your guinea pig's name? Dash. Dash? Okay. All right, we're going to go to Travis's story. Travis, are there any updates to your story? No, I don't have any updates. I don't have any updates to your story since we published the book. I am now 10. Okay. All right. Let's hear it. I got to get to the page. Okay. Okay. Here we go. Yeah. Okay. I'm thinking about maybe being a cop, he says. Travis, who is hearing impaired and lives with his mom, his dad, his death hold right for them. I think you can get this summer money from being a cop. He says, and he still got a lot of action while you're getting money too. What does Travis think a typical day for a cop would be? Well, I have two theories about that. He says the first one is a cop. The other one is if they do work at a desk job, figure out figuring out stuff that's happening. Yeah. Honestly, because sometimes it could be a little boring because if you go into a cop station in a nice little neighborhood. Oh, I think we're having a sound issue. Oh, Travis, you know what? You're muted. Let's start back from he adds honestly. Yeah. Honestly, sometimes it could be a little boring. Oh, you're muted again. Yeah. Honestly, sometimes it could be a little boring because if you go into a cop station. In a nice little neighborhood with home security, that's unlike they get burgers. So you could just be sitting at your desk, picking coffee all day and you can get it done. Then you'd be, you'd get stuck with a desk job. What is Travis saying cops are like in general? They'd have to probably, they probably have to go through a lot of training to be a cop. So they probably be super strong and tough, but so they might run a lot. As for the type of cop you would be Travis says, I'd probably be really tough too, but I don't run. I'd probably be cheerful slash tough. If people are giving out awards for their cop service, Travis says, this award would be maybe, or maybe funny, really funny after criminal. I run really fast. Travis also suspected his lunch routine would be different from those cops. In most movies, I see cops get trainees food for some people. He says, I like Chinese food too, but it's not healthy. I probably get at least like five, two, a day for lunch to get better. And then I have a maybe ham and cheese sandwich. Travis says, his mom creates software and my dad's not explained to me when he's done, but I never really know when to stop. We'll put our best jobs, she explains. And they would probably get a lot more money than me, but they wouldn't get any action or adventure. Does anything scare Travis about being a cop? Oh, yes, he answers. If they outnumber you and you have a bunch of criminals on you. And you don't know karate or kung fu, you're going to get captured. Insights from the urban playground. San Francisco has a lot of action for a cop. There would not be much time to eat Chinese food and donuts or to sip coffee all day. The city is just too busy for that. And it is a good place to learn karate or kung fu to supplement your official police training. There are many places in the city to take lessons. In San Francisco, there's not too much to grunt about for a cop. The city has many home security systems, but there are also lots of criminal courtrooms where cops can serve as trial witnesses. Sarah. What do you think would be fun about being a police officer? If you think it would be fun. I don't really know what would be fun. Okay. Do you think it would not be fun? Kind of. Okay. What about you, Bex? I see you nodding your head. No, I don't think it will be fun. Okay. How come? I don't know. I just know. I just saying, I don't know. Yeah, not for you. Okay. What about you, Lila? I think it would be kind of, I think they would be an interesting job, but I don't know what would be fun. Okay. Do you think it would not be fun? Kind of. Okay. What about you, Bex? I see you nodding your head. I see you nodding your head. I think it would be fun. I don't know what would be fun. I think it would be a fun job, but I don't think it's, I don't think I would be a police officer. OK, all right. Okay. Thank you all so much for reading your stories and you can stay on. When Nicole and I talk and you can just, you guys are all on mute right now anyway. So thank you so much for sharing your stories with everyone and for answering the questions. Oh, there you are. Okay. Hi, everybody. That was so great. Um, I just as a, as someone who graduated with Katie and who's known her, I, I just want to say congratulations on publishing this book. I mean, it's truly amazing. And I was thinking about this time. Um, it's hard to like say that there's anything positive. Um, I was thinking about this when, when during a pandemic, but I really, I was thinking about your book and how a lot of my friends who have kids say that they're, um, right now they're, they're kids are really missing their friends and they're feeling isolated. And I just feel like this book, it's sort of like perfect timing. Cause I feel like it could really bring kids together and make them feel less isolated and like, you know, learn what they have in common. It's just great. So I hope, um, I hope more and more people buy it, especially during this time. So I, I can tell I've known, like I said, I've known you for a long time. And I know you love kids. And so what inspired you, um, to write the book, where was there, where there are particular kids that actually inspired you to do this project? Yeah. And you know what, before I turned it over to you, I forgot to say, anyone wants to use the chat bar to ask questions. Nicole will monitor the chat bar. So go ahead and do that, um, or comments or anything, but if you have questions, she'll monitor it. Um, I wrote it because so I, in 2017, my mom for my birthday said she wanted me to write a series of family stories. She got me a subscription to story worth, um, which is a platform where you can write story members can write stories to each other. So I wrote to the six nieces and two nephews in my family. And then I did that for a year. And then that led to my Noe Valley voice column where I profiled different Noe Valley, Noe Valley's a neighborhood in San Francisco. Um, Noe Valley kids every month. And then, um, that led to the book when I met my publisher, she saw that I had written a lot about the city and that I had been in the past few years writing about kids and she put them together and said, you should do this book about kids growing up in the city. So cool. I was just thinking about what are your nieces and nephews think of you as about you being a published author? Are they excited? Yeah. They were some of them were the test cases. So I did some profiles on them, even though none of them is in San Francisco, but when we were doing just kind of trying kids and profiles. And yeah, like they're just their little personalities are also different. So the one who's obsessed with fame was like, I'm going to be famous. I'm in this book. And then, you know, like another one's like, wait, I just want to make sure I got everything right. You know, so they just, yeah, but they're really cute. They're really into it. Um, and, you know, you knowing kids so well and why, why do you think it's so important for them to, you know, have a platform like this and to have their thoughts and feelings and opinions acknowledged. Like I never really thought about it that, that much before hearing about your book. I think a lot of people, um, sort of acknowledge kids, you know, like if they come into a room or whatever, but then it's like, there's the kids table, you know, and the adult conversations. And when you think about a kid looking up and there are all these things and it's like, you know, stop tugging at my shirt, you know, and it's like they just want attention and they want, you know, and when you turn to them and I know just as an aunt of eight, you know, and I'm always like, where's the kids table? I'm gonna sit there, you know, or like wherever I'm sitting becomes the kids table. I'm like, I want to be at their level. I want to ask what they want to know about because I feel like they completely come alive in a different way and that I just, for whatever reason, I tune into that. And I think, um, I just think that doesn't happen a lot in terms of, um, I mean, in terms of the many interactions they have in a day with adults, you know, I think there's a lot of hi, how are you doing? And then let me talk to the other adults. And I think it's really important for them to understand, you know, I'm not just playing with you as an adult playing with the kid. Like I want to have a conversation with you. I want to hear what you care about. And that's just important to me because I remember adults that did that for me, you know, if there'd be a sea of adults and there's like the one person I always wanted to sit next to because they asked me about everything I was interested in and how my day was. So I just try to always do that for kids. Yeah. I think it's important to know that you're talking about this. It's like to build a confidence to actually like have an opinion and be able to share it and not be afraid of what people think maybe. Because I know for a while, like with journalism, it took me a while to be confident with writing like an opinion piece. So maybe if I had more people like you around when I was little, would have helped. Um, So what struck me, obviously the kids stories are so wonderful. And, and I enjoyed like, but I really enjoyed the insights from the urban playground at the end. And then the, the questions to prompt like a. More of a conversation after the story was told, can you like tell me a little bit about the thought process behind that and why you included that. And it also sounded, was it a lot of work to pick up on their answers and then kind of research it and connect it to the city? It seems like it would be a lot of work. Oh yeah. Um, so the insights from the playground, that was my publisher's idea. And she just thought it would be good for me to have it to tie it together and sum it up. And originally she wanted that to be. A lot more words than it was. And for the kids interviews to be fewer words and it, and I just, that didn't feel right to me. So I just changed the ratio, but I understood the purpose of the insights of the urban playground as I wrote it, you know, more and more of them that it's kind of tying together with the kids said, and it's sort of, it's like mirroring them in the way I was just talking about in person, doing it in the book, right? So somebody just shared a story. And if a child's reading that story with one of their significant adults, they are, then, you know, they hear whatever the story is, or they read whatever the story is, and then they see this adult, the author kind of validating and normalizing whatever the story is for the child and connecting it to the author's understanding of the city. So the research about the city was not really hard. Like sometimes I said what the population is or, you know, whatever, but that was pretty, I mean, I've lived here since 99. So a lot of it, I just kind of know. But, and then the five questions, the really important thing there was just imagining could be anybody. I mean, it could be kids talking to each other, but imagining kids and adults talking to each other about these questions, because one of the things that came out repeatedly in my interviews with kids, if the parents were observing or listening in is that it's, and this was exactly my publisher's idea. I mean, she really came up with the concept is that even the adult who knows, the parent who knows their child so incredibly well as most parents do, may not ask a question in a certain way that will elicit a certain answer. So I had a lot of parents go, oh, I had no idea. I had no idea that they were thinking that or that they were still thinking about it or whatever it is. So that's what I love about the questions is I feel like they can have that time together to explore based on something. Why would the parent ever think to ask this question? Because it came out of some story they hadn't heard before. So, you know, it's like once they hear it and they can just read the question that's there, the hope is that different conversations emerge. Yeah, I wonder, have you had, have you gotten any feedback? It sounds like something like this could bring, you know, the parents and the kids closer together. Have you had any feedback about that? I have. I mean, I've had parents say to me, I mean, definitely when I was leaving, they would say if they were listening what, you know, what I was just saying, but I've also had, and I was telling you about this the other day that there was a parent who said, oh, my, one of the kids in the book had a show and tell with his school over Zoom recently. And he said, oh, I have a chapter in this book. And I don't know what he said, but his dad said, he's fun quite a tall tale about how he got into the book. So I'm just like, I hear things like that where they just, yeah, there's some follow up, like the book's life goes on and on without me. And once in a while, I'll get some feedback about something the kids said about it. That's great. I love it. And I forgot that you knew that we're so old that you have lived there that long and that you know the city that well. And then I was just thinking about, you know, was there, I know you broke the book down into different themes and, there are one or two themes in particular where they, you know, wanted to talk more about it than others. Did you, did you find that? Yeah. So the 10 themes were family, favorite foods, hero, favorite holiday, pets, school, sports, talents, vacation and work. And holidays were a big one. So when I talked to kids, I'm trying to think if anybody on this call, I don't have any holiday kids on this call. If I talked to them about holidays, I always asked them if they could invent a holiday, what would it be? And I just, I was like, how long have you been thinking about this? I mean, every kid I asked have this really specific holiday and a name for it and the rituals. And as, as another journalist asked me in one of my interviews, or as she pointed out, she said they're always in their pajamas, like whatever the invented holiday is, like they get to run around in their pajamas. Um, and, uh, which I guess they do now have a holiday. But, um, so, uh, so holidays were a big one because they just, it's like they had it all mapped out before I asked. Um, and then, um, work was also same thing, like just a very, very clear image of what they wanted to do for work and all the details about it. I mean, you could just tell they've been thinking about it for either for a long time or just a lot in a concentrated period because they had a lot to say about work. Well, and what were the age ranges of the interviewees was, um, that's amazing to know what they want to do. So, so young. I know five to nine. And it wasn't even, I don't think I talked to anybody who wanted to do what their parents did. Like it wasn't even that. It was like they had this idea of something that they just wanted to do. And they were so clear and detailed about their plan. Well, that's impressive. Um, Oh, I know. So how many kids did you interview? Um, Well, I interviewed. So originally the book was going to be, um, kids in cities around the U S. So I interviewed about 65 or so kids before my publisher called and said, we need to change it because the sales team was thinking it would be better to do San Francisco because you lived there since 99. So I interviewed about 65 and then only a handful of those were San Francisco. So I kept those interviews. Um, Like Sarah, I think I interviewed Sarah in the first go round. Um, And then just got a bunch more San Francisco kids. Um, And then from the, from the San Francisco only group, I think it was like 55. So I took most of them. Um, And they all ended up on the website, but, um, yeah. Yeah. And did you like, from when you started this to like the last interview, like, was there anything that, that you learned? I don't know about, but just about the interviewing process or even the writing process. And also I know for me, especially during the pandemic, I've been reading a lot. And I feel like I don't want, I never want it to end. Like I kind of get sad. And so I'm wondering if the writing process is the same, like where you, where were you sad when you finished? Um, so I, let's see. So the first one is what, um, did I learn about, I had two answers for that one. Um, I'm blanking on the first one, but the second one is just learning about kids in general. Um, and I already knew this, but I think it's so amazing just talking to so many. It's like the second you start talking to a kid, you're like, I kind of know what they're going to do when they grow up or like, I know, you know, like you really kids really have their own personalities. Anybody who's been part of a family or, you know, I mean, knows that, but it's just so remarkable. Like having talked to so many, it's like, or even if you don't know what they are going to do, it's like, they're just, it's like that kid is a scientist. That kid is an artist, you know, and it's so clear. And it's so amazing to me that any parent would steer their kid in one direction or another, because it's so obvious to me like this is what this kid is. Like this is, you know, like, um, so that's the first one about, um, and I'll have to come back to the, there were two answers I had for that. I'll have to think of the other one, but, um, and then the, I was not sad when it ended because it was a ton of work. So, um, it was really fun and I'm really glad. Oh, I know my answer. The other one might be just this triggered it. So I learned a ton and I'm really glad that we first had a B us city kids because when we changed it, I wasn't even upset that I had already done 65 interviews because one of the things I learned is, um, so my nieces and nephews, if they lose a tooth or they like grow, you know, they do the measurement and they've grown or whatever, they want their parents to FaceTime me so they can tell me. So I thought, Oh yeah, I've got to do one about getting bigger. Like that's a big deal. Getting bigger is a big deal. So that was one of my categories at first. And it was such a non start. It was like a total flop as a question. Like, even though they get excited about the new teeth and all that stuff, like there was just nothing to talk about. So I was like, this is fine. If we start over cause that, that's how I got holidays cause I replaced bigger with holidays. Um, and it was a lot of fun to do this. And I loved the organic process cause it just started from the inside out. Like I, I practice law. So a lot of people, it's like, a lot of these kids have mothers who are lawyers. I mean, it just like started where I was and grew out from there. And San Francisco's, you know, like a lot of cities, it's like, it's geographically small, but it has a lot of people, but it's like concentric circles, you know, so just kind of crap, you know, had tentacles like that. And, um, so it was fun to watch the way it progressed just from who heard about it and, you know, how they got involved. Um, but yeah, by the time it was over, it was like, okay, that was a ton of work and a concentrated period of time. And I was sort of trying to write as I was doing the interviews. And then in the last three months, it was just a mad dash. And, um, yeah, I'm glad that that part of it is behind me. I love, love the honesty. Um, yeah, it's weird too. Like for people who are watching, like I said, Katie and I would just just, like, we, you know, we probably only seen each other a handful of times physically in the last 20 years, but it always sticks out to me. Like, and that's why, like I, this book isn't much of a surprise to me because Katie is just such a kid at heart. And I feel like she's always smiling and energetic and happy. And kind of like, regardless of what's going on, you know, and obviously she said she has a lot of responsibilities being a lawyer, but I know that she still appreciates like the little things. And when we get together, it's like, we're just, it's nonstop talking and laughing. And so I was thinking about this book, um, for me and just how, like, sometimes I do struggle as an adult to kind of, you know, to kind of, you know, I think Katie does such a good job of tapping into. So I thought, like, is this something that, like, do you feel like it's something that parents could get something out of too to just kind of retap into that innocence again? Like, you know, I feel like I want to read the book cover to cover. Just after reading, you know, a few of the stories, you know, I feel like I want to read the book cover to cover just after reading, you know, a few of the stories and I felt like I wanted to answer, you know, so is that, I know it's, is that part of your goal or would you be happy if people walked away feeling that way? Yeah, I hope they do. Cause I mean, and that's what I love about the questions is that they really have an opportunity to turn to their kids and ask these questions. Um, they're just helpful questions because, you know, like I said before, they come from another kid's story. So the parent would not necessarily have a reason to think to ask a particular question that I asked in the book, because all the questions came from something a different kid said. So I, that was the hope is that people will turn to their kids and ask these questions. Um, and in terms of staying young and kid at heart, that would be such a cool outcome of this because I mean, thank you for making that observation because it's definitely true of you too. That's why we laugh all the time and it's, it's, it is true and it's important to me. And I think it's the reason, you know, I am the person, you know, when kids come into a room, it's like, there she is, you know, it's like, you know, and it's that it's, I just, I do love to stay young with kids and I do, I'm such an observer about the world and really curious. And, um, I, I would love to see, um, I love it when I leave one of these interviews and the parents are, you know, I mean, I had one where I think I was telling you about this on the phone the other night that the, the child's mother was sitting right next to him the whole time. And his answers were just so funny. And she was doubled over laughing and he kept looking at her. He's like, what? And she's like, you're just so cute. So yeah, I love when things like that happen. Yeah. So I guess that leads me into like my, my final question though, even though you did say it was like a lot of work and, um, do you have plans like for another book or what's next or, um, and are you still, I forgot to ask, are you still doing your newspaper, the column is that. Yes, I still do the column. So I've been doing the column for two years and it's very similar. In fact, I started taking the questions that I made for the book and using those for my column interviews. So that column is the Noe Valley voice where I profile, um, different Noe Valley kids every month. And it's, it can be all the kids in a family or one kid, you know, whoever wants to do it, it's the kids in a family. And, um, I do still do that once a month. And I do want to do another project. So originally when COVID-19 came around, I really wanted to do a project called something like kids and COVID-19. So I started interviewing, trying to think if I interviewed any of these four, I don't think I did, um, but I interviewed some of the kids I've interviewed before and some new kids about their experience sheltering in place. And, um, it's, it's, oh, you know what, I did, maybe I did talk to one of the kids on this, I think I did. Um, it's hard because they're so bored, a lot of them, and they can't talk to their friends as, you know, I mean, they're talking to them on zoom, and they, and some of them are seeing their friends a little bit more. But when I was interviewing them, it was really strict shelter in place. And, um, it just wasn't making for great material because they were so bored and they were having such a hard time. And then everything happened with George Floyd and the, you know, um, the protests and everything like that. And I thought there's a bigger topic to explore. So it's just been in motion. And I've been talking to, there's a school in Oakland that I'm talking to about, um, some kids there who want to, who want to, um, their English is second language, their Latinx kids and they want to learn to read on my book. And there might be a community project there. So it's very, it's, there's a lot of swirl right now because it's not clear what I'm going to do. Like I've thought about another book or a podcast or something. So I'm just kind of putting, you know, like I thought I knew exactly what it was going to be. And now it's just kind of putting different things out there and then paying attention to what comes back. Well, good luck. I can't wait to see what the next project is. And wait, I think there are, there's, we just opened up chat. There's definitely a question in here. Oh, it was, um, how did you source the children? Um, and how did you decide on the ages? Yeah. So I decided on the ages first. Um, and I just was thinking, um, I, I just love five. I love five year olds. And I thought anything younger would just get a little bit silly. So it was like, you know, we'll start at five. And then I just thought, let's have a range that's not too big. Um, because then it's just a, it's a different book each time you turn a page. So I just kind of thought, you know, with my brilliant math skills, I thought that was a four year range. It's actually five. Um, but you know, like it just, it's, it totally worked because if there'd been a 10 year old in there, it would have been a different book. And, um, so that's how I did the age thing and the, um, yeah, and sourcing the kids. I mean, it really was like a bunch of people whose moms were lawyers and then people heard about it, like on moms, internet groups, Facebook groups, things like that. Um, and then just, yeah, people would just, at a certain point, I didn't have to keep looking. People would just reach out to me and say they'd heard about it. So that helped a lot. And I was always trying to make it as diverse as I could, um, which actually turned out really well. Like I, I, I was a little concerned because the timeline was so fast between when I signed the contract to write the book and when it was due. Um, but it just, it kind of worked out. So, um, yeah. Love it. Thank you. Does anyone else have any questions? I didn't see anything else in the chat. Oh, and the last one, you already answered that just about does, do you have any more books in the works? Oh, no pressure, no pressure. Well, thank you so much both Katie and Nicole. I really appreciate it. Katie, please pass on my thanks to the kids as well. I really enjoyed the book. I got such a kick out of reading it. I laughed out loud multiple times. The kids were so cute. I could see why their moms were proud. And thank you everybody who tuned in. I really appreciate your support as well. I'll be putting the recording up on YouTube. So I will send out a link to that to all the participants. Everybody registered. So thank you both so much and good luck. Stay safe. Stay healthy. Thank you, Jessica. Thanks Janet. Thanks to cool. Hi Katie.