 Aloha and welcome to Think Tech Hawaii. You are watching the State of the State of Hawaii on Monday, September 27th, 2021. I'm your host for the show, Stephanie Stoll Dalton. Our topic today is the Eurasian Center. This non-government organization builds positive relations, cultural understandings, and promotes economic development among the nations of America, Europe, and Asia. As we know, Hawaii is geographically located in the middle of Eurasia and has natural interest in this organization's transactions and presumably more some potential for more participation in its initiatives. The Eurasian Center's educational outreach also may be a resource for Hawaii's aims to diversify and strengthen its economy and support America's global participation. Now, our guest today is from the Eurasian Center, an officer of the organization, and his name is Ralph E. Winnie, Jr. He is Vice President of Global Business Development or the Eurasian Business Coalition and Director of China, the China Project in the Eurasian Center. He is also a partner here in Washington, D.C. of Henson Pang and Winnie International Law Firm, which is also located in Shanghai, China. So more importantly, Ralph is a local boy, a former wrestler on a winning Punahou team back in the day. So welcome Ralph to the program. Thank you, Stephanie, glad to be with you. Thank you, thank you for taking the time. Well, I'm gonna start by asking you just to talk a little bit about what is the Eurasian Center and your role in it? And then maybe the mission too. So if you could just make it clear what you all do. Yeah, the Eurasian Center was founded in 1987 by Dr. Gerard Janko, one of Gorbachev's energy ministers in a Soviet dissident as a way to promote people-to-people exchanges, relationship building during the time of Perestroika and Glassnod. Around the time of Mikhail Gorbachev's reign as president of Russia, and he was looking to do outreach to improve the relationship between the Soviet Union and the United States. So the Eurasian Center was formed as a center for Soviet-American relations as a way to promote people-to-people exchanges and relationship building. And then after all of the Soviet Union in 91, the name was changed to Eurasia to incorporate the former Soviet blood countries. And Europe and Asia. I was brought on board to handle China. I had spent about a year and a half studying in Russia at Moscow State University. And I learned the language and I studied law and business there. And then worked in Washington DC for a boutique trade law firm that I rep office in China, which took me to China quite often. And Dr. Janko asked me to come on board and help develop our China programs as a way to bridge the divide between the US and China that was starting in the late nineties into the 2000. What our center tries to do is to not only publish scholarly work, but to create an environment where people can come together and create positive discourse and dialogue. And to break down cultural, religious barriers so people can feel comfortable engaging and promoting their ideas in a positive environment. And we look at our role as a bridge to create public partnerships between the US, China, Russia and Central Asia and develop personal and professional relationships that is going to lead to positive discourse not only on the political, but on the business side as well. And having been born and raised in Hawaii, I really take those values to heart when I'm engaging with people in China, Russia, Central Asia who have a very positive impression of Hawaii but not necessarily of the United States per se and trying to impart what a wonderful country US is and how exceptional our country is. I was very inspired by Reagan's belief that the US was that shining city on the hill where people would come and escape political religious oppression and be able to come. And if you worked hard, you could make your mark. And I believe that my role with the Eurasia Center is to really help and grow and develop these relationships, not only in a personal but on a professional level and create long-lasting relationships. And our center has done things not only like art exhibitions, we brought the Bella Leica performers over, we've done Japanese sushi parties, we've done, I was an emcee for a fashion show and we also do various conferences focused on the Silk Road Initiative, US and China, US and Russia and global business developments to grow and promote small and medium-sized businesses. We love to work with delegations that come over from Russia, China and Central Asia who are looking for potential business partners. That's very rewarding for me personally. Yeah, now I know that you are not the first organization or initiative to do this kind of outreach. Are you from the US or are you? I mean, in other words, that's a very striking arrangement that Dr. Janko prepared for. Right, he had a vision. Yeah. We have the Eurasia Center make its mark, not only within the United States, but globally as a way to bring people together. If you grew up during the Cold War, you remember the tensions that existed, especially with the Cuban Missile Crisis, the situation with Afghanistan, the downing of the Korean airliner. Intentions were very, very high. And one of the ways that you could break down those barriers was to focus on culture and the arts as a former wrestler. I bring that perspective with my involvement with US Wrestling Foundation, which took me to Cuba. And one thing that I learned from being in Cuba is that wrestling is popular in places where the United States is not. And when Americans go over there representing the US Wrestling Team, they are treated with the utmost respect. They're treated as honored guests. And it allows us to really impart the values of the United States to help develop and promote relationships at that personal level that the government of a country like Cuba will recognize. Iran is another country. If you remember when the US Wrestling Team went to Iran for the World Cup, they were the most popular team. When they arrived at the airport, I kid you not, they were moved to the front of the line to go through customs, except they couldn't go through customs right away because all the customs agents wanted their pictures taken and to share their stories with the wrestlers and the coaches. And it's this kind of bonding that you wouldn't normally expect. And our center is really at the focus of trying to break down the governmental, religious, and barriers that really are a threat to creating global peace, harmony, and bridge building, which is really important. Well, so as you, it seems like your work, you're coming at it from a number of different levels. So this bottom up thing with the relationship development and the youth and the athletes and all those places that it's easy to relate across cultures and national barriers. And then you're coming in also above that with business ventures and that has, so how do you roll all this up that might have a possibility of affecting the ethos or the, the... Well, you started that, you start at the personal level. I always say when I go to China, the very first meeting that you have with the Chinese is key. They're checking you out to see if you're someone that they can do business with. So that very first meeting, you're not talking about business, you're getting to know each other, and you're talking about your friends and your family and what your, what your hobbies are, and everyone is trying to get comfortable with each other. You find... Once you do that, then you can take it to the next level because the Chinese, like the Russians, like the Iranians, they're taught to be very wary of foreigners and you have to get over that mindset, that mentality and be able to move to the next level as a respected and trusted friend and partner in order to be able to do the business deal. So do you find that America is a little less friendly or competent on that, making that personal contact? I mean, that's what I've noticed every time is that, yes, the other countries and the other people socialize at that personal level a lot initially, and for those points that you made to find out who you are and what you do and what kind of person you are and what your interests are and kind of like assessing what is, what are you here for and what are your bags. But, and I find that maybe America doesn't spend that much time on that business, that entry, is that an issue? Well, I think having grown up in a mix of Asian, you know, Western civilization, if you want it, for a better word, I understand how important that personal relationship is. Whereas if you come to the mainland, you know, it may all be about the contract. It just depends on the situation that you're in, the cards that you're dealt with. But I always feel, no matter what situation you're in, try and develop a personal rapport with the person on the other side of the table. Don't lecture them, don't presume to think that you know everything about them. Listen, be a very good listener and hear what they're saying. And that's what I would have told Tony Blinken. I mean, when he went in and lectured the Chinese, you can't do that. You've got to be respectful. You've got to listen. You have to stand your ground on certain things. But don't go in and start lecturing people if you don't have a personal relationship with them. So the Secretary of State did lecture them? Are you referring to what was a televised readout of as well? Yeah, when the American delegation showed up in Alaska, the Chinese perceived as they were being lectured by the US side. When we have issues that the Chinese would say in our country that we need to address, when there are riots in the streets based on racial inequality, then we're going out and telling other countries how to do things. That's how it was perceived. Now, I do think if you look at our system where people have stood up and fought, whether it's the civil rights workers from the 60s, they worked within the system using the media, using the courts to be able to affect positive change. And that's what we show. And we should be continuing to show the world that if you work within the system, that you can affect the change that you're looking for, that you don't need a physical revolution like exist in other countries. But you can work within the system to affect positive change. So can you give some examples of what working within the system is? So you're talking about the system of the other party out of your own system. What does that really mean in print? Well, when we go to China, we take clients over, we encourage them to work with a trusted partner on the ground that can help them navigate the system, legal, political, and regulatory, to be able to get their project completed and to be able to register their patents under Chinese law. We can point to the successful outcome of Michael Jordan's lawsuit when his Air Jordan shoes were being compromised by a Chinese competitor. What he did is he hired a Chinese law firm and a Chinese media firm to take up his case and then one. We look to the example of Singaporean Chinese that have won their cases in Chinese court. This is not to say this is easy to do business in China, but you have to be able to do it the right way. And that's why we have a very strong law firm, IPO-paying, Shinkulaw that's on the ground that helps clients every step of the way to get established in China and to be able to know that they're in good hands when they come, that they will have a trusted viable partner and they'll be helped to the legal, regulatory, and political situation that they'll have to deal with. And conversely, when you have Chinese and Russian companies and Central Asian companies coming to the US, they've got to feel like the system here is transparent so that they can be able to navigate the system, both on the political, legal, and regulatory. And that's always a challenge because of the different mindset and culture, but that's something that we at the Eurasia Center really strived for, to be able to help get everybody acclimated and to understanding how things are done here in the United States. So are you talking also about what it is to work within a situation of political risk? Because I know you all talk about developing an understanding of the political risk and what that context is. You are the only ones who really went gone with that. Well, political risk is important. You want everybody to realize that when they come to the United States that there are going to be challenges that are going to have to be overcome on the legal, regulatory, and political side and be able to prepare them appropriately even before they come. But once they're here on the ground, be able to think on your feet to be able to help them navigate through the system with a transparent legal, regulatory system that's in place. And that's what we strive to do at the Eurasia Center, not only working on the personal and professional level, but making sure that the people achieve the results that they're looking for. It's very challenging right now because of COVID, having to do everything over Zoom. And you cannot need face-to-face, press the flesh and shake hands for perfectly logical health reasons. But at the end of the day, people have got to be able to come together, sit down, talk, and engage personally and professionally in order to get things accomplished. Well, OK, those are definitely impediments. But presumably they're temporary. Yes, presumably. And get back to having the advantages of all of this momentum achieved through the personal relationship. I guess what I'm trying to get at is that when do you start bumping up against totalitarianism or communism? When do you start to bump up against that? How have you all learned or what do you all do about that encounter? Well, you have to know how to engage at the highest level. You have to have the right people in place that have the ear of a particular government. That can vouch for your bona fides, your credentials. And you have to be a very strong and powerful voice in terms of promoting your position. In many of these Central Asian countries, like Russia and China, you advance by being strong, physically, politically, and emotionally. You've got to be perceived as being strong. And having a wrestling background is very important because many of their former wrestlers, weight lifters, they all go into a profession where they are considered strong, powerful, respected people. So you have to have that position of engaging from a position of strength, not from a position of weakness. And that's where the US is going to have to look towards showing their engaging from a position of strength. That is going to be the key to achieving long lasting economic success and prosperity. And that's what Reagan saw. That's what Reagan pushed to do after he took over from Carter was creating an America that led by example that was strong and powerful and that helps their fellow men. Well, I mean, it's still a matter of then getting strong. And so, OK, so that everybody's working off of a powerful, a power base or a strength of their own, the strongest they can be. And then when it gets into the Hong Kong situation or what in China, I mean, it just seems I think that's such an interesting example where you're talking about having so much momentum there. But I mean, that is one of the toughest places right now to come up against the differences in the systems. Well, the business community will have a strong role to play in what kind of relationship they want to have with mainland China. How are they going to engage? How are they going to do business within New Hong Kong? So I think it's important for the business community to stand up and to lay out how they want to be able to engage moving forward in Hong Kong. That will put the Chinese on notice as to what the Western global corporate elites, if you want to say, use that term, think and how they're going to react once. So the global business community certainly has a strong role to play in the kind of system that they would like to see in place in Hong Kong. And they need to communicate that effectively not only to the Chinese government, but also to the US government. Well, and so that is something that you all advise and consult on, right, is the Eurasia Center, because people don't come like you're talking about Tony Blinken. I mean, that's just so disappointing to hear that he came at it in a way that might not have been simpatico with them, which just gets you in trouble right out the gate, right? But hopefully he'll be able to correct on that, especially. Right, for the good of the United States, absolutely. Because that's what you're going for is to get. So that was one of my questions is, where is all of this going? Where does the Eurasia Center, the big, big picture coming out at the end, where you've achieved all you can achieve? What will that look like? What I think is you're going to have to create a system where there's free flow of goods, trades, and services. We have appropriate trade rules and barriers in place. But at the same time, you have a viable global economy where people can engage on a personal and professional level to get things accomplished. Trump, whatever you want to say about him, he's not a politician or diplomat. He was a dealmaker. So what can you do for me? And that was his goal was to make the art of the deal, to make deals like he had with Mexico to keep these migrants in the country while they were filing their asylum claims. Who would have thought that he would have been able to orchestrate such an agreement with the nation of Mexico? We need, every country needs an influx of new immigrants. If you don't have that, your society is going to vanish and evaporate. At the same time, you cannot allow your borders to be overrun with people that could have nefarious intentions. So you have to maintain that balance. You have to have the rule of law respected. You have to have a level of compassion and empathy for people that are escaping a horrific past or a fixed situation and are coming here for a better life. So that's what we have to strive for is the right balance and ensuring that we are moving forward, promoting the United States as the bastion of free market democracy, and to promote economic trade and development so that we can grow and lead the world in a very positive way. We would like to get back to doing that again. Now, your level, you work at the level of the nation, the nation level. I mean, that's your connect at that level. Is that how it goes? We work with all different stakeholders. It could be small business. It could be corporations. It could be people in government. It could be sportsmen. It just depends on who engages with us at any given time. And you have to be comfortable at all levels. And you have to know and understand what people are looking for. That's why I say you have to be a very good listener. That way you can understand what is on people's mind. What is going to help them? What can you do to help them achieve their goal? So in the case of the state of Hawaii, can it get from a resource such as you all are and all international? Can it strive to make a connection that would be working together with you all on doing things for itself that gets its economy strengthened and diversified, which contributes to the US being more connected globally? What would that look like? That could be out of the government if somebody wanted to. Well, as you know in Hawaii, everything is relationship-based. The trust and respect that people have. You have to start at the very basic level and develop those connections through the personal familial network into the state government and being able to have trusted allies, partners in state government that are going to be open-minded to any kind of plan that you put forth to grow and develop the state of Hawaii because they're very entrenched networks of people. And Hawaii does things their own way. They don't like to be told how to do things. So you have to have that degree of respect and trust when you're proposing something before people will come around and support and endorse it. Well, certainly Hawaii has a tremendous amount of opportunity working with various stakeholders in the public and the private sector. And we need to look at bringing in more delegations from China, Japan, Russia, Central Asia. And I think when they loosen the restrictions on quarantine, I think it will be a boon to Hawaii. If you can get more of these tours coming over where people come on vacation but then open it up where they're able to be exposed to potential business opportunities that would help grow small business in the state of Hawaii. Because that's the engine of growth is small business. And they're the ones that are hurting right now. So we've got to create new markets of opportunity for small business in Hawaii. Exactly. So that small business level is really important to embrace and build up. So is that maybe going to happen? Where's the incentive for that going to come from? How does that start happening? People watch this program and think about, hey, well, this is a way to get started. But what can happen? Well, I hope people are watching this program and will call in with ideas. Right now, so many businesses have shuttered people have moved to the mainland because of the lockdown. So what we have to do is focus on bringing people from other states, other countries, bringing new market share, new ideas, new business opportunities to the state of Hawaii where we can help grow and develop small business, working with our allies in the state government in a way that's respectful to the state and recognizes Ohana, recognizes the important contributions of the Hawaiian people and the land. All of this has to be taken into account when someone that's a foreigner comes to the state of Hawaii. This is sent through. Well, you know it well and have stated it as it needs to be. And hopefully, we will be able to go that way and make a difference. I know there are many ideas about how to diversify and strengthen this economy. And we need all of them. And hopefully, we can use some influences such as you all bring to it to help. I think we're getting close to wrap up time. So I wanted to say, is there any final comment that you'd like to make about the Eurasia Center and its work here in this program? I'm just very excited about things moving forward. I think once we bring this virus under control, you're going to see everybody want to get out and engage and look for opportunities to grow and develop, not only on a personal level, but their business. Nobody likes to be cooped up and kept and confined away from friends and family. They want to get out and they want to innovate and create and engage. And so I'm really looking forward to talking with people, moving forward and seeing what the Eurasia Center can do to help grow and develop personally and also professionally, especially in the state of Hawaii, which I'm so fond of having been born and raised. Yes, yes. Well, it's a little hot time now for us and we'll have to wrap it up. So thank you to our guest Ralph E. Winnie Jr. Asquire for this information and these ideas about how the Eurasian Center is a resource for the world, but it's also a resource for our state. And now to know about the way it goes forward to have an impact internationally, that's also some learning that's very helpful. So I'm your host, Stephanie Stoll Dalton. This is the program on think tech, the state of the state of Hawaii. And I'll see you next time. Mahalo everyone for watching.