 First on the agenda is to approve the agenda anybody have anything they want to add Modify I Didn't know if we Should have something for Neil Fox if anything happened with Neil. I think he was gonna come to the next so I Talked with him this morning and he said he's been talking with people from the state He's not prepared to do anything yet, but he is on the agenda or actually we will do a Board of Health meeting at 530 our next meeting we'll have a pre meeting at 530 for the Board of Health Where he will be here with some information that he's okay, whatever he's done now Yeah Do we need to do anything for Jose in terms of that decision for his grant he's gonna be on he's got an appointment for the next Me. Oh, yeah, is that coming in time? Because he saw me where he worked and he told me we had Something to do something tonight. We're going to get his paperwork All right, I'll accept the motion to accept the agenda as Okay, all in favor All right public comment inquiry, this is the spot if there's Nothing on if there's something on not on the agenda that you'd like to bring up. This is the time to do it The capability that's here does have an agenda spot. So you're yeah, you're right on here Stacey We do have our first point for 30 years, so we'll get you in and out. I want to wait another 15 minutes So Stacey want to talk about his property So I guess we'll have to clarify what what you're looking for Like When it comes to water water and sewer that can be done here because we act as the water and sewer board But when it comes to taxes that would have to be done just through through a different So also so with your So right now your water is not hooked up right So that shut off So I believe what's happening right now just talking with Theresa and Greg today is From the date that it was shut off from the event you won't receive any bill for that I can't remember what the exact date was but it happened just inside them This next quarter September 24th, so you won't be billed for the whole quarter as right now what you would see would be Well, what needs to happen is that the ordinance actually allows for a Interruption or termination of service so the water commissioners can do that in an emergency situation They don't have to tell you that they're doing everything You just have to do it So that's really what we need to do most likely what we really because are you gonna build another home there anytime soon? So we're basically we will terminate the water service to that That property and it will be able to build it all And it'll be from the date the day established, which is most likely that September 24th So it's not necessarily gonna be an update, but I think it's more just a Termination of the service and as water commissioners you can do that. So does that sound like what you're looking for? So I guess at this point what we can be doing It's almost to make a motion would be to Determinate the water and sewer services first the property add to 286 South Main Street From the date in which the emergency happened into the foreseeable future I'll make that motion. Okay. Second Y'all there All right So what you'll see on your final bill will be a prorated amount that trees will put together just up to that 24th date And then from then on out here Except what you know, yeah, yeah, no future going So if that's what you want to do we need to actually do an interruption of service Which is just more of a temporary kind of thing you can't it just basically the code says that you Will you decide to turn it back on it's like 25 dollars to reconnect to the Okay, so that's what you really want to do We maybe need to reword that is to amend that to say any interruption of service unnecessarily a termination Okay, so maybe that's what we either way I think We can make it happen. We do it this way and then if something changes down the road Then we can Regardless if it's interrupted or terminated at this point Right that Because we're kind of running on the code section talks about the right emergencies Which is what this was it says if it's if it requires a shut-off due to the emergency It's responsible to pay a 25 dollar reconnection The main thing right now is it just doesn't want to be built so he essentially We all set that So we all Got the long run out email chain as it's as fast as we can have With the e911 numbering system You want to kind of take us up the speed of what we're well learn now? We've set it up, but all in all they did a pretty good job Where it starts in the intersection Intersections he is on the right On the left Number two 16, I think, that had to change. Well, then the backlash came of even though 16, that you've got to change your nine-on-one address. You don't think much about it, you start changing your license, all your billing, all the tax skills, and then everybody started complaining. So, Greg and I have talked three or four times about this or that, which is the way we go. We are done correct for the way nine-on-one states you have to do is when they change tax. And I have made the recommendation that if Royalton was going to change, they should really go scrunch a little bit better, because even though it's north to south, they go up the north road with nine-on-one, nine-on-one percent of the time to go to a call in Royalton. They don't have all the way around 12 and that type. But they already had the gears to work, parents signs the order, everything's done. Well then, you know, I get it. So they kind of fought back and forth and they sent out a second letter to the residents and then there was more of them. Well, then I didn't think a whole lot about it, so I got the last email, which I don't think all got with the yellow. And I like how many roads now they're looking to change. It's not one or two, there's 15, 20 roads they want to redo every three years. So when we, I didn't see any of that. No, we didn't get that. So when we say they, who's they? Is it the state, is it? It's a little, one of them from the state of the mausoleum, Tyler Hermanson, yeah, Hermanson, or maybe any of some of the casters, I thought no one was going to be here to explain it, because by, it's kind of conflicting, like in one email it says, we really don't have anything to do with our breath. But then in another email, he says, well, the state can do that. John St. Road, East Mellon Road should be changed. Arnold Road, the Stinson Road should be changed. Bishill Road should be changed. Tyler William Road should be changed. Music Mountain Road, Gay Hill should be changed. Willysville Road, the Stock Bridge and Mellon Road should be changed. Or Rue Crawford should be changed. More roads. Those are the highlights one, there's another, you know, they're going on that. Tcho Hill, Tcho Hill, KM Road, Rochester, Mellon. Where do you stop? And what confuses it all is the mailing address. Because Bethel happens to be the home of the male. Everybody in Barnard, rural delivery, says that Bethel belong. So, you know, they said, like let's say someone didn't know where they lived, or was staying at the house and didn't know, and they had a call. And they looked at their mail and said, well, six North Road, Bethel belong, because that's the mailing address. So they're going to call Bethel Park. But that would be in Barnard. We're upright. The fallacy of that is the fact that the North Road and Barnard fight or share greater systems. We both, if I had to pick a number, it's a mid 90% that listed each other constantly. So we know that. As long as I can remember, the only issue we ever had years and years ago was actually the method for where Bethel was. There was a sugar house, Hill Road, in Barnard, which is the old San Francisco area. And ladies had a method of shooting whoever was there didn't know where they lived. So they picked up a piece of mail and said, well, 295 Sugar House Road, Bethel belong. Well, before anybody even moved, stayed this back and had to figure it out. Because we have sugar Hill Road. So there was maybe 30 seconds of confusion. There has been a confusion in other towns. And my feeling is right now, I just hope that someone from the state can be here. Because I really think we're open and Pandora Fox. And think, in your own mind, if I told everyone to you right now, you've got to totally change your address. But that really means you have to change. You know, it's not just going out and getting a new red sign, it's everything. Because that's your mailing address. So, you know, everybody has input. It's not my call by any means. And when it started on this thing, my first thought was that it was a call that wasn't frozen, they couldn't do it. Well, they were trying to find this address. Well, the 9-1-1 lack of a little address wasn't posted on the house, wasn't posted on the property. So they weren't able to find it, mostly, because it sounds like they were right there. Maybe it was within, that he did it, right? And they just didn't have a sign. That's why it wasn't posted out, so they didn't get to where they needed to go. That really is under my initiative. I thought it would be a better idea. In the past, we said, we'll do it again this year, as we did. My view is, if any town is going to invest time, they need somebody to go street by street, house by house, and see who actually has their 9-1-1 sign up, and is in a location where emergency services can see it. And a good share of the time, the problem always is, there's no sign. Now, you can run it by the numbers, just like I said. That's the way we do it on fire. We have a call on Camp Elbow. It starts from Camp Brook, because that's the main road, not the Willysville Four Corners. So the numbers start out there. So if it's 1-7-8-5 Camp Elbow, we know it's 1.7-8-5 miles from the intersection, down the road, it's going to be on the left, because it's an odd number. So you can work your way there. And what happens is, Barnard comes from 0 to 6,000, and then Willysville started at 0 to like 3,000 or 4,000, and then Bethel goes from 0 to 900, maybe the other way. So I don't see how us changing our 16 addresses is going to really affect them. This is my biased opinion. If it's not broken, I'll fix it. But I also don't know what the state's going to do. That's why I was hoping they're going to be here tonight. I thought you got that last email, because we CC'd it through with it, but you didn't get it with the whole list that they want to change. And there's a couple like the end of Fish Hill. There's two houses in Bethel that stack over at zero. Okay, those two maybe you could change. But what's interesting is in the fiery world, if we got called to Fish Hill, might we be in reaction to any requirements told out Randolph and Randolph Center, mutually instantly, because they're going to get there before us anyway. I don't know why they did certain things certain ways. You go out, there's a white boat plane, which is actually a Royalton, right by the substation, going up 107 out of town. Royalton has all those, Sequential. And then Pat McCann, who lives in Bethel, his is Sequential with them. So it's kind of a mixed match. And now with road changes, you'll like the, we call it, they call it Rochester Mountain. Who's going to change? They're doing the same thing with Route 14. So it was Route 14, going to be consecutive, where it comes in the state of Vermont all the way to the northern border. So you get out north, are you, 107,481, that's what I don't know, you know, how they can, yeah, at this point, there's nothing meant, in some earlier emails from the E9111, they said that we're not required to do anything at this point, but they just don't recommend it. So all the time and effort that Kelly put in and all of that stuff, how did that all come to pass? What triggered all that happened? Well, I would think you would have been involved in any of the discussions. So we had the incident out there where, in Royals, they couldn't find any of this. And she got an email from this guy from the state, from the E9111, he's our kind of coordinator, he worked with all five to make sure we're numbering correctly and all that. Saying that there was this issue and we need to re-number, Royals is going to be re-numbering, so we need to re-number to make it work. So we just kind of went with that, oh okay, but we're required to do this, while the law sign letters and all that work. And then we got an email from them that said, well, I think Kelly actually sent an email saying, are we sure we have to do this or are we required to do this? We were getting a little bit of a pushback. And then we got the email that said, you're not required to do it by any means, but we just recommend that you do it because it makes it easier for response. And that's what we've heard it really thinking about, this is even more of a plus of that time, we'd sent out that second letter saying this is going to happen. And we have 16, I think there's 16 addresses and we have eight or nine people that call us, so more than half the people of their response could play and that was significant issues that they had to work with here to get this fixed, because of their address change. So that's what we've heard it thinking, well, is it's really worth doing this. And then you get your email yesterday, I just saw yesterday, with all the yellow line, which shows 14 rows in town, but they're recommending that we re-number them all. So we're a little hesitant to pull the trigger on this because do we want to set that rest then happiness throughout town? It's not mandated, you know, if it ever becomes mandated then we'll do it. But at this point, we're just a little worried about setting that example and then talking with the chief, he doesn't have an issue with the way it's working now. We have an issue with the way it's working now. No, it's, you know, like the fireman called us since I was talking about it. When someone calls 911, we're a state dispatch. Both battle firemen were around. They have 911 mapping on the computer system and they knew they saw that the call was coming from fireman. You know, even though it's about a lattice and they're saying, well, this person's saying battle. And then instantly everybody was on radio saying it is fireman. You know, and Royalton uses Hartford dispatch, which they do a great job too. And, you know, what it really, again, I think falls back to is everybody's got to be more proactive on putting your 911 signs out. Now, I live on Gilead Brook. That's a Randolph mailing address. I carry a P.O. box of battle and that must make me even more confusing. As long as I've lived on Gilead, I've never seen anybody from Randolph call Randolph fire for a call up there. Where is it in? Pleasant Street and Battle goes all the way to the town line. They have a Randolph mailing address from Gilead North but there's also a Pleasant Street and Randolph. So, you know, it's just, I think until the state actually says, okay, what are we going to do? You know, I don't, I'm hesitant to change anything. It's not a process. It's a road, don't fix it. Right. And I would say I really was hoping that the state was going to have a representative here tonight to maybe shed some light in different directions. I think the way that I see it really is, you know, too pronged. If we're comfortable with the way our system is currently, and we feel like no single person is going to be left out on an emergency call and we're not being mandated by the state to do it, then we shouldn't, you know, no sense of fixing something that's not broken. It just seemed like to me when this was presented to us a month or two ago, that it was kind of like something we had to do. Like, you know, so it was kind of more like, you know, we have to do this and it kind of went by the board. So then I was a little taken back when I started seeing all the emails because I was thinking, well, we all knew there would be some people that would be unhappy, but this was something that had to be done so they're just going to have to live with it, but. And that was the impression we had originally. Right, and then when Mike went in to talk, I didn't know about it until lately. I didn't even know that it had come forward or anything until I started getting feedback from residents like that was my, I created a problem or something. And so that's why I went in and saw Calis and what's this all about. So she wrote a letter, her and I sat there and she wrote an email right back to Tyler. He wrote back pretty quick and said, well, you don't have to do anything. So we have North Road and then we have the other roads that was 13 miles. There's more that they're recommending to do. At this point, you know, those likely, what they kept giving for a reason was they kept saying it was the fire department. They said, well, what are you going to do if someone from Byron who lives on 6th North Road in Byron calls the fire department and they tone out that because they're reading their mail and saying that when you get into the what is that the beauty part is that the environment around the same one, you know, there's fire in every way. I think if someone saw there was a fire under their station, but the moralist too was 911 dispatch immediately gets the, comes up with their map. They know the fire is in Byron. So, you know, it's never been an issue for us. It never has. In modern times not changing anything. There are these things that they have. Right, Byron is, you know, and the way they say it works is South to North. So, if they're going to read your team, or else you're going to tell the officers they've got a plane called here and they're weird. That's my biggest hesitation is there's no precedent set. And it seems to be the fire department's never had an issue with so much as the medical. And in the medical world, there's so few roles anymore at work. You know, it's all helped and it's hired. But they do a pretty decent job. So I stopped and saw Matt Harris today who runs White River Valley. And he said he's totally fine with the way it is today. You know, they've had their mishaps before. They got called Mutual Aid to Royalton up on North Road to Russo. And that's a confusing one because Russo Road actually crosses North Road, which is kind of unprecedented. Usually when it crosses another road, they change the name. So what Royalton did was, if you look at the signs up there, now they actually put the 911 sequence numbers one way and the other. So you get a feeling of which way you're going. But I still say it's right back to signage. It's the number one thing. It's, you know. Well, I mean, I guess my two cents on the matter would be one, you know, it sounds like your department feels very comfortable with the system that's in place currently. The enemy, I mean, it's solely because words that's Mutual Aid. But we're also Mutual Aid with Royalton. You know, when they have a fire call on North Road in Royalton, they told us instantly because they know we'll get there before they do. I would just make the recommendation that, you know, right now the roads that we have in question, that we make sure that we understand each one of those roads and maybe talk with your counterparts on making sure that we have those gray areas covered if something did happen for now. I mean, I think that was... Which I know we have done. You know, they consider it to be like, you know where Halvin Road is and that one. It's right on top of Matt and Tosh Hill and over the other side. And it's a, I think there's two houses out there, maybe three now, that, so they change the airport name on it, once you have three houses you have to have a name for the street. Well, that connects through to Brainshire via the class four road that's totally impassable. And that is one of the roads that came up. You know, how do you sequentially do that? You know, because at Alvin Road, a brain tree doesn't pick up for probably another eight miles because there's nothing in between. Is there also something that we can do at the town level maybe... People can order their 911 signs for five bucks. Kelly orders them. Well, I was just thinking if maybe there was something we could do on, you know, maybe for now, just on those roads in question, on some sort of mailer, you know, making sure that they have, rather than having a representation from the town, go around all these roads and look to see if they have their address correct out there. Maybe if we had some sort of mailer we could send out to them. Well, I would suggest to say if you haven't, let's make sure that you have those. Yes, you did. Okay. Because you are responsible for your 911 sign. Right. If you don't have your 911 sign on, if you have a medical call or a fire call. Right. You know, everybody does the best they can. So we've been pretty proactive of that over the years and it's still a toughie. Right. But, you know, I'm just gonna say, if anybody, if any town's gonna invest a little bit of time, it should be a design that's not in redoing three quarters of the roads. So at this point we're gonna leave things the way it is, unless we hear otherwise from the state. Greg? Less than a minute at this point, yeah. If they be indicated, the entire state just gonna have to go through this. It's not just about them. It's every single town that has a connecting road with different names. There's all of a sudden gonna be under scrutiny. And it's a little frustrating to believe the way you come over the roads are they follow the record, the recordation of the state in the back of it. And we didn't. So now they're saying that's wrong, you know, remember them. And it's interesting, like I was telling you about Fish Hill, which starts over at zero at the far, when you go into that. Yet, some of the other roads, like Spooner Hill road, if you know what that is, when you come to the end of Spooner Hill road, that's back to Bethel again, but they made those numbers sequential. I don't know who did it back then or why. Right. Well, now once this one came through in what the early 90s are, that one came in the early 90s and they changed all those numbers. Okay, I mean, I would just say at this point, let's just make sure that we have, you know, we've touched base with our counterparts in the other towns to make sure that we, you know, like for instance, if Royalton is moving forward with renumbering theirs, let's make sure that we know what they're doing as well as those roads that we have in question. And the topic is they're pulling in the U.S. Postal Service into this, which had nothing to do with 911 to start with. Right. And now if you're saying that the way the rural mail delivery goes, it's gonna have precedence on how your 911 address goes, I don't think how you can make that work or at this stage as crazy as it is. Well, if we could do something in the town report or some kind of a reminder flyer, I assume everybody has gotten a 911 sign at some point. And there's so any new housing that's been built. Yeah, and we can also re-grade the visitors that they do to check and make sure that that has been put up. We already have a page designator assigned in town report, they're actually working on for this. Okay. Or half page, I don't know how big it is, but it's in there, it's in there. Sounds good. Any further discussion from the board? All right, well thank you. Thanks. Thank you for your voice. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I know, I'm sorry. Caspo. I was interested in the program because I was interested in the relationship between 911 and the postal service. And why did the postal service become one instead of before it was like that? Right, and then that's what's crazy about it, technically with the US Postal Service rural delivery, for our numbers, there's a duplicate environment. But it's the postal service, it's not 911. All 911 addresses are done correctly with the way 911 was set up for a door tap. The red and the white letters, yeah. So I think at this point, taking the page in the town report or maybe even doubling that up with a mail or something, like what he has there. What was it saying in the town report? It's just to reiterate the need for everybody to have their 911 signs posted so that whenever, yeah, so that when the first responders have to get there, they can find a place. Just a reminder for the, yeah, for the property owners on their responsibility to have their number located. And it'll say it under a building in the town so you can get them through us and just make sure they're posted. That's kind of what it's about. Yep. So we're gonna, I guess, sounds a little bit like we're gonna keep the number in the way, doesn't it? It's for us. Okay. Right, that's right. All right, we'll have a good evening. All right. Good evening. Have a good night. We are starting our first discussion for the coming budget season. And as usual, we kick it off at that time. So, you wanna take us through the trees? Well, I can just tell you I flex a couple of things. One is increasing your care. You know, I guess I just wanna start with a general applies statement about it. So first of all, the audit that we're going through right now, the expenses that could be controlled or controlled. You know, but what happens is when you have personnel that's been here for a while and see Jean Burnham retired, Pam came in, they were laughing for a little while. I came in, I'm not sure if my salary and or my health are sure. So it's certainly something that I'm taking into consideration for budgeting now is if you have someone who may or may not be retiring, you're gonna budget for that lead time. That way, if you don't use it, it stays there and it'll go to your undesignated fund balance, hopefully creating a surplus. So that's a big thing. And but there's always talk in every town about level funding. Obviously I've said repeatedly, I'm against that. There's certain things we can't cut anymore. You know, your electricity, you know, phone, things like that that are very difficult to control. There's not a huge part of the budget that you really can control. And Dave certainly knows that from schools. So what we also need to remember is we're budgeting 18 months out. So I don't know about you, but my crystal ball is a little bit, you know, rocky and a little bit cloudy. So what you wanna keep in mind is the fact that if the wheels come off the bus at some point that you have, a little bit of my distance in there doesn't mean it's gonna be spent just like we budget for salary increase. Doesn't mean someone's gonna get it, it just means we budget for it. So I guess what I'm saying is I want you to really think about that when you're moving forward, you know, through the budgeting process. Obviously we're not gonna bring another 10% increase to the voters, you know, like we did last year, but that was, we had to clean up that loan. You had some issues that we had to take care of. The other thing is I'm not sure certainly people, there are people who feel that the budgets maybe in the past weren't managed properly. Well, it's also because they weren't budgeted enough money. And I do think that it's going to take another year or so before we really know what it's gonna take to get the services that the voters want, whether it's roads, whether it's whatever. The other thing is too, everything that was left is in disrepair or it's broken or it's, you know, your water system is almost, it's more than half appreciated and this obviously needs a lot of work. Highway equipment is the same way. So it's not like the budgets were overspent and you were left in this really great situation. We're not. So, you know, I just want to be very bluntly clear about this moving forward that we will, you know, we need to present a realistic budget to the voters because I think by trying to level fund we've kicked every can down the road and then, you know, that's where we're at. So obviously we're, you know, really looking at that and we need to budget some in. You can certainly cut it in the end. It's your budget to bring with the voters but I just kind of wanted to say, this is where we're at. You know, we find any really great pots of money or anything like that. So that's one of the reasons that we increased the repairs, parts and tires lines from 41,000 last year to 50, trying to hold equipment longer. Plus it's, you know, poor Allen has, you know, had a lot of repairs and Brad could certainly speak to that. The other thing included in this budget is we know renting of a roadside mower, which is something that we, you know, we've been able to borrow sometimes from other towns but that's kind of tricky. Allen needed some more basic tools so we increased that line. The debt financing is down a little bit from last year. Like I said, it was going to be because we had that free. So the budget we have, we're looking at, this is a 5.14%. But the other discussion that you have to have here and I think this is Chris's and Greg is going to talk about this is, oh, we still budgeted for that 110,000 for highway rehabilitation. But I really think that that needs to come out of here and it needs to be, you need to do a two-part vote at town meeting and start a capital roads budget and then put this 110 in there because if you don't spend this 110,000 by June, it goes into the undesignated fund balance. So, you know, it's nice to have capital funds so that you can, you know, expense that money in and out or grants or whatever. So. No, and I'm not sure you wouldn't open session. I wasn't sure. Well, I don't know anything. Yeah, so I don't know. You can avoid it. Yeah. Yeah, right. Exactly. So then you can read the notes. I think you've got notes on the side, but certainly Greg, there's more. Question for you, trees. The, the 780 hours for Doug first. We should talk about that in the session. Well, we're discussing the budget, aren't we? So. Well, just the lead time. I'm not asking about his personal stuff. I'm just asking about that. No, I'm just saying that it's the same if you thought you had someone who may, you know, in any department, if you had anybody who you thought may retire or more. Right. If I could, if I could finish, I think I'd asked at some point in time about that a long time ago about when we had those big. Right. We had several that happened all at once. And the theory was that the money was actually there. Somewhere. Right. That was my. In theory, it was, it was taken out on a regular basis as time progressed. Yeah. All right. That's what I'm asking. That was an expense that we had not, well, that wasn't budgeted for. Well, my question, I thought it was because I thought it was looked into the accrued, you know, because we accrue what we, it's a bunch of. Right, right. But I guess it was not paid for only. It wasn't actually the cash, so. But that was fine. It was never really there. Yeah. Okay. That's what I was asking. Yeah, exactly. I was suggesting that we, that we budget for that. And of course you're never going to hit it. It's right, but in hopes that we can. Yeah. Yeah. The other thing that once someday when the federal has an unblessed being of fund balance, I know when Fred Diplissi's of Sullivan and Powers was here last year, he did recommend that we, you know, maybe set aside some of that for that reason, which would be nice. And then he wouldn't be showing those sorts of things in the budget. Mm-hmm. So I have a divergent question, but I don't want to leave this. No, no, I'm all set. No, I just, I wasn't concerned about doing dog, but I was just concerned about the concept. Slowly. So your recommendation about the $110,000 for the highway rehabilitation and sort of breaking that out and putting it into more of a capital fund. So two-part question. One is, would that be specific to public works? Yes. It would be capital fund for public works. And would that then cover things like when Greg comes to us saying, okay, we need new winter tires or the snowblowers? So that's not for the second- So the original thing we used for that line at the institute, we have a capital plan for fixing the roads, paved roads. We have an paved road plan, we don't necessarily have a capital plan at this point, but we have a capital, we have a paved road plan that was done through the study that we had done. And when they approved that fund, that was to fund those improvements on a yearly basis, not to collect those dollars and do those improvements as we had the funds bill. It was to do each one kind of a lot of time. So what we're proposing is that we take that out and it becomes a capital fund, which then any unused, any that's unspent gets carried over to the next year. So we can then do a capital plan, a long-range capital plan that'll tell us how we need to save or where we need to spend to make certain things happen. That never happened. It was just putting it as a line-hand instead of an actual fund that would be carried over. And then he wrote this in January. Yeah, sure, we could do it in a way that we would want those 10 per day. It would still be for the same purpose, in a sense, it's just held differently. The actuals. We already have a highway equipment fund. And then basically, you really don't want to take anything out of the capital fund. It's less than five grants and they'd appreciate it. But you do have a capital equipment fund. That's the perfect solution. You have equipment and you have roads and you know, fire has one. That's kind of the nice way to do it because then that money is always there because say you can't, you know, if I'm in a good place straight out, you know, you can't get them here by June, but they can come in October. You just said goodbye to a big chunk of change. And it just went into the- Well, and the roadmap is already there. But the way in which we fund it is not correct because for instance, Greg and I, you know, if you look at the capital plan that we have, you know, we're supposed to, this past year is supposed to fund it at like 110,000 and then next year it's supposed to be at like 160,000. Well, we had thought about not doing it. Well, there was a few things that we got ahead on. So we decided to instead of doing 110, the budgets that we're in now that maybe we would only do half of that and save. But what we found out is if we don't spend it inside that year, it doesn't carry over. So a lot of people actually have a fund for it. It goes back into the undexinated fund and we can't use it. So where did the 110 come from? Where did that number come from? It was a recommendation in- From that long-range plan. From the long-range plan. It'll show it. This is for doing like Sand Hill, for example. I think it was one of the long-term- Multiple runs. Yeah. The study covers all the paper that we took down. Yeah. But to your point, I'm taking like tiders and stuff out. What we're trying to do is make sure that the operation budget incorporates all those expenses. So we're not asking you for $2,000 right now. Okay. And that was sort of where I was going to do this. That's why we're trying to fund the rest of this budget correctly. It sounded like that was the direction it was going, but I was just trying to clarify how we were getting there. I think I'm following. So not only do we have to take that, we need to move that into its own fund, but we need to also re-look at it to see what that number is supposed to be. Yeah, I didn't think that entire capital plan that I did, it's not set in stone. And that's what's nice about it. It's a roadmap that it can change. The study recommends a certain sequence. I don't agree with the sequencing. I don't think you agree with the sequencing that they recommended. We can all go through that. We can go through a capital plan, look at that study and go, well maybe we do this roadmap and skip a year and do this roadmap and this roadmap. And that shows us how our funding's going to work out. And we're not losing that money at the end of the year. We don't spend it because Mike can't get here until August 1st. Nice thing is to then have to get a payday and bring it to the match, it's outside. And I used one of 10 this time, Chris, because that was what was in town report budgeted for next year. So, or the year where it's open. It also works better with grants when we get grants. Oh yeah, because it's nice if you have a payday and you don't have that. All of a sudden, what was going to be a shim coat now could be maybe you reclaim, do some reclamation and you're all of a sudden in it or you could go further or whatever. Or a lot of times with your grants when you get them, you have almost two years to use them. Exactly. But if you're only inside your budgeting season, you have to use it within that time. And when you're writing a grant, they want to see that you have a capital plan. You've got a fund, you've got money there available with that. But that 110 is raised by taxes. Absolutely, it stays in the budget because you will have to appropriate it out. You don't have to be voted on separately. So the 110 stays in the budget just is going to, instead of being used as an expense, it's going to be appropriated out just like you did in the high way. So again, every... To create it into the fund. Exactly, it would be a one-time vote accounting to create the fund, then a second part to fund it, and then in the future, people will just see the money in there and know that it's in the fund. In the fund, yeah. But I'm not sure what I would call it. I'm not sure what I would call it. Oh, yes. All right. You know, there's nothing, not a whole lot here that's a really large change. If there's any questions I can definitely answer them for you. But, you know, we did raise the tools like Theresa talked about. Alan's company multiple times said we don't have... We don't have sockets. We don't have anything. We don't have anything broken or non-existent. So he wouldn't need somebody just to go buy some basic tools. And then, yeah, this is a... What was 50? I don't know. This is a 15% increase in price per ton for salt. Yeah. And last year was a big year. And so, you know, some of that stuff depends really just whether or not you're gonna... Yeah, we got a better than state bid price on the salt this year. And it's still a 15% increase. And that's better than the state bid. This is crazy. Now, Greg, I have to pay this lovely... Would you love the state permit about the road? Yeah, it's a... So there's a storm water permit now that we have to have every year. And it's basically a fund mechanism. You don't need to worry about it. It's a fund mechanism, not a state, basically. But they're gonna... It's a storm water permit that we have to have. So there's no question of that. So that's an addition of like $1,300 to the budget under permits. The other thing we did this year was last year I'd only funded 70% of our HRA liability because I wasn't really sure how that was gonna go in Bethel because the town with Bethel pays half of the deductible and it goes on the card and you use that first. But we're gonna... Looks, people go through it. So we're gonna fund 100% of the HRA liability this time just because I didn't know how Bethel done it. I've done it in the past by only budgeting a portion of it. But that looks like that most people go through it. So we're gonna budget all of the HRA liability now. So there's also a change there in health insurance into the same thing that we did last year was say, I know what to base the budget on for the first six months of health insurance. The next six months I'm gonna do a 10% increase discuss. We made out okay this year, but you never know. So that's kind of the way we're gonna do that same scenario because we know the number for six months but we don't know the number for the next six. So that's where we're gonna do that. And then the other side over, we borrowed a neighboring town somewhere this year and it's probably not an issue with that at all. They had no issue with us doing it but I wanna just make sure that if they say no that we still have to be able to do it, we'll get that no more. We're gonna look into purchasing them all. Yeah, I mean that's the only way to look at our capital plan as a whole other volume. So back to the 110 again, I don't wanna beat a death bar. I just, I'm just curious. So if that 110 is the concept there, well if we only utilize, we'll put that aside and if we only utilize 60 of it let's say so that the other 50 is kind of building a fund towards when the big kahuna hits and we need that money because that's, every $19,000 is depending on the. That's true, but I mean, and I'm sure. That's the intention. That's why I'm gonna get asked. I mean that's the thing. About 81 miles of road in Bethel. So the fact that you always will have a road project going is I can't imagine a summer you don't, is that like the culvert lining up on. It's favorite. Oh it's not all roads. It's paid to us. But you can make it, whatever you want to ask. When we take this to the road, we can make the plan for everything. I'll get to ask that. The highway, we don't take money out of it every year. We may just buy it, you know, put it in, whatever you put 100 into it and we only take 30. And we have this small range of plants that says okay, you carry that over and you carry this over and you spend this a little bit. That carries over and you just have this long term plan that's the whole idea with us. We can't do that now because that one team goes late. So there is no plan. And being how critical our budgets have been here, you know, we want to try to get out of the peeps and valleys of budgeting up and down. You know, because if you look at the funding mechanism for the capital projects, for paved projects, you know, if you follow it, it's, you know, 110 one year, then 160 the next year, then 120 and then 200, you know, it's like up and down. So if we can find that happy medium, that way we can consistently, and then we can move that money over, which we thought we could do until we found out this year. You know, you probably don't have to set, you don't say it's 100,000 for the next 10 years. As we do our planning, we see that our needs first to lower whenever we can, we can taper it down. Or up. Or up. Yeah. It's whatever it is. We have to really establish that plan and figure out how the funding works. It's the same thing you do with highway equipment. Exactly. If you fire equipment once you stop making your payments, then that money will go in there and hold. The whole book of capital funds is obviously that you're not borrowing money, is that you have enough by the time you trade in something and you have enough safe that you can purchase it outright. So you're not, you know, increasing your debt load. So, not that I want to go through every line, Adam. However. Too late. However. I wouldn't just kind of like to go through this kind of in order. You know, we don't have to go through every line on them, but maybe just take it by each section and talk about a few of them. On the public works personnel section. Well, let me back up. So overall, this proposal versus last year, it's $55,000 higher for the public works. Overall. So, you know, currently right now, I mean, we're looking at, you know, almost three cents on the tax rate just for that one department. They don't, you know, we don't know. Keep in mind is once you throw this into the rest of the budget, how other budget load. I don't obviously have this as an offset by any revenue yet because you will get state highway aid. So there's some things that will reduce that. And I completely agree with Therese, you know, one of the major issues that we had in this town was the every year we budget for $5,000. However, every year it runs over by $10,000. And it was easy to bring to the taxpayers to get approval on, but, you know, we ate it in the long run. So, I mean, we definitely obviously have to have a realistic budget, but I think we also at the same time need to look at our needs and wants a little bit too. I can tell you Chris, the retirement portion went up, the state upped it, I think you were at 10.66 and I heard 11.7, so the town's match for the retirement went up, that's just recently. I actually couldn't go back. That's state mandated, you said that's a state mandate? Yeah, the state, because we're part of the state retirement system, they have to just tell you what's going to happen. I mean, unfortunately, you know, under the public works personnel section, there's really not much that we can do with that. You know, I'm a majority, well, some of that is the buyout of retiring, you know, type people, and then the increases in healthcare, which we have to deal with every year. However, if you kind of, if we look through some of these, a couple that kind of caught my eye first was, obviously I had the repairs parts and tires that went from $41,000 to $50,000 in this proposed budget. You know, and then just kind of looking through the three year history, it's about a $47,000 average. Yeah, because in 1617, yeah, you weren't 53, it was 46 in there still. So I just kind of, my notes anyways, was just kind of, I had written, you know, maybe we could bring that down to $45,000. We have the garage building supplies line, which it seems like every single year we have missed that one. So I guess the first question is, what is the real number there? And because like, you know, are we really, do we really have our finger on what that line item represents? Or is it just, are we just throwing bad money into? Well, we went for all the detail, you know, Alan, you know, we have all the detail of the budget and we talked about it for him, you know, it's, it's. Because every year that one's that. It can be supplies, like he was telling Greg and I, it can be small tools, it's paper towels, it's toilet paper, it's all stuff. It's a little bit of everything, right? Yeah, it is. It's also a general place still. And you know, if you need, you know, whatever it's fire extinguishers, obviously those, there's code for that. So it is kind of a. But it just looks like it looked like that was one that was always kind of had a control. Maybe because nobody was really looking at it, but you know, almost every year, except for one, it was off by 25, 30% every year. And then one year it was off by 100%. And then however, if you kind of, I don't know how, you know, how accurate the actual is for this year, that's here. But it looks like it's being managed pretty well. Yeah, well, we budgeted 8,500 and it's at 25 and change. So it seems like maybe because we have the finger on the pulse now, maybe it's being managed better. So my thought on that was, you know, our current budget season's 8,500 looks like it's being managed pretty well. Do we really need to bring it up to 12, three? I mean, just remember every $1,000 here and $1,000 there we find, you know. You find 18 of them, it adds up to a penny. So the other one I looked at was that seemed to be one that's always been severely under budget, which then I have a question mark is the uniforms. So every single year, uniforms is almost doubled. Well, Greg's next to my dad. So I don't, well, $1,000, $5,000 for the last year. It was, you both. Well, I'm just saying in the past, it's always been doubled. Well, as you guys, it was, I don't know why, because you've had a uniform that was doing your uniforms rigging up. So they're gone and we now buy our own uniforms. So we're good. That's why we cut it from $10,000 to $5,000. So I was just curious if the $5,000 in that case was, was it accurate enough to be accurate. So that, so many trends showed that we were. Yeah, each employee gets a stipend. I know that was a lot of each employee, and plus it leaves a little bit of a don't prefer things that they should be buying, you know, like rain gear or things like that, that should, maybe the taution of buying for them. So the reason why it was trending, the internet actually gives you that uniform first. And they were under contractual agreement with them for a lot of years, like 30 years actually. And there was a buyout at the end of last year, which is why this is the little line. But an hour at that $5,000, that's a steady number. That won't be over the standard. That actually should be understood because the amount of each guy's gaming comes up to roughly half, I think, of that $5,000. And it's plenty for them to get boots and pants and shirts and all that. Is there a reason that diesel is budgeted so high, but isn't that, is it just to- They give you two shittings a year. So it's really just a matter of time. You're looking at just one, or one day one shittin'. It's a daily, yeah, I think it's two, right? Yeah, I think it's one. I also do the fire and the constable would pull out of there too, so it depends on what you call it. Fire makes, and then what happens is I build a constable budget and I build a fire department, so then you put that money in. So some of that is off, so yeah. Constable doesn't use diesel a little bit. Well, he gets built for just gas, so they feel that they have up there, so. It is not, I mean, you're substantially under, you get $55,000 there, you know, $17,000, it was a $34,000, and $29,000, and $16,000, $17,000. Right, it's hard to know what diesels, it doesn't do anything, what, you know. It's gone up to $15,000, because it just buffered in in case prices. Right, yeah. We dropped the $5,000 last year, but you gotta, I think, see how things go. Yeah. And it looks like right now we're on track for about $42,000, if you carry out what we've used versus the rest of the year. Yeah. I mean, that just might be one that, you know, do we, does that $50,000 become a $45,000, you know, like. Yeah, but do we, if I put the price of diesel's gonna be in the next, it could be. If I knew that, if I knew that I would not be here. Well, if we're buying it all from the same place, then we shouldn't be able to lock in at some point, shouldn't we? I mean, maybe I'm, I guess usually, I don't know how I'm gonna show this. I think it would be a good deal for them, I mean, I could see the oil has dealt with them for years, and they just, we can bid out diesel, we can bid out on heating and stuff, but it's, you know, I just wanna say it's best if you have a hard winter, you know, how it's gonna go. The other thing is to, it's never bad to leave a little bit, just in case something breaks and you're overspent on something, and there's a little bit of cushion to save your bottom line, but, I don't know. That's the part, about the 18 months out, you know, that's a bit of a pain in the neck, isn't it? So on materials, anybody have anything else? I got a couple questions, but you were too busy. Go for it, David. The phone, $3685 a year for the telephone, what else is going on with that? So they have telephone, they have internet, there's a cell phone, and they also have... Pages, right? Security cameras. Is it a pager? Pagers, no. Is that part of the, that's a different thing? I don't know if they're, let me see what it says, telephone. Do they have other communications? He's like being called in. Well they have one pager, Morgan has a pager. Yeah. Communication system on their, what, when it's several, five, and ten, that's what it is. So that's what the telephone is, it's internet, telephone, cell phone, and I think they have a special connection, you know, because of their securities, this one. Really? This is just, because I don't know, the 100% of their HRA level, why, why, why that 100%? Just because I, I budgeted 70% last year, because I wasn't sure, obviously wasn't, wasn't sure how I've worked in Bethlehem since I was new, and just seeing that people are using, so instead of what I was funding was just 70% of it, in hopes that not all employees were, were using all of their HRA, because sometimes they don't, and so you have, you know, you can budget it a little bit of the liability, but they are using it, so it just makes sense to have, to cover 100% of it, I just really didn't have many people who weren't using it. Insurance is expensive. I understand, that was, I spent six months negotiating insurance. I love my questions, but we only budgeted 25% of it. Yeah, I only budgeted 70%, and, but, but you know, it's the, what, how it works here, is that the deductible, you use the card first, so we, Bethlehem front-loads our share, then once the employee goes through that, then they have to go through their share, so because it's front-loaded, most of it, you know, when people end up using it, so. See, we, they pay first dollar. Oh, see, in here, they pay down pay first dollar, so that's, We had a special formula in there, they had to pay first dollar. Yeah, no, that's the way it works here, so. Yeah, okay, I just, I just wanted to understand. No, of course, that makes total sense. Anything else on the first page? I mean, granted, we can come back to this, you know, once we start seeing some of the other section. It's good to identify some of those spots to look at. But, you know, these are areas that we can. Well, I just wanted to mention that, you know, I've used the word level fund it around, and I understand the concepts, how the whole thing works, and it's never, my thought, though, is if we never set a target of level funded or close as we can, and just look at all these individual items, realizing that every 19,000 is a penny, then it'll never come to pass. It will, and in the past, I've heard, well, it's okay, we can bump it up 3%, we can bump it up 5%, last year we hit people pretty hard in both the sewer and water and the taxes. So I think, and it's really impacting, we're hearing it all the time, how it's impacting the folks on social security and the elderly and all that. So I just think, when I use that term, I just, I think more of the concept of, you know, 3%, well, 3% is not good enough. Can we get it to two and a half? Is there something we can do and just keep that in mind through the whole process? I think it's, you know, I think we've done that. I mean, not, you don't know what we've done. It seems to be a thousand percent better than it were. We're trying to level fund with an understated budget. No, I understand. I understand, you guys are up, you guys are doing, I mean, I see the bills every other week, you know? I mean, everybody is being how responsible for their expenditures and everybody's pulling it out. No, I think you're right. I think, yeah, obviously it can't be carte blanche. I mean, I think if you look at, you certainly look to, you know, my thinking is three to five being on the outside. And like I said, it's obviously, you know, we're now going back to the voters for another 10 and, but it may take, it may take, as I've said, you know, a year or two to figure out what your number is. And then it's really a lot easier to keep that, you know, 3% or less. So that you're kind of in that thing. And while I certainly feel bad, taxpayers must not forget that because they were a lot of fun to grow on time, it was, you know, there was that, which is unfortunate. I'm not saying that in a mean way. It's also too bad because whoever got away with a good, now the new people are paying for it. So I know, but everybody drank the Kool-Aid, you know? Exactly, you're right, Paul. You're rearranging the chairs on the Titanic. Yeah, I think it'll help you once you see the budget in totality, you know, to see, but, you know, every line I would need to feel forgot. I think a couple of budget seasons ago, we had established as a group at the time that if we wanted to go from the budget that wasn't very well put together to a absolute perfect budget where the town should be, you know, we had thrown together, like it would have to be an instant over the night increase of like 12%. Oh, sure. That was kind of what we were thinking. And I remember Carl and I talking and saying, you know, we're not gonna go 12% in one year. So how can we pick over the period of X amount of years to get to that? And then once we are at that level, and then we can control it and keep our, you know, more of a level funded budget. So that's why, and I think that's where that 3% came up is we were talking about, you know, how much do we think that the taxpayers could come up with over a period of small adjustments? Granted, now that we have, you know, our town budget, we had water, we had sewer, and we had all this long-term debt and things like that that all came at the same time. So they've been getting hit. And I think last year we were just under 3%. If you take the long-term debt, you know, I think we were at 2.7 or 8.7. But even that was kind of a guesstimate because it was the first real look at the, even the information that you guys had a long time ago probably was incomplete or maybe. We would look at the old budgets and see that. It was budget $5,000 and every year it went $12,000. And you know, why budget $5,000 or, you know, or who's watching it, you know? And I think, and we had talked about that after this, you know, when we get to July 1st of next year, we're at that point, we should have a pretty good handle of what it costs us to run the town. What we're looking for. So when we get into that, you know, 20, 21 budget that it should be, we should be online with. So a couple years of history. Well, you know, but. A good history. So let's talk materials. That's great. So we have, so we'll pick on salt first. We could see below a hundred. I mean. So we talked about that salt went, there was a 15% increase from last year. However, the budget was reflecting a 47% increase in salt. Yeah, well, we'll get last year. Well, we use over spend. Yeah. We use a lot of salt last year, but I think there were some instances where we use salt that maybe we didn't really need to use salt. You know, there was that. Remember we talked about last year at the board, that there was that kind of learning curve year and. 1617 was also over. So I just asked, you know, what, what, you know, if we did, if it was 15%, then you're probably talking more like $80,000 for that item, not $100,000, which is 1 cent on the tax rate, you know. The other one too is sand. And we have sand level funded at 35,000. However, we, we purchased more sand than normal. We did. Which we, I remember talking to, you know, that was the deal to take it. We took it. So here. So at this point, wouldn't we have a balance of. Well. When we have a surplus of sand at that point, if it's managed correctly. Depends on the water. That's the kind of thing you might want to have a little buffer on. No, but we, in the budget right now, we budgeted 35,000 for sand. We had an opportunity deal to take more sand and we did it. So in theory, we have a surplus. You were right. In theory, you're right. We have a surplus. You know, could we take advantage of that surplus? So, you know, when we cut that surplus out, just talking about it, so that, I mean, I don't think we need to cut anything tonight, but it's good to have this conversation so that once we get the whole budget together, we say we're at 6% and we need to cut something. You know, we know this, but maybe it's something great that you can look into and see, you know. Well, I think you're right. But again, what we're talking about, and you guys know better than I do, is you've lived here a long time. The variable here is 11, I mean it's just. The same last year went crazy with their sand. They laid down more and more salt. They wrote about it in millions of dollars on salt last year. It was just ridiculous here. If you wrote over budget on salt, you can always do the sand because we've got it. Right. Which is cheaper than salt. But what we're trying to do is, I don't think we have a bare roads policy, do we? We do not have a bare roads policy, but tell us. People forget that. We might do that in every town we go to. You know, we want a budget and not enough, but we also want to have, you know, not too much, of course, but it's tough out to answer to that. It's a lot of money. So I don't know. It's a lot of money. Well, the other thing too is, you know, Alan made a really good point. Alan, your highway, your road foreman, was saying to Greg and I, the other thing is, you know, you don't have a salt shed really that you can store. So if he had a salt shed that was bigger, he could be able to buy in the off season and fill it in the savings which can't, so that's certainly one of those things. For now, he can only take, you know, truck over to where Essec Avenue keep coming. So down the road, when you build that, you know, town fire and salt shed, you know, he's saying. Well, what's the shed that we have over there? What's in that shed? Oh, there's probably a whole 10 yards. It's just the one of the women out back there. He's actually gonna give his asphalt, he's got asphalt, a small shed too, that's probably 10 yards, maybe the most. He's trying to dump that out, but we don't know where he's gonna put more salt on there tonight, but. I mean. What we can look at is, look at the historic trends, quantify those, we'll get a number with that and actually 15% and see what that comes up with. I don't know if that's gonna, if that's gonna get us, because we're at 68, we're at 100,000, 86,000, and at 48,000, over three years. So that's 100, that's $200,000, 210, over three years. So, what is that? Seven. I can't even ask, sorry. Seven. Yeah, 15% of that. So that puts us at 85. 81. There you go. So just looking at those things. I mean, I, you know, you talked about the tools, that we need tools, obviously, but, you know. How can we best do that? I'm gonna have to bring you some home and work on that. Yeah, he said they need screwdrivers, he said we create, it's just crazy. He said the basic, just set tools that we actually just need. I don't know, I see it all the time. You know, a lug nut here, a whole wrench here, you know. You're crazy, yeah, you're right. What's the bridge material that $148,000 jumps right out? Bridge 33, no worries. That is a, that number is not, is not right. Should that be there? Right, but, so we have to pay you for the entire bridge up front. And then we get reimbursed with the stake. So it'll be a revenue offset. Yeah, partially, yes. That number goes down because we were funding that for the last couple years, waiting for that to happen. And that goes way back down. But that's overstated simply because of the grant that we got and the way that, we're gonna look at doing our grants a little differently so that they're fundamental. They show a little differently in the budget. So they're not shown in here as a huge expense, even though it reimburses kind of back and at all. At the end of the day it works itself out, but when we look at liners in the budget, it looks like it's really skewed. So we're gonna work on that. But that's what that is. That's part of the payment for the lily drill for the bridge that will be reimbursed. Was there any more grant money due to the miss reading? We maxed out on 75. So we're on the book or whatever is additional? Yeah, roughly 90,000 dollars. I have spoken with the engineering volume. I've only got a lot of anything back. You're saying, you know, I'm asking if they're gonna help us out with running as we get. And they understand that, but they haven't come back to me with any resemblance of any sort of financial. Well, it's a good thing we didn't do a lot on our Hiree rehab. Yeah, that's where it all came from. Because I pretty much plugged that whole thing. Yeah, yeah. It's a shame that, yeah. Well, I'm gonna be careful on that. Well, I mean, you have an engineer for a reason. You have to depend on their numbers and unfortunately, it's way too big to help you. Well, I'm just surprised they don't have an error in their mission or some kind of a clause that says, we screw up. And because they, I mean, they're engineering at the same time upfront, I messed up. I messed up with the calculations in my budget. Oops. And, but they haven't done anything yet. So we'll see where it goes. I mean, maybe we'll get some money now. Is it worth pursuing? Is it worth pursuing further? You won't get anything out of that. I mean, I don't want to pay for legal all that. I mean, that's not gonna get anything. Or you would, but it'd be cautious. It's a little bit common to like to get things right. Only there was a select board member that said son at that point. But you don't review the plans to look at your quantities. All right. So I mean, we can look at it all. We can definitely look at that. I mean, we were over because we, we felt, I mean, I talked to Alan, he felt that he was scraping where he thought he was scraping. Of course, he wasn't learning from there. But he was like, he said, we have spreaders on low. We're not done. Just the dumb. But it's hard to tell, you know, we don't know. Not that it, not that it made a huge thing, but I think we still had, I think McCullough was pulling material out there last year for the school. True. And Alan, you won't have, which you won't have. You shouldn't have any of that this year. Right. Because the school has their own contract. When Dylan was, When Dylan was loud, so we were under contract. There was sort of a contract in place. It really wasn't. It wasn't. That the town was glad with the salt and that stopped. And Alan, he was full of love there. Right. So that should, you know. Help with that. I mean, I'm kind of one of those, you know, I kind of like to look at the salt, gravel and sand, all those kind of one, one identity, you know, I mean, it's kind of like the way the state looks at their plowing and their paving is, they go through a really tough winter where they use a lot more salt than they don't do as much paving in the summer, you know. So, you know, if we go through a winter where we have a tough winter, then maybe we don't do as much gravel in the spring summer, you know. Or if we have a year where we don't have a lot of, use a lot of salt and sand, then we do a little more gravel on the roads or something. You know, I mean, it's kind of like, almost like those three items kind of go together. Unfortunately, the town is, while they're then remissed and taken care of, most of the else they also remissed and taken care of the gravel roads, there are several roads that they are grading leach. So, that tells me there's no gravel left on the road. So, we're hoping to reclaim some of the gravel, so we've got years and years of wind roads of good material on the edge of the road. So, Alan and my boys up there have built this contraction that's got like a blade hanging on it that will pull those wind roads back into the roadway. And a lot of food and vegetables have got everything because that, and they're trying to reclaim and take some of that, those years of gravels placed on that road and grade it off and bring it back into the road. And in hopes to save some of the gravel costs that we have down the road. We're hoping, we'll see about those, but that would help some, sure, there's, according to Alan, a lot of good material that's been stockpiled on the side of the roadway, through grade. And we're gonna stop the wind roads. So, we might see some savings there once we get into it. I think we're probably able to look for the mud season thing. So, that's the big question. What sort of a mud season are we gonna have and what's the route that we need for that? You know, I don't know, it's just, those three items, I agree with them, they're just, they're large ticket items for sure, but they're also the biggest question marks. Actually, you never know. Yeah, and a little fun at the end of the two, because they seem to be okay. Hoping to see a little bit of savings in the cemeteries, I'm actually gonna, that's all for maintenance in cemeteries. And I'm gonna put that up to this year for the knowing, the edging, and all that. And hoping to see some savings, I don't know. We're budgeting for the status quo, but there may be some savings there. I think it's good to talk about these items that, you know, I don't think we, again, I don't think we need to play with any of the numbers at this session, but it kind of gives Greg and trees a few things to think about when we're putting the whole, once we get the whole budget together and see, you know, because obviously there might be some departments that are less than last year, and some will be more and then we can kind of figure out what the healthy balance is at the end. In two weeks, you'll see fire, breakfast, constable. But typically you'll see, you'll definitely get firework in the constable in the next two weeks. But typically, you know, the public works one is what, 60% of the budget? Yeah. Like that. So, you know, it's a big, big piece. Yeah, it's a big chunk of it. So something, maybe this is something you could do, Teresa, but I like that Chris has sort of highlighted some areas that we could kind of come back to once we've seen the whole budget and talk about it. And I wonder if there's a way to denote that so that when we're starting to see the full budget together and it's, you know, a month or so from now, finding those spots in this older packet, if it's sort of denoted on the budget of an asterisk or something that indicates to us, hey, we talked about maybe coming back and looking, then when we're thinking through it on our own before coming to discuss, we've sort of already highlighted those spots that we're going to come back to. Yeah, I made a few notes on mine too. Okay. Yeah, it doesn't even have to be anything major, just a little, something that indicates to all of us that, hey, this is something we talked about in a meeting that we might look back at. Because I like that, Chris, I like that you were kind of bringing our attention to certain spots and I think that's helpful. And the top thing too is, you know, not that our cost is trending upwards because I think we just had budgets that just were not ideal or realistic. But our revenue, for the most part, typically trends in a little bit of a downward position. So you're, you know, you're going up on one and down on another. So that'll be a challenge. I mean, every time one of these, you know, a house comes off or a piece of property or something like that, that's revenue that we're losing in the town. So you've got to think about that as well. Any further discussions in regards to the public works? Portion of the budget? Small question, which probably has nothing to do with, well, it does because what happened with the budget for the highway, what the trust fund or budget of last year? I mean, considerably lower. Then we're budgeting for the basis of equipment. Would you add them all together for the $110,000? Because what happened is it was a lot of odd things that happened here. We were, you know, Bethel was transferring the $110,000 to the highway equipment fund. But what wasn't really open, like to disclose to the voters is you were using that money to pay loans back. So I thought what would look more transparent to the voters was if we actually showed the payments in your budget and then the difference is getting moved over. Because what happened in the quarter department was they're not budgeting that money to cover the payments. So that fund was in a shortfall. Well, they're budgeting enough. No, they weren't. Well, nobody, I mean, like going forward. No, I meant, you know, for their trust. Right. But they were all for our budget. But, so to me, it didn't seem, I felt it should be more transparent. So that's why. So I thought, yeah. And that's why. That's why. That's why. That's why. Exactly. So this way you can see that the wind, you know, how much is that. Water heater. You kind of see it. So this made me feel a little more comfortable because we really don't disclose too much about the fund. So I'm just saying that with fire. And if you have a plan that you do out from ADC, you'll see that. We do the same thing with fire. And like the fire department, we ended up slightly coming ahead on one piece of equipment there. So we'll save the fund off. Because at the end of next year, then that fund comes back into the positive rate. And then we'll get the leaders out of there. I can't, I doubt that. But that was due to the last piece of equipment that we had to get, that we had to figure out getting. Well, here was interesting too, because I've never seen it before. We're in a town. I actually bought two dump trucks at once. I've seen them, I've heard of it. So. Oh, now you've seen it? Yeah, I've seen it. I've seen it. Surprise. Usually I've seen it. I've seen it. But I'm bad. Surprise, surprise, surprise. I bought two and one spent half the time down. Yeah, I was like, wow. So that's why. And it's like, you can't say need fire, because, oh, he's working here. I really appreciate all the work that you folks put in on this, though. I mean, it's true. And you can clearly see that. You can clearly see the work that the department heads are putting in for these as well. Yeah, they do. Especially the pump policies. Yeah. They're no accountants, and whenever something's not right, three's giving them all away, so they figure it out. It works every time. But I just. Before, if I see something that looks. Yeah. Yeah. I have a question about it. I'm not shy about it, I ask you. No, it's good. And it's nice, too, Dave, because the department heads now call that even Dave Aldergetti comes in and codes firebills. So it makes sense they know they're buying and sweating it out, and they get budgets like you guys do. So it's good, and everybody's good. All right, we'll move on. Last time we had talked about the long-term debt, no, with Mascoma. We had talked about the 2025 and 2030 year. And we decided as a board that we would like to move forward with a 25-year melt. So this is the note in which Therese has put together with the bank. So we'll be looking for his motion to sign the change in terms of agreement resolution and tax certificate with Mascoma Bank for the $1,444,000. Well, no, for 25 years. We're the first 10 years at 3%. I so move. Lay down right out there, Maury. I so move. So this one here, change in terms agreement, that's going from 1.725 to the one before the reimbursement came in, the final reimbursement. Which is what we said here to do last year, telling me that we buy it down with the FEMA money, which we got over there, physically got all the way yet. But we finally settled FEMA. So that money, we have the first round of it, and the second round should be coming our way. So that's what we did, because we bought it down with that, which is what we said we would do. Did somebody second that one? So that again? OK. OK. Is this the guy who heard that? I was waiting. OK, no, that's fine. I just want to try that in the room. Thank you. OK, all in favor? All right. So the budgeted amount that we'll see in the budget will be the $82,945. Yep, and you'll see it. It's in the highway budget. Yeah, it's in the highway budget. Do you already have your copy in there? Are we good? Yeah, I laid a little bit more for the second round. And I didn't see it in the last page last night. That financing? Last year we budgeted $109. Oh, yeah, I got it. Well, the other big thing is, too, because we budgeted $109, I would say, we budgeted for payment. So I was also able to take that money, payment, plus the FEMA, and put all that down on it. So it helped us buy it down a little bit. I think there's three patents or four, I can't remember, in this ham, obviously, at the time. We used to have an N over N, or something like that. Leave me on here. You're a better ass. What's that? It's all mine and me. I've been called off a lot. Yeah, he did. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm blind. We can sign the zones. Here you are. They've got FAM in here, but not the FAM. Is that four board members? Yeah, four board members and treasury. It's OK, Dave, we still like you. Yeah, just write your name, sign it, and write your print. Sign below the walls here. And then you get the other tabs there. I'm sorry. I didn't even catch that. I read all of them. I didn't even have stuff to ask you. Have you made your hiccups with anything with getting the plows out a little early today, or everything? No. Run? No, I don't think we've received any complaints at all. I went to... Well, the first time on Friday night, or I should say 3.30 Saturday morning, they could have waited an hour out. Because them babies are loud the first time over the road. Yeah, I might do my new puppy doll, but he's not puppy anymore. At least he likes the sound of it. So he barks, and barks, and barks, and you kind of make him laugh. I'll wait. Once you get a snow road, you'll never hear it from him. No, I tell you what, Friday night, I heard him when he came off the car, which is a mountain which is 7 tenths of a mile away. Yeah, see I'm on my favorite road, so I heard it. My dog hears no way to talk a little bit, when they're driving by. They don't even have to be on my foot, but he's barking. That's good. Yeah, not 4 or 5 o'clock. What are you supposed to get up on? No, I think they went pretty well. We had a little hiccup of a plow, and we got a run-in, we got a go-in, and it ran good all day. So he used that to pull the load on the tractor, and we saw how the load goes out. Yeah, it came down through town, and it was hung, it looked like it hung up on the curb with the door open and nobody around. Oh really? At the top of Pleasant Street. At the church school. They had a share bowl, and they had to work on it or something. And is the downtown unit all put together now? For? On my book, yeah. Pick up truck and plow and all that stuff. Everything's all set there. We're still in the process of purchasing the piece of equipment. Now there's some weeds in the head again, and I've got the weeds in this all good. I think it's ready to go. I don't think the weeds will have the spray line around the bed. What you tried, she can't do it. As far as the plowing, it's all really great. Doug didn't get his wing on? Huh? Doug didn't have his wing on. I don't know why he didn't have his wing on. And now, on this on his, his head always blew up. So he scored one from the local parts of the area. Hopefully we get that in soon. Good. That was the way of the issue they had. Not much snow here, of course. Huh? I'm wondering about the pieces up tonight. The trees up tonight. We're going to make our way to the community the rest of the main street, and see how the piece of equipment is. I know it's the abandoned cars in there. And the parking lot. No, no, no. It's over at S&S Auto. There's 40 other ones. Look at that. It's only 40. Is that my outlaw, boys? Yeah. How about that later? The other one's going on. All right. We will move on. The next piece we had was the sewer use ordinance. Yeah, so these are the this is the water sewer ordinance that I brought out of the water ordinance to you at the last meeting. And there were a couple of revisions that we had to it. And you had asked me to put together the sewer. So that's what these are. The final versions of the two ordinance changes. So it's really cleaning up some of the the vacancy rates that we kind of did talk about. And what it does is basically says that regardless of what type of property it is if the property is completely unoccupied and we if it's completely unoccupied it needs to be put onto the vacancy rate. That's the option which we will exercise. We shut the water off. Along with that, it also cleans up the vacancy rate on the second page. It originally just said vacancy rate of $18.80 for the water and whatever it was for sewer. $120.70 and it didn't really stipulated that man how that was calculated or if that was just a fixed rate. So we cleaned that up and said that's for the equivalent unit. That's the calculation of the last time they were that it was occupied. So just asking for approval of these two ordinances to clean up the vacancy rate for the water and the sewer. So why do we have a disconnect and reconnect fee for the sewer? It's not like we disconnect or reconnect anything. Is it just the reactivation of the account? I mean what's the connection? You're doing it for the water. We can eliminate that. But the idea is re-establishing the accounts for some administrative costs that are there. I'm just the physical going out and turning the water on for some administrative setting up the account and getting everything back up to where it should be and getting everything in memory and all that stuff that they do that I'm not fully aware of. There's some process there to do that and to make sure it's kept at that place. So as this is during the questions I'd be happy to answer them but it's pretty bad. So this is effective in January? Yeah. So this has to be formally used. This has to be posted in five places. In the newspaper, a quick synopsis I think you can go to the newspaper and there's a time that starts for somebody to come back in the competition to discuss this and fill this. So the January 15th is when it will actually become legal and be part of our awareness at that point. Any further discussion? We need two motions then? So I will entertain a motion. First we'll talk about let's do the water first means that was brought before the board last time. A entertain a motion for the amendment put before us in regards to the vacancy corrections to the water ordinance. Second? Dave moved it and secondly second it. All in favor? Aye. So that's for the water and then I will also entertain a motion for the sewer for the amendment put forward as well in regards to the occupancy or the unoccupancy rate. Second? All in favor? Aye. We'll have to send a marfee for sign on all of this. The board paid $25 signature. Administrator. We're just talking about part of the administrative more there we go. There you go. Unlimited comp time at this point. We are a little like that then. Do you eliminate the unlimited comp time? You need yourself to get rid of it. So parking we got parking lot ordinance. Yes, so we've been kind of talking here there about an amendment to the parking ordinance that we have and this is kind of what I've come up with along with this proposed ordinance there is a department permit that this is kind of based off of. So the concept is that we will have because we've got issues with the power of this parking lot and there may be large part of the sporadic parking lot all the time overnight, it's tough for the park. And what I've come up with is this concept where we will people that are permitted parking over the tenants that live there and the owners that live there will have a parking permit that will be good for the year that they're in. So if you get it in July, it's until December 31st. And there will be a designated spot on the uphill side where there will be signs posted for overnight parking. And that's where everybody will get parking is on that up-to-the-side. And anybody, so when we come into the plow at four o'clock, five o'clock in the morning and there's part of the parking lot now on the side, we are within our right by ordinance to plow two toes for that position that you should, it's overnight parking by permit only. So that will allow us to have a whole bottom side in the middle section and hopefully part of this other end that we can clean all of that. Originally there was some bottom out in having a blue light and having cars move to the bottom. The more I think about that, I think the logistics of that are not going to work. So, you know, once those cars and the people that work overnight may leave and we have an opportunity, we'll definitely get in there in the middle section of that. But it won't be, we won't make it necessary for those cars to move to the south of the side like we originally had talked about. I think it's just not going to work. Logistically, it just won't work. But by doing this, we have the permitted overnight people parking in this maybe area that leaves an entire majority of that parking lot open so that we can come in really quickly and plow it in the middle. How many people do you think that is? I did the count at one point and I guess it's 10 to 15 is my recollection and just thinking about like, so we have we have two crocodile parks at their spots but Kevin has four units one that has one one that has two so that's five another one that has one and another one that potentially has two but right now they only have one missing something here. The Korean Union folks that park in there on. Yeah, and then the tenants the Korean Union tenants. It's now in Rousseff's building. And then a few folks in this apartment they can park there at night but during the day they have to shift to this lot. So it fluctuates but it's about 10 to 15 15 being I think the maximum. We're going to have some criteria to get an overnight apartment and we just can't ask for it. We have to be permanent. We have to come into the town. We have a reason for wanting that overnight so other than I want. So the permanent has stipulations and it shows that you have to have a contact number of course but you have to have your landlord's name landlord's contact number so you have to show that you're part of that of this area. And not just somebody coming in all right. Now I think you know having additional spots we're talking about having the 15 spots. And I think likely though there's all being full or pretty low. If somebody were to stay overnight with their friend or something as long as they park up there I don't think it's a major issue. It's really this is really intended for people parking on the bottom side and not allowing it to become sort of a problem thing now. That's good. It'll have to be a constant because this is a law. So we have to be there. Too many. So what the permit the permit limits each address to just two permits. So if you've got a friend or maybe don't make $20 whatever you get permanent if you want it or find someone to park in there. It's not really just the design for the short-term overnight they're staying overnight. It's not really for people that are staying for an extended night time. So the permit allows for two permits. The ordinance allows for two permits. I just wanted to clarify. So like for the laver block it has multiple units in it. That's per unit. So that street address, unit one. Exactly. Exactly. So that kind of is meant to control somebody who has a bunch of friends over and they're staying for a week. You can only have two permits for that address. And I did that with control and I think 15 spots is kind of what we talked about. And I've been playing with the theory for the signs. The easy sign to be, you know, permit parking only between the signs. But I would also like to have people be able to park in those spots during the day just not over there. So I'm working with what was kind of the language of the signs that would look like between these hours. Permit parking only after a block or whatever it is. Six to six or something. Somebody with a permit comes home from work and wants to get in that spot and somebody park there. But there's 15 spots. So again the likelihood of them finding the spot. And you have to be on that spot by whatever the time is. Because once people are getting off work or getting home, we're hoping that other people have left. Eating pizza or doing whatever and they're going to get in the spots. The challenge, anything you will have is we don't have a full-time enforcement person. Nor I don't think that this parking ordinance is really meant to have someone going around parking. Being a parking meter person. It does allow us if all of a sudden there becomes a vehicle that's kind of abandoned. Like we've had in the past. We can plow people in too. If you're not supposed to be there you can get plowed in. You may not get towed but you may not build it out. That's just something that we're not going to go around everybody every night. We're not going to be checking the parking. That's not going to happen. But I think the majority of people that are over an hour hours are going to go by these rules and they're going to have their own. Even if you did get the abandoned vehicle owner that has a permit there at least you'll know who the permit is and you can track down where the passengers have a car that's abandoned and you don't know who it belongs to. Something I was wondering and this might be a little bit fraught is if the permit signs because I was wondering if you were going to go after a certain time evening or night it becomes a designated spot to sort of prevent people from parking there. They go to Babes and they're getting there at 8pm. They're not parking in a designated spot. But could the signs have a tow truck number to call that will be at the owner's expense? So say the lot is full and somebody who's a permitted person wants to be able to park that number that car would be towed to the owner's expense. I don't know why I said it might be fraught. They're not what we're doing with that towing is that we're we're enforcing our owners with our constable who has that authority to do that. But our constable is rarely on duty. True. Unfortunately what happened is if the parking lot was completely full and somebody had a few spots maybe overnight or not overnight well let's say it's an overnight person you would have to file a complaint with the town and then when he's on duty maybe he goes through the parking lot. Yeah I know there was an enforcement section in the ordinance and I'll have to see what that says. We may have to revise that and maybe like Trish just said maybe we need to change it so that myself the road foreman, the constable people that can enforce that and make the call out. Right. Maybe it's not a number you put on the sign but it's a number that when you get the permit you're given a sheet that says if there's ever an issue this is how you address that or something so then it's not just random people calling it's you've paid for your spot and if you can't get to your spot here's your recourse. The parking permit would be visible in the car right? The road foreman would be like they could see the permit, they'd realize okay probably you know only they didn't have parking so they'd I just wonder I just wonder if maybe we should have something in here that spells out the non-permitted parking so if someone does park in one of those spots that's not permitted. Right now there's really not much we can do other than maybe tow it but that's what the ordinance is to be a little more severe than that and maybe people won't park there my guess is probably at least for the near future we will have that issue but if you know if when the buildings do get full then we could have to re-circle wagons on some enforcement. I think the majority of people that are with the cars that are on the line are visited and so I don't know if it's going to be necessarily a large issue but if we get those all wrapped up in one section I think it solves itself. I mean you drive through here right now and that parking lot at 3 o'clock in the afternoon is pretty empty at that point well you know the uphill section I mean there's not like a full parking lot in my guess is it during the day 6 o'clock in the morning there's probably all the cars out of there are people with but they're just scattered well the other thing you may run into is if there's an event here at the town hall in the evening and that parking lot gets full pretty quick you know so how True, but there's a lot of spots on the bottom and if they do this right I mean we'll just have to play with them from all the good points and that's why I'm not playing with this sign as to what exactly is it going to be and how are we going to allow these cars to be usable during the day and not at night. Well I like the idea of having them be a little flexible because I think a lot of people do leave out there so why not have those spots that are a little closer to downtown accessible during the day and not locked up at night. First Mo took away our comp time and now you're taking away our parking spots so there's no better way to get on the side of it. Right? Something I was curious you had mentioned and this was a little while back about maybe regaining some of the bank parking spots was that still in the works or we're wasting them out a little bit and we're still trying to work it all the way through it sounds as though we might be able to pick up two or three of their customer parking spots and possibly draw their employee parking spots by moving over the handicap to the other side where it should be any way out of the downtown side and restriding it in certain ways that won't happen until spring when we restrack the whole thing. The other might happen hopefully soon where he takes down a couple of signs like customer parking and instead of having five I think he's talked about just going down to three so we pick up a couple of them which I I'll next time I see them I'll talk with him again about it I think I had put it out there to him and I think he had to talk with whoever the regional bosses or whatever I don't know but whoever he got to talk to he's super measured so I'll see where he came from I think right now it sounds as though we want to locate possibly how we're going to regulate people that are parking well I don't know I think this covers everybody else I mean it basically says that if you don't have a permit and you're parking there over nine that you can be towed In that sense though I think you need to explain who can compromise the tow Yes, yes I'll look at the enforcement piece of that Your son is going to say parking permit from seven o'clock you'll put that in whatever time you're sitting right? Yes, it'll say something like parking what were they parking by permit on the whatever time you want to park parking by permit only at 70 and 70 or something like that I just haven't really got that all over but we should we should have that in the policy we should have the time because what's going to happen is it says overnight right now we haven't defined what overnight is most of us kind of know what overnight is plane devil's advocate I park in a spot and you tow me and it says overnight parking and I'm going to come back on the town because you towed me and said well you towed me at 6 30 overnight probably not only do we need a sign but it should be in our ordinance that this is for 6 p.m. to 6 a.m. or 7 p.m. to 6 a.m. what do you think what do you think a reason to allow somebody who does not permit to park in a spot I would say normally you'd have to majority of people either leave or are coming back from work in the 5 to 6 o'clock hour so you're somewhere between that time I think 5 o'clock is fine I think you should be out of that overnight spot by 5 o'clock so then somebody who's working downtown park there aside from restaurants something that's later and it's not really so much you know if you've got somebody who if the streets are packed cockadoos and full bore and both sides of the road are plug-solid on a Friday evening and they go park up in the town garage and it's 7 30 and the only spot that they've got to back into is one of those spots on the high side that's how long does it really happen I don't know I know I know on a Friday night it can be pretty busy down there 7 30 on a Friday this lot starts to fill and it's a lot of it is cockadoos and babes it really is driven by both so what do those people that spend the night what do they do with their cars well I think that's some of why what I think Greg was saying earlier was why cars get so scattered as somebody's coming home and they just park in the first available spot and the reason that the people that I know that belong to people who live here will park as close as they can and so the only reason if you come out in the morning and there's four open spaces and then a car and then two open spaces and then another car is because that lot was full when they got home they will by nature just drift as close to home as they can and so I think your idea at least my understanding is to consolidate those people at that point you really want to look at the 5pm or 5.30 or 6pm when people are coming back and say you know what if you're here temporarily for a cockadoodle for babes for the laundromat whatever you might have to park a little further away because if the goal really is to consolidate then somebody coming home at 5pm if their slot is taken they're not necessarily going to go back out at 9pm to see is there an open spot but this is also mainly mainly just for winter maintenance too so we could also put in the ordinance this is you know between whatever you know May 1st April we already got a word it's November 15th April and so do these overnight spots become the same the same as that right they're open they're closed I mean they all work with their skulls it's not very big I mean are you thinking it should be as early as 5 or maybe like 6 or maybe 7 maybe that's the later you push it the later somebody may have to come down in epigammas to see if my spot's open because it wasn't open I like the idea of just doing it seasonally the rest of the year is hoot for people who are working because you're right it's about consolidating but only so that we can maintain the area that's it so maybe we stipulate that the permits are only required between November 15th and April 15th I think so I think you need to chase it all year I mean we're just looking at trying to do better maintenance I agree with you Greg but just to play devil's advocate on this is thinking about humans and habits and forming habits that then stick are we shooting ourselves in the photo if we say it's only seasonal that instead of getting people into a good habit they'll stop shooting ourselves in the photo if we say it's only seasonal instead of getting people into a good habit that they'll stick with then having to figure out how to reinforce it there are people that park in the lot overnight that as soon as April 15th happens they're parking up straight in front of their building and as soon as November 15th happens they're backing a lot so they may self enforce my answer to that would be which challenge is going to be more difficult getting them retrain in the winter or dealing with all the main street people that are not able to park in those small spots or flying parking when it's a nice sunny day and business is booming I don't know which is because what I don't want to do is is detonate those spots and lose those spots to you know, patrons that's what I'm about to is how do we do it make it work so we can maintain the area but not lose those spots so I hear what you're saying Koba I actually agree with the season all more I just wanted to sort of hear it out or hear if anybody had any other thoughts oh, it's forkling I think it should be a season off you know, I think the season will work and what we can do is just go to the landlords and say you know come I don't know October go to the landlord and say I don't know how many I don't know how many there's a set of instructions that go with it that says this is what you do they make a copy to it well, each person comes and he gets an individual permit if you're going to have it for half a year you can't share it's 20 bucks you're going to drop it down to 10 because it's just we should start at 25 yeah, but if you're just having it for half a year at least a half an hour of administration on this it's still going to rate the same amount of time to rate the permit there's enforcement there's enforcement there's the detail itself about who and we changed colors over a year or two and we're taking colors over a year or two we are hey, it's a non-tax revenue there you go there's $1.5 million $1.5 million right here there's an industry on the permit application we've got commercial vehicles and temporary plates to be excluded so if somebody works for a business but lives in town and has a commercial vehicle from their work they couldn't get a permit just throwing it out and temporary plates usually lead to permanent plates but I'm not sure why tell me temporary plates maybe we could say something like proof of residency must be and whatever and you're not generally you're like a 20-day plane whatever it's supposed to be but people are going to get a new car every now and then okay so did you decide did you file a permit at 7 a.m. or did you decide that time I think we agreed on the seasonality that November 15th to April 15th I throw out 7 to 7 I throw out 7 to 7 just for 5 I'm going to 5 because if you want to be some that are going to push it if you have a 7 to 7 someone will still be there at 7.30 but on the downside it's really not as important if someone left at 8 o'clock versus 7 p.m. whoa I'm saying in the morning if someone left an hour late I don't think that's a big deal I'm a little confused do you have to leave this but I work from home so I don't let my vehicle out every day no it will be open to anybody at that point so permanent or non-permanence the start time in the evening so if you're staying home all day and you want to leave your permitted vehicle there I'm not going out I'm not going out if you leave a car unintended in a town road or a parking lot before I think it's like 4 days or a week or something like that then it can be ticket I mean I gotta go get groceries what you've never done I think I can do that in the internet so that area can get cleaned up so if somebody leaves that car there all day they're all day it's going to get blown in or blown away. Alright, I'll go with 5. 5 PM. 5 PM to 7. 5 to 7. 5 PM to 7 AM. That is what the defining overnight is. Yep. We'll do that. We'll bring that to the final guess. Just for curiosity's sake, is this going to get opened up to other than myself, any residents who are going to be interacting with this prior to us approving it? Or is this just a town? We're just deciding this. We're deciding this. It's just more curious. You're impacting the ordinance so it has to be closed because there wasn't this idea of showing people all over the place in the moonlight and all that kind of stuff. I didn't feel the religion involved in too much. This is really just kind of defining what would happen. Well, I'm just a word of mouth. I've been, when I encounter people I know who use the lot overnight, I've been just saying, hey, just so you know when it snows, they're at the town asking us to park on the uphill side. My idea is once it's approved, I was going to hand the litter to all the owners and then they get to send it in and out. So when would this go into effect? So if you approve it at the next board meeting, let's say. It's got 15 days, but you're going to have 60 days. I mean, you're going to be until, it's probably going to be the first of February or something by the time you can. Yeah, we will. My plan was good to go. Then you need to give them enough time to go and get their permits. The plan was to get this signed and get it posted up there and then talk with the owners and say, look, this is approved. It's coming. Start training. It's already going to be happen. It almost seems like at this point we're not going to have it ready for this winter. By the time you have it, it's going to be February or March. It's going to be January. And again, I think the people that are looking there are going to appreciate what we're doing. They're going to have a kind of designated partner for themselves. It's going to be everybody else that's really the issue, but which I don't know. I really don't think it's a big issue this time of year. I think people that are working there are probably people that are living there. So we're going to start this process out before the official ordinance gets approved. And just kind of start the herd. And everyone I've talked to is completely understanding and on board for the idea of, okay, if it's snowing we park on the uphill side so they can get it. It's like, oh yeah, that's smart. Okay, I can do that. There's never been a pushback of any sort. So I think we can start getting people into those habits now. Any further discussion in regards to the parking lot ordinance? And the EU water discussion. This is the third time now we've gone over that. So last time we discussed this, there was some talk about the cost of meters even though we know we're not. What the cost of adding the meters would be. And then we had talked about what it would look like if we went back to the multifamily of commercial individual units being assessed at one EU instead of whatever that EU was. So the last three sets of data here, that's what I've done. So the addition of meters that's simply what the quarterly payment would look like with the addition of $400,000 note at either 20 years to 1%, 20 years to 2%, 30 years to 1%, 30 years to 2%. And that note is to cover the cost of installation. The meters themselves and the installation. That's what I assume. So the $400,000 came from a grant to be applied for. That did include installation. And that was years ago. That was like three years ago. So that number probably gone up, but I was using the best data. So we applied for and got a state revolving fund. We didn't take it, but we got a state revolving fund long before $400,000 for purchase and installation throughout the system. So that's what this looks like. It's that payment. So that's just the payment for that? Yeah, it's just the calculating in anybody's time to then calculate and that's just the units in the installation. That doesn't include the whatever data collection we have to do, whether that's mainly through a little reader on the house or digitally through a battery-operated sensor thing or if it's a telemetry system with a satellite like Mrs. Funder was talking about. I mean, I can be done, but it's in a copy. So we may need two or three because I don't know. That's not it. This is simply just the $400,000 to purchase and install and then at the different rates that they're looking at. The state revolving fund will do 20 or 30 years and we are assuming 1%, but until they kind of fully do what they do, it could be as much as a 2% problem. Let's move to the categories quickly. When you're looking at this one, it says addition of meters in the blue. So that's the one that's just the meter. So if you look at the column before a cost, so it says old cost and new cost. So the new cost is what we calculated with the going from all houses being a one to houses being based on their actual bedrooms and what they didn't even look like. So what I did for this addition of meters is you took the new cost plus, so whatever that number is, a budget plus the payment for the $400,000 divided by the ease, divided by for four quarters and after the payment comes out. So really all the difference between the new cost number and the 20 year is the addition of the payment in the interest. Does that make sense? So in this case here I'll just use my house as an example. So current cost would be $115 under our current system. If we went to the new cost system which was the equivalency based on the bedrooms of the, that would go from $115 to $161 a quarter. And if we base that on with the, of course, right now right now in the system we have, we can use an abundance of water, you know, we don't get charged extra. If we went to the bedroom rate it would be the same thing. It would be no metering, it would be based on bedroom usage which looks like anybody that has a home larger than two bedrooms will have to pay more from the looks of it. And then if we go to the meters, the meters it's hard to run an average but if you went to the meters it would probably be another $15 to $20 a quarter on top of the new cost. This is where we go down. So for instance right now if we went to meters it would almost be like $60 or $70 a quarter more. It may not be. Here's why. Because your new cost or even your old cost would be lower because you're only paying your fixed cost, not your consumption cost. So if I wanted to kind of go through that whole exercise I would have had 60 more columns on this spreadsheet I didn't want to do that. But the theory if we went to meters is that we wouldn't have this EU based rate of $115.42 or whatever it is. That would actually be lower because our base rate is our fixed cost and then you have a new piece that's your consumption cost. So there's a possibility that those numbers could go down or they could go up. But I was trying to make this as simple as possible based off of the rationale that we're using now. Yeah because you're right if you think about it. It could go either way because if you also you're not carrying in there that if you put in touch pads you're going to have to have something manually. And your consumption could be really high. Those 300 meters, does that mean something like that? For water meters you have some unmanual reading in every quarter. So the more I think about this I think this 100 meters is not necessarily an accurate number and I think I could fix it pretty easy. I think what we could do is just take the fixed cost plus the payment and run it with those numbers. Because you could make your base rate could be based on all your fixed, your operating cost and then your consumption cost could cover your debt. Are very good. Well yeah I got just that thinking well. Because what it's doing now is it's basically covering everything. Our fixed rate which is our new cost is covering 100%. If we had meters we would have a different billet structure because we would have our fixed cost or whatever that base rate would be. Well you're still going to have the fixed cost plus the base rate. The meter. Which would be lower. So it's 80% below that number, whatever, 8% plus the payment divided by all the other stuff. That would spit out a fixed cost base rate. I mean we would have to figure out how the consumption would relate to that. Whether you get 100 gallons per day is based into your base cost and all that. But in theory you could be paying less or more. It's hard to tell. But for this this is just basically saying that if we step slow we add meters to the system. This is what it looks like. And then the next column would only need you for apartment units. So forget about meters at this point. Meters are nice. This is simply reverting back to changing the multi-family units, the apartment units, to a 1EU per unit. Because each one has a kitchen and a bathroom and a lamp. So that whole cost is basically the new cost from the one before. Which had the EU calculated per bedroom. And the new cost is the EU calculated with the one for the individual units. And the last column is the combination of both. So this is incorporating the additional cost of the EU's plus reverting the EU calculation over the amount of EU's back to the each apartment being one. So you're saying that the new commercial apartment units away from being based on bedrooms and just being assigned 1EU per unit. Yeah, because we talked about nature bathrooms and everything. The same pictures as the house room. So those are the raw numbers. If you go to the bottom of the spreadsheet, the very, very last page probably on yours, it shows the percent increase. And that's based off of 9%, 10%, 6%, and 7%. You guys have that? No. Okay. So the ambition of that first line that we talked about. After you run the number, so the volume, what the new rate is, and the old rate, the increase that the meters are going to cause is the first line out. The first line out on the, what is it? 1% for 20 years? Is that the first one? So the addition of meters is a 9% increase. The next one is 10%, the next is 6%, and then the last one is a 7%. That's what the meter will cost. The new cost? Yes. Because we're all talking new and not already. You're just leaving the old on the four comparison. Do you have those percentages for the addition of the meters with the second addition of the meters? I don't know if I ran that. So now that's just the meter cost. Let me, I can probably run it pretty quick. I mean, presumably they'd be relatively close, because you're just offsetting... Your final numbers are still equal to each other. If you do the EU by apartment unit versus what it is. You're fine, because that increase on the apartment unit is offset decrease on your resident unit. So it should be relatively the same if not exactly. So if you go with the EUs as one EU per apartment unit, like we talked about kind of reverting back to, that puts your total EUs that we divided this all into as 839. And currently we have 524. The way we're doing that. The way we propose to do it, we're looking at 803, I think. 803.83. So you pick up the EUs which makes your preview. It goes from 75 to 24, now to 72 or 7. So that's just more data. This can go all sorts of things. But I think to really look at the cost of the meter you could have to look at basically changing how we structure our feeds. And how would that look? What would that nature be constructed for? And then go from there. And it's going to be hard to track because it's based on the assumptions that you're going to have. These fluctuations. And that's probably what we need to talk about. What is that base feed? Right now we talk about it being just our fixed costs. But I don't know if that's necessarily enough. Somehow you better talk about it. That's a base feed. That job has been done. So we're talking about a 10% increase to add meters not including data collection. So it's going to be well over a 10% increase. Yeah. Yeah. So how can brand plus the Van Gogh reader? Well and the meters have, there's three different types of meters. If you buy the heads on the meters there's something like a radio frequency that you go by and you can hopefully from a road hit this little button on your reader and it picks up that number. And those batteries actually are roughly three on a mulch piece that send out that unit, that radio frequency. You've got its laundry system with the radar with the stuff on the poles. That's super expensive. Super. But it's instantaneous. So there's no manpower with the coffee. You walk out to a centralized location, hit it in the... and then you have a touch pass where you actually have to walk out and there's a little unit that's wired to your bill and you touch it and it gives you that's the most labor intensive. And we have 300 and something. Accounts would probably take two days on a good day. Two days probably to rebuild those. And that's just the reading, not the processing that data or creating the bill from the consumption. Verifying the bills because once you read them you know there could be errors. It could be wrong. So there's a large part of that is going through the reports to make sure you're not getting these anomalies in the readings or building somebody for something ridiculous. And then you send them back out. He had to send them back out. He had to send them back out. He had to send them back out. He had to send them back out. He had 600. He had to send them back out. That's the way we did it. And you'd have to listen and say, you know, you missed one or something's wrong and you'd have to go back out. Yeah. So there's a lot of other just besides just putting a meter pass. For sure. I mean I think it's definitely important that we look at the meter option pretty closely just because we've had a lot of opposition to the way things are now and meters tends to be the louder voice. And just looking at the way this is calculated here, it doesn't exactly give me what the... I have a good feeling it's going to be an increase but it doesn't really show a pink picture right. So if we could figure that out maybe just on what a base system, the cheapest meter system would be and then any upgrades would be obviously on top of that. Just so that we can get it out there to show people that. I think we're going to need to have a discussion on what the base rate is going to be. Right. Because that's a big part of this. And we want to make sure that our base rate will cover a lot of, I mean, a majority of expenses because people decide we're not going to use water or lose our evidence. I also have to discuss how much I gave them. What is the base rate that might buy concrete today or you know how it's going to work. Because an EU is basically, so we have four meter accounts in town. So they get credit for their EU consumption. So because an EU is in gallons a day, if they had a 10, right, they're getting 2100 gallons a day of credit on their bill. So when their meter read comes in we credit them how much ever that is. So we have to talk about that too. But we've got to add 1000 gallons a month or whatever it is into that base rate. For the Israeli EU. So then you're, when you credit it back you're still making your fixed cost. Yes. Right. Oh yes, it's definitely not easy. There'd have to be a 100, 200 gallon limit that they didn't use especially if it was too bad. Oh yeah, that would be your major. If you don't give it to it then it is what it is. Well typically it is. I always see it somewhere between 1000 and 2000 dollars. And those are so you regrouping some of the costs there. You know when they're not using that much. And it helps out the people that are low users. Because there's a ton of different ways to build it. I mean we can do tier. But typically the really low users are just going to pay a base rate and they're not going to use one. That actually helps the town. So it's kind of just a trade off to help them out too. The low users are the ones that actually the town makes money. I think. Because you're allotting them. So you're allotting at 2000 gallons and you're losing 500. You're still getting paid for that 2000 gallons in your base rate. The majority of it you'll find. The majority of ours is 100. We're low. We're minimum use users. Yeah. And high users you know if we have really high users then we can talk about a tiered approach. Where they get to a certain threshold and the rate per 1000 gallons is kind of a thing. But that's all the kind of stuff that we should figure out before we can really have I think debatable numbers that we can talk to somebody that can be able to talk to all of them. I mean the more we look at the you know the system based on the bedrooms I don't get a lesser feeling about it each time we look at this thing. You know it just seems like the question that keeps popping in my head when we go to that type of system is the you know the elderly person that has a three or four bedroom home that they're living by themselves. Because obviously anything larger than a two bedroom house would go up. But you know so it just seems like we're putting a larger burden on those potential fixed income people. Kind of looking at that. But at this point however if someone wants to buy a five bedroom home then that comes with the responsibilities of having a five bedroom home too. You know. That's why I don't have a seven bedroom house because I can't afford it. But yeah it's good discussion to keep having a good job with this Greg and however we can you know I think we definitely need to you know go through the whole quarter meter option and exhaust that and we got to put some time into it just to see where we're actually at. Well I think budget time is a good time to do it. We're going to be looking at the water and sewer burden. So it's a good time to really delve into it maybe directly after the budget. Start to maybe come to a consensus on how we're going to establish those at that pace. So maybe we talk about that after the budget. Maybe we can actually start talking about that after you guys. I'm up with a starting place where we're going to start. Let's not go that way. Let's go this way. This seems like the path of least resistance. So the thing that might be working the best and what do we need to do to go down that path. I think it would be helpful to have some data on the data collection in different ways. Sure. What kind of money we're talking about. Sure. Yeah I can definitely get the installation cost, the hardware cost, and the software and then we can just kind of extrapolate, I guess, from there how much time it's going to take. You've done it in the past. I've done it. Any J-Press card will play. We'll start with every system so long in the years. I want your cops. I think we're going to softish all the ports. We've got to have those batteries. If we go with the batteries, we have a 10-year life cycle. And again we're 300-plus weeks. So you've got to start adding in our capital expenses that we're going to have to plan for the future. It's just there's a lot involved. I think after you guys have really dissected the water logic, it might be a good time to start thinking about what we're going to do. The software updates and technical support and all that. You've got to know what units you've got. Trumbull units, as we was a big Trumbull unit, GIS type unit then it wasn't cheap at all. I don't know what you guys have used but... The same thing. And then the time to do it. Maybe even finding some other towns what that cost looks like. But if we go with the meter system, that's not to go before the bomb or the whole town. It would basically be part of my intent is to go before the voters to the town and ask for a sum of money that we would borrow from the state of Baltimore most likely. And that may or may not be a quick meter. It depends on the number of conversations. At this point it does not. The water management plan... Repairs. Yes. The water management plan is what's going to dictate how long and how long. And the meters are not in that long. They're not at least in that long. That would be a separate piece but it could be funded to the same source. Doesn't have to be. It would log on. Unless we plan for it in a 20 year time or so. So do you calculate these rates? Do you put that whole meter cost into the... Yes. So that's the... It's adding the payment. So this 20 year, 100% of whatever is... Trees getting the amortization schedule and I just added the payment to the budget. And the rest of the members like we normally do. So to establish our annual rate we basically take the entire budget divided by the amount of EU's that we have and divide it by four. I understand that but... The water bills, is that going to be considered infrastructure or is that going to be considered user equipment? That would be infrastructure because the water... That $4,000 would not owe this formula because you're going to spread out a little bit. Now this is... This is based off of users. Yes. Not infrastructure. Well I think that... The EU's are based off of users. So everything goes back to the EU. And that's just the water and users. Yes. Now I think I know where you're going. It depends on how we structure this vote. But if this payment or all this infrastructure that we have to put in from the state and all of them alone, if we decide and try to get all of the townspeople to pay for that, then I think there is a cost reduction here. But that's not the way we really... Again it's basically more about the users. Is this factoring it on? I think it was Theresa sort of brought the idea up of just metering downtown businesses or businesses. I don't know if it was just downtown but this is not part of this discussion. Is that still something being tossed around or on the table at all? Everything's over. Wait until you know what your big number is. I think Greg's just kind of waiting. I don't think there's anything off the table until you know what you're going to bond for. I have some idea what you can basically, what you can afford. Yeah. I think that comes to this at all. This is based off of the status quo, how we're going in, the number of the users and that all just carries forward. And there's no change in any of the building at all. That all is assumed to be the same. Does that make sense? Yeah. It doesn't make sense to me. So no. I was just curious. That's a whole other whole thing going on for sure. The big reason it's on my mind is that people keep bringing up Ethel Mills as the example of they're probably a larger water user than we're charging them for and then they're paying for it. Is there a way to account for that or hold them accountable for that and help offset some of this? Will. That might be the best way to go about it but you can't necessarily single them out. You're going to get a meter and no one else can. You're going to get an assumption. You know, it could be way out there which is, woo, we get all this revenue but it could be nothing. And then we're making these assumptions that they're using all this water and in reality they're not. Right. But it's a way to then sort of appease those people who come meeting after meeting and say, well this is... Yeah. I mean I think it's something we could definitely put that putting meters on a lot of people. No, why is it that all of this if you can't just depending on what they say, if you can't afford to do the whole account then let's do all the commercial properties including apartments and leave the residents alone but do all the commercial properties. It just really depends on the numbers. But then we'll have to establish a base rate for those. Exactly. So it just depends on what... It depends on what they want to do with it, how much. Or we can do it like we do other meter accounts which is essentially the same thing. That's going to be used. It's not. That's a possibility. I don't know how much really implication that would have to hear because it's a variable number because it's consumption. So they're really going to try to identify that. But we could... I can kind of throw that in there because it's really based on the same method. So like our meter to cost now are being charged based on the same method as everybody else. It's so much for you to use. Then we add the consumption on time. So that would be the same way about the number. It would be put a very used tube. They would get plus whatever their consumption is and that number is such a variable. It's hard to really know what that is without having to add to the bottom. And that would be the same with all the commercial properties. We just really wouldn't know what to do. Exactly. It really just depends on what your master plan, your final number looks like. You know, you may be terrified to see that's him. Well, I mean, you currently know how many EUs you have in commercial properties, right? So you know that you have X amount of commercial properties and they have a yield of this many EUs. And if each EU right now is whatever, $115 or whatever, you know what you're charging so-called fixed... well, wouldn't be fixed. But if you did 80% of that number, that would be your so-called what should be fixed at your base rate. And then you add the equipment and then you add all your meter to that should give you a pretty close-up. Well, the way we kind of I guess feel that we're doing it equitably is we're not even going to reduce rate. We're charging the full rate when we're giving them credit for the EU, the consumption credit for the EU. Does that make sense? So it's kind of a six of one. Yeah. You're backing up the numbers. It can go a little slow, it really can. Because again, if you start talking meters, you start talking just the very first. Any further discussion in regards to water? Oh my god, no. Are you sure? Yeah. Alright. Alright, we will table that for the next time. So let me just make sure what you need from this what we're looking at now. We want to put together the cost of paper we eat, types of it. Matter of fact. Yeah. If it's possible to get a comparison, maybe not necessarily a town that they size as ours, but a comparison of what they would take into 600 people and worth 300 to buy that half just to call it some sort of equivalent to know what their manpower into it is data processing. Question cost. We have some select board meeting minutes. We have the last two, I believe the 15th, I believe we had some amendments for that. Right, but we had, I'm trying to remember now, we had several amendments to that. So the 15th, the 15th we had some amendments for that. Yes, this is the revive. It was a little change. I think you have some revisions. Any issues with the 29th? I didn't see anyone looking throughout. Well, Amos is not his name list. I'm trying to find it. She has him as Evan Post for the question mark. It's Amos Post. Where are you at? On the 29th, the second page, the top integrity energy. What's his name? Amos. U.S.D. Is it right? The last name right? Yeah, the last name is correct. On page three, there's a letter from Bethel Listers. Yeah, that's being cleaned up. So I've made that change already. We've eliminated that. Do we start this item and all that stuff? So all of us are very informational, so we just put the name of the person on there. So there's nothing else that you guys can approve of? Make one motion to approve October 15th and 29th as amended. Yep, we can't see it. All in favor? Aye. I thought we had the fifth one. Town Manager's Report? Yeah. But it started as you can see. So we'll be working with the department heads. So we had the meeting last week with the DRV. They approved the site planning. So I'm moving forward with the land and water conservation. It's kind of involved. It's a little bit of a pain, but that has to be doubt by December 17th, I believe. So I'm finishing that up and then we'll go to the next slide. So you said they approved the site plan, but they didn't go through all the specifications of square footage and setbacks and all that kind of thing. It's been overall a picture of what we're sort of proposing. The specifics are not, it's not meant to be by any means meant to be scaled. But it's not. Just because of the 10 squirts that date doesn't mean that's what it'll actually be. It'll be good after you open to it. So the skate park is still, the people on the red board are still under the impression that the skate park is limited to 5,000 square feet. If I think is what Lorde said, give me something that's no bigger than 5,000 square feet. And we'll take a look at it. So of course you're going to maximize that, huh? When they get closer to that, that kind of design will bring them back. I was talking with Carl Ketchum there, and he was concerned about how close it was. There are calls about setbacks and parking spots and all that kind of thing. He was definitely meeting, and the setback for the tip for the skate park is 15 feet, so they moved it back to make that decision for the setback. So he was okay with that. But he was dead. There were a couple of visions to it based off of some of the comments that were made, but they went ahead and looked at it. So I'll be reaching them to the architect that designed the first one, did the CAD on the first one, and they'll be putting it together here. So yeah, the Grand only event hopefully will be going at the end of December for the skate park. The water master plan? The water master plan. So the state took their sweet time and now they're open. They had all sorts of issues with this master plan. And they're looking out for Ross, which is great. But they came back with about seven pages full of comments today. So they sent out our engineer and explained to them what they wanted and what they saw and our engineer is now going land by land and addressing and changing each one of those items. So I don't say the same thing for another two or three days. So once they need it for us so that we can go over 90. So what's your address? Does it have to go back to the state for re-approval? Yeah, it should be pretty quick. It really should be really fast. So it may be, first of all, I don't know. It just really depends on how quickly our engineer can get seven pages of comments addressed and suitable for the state. Did you read through the comments? Oh yeah, I mean we're good at stuff. Who's the stuff? I mean where are we looking as a town right now? It was solely items and assumptions that were made and things that were data that really wasn't collected correctly or maybe should have been collected and was, stuff like that. It was more than the methodology of all the technical information that was in it. It wasn't that sort of numbers at all. I don't know where that was right. I haven't seen that part. Well actually I do have a draft that I can bring to you if you don't look at it. But they're not proof. No, I wasn't necessarily just thinking the numbers were more of a, you know, was the state on kind of the same wavelength that us and the engineer were? I mean was there, I think so. Was it a lot of just, you know, small technical comments or was it, you know, well we think you should do this? No, none of that. None of that. It was the, not the assumption that started, but the comments that were made and the recommendations that were made need to be validated a little more and this is how we like to do it. Kind of stuff. No big surprises. No, no. The state's not saying, oh your system's going to die tomorrow. But none of that kind of stuff. It was really more just, hey Mr. Engineer, you need to show me and prove to me how you're coming to that understanding, right, you're coming back to that, what approach you used, type of stuff. So really more technical type things. Stuff that's in the vast industry in town for sure. There were a couple things that the engineer didn't put in that the state would like to see as far as potential projects in the future. Stuff that we didn't really think were large projects but they want to see it in little things. But nothing that's going to be a substantial change from what we all thought. So I hope that we would be creating a number of things that's probably going to be a little much. And the bad thing is we need to have a number in mind when we go to the good and as to what we're going to be asking for through that level. And we may not do it. We may have to do a mid-year boat. We may have to. We may have to. It's not going to be the draft numbers. The numbers are going to be draft, report, or not. It's not going to change substantially. They're going to be generally where they need to be. And there's some big numbers there. But the report, but I'm really going to go from the report is that how they're realizing those projects. And how they think they could be putting them together. That would tell us how much we need to ask for. But they say that yeah, there's three projects that need to be done in the next five years that maybe we need to ask them all. If they say, well, there's one now and then one in four, five years and maybe another one in five years, then maybe we look and say how we can ask them to do those. So that's really what we need to do. And the bridge 33. Yeah. Do you think maybe now is the time to invite the engineering firm and me with the select board to select people? Hot seat? I can. Yeah. Sure. I mean, that's kind of what I'm thinking at this point is to ask the tough questions here in what, you know, basically at this point what they're going to do for us. Right. I can make that phone call. Yep. So in doing that, if you could just put together for us for the next meeting, maybe kind of what the estimate was because you gave us some of that stuff like, you know, maybe just informal, boom, boom, you know, this was this was the design flaw that cost us. So I'm not sure if I missed something, Greg, but at one point you were working on a harassment policy back in June or July. I think it was the last time we spoke about it. You were asking too much. I'll bring it back. You're just coming at me. Okay. I'll bring it back. I was quite pleased with what you said. And nothing will do. You said we were going to talk about SNS later. SNS? Yes. Yes. So I pulled their conditional use permit and there are no conditions in the permit to limit how many cars they can have. So the angle is to try to limit the cars that they have with our service water or well ahead. Yeah, rather protection. So that made me just have to move the cars, but what it does say in the minutes from the meeting for their permit was that they've stated that they thought that they have eight to ten cars and if things were going well they could have up to fifteen or something like that. So there is that statement from them. So I don't know if we can pursue that angle, but as far as the permit they are meeting all the conditions of the permit because there was no condition that said if you'd like to be limited on how many cars you can have. Does that permit expire at some point or is it a odd infant item? I don't imagine. Does it come up for renewing? I don't know how this was worded. I think it is a used permit service. Yes. It says in their permit that they can do they would do a small amount of service work in the back and they have to keep all their parts and pieces and all that and go back for it. Yeah, but still that's right on top of the well that it is in the flood plan. Yeah. But I just want to structure some things like that. So as far as the flood plan, don't worry about, you know, floating debris and all that. They've got a permit. They've got a condition to use permit. So they are legally authorized to be there. So they can change the oil and just put it up in the kitchen? Well, not that well ahead of me. So as far as the permit itself, I don't know that we have any legal recourse on that. Other than they have a statement saying that they thought it and they didn't know it might be a 20 car. That's a Rick thought when I talked with him. He said they didn't have a specific number but there was never more than 12 or 14 or something like that that ever came up in the discussion. But from the zoning and legal perspective, it would be tough to say hey, so what you're saying, but if there's no condition that says you can't, that's not right. If they can put a condition that says you can't, then 10 car works with them, and that's the state. But with the new zoning regs, are they grandfathered in? Oh yeah, they have permission to use permit based off the old regs. They have a permit that's the whole issue. They have it and the conditions are what the conditions are. Now the well that protection is the whole thing. Yes, because it moves. The problem with that is it actually goes more towards the high school or the school than it does towards them. I mean they're in it of course, but I'll have to see. They parked around that. That's the whole number issue. That's Tim. I think there's a legislation there. And so they look at it there with some of his sewer chub. That's the whole number issue we've been fighting for about. The parking in front. But again, that's not a condition of the permit. They're not a violation of the permit. They're a violation of being A-holes maybe, but not a violation of the permit. So the well that protection is really what I think we need to look at. And see if there's anything there that... And that may be just as simple as they may have to move the cars. I don't know. It just depends on how that language, what it says and what those limitations are. Because in the immediate area, right around the well, as you expand the forest, the limitations become less and less and less. What are our rights in that area? We're essentially leasing the land from the owner. But we do have a well that protection care, which is something that we get that we have every right. I just didn't know if we could corridor off 10 foot buffer zone or something. I didn't know if we had any recourse to put a buffer zone. The well that protection does that. So it's a circular thing. It expands out and it actually moors a little bit. But in the immediate area, it's going to circle us. That has a certain set of limitations. And then if that expands out, they change. I just need to figure out what portion of that, if all of it, then we have something to talk about. If not, maybe they just have to do some operations somewhere else. But I don't remember the permit saying that they were going to be doing some minor mechanical type stuff in the back. And that they would have all the reverse stuff up there. Mechanical is different than servicing vehicles. Yeah, they're own vehicles that they move in and out of there. They're servicing. I know folks that have bought vehicles there. They haven't serviced them. But the actual number itself, I don't have any legal authority there. The permit being contested, which it sounds like nobody contested it. They'll just give them free rein. But you guys have a good question. I'm not sure how long from now. I mean, my gut says they're about as long as the business is there. But I'm not sure. I don't think you have to come back there. I really don't. Once it's established, it's established. Your zoning regulations would say something like if they shut it down for a year, then they might... Once it's established in there, they've got the permit. Because most of the time, the only way you get in your permits that you might say something like so many truck trips a day out of a quarry or so many cars, that has to be, that's done at the time of the permitting based upon probably a adjacent property owner complaining about noise. And now that they have it, even if they said we were going to have more than 15, they could probably have 100 there now. Yeah. I'll check that. So I see something. Do you have anything else? So we have a constable report. I don't know if there was anything on there that Paul weren't talking about. Yeah. Well, yeah, I just... I think I sent you an email last year. Is this something in right? Is this some kind of written contract that we had that specifies responsibilities of us and responsibilities to him and who's going to cover what and all those kinds of things and I don't know, I wasn't involved when he was appointed. I don't know if you guys were on the board when he was appointed or what the direction was meant to be, but I just think there's a lot of questions that I have. You know, the vehicle coming over the mountain every day or every time it comes over back and forth. Should the vehicle stay here? There's just a lot of different questions about responsibilities. We don't have a contract for that. I could not find anyone that we ever had a contract with our constable. He's basically appointed as an employee and falls under our personal policy. Is there a job description? The job description I brought to you last year and it was the state statute work and that's it. That's all we have. It's the state statute. You don't have a right to define what his position really is a little more and what the expectations are. I can tell him, I'm not getting real far with it. I'm still waiting for the spreadsheet that's supposed to show me how he's splitting up. The time is on our time. He used somebody else's car and somebody else pays for the class. He's got an element in his head as to how he's making his equity, but I still haven't seen it. He reports to you, doesn't he? He does report to me. He's a talent employee. He doesn't control over. He was going to a conference. I haven't always had companies that I worked for a page for me to go to conferences. Some of these things require to get training hours and things to go to. If he's required to get to training, go kind of on his own too much and not have enough supervision. It sounds like I need to rain a little bit and just be way more all the way to do it. Well, I think if you just established the procedure, then there won't be questions. Well, I got to establish the procedure with us and the other two accounts too. They all got their own thing or whatever it is. I think in the other accounts, he just pretty much does what he needs to do. There is room over there. I think it's getting the impression from the board that this is not acceptable. There's just a fine line there between what he needs for time to go get recertified versus what might be a business day to go right. What kind of expansion should he be covering as his own? I'm not even aware of it. I'm just going to jump into him a little more and we'll get more involved in what he's actually doing. I don't know if it's possible or not if he could give us a list ahead of time of these events. I want to attend this year or this quarter. We hold him to the budget just like we do everybody else. I did. One thing I'd like to see is he's got a couple of speeds here. It says 46 to 25 nurse. He doesn't say whether he gives him the tickets or he just lets him go. I'd like to see if he stops somebody. That's just another button. There's a little spreadsheet here with his software. If you don't give him the ticket. It doesn't say anything like that. I'll tell him. I'll have him manage this report. Anything else? I just want to ask how many tax sale doses you give him I'm sorry. I can't take one of the extra dollar rooms about a quarter of a million to the attorney. They did the first round of letters which basically gave people a time frame to come up with an arrangement and we have some payments involved. We have some payment arrangements and I have not yet gone back to see the next process. The next process is going to be going through the list with Greg and then looking to see how many of those properties that we think we could find buyers for. Some of them I know I can, some of them I'm not sure about yet. To me I don't really want a tax sale if I can't find a buyer but at this point I have a list of people that are waiting for tax sales I want to buy. So I think it will be at the beginning of December before we finalize who's going to tax sale. But at least we'll have tax sales. I think you say that's a good thing. I will be adjourned. All in favor? All in right.