 OK, just while our panel members are getting seated, we'll begin to do the introductions. It's Kira Kota, I'm Phil Edgar, I'm the Manager of Digital Collections here at Te Papa, and I've been very privileged to have been the Chair of the NDF Board this year. So it's my pleasure to welcome you to the NDF sector leaders panel. This is a new thing for the NDF conference, so we're trying it out this year. One of our key goals as the National Digital Forum is of course to foster a cross-sector collaboration, and one way to do this is to facilitate conversations amongst our sector leaders, amongst those that are shaping our digital strategies and our organisational strategies. So on NDF's 15th birthday, this seemed like a great opportunity to bring together leaders from across our sector to hear about their organisation's current strategy and thinking, and to discuss how they see digital transforming their organisations now and in the future. Our host and facilitator for this session is our final keynote speaker, Kira Winesmith. And as this is Kira's first opportunity to be on stage, I'd like to introduce Kira to you now. Kira is a digital leader and strategist working across web, mobile apps, virtual and augmented reality, SMS and in-building interactives. With a focus on developing unique and meaningful digital experiences, he's led and collaborated on many award-winning projects over the last 15 years. Currently, Kira is the head of web and digital platforms at the San Francisco Museum of Modern Art and co-founder of the SF MoMA Lab. Kira holds a PhD in new media and degrees in computer science and physics. He and his work have appeared in New York Times, Wall Street Journal, San Francisco Chronicle, National Public Radio, Australian Broadcasting Service and Wired Magazine. He writes and speaks about the intersection of digital culture. And perhaps if you could join with me now and just welcoming Kira to New Zealand and to the stage. And I'd like to introduce our panel. We are very, very grateful to a number of leaders giving us their time today to be part of this panel session. Working from left to right, we're all seated in the right order. Alphabetical by surname, we have Heather Beggart, the group manager to delivery for the Ministry for Culture and Heritage. I'm Rachel Essin, Director of Content Services from the National Library of New Zealand. I've got the order wrong now. Moving one back. And Rebekah Elvie beside her, Chief Executive of Ngatanga Sound Division. We welcome Melissa Firth, who hasn't had to come far. She's the Chief Digital Officer for the Museum of New Zealand, Te Papa. David Gainster, we welcome you to New Zealand, to Wellington and to your first National Digital Forum conference. It's great to have you here from the Auckland War Memorial Museum. And finally, Anthony Moss, Director of Government, Rekord Keeping at Archives in New Zealand. Welcome. So, how the panel will run? So, we're going to have a five-minute presentation from each of our panel members talking to their institution's current strategy. And I realise that it's quite a big ask to sum up strategic direction in five minutes. So, a bit of a challenge there. Kia, we'll pick up the conversation and build in questions that we've sourced from you during the conference. And we do hope also that there'll be an opportunity for a couple of questions from the floor at the end of the session. So, I'd like to welcome our first speaker to the floor, and it's Heva. Thank you. Nama, Inui Kia ora koutou. Wonderful to be here, thanks very much. I run the delivery group at the Ministry for Cultural Heritage and a number of my staff are here in the audience today. Lovely to see you all. The emphasis of my presentation will talk broadly about the Ministry's strategy and purpose, but a particular emphasis on the work we do in the delivery group. We are the public face, if you like, of the Ministry. Do I have a clicker? Excellent. Lovely. That would be handy. Thank you very much. So, connections. Connecting people with culture, the cultures of New Zealand of Aotearoa, connecting through storytelling. This is what we do at the Ministry for Culture and Heritage. We create, we make, and we support connections within through both digital and physical platforms. We connect people across communities and cultures, seeking to reflect the diversity of views, perspectives and traditions. And we do this to promote a confident and connected culture. That's our purpose. Confident in who we are, knowledgeable about our history, our heritage, to be invested in it, to be proud of it and proud of our heritage. Confident about our place in the world and confident about our future. So, our goal is to connect more people with the culture of New Zealand, and especially to connect what we call the unconnected. Those who are vulnerable, disadvantaged in our society and or whose important perspectives are well represented in the New Zealand narrative. We connect people with places. This is the National War Memorial Park, Pukiahu. So, places that are important to our nation's history and also to our future, that both embody and shape who we are as New Zealanders. At our National War Memorial Park in Wellington, we're seeking to connect a broader audience with our military heritage, but also national expressions of citizenship and commemoration. In the 1930s, if not aware, probably one of the first national crowd-sourcing projects, our National War Memorial was opened and more than 10,000 people attended that opening ceremony on Anzac Day in 1932. New Zealand's population at the time was 1.5 million. Today, an average of 76,000 people visit Pukiahu each year, and in the 2015 Anzac Day commemoration as part of the World War I centenary, over 40,000 people attended. So, we connect people across time and place as well with the ancestors to understand and appreciate their genealogy, the generations who have given service to people and to this country, those who have protected and nurtured the rights and opportunities and legacies we enjoy today. So, these are stories that we research. We research with others. We support research others to do, and we share them. We partner with others to tell their stories. So, we're in the storytelling business. It's a privilege we share with all of you here, and our focus in the ministry is on stories about our national identity, our whakapapa, stories about diversity, views and stories that connect people with our unique Māori heritage and culture. Our audience is broad, ranging from school children to new New Zealanders and to veterans in their descendants. We facilitate events and experiences to promote storytelling and to engage communities and commemorations, like this one coming up in 2019. We engage communities and uplift the stories that they wish to share. We like to think, we give voice to stories that people might not otherwise hear but need to be heard and shared. We also fund and monitor a range of agencies, some of which are here today, and we administer contestable funds that support the expression of New Zealand's culture, creativity and identity. We capture moments of history, powerful snapshots of our evolving culture which resonate with New Zealanders wherever they live. We also care for some of our nation's treasures of our tonga. We look after national icons like these, our flag, our national anthem, coat of arms. These are all important to all New Zealanders who are born here, those who migrate here, past, present and future generations, stories that express who we are as a nation. Getting the time nod here. Our digital platform is where we connect the most New Zealanders abroad audience. We've seen a 10% increase over the last four years in these various websites that we support. We now have over 10 million visitors each year and a lot more through our social media channels. We've refreshed our digital strategy recently to place digital publishing at the centre of our public engagement activities. And to inform this strategy, we undertook some face-to-face audience research. In short, it told us that our products are trusted, the credible, and are relied on by a wide range of users, including students, teachers, librarians and lifelong learners. But to keep pace in a crowded marketplace, we needed to diversify the subjects, the viewpoints and the type of material we publish, with increasing emphasis on co-creation with communities and producing rich media experiences. So here's a bit of an example of how we're doing this. This is our Te Tai Treaty settlement stories project. We've partnered with Iwi like Ngati Awa to co-create and co-fund their settlement journey narrative. And our aim here is to use multi-media formats to engage a wider audience, to strengthen public understanding of the treaty in the settlements process for the benefit of Iwi and of New Zealand. We're also partnering with the Ministry of Education, which means this content can be used for the education material and curricula, and we're looking to produce material content as well. I can just go back and play that video clip. Look, this wasn't just yesterday. This was a few hours ago in the grand scheme of time that all of our land here, from Waitahanui down to the Haaparapara River, including Te Whanapurui Ngai Tai and Whakatoia, was confiscated because of the actions of probably three people who had killed James Falloon and some of the crew of the cutter, Kate. Because of that action, all of our lands were confiscated, and I just couldn't understand that having studied law, and it just struck me as being completely unjust and wrong on any basis. So that's how we plan to connect more New Zealanders through Story Challenge to promote a confident and connect to New Zealand. Thanks, Heather. Let's keep going. Kia ora tātou katoa. My name's Rebecca Elvie, and I'm Chief Executive Tumu Whakarai at Ngātaunga Sound & Vision, New Zealand's Audiovisual Archive. We are in the digital game whether we like it or not, and, fortunately, we like it. And that's because, increasingly, as most of you'll be aware, almost all audiovisual content that's created today is born digital. So for us, a decision to be digital or not be digital was never really an option. It was going to happen, and the question was, how are we going to go about it, and how are we going to make sure that we were doing so in a sustainable, effective and long-term a way to ensure that we weren't taking a lot of steps now that we're going to ultimately prove to be flawed or fruitless in terms of those technologies and formats becoming unavailable at some point in the future. So for us, the themes of today's panel are really, really poignant sustainability in the sense of the pathway, the technology pathway that we choose is an incredibly important strategic question that we have to ask ourselves and regularly re-ask ourselves to make sure that we're on the right path. So with most AV material being born digital today, that does two things for us. One, it makes our job more challenging in the terms that there's a great deal more material being produced. So in the old days, people made films and it was an event and people dressed up. If I'm talking about home movies, people dressed up and it was a very important occasion and it was expensive to do. And those films were kept, and they were kept safe and they were tucked away somewhere and they were bought out on special occasions. Today, we get out of cell phones or our, you know, mini video cameras or sound recorders and anything is captured. Everything is captured. A lot of it is probably relatively low value and the trouble is it's all intermingled with the things that are incredibly valuable and important pieces of our nation's heritage. So one of the things we have to grapple with is how do we make sense of that? How do we make sure that we are able to educate the creators of that content about our role and how we can help to make sure that those precious taonga are captured and to do so in a way that's really easy and inexpensive. The other upside, I guess, of material being born digital these days is that it means that our role in sharing and making that content available is a lot easier than it used to be. Certainly our organisation and its predecessor organisations gained something of a reputation for being quite hard to get material from for reuse. Regardless of whether that was a commercial reuse or a not-for-profit reuse or just a family who wanted to see Nana who had been on television or had been in a film or an advert. But digital material, obviously, you can share it, you still have it, you're not losing anything. So we see huge benefits in being in a digital space. But it's also a cultural journey for us as an organisation. So those same archival instincts that wanted to keep material safe and out of the hands of prying eyes and other people, they still exist. That is still how some of our very, very talented and very professional archivists think about the work that they do. And many of them are still handling the physical objects as well as the digital. So how do you start taking your team on a journey that says sharing the material isn't actually going to harm it. It's something we should be doing and we should doing it more and more often. I know we're on short time frame, so that's probably the main things for me. Storytelling though, clearly a theme for us as well. That's the business we're in. It's fictional stories and it's non-fictional stories and everything in between. Sometimes they get a bit muddy in the middle and it's absolutely what gets our staff up in the morning. It's that ability to connect people with their stories and whanau with their tupuna. It's a phenomenal industry to work in and we love it. So, thank you. Kia ora. Kia ora koutou. I'm Rachel Essen National Library and I'm already hearing some themes that are coming out. The National Library and I are the same age. It's a bit of a confession and like the National Library there is more information about me available online. The caption from the Nelson photo news April 1966, the year I'm really giving it away and it reads Jim and Angela Essen and little Rachel have come to Nelson from Wellington Jim's an entomologist with the DSIR. This is being digitised and made freely available. I just put that in because it is that connection that we've been talking about and that connection to whanau and the information that's out there. But getting on to the National Library and our strategic directions turning knowledge into value is what we're calling our strategic directions. We're looking out towards 2030 and there's a very worthy statement there that talks about creating cultural and economic value. We consulted widely throughout 2016 with stakeholders with other public libraries researchers and we distilled all of the feedback into three strategic themes, taonga, reading and knowledge. As we worked to develop these themes and understand what they encompassed it became very clear to us that they were integrated, connected and they reinforced each other. And I think also we've heard today that other institutions have similar themes again that would be integrated, connected and reinforcing. The motivation or some of the discussions that we've had was about wanting to solve real world problems and that value wasn't just economic value but there is a whole range of understanding and definitions of value. Improving literacy to boost social participation is a really important aspect of what we're looking to do and the issues of social cohesion and connection which have already been referred to. Just going very quickly into a little bit more detail about each of the themes, taonga, New Zealanders will trust that their documentary heritage is collected, protected and accessible. We're wanting to really develop some more formal frameworks of who's collecting what. Museums, libraries, universities we want to identify the gaps, reduce duplication and leverage specialist infrastructure and for example digital preservation something I'm sure is close to the hearts of a lot of us here. One of the really aspirational things that we've got in the strategic work programme under taonga is that large scale digitisation this physical knowledge resources that all of the ones that are important will be digitised we won't be doing that on our own so we will be looking to partner. Reading we know that there's an issue in New Zealand with functional literacy and we think that there's a role for libraries, for museums and galleries to be able to help with that. Reading for pleasure digital literacy and digital inclusion and te reo Maori revitalisation are all things that we're looking at working on under that strand and knowledge and this is really about connecting New Zealanders removing some of the barriers to accessing knowledge. We know that sometimes our institutions make things hard to find and then when you find them it's not always easy to use them so we really want to work to do that. There's a little bit. The other thing that I'm particularly interested in is the concept of collaborative ready practitioners. I think we really need to focus on developing a workforce that has the skills and the mindset to work together to work across our institutions and around the country. In healthcare there's this concept of collaborative ready practitioners they've been doing a lot of work about how do you actually develop a workforce that can work across professions such as physicians, physios and the research shows that you get better health outcomes for your community if those practitioners understand how each other works and I think in the sector that we work in we should be doing better in terms of that. I'd like us to think of ourselves like a perfectly functioning New Zealand health system that we're working together to achieve the best outcomes for New Zealand. OK. Do you not talk amongst yourselves? OK. Kia ora tatou. I'm Melissa Firth, CDO at Te Papa. I've got just one slide today which is this Southern Cross and we've recently encapsulated our strategic narrative as a Southern Cross rather than a North Star which you sometimes hear about. We've been on a journey of renewal for the last probably two and a half, three years and that journey of renewal will continue over the next five years under the new Chief Executive, Geraint Martin and that renewal covers everything from renewal of the building and facilities to a sequence renewal of our permanent exhibitions to a new conceptual framework that we're putting finishing touches on for the next five years of programming that docks back into the original concepts from which Te Papa was born 20 years ago. It also covers investment in digital over the last couple of years and also looking at how we streamline our back-of-house processes and systems so that we're being efficient and sustainable in what we do. The digital strategy for Te Papa I guess does not stand apart from the objectives and the purpose of Te Papa across that Southern Cross of past, present and future. And so when we designed it a few years ago, we were really thinking about how do we add value to the museum and amplify the impacts across each one of those dimensions. So in the past space, for example digital is really about increasing use of and access to the collections by people and again it's about connection. Some of the things we've done in that space already include upgrading our collections online platform with an API and setting up an accelerated digitisation programme. In the present space that's obviously about audience and participation and I should say that circle in the middle there of people and cultures is the culturalism is sort of the central basis on which Te Papa was built and makes Te Papa so different from so many museums in the world. So the present aspect of that obviously is about exhibitions and learning invigorating our learning programmes and our events. Also how digital experience feeds into that and creates new connections that are relevant and engaging with the public. And also we're using channels like online and social. Some of you may have heard Michelle speak before increasing awareness of what we have and what we hold that is going to be useful and valuable to the public. In the future space that is about, talked about this before in relation to Mahuki the future is emergent so it involves conversation and collaboration between people and Mahuki is one side of that in terms of how we have invited and creative industries around Te Papa and all of the knowledge and assets we have in ways that generate new value but also the work of Te Papa's NSTP team sector development, iwi engagement all of that really fits in that future space. How do we work together? How do we create a safe place for challenging conversations and really dock back into that notion of Te Papa as a forum for the nation? At the bottom of that Southern Cross is sustainable business and again with digital the third pillar of our digital strategy over the last few years and this won't go away is how do we use the transformative properties of technology to increase the effectiveness of what we do, whether it's reaching more people, whether it's creating scale and what we're able to put up in front of the public, whether it's collapsing the time needed for a back of house process and some of the things we've been doing there include things like an experience delivery platform that has halved the amount of time it takes us to create interactives on the floor a digital asset management system that will make it easier for the storytelling folks in the museum across marketing comms, exhibition experiences to find assets and use them to tell stories faster and richer way. I see that in the future going more towards actually how we underpin every aspect of the museum's business with technology that makes everybody's lives easier. That's work in progress. Thank you. Thank you. Kia ora koutou. David Gamestiff from Auckland Museum. Like Te Papa, we're also going through a sort of strategic reboot thinking about the future thinking about what success looks like in five years, ten years time and of course one of our key themes and key priorities for the development of the Auckland Museum and our place in New Zealand's fastest growing city and most diverse city is of course digital and in that sense we have maintained our ambition to be a leading museum in the digital domain. I just want to quickly cover a number of key themes within that ambition and that strategic priority. One being access and openness to collections and assets, one being the creation of digital assets a third being the digital experience that we can offer and another final one I'll just touch on very quickly and that's about our connectivity if we move to the there it is I've found the right button. So in terms of open collections, open data and I know that that's been a focus for conversation discussion here at the meeting it's very important to recognise that there's been a huge paradigm shift in the museums and galleries community internationally over the last few years we've moved from a traditional model where collections of access was exclusive to a position which enables open digital access as a default and the Auckland Museum is a leader in this democratic process and we will continue to push the boundaries for the benefit of communities for research and education to enable audiences and our communities to make connections and find meaning in our assets we will invest further in our public interface and enabling a deeper interrogation of our images and data including the whole process and practice of developing community knowledge and sharing knowledge creating new content that's a shared enterprise with our knowledge holders around the community and that is something I think that distinguishes the Auckland Museum's content from many others we want to be seen as a leading digital museum in terms of that visitor experience that is now going to be accelerated through our big investment capital programme investment around our galleries and our facilities over the next few years a huge multi-million dollar investment in far greater exhibition space more galleries but really enriched and improved digital overlay supporting and accelerating understanding of those collections and those displays that I think is an interesting area for discussion it's about how we innovate new digital interfaces and how we adopt existing ones to find the right formula for what we want to achieve in terms of sharing our knowledge and in the creation around our assets we're also thinking about how we use the digital to enable people to create a stronger and more effective visitor journey both in terms of orientation and wayfinding I think that's an enormous challenge of course when one of the primary parts of the museum business is the destination offer and with a large encyclopedic museum like the Auckland Museum but humanities and science collections and stories how to navigate a cultural journey through that content is one focus for our digital strategy and that'll be no different here at Tepapa the other final theme really is about connectivity it's about connecting the assets and the stories to create new cultural journeys through the institution with onsite and online I mentioned that digital interface there it's also not just about us and this is where I think the digital asset can completely transform the position of the institution within the wider cultural ecology you'll find that in other big metropolitan centres around the world that institutions are bringing assets together through the digital platform connecting collections and stories across the city and completely transforming that visitor journey Auckland has a very rich collection of cultural institutions and assets but they've never worked in a connected, joined up way and I think that's been at the detriment of the outcomes for Aucklanders and for visitors and I think that we can improve that position we can actually create a new time through a joint digital platform and that's what we're working on at the moment for Auckland a new journey across the cities, cultural assets across museums, across galleries across archives, across libraries anybody who wants to explore the Maori or Pacific culture can do that now or will be able to do that more effectively in the next few years through that platform so that's the commitment and that's the innovation that we want to drive to really reposition and sort of nail that role of the Metropolitan Museum I'm doing great but I'm just finished I think it'll reinforce and cement the role of the Metropolitan Museum as a key driver for the creation of the smart city that's the big ambition what defines the global city in the 21st century and I think that museums, galleries, libraries and archives have an absolutely pivotal role to play in that definition and reforging of the global city and we'll come back to that conversation I hope, thank you Tony Kia ora koutou Tony Moss from Archives New Zealand we, like our departmental colleagues at National Library have been working on a new strategy in the last year and we launched it in May not coincidental that we were working on these things at the same time and I think we've produced with some degree of interoperability, compatible strategies with at least our National Library colleagues but I hope with the broader glam sector where we interact with it it's a very simple strategy with three of course there's always three three main focus areas it's magic number that's right we ran for us a reasonably extensive consultation process with a little bit the usual suspects when we're consulting but a pretty broad process to really to test what should the direction of archives New Zealand be we had a pretty confident idea about our role, about where we should be heading but we wanted to test it and well I think we were more or less on the right track because most of the feedback we got was yeah that's right, what you're proposing is the right thing to do, just do more of it do it better do it in a more interconnected way do it smarter and do it for us please no I paraphrase but look we've ended up with I think a very neat strategy the three focus areas one taking archives to the people to upholding transparency and three building systems together so there are a combination of things that we want to do as an organisation how we want to deliver services and how we're going to work together with other institutions but with the people the people we serve and while we're in the DIA context we have strong connections with the library on what is the overlaying digital strategy layer because we do already work closely together in so many areas and we want to maximise those opportunities for improving delivery so what are they all about taking archives to the people pretty self-explanatory on the face of it but it's quite big getting government information government records and public archives more readily accessible for a wider ever wider group of users promoting what we do and what we can provide to users of archives and gearing up as an organisation for growth in our physical and digital holdings now it's not just there, it's not just archives it is government information so it's current records and archives that we're interested in likewise upholding transparency now that's a key component of what archives as an entity does under the public records act and we were encouraged to see pretty strong support for that role amongst the stakeholders we consulted it's reinforcing our intent, not surprisingly to fulfil our statutory role to support open government principles and to enable government to be held to account through the creation and maintenance and accessibility of full and accurate records that's at the heart of the function we perform as Archives New Zealand under the Public Records Act and so we are upholding transparency we are looking to our archival holdings of historical material but we are looking out across the whole of government the public sector very broadly defined the third leg of the strategy building systems together that's just a way of working that we want to follow and realistically we need to follow the investment we all require for new platforms for pushing information out and making accessible to the people is always going to be huge and it's obvious the more we can work together the better result we'll get also you've run out of time sorry do you want I didn't mean to cut your tiny bit of housekeeping I'm going to pour a glass of water and I'm going to stand over there and while that's happening everyone who's in the wings could you come in and if you're right on the edges could you let the people sitting on the stairs and kind of stuck so come in off the wings everyone come and make some room if you're right on the edge there and then we're going to get into the questions alright thanks everyone first to the whole panel as people are sort of settling in you weren't able to see Minister Curran's I don't think everyone's able to see Minister Curran's opening address yesterday she touched on a few key points that for me as an Australian working in the US I wasn't aware of and wasn't really looking at and I'm curious I think it opens for us a door to think about how the glam sector is going to interact with government going forward but also how the glam sector can take advantage of this moment and that's something that's really unique but maybe that's just my reading but also this environment and having worked in the US, in Australia and in Europe there is things about New Zealand that the rest of the world cannot do your lack of states, your functional government relative wealth, high education I live in America functional government you have a functional government so I think that opens for some opportunities and there's something that she talked about a number of ways about a lot of you touched on this notion of collaboration of working together and in the museum sector, especially in the US consortial efforts have almost all failed the wreckage on the side of the museum consortium road is is replete for the last 20 years or so what is different about your institutions what is different about this moment or what is different about your practice that means that you will be able to collaborate effectively and create new cultural journeys for New Zealanders in this moment I'm open to anyone to start to address that I'll just suggest that I think the key thing about consortia is that they are not over engineered in the US, I think the US experience has been to create very heavy architecture and I think we need to move towards business, collaboration and partnership, joint venture collaborations which support both or more parties to say develop their audience to get cross visitation to reach parts of the ecology that they haven't yet got a stake in so it's really about finding light touch business driven quite focused initiatives that can get real value so short sharp interventions no heavy architecture and the thing about the kind of government local government situation is that there's always a tendency to move towards that kind of architecture and I think if you to look at how the tech sector works and business innovation doesn't work like that at all it's business driven joint venture and that's how it works and that's what we need to learn and then I'm going to ask about staff. I was just going to say from the National Labor's perspective in terms of our strategic directions and delivering those what is different is that we're recognising the resource that it requires to collaborate well and looking to actually to shift resource to be able to do that so we're looking at the collective impact model and recognising that you need to have a backbone and that is deliberately focusing on developing a shared agenda and actually having the resource to drive that to have the reporting and to do all of the work that goes along with it I think often what happens is that you think collaboration just means a few meetings and then stuff will just happen but actually it's work and you need to recognise that and you need to fund and resource it. The cash cry the work that the Government Chief Digital Officer does and his staff do in the Department of Internal Affairs is centrally led collaboratively delivered so it is a cash phrase and you talk about backbone, racialise sometimes we do need to have though a bit of backbone I put my regulator hat on quite enthusiastically sometimes there is a place for regulators to set rules sometimes there is a place for regulators and central bodies to provide shared services that can be taken up because there needs to be a leadership role and I think thinking about the New Zealand context that will often be central Government just because we have such a strong central Government and less well resourced other layers of Government. Karen also mentioned the idea of a CTO for New Zealand which I thought was an interesting turn of phrase the CTO lifespan I think is reaching an end certainly reaching reduced utility certainly in the museum sector in the US but then I started thinking ok so say I was going to hire a CTO for New Zealand and I was writing a job description what would I put as the first essential responsibility so I'm curious to the panel if you were hiring a CTO for New Zealand make sure that GLAM's work was valued was included in some way but not central but included if you're writing that job description yourself what would you put one of the essential responsibilities that you'd like to see maybe start with people who don't work for Government first Tough question Kea I think it's interesting that it's a CTO role because that implies a lot of really the underpinnings around cyber security you know data all of that kind of stuff and that's really important but I think the other thing that's really important that can so often be overlooked is that that interface with the audience and actually the experience side of it and you know people like Pea War it's very wonderful that we've got somebody like Pea and her colleagues at the DIA really thinking about how Government digital services are made more human so that would probably be at the top of my list I actually have Pea's response to this question I'll read that out afterwards so does anyone else want to I think that one of the key things that someone in such a role would need to be thinking about is how to optimise the investment because you've got lots and lots of disparate parts that's not limited as you say to the glam sector but I mean we're all making investments in IT and technology and digital infrastructure and you know we're a small country we probably can't afford to all be doing different things in different ways at different times and so having some way of capturing an overview of what's going on so that you know if we need a digital asset management system and we know that TAPUP has just built one well let's grab that and make sure that we're leveraging that investment from each other and being flighty and agile and ideally getting ahead of the game so that if we need a few different things in ours than TAPUP does then we've thought about that at the development stage rather than after the fact so that ability to look across and look for those opportunities to leverage investment from the outset I think David you touched on this idea of an Auckland base but obviously New Zealand focused set of tools also set of practices and approaches would you lean on government for support in that was that something do you think the Auckland Museum is placed to drive itself an interesting question about whether we would ask government to support a metropolitan institution like the Auckland Museum I think there's another conversation but because it would break the paradigm maybe digital will do that would be very interesting but we are plowing for we are forging ahead focusing on innovation and actually exploiting and building on the platforms that we have created and invested in so we are going to create a digital cross-search platform for Auckland using our own assets and investment as the basis for that so I mean I think a lot can be done with existing resources it's just the strategic collaboration that's missing so we need to get that right and I think a lot can be done it doesn't need to be the full architecture it can be a gradual and staged approach but we need to get some quick wins and we need to do some more prototyping and we need to be more experimental we need to learn from practice and I think that's what we're committed to and I think there's a lot that we can be doing with institutions outside our own sector as well and we can learn from industry and we need to invest in infrastructure that enables incubators and start-ups to work with us in a more effective way I think we need to rethink some of the existing models for how we develop as an institution and that will become increasingly I think a collaborative one but based on mutual business interests so I think we can do that in a city like Auckland and I'm excited to explore that possibility further It's a cheeky plug here for my talk which is going to cover a lot of that ground I'm going to read what Pia said she suggested that the CTO would need a function to bridge across sectors to create collaboration opportunities and a room for experimentation keep abreast of emerging tech and then obviously with her Government hat on support democratic engagement for all I'm thinking Heather if you could talk to what you would like to see in such a role and then we're going to move to questions of sustainability If I agree with the comments that have been made about having a bit of a strategic map of what actually is already underway and where those gaps are and how do we bring everyone along on that journey and look across and see where those opportunities are to leverage what already has been invested where the quick wins can be and beyond the technology solutions as well so what are the fresh ideas about how structural other reform and change can facilitate that working together and being collaborative in that approach because we are a small nation and we have to but in a way that really medicine is going to make a difference for New Zealand I think there's a lot that museums in the glam acronym can learn from libraries and archives and I'm curious in thinking about sustainability the big themes that have been coming out when I looked through all the questions on Twitter when I looked through the questions that came from the board the three epochs of digital transformation and I haven't asked a lot about that because I think you've all covered it pretty well sustainability was really key and then thinking about inspiration and sort of an eye to the future on sustainability looking at libraries and archives for answers or approaches there's a sort of common adage that every technology system you build you spend 10% of your time looking after it, tending it making sure it doesn't fall over if it's two institutions, five institutions working together they're all spending some amount of their time tending it when the library and archives thinks about these systems that they want to syndicate for people to adopt how do you bake in sustainability into your strategies and practices? Certainly from our perspective because of the volumes of data that we create we have to be thinking about the lifetime cost of digitising a title so it used to be that when a preservation effort was made the conservation of a physical object you got to then put it in a vault now you're paying the power bill because you still need to keep your LTO tapes in a climate controlled vault fortunately they're a lot smaller but you then have to bring it out every few years and migrate it to the next format of LTO tape and so you're entering into a lifelong exercise and sustaining and nurturing and carrying forward that data multiple copies of it probably through its lifetime and so thinking about things in that way has radically transformed the way we invest in our infrastructure and our technology but the nice thing about it is it also means well we're here for the long haul and there are a lot of people doing similar things to us who are working to much shorter timelines so we see a real opportunity for us to be thinking about things we need to do anyway investments we need to make anyway for example in server farms all the broadcasters all of the content creators are doing on smaller scale in little bits and this opportunity to say well why should we all do it why don't we do it big you piggyback off what we have to do anyway and actually we build in that sort of sustainable infrastructure investment over the long term so I think that's really exciting but it's also a big leap of faith because what we would be saying is to the TVNZs and the RNZs and to the world don't build your own use ours and they are used to being even more so than any of us are completely independent stand-alone commercial entities that would at least so perhaps for RNZ but obviously they don't want to be reliant on other service providers if they can help it so it's an interesting discussion and of course for us sustainability is also about environmental sustainability we're running as our others massive climate controlled infrastructure that uses a lot of power and staff sustainability obviously and sustainability of the knowledge around how the systems function I think is to give Tony do you want to tack on the end of that? Sorry there are interesting examples in government again archives and libraries are working together on digital preservation using Rosetta the ex-liberus product and we you know we have within our institutions thought the next steps not with any concrete decisions yet but there is a clear possibility there of presenting that offering to a broader market as a service for example and consuming as a service rather than buying kit is a common approach within government at the moment and there's no reason why that couldn't extend out into broader sectors as well so there is potential there and I think there are models that are more or less working within government that maybe can be expanded That can create a challenge at the moment though for institutions that are capital funded for projects but don't necessarily then get additional operating ongoing so you know when you're coming at it from a tech angle where best practice is agile and it's nimble and you know you build a minimum viable product and then you test and you learn and then you build the next but the classic kind of prints two way of funding and assuring projects does not match that model and so when you're thinking about well we've created these platforms how are we going to sustain them over time if you add more platforms that means more operating and that's in the case of an institution like Tapa where we're building digital architecture for the first time that's operating that doesn't exist at the moment so we've got to work out how to create the capacity to do that It probably means actually changing the structure of the institution Yeah well yeah I've often wondered and maybe Pia might have a comment on this too how the GCIO balances that tension between actually you know tech into the cloud and the consumption of services as opposed to build your own and actually all of the governance processes that go along with classic procurement At the Museum Computer Network Conference it was in Pittsburgh it was his 50th year it was the 50th year of sort of computation in a museum context the first the program for the first one which was in New York 50 years ago actually tubes wow you know like that's literally the level and now we're talking about these really nuanced approaches to say you know a big theme this year was sustaining innovation not even what is innovation not even does it have a place but like how do you keep it up and I think and this is turning into a question rather than an anecdote How are you thinking about the structure of your organisations like who works for whom and how they work to sustain innovation or even like first of all to make it possible but more importantly to sustain innovation beyond simply what we just talked about aligning staff how do we make structures that sustain and create and sustain innovation so that we can be contemporary because we must be contemporary our audiences are already there So I gave a bit of a talk about Te Papa's innovation story at the Mahukisho case on Thursday at last week and I think innovation is not the preserve of Mahuki or kind of one team that's off on the side doing stuff it's actually a mindset and it's a mindset that anybody can pick up and that is how can I improve what I'm working on right now and you know in the kind of classic model of exhibition development some of the ways Te Papa has brought in new innovation is by partnering you know bugs and Gallipoli we partnered with Weta on that and that created a new way of storytelling in a museum space in museum education I don't know how many of you have been to see Hinatore up on level 4 but taking a steam learning lab idea and really applying kind of creative technologies to culture and heritage in ways that engage kids in a totally different way so that's come through from our learning teams our digital team works with everyone from the exhibition teams and how experience, how we're going to interpret things differently through to experimenting with content for an audience development perspective and I think if everybody actually thinks what can I improve and what I'm doing at the moment innovation is really about intentional change that makes things better, it's not necessarily just digital. I couldn't agree more. Can I add something quick to that at the National Library we've set up an innovation group which is kind of cross-organisation Fiona, your convener, Feldstein's been really involved with that and that is starting to pay dividends but it is putting something very intentional in place to do what Melissa told me about which is say that innovation can happen anywhere and actually give it a bit of funding and a bit of space and encourage it but the other thing I think is that environment where it's safe to fail and that's certainly a challenge within Government that's not necessarily terribly safe to fail so we have to balance that and we have to create that environment. David, six months then from a different environment what are you thinking in your institution that you need to reshape to prepare yourselves for the future you've described? I have to be careful what I say, I've got several colleagues in the audience it's alright you've still got a job in the audience. I think for us it's really thinking about the future and we've been thinking a lot in the process of our five-year strategy and really leading with the digital museum and the way it's transforming the museum right across all our operations from collections management curatorial to the visitor experience and to our external connectivity it's absolutely fundamental and we are really a question about how we become a digital museum and how we mainstream innovation as part of our business as usual operation and yes there will be structural change, there will be a greater emphasis there I think about how we manage all of our assets as digital born content becomes an increasingly a really growing part of our asset that's going to change the shape of the organisation as well and that will be increasingly visible in terms of the gallery floor experience but I think also for us it's not just about us, it's about how we engage with our collaborators partners and our audiences and it's about sharing knowledge creation going forward and I'm very taken by some of the experiences I've already noted here in Australasia which are really interesting in terms of bringing innovators and start-ups into the business to work with them to develop your own business model and develop innovation together and there's a synergy there really interesting strategic synergy and I've been very impressed by what I've seen in Melbourne and Acme for example about that kind of practice which I think is really changing the paradigm so that'll be interesting for us in Auckland as we become a much more collaborative networked sector and that will change all of us institutionally and that will change some of our structures this is a real tipping point for our sector which is very exciting and that is only in line with what I'm seeing in Europe and North America and elsewhere right now There's a lot of interesting stuff in there I'm curious then giving this language of tipping point people have been saying like there's a rare opportunity lots of language about an available moment that in theory there must be grasped in that context what is NDF's role in helping New Zealand shape this future Maybe I need to ask NDF that Is he or she here? Let me ask it in a more practical sense You have colleagues who are in the audience your institutions are supporting this organisation and have for 15 years you've been attending and spending money on it people are putting in hours on presentations and it's a meaningful part of why your sector is more successful than most in the world What are you hoping they get out of being here What are you hoping they're getting out of this engagement with this group I think the value of NDF is the value that it has provided since the beginning which is it's an opportunity for people across the glam sector to get together and share knowledge and one of the unique things about this conference is actually the sort of generosity and openness within which learnings are shared and like any community of practice you draw energy from getting together with other people who share the same challenges and opportunities that you have and you know compare notes really so it feels like it's a good function that's continuing well That was lovely and didn't help illuminate So let's talk then About the last few minutes we got together on inspiration there's a number of questions came through on Twitter and in person so I might start at the near side looking outside of New Zealand beyond NDF because it's clearly a place that we all get inspiration looking outside where are you looking and where's the ministry looking for inspiration about how you can improve your practices I don't think there's a single place that the ministry is a whole lot so I think across the ministry even though we're small there are a number of people who are connected in various places and look to different countries and spaces for inspiration I had a benefit of spending a week in the Silicon Valley recently and that was an incredible experience to see what's happening there at pace and how some of the design thinking that's reflected here in New Zealand is actually really helping us to understand and think through what is it that people want and actually we need to really understand the customer's needs and orientate our product and service but also our culture and our way of working in an organisation to align to that as well for me personally my inspiration is my kids because they spend far too much time in their devices but I'm just really interested in the sorts of things that they pick up the information they take on board how it comes to them and how that facilitates conversations they have with their peers and the future generation obviously but just bearing in mind that that is happening day in and day out within our homes those of you who have children and how you can take those experiences and those observations to inform directly what you do in your work so you don't have to actually go and see an expert opinion and they're in your homes Awesome, that's yes I totally agree as a parent thinking also about where the rest of the world can gain inspiration from this community what should I be taking back to America? I think there are probably two main things I think certainly for our organisation a lot of our inspiration comes from the collections which in many regards comes from a Māori proverb which is about walking backwards into the future so the idea that who we are and where we've come from helps us understand where we're going and why and I think that one of the really precious parts of the work that we do is connecting those moving images with the ancestors of the people who are in them and just the extreme power and emotion that comes from that when you see someone realise that that was my auntie and they're no longer with us but I can hear their voice it's quite phenomenal and I think the other thing that probably we certainly don't and as New Zealanders we're also very reluctant to say we're good at something but one thing we are clearly aspiring to be better at is our relationship with Ewi and the Treaty Partnership we're a charitable trust and not technically part of the Treaty of Waitangi at all except that it was built into our constitution in the 80s so this idea that there are different world views and different ways of looking at the work that we do and understanding it many of our partner organisations overseas the other film and television archives are predominantly commercial content they feature films that were created in the last century and that's not our predominant focus our predominant focus is actually on films from Ewi that show aspects of Māori life and Māori heritage that is very rare to find overseas and it forces you in a good way to think in a really different way about your practice that I think is something that we should be a little bit proud of we're still Kiwi but a little bit proud of on an international stage it seems totally apparent to me as someone who's been adjacent but never sort of involved in the sector here that the way that the cultures are embedded there is genuine biculturalism where indigenous peoples are treated with a level of respect and engagement that is simply not apparent in any other places I've worked and I've worked in places that have established indigenous cultures that are essentially obliterated so I think that's something that the world could absolutely learn from I want to end with a library Rachel what would you like to have adopted outside of New Zealand? What bit of New Zealand would you like the rest of the world to say that's great, we're going to do exactly that I spent a little bit of time sort of thinking about that when there was a heads up about one of the questions might be what could be inspirational to people from other countries and I think like Rebecca the relationship with iwi Māori is particularly important aspect of what we do He Tohu which is the titidity and the suffrage and the He Whakaputanga exhibition that opened earlier this year at the National Library the archives documents but a partnership with iwi, with archives in the library I think is truly inspirational and if you haven't been to visit, please do little plug there but alongside that I think one of the things that we've done is made up of subject headings and again that is a real partnership where we have a group that works together from made up of iwi representatives to Rapa Whakao the Library Association for Māori librarians and National Library staff and to actually create Māori subject headings that are then used in world catalogue records that can be searched online I think that's the kind of thing that I would love to see other overseas institutions do with their indigenous communities and their languages so I think that's something that although the kumara doesn't like to see how sweet it is I do think that that is something that we should be immensely proud of Can you join me in thanking the panel and also like a little thanks for Philip who gave me all of the background and made it sure that I actually knew what I was talking about and so thank you for that I'd like to also thank the panel thank you so much for giving up your time for this. We won't wait another 15 years to do this again and thank you to Kia for being such a warm welcoming, honest and challenging host and judging by the Twitter feed it sounds like it's been very engaging and very well received so thank you very much again and next session will start in about three minutes so