 Good morning and my apologies for the delay. I am actually unwell. Anyway, let us begin with our presentations. So, is our friend Rudra Murthy here? Yes. So, why don't you... Good morning, everyone. My name is Rudra Murthy. I'll be sharing my views about the TED Talk. Why insist on English? This TED Talk was delivered by Patricia Rann. Patricia Rann, she is an English teacher by profession who moved to Dubai around 30 years ago. She has seen various cultural and linguistic changes. And in this talk, she raises an important concern about language loss and globalization of English. So, before moving to language loss, she recalls an incident where one of her colleagues who teaches English to the adults, takes them to the garden to enrich their vocabulary. But what happens is, the teacher, she learns the Arabic names of those plants, their medicinal uses, their cosmetic uses. So, how did they get this knowledge? So, they might have got this knowledge from their grandparents. And how did their grandparents get this knowledge? So, that must be from their great-grandparents through their language as the medium. So, when a language loses, we don't know what we lose, because there's a wealth of knowledge which is embedded in it. And we might be inaccessible to that wealth of knowledge. And at the other extreme, we have globalization of English. Could there be a connection between these two? We don't know. Let's see what she answers. So, why is the world moving towards English? She tries to answer it. So, what she says is, according to the world's latest university rankings, the best education is to be found in the universities of the UK and the US. So, in order to get admitted to these universities, one has to pass a test. And that test is based on linguistic barrier. So, it makes sense to have a linguistic barrier if one needs to get admitted to the School of MBA or School of Law. But how valid it would be to reject a person solely based on his linguistic skills if he wants to get admitted to a chemical sciences discipline or an electrical sciences discipline. And the other reason for globalization of English could be, most of the research now is conducted in English. She calls this a self-fulfilling prophecy. So, she questions what happened to the translations where people translated text from one language to the other. And we are not seeing such translations now. So, it doesn't make sense to reject a person solely based on his linguistic skills. Let's not put this linguistic barrier. And also, she is not against English, which is seen in our talk. She says that the world requires a global knowledge. And we have chosen English to be our global language. But we need to define a boundary. It shouldn't end up being that English is the global language and just we have an handful of languages. Because there are various other languages existing in the world. And we don't know what knowledge has been encoded in them. So, we need to preserve those languages to extract the traditional knowledge which is imbibed in it. So, she concludes the talk by giving a message, to be an harmony between English and other languages. Let's not completely give priority to English and neglect our languages. So, we shall give equal priority to English as well as our languages. And coming to the critic aspect of the talk. So, I am in tune with whatever she says. And I don't have much thing to contradict whatever she has said in our talk. Thank you. So, he does not have much to say about the talk nor does he have much to contradict. But any strong views from the rest of the class based on what he said about English and other languages. We should be concerned with this topic, right? We have 17 major languages of the world spoken here. And some people claim that the emergence of English as the only language being emphasized by everybody, causes a danger for smooth progress of other languages. Is that true? Or there is no such danger? How many of you come from areas where English is not routinely spoken as a broad social exchange? So, some other languages spoken, whatever Hindi, Marathi, Telugu etc. So, what is your opinion based on the TED talk that he presented briefly? What is your opinion about the emphasis on English in India? Would it cause harm to Indian languages? Or it would not matter? Or something special needs to be done? Okay, so let us use the think-pair-share and try to resolve this issue because I would like you to consult with each other. So, talk to your neighbours. It's your fault too. Next two minutes. And don't do it as a part of an assignment. Do it as if you are deeply concerned with it. Discuss this. You can discuss this in not very loud voices but discuss it with among your friends. The issue is that are Indian languages in danger of getting extinct over next 100 or 200 years if this emphasis on English continues? Okay. So, some discussion has happened. Have you reached any conclusions? Some conclusions. So, let's begin from the other end and let's have the conclusions heard one after another from each group. She tells your name and anyone of you can speak. You can do all the three names and then speak. Hi, I am Karan Poonamia. This is Kupnel Ghursani and Shashwat Rohila. The discussion we were having was, while it is essential for a global language to exist. So, English serves as a medium for speaking to the global mass as such. But in this case what is happening is the languages that we have, the current major languages that we have. We are ignoring those languages because we see profit in learning the global language and there is not much we can gain by learning the languages that we have. Like we were discussing regarding Sanskrit. So, while a few selected mass of people have knowledge in Sanskrit but majority of the people don't approach Sanskrit because there is nothing that we have. There is not much that we can gain by knowing something in Sanskrit. So, because of that what is happening is that we are losing out on a very major chunk of literature that we already have in Sanskrit. And many people in India are not able to comprehend what exactly they are trying to say. So, in this case and there are certain older languages like Pali, Ardhamagdi in which we have a very large amount of literature that those languages are not spoken at all in India as such nowadays. So, that literature that amount of information that our ancestors had collected those are practically rendered useless now. People are just reciting it as it is but then they actually don't know the meaning of majority of the text that they are reading. So, what we were discussing was that learning English is not bad. You need to learn a global language but apart from that there should be some focus on learning and usage of the local languages that we speak. You can see that they have carefully chosen languages which are practically dead socially. Sanskrit, Ardhamagdi, Pali are not spoken at all. They actually wanted a comment on the existing Indian languages which are largely still even now. So, what do you think about Hindi, Telugu, Marathi, Tamil, Hindi, Gujarati, Punjabi, Rajasthani? The English is a global language and it should be. But there is, I don't think there will be any danger in our national languages. If they are taught properly then apart besides with English our global language, the national language can also be taught simultaneously. And the student curriculum should be maintained accordingly. And one more thing we don't need to speak in English to teach someone English. So, we should talk in Hindi or some national language only. English should be enough so that the person can communicate anywhere else. They should not be taught as hard as people. Okay. What is your opinion, friends? Who would like to speak on YouTube? Tell us your name. My name is Abhay Gajabee. I have discussed with Swapnil Jaiswal and Vani. I would like to contradict with Shah Swat. Actually, what I am saying today that parents totally communicate with their children in English. In cities, they don't know their native language and also they don't speak in Hindi. So I think that our native languages are just dying slowly. Even in small towns that children are, they are given the knowledge of their native language. And then in schools, they are taught while translating the words, it's proper. But in bigger cities like Mumbai and Delhi, they promise communicating English only. That's a rather strong judgmental position. Is it based on any proper statistics either collected by someone else or it's your feeling? Experience, very good. Experience, what is the sample space? You all learn statistics. Experience, you know, I agree. You go out to the malls. So how many? One thousand? Hundred? Twenty-five? No, no, no. I'm talking about something else. I'm talking about statistical significance of a sample size to reach conclusions. What you say is important, but is it true or is it based on the sample size which is not large enough to indicate statistically, concludable, no, so what numbers? This is another one we should be aware of. Because if we make concluding statements, either they should be based on a survey, like for example, what they call, whole outcome surveys. Now whether you agree with them or not, they try to present it in terms of statistically significant speakers. But I'll tell you some surveys which have been conducted in smaller places and surveys which have been conducted particularly in large and small places amongst families which are economically not well-to-do families. And these surveys indicate a very drastic trade where the families, the parents believe that the only solace for their children to go up is to learn English and they forcibly put their children in English medium schools. So in Maharashtra itself, for example, a large number of Marathi schools are either closing or there are no students and a large number of English schools have propped up where there are large number of students and yet they are extremely poorly coached because particularly because their families cannot converse in English and their families are unable to give the language support which is required at home when the children are studying that language, which never happens with native language because people speak native language. So this has been shown to be statistically true and that is where we say that the danger is that contributions to the Indian languages in future which comes from the society, you see, authors, poets, etc., don't fall from the sky. They come from the same society. So if that society does not indulge in educating their children into their native languages sufficiently well, then there is a danger that contribution to that language might over a long period of time. So I personally dread the future where as they mentioned Pali, Ardhamagdi and Sanskrit which are socially read languages should that same thing happen to Hindi, Telugu, Tamil, Bengali, Gujarati. I do not know. Fortunately we will not be alive to see that time but there is a problem at least as far as the status is good. The second question is that while English is emerging as a global language and practically everybody in every nation and society attempts to learn English but in the western societies and in the developed countries this is not happening at the cost of their language. This is not happening at the cost of their language. For example, you go to Japan, you go to even a slightly underdeveloped country like Turkey. Or you go to France, Germany or Russia. Practically entire education and the dialogues between parents and children continues to be in their native language. The writing even of scientific finding continues to be in their native language. They learn English only to ensure that globally they remain competent if they take up any job or if they have to interact with the global population. But this is consciously being done by those countries. Perhaps some of us might like to think that some such strategy where a very good and strong support for the Indian languages plus an adequate training in the global language perhaps could be the best combination. Anyway I speculate. Our friends here. My name is Murugesh Mohanan. To start with, I will state my opinion that no country's example can be taken as a precedent for India. There is no other country which has the language diversity that we have. And my second opinion is that the greatest danger to any Indian language is not English but another Indian language. The strongest culture imperialism in our country is from people who would like to get one single common language that's the national language. Let it be Hindi or let it be something else. It's not English that is problem here, it is ourselves. I think very wonderfully spoken and very bluntly spoken. Have you realized the truth of what he is saying? That the danger to Indian languages is not from an external language like English but from other languages and parochialism that you see sometimes amongst people. I do not know but when I was a student, there was a huge wave in the north in the city of Indore where I studied where any what you can say notification in language other than Hindi was black painted and so on. And there was a counter wave in Tamil Nadu where anything that was painted in Hindi or any other language was black painted. These kind of problems are perhaps greater problems to us. And the second and most important point is that we cannot take any other nation as an example for us because simply there is no other nation with this kind of diversity. So you'll have to figure out our own ways of solving problems. Thank you. What did your group discuss? Nothing much to add. I agree with Murugesh point that and I don't feel like anyway our region language is going to be killed off that soon anyway. No, not that soon. I am talking about 200 years. Yeah, maybe, yeah. But yeah, we can't really predict about that right now. That's what I feel. So he doesn't, yeah. Yeah, Murugesh. In the English of today, we are the English of 200 years now. English 200 years ago was not English today and English 200 years later will not be English today. Languages continue to evolve. But as somebody mentioned the literature in those languages continues to thrive and continues to be enjoyed by people all over the world. And it is the continuous contribution to the literature which actually keeps the language alive in some sense. So that was the only reason I mentioned that continued contribution to the languages not from scientists and researchers necessarily alone, but from other people who use the language and who relate to the language users. That should not fall down below certain level. That is it. See for example, I will suggest one thing. How many of you have known of Kural's? Kural's anybody heard of them? You never read them? There are Hindi translations available. Thirukural used to be compulsory learning in Tamil schools at least 50 years ago. I do not know now. Or now also, okay. The wisdom that is exhibited in those beautifully constructed standards is none less than anything that you find in either Gita or Bible or anywhere else. In fact, some of the things that you might consider, but there is a beautiful book written by Srinivasan, the CEO of X, CEO of 3I Infotech on the observations in Kural's which are meaningful for modern management. Modern management. Now I can see some interest in the eyes of people. You might want to read that book. Now the point is what exactly is the equivalent of those Kural's that has been constructed in Tamil in last 50 years? Of course, such constructions are very rare. Gita was written only once for example. What equivalent has been written in any other language is doubtful. People have translated Gita. So people have translated Kural's. But what I meant was that the contributions of that magnitude continuously being attempted by the authors and people in different languages. So that was the context. Okay, you have some observations. Hello, my name is Vivek. I will give you example of my nephew. He is studying in English medium, but he can speak Gujarati also. But I have seen he has trouble in reading and writing Gujarati language. So I think probably after 100 years maybe our native language will be spoken, but it will be not a problem. Again this is a rather small sample size, one person. This sample size is significant because he is relating to a close observation amongst people of his own family. And I think many others can relate to similar instances. By the way, in Mumbai city, the big city somebody mentioned, it is absolutely correct that in big cities many people take Mumbai for example, which is a conglomerate of practically speakers of all major languages in the country. And yet you will find that there are many children who can speak their language, who can probably read their language but who may not be able to read comfortably in their language. I think that is an important topic. Let's go to the group of girls who were arguing very vehemently as I could see them. Any observations? Nobody was to speak? Actually I have read somewhere that the language we speak affects the way we think. So it affects our thoughts. So means every language has its peculiarities which reflects the culture or the value based on which we are based on. So if one generation is trying to make their children to teach English by prioritizing English and not taking care of teaching their native language to them, then they should be aware that they are depriving them of thinking in the way their culture is. Means they will not be that much close to their base, that much close to their values. And I think which is important for our progress. There is one question that I would like to raise. Do we all agree that whatever be the state of affairs, any language whether it is Indian language or global language that is being used by people, the language better be used correctly than do we agree all of us? That the correct usage of any language is important whether it is global language or our language. And therefore we should be concerned whether the children of the next generation wrongly use a language whether it is English or Gujarati or Marathi or Tamil, it doesn't matter. But should it not be important to emphasize that whichever language you use, you use it correctly. I think that much is a common conclusion. So he is pointing out another important issue. There are dialects of the language. In fact, people say that languages change every 20 miles. And dialects do exist. Just as we have diversity of the majorly used languages, we also have a lot of dialects of all of these languages. And as he points out, he claims that Rajasthan is not a language, but it's a dialect which is a spoken language. Many of the languages in the north incidentally which use Devnagari to write may not have their script, but it may not be exactly correct to say that these are not full-fledged languages. Kokani does not have a script, for example. But it's a fairly well-established language, perhaps emerged as a dialect of something. But this is a problem on which does anybody have an opinion? What happens to the dialects? Is it that one of the dialects becomes a mainstream language, whereas the other dialects sort of survive around it? Is it that dialects, because they not much written material have a danger of being extinct, because there is no written literature in that? If that was so, then Marwadi would not have been spoken in nooks and corners of the country, more or less in the same way in which the Marwadi is spoken in Rajasthan, carried by the families. But it's a spoken language, not written language, as you point out. So that's another dimension of dialects. There are places near Tanjavur in Tamil Nadu where there are a lot of Marwadi-speaking people. I was quite astonished to find that two of my colleagues in the department of computer science had their mother tongue written as Marwadi. One was Professor Ramesh who has left us since then, but the other is Professor Sudarshan himself. Now, however, I tried to listen to the Marwadi that they speak at home, and I couldn't figure out. It is not Tamil Marwadi, it is Marwadi still, but spoken in a completely different way. So, yes, yes. So, he is now adding one more dimension. What happens to such languages or what happens to such dialects? Okay, fine. We'll have one more opinion from here and then that group, and then we'll have to close. Mostly these are disappearing because we are more on learning English and all those things. We are now not, I am Rajasthani, but I am not able to speak proper Rajasthani because my grandfather, my grandmother always speaks in Rajasthani. But what we have heard from childhood was a mix-up of Rajasthani and Hindi. So, we are not able to communicate properly in that language. So, now means many things as because of maybe media and education and all these things we are involved in much more languages like English, Hindi. So, we are not able to speak any one language properly, not Hindi, not English and not Rajasthani and all native languages. She has a grouse that because of variety of circumstances she is not able to speak any language well, whether it is her own mother tongue, whether it is Hindi or whether it is English. Let me tell you that such is the dilemma faced by a large number of people of both my generation and your generation. And what we should be concerned about is what happened to the next generation. So, let's have one more opinion from this group here. Somebody would like to say, no, you at the end. I think it is easy to say that we should do all this but there should be a concrete incentive for people to do this. When you say that people have moved away from regional languages, there is a reason for that. There is some truth in the fact that people are finding use in English, learning English. So, unless we incentivize learning their regional language, there is no point in idealizing all this. Since you said incentive, I will say that in Tamil Nadu, there is a rule that all friends must learn Tamil. So, I don't know if this rule exists everywhere but the end in Tamil Nadu, it is like a sharp. The first language, the sharp name should be written only in Tamil. The second only should be written in English or any other language for that matter. Sometimes it feels like people are fanatic about the language but of course it also means that your language is deep rooted in still. The language will not get eroded very soon. It's interesting that he mentions compulsion. By the way, most states have that rule. So in Maharashtra, for example, learning Marathi is compulsory. And I know of a case not now but 35 years ago when a bright girl had come from Tamil Nadu when she was in 9th standard and she was surprised to find that she will have to appear for a Marathi, for a 10th board. She studied Marathi for one year. You can imagine that 10th standard Marathi would not be same as being able to just write, she scored 74% marks in that Marathi paper. Neither that girl was extraordinarily bright or there was something terribly lacking in the way that 10th standard examinations in Marathi were conducted. Well, the latter was true which she herself confessed. She could not write Marathi properly but she knew the kind of questions which are asked. She could mug up answers to many of them. She could practice writing exactly those answers many times. And when the questions came appropriately in the exam, she could write those. So compulsion is not necessarily the only way to ensure this. Incidentally, about the signboards, in Korea there is no signboard that you will see which is in English. And it is not because of any compulsion. There is no compulsion there. In China, the Chinese equivalent of IAS examination, etc., are conducted in Chinese. They are not conducted in global language. And China is a larger global economic power than India even today. So it is not necessary that a global language must be adopted by the nation as a whole. For global interaction, you may need that language. Here what is happening is people feel that knowing English is the only way out. You are talking about incentives or you are talking about compulsion. My contention is either need not work properly, perhaps a judicial combination might work. Consider this class itself. There is an incentive of having such discussions, presentations, learning the language slightly better and therefore that being useful to all of us. There is a compulsion that if you don't attend regularly, you will fail. Although there are no credits, they have pass-fail course. Now look at how a majority of the people who have interpreted this compulsion. Look at this entire empty desk here. I counted. There are exactly 35 out of 125 people presented. 35 out of 125. So what do we make out of this? Compulsions and incentives both have failed. Why? They have figured out that Patak is a Lallu, he will eventually pass everybody. So I don't have to worry. Now once you reach that conclusion, then you quickly come to another conclusion that while there might be some merit in attending classes, there are more important things in life to be done, particularly at this type of the year and therefore it is not necessary to waste one's time in getting up very early in the morning on Tuesday and slightly less early in the morning on Thursdays and come there. So this is the conclusion that even bright human beings who qualify to join MTAG and PhD program of IIT Bombay can easily draw. What do you expect from the lesser mortals in this society? Will they not reach their own conclusions like that? So whatever is the incentive and whatever is the compulsion, each human being and the family of a child is capable of evaluating those and they evaluate what is in the best interest of either the child or the family. And if the best interest is served by something else, for example getting the children admitted to an English school, although there is no support system, so be it. I think that is what happens there. Yeah. The main point of my saying is that if we do study in our native language, we can get what is the exact point of study for any kind of material in less amount of time, much, much less amount of time and comparative to English. So it might get speed up in progress if we see in terms of progress. Then there will be much speed up in the progress in the research. If we do research within our native language, we can do if there are translators are present. We do our research in native language and based on translator, translate it into might be in English or other languages. Yeah. My name is Mahendra Kanani. I give my own example. When I study a sentence which are made up of two or three sentences, I have to read two or three times to understand what exact it want to say. When I study in Gujarati, I have to only read only one, one time, only once. Quite unknowingly, he is probably telling us about the ease with which your own mother tongue is studied or learned when you learn to write. It is probably not because of anything else but because of the fact that from your childhood, you were listening to the words and sentences being spoken in that language. Your mind was far more ready to understand that language when you first encountered it in written form. The same thing would happen in families where English is routinely spoken by everybody right from the child. That is the importance of the language that is spoken at home when you are growing. Don't forget what Prasaprakashvaitya mentioned about the development of human brain. The patterns are set very early for understanding those. Thank you. Bye.