 Good afternoon. Welcome to Corona virus and our mental health. Today is May 25th and I'm Ken Burton is coming to you from Hollywood up on the North Shore. Now, a week ago Sunday the New York Times made it official, they put on their cover, which for the first time ever extended to their back cover a double page showing 1 million dots, signifying 1 million Americans who have died from the coronavirus. And yet people are demasking. They're throwing their mask in the trash they're out in big groups. It still feels to most people like we're back to normal. Are we're closely getting to that and yet there are still surges back and forth. And if you look at the Hawaii statistics. New York Times tells us as of yesterday, May 24. The daily average number of new coronavirus cases in the past week is 1000. 1000 new cases. Every day, this last week in Hawaii. Now that's nothing to sneeze at. You know, it better have your mask on if you're doing the sneezing I'll tell you. Today, I have my good friend, Daniel live with me. Daniel was with me in March, you may have seen that show. Daniel is a man of many hats, and in March he had on his psychologist at, and we talked about therapy. Well today, Daniel has his spiritual hat on. Daniel is a rabbi. And when he was a young man he was a Taoist. So he is rich in spiritual tradition. I want to talk about how spirituality can help us in these dark times with coronavirus. Daniel, welcome to the show. Thank you so much. It's great to be here. It's great to have you. You know, we're not only dealing with coronavirus. But we're dealing with so many other dark clouds in the sky. I mean we've got the war in Ukraine. We've got mass shootings. We've got climate change. We've got inflation. It just boggles the mind I can't even keep track of how many dark clouds there are in the sky. And yet spirituality can be a great support for us. It can help us see the clear parts of the sky it can help us see the way to a better day. So, I would surely appreciate it if you could start us off and tell us a little bit how spirituality does that. Just to kind of put it in a little bit of context. Spirituality is a term that's used since the 70s heavily to indicate some kind of spiritual life, whether it is in a formal religious form, Christianity, Judaism, Islam, you know, Shintoism, whatever. Or more newer forms that may draw from inspiration is one of my clients that I don't go to church, but I believe in God, and that was her, she had her own way of doing so. Spirituality is very potent way to help someone be in the world. But again, I'm aware some people watching these shows are not necessarily identifying themselves as religious or spiritual. So essentially I'm going to be describing what a person who's religious or spiritual what their experience from my experience of them is I've worked with a lot of different folks from a lot of different people. So, just to write off one aspect of spirituality again looking at what the different traditions may have in common their differences. The one thing in common is this sense that there is either a being or a force of some kind. I want to find out what the universe wants from me or others will say I want to know what God wants from me or Krishna or whoever. There's a sense of a force and in many of these traditions, some kind of relationship, even in certain Buddhist traditions you don't have a relationship necessarily with God, but is sense of your own Buddha nature or the being in the world. What is this relationship that can really help folks through these dark and difficult times. Well that's a big, that's a big item support because during these times, a lot of our support has been cut off. We've been cut off from people. We've been cut off from our daily activities are groups and everything. What are you saying and what I certainly believe is, if we can look inside that spirituality whatever our own spirituality is, it can be a supporter in these times. One of these things, one of the things that you and I talked about before this show was, we have a tendency to take life for granted. We have expectations of life. And when things go wrong, those expectations are sort of lost. And we think, my God, where am I you know, this is not where I'm supposed to be. This is not where I was headed to and all of a sudden. I mean this different place with different rules and I'm lost. And I think spirituality can find that for us. I don't know. Part of that, that lost feeling is feeling at least like you were kind of alluded to before isolated that during COVID a lot of us are isolated from our usual social scenes. And paradoxically, at least again in my tradition and perhaps in others, one way to connect with the spirit or the force of the universe is through people. Is is making relationships with people, even through zoom or other ways that helps greatly. But the sense of being lost does also get diminished. When we come back to developing our own relationship with our spiritual source. Okay. The 12 step groups have a wonderful name to hire power or power that's not necessarily above, but it, when we connect with it, we feel higher so from a more standard religious perspective it would be God and I want to see how God is helping how can I do that I need to develop my relationship and many traditions is through meditation or prayer, or studying spiritually inspiring texts. These are ways that people will connect it's all about in a way connection of that develops the relationship even more strongly so you're less alone even if you're not connecting with so many people. I've been doing a study little study group with with a couple of folks and that it really makes my week it because I'm preparing. I'm connecting. I'm thinking. I'm also have my own particular spiritual practices like prayer and meditation that helps me connect. I feel less lost when that occurs. You know, when we're talking about this it's not only you know when you're talking it bounced off my mind that it's not only people that we're not connecting with it's the moment that we're not connecting with when we expect something different and we find that we're sort of lost. We're looking around but we're not seeing that moment we're not living that moment. That moment also gives us that connection where we can connect up with our own spirituality. You find that in your groups as well I assume. Well definitely this. At least from a Jewish tradition there are a couple of concepts one is yesh and the others I am these are Hebrew words yesh means there is. I am means there is not early aim, but on a spiritual spiritual level yesh means we're seeing things from a dualistic perspective. I have expectations I am separate from my life experience and I'm not getting what I want. And that's very frustrating versus a small spiritual or even mystical approach is I am is there are no separation. We're all connected. Okay. So in every moment as I I connect to the unification or whatever moment I'm going to find out what I need to do in that moment. And so that helps me let go of some of the frustrations I have and say okay here I am feeling isolated what can I do to connect with life right now. And, and taking that, whether it's from a formal spiritual perspective or practice or just as a person, going out into nature, for example, is a very spiritual practice for many people. You feel connected to the world around you, and can let go at least temporarily some of the, I'm over here and you're over there we're all separate. We need that to function in the world, but sometimes we go a little too extreme and it leads to a lot of uncomfortable feelings and disappointments. Absolutely. Yeah, the, I connect up every evening on my line. It's the pleasure of Daniel and his wife market being up on that line. This last week. But every night at five between five and six I go on the night and I connect with the animals, the birds, the sky, the trees, my yard, the garden. And I did that for an hour and it gives me such a such a relief and from that. I mean living in a place like Hawaii is such a blessing. It's such a wonder how beautiful this island is. And once I connect with that moment I can also see the people that I cannot see immediately like I can. I can envision my daughter who's in Kailua an hour away from me in the drive just by sitting on my own the night. I can connect with her I can connect with you. I can connect with other friends. If I only just take a breath and be in that moment and then it comes to me, rather than sitting there and listening to the news and going, oh no, oh my God, you know, whatever you say, you know, we're in big trouble. You know, I'm lost type of thing. I mean, when you make that connection I know we're talking more spirituality here, but psychologically, physically, these kinds of practices are very good for us. They create more peace, more positive sense of well being, you feel more grounded and less lost. And the losses in your life, people have passed on. It helps us cope with it better, helps us move forward better. And so yeah, that's great that you do that. And can we follow that up because that was the next thing I was wanted to talk about was that feeling of loss, loss and grief that so many people have gone through those million people that have died in this country. And so many people have touched so many other lives and those other lives that are still here. Yeah, I'm missing them and feel that very strongly it's like, like part of you has been cut out. How can we deal with that kind of grieving through spirituality, Daniel. Well I won't pretend I have all the answers but something I learned a long time ago I used to work at a synagogue I was a Hebrew teacher, and I heard this terrible story about one of our kids got run over by a car. And the rabbi was sitting with the parents and can you imagine it's like the most painful thing the parents wanted to know, where was God and all this you know they're trying to figure this out. And again coming from more mainstream religious perspective and he said you know, in Hebrew, there are two names for God, or two, two basic names for God is Elohim, and yeah. They have qualities, because they're not just a being it's how we experience again back to a relationship so Elohim we experience as bam, things happen, you know. Oh, this thing started happening you know, many of them wonderfully surprising and many of them, not wonderfully surprising like losing somebody, losing someone to coven. And we see, you know, where's God what's going on I'm so uncomfortable I'm so sad. And this rabbi said but then there's yeah, there is the God of compassion. That aspect of God helps us to deal with the other aspect, you can replace the word God with life doesn't matter what matters is that there are things we can do we can connect with connecting with our spiritual source can help us go through our grieving. And maybe even find meaning within that. That as we take that moment or two, even just to whether you wanted to say, I need some help. Just feel the presence or like you going out being in the presence of the world, not trying to find an answer, just being present there. That is what one way I'm familiar to deal with those things that come down so hard and we don't know the answers we don't know why we feel angry. This is key is spiritual connection, even if you're mad at God that's part of a relationship or mad at the universe, however you want to conceive of it. This is a way is to be present with it and connect with in any way you can. That helps us cope. Yeah, and I totally agree with that, but the difficulty is that with some people. It's very easy words to say, you know, we're, we're sitting here and we're telling people, take a moment, live in the live in that moment, see that moment identify with it. And those words sound good, and I tell that to people, and they try it, and it works for a couple seconds and then boom, you know, all of a sudden the world crashes in again. The mind up here, just going going going on all the negatives. And those few seconds of spirituality of refreshment of joy just goes yet to keep them in that. It's hard to, it's easy to say but really hard for people to do. And I keep trying to tell them keep working at it. But it's difficult. I don't know. I think it's one of the things that have been successful for you in these areas. One thing is, it depends on what stage the person is. If they just lost someone. I'm not going to give them advice. I'll just be present with them. I can do they want to just talk a listen or whatever. But at another stage that may be ready to try some of these things are here. I've not been a great Hasidic Rev I said that suffering tends to fade away when we are really connected with our purpose in life when I'm doing those kinds of practices and you're right it is a practice to be in the world to be in the world yet connect with a spiritual connection of some kind. Like I said, whether it's God or however you want to conceive of it or just being with life, that as you, it takes work because we are trained in a dualistic world to think we're separate. And it's hard to come together but when we do things that connect with our purpose in life to become connected. Then those things that we thought were suffering cease to be the same. It becomes less painful. It becomes even on some level at some point strengthening there's something you familiar with post traumatic stress disorder. There's there's a whole field of therapy for it, or perspective called post traumatic growth. That going through these difficult situations actually can help us grow. And some of the ways they can help us to reach that is exactly what we're talking here to have some quiet moments to do our best to notice those thoughts of sadness, or whatever comes through us and honor them not necessarily push them away, but honor them, and then refocus ourselves back. Let's say we're just doing some meditation we were hanging out, taking a walk in the woods or whatever and just walk in the woods. And yes, take those with you, because they are eventually going to let you know something really important in your life. And then they'll eventually transform into something else that won't be quite as painful. Yeah, I totally agree that it well put thank you. One of the things that I've tried in the past. Because it is so difficult to to keep practicing to keep trying that. Every time the world intrudes and stops us and blocks us it's a, people take it as a defeat. Right. And oftentimes I'll try to give them something to do. That's beyond just thinking something, not just cognitive. Sometimes I'll just say, turn your head. And look at it from a different side. Every time you feel like the world's crashing in. And you're going to be defeated it's going to overrun you to the side, or my favorite is to look up and look up and see the heavens and get strength to say I can try this I can keep at this I will keep doing this. I can find a clear spot in this dark sky. But the physical part seemed to help people a lot as well as just simply the cognitive part. Yeah, I know it sounds sort of silly but hugging a tree or laying on the beach and feel the ground beneath you or sit somewhere and feel the ground beneath you. The intent is not, oh I'm going to do this and is it working. You know, no, we're not trying to get rid of these feelings or thoughts they're there. It's part of the whole process. So, you know, whether you're praying or meditating or just being present in an experience like taking a walk in the park. It's just be there but also accept yeah I'm going to have these thoughts and that's part of it, not to try to get rid of it. Let it be there and refocus your attention as best you can. It's, you know, you'll get the interference thought oh but that's not happening. And that's just another distraction. Okay, here you sit over here, and we're going to do this. So, it's all part of it all the feeling of lost this. Just let it be there. But bring yourself into some kind of experience where you're focusing on something like the breath or like the world around you. You know, a good world around you if you're in a place that feels too negative get out find a more positive place. I keep coming back to the woods in or the beach or natural environments naturally can help us to to feel that sense of oneness being in the ocean. You know, those kinds of thing, or being with with people you love and just hanging with them. When I first moved to the North Shore. And that was 1977. How many years ago is that I know we want to go above. But one of the things one of my friends did here on the North Shore was we went to my may have alley took me to why may have alley for the first time. And we hiked back to the falls. And one of the first things he had us do and we were there. There was about five or six of us. He had to stop along the way and hug a tree. Yeah, so every, every time somebody says to me hug a tree, I'm back in why pay a valley. Hugging a tree on my way to the glorious waterfall and the swimming that can be done there and it's that is another thing that if for some reason you can't leave your house, close your eyes and go somewhere in your imagination. That is your memory. Right, that's a very spiritual practice too because if you had like like what I was there with you I was hugging a tree with you on the on the on the road to why may have. You can go back to an experience you've had and replay it and re experience it inside, and that is just a strong way to connect as going out somewhere. Absolutely. And we're getting to sort of the my favorite part of this full talk and that is the thing I love best about spirituality. And that is the hope that it engenders. I know we talked about this before so can we take a moment and can you tell us a little bit give us a little perspective on the hope that spirituality can give us. Yes, well again, it depends on what's tradition but often just having a belief like I have one client. He's going through some really hard stuff. And he said but you know I know God's going to take care of me. He has a certain level of faith and that increases his sense of hope even though it's going through hard times. It's going to be okay in the end. So on that level the sense of belief in in that you are going to align with your spiritual source. The other is these practices I keep talking about. Okay, they actually if we can calm down enough on the inside and feel a connection with the world. That often starts to increase a sense of confidence of hope. As we let those negative thoughts or feelings be there but not overly focus on them. We can make room for that other part of us on the inside to come up bubble up. And that one way to describe that is hope. Yeah, it's an amazing thing because it. It brings out the best in us. And that's what we need we need to see the best of us during these dark times. We see where we've failed where we've fallen short. And we can't be there to comfort loved ones when they're sick, for instance, when we can't do the things to help people that we used to do. That erodes our confidence but if we in touch with the spirituality and not only the spirituality of our higher power, and those around us but our own insights, or our own essence. That's part of the spirituality to and that just makes you feel not only so much better, but it makes you have hope that you can make some good choices that you can choose. What's going to happen, not just sit back and be rolled over by this coronavirus steamroller or climate change or whatever it is that's rolling over us that we can make some changes and that we have some power. And to take that attitude which helps greatly instead of oh I know it's going to be terrible is to replace that with curiosity. Let's see what's going to happen. I'm ready for it. Daniel we're we've got less than five minutes to go so my sort of traditional final question is, maybe you could share a little bit of something about how personally that you've found joy during these last two dark years, because what people don't understand is helping professions whether you're helping in a religious way or a psychological way or whatever way that you're helping other people. It's hard on you is is on the people you're trying to help. And so, what thoughts on what's brought to you some particular joy in these last few times of dark times. Well, a work perspective, I feel incredible. Most of the time joy working with my clients. I feel very inspired by the lives they're going through the struggles. We work together to explore how things can be better. They inspire the heck out of me. But in addition to what I do in my work. What brings joy to me is is studying religious and spiritual texts is learning and reading is spending time with my wonderful wife is going out into the world going to beautiful places and being there. And as you know when I'm not working some of the things that bring joy to me and just being aware that I am in the world of the Holy One which is is a fascinating who knows what's going to happen next exploration and adventure adventure in a beautiful place called Hawaii. Yeah. Sometimes you know Daniel I think I've died and gone to heaven and heaven is actually where I live now, you know, yes, yes. And so that certainly makes me feel good and takes away some of those dark skies that's for sure. And I hope that everybody listening to us can sort of live in that Hawaiian moment and be one with our Hawaiian environment. And by the way, for those of you who listening in if you have any questions, either Daniel or myself or any other guests are people who've been on this show that you want to ask are some comments that you have please. Let think tech Hawaii know that they've been running I'm sure where you can send the questions out I see the thing below me right now so be sure and let us know we'd like to hear from you and respond to what you're thinking about and how you're feeling because it's important to us. Daniel thank you again so much for being here. And thanks to think tech Hawaii and Jay and Naly and Michael and everybody who works here for helping us out and thank you all. For those of you out there listening and I wish you the best of days and the happiest of days and the most spiritual of days. Aloha. Thank you so much for watching think tech Hawaii. If you like what we do, please like us and click the subscribe button on YouTube and the follow button on Vimeo. You can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and LinkedIn and donate to us at think tech Hawaii.com. Mahalo.