 Hi, this is Debbie Daschinger and welcome again to Dare to Dream. This show has been nominated for two People's Choice Podcast Awards for a Coalition of Visionary Resources Award currently, as well as for a Webby Award. And we were written up in Welp Magazine as one of the top best 20 podcasts to listen to this year. I'm Debbie Daschinger. What do I do out in the world? Well, I'm a media visibility expert. And I help visionaries like you learn how to write a book that is highly engaging, take it to self-publish, and also I have a fully done for the author guaranteed international bestselling book program. And the final leg of the visibility work that I do with folks is I show them how to be interviewed on radio and podcasts and get massive results. I've got a gift for you so you can learn how to start doing these things and become very visible out in the world. Go to DebbieDaschinger.com slash gift. That's D-E-B-B-I-D-A-C-H-I-N-G-E-R dot com slash gift. I'm excited because in a little while I'm going to be bringing my special guest on today. And that is Sister Dr. Jenna, who's going to be providing some wisdom and insight on transformational value of turning within contemplative and meditative practices. And I want to thank the sponsors of this show, Dr. Dane Here and Access Consciousness. They do energy healing work out into the world. If you would like to take a course or become a facilitator, you can do so by going to one of their websites and they do this work globally. It's Dr. Dane Here, H-E-E-R dot com or Access Consciousness dot com. I am so excited for today's show. And I think it's incredibly timely to be talking about this because it's how to be at peace with yourself and with the world. And we're going to be talking about her new and amazing book, Show You a Picture. So when you're ready to purchase your copy, you know what it looks like. Sister Dr. Jenna is the author of this new book, Meditation, Intimate Experiences with the Divine through Contemplative Practices. She is an acclaimed trusted spiritual mentor committed to bridging divides and societies and building relationships between global influencers. She has impacted lives worldwide, inspiring change and solutions to current day crises as the founder and director of the Brahma Kumaris Meditation Museum located in Washington, DC. Sister Dr. Jenna is the host of the popular America Meditating Radio Show. And we were just reminiscing that probably around 2009-ish, I was a guest on her show. So we feel like this is a beautiful come around full circle to have her here with me and to introduce her to you or reintroduce her to those of you who already know her. She is a member of the Evolutionary Leaders Circle and was selected by Empower a Billion Women 2020 as one of 100 most influential leaders of 2015. Sister Dr. Jenna's voice of influence is particularly in need in the wake of tragedy and increasing violence in our world. And you can find out about her and the work she does at this website for more. Go to americameditating.org. And with that, I bring Sister Jenna to Dear to Dream. It's so great to have you here today. You're amazing. That was a great introduction. You made me seem like I'm special. Thank you. You are. And I love how humble you are. What an amazing life you have led. And I loved that you included that, some of the behind the scenes that I didn't know about in this book. So let's talk about your new book, Meditation, Intimate Experiences with the Divine Through Contemplative Practices, because you ask and you start the book and you ask us about doing a contemplative practice with this question, which is, do you know you already meditate? So that's whether or not we actually meditate, air quotes. Do you know that we already meditate? So Sister Jenna, can you explain that? How do we already meditate? Do you mind if I first compliment you on your wonderful color nail polish? Never. This is my new joy. I've learned how to do different nails. It's a beautiful joy, everyone, oh my gosh, it's such a beautiful joy to witness. And I'd like to also answer something that you shared that it's interesting that you said what a life that I've lived just recently. I was, you know, pandemic offers you some space and I was emptying out some pictures from the phone and I came across some of my baby pictures when I was like six, when I was like 13, 18, and then bam, you know, I'm this amazing spiritual person out there. And it was so interesting, Debbie. I found myself just being so grateful for the journey that I've lived so far, that it really has been a blessing and it's been rich. I don't think I was supposed to go down this road. Really? Yeah. My background was such that my mother had me when she was 17, but also she was orphaned and coming from a very tumultuous existence, at least her beginning years, what does she know about raising a child? And so being an orphan, you know, here comes a child that she has to take care of and my poor father who's Indian, my mother's African, he didn't even know what to do with her. So I think, you know, I think there's something that is preordained for our lives, despite whatever efforts we're putting in. And so in the book, when the first question is that, do you know you actually meditate? Because we all think, no, we dare to dream. That's meditation to dream about something that is not existing right now. But you're feeling something on the inside that I think I have the ability to manifest or emerge into a different person. So the beginning of the book, I think starts us off with questions that we need to ask ourselves. Yeah. Yeah. So that's amazing to me. And I want to also go back to what you said in the beginning about your parents and their experience. And it's very interesting to me always how in hindsight, we can see how we were set up. And usually it's the gift or the wound that creates a healing that promotes us into becoming the person we were supposed to be. Because in spite of what you shared, you actually had very spiritual parents. And I was really moved sometimes that you could turn to your mother when you came to that point, that little bit of crisis with some of the special things happening to you. And she was so there to give you such beautiful advice and guidance. You know, she wasn't always like that. And she was very different than what she is now compared to the work that she did when she entered into our spiritual community called the Brahma Kamaris. Imagine growing up with a dad who's very noble, you know, very traditional Indian, you know, quiet, you know. And then there's this mother who's just wild and insecure and, you know, came from broken pieces and doesn't really know what to do with anything right. But then she comes into her awakening and ends up experiencing God as light. And I witness with my own two eyes and my third eye that woman changed in six months. And so I thought that that was going to be temporary. So by that time, Debbie, and everyone, I was about 17, 18. So, you know, those are very tender years. And then when you enter into your twenties and you're kind of going out and doing things, you make mistakes. And so it was interesting that when I would have experiences, if they were mystical or not, I would then go to her in those days, Deb. And then she could give me the right answer. She would put me on track and make sure I was always connected first to the divine, to God, to the Supreme, who I call Baba. It says, once you turn your attention to Baba, Baba is an energy that is love and peace. And if your decision is not going to come from that intention, then don't do it. So imagine hearing that when you're young, you know, and trying to find the power to be able to respond to choices that are presenting themselves in front of you with love and peace, when really everything inside of you wanted to make a decision that was vicious, that was angry, that was vengeful, that was not love and peace. And so it was good to know that we always have a choice how we're going to make our decisions and how we're going to live. So I loved that, Deb. I love having a mother who turned her life around. Yeah, as did you. I mean, I really like that you didn't come from this. It's not like, you know, from inception, you were suddenly this very spiritual child. I mean, you went through what you went through, like most kids and you had a hunger for success and for money and for cars and all of that. And you so you had your journey and you talk about in the book, meditation saves lives. How did meditation save your life? Gave me the courage to see myself. I was able to really see me. And that's not always easy, that when you turn your attention inwards behind your eyes and you begin to really look at what those thoughts are revealing you are or you've become, then what meditation did for me. It gave me the courage to say, OK, I don't know if I want to keep that. I have to toss it. And when I wasn't doing it, it was like I was running away from myself. Remember those days where you just would not accept that there was an issue and you would keep running and running and it was just chasing you all the time. So I don't know why the whole world is not meditating right now, because even now my meditation practice is so integrated. It's always been, but now even more so. Sometimes I'm not sure if I'm even meditating or not. What do you mean by that? I'll be sitting in a group of people and I'm somewhere else on the inside. And I can see it on their faces that they're not where I am. And it's not to say that where they are isn't good or isn't devolved. But when I go inside, I go, I'm somewhere else. And I can feel like even I'm with a lot of people, I'm not there. And so my meditation has taken a deeper focus in a more natural way. So I don't have to be sitting in a meditation room or sitting up with my legs crossed and burning incense to meditate or have a guru or play guided meditation to meditate. That's what I mean. It's changed. Yeah. And you also mentioned that there are myths around meditation. Yeah, what are some of the myths that we're perpetuating and living with and not even realizing they're not true? Yeah, I just mentioned a few of them that you need incense. No, that you need a guru or a teacher. Maybe you need them for a jump start. I wouldn't call them a guru or teacher. I would more call them, you need a good friend that has wisdom that you can trust in their guidance. If I'm going to adopt a guru or a teacher and I feel subservient, it'll take me a very long time to grow. And it's funny because even my students, I don't micromanage them a lot or I don't feel like I have to keep telling them what to do. I send this energy like you do know how to use your own resources within you, right? And it's like I have this feeling about them and I've noticed that they're comfortable if if I present to them that I'm really big and they're not. It's the weirdest thing I've observed. It's almost as if sometimes people are more comfortable putting you up there and that they're comfortable down here. And the worst part to it is if you don't live up to their standards, they start to argue with you and you're like, why are you doing that? That I've never even given you that permission to even put me in that pedestal. Anyway, one of the myths is you don't need to sit in a specialized corner, but it's good to create a special corner in your home where when you walk into that space, the vibration has been built up in energy so it can welcome you and assist you. And another myth is you don't need to go to the Himalayas to the top of the mountain to have an altered experience. And what's another myth? You don't need to empty your mind. You know, when you meditate, you don't have to actually stop thinking in order to experience a real meditation. Meditation is actually about thinking, but creating thoughts that are connected to your vision, which is pulling you and to really begin to deactivate your past that's trying to push you back. So that's a big plus. And can you explain what is your practice exactly? How how does the practice or process unfold for you when you when you everything from how long, when you do it, you say it's OK to have thoughts, all of this, what is it like to be inside of you and have the experience? But also what are some of the practical measures you take? What a great question. What it's like to be inside of me. Wow. I have to pause a little bit for that one. There's a lot of creative energy. I feel like I have the capacity to create great change through innovative methods, progressive methods, projects, initiatives, ideas. I can feel it all the time I see it in my head. You know, I see large numbers of people sitting in meditation and seeing that through their meditation, the world is changing. Inside of me, I see the world destroying itself because of vices. But then I also see there's a very strong community of people who have all of their spiritual strength in them that are rebuilding it up. And I can see myself imagining how the world would be restructured in such a beautiful way where it's more sustainable than it has been, especially in the last hundred years. I see sadness, but it's not of this birth. It is a birth of the past. I don't know how many. I don't know which one, but I see it. It's a sadness that says I ache for the world to this day. I still have that feeling. It's as if I feel we shouldn't be this way. You know, with each other. But I'm getting better more and more because I'm understanding it's preordained. It is supposed to happen, but it is there and I can feel it very thick in me. Do you think it is a past life or do you think it's an extreme awareness and connection, maybe detached connection, but a servant knowing what's happening? Both, yeah, both. And they're interconnected because I might talk to my mother and I have. And she's like, I don't care if there's a million people suffering, you know, but she's into herself transformation. So there must be some connection that I have with the way of the world because I really feel it more than a regular person. Yeah. I love to play. I love to be light. I don't believe spirituality has to make you be so serious and and and, you know, official. I feel the purer you're becoming and the more spiritual you're becoming. There's a kind of a sweet innocence and playfulness that comes over you like you go, I got it. You know, I got it. I mean, yeah, why not? What's the problem? So then there's that part like before we started and I was teasing you with my audio, that's what I mean. Like there's a playfulness that comes over me ever so often. And those are just some of the things in me. There is a part of me that I love to be with people. And I don't know if it was the pandemic or if it's just my changes that I'm going through, but recently, I would say for the past six months or so, I just don't want to be with anyone. So that's been a whole different turn. And it's almost like now when I'm with people, it's like I know it's a responsibility, it's a duty. I'm feeling like I'm almost just wanting to just be in a little corner and allow my energy to just be restored. And I actually don't have to do anything to restore my energy. It's already there. I have a connection to source, to God. And all I have to do is when I walk and eat and sit and talk, make the connection with the divine light. And I know the energy will be restored. And I'm feeling like I'm not getting that consistent flow that I know can switch things over for me in a way that it'll just be automatic pilot. So I was such a great question that you've just asked me because I'm telling you, those are the things that are living in me right now. Amazing. Yeah. Is there a particular time of day when you do this practice and generally for how long? So, you know, in the book, it shares how I used to run these nightclubs in South Beach, Miami back in the day. And I used to go to bed. I mean, we used to close the club at five o'clock or so in the mornings. So I wouldn't turn in until like seven, you know, and then I would get up by eleven or twelve and have lunch or something. But now I actually get up at three fifty. Around that time, my body moves and I can know it's time to get up three fifty, three fifty, and that's not three fifty in the afternoon, folks. It's three fifty in the morning. And I just get up and I have a habit of watching. What is that first thought in me? And that's always been a very big thing because the first thought that I can identify when I open my eyes, it is connected to the way I lived the day before or the week before. So let's say if I get up and I feel just messy and groggy, that I know I've not been in a good place either the day before the week before. But if I get up and I can feel the thought of showing me a vision or I'm concerned about something that I have to be responsible for or to take care, I can feel if it's weighing down on me. But the solution to that, everyone, is despite whatever that first thought is in the morning that I wake up with, I redirect the energy to God and I'll just go directly, just very quietly. And I'll say, Baba, here's what I'm thinking. And I'll just sit there in that connection with Baba and I'll just be with it. I was talking to a protege of mine, her husband passed away. Unfortunately, it was a freak accident. He fell off of his bed and just died. And we were just talking the other day. And she was saying that I've missed my best friend. It was like I just trusted him and he trusted me and I could be whatever I wanted to be. And the weirdest thought came over me when she was telling me that. And I was thinking about my brother, my mother, my sister who was around me, some core people that are with me. And I was saying, yeah, I feel that with them. Like, even if I don't talk to them for a few hours of the day or my mother has dementia now, so she's not saying anything that makes any sense. There's a feeling in you that but they're mine, like they're mine. You know, like they're with me, like we have each other. And there was just something so powerful about that. You know, and so I feel that also with Baba. When exactly, exactly. So that's exactly what I was going to that I realized just from that conversation with her that that's how I feel with Baba's presence and light in my life, that I don't have to be talking or Baba doesn't have to be giving me power all the time. I just know Baba is there for me. You know what I'm saying, Dems? And I just feel that comfort, knowing that that energy of God, because if anything happens to my mother, then I've got Baba. If anything happens to my brother, then Baba was there. My sister, I wouldn't want anything to happen to them because I'm so happy with them in my life, but the foundation is Baba. And it's an important one to identify, especially now with so many things changing in our lives without any warning. Exactly. And I am sitting here. I feel really moved by what you said, because that's power to me, that there is something that is unseen, but known by you, intimately known by you, that sustains you in such a way that whatever will happen, and for all of us at some point, this will happen. This loss, this change, transformation will grow older, people we love will pass pandemics, and yet you have this constant in your life that you know. Yeah, yeah, Baba. Yeah, and it's interesting because it's such a slippery bond, even though I know the energy of God is eternal and it's consistently giving protection, love, guidance, truth, silence. I'm sometimes not always present to it. And I look at what's going on with Russia and Ukraine. And I sometimes in meditation, I'd say, Baba, I wish you could touch the intellect of these leaders, but they're so caught up on thoughts that are lack of trust for each other. Or maybe they're caught up on thoughts thinking that I have to control this or I'm going to make a statement or I hate this, that they're not able to even feel what Baba would actually want for their lives so that they could actually live better and for the life of me. I can't imagine knowing that, let's say I live in my property and there are eight houses out there and I just decide to just throw a grenade on all of them because I just can't stand the way that they treat me or the way that they are. And then I walk past their houses and go, see, they're done. Where's my consciousness? It is so removed from truth. And just imagine the hell that I must be living in to think that that's that's good. But here's the caveat. It's supposed to happen. OK, let's do that. Because so many people feel very out of control. You know, waves of the pandemic, loss of income, rising prices, feeling like maybe there's a light at the end of the tunnel, this is lifting and then boom, the war. And with the war comes all these new restrictions and. And also, I think the way people treat each other in general, there is not everywhere. I know a lot of kindness, but I have heard so many people talk about how inconsiderate or cruel people can be on social media if you express yourself or this anonymity that people use to go after people on the internet. So there's also a great on kindness or just in general, if you drive around or you're on a line, thankfully, I have experienced a lot of kindness from people. Sometimes those are God shots for me. I it's like that was an angel that was so beautiful that moment. And yet there is also something else, right? What is inside of us gets reflected out into the world and art imitates life, light imitates art. So there is with that this incredible sense of a lack of control. And you had mentioned you can't control things. This is the way it's supposed to be. So for people who are really experiencing anxiety and depression and and so hopeless, what is your recommendation? What is your knowledge about this time right now? I don't want to speak as an authority for anyone who is going through depression or might even be on the brink of taking their lives because the depression is so deep. I mean, I've witnessed it in my mother and I've seen that. I was raised around it and I can't understand the pathway that a soul takes inside of themselves. But I have experimented and thought, what if I decided to just to give up on everything and just to be sad? I could see how you could open up that gateway in your consciousness and just start to travel down there without knowing if you could ever come back. I've seen it that it is possible. So in regards to the question, though, I think that this is from my observation looking outside in and from my spiritual understanding of universal energy and soul energy. I think there are certain factors that are very clear. There's something from our past that is entered into the consciousness and it has not gone to sleep in. It's very activated and for whatever reason, the soul doesn't have the capacity to fulfill whatever the need is of the soul in the name, form, land, time and place that it's in. So there's a deep rooted frustration at a soul level, but the soul doesn't have the language. The second aspect that I think with depression being the way that it is, I think we are looking too much at other people and we think that everybody else is better off than we are. And we might be putting our lives down, thinking that it should be like this and it really shouldn't. And the more time you spend in taking care of what you can do in building your capacity and using less time looking at other people and comparing yourself to other people, you will be much better. You feel a lot more enthusiasm. And the third thing is definitely a chemical imbalance. There are chemical imbalances in our brain that if taken right medicine, it can really help us to somehow balance out a little bit of what's going on. You see, the brain is like an organ, like the heart is an organ. And if you have a hole in your heart or the heart is not palpitating with the right rhythm, then you can go in and fix it. And the brain is so intricate that if something is not going right at an emotional level, maybe I do need a medicine, maybe I do need a shock, a shock injection of some sort to kind of get me recalibrated. But I feel that with social media, as you've seen, suicide rates are so high, especially among teenagers, I think they're just seeing the wrong things. Kim Kardashian does not look like that every day. And you don't know what her life is behind the scenes. And even if she has 200 million followers, you know, she's got the money to push out her message that she can get. I don't know how many followers she has, I'm just guessing, but she has the money and the funding that can do that. And so that might be right for her, but what is right for you? You have to look for that. Yeah, yeah. And what is right for you are the very voices we need right now. Usually those very sensitive people are the people here to actually lead us in some way or show us something. Yeah. And I think, you know, when we look at the way the whole world is moving right now, it is in a way moving way ahead of itself, like science is very much ahead of the game. And we're still just happy with sending a text. But there's a lot more that we can do with science. And I feel that there's a wheel that's spinning really, really fast and out of control. And we're like the mere guinea pigs and we just can't keep up and we think we can, but we don't have enough wisdom and that's why meditation will save your life because you don't need to go that route. You just need to be present. Yeah, beautiful. Folks who are listening, who are resonating with what you're saying. And let's just call it they've tried it or they didn't find their way through meditation or they haven't done it because they're really not sure. So they don't need a guru, you say they don't need. They don't need all these incense and things we've been taught. We don't have to go to a mountaintop. What can they start doing right away to facilitate some kind of change and some kind of peace? I would invite folks to really ask themselves how they're feeling right now. I mean, are you happy? That's where I have everyone start that because based on that answer, then you'll know if you need to do the work. And again, do not compare your happiness to other people. Just start where you are. Are you OK? And if you can answer yes, then keep doing what you're doing and look for some new things to do. And if you're like, no, I'm not OK, then look where in what aspect are you deceiving yourself, what what energy in you, what what part of your personality keeps repeating the same cycle of consciousness, keeping you where you are. You know, some of us have dreams to do a lot, dare to dream and then you get a picture of that idea in your head. But then you find you just don't have the energy to sustain the motivation of the dream. Why? There's some attachment to something maybe of the past, a thing, a person. Maybe there's some ego identity. Maybe there's some greed for some recognition or whatever. Maybe there is desire in ways that you really don't need to feed into that energy. Maybe there's some anger. Maybe you're even angry with yourself. And I use this acronym, algae, anger, lust, greed, attachment and ego. Maybe that energy is so much inside of you to very quietly, and it's really stealing so much of the soul's energy that you just don't have the motivation to do it. You want it. You're dreaming it. You see it. You feel you deserve it. But even as you take the steps, it's not revealing the power and the magnitude that you think it can. So what is that energy that is holding it back? And it's the algae. And when we meditate, when we transform the algae into trust, service, truth, wisdom, compassion, communication, dialogue. You know, it changes the energy. And it's very true. The happier I keep myself, the more life will unfold for me better than I would have ever planned. And then then comes that person, then comes that situation, then comes. And it has nothing to do with anyone outside. It has to do that those people in situations outside are triggering in me something that is still sitting there. And I need to replace it with what I've been doing with Baba's love. You know. Wow. That's such a peaceful energy. First of all, that's very healing. Just being in your presence is so healing and healing. Hearing the words that come out of you is very meditative. It feels to me. I really like it. And I'm curious about your current right now in the midst of practice. Since the pandemic, what's changed or what's evolving coming out of your practice that's new? Well, like I was mentioning earlier, I get up around three fifty every morning and I sit for about forty, forty five minutes in meditation. Then I used to do an everyday morning class at six thirty. Now I do it maybe two, three times a week. So a lot of the younger generation, they're now teaching the classes in the morning at six thirty onwards. I miss it sometimes, but I'm also recalibrating. You know, I focus on my diet. I've been doing more juicing of late and I've just been awarded or actually initiated into Viome Health Sciences, which is a new health treatment out there founded by billionaire and entrepreneur Naveen Jain. And I've loved it. So it's like they take a sample and then they tell me the kinds of food that I'm putting in my system that are actually contributing to my ill health. And so you get these supplements and you get a sachet and you just take that every day. And your whole metabolism gets recalibrated. So I was on that for a few months and I could actually feel something was happening. Then I went away to India and broke my routine and then I came back and I have to start back all over again. But I've been finding that being into this Viome and using some supplements and trying to get my health in order has become a very important thing. So in terms of the spiritual practice, my practice is going to be completely different than somebody who wants to learn how to meditate, getting up at three thirty or three fifteen in the morning is because I want to hear God. At that time, there's nothing disturbing me other than what's in here. And then at six thirty at seven o'clock in the morning, I want to hear again. Tell me what's my guidance for the day? What are your directions? What should I focus on? But then here's a good thing that everybody can do. They can pause for traffic control. That means every hour on the hour just stop and go inside and ask how am I feeling or ask what does love want me to do right now? And that's like your reconnection to Baba, to Source. And when you do that, it starts to really help you to build your spiritual world on the inside so it doesn't make you, it makes you have more energy by the end of the night than to be tired by the end of the night. You know, if you're not checking in spiritually, then if the soul keeps using these five senses, it's getting tired. But if the soul is pulling power from Baba, it's getting replenished so it can use the five senses as much as it wants. So that's a law that I've understood very clearly, that if I'm connected to Source, if I'm connected to Baba, I'll always have energy and that energy will always want to produce something good. I definitely would not go to war with that energy. I definitely would not be bombing buildings with that energy. I would not rob, steal or cheat somebody. If I have so much energy in me, it can only do good. So that's why we need to do more of that so that we can change the world. And that's a beautiful those two pieces. I just want to repeat the traffic control stop every hour, which is a really nice practice and the question, what would love do? So powerful, because from that, if one is willing to wait for the answer of the wisdom that comes, a lot would be resolved in everyone's life, you know, personally, business wise and globally. Yeah, absolutely. And I was sharing with the students the other day that even as you're processing your life and I was laughing the other day because I have a great group of friends and they were doing a workshop here at our place. And I was just saying to my family, I said, you know, I'm so tired of hearing every time people are processing their trauma. It happened. Let's just get over it and move on. And this was me talking to myself when I was saying that that, you know, how much more are we going to go to therapy and process what this person did to me? It's almost like an addiction now. I mean, the world's coming to an end. Let us get ourselves filled with power so we can help it to rebuild. That's where I am right now. You know, so and I get it. I know we've I've been hurt by people that I've respected tremendously, you know, I've been disappointed by people who were to be a lot more noble than I had expected them to be. OK, I didn't want them to be that way with me, but they were. And when I was younger, it hurt. But now as a woman, they were supposed to do it. OK, Om Shanti, let's move on. You know, Om Shanti, you know, in your life, Sister Jenna, you experienced a spiritual council of teachers. What are the specifics of who they are and what transpired or today transpires in your relationship with them? Yeah, I was a little girl. I was at the laundry mat with my mom and I felt that I was transported somewhere up in a space of consciousness. There was space in me when I was a little girl because my purity was not polluted by a lot of hurt. Or loss or disappointment or desires or expectations that weren't fulfilled. And so being so pure at that age, you could feel that you were being transported like somewhere. And the council, I would say, now were the Brahma Kumaris or my Yogi family who surrounded me for all these years in sacred trust. It was just these beautiful beings. They were human and they were very virtuous and very pure. And they were just checking in on me. They were like, where is she? Is she in good company? Is she safe? Is she protected? And that's what I felt like, yeah, I'm OK. That's just how I felt. And then when I came back into my consciousness, I remember tugging at my mother and saying, you know, this is what happened. Did you feel that? And she had no idea of what I was going through. But when I came into the path of my spiritual practice with the Brahma Kumaris and then I went, oh, that was the council. Oh, you guys were checking in on me. I'm fine. And that's how I remember that scene. Yeah, you had such a beautiful other story as you got older and started to experiment and it really scared you where most of your physical being disappeared. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I totally understand why you were freaked out at the moment, why you were trying to regenerate yourself. At the same time, I'm reading this and I felt a little jealous. Like, what an amazing experience to have. It's so funny because when there are a lot of people in the world that are having very deep spiritual, mystical experiences, but they don't have the backup of spiritual wisdom to sustain or understand what they're going through. And at that time, I was about 19, I remember about 19. And I didn't have the understanding of spiritual wisdom that I do now. So when I actually feel that, I'm like, oh, my God, that feels great. But at 19, I was like, oh, I can't feel my body. I can't feel, oh, my God, something is happening. And I somehow found the strength to go to the bathroom and I looked into the mirror and I couldn't see my face. It was like I could only see my eyes and I just had to get to the phone to call my mother and go, oh, my goodness, I've done something and I can't come back. And that's where she said, it's OK, it's OK, calm down. Your soul, the soul is immortal and eternal and it's imperishable and it's a light. So you were moving into the experience and the consciousness of your soul. But your body is there and the body stays there, but your consciousness is changing. And then little by little, I kind of grabbed myself together and came back into my skin and decided to never do that again. I was OK, one and done. You know, what an amazing feedback from your mother. And clearly, once she got into her spiritual practice and healed so much, I mean, she was a tremendous font of wisdom. And I can't help but think or be curious. My mother has Alzheimer's, she's in a facility, so I relate to you. Do you wonder or know if, even despite the fact that your mother for today has dementia, that she still engages in this somehow deep spiritual connection that she had? Absolutely. Absolutely. I think she's even there more now than even before because she doesn't have any distractions. I've seen that the most beautiful scenes, like sometimes she'll stay with me in my room and it's a twin bed, so she's on one bed and I'm on the other. And I might wake up early in the morning and I'll just turn and I'll see her. And her eyes are opened and she's just looking at me with so much blessings. I could see through her eyes, she's just blessing me. And I would just pause and I would look at her and I would say, I see you're sending me your blessings and she'll smile and she'll go like this. What a gift. Yeah, yeah. So I can really sense that she's in that connection with Baba. And I don't want to disturb that. So dementia or no dementia, stay there. You know, it's just like having a blessing around. So it's been interesting to witness. One of the lines your parents said to you, never forget that the world behind your eyes is the real world. Like, yeah, that is an extremely powerful statement. How does that idea manifest in one's life that the real world is behind our eyes? I'm wired to be more in tune to vibrations and thoughts. I was at one of our sister's house the other day in Chicago. And I walked into the room and I was staying a few days as she was overcoming some issues and I was having dinner and I says, I know what you were thinking. You know, you think this and this and this is going to happen. It's not. And then her sister just looked at her. I swear I didn't tell her anything. And I said, and I said, no, you don't have to worry about that. Don't worry, but you don't have to worry. It's not going to turn out that way. So I think what happens is that when you are focused on the world behind your eyes, you can think of a person or a thing and automatically the vibration of that person will come to you and you will know for sure how to handle that relationship or situation. So let's say you think of an old lover or an old partner and the moment you think of the person, you either feel the resistance or the disappointment or the hate or the betrayal, no need to call them. You still need to keep giving them your blessings and your good wishes. And maybe a year or two or five years will pass and then all of a sudden he comes across your mind again and you're like, I wonder how he's doing. I hope he's doing well. Then it's like, OK, you could just reach out to them at that time or, you know, your good wishes that maybe they too are feeling the same way too, which is why you could pick up that energy. So the world behind your eyes has a lot more power than what you can see with your both eyes. Yeah, I have been there. I know intimately that of what you speak and I know that transition and to one day inexplicably because of the work that's been done to contact, connect with, see this person's moved on, you know, the great things they're creating, the new person in their life, whatever it is just to think that is so beautiful. I'm so happy for you. And there is none of that gestalt that was there before, which is really toxic. You know, I mean, it needs to be worked through, but it's also toxic in the space of two people. Yeah, I have one of our students and she's kind of transitioning in her marriage and every time I think of her husband, I would just feel that he's in such a revengeful place. And I would just tell her, just don't just don't call him now. Just don't talk. And just recently I would think of him and he seems like he's calmed down. It's energy. And the other day she went to see him and she actually came home and said, you know, he was really nice to me. And I said, oh, good. Then just work, work with that energy for now. You know, because maybe he's growing and changing now and realizing he can't hate you forever. That hate can't last in him for a long time. It has to change. So when you are more in the soul conscious realm and when you are so aware, it carries a vibration of purity. Purity becomes a measure where it protects whatever you have developed so far. But if anything isn't pure or positive or powerful for you, your purity will signal it to you. And it will give you the caution or give you the right thoughts to have. Or it will tell you where to go, where you don't need to go into that energy. And the only reason why you might think your purity will fail you is if you felt the purity was trying to protect you, you went against it and you started to go into the push and pull the tug of war before you make a decision. And then you finally just decide to make the decision from the tug of war. You will feel that because of that mixture in your motive, there's going to be issues and problems. There will be a challenge somewhere down the road. And so in time, as you're growing in your life, trust. What does love want me to do? Trust that your purity will always set you free. Trust the world behind your eyes and the thoughts that you feel. If they're connected to your peace, love and power, keep them. If they're not, your soul is saying, do some work in this area and you'll be fine. This is such an unfair question and yet it's coming up and I want to know, who are you? I mean, are you a galactic being? Are you, you know, a servant of are you like who do you know yourself to be? When I first started on the journey of answering that question, I was informed that I was a point of living conscious light. As I focused on that energy more, I began to feel like I needed to understand what type, how, what is it supposed to be like? So then as I started to grow and evolve with spiritual knowledge taught by my spiritual community and teachings, I started to discern if, if I really am being filled with that divinity and sacred power, or do I still have a lot of room to go to be filled with that power? So who I am is this living energy. I'm aware that I've been traveling throughout time for a long time. I'm also aware that I'm in a very ancient part of my journey that I believe that if I break my attachments and transform them into real love, I'm not coming back here for a long time. I will go back to Baba, I will sit peacefully. And when I'm bored being up there, I'll just say, can I come back down now? And then somehow my energy will just bring me down. But I would have had a lot of content of character because I left with that. So I will come back with that energy and I will do the thing all over again. And maybe we'll be sitting here having the same conversation again. And it's going to be fine. And who's there for you when you are as prominent and visible out into the world? Friends, my friends, my friends, my friends, my friends and my family. I live with beautiful folks and when I'm not doing good, especially my brother and Antonia, who you deal with a lot. And then I have some of my peers who are my age and spiritual journeys. But if I'm really feeling off or I'm being tested, I am humble enough to say, guys, I'm not doing so well. Could you just look out for me and they will in a heartbeat. So they'll just make sure, OK, make sure she's OK. Don't bother her today, just give her some space. So I'm not going to be one of those people who I'm aware of my power and I'm aware of my position, but I don't need you to be aware of it. I don't need you to know who I am, what I'm capable of doing, so of no interest. Yes, I would love us to work together. Yes, I want us to make the world a better place. But that's mine. I've done work. This is my property. I own that. And that's important to me. And so if there are days when I'm off and I just don't feel good, I just thank the drama of life for sending me the folks that it has. Yeah, so important. Yeah, yeah, to have that level of support on this journey and that it's OK to fall to pieces now and then and they've got you. Yeah, yeah, it's important for me. And I might not be the kind of orthodox spiritual folk that people are accustomed to where you have to uphold an image of power and perfection to try to convince people you're the chosen one. And I'm not quite sure why I don't believe in that. I believe that it's important if people are really sensible devs. They should know by now a person does not get to perfection without going through some really messed up processes. You know, and and and without falling down and getting up and and being human. And then, you know, reviving themselves from that human conditioning and moving into the sacred. And I feel that for me, my students and community, they should know that that's a part of the journey. But I've seen their naivete, though, they want, I've seen people, they need a guru or a God to determine if they're going to believe in the energy that you are. And they don't put in the effort. I've seen it over and over again. And so this is like 20 something years ago, but I remember just thinking about Jesus and Buddha and Abraham and all of them. And I said, talking to Baba and I said, Baba, Jesus only had twelve disciples and look. I mean, two thousand years later over a billion people are finding sustenance from his message. There is no Facebook, there is no smartphone, there is no LinkedIn, you know, or Twitter. But the energy of the intent of his love has continued for two thousand years. So I don't feel that we have to buy into all of that. Yes, I want to see my capacity grow. Yes, I want to see what wonderful things can come out of this being. As long as it's of service to the world, I'm OK. I have a word in your book and I don't know if I'm going to say it right. It's either Siva or Seva. Seva. Seva. Yeah, I keep doing Seva, which is selfless service. Keep giving. Don't wait to give after somebody has given to you, but you give before you take. So when you're doing Seva, you're just I'm here to serve. I'm here to give because I have a connection to the one who's the ocean of love. No. So let's just keep giving. Just keep giving. This is Dare to Dream, Sister Jenna. What are you next dare to dream? What are your future dreams or goals? I would like to produce more television series, documentary films where the message of our connection to God is a very natural one. It doesn't have too much of a religious undertow. It just has a natural life process. So I'm really curious about working and collaborating with film projects right now and doing things more in the media. I'm get excited. I want to write songs and I don't know if I can sing it, but I want to write. I want to play an instrument more and develop more languages because I love languages. I love speaking them. And I want to just expand my vortex of friends. And I want to see my family. That's my immediate family around me. So powerful that I never have to worry about them. I literally want and I'll know when they reach that point. I'll see it in their eyes and I can feel it in their energy that I won't have to worry about them, that they've got God fully in them and they will sustain themselves. And those are some of the things that I sit with in me currently that I'd like to see happening around me. Based on one of your dreams, learning instruments and writing songs, I am a singer. I'm with a band called Lions of Lira and we do extremely healing music to shift people. It is purely for positivity and inspiration. We use meditation, we use sound bath, but it's very unique. The energy that we bring to the music. And I just want to put it out there. You know, you have many people at your disposal, but if you don't sing the songs and you would like someone to, please think of me because that sounds like you would write something just amazing and totally connected. Yeah, I'll send you one that I did. I was in an interview in India last month and one of the presenters said, you can feel it in the vibe of the person. And in the conversation, I was saying, oh, yeah, I can feel it in the eyes of the person. Or when I look into God's eyes is not a human eye, but when I can look into the eye of a person who's in remembrance of God, I can feel that. So I wrote that song at four thirty in the morning. Well, yes, please send it. I would be thrilled, like really to go to check it out. So it's been a wonderful being with you. So much it has been too long a time coming. It is my honor to get to know you in this way. I recommend everybody to get this book. It's a beautiful book. And I actually knew there's contributing thirty seven contributing authors in here, many of whom I know personally and many names you will know. And they tell their stories of illumination. So well worth it. And again, if you would like to find Sister Jenna and connect with her classes or learn more about what's possible through what she does, it's Americameditating.org. And I end today's show with this quote from Roy Eugene Davis. A most useful approach to meditation practice is to consider it the most important activity of each day. Schedule it as you would an extremely important appointment and unfailingly keep your appointment with the infinite. Subscribe to this number one transformation conversation, Dare to Dream with Debbie Daschinger. And if you're listening to us and you'd like to see us and see my blue nails, you can go to youtube.com slash Debbie Daschinger. Thank you for your comments. I do read all of them. So grateful you're on this journey with us. And next week on the show, the guest featured will be Lisa Hayesha, sole blazing life coach, author, transformational speaker, TV host and avid traveler. Lisa is the co-founder of the nonprofit foundation Whispers from Children's Hearts with her husband, Lee Aronson, who's the co-creator of the Big Bang Theater. Thank you so much for joining us. And remember to ask yourself when you take your break every hour or when you wake up to meditate or any time, what would love do and then do and be that.