 Hey, what's up, guys? We're back again. This is actually try number two through here, that anxiety guide.com. Joined again by my friend Monique Colvin from Canada, all away from the Great White North. It's going on, Monique. Not much. Doing a good well. Yeah. How's your Tuesday? It's good. It's a Tuesday, by the way, today. Yeah. Whatever you're watching this. Tuesday's going well. In the future. So we've actually done one of these before. Let's give people a little bit of a background. That maybe didn't see the first one that you and I did. Tell me a little bit about your practice and what you do so that everybody knows who they're talking to. Sure. So my name is Monique Colvin and I'm a certified trauma recovery coach and a social worker and I'm also a survivor of chronic PTSD from childhood trauma and I lived for decades with the very typical symptoms of PTSD. Disassociation, triggering anxiety. I was also diagnosed with generalized anxiety disorder before the PTSD. And by the way, that is because at the time they didn't really understand that you could have PTSD from childhood trauma just like as if you were in a war. So anyway, I was diagnosed with those and I lived for decades with the symptoms that really took over my life. And I mean, I still was living, living, I was in a lot of distress. You know, I still was working as a social worker doing the best I could, but I lived in a chronic state of anxiety and being triggered all the time, not understanding what was going on. And that is because I grew up in a home that was very, very volatile from the time I was born. I was born into the abuse, didn't have an attuned caregiver. And just didn't feel safe ever growing up. So that's my, and I've recovered. So that's the really cool thing is because I lived that way for decades and then I have recovered and I no longer, I would no longer be categorized if I did a test today for PTSD or for generalized anxiety disorder because I don't have the symptoms anymore. Right. And that is actually how somebody is officially diagnosed to fit this number of symptoms and say the DSM, right? And I think that's the most important part. So, Minique, the work that you do these days where you are, you're a certified trauma and residency recovery coach, correct? Yeah. Yeah. And that comes from your experience. You took your experience and turned it into this, which I think is awesome, right? Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. There's no other way to do it. If you, if you recover and you know, you know the suffering Right. from what it's like, you cannot help others. You just can't. You can't. No, I agree. I think it is so valuable that you actually live that. I mean, it's obviously bad that you live that, but, you know, in the end, you made something positive out of it. And as you did. Yes. And I think that's part of the deal. So, you know, you live through this thing and then somebody once said, I saw a really cool quote, God knows who said it, but it gets passed around that the final stage of recovery is trying to make sure it doesn't happen to somebody else. And I think there's probably some truth in that. Yeah, I saw. I've seen it posted online and, you know, different memes. Usually there's a lake or sky in the background. I love it because, um, what I found is that the messages is often, um, you know, you just, uh, sometimes it's almost like, well, that you're going to have this the rest of your life. Right. And then you really feel hopeless. Like you felt hopeless before and now you're like, okay, this is, this is me. Yeah. Learned is no, no, no, this is not you. This is not you. This does not have to be you. Yeah. I think well, before we get into our main topic and our topic today is it's not your responsibility, which I think we're both pretty excited to talk about. But before we get into that, let me throw that at you because, oh, I'm sorry. I have to make sure that that doesn't happen. Um, so before I, I'm going to throw something at you. So you said like a lot of people feel like, oh, no, they're going to be like this the rest of their lives. And one of the things I don't know if this is sort of in your belly wick or not, but we'll throw that anyway is people who are involved with ACT acceptance and commitment therapy that often are get freaked out by even the name of it because they feel like acceptance means they're being told well too bad. This is just the rest of your life learned to live with it. And I think they misinterpret that. I don't know if you have anything you'd like to add to that because I, that's not the case. Acceptance is you're part of the puzzle, but it doesn't mean accepting that you will live with the symptoms of trauma forever. Yeah. No, I think that yeah, I could, and I could understand why that would be, yeah, that would be scary to them because that's not what they want. I don't want to accept these feelings of fear. I don't want to live this way always, but I think it's, it's just, it's, it's an acceptance that, you know, we don't have, first of all, we don't have to be afraid of the sensations because in and of themselves, it's energy. It's safe and also the reality is, is that as long as we're going to be like in this human suit, we're going to have all the feels and that's just the part of being a human being. We're going to have fear. We're going to have anxiety. We're going to have happiness. We're going to have joy. We're going to have, you know, all kinds of stuff. It's just, it's, it's what it is. And so it's an acceptance of being a human being. Yeah, I think so. Yeah. So yeah, that's one of those things and it's great to see everybody was fully recovered and now doing something positive with it. So let's get on to our main topic, which we could, like I said, it's not your responsibility. And Monique and I were having a conversation last week sometime when we stumbled upon this and we're going to do two more of these after the, at least we had different topics already lined up. So let's talk about it's not your responsibility. Here's one of the things that I find so much with the people that I deal with. And we share a very overlapping audience. You and I, I think, although our approaches may be different. I get all the time people who are, I think, sometimes afraid to actually start doing the work that I talk about all the time, that exposure in the nuts and bolts of facing the fear and all that the CBT stuff, they understand it, they get it. They know what they have to do. One of the things that I think blocks people sometime from actually acting is this overriding fear that they have, that they are responsible for the happiness or the okayness of the whole world. And they are worried that if they do these things, which are hard to do and that they struggle in doing them, that they will somehow ruin everybody's day. I can't go to this birthday party because what if I'm anxious and I ruin everything? What if I ruin the bridal shower? What if I ruin the dinner? What if I make my kids sick? What if I, and they take on this thing where they feel somehow rather that what they're dealing with will change everyone else's world too, that they are somehow responsible for making other people angry or upset or anxious like them or unhappy. And I don't, it's not something that I have a lot of experience in, but I have come to recognize that this is a very common trait among people who deal with these disorders and it often stops them from taking action because they're afraid they'll do it wrong, which we're going to talk about feeling competent in another episode. But I mean, do you have any, have you run across this as well in your, on your side of it? For me, it's a block. People that they get frozen, they don't want to do it wrong because they don't, they think that that will impact everyone else as if it has nothing to do with them, it has everything to do with, if they make everybody else upset. And I don't know, you know, where that comes from necessarily. Yeah, there's, I mean, as you're speaking so much is coming to my mind. I mean, first of all, it comes from really, it really does come from conditioning comes from very early where we really felt like we have to do things right. We had to do things perfectly. And also this thing about responsibility as many people, including myself, people who have histories with trauma and maybe some who don't even we, we take on from a very young age, the responsibility, the emotional responsibility of other people's feelings or states or behavior. And it like it doesn't really make sense, but this is what happened. Like I know for my for as an example, I this roles were switched. This is very, very common for people. The roles were switched where I became the, the, the parentified child. I gave, I gave advice to the parents. I was her psychiatrist. I was her, you know, dear Abby, I was, you know, and so what happened was too much of a burden from a very young age was placed on me. This responsibility that I had to make sure other people were okay. It was my, so I would like in my child's mind really try to figure out how to do that. And anyways, when this is done enough times, you really start to believe that you are responsible for other people, for other adults in your life, for family, for everybody, for, and wow, what a heavy, heavy burden because as we know, and as you were talking about, it's enough that we have to, you know, we want to try new things, but then having to think about, you know, how is this going to affect all the other people? Oh my gosh. It's like move and try. When I hear people say these things, often I wonder like even without an anxiety problem or an anxiety disorder, that would be a hell of a burden to carry. Exactly. To think that somehow you are responsible for whether or not the people in the room are happy or sad. That sounds crazy. Not crazy. It just sounds crazy by meaning like that sounds like a very extreme thing to have to carry all the time. And then when you add on top of it some of these anxiety issues that I'm dealing with, that the people that I talk to you would deal with, it becomes almost crippling for them. Exactly. And so that's when you said it's like they don't, they might not even want to start because they're like frozen in their track and we can understand why. And so I can understand. Well, I don't have to understand. I have to, I have to accept that other people have different experiences, right? So I can understand somebody who says I'm frozen in my tracks because I am afraid. That I get, but I am frozen in track in my tracks because I am afraid. Yes. But I'm also frozen because I may ruin X, Y, Z for everybody else when I do this thing and I don't do it well. And I also find that they come hand in hand with some of the other topics that you're not going to talk about that thing where I'm not capable. I don't have it in me. There's no way I'm going to be able to do this. So I'm pretty sure I'm going to fail and then I'm going to ruin everybody's day. Yeah, tremendous burden. So what we're talking about, we were talking about that burden, right? So we got interrupted. I just did some video together and we were talking about carrying that burden and Monique you were saying that's these people, they will already put themselves projected into that position of now I'm at the bridal shower and I'm having a panic attack and everything's melting down and I'm ruining the whole thing because it's all on me. And you know, they feel that like they're really there there, right? That's it. That's because that's how we're designed. So you can imagine there. They're in this. It's like you're in a 3D movie. Yeah, 3D movie. Not a 3D movie yet. What is that called virtual reality? So I know because the nephew has that game and I've done it. So all these things are happening and you're there. You're like touching things that don't exist. That's what happens when we go there in our mind. We physically feel the anxiety. What if that happens and then you know, they're all going to laugh at me and then that and so we're feeling it. So that almost we almost take that as truth and then we say why bother, you know, that that's going to happen. When in reality, you know, we don't know what tomorrow what tomorrow at all. We have no idea. No clue. But I think on the whole anxiety disorders are very much based on predicting the future, whether that future is in two seconds or in two years, much of that is involved in in trying to predict the future or being worried about what's going to happen as opposed to what's going on right now. And I think some of it is exacerbated by what happened in the past. Now, I I don't really this is where you are definitely stronger. There's no doubt about that where the impact of the past comes dragging forward with you. For me, I'm usually dealing with like trying to get people to not live in the future. Let's not live something that hasn't already happened. So what do you do this? This person are, you know, patient XYZ who has lived this entire existence where they feel responsible for everyone's happiness and well-being. And I find that they even take on responsibility for the nuts and bolts of different events of, you know, we're having it's Christmas dinner and if I don't feel right, none of this will go off like somehow or other. And I think at face value, it almost seems like, wow, like the world doesn't center around you. It's not that. It's not a negative self centeredness. It's a true belief that that they can ruin everything. How do you deal with it? How do you get past that? Yeah, well, you know, really, for me, it's really a question of taking the time and talking to them, talking to them and with them about it and they really have to have their own insight. And so a lot of that is just talking it through, maybe looking at other events in the past that happened, some of the conditioning, those condition beliefs that we have, you know, if something happens, I can't manage. There'll be no help. I'll freeze and I'll be like this and I'll make a fool of myself. And those are condition beliefs that we've heard our mind speaking a thousand times. And so by looking at that and saying, you know, that's just that's the computer brain saying that over and over and over again. Yeah, it's not you. It's just so it's like looking at that and and them having a real insight into that. Oh, good. I mean, that's that's what happened with me a lot. And then there's this what I have found is and there was this like separation between Oh, so it's my beliefs that I'm not capable that I'll just freeze and make a fool of myself that it's not true that I believe that because in the past there were so many times where I actually was stuck and couldn't get out and I was frozen. But that was then and today I have I have legs. I have a door that I can leave. I have, you know, I'm powered today. I'm not what I was then and getting an insight into that can be really, really helpful. Sometimes I find that when I have pointed that out to people, they are not even aware like they weren't even aware that they were carrying that. And I remember one. So maybe just even starting with the awareness of like, oh, wait a minute. Why am I I have to catch myself? You know, maybe this is a good technique. Like when you start to worry about what you're going to do to everyone else's day, if you panic, you have to remember that that's, you know, that's that's a pattern that is not being healthy. It's not helping you. It's it's a pattern you've been in the whole time. So many people that I brought that up to like, why do you think you can ruin everyone's day? They oh, yeah, I didn't even know I was doing that. They don't even understand that they're carrying that burden needlessly in a way. It's really good that you say that because I for me that is a huge part of recovery is where awareness because so much we're not even aware of it's automatic and we don't even we don't even see it. So that's my insight. When you really see it insightful things can really really change for you like they did with the person you you were talking about. You said I didn't even see that right. I didn't know I was doing that like, oh, you're right. You know, and I literally said like don't take this the wrong way, but why do you think that you have that kind of power that you can destroy this entire event by having to excuse yourself because you're anxious. She thought for a second that's a good question. I never thought about that before. So anyway, I think a lot of it for me is the understanding that like, yes, I talk a lot about accepting and going into fear and accepting and floating and not reacting, but it's not all accepting like this is not something that goes away. If you just accept and do nothing like and I think people sometimes get the wrong message like not everything is fixed by just accepting and floating you know, the key words you see floating around the group all the time. Like this situation where you feel responsible for everyone else's happiness and or well-being is something you have to actively work on. I'm going to say. Yeah. Well, it's huge and that too you need awareness with because people some people are just doing it and they're not even they're not even aware that they have this huge anxiety and they think that they're responsible for, you know, a brother, sister, and friend, you know, and we were not designed to carry, you know, that much. It's enough to be able to, you know, handle what we have to handle. But I mean, that's why the anxiety starts welling up because one thing at a time, you know, we can't handle too much. Yeah. I think it's probably true and that understanding of like, wow, I'm carrying a lot right now. And I think for people who are struggling my people, if you will, who are struggling with the nuts and bolts of panic disorder or agoraphobia and those sort of phobias, I think you have no choice but to let go, to get past some of those things. You have to be able to let go of that burden of I'm going to ruin it for someone else because you really have to be able to work on yourself. The nuts and bolts and we've talked about this of getting back in the car and driving, getting back to work and getting out of the house. Like it's really hard to do those things. I think if you're not also at least acknowledging some of what you're carrying from the past, at least. Yeah. And I'm really of the belief that that people they don't want to remain that way. They want to change. And so, you know, they're willing to if you if you point out like you did, you know, they're willing to to look at it and have an open mind and see they want to change. They they're not happy with the way things are. And so there could be what they could be willing to take the risk of yes, into it. Right. Maybe that's true. And you think in your experience is this primarily something that comes out of the parent-child relationship? I mean, obviously the analysts will to psychodynamic people will tell you that is the most important relationship you ever have in your life. Well, which they probably I wouldn't necessarily just so much as formed in those relationships. Well, that's it. And what happens is in the first two years of your life. If you don't have an attuned caregiver so you don't have like a mother or father or whatever it is that that comes and meets your need when you're crying when you're that looks you in the eye that, you know, you start to feel very insecure and you develop it affects all your relationships in the future and you develop what is called an insecure attachment and that affects all your relationships in the future. Like, I did not know that. You know, I didn't understand that. So it's like you're developing a very healthy foundation of base and it affects you the rest of your life. Yeah. Yeah, I get it. But the good news is these are not insurmountable problems. Yes, the good news. Yes, you can be crippled with anxiety, highly agoraphobic and dealing with these things and still wind up living a really great life. Absolutely. And I mean, I'm an example of that because I did not have an attuned caregiver. My home was not safe. I feared for my life sometimes on a daily basis and I now living a very ordinary Thank you, God, ordinary life, which means, you know, I, I feel happy in my life. I do things I want to do. I have anxiety because that's part of the human condition. Sure. But not, it's not generalized. It doesn't scare me. It's not something that is an issue at all. I have anxiety just like you do. Just like anybody. Anybody does right. And we all get anxious sometime over something. Exactly. But it's probably could be a constructive thing. When you get to the point in your life where you're not afraid of it and you're not crippled by it. Absolutely. And it doesn't drag you around. Sometimes it's a productive thing. Like, why am I feeling like this today? There's a reason. So maybe it means I need to stop and think about something. Or change what I'm doing or loosen my schedule or something. It means something. And I also came to the understanding that like we've been installed with a GPS. So in other words like if I start to feel a little anxious I know right away I know what's going on. It means I'm really busy up here. And it's like, oh, okay. You know and then I know it's going to settle down and it does it always does but I don't get scared by it because I understand what's going on. Right, right. It's just a good story. So what's the takeaway here? I think the takeaway is you're not responsible for everyone in the world. We're only responsible for ourselves in the end. And let's talk for a quick second about those other people because I think we probably as part of this discussion not to take it on too long but we probably have to acknowledge that if you are going to be that person and you were going to take on the mantle of pleasing everybody and making everybody happy or sad. I'm going to guess that there are going to be people sometimes in your life. Unfortunately, that will let you do that. Yes. Right now. Life's going to be easier for them. Yes. So yes, I will blame you are responsible for making me happy. Sure. No problem. Run with that ball. And I think so you're not. I think there's the realization that says well, I'm not responsible for making anyone else happy. Only they can do that. That's right. Right. And things happen every day that are good or bad and you can argue Buddhism wise that nothing has a judgment attached to it. But it's never what happens. It's what we how we interpret it. There are things that happen that we kind of universally all interpret as bad and some that were universally interpret as good. But even when bad things happen, it's up to an individual person to be devastated or not by that. It's not up to you. So, you know what really helped me was just because I mean I felt sometimes like I just an example. Let's say my husband came home and he had on his, you know, he came home from work and his face maybe looked like he was upset. Immediately being responsible for everything. I would become defensive. Oh, it's about me and I put on an angry face and we'd fight and it had nothing to do with anything. Now, I have this understanding and this is what I helped my clients see is that what is happening is that he's coming in the door and he's responding to all the thinking that's going on in his mind. Maybe he's thinking, oh my gosh, this at work and I have that to do and I have that and so it has nothing to do with me and this is the case with all of us. So, you know, the person that you're thinking you're responsible for or they have whatever they're that's going on in their mind that is what they're dealing with. It has nothing to do with you. It's, you know, their reality and you're not responsible for what's going on in their mind. Yeah, I don't think part part of that is then we could change our own we can gain an awareness of what we've been doing and the patterns are in and we can work to change them for ourselves. But I guess there are times others you may have to adjust some of the relationships in your life because you could change what you do. But if you are still going to be surrounded by people or at least have people in your life that are taking advantage of that. Yes, make me happy. I will pin it all on you. I think sometimes that I would touch in that for a minute or two. It's probably there's some impact on relationships somehow when you go through this and start to shed that I'm not responsible for you anymore. I guess one or two things can happen that people close to you can be thrilled for you and say, yes, you're not responsible for me. I'm happy that you're not feeling the burden or or now. I I haven't really seen that per se but I think that as people start to shed a lot of their you know their old beliefs and ideas and there's going to be little changes in the relationship you know but in the end you know people are going to feel a lot safer and calmer within themselves and stronger and yeah good thing in the end. Oh, I would say it can only be a good thing. I'm sure so awesome. I think we've done enough. No we've probably done 25 minutes across two broken videos. So I'll edit them together. So we're going to do another one of these next week and I believe next week we're going to talk about we had two of the topics we had that empowerment thing which was great that's such a that was a learned helplessness and empowerment. Yes. Flip them flip them backwards that was really great and I think the other one we're going to talk about was just self-worth and confidence and competency and I think that one plays into what we talked about today a lot. They seem to me they seem to come together. Yeah. Yeah. Me too. So next time we'll talk about that feelings of incompetency or not feeling we can't have a high self-worth and that sort of stuff. So that's good. Thank you thank you for taking the time it's always fun. Thank you to be here it was fun. Yep. Yep. What where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you? Sure. So they can reach me on my website at www. money covencoaching.com I have a podcast call freedom from CPTSD and anxiety and I have a Facebook page money covencoaching. Cool. I'll link them in the video description. So wherever you're watching you be able to find money. Go follow her. She's she's good. All right. Many thank you. Thank you. Well, let's see in the next one. Okay. I feel the recording hang on.