 Hi everyone. So I'm going to begin for a second. I'm going to ask you all to take a few seconds and think about a time when you felt happy. And now I also want you to take another few seconds and think about a time when you perhaps felt a bit more anxious. The purpose of this kind of mini exercise is just to illustrate that all these emotions that you might have felt are just totally normal and they're part of the human experience. And because they're in fact inevitable, I think it's especially important for us to have tools to be able to manage the range of emotions that we experience. And that's a base topic for our Ask an Expert series. To those who are new here, the Ask an Expert series is a video podcast where we chat about mental health topics with experts. So if you're keen to also get involved, like help with the podcast series or to be featured, then you can get in touch by checking the description box below for the signup form or just to get directly in touch with me, Monica at psych2go.net. That's my email. And with that, I'm Monica. I'm the host of the series and I am a medical student. I am really, really passionate about making psychiatry really accessible for everyone everywhere. And it's just a huge honor to be able to be a part of this project. And with that, it is also a huge honor for me to introduce our wonderful guest today to talk about managing emotions. Dr. Conte. Hi and welcome. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Thank you for being here. So you've got so much wonderful experience and just so much that you do. So I'd love it if you could kind of introduce yourself to our Psych2Go community. Well, yes. First of all, hi. Thanks for having me. Happy to be here. I am a licensed professional counselor. I'm an anger management specialist. So I'm an anger management specialist, a level five anger management specialist. And sometimes degrees and letters don't mean, you know, you wonder, what does this really mean? But they're only just a handful of us in the world. I kind of feel proud of that designation. But what it means is this, look, I have more than 20,000 hours of clinical experience. I've been doing this work for almost 25 years now. And I'm really, really passionate. I work with, I specialize in working with people convicted of violent crimes. So I'm frequently in maximum security prisons. I train officers on how to handle and work with people when they're struggling with really intense emotions. And I do a lot of work with people who are incarcerated, try to help teach them a different path. You might have seen me on some TV shows, I work with celebrities, you know, different people. And I work with professional athletes. So I'm also a sports psychologist. I do work with some of the best athletes in the world. But so here's a really good summary. And it kind of hits on what you introduced at the beginning, which is tapping into those human emotions, this human experience. And that is this. So I've worked with thousands of people all over the world for more than two decades, from celebrities to people struggling in solitary confinement all over. And I've come to this profound realization, Monica, that the world boils down to two kinds of people that are people who have issues and dead people. So if you're alive, you have issues, we all do. It's called being human. Absolutely. And I think it's the first thing to like really accept that, because I think sometimes there's a lot of pressure and being like, Oh, I'm just going to shut down those feelings of anger, those feelings of anxiety and all that. But it's about managing them and how to best use them, right? Because we can't navigate the world with having, for example, no anxiety, because that would be asleep, right? And we wouldn't be able to perform. So it's about how to hit that balance. And that's our topic for today. So that's a really good lead in because, you know, in sports psychology, if you have no anxiety, you probably won't perform at your best. If you have too much anxiety, you won't perform at your best. So we actually help people strive to have what's called optimal level anxiety, which means, of course, they're going to be some nerves. That's okay. That's a part, as we said, it's part of life. And it's not about escaping these emotions in any way. Sometimes people say, Oh, anger management specialist, so you must never get angry. And I think that no, that's silly. I'm alive. Of course, I'm going to experience all the emotions. It's not about not experiencing them. It's about how do we handle them when they inevitably arise? Mm hmm. So why don't we just dive in with the whole topic about managing anxiety, something that is so common? I mean, everyone on a day to day basis might experience some sort of, I don't know, nervousness, but some other people might experience full on like an anxiety disorder. So how should we start? How do we begin this conversation of how to manage anxious emotions? No, so that's that's a great, great question. So here's the reality. So anxiety is can be overwhelming. It can be intense. And actually, anxiety and fear are neurological twins. So we're just looking at a brain scan. We wouldn't really be able to tell the difference whether someone's experiencing fear or anxiety. But here's what happens. So our minds, they really want to match our bodies. So I think here's one of my best ways to describe this. Let's say that you and I down three energy drinks right now. So if we down three energy drinks, our hearts going to start to race and our bodies going to start to mimic anxiety. And then our mind is going to race to try to make up a story to match our bodies to explain it to us. So we might think, Oh, no, did I did I send that email? Oh, oh, no, maybe I shouldn't have said this. Maybe I shouldn't have done that. And then when we add those intense thoughts, now our body shoots more adrenaline and more cortisol. And what happens with this experience of anxiety is this, it's like anxiety is like this big, like if we could just see my if you could see my fist, but let's say anxiety is this big right here. Now, if anxiety is this big, and then I say, and that's just a physical feeling. And then my thoughts come in. So this is my body's feeling, I'm shaky a little bit, maybe I feel nervous, my heart's racing, sweaty palms, maybe now when my body feels anxious, if my mind starts to race to make up stories, Oh, no, this is awful. I can't stand this. Now it floods more adrenaline cortisol, which then makes my story even more. And now it gets bigger and bigger and bigger. So anxiety oftentimes comes from us trying to resist the experience, rather than becoming mindful of it and going, this is uncomfortable. I don't like how this feels, but and this is a key Monica, there is a beginning, a middle and an end to every emotional experience that we ever have. And the more mindful we become of that, the more we're able to handle this experience of anxiety. Absolutely. I think with the recent kind of pushed towards digital apps, there are ways to make mindfulness more accessible for everyone, right? So when I think of mindfulness, it's kind of like being aware of our emotions and not fighting it, just kind of accepting it. And I like to practice this through mindfulness applications. I love HUD space, I love calm things like that. But are there any kind of other tools that you find especially helpful to really channel that mindful kind of feeling? So one of the first things that I teach people to do is imagine that if you're, if I'm like still sitting here, but imagine there's like a hologram. So I step outside and I look inward. And so it's almost like I step outside myself and I just become an observer. So maybe I start to feel really anxious. And when I step outside and I kind of look inward, I go, well, that guy, he's his stomach's anxious. Oh, his heart's racing a little quickly. Oh, look, his thoughts are going pretty quickly. But now here's the key. As I observe it, as I become the observer, I don't have to take on those thoughts. I don't have to run with those thoughts. I simply become aware of them. And I think that's the piece that I'm trying to, if I can reach in people's hearts out there who struggle with the anxiety and have you understand, because sometimes people say, well, what if I'm not doing it right? And then they beat themselves up about that. And I don't want you to beat yourself up about being mindful. It's a simply awareness. Can you be aware of what's going on with your mind without judging yourself? I think as you were saying that, I was definitely picturing just kind of at the side of like watching the sea, kind of the water, you know, like going back and forth and observing it, but not actually stepping in. So that's kind of how I pictured it as you were describing. And I don't know if it's going to be helpful for anyone else to use that. No, but that's beautiful because it ebbs and flows, and so do our thoughts. So does every emotional experience we have. When I mentioned earlier that there's a beginning, middle and end to every emotional experience we have, what I always teach people is this, your emotions inevitably, your emotions will come and go, but your actions can't be undone. Your words can't be unsaid. And that's why it's worth being mindful that simply because I'm having an experience of anxiety or anger or sadness doesn't mean I have to act on it. And the more we practice being mindful, whether we watch it as waves, whether we watch it as sometimes I teach people, imagine your thoughts were on a train and you kind of just watch this train go by instead of jumping with every thought on every train. It goes by, you just kind of observe and go, well, this is interesting. This guy's minds moving really quickly. And again, there's just no judgment. It's an observation. I find that sometimes when there's that moment of, you know, fight or flight, when you feel like a bear's chasing you almost, it could be especially difficult to just take a step back then. And so do you have any thoughts or advice for when you're in that kind of heated moment? What do you do? Yes. So let me start with this. There was a warthog in the woods and he was sharpening his tusks and a rabbit came by and he said, Hey, I don't know why you're doing that. I've been through the whole woods today. I haven't seen one hunter. There's not one hunter out here. And the warthog looked at him. He said, well, if I wait till I see a hunter, it's going to be too late to sharpen my tusks. And so one of the things I tell people is this, life, we have to train, we have to train ourselves. These experiences take practice and are there things that we can do if someone, for instance, is watching in this moment and experiencing a panic or anxiety? Absolutely. We can begin with taking breaths. We can start with absolutely being mindful of our thoughts. So here's one of the biggest keys that we can do. We can have accurate language. For instance, when you start to feel overwhelmed with anxiety, one of the things that happens is, as I said, your body's flooded with this adrenaline cortisol, excess stuff. And then we start to tell ourselves really extreme words. I can't stand this. I'll never be okay again. And so we use really exaggerated words. And the more extreme words we use, the more our emotions are amplified. So if someone, for instance, right now in this moment was struggling with the anxiety, what I would invite them to do was to be accurate with your language. In other words, if I were to be accurate, I would say I'm feeling really uncomfortable right now. It's not the end of the world. I can handle it. I don't like how it feels. Now, that's the immediate response. As I said, in terms of the Warthog story and practicing, now that's something you have to train yourself and practice over and over. And the more you practice it, the more effective you get at doing it. Perfect. I love the way that you said it because I often also notice it myself that sometimes in these moments of fear or anything, I feel like, oh, my God, my world is falling apart. But that doesn't help. That absolutely does not. It just adds, it builds on to that physiological sensation that I'm having. And then that further reinforces that and then builds on even more physiological symptoms and it goes and goes and goes and reinforces cycle. So just take a second back. That's it. That's excellent. But that's an understanding of it. And so I actually do a technique. I call it sans adjectives. And that's just a fancy way of saying sans is without, without adjectives. So think about this. Think about a situation that might be anxiety provoking and think about what might be, you might be telling yourself during it. So if you're going to go take a test, oh no, what if I fail, if I fail this test, I fail this class, I fail out of school, I'll never be anything, I'll never be. And now, and then if you come back and you take away all the adjectives, you say, I'm taking a test and my body's a little anxious before this test. And by eliminating all those adjectives, you take away a lot of excess cortisol and adrenaline that you'd be sending your body. So if I, if I could definitely help any listeners out there, it would be this. If you can learn to be accurate with your language, with what you say to yourself. For instance, this is uncomfortable. I don't like it, but it's not the end of the world. You are going to be able to handle your emotions much more effectively than if you use those extreme words. Nobody likes me. Everybody. No one ever listens to me. Everything's terrible. Well, so and so didn't listen to me today, or I didn't get exactly what I wanted, but it's not the end of the world. I love how applicable and like easy they are, like they're micro tips, right? But they're, I feel like they can make really big differences. I absolutely love it. I mean, like I could literally practice this right after the podcast, so it's wonderful. I'm very thankful for that. Well, I appreciate you saying that because so I specialize in working with people convicted of violent crimes. And I am regularly training officers on how to handle very contentious situations. So what I teach is real has real world practicality, because if it didn't, people would be in great danger. So I had to learn over the last two decades how to really give techniques that are going to be truly life saving. And when it comes to our own anxiety, anxiety is awful. It's just an awful feeling. Anyone out there who has experienced that knows it could just be so overwhelming. And so you're not wrong or bad if your mind goes to these extreme words. And it is not, you know, I really like to have people understand that. Like you're not, I don't want people to be hard on themselves as they're messing it up to be able to be mindful to say, you know what, man, my mind is being tough on me right now. I am using extreme words, but let me practice. The more accurate you are, the more you're able to find control over yourself. And that's really what we're, I believe we're all searching for peace. That's ultimately what all human beings are searching for. And being accurate with your language can significantly contribute to you finding peace. Amazing. Okay, I'm just going to take a moment to summarize the, the tips that we had, the advice that we talked about for managing anxiety. And then I want to go into your area of expertise as well, anger. So we talked about the, the kind of like manifesting mindfulness, right? Mindfulness kind of seeing things as an observer, trying to be more objective rather than kind of being so caught up in those, those feelings, those emotions at that time. We also talked about being accurate with our language because we know the physiology, I mean, it's there, the words can further reinforce all that and create a really just a spiral. So just to be accurate with what's going on and then trying to take a few breaths and to step back and to see things from the outside could help with anxiety. I know that you have so many more insights why you know what, we, we have to invite you back for maybe a whole segment on anxiety, but I do want to also mention tips on how to manage anger because I see right now lots of people are asking questions about it. So yeah, let's just dive into what you do. No, no. So this is good. And this is, this is another one that this is really profound. Sometimes there are many people out there watching no doubt who have experienced being angry and not knowing why, like why am I angry? I don't, I don't understand why I'm so angry. And it kind of links with what we first started talking about. Now, there are many different drives for anger, but one of them is anxiety. So think about this. Sometimes when we are anxious, anxious doesn't feel good at all. And when, as we talked about, your body's flooded with excess cortisol, which feels awful. So when we're anxious, we have all this excess cortisol and then we lie down raw. We hit something, we throw something, we yell, we are releasing endorphins. So physiologically, we feel better saying something out of anger than we do being anxious. Unfortunately, we often act impulsively out of anger and then regret what we did and then we feel shame and it can be a vicious cycle. But what most people don't realize is that sometimes we're angry because we want to get out of the feeling of anxiety. So that's one cause of anger. And listen, anger is tough, man. This is, this is a gripping one for a lot of people for sure. My apologies. Give me a second. I think I'm not able to hear right now. So can you hear me? I can hear you. Yes, I can hear you. Unfortunately, my audio is not quite working. So sorry, everyone for the trouble here. If people can hear me, I would say it's not the end of the world. Audio. Testing one, two. Let's test it again. Is this working? Testing one, two. I can't hear anything. This is so interesting. No, sorry about that. No worries. It's not the end of the world. Okay. Is that working? I don't hear anything. I'm going to refresh this page. Sorry, guys, if it gets cut off, I will be right back. Apologies for that. I know I think you guys can hear me, but I cannot hear anything else. So it would be good to have a good two-way chat. I'm just going to refresh this page. I'm not sure people can hear me now or not. Let me see if people can hear me now or not. I'm going to come to the top of the chat and see if people can hear me. Hi. Hopefully this works now. Does it work? Can you hear me now? Yes. I hope everyone here is still good. Sorry about that. I think my microphone here has died on me, but no worries. See, this is a good example of it's not the end of the world. We continue on. Right. So we were to use accurate, but this is kind of cool because it's kind of a great hands-on lesson. If we use accurate language, we say, okay, there was a little disruption in the way we were able to communicate, but it's not the end of the world. No, absolutely. I will lie there. I felt like I was sweating a bit, but you know what? I took a step back. I was like, Dr. Conti just told me a few moments ago to use accurate language, and that is not over. It's just a little bit of technological failure, but it's okay. No, it's cool. And I think it's almost kind of neat because I really believe things happen for a reason. I like to buy into that and it's very fitting because then when things happen, I can say, okay, I'm sure there's a reason we can learn from this, but this is a wonderful example if we're going to go and move on with the concept of anger because I have what I believe, if I could summarize what I think really encapsulates the majority of anger, it's this. There is a difference between what I call the cartoon world and the real world. So the cartoon world is our world of shoulds. People should think, feel, believe, and behave the way I think they should. And then there's the real world, how people actually think, feel, believe, and behave. And what happens is this, Monica, as long as we align our expectations with our cartoon world, we're let down. Hey, microphones should never go out. There should never be computer glitches. Real world. There are computer glitches sometimes. So if we were too bought into this, while we would crumble, we wouldn't be able to go on with the interview because we'd say, no, it should have never, it's not the end of the world. There are glitches. So what I have taught for the majority of my career is this, teach people how to align their expectations with reality. The more prepared you are for reality, the more effectively you're going to encounter it. And so a ton of anger stems from people living in that cartoon world and saying, they shouldn't have said that. She shouldn't have said that. He shouldn't have done that. And it's not that the cartoon world isn't logical. Sometimes it's very logical. The unfortunate reality is that as logical as it is, it's not actual reality. And so that's what we, that's what, you know, a huge part of anger is about learning to align your expectations with reality. So part of that when I was hearing you speak, kind of gave me the idea that it comes down to planning, sort of like, sometimes walking through what a situation might look like and actually planning, how do you react? Or actually mentally kind of going through the motions of experiencing that anger and then de-escalating and things like that. Is that something that we could do to actually better align expectations with reality? Or do you have any other techniques? No, I love that. So that's wonderful. And I'll tell you why that's so helpful. So let's say that we were going to run an obstacle course. And someone tells us that we have four obstacles. So we get over the first two, three, we get over the fourth one, and then we hit a fifth one. And then we look at each other and say, hold on a second, there shouldn't be five. There should only be four. We were told there should be four. And so we're angry. Now we, let's go backward and we're going to start again. And this time, someone tells us there are going to be six obstacles. So we get over one, two, three, four, we get over five, but we're done. And we go, oh, that's cool. Now what happened? In both cases, we had five obstacles. The first time we told ourselves in our cartoon world, this shouldn't be here. And I can't stand it, right? And then the second time we say it's, we were prepared and we were ready for it. And so understanding this. So now I take this concept to what I call the lifelong obstacle course. As long as we're alive, we're going to encounter obstacles. And so if we align our expectations with that reality, we're going to be more prepared for it. And like that Warthog sharpening his tusks, we're going to continually be prepared mentally for anything that we might encounter. Absolutely. Any other tips for kind of managing, I don't know, different sort of scenarios, like when people think of road rage, for example, does that still apply? Or, you know, is that sort of something a total different thing? Or is it kind of situation by situation? No, this is a key to road rage. Because think about this, how many times do people drive into traffic and say this shouldn't be here? This person shouldn't have cut me off. Wait, that's reality. This person did cut me off. And so think about, watch, watch how our words, our self talk amplifies the situation. A car cuts you off. And so you say, he shouldn't have cut me off. I can't stand it. People were so inconsiderate. And you go off. And now you're starting to talk all about you're angry as can be versus remember that sans adjectives technique, we go a car. This is a real war. The car did cut me off. A car drove closer to my car than I wanted it to. It didn't hit me. It's not the end of the world. I can handle it. Now, the same situation, but vastly different experience. So absolutely does this apply with, with road rage? Because oftentimes road rage stems from people living in that cartoon world. This shouldn't be happening. This line of traffic shouldn't be here today. And real world is, it is here. And so again, now here's the deal. And this is profound. And I can sense even from talking to you that you really understand this. It's, it's not just about knowing it here. It's about practicing it. So whereas I say that the concepts that I work really hard to make concepts super easy for people to understand. But just because a concept's easy to understand here doesn't mean it's easy to live here. So this takes effort. It takes practice. And oftentimes I hear on my own YouTube channel, I hear people say, yeah, but this is so hard. I'm not saying it's easy. I'm saying it's the way it is helpful. I'm not saying that it's that it's easy at all. It definitely takes work and effort. But what I will say is this, the more you practice it, the better you get at it. I love how you bring that point up because truly there's one different, it's totally different to know the theory and it's totally different to know how to actually apply it. So I kind of like to interpret situations where there might be something nerve wrecking or something that is like anger provoking as a learning experience to better practice these tools that we've talked about. So changing language, being more mindful and just really seeing it as an opportunity to better be that person I want to be. So I loved how you brought up that point. Well, I appreciate that. And I would often tell people if I gave you access to the best, most state of the art exercise equipment in the world, you say, okay, I'm ready to go get and shape doc. I can, you got me this membership. I'm going to have all the best equipment in the world. All right, cool. Now I can't do that. But here's what I can do for you. If we know that if we want to train and become more patient, we have to experience things that will test our patients. And if we want to get more effective at our self talk using accurate balance self talk, then we need to be put in situations that will help us get better at it. Just like a boxer needs a person to hold up those bags or, you know, gets a sparring partner because that's how you train. So here's what I can offer all of your listeners all over the world is a free lifetime membership to a world that will frustrate you and will give you a free lifetime membership to a planet that's going to have people from your cartoon world who are going to let you down. And then what if you were to look at every experience as an opportunity to get better at being in self control, no matter what happens around you. Imagine how powerful that can be. So I specialized, as I said, working with people convicted of violent crimes. And I had a center for people in South Lake Tahoe, California, once they got out of prison, they were mandated to come to these groups. And one of the things I would have the guys do is this, I would say, one, one week I would do this exercise and I'd say, listen, this week, everybody that you encounter, you don't know that I didn't go through and make animatronic people. And I set that situation up to test you because I want to see if you can practice these. And I would say it in a lighthearted way. But I'll never forget one time I had a guy come back and he said, Doc, you know what? I actually had a moment in the grocery store where I thought, when this person did something really rude, I thought, wait a minute, is Dr. Conti, is he testing me here? He said, so I was real kind to the person who like pushed their buggy in front of mind or whatever. And he said, I was real kind because I was like, I didn't know if you're testing me. I said, listen, that's awesome. That means you had the ability to reevaluate how you experienced that situation in the present moment. And you maintain control. Worst case scenario is you handle that situation really well. That's amazing. As you were saying that it really showing the connection between like the physiology, the way that we sometimes don't have control, but our body will act and then the way that we can kind of mediate that by the way that we interpret the situation by the way that we carry things out. So it's just truly amazing that the way that our bodies work. And I loved all the tips that you've given us so far. I know that you have so much more. Sorry, I didn't want to cut you off. No, no, no, but I was going to, if you have time, I'll tell you a story a little. I like to teach through stories, storytelling. So there was a young man who was being picked on at a monastery. And so he's at this monastery, he's being picked on. And he goes to see the headmaster and he said, all these monks here are picking on me. They're calling me names. And the Zen master, he kind of sat there in silence for a minute. He didn't say anything. And the young man, he got angry. He said, I don't think you're listening to me. I said, all your monks are picking on me. It's not, it's not fair. It's not right. And the master sat there in silence for a moment. The young man got even angry. He said, oh, now you're taking their side. Oh, this is messed up. You're supposed to be Mr. Holy. And now you're taking their side. So finally the master spoke. He said, give me your legs. And the young man said, what are you talking about? I'm trying to tell you they're picking on me. And the master looked at him and he said, cut off your legs and give them to me right now. And the young man said, no, no. And the master said, why is it that you defend your body so fiercely that you give away your mind so easily? That's a beautiful story. Wow. It's powerful because think about how many times we give away our mind. So someone cuts you off in traffic. The car drove closer to your car than you wanted it to. And now you not only give that person your energy in that moment, but maybe you dwell on it. Now you're taking that moment into the future moments. And now all of a sudden, this person, this experience has captivated your mind. And now you are a puppet to this situation. Or oftentimes you're a puppet to someone who's not even nice to you. They're angry. They say something mean to you. And now you think about that all day long and you've become their puppet rather than going, you know what, I'm not going to allow that person to what we call rent space in my head for free. I'm not going to allow that to happen. So that just took my understanding of the idea of living rent free in your head to another level. Truly, stories just illustrate and show me so much more. So thank you for sharing that. Definitely. Amazing. I feel like in just like 30 minutes, I've learned so much. I don't know about the community. Let me know, guys. What do you guys think? Isn't this amazing? This is wonderful. And I know that you've got a book as well where you highlight so many wonderful other techniques. So would you like to tell us a bit more about your wonderful book? I do. And this is my 10th book now. So I've written some books, but Walking Through Anger is a legacy book for me. And I know it says anger. So sometimes people might say, well, I'm not struggling with anger, but here's what happens with this book. My wife always wanted me, she wanted me to name it something differently because she said it's really about the human mind, the human psyche. And it is. So it is about how to handle your own intense emotions, anger, anxiety, depression, shame. It's also how you can handle and speak to people whenever they are struggling with anger, anxiety, depression, all those different things. How do you communicate? So I developed an approach I call yield theory back in the late 90s is now an evidence based approach. But it's all about meeting people where they are and getting around their fight or flight response and speaking in ways that can be heard. So you had mentioned earlier about like a bear. If a bear, you know, comes in a room, I always tell people this is kind of a cool thing to understand us. If a bear walks in the room, immediately your fight or flight response goes off. It sends a message to your adrenal glands and says, watch out. And now you're either going to fight, fight that bear, flee from it, run, fight, flight or freeze. So here's what's so cool, Monica. In 2022, here's what we know from neuroscience. It's so spectacular as equally as a bear triggering your fight or flight response. That same fight or flight response goes off when your loved one looks at you and says, we need to talk. And then the same way it triggers that intense emotions. And not just that, it's any kind of extreme words. You never listen to me. You always do that. And now, how do you, when you're in the midst of those intense emotions, how do you get around that fight or flight response and speaking ways that can be heard? So I developed an approach on it's now an evidence based approach on how to do that. It's called yield theory. And that's what walking through anger is all about. And if you like those stories and if your audience likes those little Zen tales, I tell probably over a hundred of them in that book. And you know, I have a couple other books like life lessons and teaching stories that are simply just those, like I'll just do like a one to two page story with a lesson. Yeah, teaching stories and life lessons are similar books like that. So I'm real passionate about teaching and breaking things down for people for sure. You did an amazing job today. And I learned so much. I think the community as well just benefited greatly from the chat today. So thank you so much for your time. Thank you for joining us. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. I appreciate how you receive information and take it in and then summarize it and stuff. I think that's excellent. So it was an honor to be here on your on your channel and I definitely I wish you and everybody is watching much peace. Thank you so much to all the Psych2Goers. Please leave a comment and let us know if you'd want to maybe hear Dr. Condi's more manager tech piece. And if you'd like to see any other topics. So until then, have a great day and take care. Bye. Bye bye.