 Hello and welcome to Back to Pathways to Progress. I'm your fill-in host for the evening, Juan Diego, Lisa Savage sends her regards. She couldn't make it tonight. But I am back, of course, with a wonderful city councilor, Roberto Rodriguez, Victoria Pelletillo. Guys, how's it been? It's been a little bit, but we're back. How goes it? Yeah, it feels like a short break from the last show, but in the world of council, it feels like we're kind of at a pivot point after maybe like a quiet period and about to take on a lot of work. But it's going well. Excited to be back here and really got to see Tori once again. Yeah, our last meeting was really short too. It was like, was it an hour? It was like maybe 45 minutes. It was really quick. And so that I think was maybe the last short meeting that we're gonna have because now we're getting into the budget and now we're getting to very, very dense long meetings. So it was nice to have like a quick 45 minute one, a couple agenda items. And now, yeah, we're certainly gonna get back into this one of things in spring. Yeah, no, I mean, you guys, before the show we're talking about, you've got a lot coming up. And actually for anyone wanting to stream the city council meetings, you can actually stream them. PMCwatch.com, they're on channel five. You can watch them all in their entirety. So you can see every moment. If you're not sick of them yet, you can watch even more of them. No, whatever would be sick of the two of you. No, no, no. But you know, you guys, but you know, you guys were talking about, there's a lot going on. So what can the people of Portland expect is happening in the city council? Yeah, so like in the like very immediate future and Monday evening, we're gonna have a workshop where we're giving guidance to the city manager of on the budget of what tax increase we feel is appropriate. So, you know, that's given on a percentage. And you know, you're considering a wide range, right? Like if you look into inflation, you can think of like upwards of like seven, 8% increases to match what's happened with inflation. And then when you think about sustainability and how it affects people's finances and you know, how it trickles down to the cost of living, you know, you wanna also not be thoughtless about it. So we'll see what range we all land on. To me, you know, the guidance of the tax increase is one thing, but you know, what's included in the budget is what's important, right? So we've already spoken of what our goals are as a council, right? So we wanna make sure that we're addressing housing that public services for homeless folks and climate change are like the top priorities that we've identified. So when I look at the budget and if we have to consider like cuts or you know, like reductions in spending, you know, we need to look at things and programs that are advancing those specific goals and then everything else really, we need to have a discussion about because that tax increase needs to be, you know, we can't, you know, we can't go bankrupt in this city. We can't kick people out or force people out because the cost of living is uncontrollable. But at the same time, we have a responsibility to provide services. So again, what's included in that budget is what's important to me and that's gonna be a big discussion on Monday night. I think that's the biggest thing. There's a lot more going on but maybe Tori wants to talk about the budget piece. Yeah, the budget part is hard. This is our second time now doing it. So it's a little bit more familiar than it was last year. But I think the hard part is it's really a balancing act because nobody wants their property taxes to go up and then I'm a renter, nobody wants their rent to subsequently go up. But we also want to make sure that we're aligning ourselves with our goals. And I always thought it was interesting that we do our goal setting prior to the budget because we'll do our goal setting, we're getting really excited here, there's all the stuff we wanna do and then come time for the budget conversation. It's a little bit like, okay, so let's revisit what we can actually do and what we can afford. But yeah, I wanna make sure like Roberto said that we're staying in line with our goals of housing, with our goals of climate, with our goals of racial equity and with our goals of social services and ensuring that we are providing as many resources for Portland as we can. So it's like, definitely a balancing act and I really encourage everyone to come to those meetings and even the workshop, public comment is not taken at workshops but it's still a great way for us to be able to ask questions in a very informal format. And it's a process and I think it's really important for people to follow along so that when there is time for public comment that they're prepared to share with us what they think. Yeah, and to the point about taxes, as you said, a lot of people, they were concerned about, is my property tax going to go down? How much am I paying? One question Portlanders might be asking is what would my tax dollars be going to? What are these new programs that you guys are hoping to get into this new budget? So there's a few things that we are like obligated to include in this budget that passed on referendum last November. So there are some costs associated with implementing the Clean Elections Act and there are also some costs associated with the rental ordinance that passed. So those things we already know have to be part of it. I think that outside of that, we really just have an increased demand on the public health services department. So we know that last year there was a huge increase in spending there. We anticipate that there'll be an equal demand there. There are vacancies in many departments so there are still new assessments of how much staffing is needed. And I think there'll be some requests from departments to increase capacity. So there'll be some requests to have more staffing, I believe, in permitting and licensing department. That's one area that we feel is lacking in terms of what we can do to facilitate new development, right, of housing. And if the process of getting permitting and license is kind of stopping the floodgate, allowing capacity there or building capacity that should help. So that's just one thought of what we might be looking at. There's also going to be, I understand, a conversation about the Baron Center. You know, the Baron Center is a skill nursing facility that's run by the city of Portland. It is almost unheard of at this day and age of a municipality that runs a facility like that. That's a really antiquated system. So it's not to say that we shouldn't be doing it, but the reason municipalities don't do it is because it's super expensive. It's a difficult operation to run, especially in the healthcare environment today. And so we're going to have a discussion about the structure of that, or going to say of that department and how does it impact our budget and certainly how does it advance our goals. That's a really, actually, we can go, I don't want to get too deep into the weeds of that, but a couple of weeks ago I got to tour the main med emergency department to learn more about the challenges that they're facing because of the lack of skill nursing beds and short stay beds in facilities throughout the region and the main. So the hospital is unable to discharge patients out of there into these facilities that is where they really are more, the care that they need is really where they're going to best be able to get it. So these patients often end up staying in the hallway at main med or just taking up rooms that are not, again, the best or more conducive to their health. So the way that the Barron Center interacts with that I think is a big conversation that affects the entirety of the system that we're trying to influence. So again, I think that's going to be a big piece of the conversation as well. And yeah, I think those are the bigger highlights, but there, I guess another part of, I'm talking a lot, huh? Another part. There's a lot of attention. Last episode was Victoria, now it's, now it's Roberto, that's right. I won't say this much, Monday. And another part to answer your question about what's going to be added, I don't think that this is a year where we're really adding a lot of new programming. I don't think that that's, even if we did, there isn't enough capacity of staff to run things very well. So to add new programming without necessarily assuring that things are going to run smoothly is irresponsible and not good spending. So as we look at the budget, I wouldn't, I want people to know that this is a year of us being really thoughtful about, and the council started to have a conversation about what are core services in this city? And what is it that we absolutely need and are legally obligated to provide? Plus what is it, legacy spending is what I refer to it. Things that we've done because we've always done them, but they're not necessarily advancing our goals of improving conditions for homeless people, advancing climate change policies, or creating housing opportunities. So those legacy programs are the ones that I think we need to have a discussion about, do we want to continue to spend here? And is that what taxpayers are expecting their tax increases to advance? Or do they agree on the goals that the council has stated? Again, a deep conversation that the council should embrace on Monday. Do you have anything to add on to that too, Justina? That was great. I don't know that I have a lot of, just nodding along. Yeah, the only thing that I'll say is, I think we all have, this is the time where I think on the council it's really interesting because I think we all are trying to move in the same direction of advancing our goals, but we have different ways of getting there. And so this will be, I think an interesting conversation about seeing where the balancing act is. And then also reminding me, because we were, we talk about this all the time, but yeah, the city is significantly understaffed. I think like at the state of the city, there was something like over 200 vacancies. I'm not sure how many there are now, but that's really challenging as well, because I feel like we're working a little bit at a deficit. We have all of these things that we're really excited to implement, but if we don't have staff to really advance a lot of the things that we wanna do, it's gonna be challenging for us. So I'm excited to see where we land and making sure that we're keeping in mind the goals that we have and the goals that we really solidified in December and doing what we can to move those forward. Yeah, no, that's awesome. And then on top of that, city manager sewage is coming to a head. That's, you guys are holding a session to decide or you have resumes I hear that you're looking at. So there's a hiring committee that has been really kind of like overseeing the work primarily, right? Now all of us have been able to like dive into different aspects of the work, but we are, so they were in charge of hiring the search firm that helped us with the search, putting together the job description, the posting, getting feedback and ultimately putting it out there. So that posting was out. We had the candidates that applied and now we have like the top 12 resumes and cover letters that have been given to us along with the recording of their interviews for us to review. And over the next month, we're gonna have an opportunity to have one-on-one interviews, the councilor as well, with who we decide are our top three candidates. And they'll be coming in town. They'll have a tour of the city. So I think there's a conversation that'll be happening shortly about, you know, what that tour should be, right? Like when a candidate comes into fall and what are the key parts of the city that we wanna make sure that they are, you know, presented. And I think we'll do some sort of loop around the city and try to hit on some of the major aspects of it. You gotta make sure to bring him here. Yeah, he hasn't seen it. I really can't wait to take him to Parkside to my neighborhood. It's like, I feel like. Absolutely. I mean, I think that there's, I've already heard so many ideas. My first suggestion when we were at the hiring committee, I should say just make sure that he goes to the homeless services center. You know, like that's gotta be one of the official stops. And he's gotta stop by all the public health services offices and literally get off the van and walk it and see the tour, you know, firsthand. And then maybe, maybe if there's time, we'll stop for like lobster roll or something. But you know, let's stick to the priorities of like, if you want this job, you know, these are the people and the work that we are prioritizing. These are the staff members that we wanna listen to. And these are the programs and the services that we think are most critical right now. And, you know, I think that would be really telling of what a candidate thinks when they see that aspect of Portland or when they see the city from the operational side of it, you know? So anyway, so that's really exciting. I'm just as a side note in, you know, we're also hiring a police chief. The superintendent, Serge, is happening parallel to this. We're not necessarily involved in that, but clearly we're partners. So we have a say in that. And on my personal life, the organization that I work, that I've been doing interim executive director work with the community, we just hired a new director. So I'll be finally stepping down from there. So anyways, there are all these hires that are happening, you know, all over the place. And I've been really spending a lot of time thinking, and other than that, we've also had staff hires. So just been thinking really strategically about what that candidate assessment process looks like or what the interview process looks like. What questions should be asked and how to assess a candidate. And also how do I assess an organization as they're pivoting in a transition, right? Like I've been in an interim role or total pivoting community. Now we're pivoting into a long term. We've had an interim city manager and now we're pivoting into a long term commitment. And, you know, we have an interim superintendent, interim police. So this entire city is really in this transitional period. And we, I believe, should be looking towards stability over the next several years. And so these hires, these decisions that we're making, these budgets, we all need to think of them as this big organization, this big operational thing that's happening. And how all these moving pieces, can we line them up? So we get key people to advance the goals that we've all ran on these agendas to advance, right? The key is just equity, racial equity, social equity, and injustice, and put the right people in the key positions to advance them. And I think it's a, I'm immensely lucky to be here in this position at this time. And I think the city is prime for like to pivot into a new direction. And it doesn't have to be a different direction, but certainly something new. So Victoria, I want to ask you from what I just heard from him, new police chief. And we know the Black Lives Matter movement, we've seen, you know, police brutality and you know, how leadership and training, you know, that doesn't address, you know, racial justice. What would you want to see in a police chief to head up Portland? That's a tough question for me to answer. I actually did have, I was supposed to meet with them. I think we all were, or maybe meet with the search committee, I think at one point. It hasn't happened for me yet, but I mean, I don't know, I think it's, we have to really take a look at policing and the institution of policing. And I think it's really important that if we are moving forward with the path of like keeping the police institution here in Portland, that we are having really transparent conversations about the history of policing in this country and not really saying like Portland is exempt from the things that have been happening all over the country or acting like, you know, Portland doesn't have the same racial issues that other places have because we very much do. And so, you know, I hope that if we are going to move forward with keeping this institution within the city that whoever is hired is open to having those conversations and really understanding the role and the power dynamic that they have and the history of the institution and how much damage has continued to be done to marginalized communities from this institution and coming into it ready and open to have that discussion. You know what I mean? As I'm listening to you and I'm picturing like literally having an interview with the candidate and like sliding over the press release from the Portland Police Department from last month and just asking them to read it and react. And just sit there and see, do they get that exceptionalism and that messaging and do they get how hurtful that is and how ignorant that is? And that to me, that's like the most basic kind of like bar that I need them to be at. And it speaks exactly to what Tori was saying. Yeah, I think we do that a lot here in Portland of being like we're not like other cities and in certain ways we are different than other cities. But with the racial issues, it's an insult to say that we're not like that, especially, you know, given some of our more recent events. And so I really think that whoever is going to be hired just has to be willing to have that conversation and has to be willing to look at how policing has been done and think about ways that they could do it differently. So we'll see. Well, no, because, you know, it's one thing about messaging. It's another thing, you need someone to come in and enact the right policies that are fair, that are just, that are equitable. And also, you know, create training and policies that will educate police officers and will train them accordingly to the issues that Black and Brown and Hispanic people have been facing. Yeah, no, I think that's, you know. But you mentioned something about racial equity. City of Portland is going down that road as are most organizations and governments today. Talk a little bit about, you know, what the plan is there. So there's a new hire, a new position that was filled of a racial equity and justice director. And that's a position that was funded through last year's budget. And it's a result of one of the recommendations from the Racial Equity Steering Committee that was in place after they were in place from 2020 through 2021. So their final report had that recommendation. So that was, like I said, that was put through the budget last year. There was a bit of like uncertainty at one point about when the hire was actually gonna take place even after it had been funded. But it kind of got advanced, somewhat fast-tracked a couple of months ago and a new person was hired and announced and it was a press release sent out by the city a couple of weeks ago. So we have them coming on. And I think it's gonna be exciting to see how that department kind of shapes itself and the role that they play in assisting both the city manager and staff and the council in addressing or assessing equitable outcomes of our decision-making. I think that for me, at the end of the day, like your outcomes is what determines whether you are very much like Ibram Kendi says. If your outcomes are inequitable, then you have your racist policy. If you can measure the outcomes and not find inequities, then you can start to say that you're an anti-racist organization. But if your outcomes is what measures. So in this city, you can just walk out the door and you can tell that there's inequity. So we can tell that the policies and the ordinances in the city are by no means anti-racist because we're creating inequities. And again, inequities that could be measured through racial distinguishing factors in demographics. So to me, what that department is gonna help us do is advance policies that have outcomes that don't produce inequities. Yeah, what I'm really hopeful for, well, not hopeful for it because it's done. So at our inauguration, I sponsored a resolution to create a racial equity committee that will support this department and will support this new hire. So now that this person has been hired, I'm not sure like how long it will take for us to solidify a committee of counselors that will support that work. But I'm really excited for that. And I think that that's another exciting part of us being on the council of just getting to experience this is the city's first ever, what I think of justice, diversity, equity and inclusion manager that they have ever had. And so I'm really looking forward to this individual and this department being able to advance a lot of the work that was done by the racial equity steering committee in 2020. And also just being able to say, we're in a city that is rapidly diversifying, we're in a city that speaks seven major languages. I think it's really important for people to feel comfortable that there is someone at City Hall that is advancing racial equity and is advancing the interests of marginalized individuals here. So I think it's really cool and I look forward to meeting this new person, welcoming them to Maine and to Portland and just really creating a good working relationship with them so that we can support their work. Yeah, no. I mean, and you've said it in the past, we're a small town that became a big town and we have all these big town problems. And that of course is gonna weigh into the people that we hire to create policies to advise us. Superintendent, you were on the school board. What would you like to see in a possible superintendent or candidate at least? Yeah, I mean, I think like, besides like policy-driven stuff, I think number one, you want somebody that's committed to be here for a long period of time. Like you don't want somebody to use this as a career stepping stone because transition at the superintendent or transition in the leadership position of any organization is really detrimental to advancing big strategic goals, right? So if we really care about continuing to advance equity in public schools, we want to have a leader that's committed to being here in the long term. So that's one of the key factors. As far as like their ideology, so to speak, or what they come with, I think today the vast majority of candidates that are going to be applying for superintendent positions understand that advancing equity, it's particularly if you apply to a place like Portland, it's part of what the ask is. So for us, I think we just need to identify those that agree on what equity even means, right? Like Portland Public Schools actually has a policy that defines equity for the purposes of decision-making for the school board. And that policy took over a year to develop and it included input from everyone in the community, outside of the schools too, again so that we can have a guiding document. So when you're looking at candidates and you look at your policy that defines equity, you should be able to identify whether that candidate agrees with your view of it as you fit it into your strategic plan. To me, you know, as far as you mentioned the size of the district, the proportion of the district, this is the largest school district in the state of Maine. It is the most diverse. There are over 60 languages spoken in the homes of our students, so ELL students are a huge portion of our schools enrollment. And so I think that we need a superintendent that comes with a background that understands that environment, right? That maybe comes from a school district that also has a strong diversity in language spoken. And also what is their philosophy into second language education? You know, I'm a second language speaker, right? I remember in my generation, it was like you used to be like, you know, speaking Spanish, you used to be like embarrassed of it. Like you used to be pressured to like learn English and it's like that colonizer mentality where you're like, you know, forget your heritage. And now we wanna support the development of English language acquisition. Wow, embracing your native language because your home language and culture is literally what we've been claiming all along is brings the value to our community. So here we are telling you like, forget that and learn English, no. So we, as we think of our cultivation and assimilation and how our students interact with our school district, you know, we need a superintendent to understand how that plays and that philosophy fills into our system. To me, those are key things. And you know, I'll say that those are the things that I found superintendent Javier Botana was fucking amazing at. You know, like he gets it, you know. He said, let me just say this, you know, like, he was a Peter Pan immigrant. You know what that is? Those are kids that from Cuba whose parents were just sending them out of the country during the Castro regime because they needed them out of there. So he and his little brother went over to Spain and they were there on their own until their parents eventually left Cuba and then they reunited in the States, eventually grew up, you know, as an immigrant family in non-English speakers, eventually coming up and look at him, man. He ended up being the superintendent of a school district and the largest school district in the state of Maine and being incredibly successful. You know, like that story, that content, that experience, that love to get a candidate, you know, through the door that brings that with them and then ask him, how do you see equity in education? How do you see policy? And have that, I just love the opportunity to have a conversation with someone like that. I mean, you know, as you said, superintendent Botana, he was Cuban, you know, he understood that struggle. He understood coming from only knowing one language and the struggles of trying to learn English and the system in place. Would it be helpful at all to, and I'm not saying, you know, solely about Pupil, but would it be helpful to look for someone who is Hispanic or is black and brown or who, indigenous even, or who comes from a background that understands, you know, what you've been talking about? Man, I'll tell you this. I am, I'll tell you, okay, I'll tell you my personal opinion after I say what I'm gonna say. I'm gonna tell you a story. I was, when superintendent Botana and I, when I was chair, we were reaching out to HBCUs throughout the country because we wanted to connect our students with pathways towards HBCUs. And that's something that had not happened before in those schools. And so we invited some folks over from Clark University and I forgot what the other school was over in Georgia as well. And we, they toured the schools, they met the students, it was really great. And then that evening, Javier and I took them out to dinner. So we were out here at one of the local restaurants near Monument Square and we were having a great time. And these two gentlemen, these two black gentlemen were just blown away. They said, we knew we were coming to Maine to meet the chair and the superintendent of the school district. We never thought we were gonna meet this Puerto Rican dude and this Cuban guy. Like they were blown away and they were just like, in your school and everything that you guys are talking about, equity and the way that you're supporting you, like they were just so impressed by it. Like that, and that immediately translates to our students having more opportunities for post-secondary success. So that value, nothing but like you can replace it. Like that's something that our experiences brought to the table. So yes, I think that there's value there. But look at what we have to endure. And look, I always want to like give the opportunity but I wanna be really fair. Like I'm asking you to step into an arena that you're going to be exposed to racism. Like blatantly, like just blatantly like racist people. You're gonna, the hate and the pushback when you try to advance justice and do righteous work amongst a predominantly white society is hard. You know what I mean? I fundamentally think that, and this is gonna sound really weird given the work that I've done. I fundamentally think that we need to focus on our own communities. And that while this is a diverse community, it ain't my community, like I don't live in community with Puerto Ricans and Portland. And when I talk about my community, that's who I think about. Now, when I talk about the community in which I can inhibit and that I have to like, my kids goes to school in and that I work and that I employ people at, then I think more broadly. And when I think about my public service, I think very broadly. But when I think about, if I'm a candidate for a superintendent, I'd want them to like, brother, there's an opening over there at the HBCU. Bobby, there's an opening at the University of Puerto Rico, like go out there, you know? So that's the complexity which I approach it. And that's the way I'm not gonna answer your question. All right, well, we'd love to keep talking, but sadly, we are almost out of time. Guys, thank you so much for coming on. Next month, we hope to have Lisa back. You were great. So say, you're the new fill in if she can't make it, so. Oh, it's all done. No, but no, guys, thank you again, for sharing your thoughts and all this, informing the people of Portland, what's going on in our city council. People love transparency and having you guys on like this and talking about that, I think is really awesome. Do you guys ever get people coming up and going, hey, I saw you on pathways, I love you? I did get an email from someone that said I saw you and I didn't vote for you, because I didn't like you, but I watched your episode and I like you and keep doing what you're doing. Look at that. So I'm just saying this show is changing people's opinion. That's what we love to hear here. What are they doing? Yeah, no, yeah, no. And of course, guys, as I said, you can stream city council meetings on PMC, PMCwatch.com, and you can stream all these episodes, all these shows on PMCwatch.com. Go back to the back catalog, check out the other episodes, see how we progressed over the years. And the podcast, Spotify and Apple podcasts, of course, were on those two, but guys, thank you so much for being on. And guys, once again, of course, you can watch all the episodes of Pathways to Progress, including shows in our back catalog at PMCwatch.com. You can of course stream on PMCwatch.com and watch on channel five. You can listen, Spotify, Apple podcasts, Pathways to Progress. But guys, thank you so much for watching and we'll see you next time. Thanks.