 –Välkommen, everyone, till den här säsongen på Kostel, på Kostelszonen, och i det här utvecklingen, och mer eller mindre för evidensbaseringssolutioner, för management. Jag är Mats Björk från Stockholm University. Jag är moderater i den här säsongen. Och vi har en panel här. En analys är selectet för att tala om utveckling i Kostelszonen. Vi vet att den Kostelszonen area idag är att följa en större del av den populationen. Men vi vet också att den Kostelszonen ekosystemen är internt att följa andra ekosystem. Det är en del av den här environmenten, som är extremt viktig och vänligt. Vi ser en ökning av pressen, som i många delar i världen, och vi ser att den här säsongen ökar, men också, hoppligt, ökar, om det är en bra mål som kan leda till en lite mer positivt utveckling. Så, i order för att ansöka, eller åtminstone ge de frågor om vad de behöver för evidensbaseringssolutioner i den här säsongen, och vad kunskapen kan vara. Vi har invitat en board, som kommer att ge sina visar väldigt, väldigt snabbt, och vi hoppar på en lång diskussion. Vi har Martin Guldström från Södertörn Universitet, marinerkologis. Vi börjar tala. Vi har Inger Näsland från WWF, som i många år har varit med Kostelszonen, inhabitants and their needs and management. Och vi har Linus Hammer från Swedish Board of Water Management, som har en lång tid, och som kommer att tala och hoppas lite positivt på en möjlighet av en riktig management av Kostelssägen. Okej, jag vill inte längla, utan jag kommer att lägga till Martin Guldström. Jag ska tala om Healthy Seascapes och hur det är att connecta global change-environment. Seascapes, det är en viktig sak idag. Vi talar om Seascape-approver. Vi talar om Seascape-ökologi, som är större än ekologi. Vi talar om landseinteraktioner i Kostelssägen och ekosystem som bildar Seascapes, men också de importerna för så många i Kostelssägen i världen, i utveckling i länderna. Seascapes kan vara bra, de är importerna, kritikerna för organismer och habitanter. De är kritikerna för oss. Det är mycket utveckling i Kostelssägen och i många utvecklingar är det tropiskt. Det här är från Tanzania. Det är vår sänkning. Det är färg. Färgsägen och det är inkomst. Det är extremt viktigt för exempel fisk, fisk och så vidare. Seascapes i tropiska fisk är generellt sett som olika fisk och ekosystem som är intervjuade i olika sätt. De är som i Kostelssägen mangrus, segrasses och koral fisk. De reglerar många fisk och de har så många importerna och de intervjuar i olika sätt. Koral fisk och buffer för exempel för att de står med väder och de andra system och de andra system feed koral fisk med organiser och nutrients och de är också filterna för så många nutrients. De också intervjuar och med society. De är synergier mellan system och med society. För exempel turism är det linkeda till habitat protection. Bra habitat och bra turism. Fisk är väldigt linkeda till alla system utanför det är inte ett bra utgång i fisk och produktivitet. Så så kan kustels ekosystem kustelssägen är så important för för human och för society tråd välbyggning och resiljons och utgång är mycket ekosystem services det är en environmental services regulating supporting services ekonomik services och social kulturell services. Men vi också som human behöver vara regenerativ och sysstänliga och sysstänliga sysstänliga aktier. Det här jag vill hälsa att ekosystem och ekologisk integritet är så important funktioner och processer och en stor biodiversitet som faktiskt leder till ekosystem eller ekosystem konditioner i ett bra steg och ett bra steg. Vi är så många kustelssägen i världen. Det är en stor number av utgångar och aktiviteter. Så det är en extrem jigså att sälja problem. Det är vad det kan vara för några år. Vi är byggt en bredare approach till management även om vi fokuserar specifika species också. Vi ser också ekosystem holl ekosystem ekosystem baser och så vidare. Det är mariner och speciella planer om terrestrial environments och planning i det bästa sätt. Men vi har de major problem allover the world. There are environmental changes because of us. Impacts at global and local levels all from over-exploitation of our resources to changes. We are reducing land in different ways and we are modifying and destroying ocean invasive species and upon that climate change and many more impacts. So all those impacts they are driving also the structural change at different scales at different spatial scales it can be plans up to major landscapes how we fragment them and affect connectivity. I come back to connectivity. And this will affect ecosystem functions and services. When we talk about seascape and in for example seascape ecology or landscape ecology when we work with major areas in the coastal zone we talk about scale also. Scale is so important. One organism is has a seascape that is not at all the same as another and we also need to understand the interaction between temporal and spatial scales because so many impacts so many processes are interacting between different scales and for example if you introduce a protected area that is at a certain scale and that should go in line with the scales we are trying to understand and protect at different ways. Connectivity that's a word and a concept or so that has been raised since long time but it's very, very tricky to actually bring in a very good way into management and policies. But it's a work that is going on ongoing and it's progressing very much now around the world for example ISEAN has a guideline for connectivity through networks and corridors and link this to global major management initiatives and connectivity initiatives. Also for example Convention on Biological Diversity calls for connectivity between protected areas and restoring also connectivity between degraded systems. Connectivity, yes could be just an easy example is a fish that needs so many different environments to fulfill the life state all life stages. Maybe a fish is using sea grasses and mangrove nursery, live on the adult outside in the coral reefs and the open water is also important because of the larvae that are spawned. They go with the currents and then settle in another environment. Another example of connectivity I will mention now in the final part here is to fulfill Paris agreement goal and climate change goals the last years one of the major things we have already heard it today highlighted is the problem of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere just filling more and more and this is because of of course cool oil and gas and cement but also because of land use in different ways we are destroying environments and there is habitat modification habitat loss and so on. Luckily we have natural carbon sinks which is a sort of nature based solution this can be done in many ways but this is our nature so we are only on 417 ppm today which is way too much because of our land and ocean sinks. In the marine environment we talk about coastal blue carbon and ocean blue carbon and green carbon is the carbon that is absorbed in the terrestrial environment and the coastal soon is extremely efficient in sequestering carbon because of high productivity slow decomposition when it comes down to the sediment and input from surrounding environments surrounding habitats a huge part so vegetation in the coastal soon contributes carbon in capacity and they can fuel each other vegetation can go from one area and carbon end up in another environment so we need connectivity we cannot just lose some of the systems and this we don't know so much yet but it's an ongoing studies nowadays for in one earlier study along the east african coast we found that blue carbon sequestration in sigras meadows are influenced by the landscape configuration and that fragmentation of different habitats makes it worse continuous areas but with influence from other habitats are very important and if you disturb areas carbon sink could go to carbon source with the emission of green house gases so that is also a major problem I will end up with two slides here about seascape ecology together with a lot of colleagues we did a study to identify research priorities for emerging ocean sustainable science and this was based on a special delfin method that I don't go into but academic expert in seascape ecology senior managers and conservation practitioners were involved and put up questions all of us and in the end we had a list of more than 150 questions that was put into nine themes and in the end I don't show all results but interestingly 65% of experts in science and expert practitioners in conservation and management agreed about 65% of the research questions could be like seascape change seascape connectivity ecosystem based management restoration sustainability science and so on so finally key challenges we need to think about those balancing food provision from oceans and coast with nature protection it should be meeting climate goals while maintaining natures and natures contribution to people resourcing growing cities while maintaining the nature that underpins them feeding humanity without degrading nature on land conserving and restoring nature while contributing positively to human well-being and maintaining fresh water for nature and humanity so there are some key challenges in conservation nature and natures conservation to people while achieving sustainable development goals adaptive to the united nation adaptive to the united nation and that gives both trade-offs and synergies in that way thank you from pelagic seascape hopefully fairly healthy thank you Martin we will take questions of the three presentations so I give the word now to Inge Neslund I'm Inge Neslund from WWF Sweden I'm a senior advisor for marine and fisheries and my work has been all over the place I'd rather say but one part is the Indian Ocean and our work there together with colleagues WWF is presented in more than 100 countries and in most of those countries the protection of the ocean includes projects and policy work on local regional national and global scale discounts for protected areas fishing management exploitation of oil and gas as well as deep sea mining and all is covered by the agenda 2030 how can we do a sustainable development within our fields we think that there is no way to make holistic change by working in just one area as the ocean it's water and it's life are all linked together and also exposed by climate change and the contamination of other things in the air from policy and practice point of view we are working with climate change but we think we need to have to secure the ocean biodiversity and hold the climate change it's a crucial combination for functional and productive exo systems that Martin talked about and this is independent on where on the globe you are for the regional coastal areas we could say that we can push within the United Nations global agenda and within their different meetings like the last one in Portugal the ocean decade but we can also work on governmental decisions within the countries we work and making the decision bodies to be alert on what is needed we also during our work base all the discussions on scientific publications or scientific discussions so our overall goal is a productive and silent ocean ecosystem sustaining human well-being and conserving biodiversity we need to connect these two together by 2030 we would like to see an effectively managed ocean with at least 30% of the area under protection and significantly reduce the impacts we think we can do this all work together scientists decision makers from the local to the global of course this is a hard work but this is our our goal or outcome and by 2030 we also would like to see that we have doubled the world sustainable managed fisheries which is food for people but it's also a very important part in living ecosystem the fish is not only food it's also for the ecosystem our focus is for coastal communities you can see the middle column there we we will work with no deep seabed mining which is on an international scale but also on a national level to have countries to vote for moratorium on the deep seabed mining as we know too little to start to disturb the seabed on the deep areas but we also work with blue futures which is sustainable blue economy that can be on very different levels but one level is within the coastal communities and we have a very strong focus on community led conservation which include local fisheries management so both conservation and the access to food and to combine these things are very important you can also see sharp recovery there and coral reef rescue to how to protect coral reefs that are now in a very scarce situation globally with the climate change but also the fisheries that is taken too much on both in open water back along the coastal lines we see now shark fishing in areas where they never been fishing shark before due to the demand globally and those are the top predator that also regulate the whole ecosystem so the tropical seas focus for us in Sweden has mainly been the Indian ocean and to be able to keep all the good biodiversity in combination with people's wellbeing we do have quite a bit of funding from the Swedish Development Aid CEDA and that is to support civil society I think this is one very important part in our work to connect science decision makers and the civil society rights in a line that can keep the oceans and the coastal water specifically in a good condition there are of course important to ensure both that the Development Aid include climate change and resilience work as well as to support and secure marine biodiversity of course also freshwater and terrestrial biodiversity because it's all there connected so what we do is we have two programs one is called the civil leading the change and the other one voices of diversity that we work within our colleagues especially in east Africa the west Indian ocean seascape regional program but it's not only the regional program it's also the national program and what we try to do is to synchronize ourselves so that every country, every office will have the same main points to work with and then of course you have to work according to your all national radar or what is needed specifically there but WWF has a unique position to collaborate with civil society governmental bodies ensure good governance in countries and give ownership to the coastal communities it doesn't matter how much science we have if we don't have a connection between how people's needs are and restrictions law setting within the government but also the local I would say like counties in different areas I have a few examples from Madagascar, Mozambique and Tanzania where the coastal community work has really been a good asset to give local management plans but to have a local management plan for your for your fish and for your environment for the biodiversity you need to be accepted as an organization within the national government and that is a process where we also can support and where I think science can support we would like to work continuously with the ecosystem based perspective with the HG principles and without people we can't save our oceans so we need to collaborate for the science as I said in the beginning we are basing based with all our knowledge on science we are science driven organization working in dialogue with many different actors and on many different levels I'm not doing the whole work we are a big group of people so just to finalize it's all connected and remember that when you continue to discuss and when you continue to work with your scientific tasks thank you for yours Thanks and the conference for inviting me and the very difficult word Swedish agency for marine and water management so here we are in the middle of the web we are the national authority for managing lakes and rivers and sea we work together with a lot of other authorities on regional level and national level and also under the European Union I also want to show you a big storage facility for tobacco in Gothenburg here you can imagine a lot of Swedish snus being made but this is also our headquarters so we are around 300 employees and most of us are here in Gothenburg but we work also with more international business we have a unit for international cooperation and that means international outside of the EU, we also have many colleagues working with on the EU level of course we are running three quite large programs for capacity building and bilateral relations and most of it is actually carried out in the same region as Inge was mentioning here and Martin you also had examples from the western Indian Ocean and one may wonder perhaps maybe not in this room but in other rooms one may wonder why we are here but Sweden has been working with East Africa for decades and decades and invested a lot to infrastructure and capacity building yes and we have good friendship and we are very welcome in this region it's also a region where we have many of the least developed countries and a population or populations living very close to the marine ecosystems our work is much together with the Narobi Convention which is a bit similar to Hellcom's original seas convention containing 10 countries those who are marked here we also work together with the IOC UNESCO but that's a bit of a background but I was invited here to comment a bit on how we can encourage sustainable governance of coastal areas and I think I will touch upon both of the previous speakers Martin you talked a lot about connectivity which will also be re-mentioned here you even had a pelagic species in the end because they are going to come to the importance of that Inger you also talked about the importance of connecting science with policy and also to have a right based approach when working I mean there is one thing to preserve environment but we must also use environment especially in this region at least in our case and I think in yours as well the main goal is to reduce poverty so first I want to mention connectivity here that what we have noted is that it's essential to not only focus on the coastal habitats but also to bring them together with the the pelagic like the outside for you who are not marine biologists like the bigger sea where we have fishing where the international fishing fleets come in and wipe up everything so that the local population don't get much left and these policies are often handled in separate rooms from the more local coastal system management so that is something that we need to change and the Narobi Convention is working trying to change that and of course we encourage that and then we have the cross sectoral aspects marine special planning is one example of working cross sectoral and it's a new instrument and provides a window of opportunity that I will soon present more on and then I will also mention blue economy as blue economy is something that some governments think that you can just go out in the ocean and dig up gold from the deep seafloor and that is often not the case we need to look into realistic expectations and we need to make sure that the growth stays in the local community and doesn't end up in in other pockets so if I'm going in now to just illustrate a little bit about marine special planning what is that as you see here the sea can be very busy it's often not this busy but a lot of things happening in the sea especially in the coastal zone and it's increasing all over the world it's increasing and marine special planning has to do with prioritising the the space between different sectors so that one place has a priority for fishing another one for shipping, a third for conservation and in the best case many of them can be combined but it has to do with saying no to some things and yes to other things we have done this on land for 100 years so it's nothing new but it's very new to do this in the sea and on the left side you see one of the Swedish marine special plans and on the right side you see the embryo to the marine special plan of the Seychelles and SWAM we are working a lot on capacity building on marine special planning and we can do that because we have been responsible agency for marine special planning in Sweden so we have the the experience but of course they are doing something else in other countries but we can bring in what we think you should think of and what you should not do and then we can also facilitate south to south learning we can also bring in new knowledge we have asked the University of Gothenburg to develop several studies here targeting gender aspects and poverty aspects in marine special planning because in Sweden we don't have much experience from those fields and there is not much out there on these aspects but it's super important that now when a new instrument comes in how can we make sure that it pays attention to gender aspects and poverty aspects in summary marine special planning is the planning of ocean space it's a new instrument almost all east african countries are implementing it or beginning to the drivers they can be blue economy it's often like that or it can be sustainability as in the case of the seashells it is an opportunity for weaving in connectivity into marine management to be truly cross sectorial have to negotiate between all the different sectors trans boundary crossing borders both natural borders and borders between countries it must be ecosystem based if it's going to end well and it is a good place to bring in science and there's a lot of room for capacity building here because it's a very new instrument so now quickly moving forward to one of the tools that we can use within marine special planning we have ships in the ocean but we also have fishing, unification all sorts marine mining you mentioning so when you do the planning you need to understand how this all of it affects the environment at the same time so Benjamin Halpern as was presented by Joe Martin did study where he and his research team could illustrate where do we have high cumulative impact combined impact and where do we have low so if this map was giving to the king Neptune he would be very angry on those people living in the maybe for instance in the UK and in the Far East because they are polluting and destroying the environment much more than other places this is also information that is very important if you conduct marine special planning the method that they used is to combine a lot of spatial maps on human activities and on ecosystem components such as seagrass and then also to have a sensitivity matrix that explains how sensitive is the whale to the ship and so on we adopted this in the Swedish marine special planning and we made a tool where we can we can simulate what happens we can look into how do the cumulative impact look now but also what happens if we do policy change if we do different plans how will the cumulative impact change then we can evaluate our marine plans before they are set in stone we can compare different outcomes of course it's never environment that wins at least not fully wins we can compare plans on the outcomes of plans often the negotiated versions of the plans are not completely environmental friendly but at least better than it is now for instance and we can run this analysis for any given area we can also follow the trace of pressure so who is affecting what this is very informative when dealing with the priorities of interest between different areas and as you can understand of course there is a lot of uncertainties here and it can only be used on a strategic level but this has been very good for us in Sweden to work with and we are now working together with attention to have the same tool implemented in the western Indian Ocean as a big job all these different maps needs to be developed and we need models we have a lot of open data but there is not all data for all the places we then work together with very skillful partners both Swedish partners such as the geological survey of Sweden and SLU AQUA Universities and Gothenburg University and together with African partners of course all the member states of the Nuremberg Convention is part of this work so we have done this remotely over the last couple of years and what we do is to bring in data rework the data make models that are sound and then develop the tool which looks like this in the Swedish context and will look like this in the Nuremberg Convention context and we will have a launching event of this tool in October so it's only two months from being there and I'm sure we have to rework a lot of it afterwards but it's just something that the governments can use for addressing environmental issues as they do policy and planning on a strategic level marine special planning should consider everything and that's why this is needed we also have used a method that is scientifically based but of course a lot of uncertainties still there to consider we work together with representatives from 10 different countries and our Swedish partners and it's truly science to policy this will be information for policy makers to use and the people that we work with in those countries we work both with marine ecologist and with managers and the tool will be totally owned and hosted by the Nuremberg Convention so Sweden will not have anything to do with this once it's there other than help on request so my last topic I believe I'm running low on time is the importance of enabling local blue growth we talked about which pockets the money ends in and we wish to make sure that poverty alleviation is really the end goal when using new marine resources first of all we need to know what is it that we're going to dig out of the sea that we haven't to dig out already what we find in the studies that we have made the largest potential rests in coastal tourism environmental such and marine culture there's not too much fish to go out and get that we haven't found yet and so on some countries also have oil and gas and then we have looked into 10 or 9 sorry we've looked into factors that actually enable local blue growth and those nine factors that we find out they are infrastructure like electricity, maritime infrastructure access to credits we have to have law that works, value chains and environmental law and innovation and strategic planning and so on if you're interested in that just download this quite fresh new report and see what we found based on four targeted studies but it can altogether spell out like co-development and not expect anyone to start a fish farm and then the community will immediately start to bloom we need to have other aspects in there as well and I think that on a conference like this it's not a big news but some people need to hear this so coming back to the last the previous questions I just want to underscore that we need to bring together coastal and offshore marine management marine special planning provides a window of opportunity and we need to look into the local blue growth and co-development is important there thank you so much and here are some links thank you Linus so we are opening up for questions from the audience and also online yes already there I think in the second row was the first one hi my name is Clara Stadius I'm from the International Centre for Local Democracy thank you very much for great presentations and you have touched quite extensively on the local aspect of this but I was also curious for a bit more in depth on the role of local governments in this and what is still needed to strengthen multilevel governance thank you Inge, do you want to take that use this so what we think is very important is to involve local people and civil society and I have a few examples from the area so one is octopus fishing which is partly a gender issue as it's women who are collecting octopus along the coastline and colleagues in Mozambique and in Madagascar they've done tremendous work on trying to inform how closures can can give a better income so they made together with the local fisheries and with the government because you need to have the government accepting this but they did you can say a trial where they closed some areas for three months some for six months and some for nine months and all the people were there to see how it's going when you open the fisheries this is only octopus fisheries so when you open the fisheries you can they could see that a nine month closure gave a double sized octopus so from one kilo they fished octopuses that was two kilos or two and a half kilos that's a very clear management effect of what what happens when you leave part of the coastal area alone another one was what Martin was talking about marine spatial planning protected area and WWF asked if they could close the coral reef no no no no so then they agreed with the fishermen that okay you point out what is the area and of course WWF got the area where there is no fish any longer and only small coral bummies and during seven years they followed up with the local scientific inventory two times a year and in the seventh year this area was a lot of fish even so much that they could fish outside the closed area six months later the local fishermen came to WWF and said we want to give a suggestion of a new closed area for fisheries and that was the coral reef because that gives the reef and the ecosystem a chance to be healthy and it also gives the dolphins around the reef a free area to swim the dolphins are interesting for tourists and fish is interesting for restaurants and of course for the livelihood for people but you need to have these kind of connections and civil society is very very important all the baseline was of course scientific ground just showing the need of having bottom up projects and there are several more examples like this showing that it can be progress we had several more questions as you can see I come from medicine and global health and I think this is a very new subject for me but I think there is an interconnectedness between ecosystem systems and health I would like to hear more on the interconnectedness on if there has been any studies been done where there have been lot of biodiversity loss especially the marine biodiversity loss and what has been the effect on health, human health because as we have seen the COVID-19 pandemic is just one of them that's coming up with new disease coming up so these biodiversity loss that's taking place at the marine level has there been any studies and coming from medicine and global health I would very much like to be linked at least know on this the biodiversity health and human health because this is going to be a new isn't for development as well as understanding because of the climate as well as one is amazing in the morning that we are towards the tombsteg very soon okay A quick answer from me Is it done? Is that yes we haven't done research on that but of course there are a lot of papers on this if you have a biodiversity loss and you lose the system the production of fish and crayfish and octopuses are not good which leads to to fame and the poetry of course and that was very clear there were two hurricanes that came on to Mozambique a couple of years ago which is a drastic thing but it shows very well what happens and that is what we are going to if we don't care about the oceans and hold the climate change so you're talking about the direct link of course between livelihood loss and health which is quite apparent of course but it's very evident that it's there and it's there in fact in fact there were a lot of people dying at those events I mean it was extreme so it was not only indirectly through the food but also directly in many ways also by they were sick from cooler etc directly in this environment so climate change had a very direct and indirect effect just so we had a question over there yeah thanks for your presentations Neil Powell from Uppsala University we've spoken a lot about evidence based approaches role of science role of policy but many of us know that in these coastal zones there is often no evidence because we have enormous conflicts of interest there are different perspectives in terms of how these coastal zones should see how we would like them to see it's not that there is a perfect coastal zone we also know that in many of these contexts policy is there's very low compliance in terms of policy so it's a little bit like an empty vessel and it's not going to necessarily enable change so often the problems in these coastal zones are more relational problems it has to do with relationships between different stakeholders that neither science or policy are particularly good at dealing with I just wondered if you have some reflections going beyond evidence based approaches to bringing about transformation in coastal zones and my last point is we were talking about marine spatial planning and you talked about coastal zones and oceans but I'm thinking about the land these are not closed systems and we have agriculture and we have forestry and we have industries along the coast and so on so I'm thinking a little bit about how do you bring on board those stakeholders into your marine spatial planning that's a very broad question there was actually several questions actually I think I will still the first part of it even though I'm being not part of the panel because you're obviously right we see all these problems and as trying to start to see one solution of this we're building up a model a trial in a community in the northern part of Tanzania which is heavily dependent on both fisheries and shallow water and mangrove which of course in this area include coconut plantation all of them very very sensitive to global change and any kind of effects on the vegetation and it's built from the societies it's from the University of the Salam it will go on for five years where we're trying to have a discussion with the farmers the fishermen etc to set up a special economic zone where we can try the solutions with discussion from the villages within and then we would have evaluated for five years is what we could get that's a very short time of course but at least a trial and it's based on african scientists trained within in Sweden who's coming back and giving this to the community this is not an answer to your question but it's said that it's one hope that we will be able to answer some of these questions how do we actually get it how do we get solutions that can be because they are accepted of the people who are involved unfortunately I will have to stop here not only talking myself I have to stop the the session we only have two minutes left and I want to say something I also want to advertise my own which is Sweden I'm coming from Sweden society organisation for all interested in any kind of development research we haven't really defined what developmental research is because we want everybody in we are a few hundred now we are growing and we have about 800 more connected researchers we will have an event here tomorrow 1645 which you can ask more questions because we are trying to take our own interest and starting up a discussion forum to improve Swedish development research we will also have a mingle afterwards so please feel welcome we also have a table down there so with this I have to stop I think the discussion could have gone on much further but thank you for listening and I will be here these two days I'm happy to talk and the panel will be here really really happy to discuss further anything after this thank you very much for listening