 No, many, many times to Ecuador and Venezuela. This is not good. Next time you come to Colombia, please let me know in advance in order to organize a trip around. OK, we're live now, so let me introduce you. But you're on for that, yes. Yeah. This is in the YouTube. Let me introduce you. So what's going on in Latin America? CodePink's weekly YouTube program of hot news out of Latin America and the Caribbean. We broadcast every Wednesday, 7 30 PM Eastern, 4 30 PM Pacific, with tonight being a special edition of what the F is going on in Latin America live from Bogota, Colombia. On Wednesday, April 26, Colombians initiated a national strike opposing President Duque's proposed tax reform bill to raise the value-added tax in Colombia. The most significant protests have been witnessed in Cali, Bogota, and Medellin with more than 20 deaths and hundreds injured. The protest forced President Iván Duque to withdraw the proposed legislation on Monday. Duque said earlier that tax increases were necessary to respond to the economic crisis brought on by COVID-19. But the bill caused outrage among many Colombians who say they already are struggling to feed their families and buy essential goods during the pandemic. Colombia's gross domestic product saw its sharpest crash in half a century with the pandemic driving up unemployment. So to talk with us this evening, I'm so honored to introduce with you tonight Victor de Correa Lugo. He is joining us from Bogota, Colombia this evening. He's an author and a journalist and has been a political and social activist in the streets of Colombia for the past 30 years and has been reporting from the streets in Bogota this past week. So welcome Victor. It's an honor to meet you and have you on our program this evening. Thank you so much for the invitation and I hope this program will help people around Latin America to understand more or less what is going on in my country. So let's start. Why don't you tell us a bit about what you've been witnessing in the streets since last Wednesday and then give us a bit of background as to why this proposed tax bill just basically inflamed a citizenship that's already frustrated with the economy and the government. Well, we have been with several demonstrations around not only the capital when I am where I am but also in other regions, especially in the city of Cali but also in Medellin, Bucaramanga in different regions of Colombia the people has been in the streets asking for justice asking for a to stop attack reform proposed by the government. But this is not just a spontaneous issues what is more important to understand is that first of all Colombia has been involved in an armed conflict during 60 years but Colombia have one of the biggest gap between the rich people and the poor people. The genie index is one of the five biggest in the world but also the concentration of the poverty of the land sorry the property of the land is in only few hands means we can analyze the structural issues. Second one sorry to develop the idea is the context from 2018 means the beginning of the government of the current president Duque who destroyed the peace process and who increase the neoliberalism policy and the third circle let's say like the novel of Dant is the pandemic the really terrible administration of the pandemic issues with these three elements is the reason why people are in the streets. So it's the pandemic and with the tax the proposed tax report the increase in the value added tax it was pretty significant it went from like less than 10% to almost 20% or that was the proposal. How I mean it's really almost impossible to believe a government would even consider initiating a tax increase when the economy is the worst it's been and people are unemployed people there's no access to most people have no access to vaccines or healthcare how do you reason a government trying to impose a tax increase right now? Well let's precise that the government has realized already two tax reforms one of them two of them before the pandemic in the year 2019 means the government doesn't want to feel what is going on in the society they continue with this logic of the part neoliberalism that the people have the capacity to pay and to pay and they will not say anything as you mentioned before this is totally true they try to apply a new tax for rice, coffee, sugar 90% in this way you know it's many people in Colombia only drink one coffee with sugar in the morning with one bread and you know it's like really to punish the people for some silly measures I don't want to use bad words taking previously you know the government of Colombia when it started the pandemic they decide to support the banks and they gave to the financial sector a lot of money they decide to buy airplanes, military airplanes they decide to support this kind of HFO this kind of intermediary of the health sector but not to support the hospital and the clinics means all the measures taken only increase the gap between the rich and the poor people and this is really I cannot understand how they don't see the reality what is going on in the field. So when you talk about funding for the hospitals we're talking about government funding of public public health facilities. Our health system is totally privatized and we have our intermediary between the hospital and clinics and the patients now at the beginning of the pandemic I am physician as in my first degree we demand from the state to support the clinics and the hospital they didn't and we make a research last year about the labor condition and we found three elements one increasing of the labor responsibility second one the time the working time was now is longer and the decreasing of the salary you know many hospitals took the decision to say okay but we are in a pandemic we will pay you 10% less or even 20% less but you have to work more. Some people, some medical personnel had to buy their own by security equipment because the government didn't want to bring them a elementary issues and this is part of the crisis but also we demand the need to prioritize the people and they want to prioritize the market just let me give you a clear example we had last year three, let's say Friday markets three, how you say? Yeah, Black Friday, sorry Black Friday days three just because the government want to reactivate the economy we propose to develop subsides to the poor people but the government insists to prioritize the market rather than the stopping of the pandemic So this is, I mean what we're listening to and it's fascinating me like we talked about just before we went live that it's a tragedy to see what's happening in Columbia but in the other sense so many of us who have been watching the neoliberal project expand through the Americas it's a miracle to see people in the streets in Columbia Columbia, there are certain countries where we know what's happening on the ground and we're watching a more progressive movement build but this has been really a big surprise and extraordinarily inspiring despite the violence to see this in Columbia can we talk a little bit about those demographics who are in the streets? Who is it that people are receiving? First of all, we have a long experience with social struggle unfortunately because of the armed conflict many of our leaders has been killed we are still suffering the consequences and some question has not answered yet just let me give you an example of level of violence in Columbia just during these years we had had 32 massacres, 32 massacres and a former guerrilla group far who signed the peace agreement 272 of their members has been killed now when you go to the streets you found mainly students, young people women, especially women, trade unions indigenous communities you know, it's like amazing you cannot define one world who is in the street in the street are the Colombian people it's not just the trade unions it's not that the students it's everyone yesterday for instance I was almost crying see the, I don't know how to say in English, recyclator the people who collect to recycle issues in the street they organize a group okay, recycle, thank you so much and they were doing part of the demonstration you know, when you see them asking that we are not garbage we are society when you see homeless people, you know say we are part of the society when you see really elderly people supporting the demonstration just moving the flag of the Colombian flag from the windows from the different buildings you know, it's really, really amazing but also, as we found in Facebook a lot of profiles of people members of the army with the uniform say we are not planning to kill civilians we are not planning to support this level of repression who is the person in the street is everyone and in the same way we cannot say this is responsibility of A or B political party is the society really fed up the people are really fed up with the measures taken by the government this is, wow to see an entire society upset and protesting it's profound it's, you mentioned just now about the police and the military today on your website and we should share that we'll share that address with our viewers you have a fabulous well, you have a fabulous photo gallery of police and military personnel stating that they are part of the people and don't aren't seeking to harm the people can you talk a little bit about the men and women you interviewed and this position that they have it's quite extraordinary well, it's Colombia okay, let me precise two elements I'm sorry to go to the no, no, no, please always to the context issues please the Colombian police forces are not so far from the Colombian army it means the theory the theoretical approach the development even the kind of weapon that they are used they are used weapon in the military way you can see the Colombian police for instance they have counter guerrilla groups they use helicopters and rifles and heavy artillery all of them are part of the police means we are not exactly so something that we can that we can call a for instance this kind of police civilian issues or civilian corps but it's more a military corps the Colombian police first of all and second one they used to take part in real brutality actions if you see the level or report by the human rights organization around the world the Colombian behavior is really horrible just let me tell you one example it's something that we call false positives but it really is a executions is to capture civilians to dress as a member of the guerrilla group and to kill them we have more than 10,000 cases documented you know this level of violence now that some few people among these 500,000 members of the Colombian army say I don't want to kill civilians is really huge issue two days ago association of former military produced a paper a document one paper saying we don't want to support any kind of participation of the army to dissolve the demonstrations in Bogotá or Cali or the urban areas and this I mean it's just few cases but these cases represent that even some people that was educated and the security internal national security internal enemy now they are thinking that this is not the correct way also in some part of the society you know some people wish in the past support the right wing candidates like the former president Uribe now they are in the street say okay this is not it was not a correct option and this is the most important that you can see different kind of people but also a political spectrum really, really big and so yeah I had no idea it was such a that it's basically Columbia and her citizens her people I had you know this is fabulous what you're sharing with us and of course many of our viewers know former president Uribe has been in New York City and there's been some significant protests there with Colombians living in the diaspora let's talk about some of these people some of these military and police personnel that you have in your photo essay online right now, today you published we collect this with some friends and we over double check several times but just to close this topic let me say that sort of then this is the preliminary information we are in about to confirm what I will about to say is that some of them are has been captured and they are under detention because of the public declaration in favor of the demonstrations is a huge delicate situation and some organizations are ready to support them and this is also that I want to say I'm really you know touching how many lawyers say in the social nets in Twitter or in Instagram say okay, I'm a lawyer, I am ready for free to help any people in their under legal process because of the demonstrations but also people, psychologists say we would like to support the family of the victim some people say well I can't help taking care of children you know it's amazing of course it's not generalized we are not in a like a big uprising national and general but it's the most important demonstration in the history in the recent history of Colombia is really amazing and the most important that I want to clarify and we the government and the big media try to present the people who is taking part in the demonstration as a delinquent and the president, the former president Uribe try to present this delinquent let's say with the quotation, two terrorists and in this way they try to move the focus to the lack of justice the tax reform, the level of repression to the war on terror and this is really important they put the focus where is the best landscape for the government you know this is not unlike the narrative we hear in the United States also if you're not for the complete privatization of the economy you know you're a terrorist you're delinquent you don't want to work all of that that's a very very similar narrative in the US and of course the goal is the same you know 100% privatization of the economy that neoliberal model now I want to add another component that is really important is the level of brutality in the street I invite you, all the people who is listening to us to check in the pages of human rights organization in Colombia the civil organization and you will see amount is amazing the amount of videos made by the civilian, by the society when you can see a police officer killing in cold blood young people in the street you can see how many times the demonstration without police has not any violent act but once the police arrive you have the violent guarantee but it's a lot of cases last night one professor, one student of a university who was taking part in one of the demonstrations in a block road were killed and nothing happened today, just four hours ago we received information by a senator of the republic that tracked plenty of civilians with weapons were killing people and suddenly was a military squash close and they arrived and the civilians escaped but they discovered police jackets inside this truck I mean, there is really a strategy to present the word that the demonstration in Colombia is a vandalization process paid by the drug dealers paid by the guerrillas, paid by the terrorism then I really beg the people who follow this program to help to spread another version of what is the reality that we have been killed several times in the last days by the government You know, it's interesting what you say about the government and the military saying the protesters are funded, trained, being motivated by narco traffickers and yet all the people in the street want to get rid of their government and refer to their government as a narco-trafficking state So who is the... I mean, who's whom? I mean, you know, I think most of us at least most of us in my activist circle we understand, you know, the drug trade that comes out of Colombia despite there being a U.S. military basis despite a government, you know, supported by the United States there's still an enormous amount Well, the majority of the narcotics come from there So, I mean, it's fascinating to me that both sides seem to be using this narrative Yes, it is For the people in the streets, it's not a narrative, it's reality for them they know what they're doing Yeah, yeah, that's right, that's right I mean, one of the biggest problem is to compare narratives but the most important is come to the street when I have discussion with some colleagues Last night I have a discussion with a right-wing member of the Senate and I say, come with me to the street we can go to the street and this is the reality I am not a post-modern person I don't believe in several realities or several truths I believe that the truth is possible to touch in the street, you know and it's really amazing the level of violence daily, you know you hear that the police is using a live ammunition I'm not talking about tear gas, I'm talking about a live ammunition We have image of the helicopter shooting people We have image that the mayor of Bogota accepted the helicopters in the ground of two schools in the south area of Bogota as well as the north This is a deployment when you have an armed conflict there is no willing of talk I cannot say to you, I would like to talk to you OK, the dialogue, but at the same time ordering the people to kill civilians or not to persecute the members of the army that are killing systematically civilians This is really a big crisis and the most important is the role of USA USA has support the Colombian government USA has armed the Colombian army USA has trained the Colombian police officers and officers of the army then in the decision of the president Joe Biden and the capacity to push from the White House the Colombian government is part of the solution we are not asking for more violence we are not asking for more killing we would like a dialogue but this negotiation table should be organized with the society and for the society now one of the biggest problem is the negotiation proposal presented by the government is really a bad joke This is the proposal by the Colombian government the current government what? go ahead, I'm sorry no, no, I just wanted to say like for instance the government organized like a the vaccination and they say, well, we would like to negotiate taking into account the vaccination people are not asking for the vaccination in the street they are asking for the health right to health respect to the health services the government say we would like to recovery the economy OK, we propose a basic rent to the poor people in order to guarantee some increase some capacity, economic capacity to the more poor families you remember in USA how you deal with the the crisis in 1929 was the new deal finally it's more gains than budget but here they love budget and I don't know why they hate gains but also they include some points like the non-violence or protect the vulnerable people come on, the government has some duties and they don't have to discuss the duty with the society they have to fulfill the constitution just see, no more but the important points about the criminality by the army about the tax reform about the access to the health facilities with dignity the government doesn't want to discuss these points that is actually the point that people are asking in the street they want to deburr the debate wow, it's so much so much of what you all of you in Colombia are protesting in the streets is so much of what we should be protesting in the United States as well you're an inspiring example perhaps for many of us maybe we should create a campaign that honestly should be called Colombian Lives Matters Colombian Lives Matters yes, that's right so speaking of so Colombian Lives Matter and us working together what would you like to see what would you ask of me and my fellow activists in the United States what can we do for Colombia and her people what would you like to see us do now what is something that we can we'll have you back on the show for sure okay, first of all I would like you to contact the congress persons the member of the Senate and demand from them public statements against the violence by the police forces and the army in the Colombian case we would like you please say to the Colombian government stop killing civilians this is our field at least my first demand I am part of the civil society organization but I don't have the mandate to talk on behalf of them but just to share with you some ideas first of all please say to the world stop killing Colombian people this is the first one second one we would like that the dialogue will be a mechanism to be established but without tricks you know without traps without you know it's like try to be honest try to hear what the people say and this is also important one of the biggest thing that also the USA can do is propose to the Senate and the congress to stop the military support to the Colombian army this is really a huge issue but I will give you something well I don't want to be misinterpreted but let me tell you something the Colombian elites and the politicians love to go to Miami and they love to go to New York you know and if you withdraw the visa of few of them they will be in panic believe me you know and it's on like the minister of defense you know because he is the few responsible of what is going on in the field the president Duque because he is responsible also you know and once a government announce the possibility to withdraw the visa they will be really touch also of course you know it's something elementary because it's now you can also help us with the USA companies in Colombia there is a lot of USA companies based in Colombia just let me give you an example several years ago was a legal discussion because a member of the trade union of Coca-Cola company were killed in Colombia and there is some evidence which are compromised or is yeah involved in these crimes the company itself if you help denouncing how some companies of USA supporting the killing in Colombia but not only during these days who has been you know it's more than 1000 social leaders have been killing the last years this is amazing in the 90s and it's not new in the 90s for instance more than 90% of the trade union leader in the world were killed in Colombia it's amazing if you add it's not matter of sadistic but let me with all the respect for the other victims of the dictator chief in South America but if you put together the missing people from Chile Argentina, Brazil, Anuruguay Colombia won Colombia wins we have 85,000 missing people during our war it's really amazing you know but also the focus of Latin America cannot be the crisis of Venezuela okay we can discuss about Venezuela but how is possible that Almagro are discussing two days ago about what to do with Venezuela how is possible that the Lima group don't say a word yeah the Lima group doesn't say a word about Venezuela it's really a change for the you know what I try to say I don't say anything about Colombia they're focused on Venezuela when the streets are calm in Venezuela and also Colombia is protesting no it's I mean it's very clear what the political and economic what the geopolitical goals are and the manipulation of that narrative it's so key and this is something that I think we should be really clear with our audience and I think many of our viewers you know already know this and perhaps agree that really the violence and the repression that is directed as the narrative towards Venezuela is the reality in Colombia and I in my eyeball can honestly say that because I've been to Venezuela many many times in the last 10, 15 years and you know never experience they're not once even despite how difficult life is for many people there particularly because of the US sanctions placed on the country but the violence and political and social uprest in Colombia is we haven't seen that we've seen that where in other neoliberal countries Ecuador, Chile we saw that like Haiti we've seen but that's you know in Colombia we have around 1.8 million migrants from Venezuela and one job that is is a bad joke I know common in the social media and the social net is like okay we have to be careful because what kind of country we will offer to the Venezuelan migrants you know it's like you know it's like we are really in pain when you try to compare about Burma for instance about the yellow jackets in France and how they get some kind of attention by the press I really appreciate how the international media now is focusing in the in the Colombian crisis but this crisis is unfortunately is not new for us if you see for instance the level of poverty I see that I haven't mentioned 42% of the people are in the poverty line 42% mean 21 million people and it's really you know a real crisis and the same time during this crisis the government of Uduque wanted to give a financial support to the airline Avianca but it's not a Colombian company you know and support the biggest companies but not the small and medium company and yeah company lots of people that he wants to tax the people that he wants to tax have no income to tax yeah this is not Sweden at all and yeah exactly and I think that this is this is important the how you focus the media also demand from your media to pay attention to the Colombian crisis I put in my website a letter I will send you this letter in English explaining in three pages the origin, the cause and the development of our struggle we have this letter already in French Germany, Netherlands, and Italian and please try to sell to say the word that the government has been killed civilians in Colombia that would be fantastic for you to share that with us and I'll be sure for our viewers to post it in the description for tonight's program as well so that everyone who's watching can see it and we'll we'll take a look at that with our Latin America team as well that is really helpful and thank you why don't you since you brought up your website why don't you share with our viewers your website, your Facebook page your Twitter account so that we know how to follow you and continue to engage with you yeah my website is victorthecurrealugo.com is like my name you know it's CC and they you can find you can find there are my Facebook and my you know my Twitter and everything victorthecurrealugo.com I let me be proud of myself to say like I has been academic journalist not I don't want to do a propaganda I try always to double check the information to be sure what I say unfortunately most of the web page as you can imagine is in Spanish but it is an English section and you can use even Google translator that many people use in order to to share with the world my job I'm planning to put several pictures but you can use as you want in order to to to show that not only the violence but also this demonstration that you know the the the the the happiness the kindness of the people in the street asking for rights. Well thank you so much Victor before I let you go is there anything that you want to say that we haven't touched on this evening that well I I did a long list of issues thinking about the boring speech but now thanks to you has not been too much boring at least not for your side but just let me tell you that we really need it you cannot imagine the power of USA and the USA society in the Colombian dynamic our more in most important economic exchange is with USA the political support you know the possibility the real possibility to touch the government you know is the the the USA society and the USA authorities and the USA media please the USA media has a lot of things to say I really appreciate it a friend of mine from I don't know Kuala Lumpur decided to to support us thank you so much and welcome we are welcome any kind of help from everywhere but it's more important the impact will be huge huge if we receive support from New York from Washington from you know Philadelphia for any kind of play San Francisco Los Angeles San Francisco Yes it's like Seattle exactly please please send letter to the minister of defense send letter to the president Duque put in the newspaper discuss in with your neighbors what is going on in Colombia really we are more than a coca producer or a cocaine dealers we are before all human beings you are human being suffering for unjust system and we are suffering the consequences of the long time protected armed conflict we need your solidarity and you remember I remember with all my passion the struggle of the USA citizen during the campaign black lives matters I demand I beg I implore please don't let us alone support us we will try to do our best maybe we fail but we will try honestly and we will try our hardest to stand in solidarity with you and I love the five points you shared with us I'm going to share them with our viewers and our many followers what we as US citizens can do to influence our own government and our own media in the states and Victor I so thank you for your time this evening it has been such an honor to meet you and speak with you and I would love for you to come back and and give us some updates and so that we can continue to support you and see your face and hear your voice and please please share our program and audience with those of you that you talk to and meet in the streets that we are interested and very concerned about what's happening with them but it also is very inspiring to see a nation of people in the streets and demanding and protesting for change for themselves and for their entire nation it's a lot of violence we all know but it's also it's also very inspiring what people organized are capable of doing the positive things that people are capable of doing so thank you so much you want to say something I can see go ahead thank you very thank you for the people who follow this program we are open to support any kind of media we need interviews or pictures or testimonies you are really we are really ready to help but this is not only our cause it's also your cause the fight for dignity the fight against neoliberalism the fight against inequality is not a problem with the Ecuadorian people alone or the Brazilian people alone or the children or the people in Burma or in France or no it's a universal issue I see that we should recover this universalism and this solidarity please our cause is also your cause thank you so much thank you so much and I want to remind our audience that you've been watching what the F is going on in Latin America Code Peaks weekly YouTube program of hot news out of Latin America and the Caribbean we have been speaking this evening with Victor de Correalugo he is a journalist and author, a doctor he's been speaking with us live from Bogota, Colombia and we will be talking with him again for updates as to what's happening in Colombia you can catch our program every Wednesday on YouTube, on Code Pink YouTube Live 7.30 p.m. Eastern, 4.30 p.m. Pacific tonight has been a very special edition of our program and also please remember to tune into Code Pink radio every Thursday morning, 11 a.m. Eastern 8 a.m. Pacific the program simulcasts on WBAI out of New York City and WPFW out of Washington DC thank you everybody I hope this evening has been very informative for all of you and thank you again Victor an honor and a pleasure to have you with us in conversation tonight