 Go, two o'clock, right on the money. Okay, I'm Jay Fiedel, this is Think Tech, and more specifically, this is the Community Matters series. That's because community does matter. Okay, we have Dorei Shin. This is her second time on Think Tech. Congratulations and welcome, Dorei. Thank you, it's been great. And we wanna talk to you about millennials today because we need to have a window, as we always do, on what the millennials are thinking because they're going to save us. We need them to save us and that includes you, Dorei. It's a lot of pressure. So we're gonna talk about the politics of the millennials. So my first question is, who do millennials have politics? Are they into politics, or are they turning their back on that? What's your view of it? I think that we're born into, in America, we're born into a government that fundamentally hasn't worked since we've been born. And I think maybe past generations have experienced a better functioning government that took care of the people. But because of the corporate wealth gap and just income inequality and all the basic needs that aren't being met, like since we were born, I think that a lot of millennials and young people are feeling really disenfranchised and just disheartened. And they're not empowered. They don't know what's going on in politics and they would care to just forget about it because they feel really frustrated. So I think there's a lot of that going on in the hearts of millennials. But I think there's also with that an opportunity to excite them and engage them in politics again if we do it the right way. Yeah, serious. Okay, let me drill down a little bit on that. Are they voting? I think that right now we're going in polarities. And I think that there's a group of millennials that are really engaged and excited and they're voting and they know that their vote matters and their voice matters. And I think there's a whole another section just as large that are not voting. They think that nothing matters, that corporations run our country and that politicians don't care about people. And there's definitely some overlap between the two. And I think that there's really a, I think that to me shows that there's such a huge opportunity for us to say like, how do we get these voters to care again and realize that just those numbers alone could shift our entire government system. Just if those people realize that they do matter and that we do have the power to outnumber and outpower kind of the rich and powerful in our country today. You know, I asked a young woman in China one time whether she voted and she said she didn't vote. She was smart. She didn't vote because she could only vote for the lowest level of official and the way it's a tiered pyramid. And then the lowest level of official votes for the next level, the next level, next level. She had no say in the selection of the premier. And she felt that her vote was really not important. And so it wasn't worth her time to do it because the system had a life of its own and she wasn't part of that life. How do millennials feel about that? They feel that this is the sort of corporate emergence so the corporate restructuring or the corporate dominance, if you will, in the marketplace of ideas is so strong that they'll never have a say. And that, you know, give it up, there's no point. Just go with the flow. You find that. I think, yeah, and I think a lot of millennials are just comfortable enough to not engage at all. And, you know, my dad always told me that there needs to be a certain threshold of suffering as unfortunate as it may be, whether it's unemployment or an inability to pay rent, something that's really tangible and visceral for people before they start to realize that they need to get out on the streets and do something radical. So, yeah, I think that millennials are just comfortable enough. We're not at the point with climate change or economic inequality that there's a critical mass of suffering. And I wish that people would engage before we hit that critical mass, but I think sometimes we do have to wait for enough people to be suffering, to really care and start to collectively unite around one message and a vision for the future. But, you know, the word is that this generation, your generation is not gonna do as well on the whole as a generation of your parents. That, you know, this is sort of a diminution in wealth and influence and so forth. Do you believe that? Do the millennials believe that they are not going to be as franchised, as powerful, as prosperous, as wealthy as the generation of their parents? I don't think that we know those statistics and facts really well, but I do think that there's a sense that there's an increasing grip of power by mega corporations and industries. And I think that as that feeling and reality continues to grow, that there will be greater frustration. And I think that's kind of what sparked Occupy Wall Street, which was almost our revolution. And I think that we're ready for another one that's going to have outcomes. And so I think a lot of young people that I talk to, they don't think that business as usual, they don't think voting every two years, every four years, is enough to make the changes that they feel will actually help them in the ways that they need to feel cared for. So I think a lot of them are waiting for some kind of revolution, some kind of new leadership that's gonna energize them to get out and vote, get on the streets, you know, build community and start asking for really big changes. I think we're kind of on the precipice of something, I think we're still in a, I'm comfortable, I'm just gonna watch Netflix and be on my phone most of the time. So I'm optimistic that we're getting somewhere, but I do feel we're not quite there yet. And as your father says, and I totally agree with him, that a little suffering would help to, as a catalyst, make people awaken to these issues. And that's not only the millennials that's everybody. Yeah, totally. But the problem is that when that happens, when you get uncomfortable and things go bad, it may be too late. It may be too late if you're hungry, for example, you're susceptible, you're vulnerable, and maybe you'll get confused about what you really want. I mean, this is not out of Les Mis, you know, where you have barricades in the street. I like that. But how do you see the millennials expressing themselves? I heard what you were saying, perhaps protest, perhaps occupy Wall Street, perhaps. Is that the way? Because, you know, that traditionally has been, you know, difficult, and maybe even violent. There's a downside to that. How do you turn things around? You said waiting for a leader. What kind of leader? And what do you think that leader would do to give you this opportunity to change things? I think that we need, I think just like we need a critical mass of suffering, we need a critical mass of good leaders. So, you know, we have a few really key politicians that are, you know, looking out for the American people, but it's not enough to outweigh the influence that industries and companies have right now in American politics. So I think that we need more than AOC and Bernie Sanders. You know, we need 10, 20, 30% of our leadership to be standing up for people and not compromising on our values. And then that will lead to the critical policy changes and government, and maybe campaign finance reform. Specific changes in the way our government is run and financed that will then allow all the other changes to happen. And one of those things is of course getting money out of politics. And that would be a really basic level of returning Citizens United. So something like that. Like those key renew deal, those key things could be enough to shift, you know, the 10 major issues we're facing today. Oh, I'm glad. And I want to dwell with you on that. Let's pick one that you mentioned, getting money out of politics. I sure agree that money is corrupting politics, has been corrupting politics for your lifetime and maybe longer. Right. And a lot of that these days has to do with, you know, Citizens United, right? Citizens United was a case in the Supreme Court. There is no indication whatsoever that Supreme Court is going to overturn that now or in the lifetimes of, you know, the majority of the court. You know, we're not going to see a bunch of Ruth Bader Ginsburgs here. We're going to see Republicans who are not inclined to turn over Citizens United. So assuming Citizens United last, how can you change that? I mean, what's the plan? Could there be a plan? And if so, what kind of plan? What would it look like? You know, for July 4th, I read the Declaration of Independence. Did you really? Yeah, I was just like, let me just read this. And I've never done it before. I'm 27 years old. And in it, it says, if a government, something, you know, I'm summarizing, if a government fails to meet the needs, the basic needs of its people and the basic desires of its people, and it strays from that in any way, then the people within the Declaration of Independence it states, the people must overturn it and change it on a fundamental level. And I don't know if, I don't think I'm the expert to say we're quite there yet, but I think we're pretty close. I think that what the people want is consistently at odds with what our politicians do. And it's, and so one example I share from a local level is the Styrofoam ban in Hawaii. It's one of the most popular issues to most of the public. It's a no-brainer. So we had 670 testimony in support and that's pretty unheard of in terms of number of testimony. And we had about two or three testimony in opposition and they were all from paid industry lobbyists like the American Chemistry Council or the foam manufacturers. And it died, the bill died. So that's one example where it's like, clearly the people are saying one thing and the government is meant to represent the people. That's why we vote people in is to represent us as a representative democracy. But as we see that continues to fail to happen at the very local level, all the way to the federal level, I think that it is an indication to the people that our government is failing us and is in fact not abiding by our founding documents. And if that's the case, what do we do? I don't know the answer. I think it's some kind of revolution. It's more than some things. I'm a lawyer so I'm always gonna start out with what's the legal, existing legal structure is. I'm not sure you're in the same place. No, definitely not. You're maybe out on the streets about this, you know? Maybe there's a place for that. But let's take the foam ban, okay? It's a travesty, what happened? Totally. So what do you do? I mean, there are some legislators who voted against or some committee chairs who acted against passing the foam ban. It's very important, climate change and environment is really important because they're coming for us and talk about discomfort, they're gonna be a source of great discomfort for us. Climate change and environment. So if you wanted to fashion a plan on this, you would say this guy, Joe Schmo, he voted against the foam ban. We are not forgetting that. Oh, what are they? And we have the power of social media, we have the power of our constituency, which is a collaborative constituency. They know each other, they like each other, they believe each other and they share your view that government is not working on a fundamental level. What do they do tomorrow to make sure that the foam ban incident never happens again? And I think this is where we come back to the leadership and it's kind of consistently a handful of the most powerful people, whether it's Hawaii government or whether it's federal. There are certain people that have significantly more power than everyone else. So within a House of Representatives or a Congress, you're not gonna have the same level of power for each person in there. So I think those people who have a lot of power tend to have the most influenced by companies and big money and then their values become tainted and they're not able to listen clearly to the will of the people, which is not their fault. I'm not blaming them. I understand it's challenging to balance it all out but it's not why we voted people in. And so I think that that's why I want millennials to vote because locally, we've had a lot of elections even in this last cycle where the progressive candidate lost by 20 votes. So to say that voting doesn't matter. Sometimes it's true in the Electoral College and the Presidential election, it's kind of true. But in local elections, it really does matter. Just a handful of people. There's a lot of elections here locally where it's just a few dozen votes off. And so I think we need to identify those people who are often getting in the way of progress and say, you know, we're going to vote you out and enough is enough. And I think a lot of the work I've done is with nonprofits and we're not legally allowed to call out or endorse politicians. So it needs to be from a grassroots place. It needs to not come from a nonprofit affiliation. And so I think that's where the challenge lies is a lot of the people like myself that are really intricately involved in this who know who are the ones who are getting in the way of progress. We're not actually legally allowed to use our community and our influence to then inform the community and voters about. Well, we'll help you. Yeah, so we just need people who aren't affiliated with a nonprofit to be that voice. It could be students. It could be people without that nonprofit status. So that's something to be aware of. Well, that goes to the whole question of journalism and the media. Yeah, exactly. And you do have the tools that can help you. Right. And I have this image of all the people on the Democratic bandstand in the debates a week or two ago. And then I can't see any of them actually, I'm sorry, fitting into your model here. So let me name some things. Okay. One is you have to find leaders who you believe in. They can be young, but they have to be educated. Totally, yeah. They can be educated, but they have to be articulate like you. And they have to have values, you know? And maybe they get on the platform there with the other guys and they shine and maybe they get elected. But then, you know, the millennials have to vote together. They have to vote together and they have to have this kind of understanding together across the whole country, really, that they're gonna follow certain principles and vote for certain people. How do you, how do you have that happen? How do you have the education and the articulate power and the, of course, the policy issues? How do you bring a group together? I think you ultimately, as you said, you need a leader. Where's the leader gonna come from? How can we have a leader who's 27 years old, right, who will be followed by, say, 100 million people? How do you do that? Well, I think that Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is a perfect example. And in her recent documentary, Knock Down the House, which is on Netflix, I just watched, it was really inspiring. It showed that she, there was a group, I think they were just an organization that trains and recruits candidates. So it wasn't that AOC came out and said, I'm running for office and she won. It was that she was nominated, recruited, and she said yes. And then she was heavily trained and supported by a group of experts who deeply understand how to win elections. And so I think it needs to be that strategic. You know, the civil rights movement, the women's rights movements, these movements didn't succeed because of Rosa Parks or Martin Luther King. They succeeded because they were highly organized, highly strategic, and unified across the nation. And so it's going to take a lot of effort, but I think that the expertise is out there and the drive is out there. It's just gonna take a level of strategy and unification. And that's leadership, too. Yeah, exactly. To create that strategy. So there's people who will become the leaders and then there's organizations that will cultivate the leaders. And so there has to be a good kind of recipe for all of that to happen together. Yeah, I'm behind on this. I have to take a minute to write my notes down so I can make a note of all the good things you're coming up with. We can take a one minute break, okay, Dorei? Sounds good. We'll come back and we'll continue. I have lots more questions. Awesome. All right. Ha ha ha ha. Aloha, I'm Deila Nyonegira, a host here at Think Tech, Hawaii, a digital media company serving the people of Hawaii. We provide a video platform for citizen journalists to raise public awareness in Hawaii. We are a Hawaii nonprofit that depends on the generosity of its supporters to keep on going. We'd be grateful if you'd go to thinktechhawaii.com and make a donation to support us now. Thank you so much. Aloha, I'm Stan Osserman, a host here on Think Tech, Hawaii, a digital media company serving the people of Hawaii. We provide a video platform for citizen journalists to raise public awareness here on the island. We are a Hawaii nonprofit that depends on the generosity of its supporters to keep on going. We'd be grateful if you'd go to thinktechhawaii.com and make a donation to support us now. Mahalo. Okay, I made my notes. I'm straightened out a little bit now. I'm gonna try to follow Dorei. Dorei Shen, our guest today, talking about millennials and politics. So, you know, we're skirting around the issue. Let's get to the center of things. What do you think about Trump? Trump has, I think Trump has psychological problems and I don't think that's debatable. I think it's clear that if you look at a list of symptoms, he could clearly be diagnosed with being a pathological liar and a narcissist. And to me, that indicates where American people are at that not only do they maybe really support and love somebody like this, but that even if they think maybe he's not the best person in the world, that they're still willing to vote for him because he's something different. And so it's been a fascinating social experiment. I think it's been terrible for a lot of reasons in which a lot of the decisions he's made has caused a lot of suffering to a lot of people and nature. But I do think that this is part of the cycle of what happens when a country has become oppressed and uneducated. So I'm excited to see what happens in 2020. Well, I'm excited, but I'm also scared. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, so what does it take to beat him? Is everybody looking for a candidate who can beat him? I mean, people like Harris because maybe she can beat him. They like Elizabeth Warren, maybe she can beat him. And Biden, I'm not so sure he can beat him. But that's the test everybody applies. He's like, I don't care about your policy. I want to know if you can beat Trump because we got to get him out of there. How do you feel about that? I think that's a big problem. I know I think that if we only focus on beating Trump, then we ignore all of the issues that matter to people who are going to vote. And I think the more you ignore the issues that matter to people who will vote or not vote, that is going to affect turnout. And then you see that when it was Clinton versus Trump. And everyone thought Clinton was just going to win. And the turnout was so bad that she lost. And now we have Donald Trump as our president. And so I think that the Democratic establishment has really failed its people by saying, we're going to continue to prioritize the establishment candidate who's going to keep things essentially the same, but be really good at talking and saying the right talking points to try to relate. But it's so inauthentic and scripted that people my age and my group of friends, they're turned off. They don't relate to the candidates. They can tell it's inauthentic and scripted. They know it's an establishment candidate, someone who's been in politics far too long to be values driven, or somebody who's changed on so many issues that they're not trustworthy anymore. And so I think that if we want to win and we want to really make the changes that we need to make, it's not just about winning. It's about making the changes we need to make. We need to pick somebody who's going to speak to people in an authentic and genuine way. And that's how I think the Democratic establishment has failed. And I think that's why Trump won, because he, as much as so many of us might disagree with him, he is himself. And that spoke for a lot of people. Oh, God. Hard. That was true. So remember Mr. Potato Man? Yeah. So you make him any way you want? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And put the mouth and the eyes on him. So if I gave you a Mr. Potato Man, and I asked you to design a candidate who could deal with him, who would be appealing, and who would be a good president, tell me all the characteristics of Mr. Potato Man or Miss Potato Man, as it may be, who could do that, who you would want to see up there on the stage in the final analysis. I think it's somebody who is consistent over time. They have had values since the beginning, and they largely haven't changed on them. That's really attractive, I think. And somebody who is compassionate and leads with their heart and is not going to be influenced by money and hopefully doesn't take any or a lot of money from industry. And somebody who continuously stands up for people and the environment and values rather than trying to maintain the status quo. Because the status quo is what got us into all of the crises we find ourselves in today. So I think it needs to be all those things. And somebody who's energetic and can energize the crowd, like few droves of people will come out to rallies for them, because that means those people will come out to vote. And it's going to be a lot of new voters as well. Yeah, we need that for sure. But you want to change a lot of things. One of the things that we all would like to see is a functional Congress. Because Congress right now is dysfunctional. They can't pass anything. Not even an infrastructure bill is really pathetic. And we're paying all this money to have Congress. And it's like they're all in breach, I shouldn't say all, but the Republicans anyway, are in breach of their oath of office. What kind of Congress would you like to see? What is your Mr. Potato Man on Congress? And Mitch McConnell. I think that the people right now in Congress, I think what's going on culturally in politics is that everything's about what party you're in. And so there's all this loyalty which just turns into duality. So it's like if AOC says one thing, every Republican must be against it. And there's no critical thinking involved. And I think that's such a disservice to our democracy, because there's so many things that we're going to disagree on, no matter what. But in the same vein, there's so many things that we can agree on. And climate change is a perfect example. There's no reason for climate change to be a partisan issue. There's plenty of conservatives, Tea Party people, Republicans who understand that our environment is impacted by human activity and that it's a win-win-win situation to address it and to make positive changes around it. But the fact that it's become partisan and a lot of that has to do with money in politics undermines the ability for any work to get done because it's high school. It's like, oh, we're just going to fight with each other and be committed to disagreeing rather than being civil and saying, let's have a conversation. And I think that starts with me and you and saying, I'm willing to reach out to someone that has an uncomfortable viewpoint. And I'm willing to have civil discussions, whether they're in person at the coffee shop, on Facebook. And I think America really needs to work on this, from the individual level to the governmental level and say, I'm going to talk to people I disagree with and conclude those conversations in what we can agree on and at least do those things. Because otherwise, we're in a completely inefficient system where no one's listening to each other. This requires some real work because not only is the burden to try to get your generation together and focus on these issues, but it's also there are people who would oppose that, people who would create divisiveness. And I firmly believe that there was some attempt at leaking the cable from the British ambassador, so that there would be a fight. And there is a fight, not only is it between the ambassador and Trump, but it's between Britain and the US. What a great maneuver to create divisiveness. The point is that there are people around who would oppose everything you're talking about and try to divide your group, divide your millennials so that they were neutralized and could not do what they had hoped to do. The question is whether the millennials can stick together despite those efforts, whether they're sophisticated enough to realize when they're being worked and manipulated. What do you think? Yeah, I think divide and conquer is a classic strategy of people in power. And I just imagine these people in these ivory towers and they're laughing at all the people below who are fighting with each other and not looking up. And I think that's what we need to do is say, you know, there are times when we need to have those discussions and debates, but there are times when it's a waste of time and we can find things that we unite on, like saving our planet, let's do that first, or getting money out of politics, or getting corporations to not have so much influence in government and elections. So I think there are some foundational things we can all focus on now and focus on all the other divisive issues later because we don't have time for that right now. Now, a lot of people have said the constitution, that we worship the constitution, it's a sacred constitution and all that, and actually it's being broken every day by this administration. And arguably it needs to be fixed, it needs to be fixed perhaps, perhaps on the electrical college. And various other points that have come up that have been stressed that have demonstrated a weakness in light of recent events. So what do you think about that? How would you like to see the constitution change and how would you propose a de-change? I don't know about the constitution itself, but I think that, you know, I think the constitution has amazing intentions. I think there's always room for improvement as the society unfolds and develops. I think the electoral college should be reformed and potentially just abolished and that we should have a more direct democracy. You know, George W. Bush and Donald Trump are the most recent presidents who won without the popular vote. And I think that, you know, that's enough to say this isn't okay, you know. More people voted for the other person and so how can we have the other person as president? And- I'd like to testimony on the phone ban. Yeah, it's the same thing. So I think that's where the electoral college has failed us and just doesn't work anymore. It's why do we need, why do we need something to get in the way of a direct democracy? I also think we need to make voting really accessible. You know, something like, candidates like Bernie Sanders will say that voting instead of you having to go register yourself to vote, that you just become registered to vote automatically when you turn 18 as a citizen. I think this was tried in other countries and extremely successful in increasing turnout. We're lazy. Millennials, I'll speak for us especially, we're much lazier than previous generations. And we sit on our computers a lot and our phones and we don't move. So if there's a barrier to entry for anything, online shopping, whatever it is, we're not gonna do it. Things need to be put in our face and that's why I think we need to be automatically registered to vote. We need to be able to online vote as long as we can make that safe from being rigged. And so those are some of the basic things we need to do to increase turnout and make it as easy and accessible as possible for everyone to vote. You know, Doree, you're unusual. Not everybody I know is your age and background is as articulate or forceful or thoughtful about these issues and committed to doing something about it. But my question to you is my last question. What are you gonna do about it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, but what are you gonna do about it? How do you see yourself participating in activities, events, programs and the like that will actually bring about the changes you'd like to see? Yeah, you know, I've been traditionally involved in one issue at a time, plastic pollution, sustainability, you know, nonprofit work, event planning and I think I'm kind of realizing that we need to do a lot more, you know, than one event at a time, one nonprofit at a time, focusing on one issue at a time. So the answer is I'm not sure, but I am having like a quarter of a life, maybe not crisis, but kind of realization that there needs to- Quarter of life crisis, you got that. That we need to have, you know, more. Like we need to be bolder and more united and louder and we need to become the squeaky wheels of our generation because change is not happening fast enough. You know, I think I've personally been kind of waiting to see what happens and I'm like, I'll participate in something when it occurs. I think a lot of us are doing that, passively hoping somebody else will do it. And I think that a lot of leaders like Greta Thunberg and AOC have inspired me and a lot of other young people to say, you know, maybe we're the ones we've been waiting for and we need to become those leaders. We are the ones we've been waiting for. It's cliche, but I think it's true and we need to step up and do more. But I don't know what that looks like quite yet. Okay, all right, we gotta check back with you. But again, is that this is not, this your view of this is not limited to state of Hawaii. This is a national view and the possibilities for you are national, am I right? Yes, absolutely. Thank you, Dorei. Thank you. Dorei to talk to you. Me too, Dorei. To do it again. Yes, absolutely. Aloha. Aloha.