 the morning I show that runs from 7 to 10 a.m. every day that's Monday all the way through Friday with different themes but I'll explain all of that later but now with me in studio I tried to give you a small snippets of of his accolades he's incredibly brilliant I'm a little bit starstruck but I will introduce him first of all with his accolades but just to name a few so he has over 24 25 years experience in media and at the broadcast sector in 2010 did you know he was awarded the moran of the order of the burning spear by the president for his outstanding contribution to the country now guys I don't know if you'd allow me to clap by myself you can join it allow me to clap for the one and only doctor executable to welcome to the show that thank you yes it is very good to meet you I've only just been seeing you good to see you on TV yes would you like to say hello to the viewers oh yes good morning US and welcome to the program thank you so very much now doctor we know you are the CEO of MCSK that is a music copyright yes but we don't this is a channel that based or we focus on the youth and the youth is that one person who's just come out of high school or is in high school and he feels or she feels that they have a talent that they want to explore maybe after they finish the certain level of education but they really don't know how to go about it and there's always either some kind of news around royalties I there's a big number out there 20 million so we're trying to figure out what is this 20 million how did it get to where it is right now how is it going to trickle down to the people but maybe let's start with what does MCSK do thank you very much first of all for inviting me it's an incredible program and I'm happy to be here and to know that this is this program focuses on the youth I think this is very good to ensure that we start conversations with the people matter because 75% of our population is below that five their youth and that's the greatest asset that we have as a country so we value the youth and when it comes to this area of talent really it is youth driven it's our youth so incredibly talented it's our youth who are very innovative and therefore the base really if we wanted to grow the economy we have to focus on them so I'm very happy to be here MCSK is a company limited by guarantee 40 years old it was founded in 1983 as a collective management organization CMO CMOs globally they are organizations that belong to artists it's like a charm for artists they come together pull together and use the leverage on the CMO to collect and distribute royalties on their behalf for the reason that an artist individually may not be able to go to every place where their music is used music is played in Matatus an artist may not go to every matter to and stop them and check whether they have a license for playing their music music is played in clubs in salons in restaurants in bars and so on an artist may not individually go to all those places and inspect whether they have a license broadcasting stations play music and and therefore artists rely on CMOs like Music Operate Society of Kenya to collect and distribute on their behalf but music business is an ecosystem it requires many players to work together one player cannot succeed alone the artist will not succeed if there is no conducive environment only legislative framework to protect their music protect the intellectual property and their copyright and also ensure that where there is infringement or unauthorized use of their music then there is a law that is applied and enforcement is done if the government does not provide that conducive environment to protect piracy then the government will have failed the artist even if they have good music the artist must also produce good music and market that music can be a good brand respectable brand not these the guys of Matusi and the crazy things like the ones I'm seeing from Kissy and other places no people should be respectable brands okay in other countries if you look at even some of the brands that have dominated the world Rihanna I think came into the limelight when she was very young and by the time she was in her 20s she was a billionaire all right because she branded herself well she understand the issues affecting our community and the American society and she's singing things that resonate with the youth resonate with the community Michael Jackson was also very young majority of the artists that have grown to become billionaires the jaysies of this world then beyond this of this world their people started young then they they branded themselves properly they they end there they used their talent but talent with knowledge because again you can be gifted in the business or in the in the you can be gifted as a musician but you're not gifted as a business person so you need also to have an ancient and a mentor and somebody to package you to know how to behave to know what kind of songs to produce songs that resonate with your culture with the values of your country and so on so that you become a respectable brand you can be invited to perform in corporate events you can be invited to perform in you know to do collabs with other other other brands and other organizations so the branding element is very critical and it also matters then there's the work of the CMO for example who must also be very active to collect and distribute your money they are the ones you have entrusted with the work of collecting and distributing the money on your behalf let me say royalty collection by CMOs is not the only source of income right now with digital media you can monetize your content on digital platforms on a spot-fly on goondaw on boom play you can sign with YouTube if you have a you grow your numbers and you're popular you're celebrated then your numbers grow and you're being paid by YouTube you're being paid by all those other digital platforms you can money you can be paid by schizatunes you know that's another revenue stream so there are so many other revenues and you must understand as a youth or as a talented person the laws governing that environment we must take business of music so seriously that we read more understand more because even the other professions lawyers engineers accountants when you're getting to that area you read the laws governing that area journalism you read the laws governing that area but in music we take it for granted somebody just has a mouth and some talent and you don't want to read the laws that govern that environment you don't want to have a mentor and agent that can guide you and you realize that by lacking men mentors or men do us as they call them in French you end up becoming irresponsible you end up getting into drugs a lot of people they do one song they become very famous they get into drugs they become ungovernable they become an advisable you cannot tell them anything it gets into their head and I think the important thing is to know that them to whom much is given much is expected so one needs to be humble you need to be a role model for society to for others so that you can utilize your brand and your talent to make money so it's an ecosystem like I said and the if you recognize that this is a talent like football this is talent like you know how do I put it like athletics there are rules that govern that area in football there are rules of the game how you play how you train you don't get into into drugs you don't insert insert your club you don't insert your referee you don't insert the federation they are they are rules of display and if you belong to Gormaya and you are not happy with Gormaya you can live and join FC lepards you you you market your brand and you sell your trade your your talent where it is appreciated in your pain so you are always looking for how can you make more money out of your talent while you are so I want I want artists or musicians to know that they are not different this is talent like football like athletics when you go to athletics everybody belongs to athletics Kenya and there are rules of the game you don't do doping you don't do this you cannot insult the federation or the the athletics federation of Kenya you got to play by the rules and have discipline and the people of a site you and who tell you what to do when to train you have your coach you have your people or oversight you and you humble yourself to be mended and to be grown so this is where the youth in music lose it go they go on their own it's one-man business and a lot of them do not make the money they should make because they lack mentorship that's where now this awareness comes in and I'm very happy that you invited me to your program to create this awareness it's very important all right so now because he I'm actually very surprised doctor you've named a couple of people I did not know you could name drop Brihanna jaysies of this world yes but just maybe to to also drop just want to mention the video it's okay it's okay and there's one name I'd like to drop just to ask you but just for the sake of curiosity let me call it that so apparently there was again maybe they say okay money in kyo chajami so you're basically translating what you see happening on the ground and nice so you people reconciled publicly so that's nothing no beef no it didn't your grunge with anyone the song has gave it by you know it a boy dates a girl they break up and the girl starts dating the father I think that's a conversation yeah that's a conduct of the song you may say it's a real story but I don't think I would envisage a situation where we are chiding the boy and telling him katsuki we buy now cook when unique on a person and your babako while these are things that happen in society they are evils they are ills of society vices that we should demonize not glorify but when you say katsuki we buy now go my my take and this is my own interpretation I mean that's why I went to school and that's why I'm an order to advice them is that it's wrong you can't glorify murder you can't glorify rape they are bad things they happen and we are aware but you don't glorify them or bring them in a context that looks like you're saying it's cool to do that because if you're saying you're gonna person any babako I think there's a context in which even some of the cases of suicide that we are seeing today and the genocide they are out of those kind of situation so it's not something to be happy about it's not something to gross about it's something that we should be ashamed of and demonize it and condemn it rather than appear to glorify it that the context of my whatever so there's no reconciliation or condemnation it's just a device sing songs that promote moral values produce content that promotes our culture do not glorify or normalize evil and the bad behavior yes it happens because when you talk to some of these people they tell you but it's the truth it happens so does murder robbery and all those other evils we don't sing to glorify them you don't you don't glorify rape you demonize it you call it out you condemn it and so I would expect more of condemnation not normalization not glorification of those kind of vices in society so it is I think misleading to say there was any reconciliation I stand to on device the youth everyone has a responsibility if you are not dot you are a parent to advise our youth to produce content that promotes our culture and our values otherwise we'll have no country if you are to promote those kind of things if that was your brother and they were being chided like that and being mocked and they commit suicide would you be happy because in a real situation if you someone took their their son's girlfriend and they were sleeping with them and giving the money and the girlfriend is touting the son you know or the former boyfriend I mean it it's evil it's wickedness and we are glorifying these things and we are now ending up in a society that has no moral values and if we destroy the morals of our nation we'll have no country nations rise or fall on the basis of their moral values and our our artists were talented they needed to know this talent is from God God gave you this talent you are influential because of your talent use it use it don't use it recklessly carelessly in a cavalier way use it to build society not to destroy it otherwise God will hold you accountable you have you have been given a talent by God that is denied to many and we'll all give an account of what we did that's why I don't share away from condemning such when I see it I'll tell them you are gifted yes but this is wrong because a person in a Babako is not something to be proud of so that's the context of the conversation okay thank you so very much for clearing that up now just one more question before we get to the crunching of the numbers and and talking about registration because it's important you just don't expect mcsk to have your money but you have not registered which I think absolutely should talk about in a bit but they had you said mentioned about Kisi and perhaps new you and a trend what goes well but I don't know if we can call him naive or if he did it on purpose but either way we know there's a catch of cloud chasing some of those things that you're saying it looks like the more wicked the more vulgar the more profane you are the more popular you become we are normalizing evil I told you Valeda we have normalizing evil and wickedness abnormal behavior and the moment we go that way we are going to destroy our country there are many societies countries that were great the Roman Empire the Ottoman Empire in Turkey there were many they including the French during the days of Napoleon Bonaparte that crumbled and collapsed because people did not pay attention to the foundation that builds the society a society is building morals a society is not just a congregation or people who live together no it is people living together with shared values and faith in Kenya we recognize family as the basic unit of society and in family we love each other we support each other we stand with each other we applaud each other we care for the angst we care for the people with the disability we are human we we exhibit love we celebrate each other when one is down we stand with them those are the values we should promote in our music the moment we start demonizing and normalizing insulting cursing vulgarity we are destroying that very fabric that makes us a community with shared values so what are our shared values as Kenyans yeah we need to go back to that and say we need to promote that in our schools in our churches in our communities someone who wants to stand out by doing crazy things they are cloud chasing and they're doing it so that they can get likes and views on social media but they're destroying themselves that kind of fame is not long lasting it's not sustainable yeah it is not sustainable and you may think yes we may talk about you and mention your name but I will not buy that song music and the content that sells is content that is acceptable by the family that can be consumed in family I can listen to it with my children I can listen to it with my parents I can watch it with in a mixed company and we are not ashamed I can play it in my car can play it in charge in a corporate event that's how now you expand your market base for your product because music is a product so that it becomes marketable and if you look at it globally products that sell their products that are consumed by family you got to think about your target your market target market and do music that will entail yourself to that market now if you sing a song that is very popular and it's all over social media on tiktok and YouTube and everywhere the question you should ask yourself is does it translate to money are the people listening is it the market category with money because if I must see you I will not play kaskia vibhaya in my family I will not play it in my car so good song you may say but the people with the money are not in are not buying it we know about it but I will never buy it okay Saru is my friend but I'll never buy that song I must see you how many could be in my category the guys with money who could be going to an event and say let me give you an example of by the Zabron singers or Israel Bonnie is around this they are songs that will go to an event and even you say you have a corporate event we are celebrating here we will say cheers are you and we are dancing I will not ask for that song so that I'm helping actually my sister to know that the people with money know about the song but they will not buy it so what is the point of producing that music this is your prime time you are now at your best and instead of producing music that will outlive your lifetime will be played because corporate exists during your lifetime and 50 years after that you should produce music that will sell you music that will outlive even you music that will be sung even produced in other languages because it's good music it has no vulgarity it has no obscenity it has no profanity if you look at songs like Jerusalem or even the recent Musabibo you know a song that is good could come from nowhere somebody just threw that song it was just leaping lines somewhere I don't through it on tiktok and now kill them to and I'm buying it will sell God has his own ways do not go for the cloud chasing because yes it could be everywhere but it may not give you money unfortunately in Kenya some of those songs play and when for example Kaskier Vibhaya started many people didn't know the meaning even me I didn't know I used to harm it and I even used to use the phrase Kaskier Vibhaya okay but when you get to know about it you you realize there's an issue you're not comfortable if you are responsible person you're not comfortable with their kind of talk in other words sing for the market produce to make money don't sing for the cloud don't sing for a name a lot of those guys from Casey London because they are now two crazy ones Yeah, they are just abnormal and I'm like I've been wondering don't they come from families validate would you want your father would you let your father wear a person and the code and you're cheering them I think we are crazy society don't they have families because I would tell him dad hey you you know don't they have a church one of them says he's a pastor are there no people can talk to them because if we unless somebody is from the bush maybe they live in the forest but if you live with people they should be ashamed of you I cannot imagine doing that crazy thing and and I have a family I would have nowhere to go so I don't know maybe they live in the bush we are degenerating into the head it's on the edge because how do I go home after doing that kind of thing so I think we are sick society and we need to start addressing that issue from the community we have left everybody to themselves that's how even our children are getting into bizarre stuff and being recruited into some of them into terror groups because we don't seem to care about each other in a society that cares you cannot stand here and record a song like that madness pure madness and we are allowing it as normal it's not normal we are normalizing madness we are normalizing obscenity and vulgarity and with it not within no time our children are going to copy that as a way of life that if you want to tread that's where we are getting so you want the way the police we are the chiefs we are the community why we are allowing this so I think we have failed as a society we are all sick and we need to have a conversation yeah okay I was told a while back I'm a millennial I'm not a gen Z but just before my generation you make a mistake don't even reach home first everyone beats you on the way the person who saw you on your way to escape you know I want to pick water and so by the time you're being beaten by your parent or your guardian you have learned lesson what did you say your full names are valentine one boy valentine one boy you're amazing you are exceptional who are your parents thank you we need people like you we should clap for this one amazing because a lot of young people think you and I was in the omensia I love I love that way of life because that's the way to get to grow I must see you because I was brought up like you wow yes wow I would be riding a bike and when I see a parent not my parent and I'm not lest anything happened yeah so you know and then so why are we doing it why are we allowing it you know those people should be arrested really for for going against societal norms because they I think they're stretching the bounds of morality and decency and we need to say no in other communities okay all right now aside from that before we run out of time let's talk about registering for now what we believe is due to us as artists and by artists as in us what's you and take it seriously update your records check be checking So it's not just enough to register. I'm a first-law, I'm an artist. I have to also register what I'm producing. Exactly. This is your work. This is your trade. This is your stock in trade. It's not just about the money, it's conversations like this. We normally have even EDGNs, we normally have meetings. You can use it as a safari pact to find a distribution, but later on you can use it to promote co-lambos and other things. You know, your music could be being played in Jamaica, in the U.S., in the U.K. You cannot go to all those countries to connect for yourself. It's not just about the agreement. You can also use it to promote co-lambos and other things. You know, the publisher of the music is Anadnesia, it's a label called Rema Lugose, it represents Diamond Platinum. It's a label that represents Diamond Platinum. It's a label that represents Diamond Platinum. I'm a broadcaster in Kenya. I'm a broadcaster in Kenya who has a lot of neighbors. When I'm talking to my neighbors, I say, I'm a broadcaster in Kenya. That's because I'm a broadcaster in Kenya who has catalogues and I'm a log sheet. It is you who supply and show which songs you played in your station and they belong to who. And then we pay them. So if you play more of Diamond Platinum against the local Condend Quota, that's when you promote what comes from Diamond and other things. In Kenya, there's a lot of Tanzanian neighbors, such as Sanna, Nigeria, South Africa and Kedalika. There's a lot of people living in there. But there's a lot of people living in there. There's a lot of people living in Tanzania, like Uganda, South Africa and Kedalika. There's a lot of people living in there. Now, we're in a digital environment. Some of the neighbors are in Kila Mali and there's a lot of people in Spotify, Mugdundo, Boom Play, YouTube. Some of the neighbors are on digital platforms like Sanna. We're trying everything possible to ensure that we strengthen our bilaterals with our countries because our music is going global and our youths are very talented and they are tech-savvy. They're able to use technology to promote their content and we're going to encourage more of that so that we can, instead of selling your music to the 53 or 55 million Kenyans, you have the globe as your market through digital platforms. Okay. This digital economy has done a lot. I'm telling you, it's the future. Okay. So what I'm hearing from you is, first of all, you're not responsible for their individual marketing. What you can do is reap the benefits of them being known and them being played. Yes. But also, there was a time when DJs were under attack or under siege. Let me call it like that. Because now, apparently, they are only playing a certain genre of music and the people outside. But it's the consumers who ask for it. Yes, yes. Consumer is king. Yes, and you are the consumer, yes. It's what the consumer wants. Even now, the way people are making noise about us, paying Rehema, who is a publisher representing foreign musicians, is the consumer who is asking for that conduct. Yes. So really, even when you go to church, we sing a mella, we sing foreign music in the church. Diara. Okay? Diara. You may not even understand what it means. It's a Nigerian song, but it's here and playing everywhere. I think, ultimately, if you produce good content, let the market determine. Let the market decide. The forces of demand and supply is what we apply. And if we play more music, if Kenyans want more foreign music, so be it. But there must be a law. And there must be an intentional, deliberate push to play more local content if we really want to build our country and build our artists. Unless that country has a respect for agreement. So this is what we should do. If we find Tanzania is playing, we are playing more of Tanzanian music. We should demand that our music is also played there. Or by law, say you cannot play more than this percentage. Unless we are that intentional, then as a government we are going to be responsible and we are going to be leading our musicians to be exploited while we are using our market, our technology, our frequencies and our national resources to build musicians of other countries. Yes, I agree. You can't determine from me what food I will eat. If I go to a hotel and I want Italian, I will eat Italian. I want Chinese, I will eat Chinese. Japanese and so on. But there must be an intentional push for us to consume our products. And if we are doing it in other sectors, we need to do the same in music. All right. Just so you know guys, White Fair Four as a channel, we have actually a show that only plays Kenyan music. It's called the E-Circuit. Yes, it plays on Saturdays from around 9 a.m. Yes, yes, yes. So White Fair Four is the place to be. We really are. 100% local. 100%. I should be here. Why don't you make me part of your channel? You say, you say. Can I be just coming for free? After this? 100% yes. Yes, on Saturday mornings until around 12. 100% Kenyan. Yes, yes. We have another one that has East African only but that also includes Kenya. 100% Kenyan Saturday morning. Wow. Yes. So I imagine the DJ has to be very creative to only play Kenyan music for four hours. So it's possible. And you enjoy. It seems like he likes it. Yes, he likes it. All right. So this is not in your docket but this is something that I'd really like to pick your brain on. So we have the Youth Affairs, Creative Economy and Sports Cabinet Secretary Ebabuna Mamba. Yes, a couple of days ago was at the 26th annual thingy for Grammys and it's something that he wants to kind of merge the creative industry like he wants. It's via talent at Hilda but it's also affecting, you know, the creative economy and all that. So do you think this is good news for us as creatives in the long run? Absolutely. I think if there's a community sector in this country or in this government who knows these jobs, see as a Bambuna Mamba, there will be less clueless or less complicated. Because it's a youth oriented area. I'm a journalist myself and I have studied media studies up to PhD level and I still find it difficult to understand. I cannot imagine someone who has no clue, who is not a musician and they have not studied this area, how difficult it would be for them to comprehend issues of intellectual property and copyright and resonate with the situation. Ababu Das is youthful in nature and by his education and exposure he quite comprehends and commands this docket very well and I think in many ways he has opened up new opportunities and brought new visitors into the ecosystem of the creative economy and I think what he has done is to broaden the sphere of influence and market for the Kenyan musician and artists through the MS and collaborations that he is doing and opening the markets and the collaboration between Kenyan artists and other artists from abroad particularly using the digital environment and I think to that extent we really applaud him for what he has done. I think it's a good way. It's a great thing for Kenya and I think as an artist artists should be very happy to see Ababu Das in charge of the creative economy and youth affairs and he understands the docket. Right. Thank you so very much. Would you happen to have any parting words? Would you like to tell the youth something? But we've already decided you're going to be coming Yes, yes. on a regular basis. Also for to comment KBC and why 254 Station? Thank you so much. You said on Saturdays you have a channel that plays 100% local content. Yes. I think we need to applaud you and give you a letter SMCSK for promoting local content. I think there should be a certificate that recognizes that. We need to be applauded for doing that. We want more channels and more media houses to play local content. There is no other way. It is in the law. It's in the regulations by communications authority of Kenya but many media houses do not comply with the 75%. Right now she's going to eat even more local content and a lot of our music is not marketed. If you realize the music you just need to give that artist a chance. Just need to play their music. Just need to open that chance and they know if you bring your music we'll play it and then we'll let the market know there's a song. A lot of artists were built through this station and through this organization from the voice of Kenya days to when it became KBC a national broadcaster a lot of people through singing and sharing the joy bringers that were started here are emerged from those platforms and I'm very happy to see that you know in this century you are still finding relevance and channels that resonate with building, budding artists and upcoming artists. We need to focus more on the upcoming artists and we need to bring discipline and pride to our own culture through channels like this that give more preference to local content. So I'm very grateful that you're doing it. I commend you. I look forward to working with you to ensure that we promote our artists and give them a platform to showcase their talent. Yes, please. All right. I feel so pumped. Like this day has played out so well. Thank you for coming, Dr. Ari. You're most welcome. All right. I must put this to a close. Thank you one more time. Congratulations E-Circuits as a unit but also Y-254 channel as a whole and of course other people that make it happen. Now please do not go where the show is not over yet. Remember please interact with us at Y-54 on Facebook, Y-54 underscore channel on X and them. And please if you take nothing away from this please remember to register as an MCSK member and please keep updating all your product that is KAMOKONANI NIMBO 15 all of them 15 and then please do your due diligence don't expect a Dr. Ari to be paying you just for that. There are other streams the other avenue streams that you should be looking into tap into the digital environment right now, right? Hashtag is when the money will be right back.