 Hello, my name is Rosa Maria Costi-Cisneros and I am collaborating with the Independent Theatre Hungary. I am here sitting down with Michaela Dragan, who will be talking about Romassine, the age of the witch, which is the work that she was involved in, and we will learn a little bit more about the production and the work from your perspective, but before that I'd like to know a little bit about you as an artist and some of the work you do in your practice. Can you share some of your work? Sure, hello. I am Michaela Dragan, as Rosa said. I am an artist from Romania, based on Bucharest, but I also work in Berlin and different other places. I define myself as a multidisciplinary artist and I am one of the actresses from Romassine, the age of the witch, and I am also the author of the play. I wrote this theatre play during my residency at Royal Court in London, and it says a lot about the politics of Brexit, and also about the new age of the right wing in Europe, and it talks a lot about immigrants, it talks a lot about witches, techno witches, and the future, and it talks a lot about my art practice on Roma futurism, and concept and art, concept and aesthetic that I tried to develop in 2018, when as a Roma artist I felt this pressure of always talking about our oppressive history as Roma people or about the discriminatory present, and I just figured out that there is no mental space and no projection regarding our future as Roma people. We don't project ourselves in the future because we wear this transgenerational trauma of the slavery of the Holocaust, we have no moments where we can think about as in the future or as scientists or Roma people as inventors. So basically, Roma in the age of the witch is just to go further with these principles of Roma futurism, where the Roma culture and history intersects with technology and witchcraft, and why witchcraft? Because I think it's a feminist political act to define as a witch, knowing the history of the witches in Europe, and I think under this umbrella of the witch, many feminist energy people can be included because they are seen as outsiders. And so you were an actress within the work, but also one of the authors? The one author regarding this theater play. You're the only author? Yes. Okay. And so can you talk about that process when why you wanted to perform the work and not necessarily see someone else perform the work? Yes, this is a very good question. This is a very good question because I promise to myself, you know, working afterwards in the actor's crew that I will never do this again. Like I just, I just want to be outside, you know, to see my writing, my theater play, how it's built. I don't want to be in interior because I don't have the exterior outside experience that I founded that more exciting. And so that kind of internal, external lens or perspective. How did you get some perspective on the work? Did you have colleagues from the from the theater company support you friends and family? How did you navigate that? Because I think this is true for many people that are actors and writers that are somehow very close to the work. So how do they step back? How was that for you? So first of all, it was like a very concrete issue that we couldn't find another Romani actress to perform in the theater play because this specifically this theater show, we realize it in another city of Bucharest and most of the actors of Roma actors, they are based in Bucharest and many of them, they have engagements here in Bucharest so they can't go for a long period of rehearsals in another city. So this was one of the problem. And the other thing it was like I wrote the Kali character. It's so much me. And I was so self-cynical building this character that it was funny for me to perform it. But at the same time, I really regretted that I wasn't outside and I can't see the show because the show is so beautiful. It's the scenography, the stage design is virtual and there are there are different 3D projections. It's really the stage design is a whole show by itself. So and also like being an interior like sometimes is you are subjective because you write the play and sometimes you know the actors or the director they get different impression and you have to negotiate some things. But it was a really collaborative thing what came out as a show and I was very happy to work with Tina Turnheim from Berlin. We invited her in Romania to direct the theater show. She also works on futurism a lot as an art practice. So I communicated with her so incredibly. So she supported me a lot. Also my colleagues from the from Juvenile Pen and also the people from the State Theater in Sfantu Giorgia another city here where we staged the the play. So yeah there was a lot of people supporting me and I'm so grateful and I really want to say that even if I wrote the play like I got so much influence from Afrofuturism first of all creating creating Roma futurism and I I read so many stuff that other people suggested and recommended me and also the people from the residency from the railcourts from London they advise me a lot in the process of writing the play and I want to say this because I'm always pro-collective and I think that you know I'm really against this idea of promoting only one individual because I think the credit has to go to all the people who are involved in a theater show and from my experience from my collective we get inspiration a lot from each other and we have so many discussions and we write collectively and we come up with that sometimes the roles are flexible you know the also like the director the theater director you know sometimes gets you know a lot of ideas from us from the actors and I think this is this is how the theater should look like you know there should not be power relationship between actors and the director sure sure and it's I also wonder you know if that's a reflection of you know some Roma families because I know that that's you know this kind of working together and that everyone has a strength and we can kind of put that together and and that we're stronger together exactly and and it's also not to be afraid of the differences that we have but rather that's kind of like our superpower so no I completely agree and I love this idea of thinking about the future because as you said earlier oftentimes that there's a lot of kind of looking back at the historical kind of context or maybe making a claim and saying like we're not this and there's so much more to us so this is really lovely to think about this kind of futurism and and technology and if we've learned anything in the last year is that technology is a big part of so many of our working lives but also our creative practices so if you could maybe talk a little bit about something that stands out for you of that process of working with technology and the script you kind of talked a little bit about the sonography of the work but can you is there something that stands out that you'd like to share with us so yes I have to say that in the last years my art practice was focused on developing this concept of Roma futurism and I really hope that this can become a movement and other Roma artists can they can take further you know the ideas and create their own perspective on the Roma futurism so for me it's very important to create arts that is focused on the future I think is a very radical idea you know to to say and to share this idea that Roma people prevail in the future you know despite all the racism that we confront despite the deportations despite the crimes because very recently we heard about the the killing of a Roma man Stanislav Thomas from Czech Republic in the same way as the police killed George Floyd in U.S. in the same way they police killed them in Czech Republic so these things are happening you know so I think like saying like we will prevail in the future we will exist in the future you know can be a very subversive and radical idea yes we were talking about Roma futurism and that's a radical idea of you know staking a claim in that Roma will prevail and you also mentioned the the police brutality and the killing of Thomas so it feels quite important at a time when there is a lot happening that is true for many communities I love this this kind of conviction that you have with that you know the Roma community has a lot to offer and will also kind of pave its own direction is that true in the work do you does the work kind of reflect this this point yes totally like Roma futurism reflects on our past reflects on our history reflects on the racism that we confront and comes with alternatives so many times in Roma futurism I use fantasy or or this character the cyber witches the techno witches who wants to change the oppressive history of Roma people because we have to ask ourselves we know without racism without oppression where the Roma communities will have been now you know how how the things will have been working for us you know having the same privileges as white people as Roma people and uh this is this is why I like so much working on futurism because it's an escape you know and let us to to imagine a thing to work on fantasy to work on fictional things to to promote the Roma subjectivity the way in which we want to write or rewrite our history to say our history from our perspective um taking into consideration that our history was brought you know by known Roma people so and also I think Roma futurism gives a lot of hopes you know of it's is this hope that in the future we can get rid of all this oppression and how the world will look like when we have the power to you know to to have movement to have global movements to to to have people that represent us to control to control technology and uh the story the story of Roma scene actually announces the era Roma scene actually comes from Anthropocene and announces a new era where the Roma techno witches have the power to control the politics of Europe and it talks it talks about a lot about the who has the power in this world who has the power to to live legacy and history in this world and how will be like when the immigrants the vulnerable person they their dreams can become reality how the world will look like will be also world will be also a place that is threatened by the climate crisis by the racism also on or will be you know the world that we all dream about it and I talk specifically about the climate crisis because this is also one of the topics of the play like the techno witches they uh in the show they put this this problem on the on the table you know is we live now in the era of the climate crisis and our world will look so different in 20 years so we also took this responsibility to to imagine feasible politics against the climate change um I don't know I it's it's a it's a very complex theater play is is my latest theater play I was so privileged that I had advisors working it was the first time and I had advisors working on this theater play so I'm I really I really hope that people will get a lot of messages from it that's lovely that's lovely and um thank you so much for for also being quite bold and brave and thinking about um you know the the current topics but also the future um because it's very I think quite challenging sometimes to to be one of the first and to be visionary and to discuss some of these these bigger topics that affect us all and you know again aren't easy to to navigate and you're doing that through work through technology through the theater um and it sounds like also that you're reflecting on that um and your voice in place within this larger broader narrative um yes I'm I I haven't seen the show live but I would love to see this this piece of work particularly because you know um there's there's something with technology that you know it changes the relationship of of the body to body and so I'm quite curious what that might look like live um so thank you so much thank you Mihaila to you to all the advisors to everyone involved in creating the work um and yes thank you thank you too and please share share with me your thoughts after you watch the play yes yes and your criticism too because I'm very open to criticism yes well you know I see criticism is actually a way to grow um and it's however how it must be you know depending on how it's delivered but I do see it as as a way to grow and and welcome it so yes no problem thank you bye bye bye thank you