 Thank you again for keeping us company. This is why in the morning I trust you well. We're moving straight to our discussion this morning. We're talking about politics and I want to begin with a question to my guest right here. What do you make of a government led by Rila? Good morning, Hilary. I think we should move away from recycling of leaders. I think Rila has played his role in the politics of this country. But I don't think he will be the best suited in the next dispensation come 2022 because of how world politics are going and how things are changing in this new era. So I think we need more of a vibrant president come 2022 for us to go to the next level because if we bring in a leader who is not as vibrant who is not as up to date with the changes in the world global politics. I'm not saying that Rila does not understand global politics. That's not my portraying. But what I'm saying is that we need more of a vibrant kind of a younger leader to lead Kenya into the next dispensation. Right now we need to respect our older leaders. We are grateful for where they have brought us. They would have done better. But we are grateful for the fact that they have brought us. But I think their time is up. I think that their time is up. There is no room for them come 2022. I'm not saying that we're going to have a 24-year-old leading us come 2022 but we need a more vibrant, a more well-integrated person with the global politics the way they are heading towards. Because when you look all over the world, I know someone will say Donald Trump is now going to 74 years. That is campaigning in the 2020 politics in the US. But you see America has gone through a lot of political changes over a longer period of time. They have been independent for a longer period of time. But if you look at them, they also had very young, vibrant political leaders in their formation stages. So Kenya being only 50 plus post-independence. Then where we are, we need a little bit of a more vibrant person so that we can jump start our economy, development and also having our global space somewhere in the global part of the politics. So for me, I would urge Kenyans come 2022. I think let's get a little bit of a younger person. Maybe I would prefer my preference would be someone between the age of 45 years to around 55 years. Maximum 60 years. We need such a kind of a bit experienced person but also a little bit younger. Then at least they are up to date with the current trends that are going on globally in terms of digitalizations, social media interactions with the population. Then remember that 70% of the current population are young people. So we need someone who is a bit close to the population that is being led. You see, when we have an old kind of a person the age, although someone would say Kibaki came in when he was around, was it 70 or 60 something? He was around 76 years. By the time he was living was around 76 years or 70 something. And someone would say he is still led. But you see it had its own challenges because he came in later as an old person. It had its own challenges. I wish we had Kibaki while he was maybe in his 45 years of age or 55 years of age would have done a little bit more. Then someone would say we had Guru who came in I think it was around 50 something being the president. But the challenge was you see when they came in with someone like William Samoei Ruto there was that spring of hope and spring of vibrancy within the country. The only challenge that was there is that we wish we had such a vibrant kind of individual with the intellect of Muay Kibaki you know the social presence of Uhuru and William Ruto and then I wish they had the intellect of Muay Kibaki maybe it would even be 10 times ahead. Would you believe with the older days where we say age comes with wisdom or wisdom comes with age? Yeah age comes with wisdom because of exposure one and experience. I'm not refuting the role of mature population in the country all the older population they still have a major major role because even in our own African setting there was a role of the elders but be as it may that there is the role of the elders in wisdom but they can serve as advisors you see they can serve as advisors not to tamper because sometimes when you have young people leading they may take us to a downhill so we still need the elders in the society so that they can share wisdom advice but we need someone who is a bit energetic because right now with Baba going overseas for treatment you see those are some of the issues that make you a little bit afraid here and there and even when you look at medieval times the younger the king the better but the younger is not like those 10 years old or 14 years old because it was the danger of it but is that nice beautiful age that someone is in that's why I'm giving that range of 45 someone who can go to war someone can go to war they are still vibrant their health is intact they have what is it vitality in them and they are also able to relate with the younger population and at the same time they are able to relate with the older population you see that's a very good mix of an age otherwise if you have a two old person they may be agap when it comes to youth representation youth interaction with this kind of an individual and then if they are too young there may be no interaction with the older population and the mature population so we need someone who is a blend a mix you see that's why you look like somebody like Obama you see his age he was in that mix he was around I think 44 years of age but at the time he was becoming the president of the united state so you see he was in between he could relate with the younger population they could say yes we can and still could relate with the mature population because he's at like a mid in between so it's a very good way of blending both sides of the spectrum and you're able to what is it as a leader you're able to to understand or to be part and parcel of both extreme cases but when you have one extreme on both ends there will be a tendency of one group being ignored as much as people may say that they will bring in advisors to advise you if like the someone can say now Raila is going to bring a young person to be advising them but you see there is that aspect of a leader when you have the experience you've experienced it yourself or you can fit into the shoes of your of your populars it helps you become a better leader because you're able to understand their situations because right now most of the challenges that you're experiencing in our leadership right now is they feel someone like who was born in state house he's never experienced any hardships like a normal Kenyan and so they feel he's like aloof with the problems that are affecting a normal Kenyan and so him he has to depend on the advice of other people to try and explain to him the experience of Kenyans but someone like Moaikibaki who was the son of a nobody he went through the same systems we went through his dad was very poor he went through the system just like a normal Kenyan when he got into leadership maybe because of the hardship he went through trying to acquire education so his number one aspect was to ensure there is free primary education so that everybody can get education maybe where he came from maybe his brothers and sisters had challenges of accessing education so when he got into power because it's something he can relate to he was able to execute us because our leaders come from our very own population and our very own society and if they come from our own society it's those experiences that they have grown with they're able to interact with us because that's what has built him so when you look at someone like William Samuea Ruto he's a son of a nobody he comes from a nobody as in he starts life like everybody else and has climbed up the social ladder so when you tell William Ruto there are people working bare foot he can understand but there are people you go tell them there are people working bare foot they are wondering how are people working bare foot or you go tell people that they are eating breakfast of 200 shillings they are wondering when all their life they have been eating a breakfast of 10,000 shillings so we need I would feel in the next 2022 elections is let's choose a vibrant kind of an individual who is not too old neither not too young but within the mid range because and someone who has grown within the society and has experienced and has been exposed to the challenges and the issues that have affected it and every common more 90 that's the kind of individual I would tell Kenyans whether it's the presidency whether it's your MP whether it's your what is it called whether it's your youth leader you aim to see a choose somebody who is mature enough to handle the crisis and the challenges that comes within we don't want issues like the way we have the MP of Mbakasi you see it's easy to he is young but whatever he is doing it's not what you'd expect from a leader it's easy to at least power easily become to have what you call impunity of the highest caliber I want us to quote Morade and whether they see when Morade is speaking it is the president speaking I don't know why is it as the people of the media who has brought this picture or this image to the public that when Morade speaks he speaks is the mouthpiece of president and when Murcomen speaks he speaks on behalf of the deputy president now he said yesterday that we think it's time Kenyans rewarded the years of struggle for Rilo Molodinga they owe it to him it's like Mandela and 2022 will be a Mandela moment would also like to tell him that is Rilo to be a transitional president who will then nurture the young generation to take over in 2027 now I'm seeing the aspect Rilo to be at the transitional president we'll be moving from Mayuz to an elderly person who will now again bring another youth he has been in the leadership do you think he has mentored people and now saying that we will be rewarding him what you take why should we reward people because because maybe they fought for something maybe their purpose in life was to fight but not to lead you know some people we have to understand the purpose of each individual and is it only Rilo Molodinga who has fought for the democracy of this country I don't think so I think the other leaders who have also fought for democracy why don't we put mother Karua then if it's the transitional we are trying to look for she has also fought for democracy right all there from 1992 all the way so we should not reward a leader because it's like we are pitting you see the way Murata is stating is like we are pitting the struggles and the fight that he has fought so at least to console his soul but at the expense of 47 million Kenyans no I feel his time is up he did his role we are grateful for the role he played and that's it I think he should just accept that he will go down history books that he was part of the struggle but now having to reward somebody because of them having fought for democracy and we are in a new type of dispensation come 2022 why should we go backwards and we are trying to be progressive I think voting for Rayla or Molo the guy is not progressive politics I think it's a retrogressive kind of politics because there's nothing new he's going to bring on the plate there's nothing new actually he's going to bring on the plate we know for a very long time Rayla is not a mentor because he was a guy who wants to be the this showstopper you know in terms of when it comes to only recently around maybe 2017 that you say I seen people like Sifuna coming on board you know yeah somehow some few young leaders in the body yeah but when you compare it with how Jubilee was Jubilee was a bit vibrant because you could see someone like Sakaja being part of the party leadership bringing in very energetic youth leaders into their campaigns you could see it was a bit vibrant and holicy but when you look at the Nasa on the other end it had a lot of old people if you are Kayam person chances of you being stifled was easy so I think I don't think Rayla now at 22 he'll change his character and then now actually now starts going to Vijana because we saw Kibaki in the year 2007 even 2002 Kibaki was surrounded by who? those young people it was the old mafia that was surrounding Kibaki because that is what he has grown knowing then maybe people like Uhuru and William Ruto they don't know why they brought in young vibrant individuals because maybe even then their circles of interaction were a bit younger popular so I don't think Rayla now come 2022 he will now have be surrounded by at young people most likely he'll still be surrounded by the old mafia the old way of doing things and I feel where Kenyans we are right now we don't need we are grateful for what they have done but I think we need to move to to another new transition because the world is going even you look at the leaders it's more younger leaders more vibrant leaders and I believe even after Donald Trump finishes is 4-year term between 2022 and 2024 maybe the next dispensation will have more youthful and young leaders yeah but we should stop rewarding people based at yeah if I need to say yeah it's like it's like a young woman feeling pity for a young man because he has really struggled to maybe help her take her out then you feel pity for the young man because he has really suffered but he may not be the right suitable mate for you you see so the same thing with our Kenyan politics we should not feel woeshe for somebody because of the struggles that they have gone through but we should reflect did we feel woeshe for Mwai Kibaki because of the struggles he had done I don't think so I think we chose Mwai Kibaki in the year 2002 and 2002 and please somebody should not come and tell me at Riala said Kibaki Tosha no people had analyzed and seen what Kibaki can do in the various departments so what has Riala you know I usually ask people apart from fighting for democracy okay and shouting and saying oh nini nini you know making our political scene very fiery what impact what other impact has he done for me I feel he has stifled a lot of development we would have been very far in between the year 2002 and 2002 we would have gone double what we have experienced between 2002 and 2007 he stifled a lot of development and people have to see that they have to think critically and analyze his legacy because apart from shouting for freedom nini nini beyond that based on his own experience being an MP in Bondo being an MP in Kibera people experience developing Kibera when or cause became the MP so that clearly tells you would you want to place a whole entire country when every other part of the world is moving fast when it comes to 2022 do you want to do that I think we need to shift from rewarding people for for their struggles because you look at even Americans do they do you think they reward people based on their struggles for freedom otherwise those activists and those people who fight for rights they would be the ones leading in those elections being leaders in the United States but people sit down and say no no no no let's think critically can we work with this person for all that time what have they done for the people I want us to look to another comment and this is by Senator Orango he said being led by President Uhuru Andrell Odinga I know Kenya will be where we want want it to be and we have only two years to implement the BBI so actually from what he has said we have two years to implement the BBI there has been a a hint that it could be this year now corona happened they just stopped maybe it could be next year maybe through the parliament but now him saying they have only two years and Uhuru and Raila working together do you think there's a way Uhuru now could like what do you call it say Raila Tosha there could be a possibility but as much as they are planning you know based on their mindsets they think this is the way the country should go and the only way the country should go is finally Raila became the president of this country now they failed to understand that this country does not belong to them so they can arrange arrange arrange but there is a one who owns this country and he who owns this country is the one who knows and that's why Uhuru reached to a point and say only God knows who is going to be president come 2022 now where would we want to change the constitution based on individuals you see that is very very retrogressive we should amend the constitution or change the constitution based on what the 47 millions of Kenyans need but we can't be changing the constitution every 10 years because when you look at the the trend it's like every every five years towards a towards a major election we want to change the constitution to tailor make it to suit specific individuals that's the problem I have with the BBI that's my major problem with the BBI because we are tailor making it to suit specific individuals when they have realized the way the constitution is currently is not favoring them you get and you see the the the people of Kenya are superior we we we say the the the people are the one who are supreme but now we are living in a country whereby specific people are the ones who are supreme the people of Kenya are number two which is very wrong because it tells you what happens is if now let's say we get a very ruthless reader come 2022 so does that mean when it's near election they will also campaign again we need to change the constitution to suit and the IBC and the IBC so I think Kenyans need to refuse and say we will only amend the constitution we'll only amend amend the constitution or change the constitution because we as the people we feel one two three four five and if you look even at the American constitution they have only they've been in existence for over 200 years but they have only done their amendments only at least 27 times 33 times have attempt but 27 amendments have gone through out of the 33 in a span of 200 years now Kenya we want to start a trend every five years we are amending something we are changing the constitution so when shall we stabilize as a country are you get and then on what basis are we changing this constitution is it based on a policy on a policy research that we have done is it based on a finding that we have done or are we just changing because we feel it's not favoring us how we were expecting it to work it's no longer working for us you understand so I think it's Mali's I think it's manipulation if your time is up it's your time is up if your if your papa's is done it's done don't come to force yourself to the people of this nation and it's and I'm sorry to say it's going to cost many leaders okay it's going to cost many leaders come come 2022 because of this whole trying to manipulate the Kenyans into into this whole BBI fiasco I want us to go back to Morales comment he went on to say this was on Facebook page that the Mount Kenya region will be voting for Raila not to punish Ruto but to reward him now let's talk about the man Ruto if the politics we seeing around right now it will be Raila versus Ruto imagine the risk Ruto will win why would he win and yet Raila maybe we will have the system and he is the people's who is the system Raila had the system in 2013 it didn't work for him right two young vibrants leaders cropped up with ICC hanging on their neck right yet Raila was part of the government part of the system it was so easy for him to have won in 2013 why didn't he win in 2013 so you being quote and quote part of the system and you look like you're favored by the system does not guarantee you that you will easily sail through somebody may argue like 2007 Kibaki because you see it worked for him because he was within the system right right now with the handshake is part of the system but someone like William Samuel Ruto is being pushed out of the system which may work for his favor anyway that's why I was even telling them they should even actually impede him let him go uko machinani he starts again it will actually even actually really favor him but now you see it has toned down over the time they have realized if we a victim it might actually work in their own this favor so where Kenyans are right now I don't think as much as Murade is just I think he's just talking rubbish shouting shouting shouting but I tell you come 2022 actually brings me to the concern that I have had for a period of time this is not the first time he's commenting such statements there's a time we even said as you can see Ruto is not a man to wish away yes and now he has begun again there's also a time he said he will support him then he changed now he's saying Reila do you think he has been put there to confuse the political space and bringing an agenda that will make us focus on different things whereas in the back does something is going on yeah you know when it comes to politics words have an impact because like you're planting a seed in people's mind so when they realized William Ruto was getting like Mount Kenya support although some people think that Mount Kenyan are lying to Ruto but you see when you plant a seed it grows over time so Murade what he's trying to do is just trying to plant a seed a thought process into the minds of the Mount Kenya population is just trying to plant a seed hopefully he is hoping that it's going to grow to grow over time but one thing he has to understand is that I do not see I do not foresee in the coming future he will plant plant plant plant but you see the beauty of the kikuyu population is that they can be very decisive at the end of the day they can clap for you clap clap but when they go to the about things change at the ballot paper and like other communities you know from the word go if they have said it they'll go with you all the way to the end but having had Raila like quote and quote an enemy of the Mount Kenyan region do you think an overnight change of behavior will happen just because or the handshake yeah or just because if Nusumkata didn't change the perception Nusumkata did not change the perception right because come 2013 they were like no we are not voting for this one they really de-campaign and come to 2017 there was no they are going to vote for this person so for me I feel I'm not saying we'll never have a low leader in this nation we will have a low leader but it won't be Raila Molo Odinga we'll have another low leader we'll have another tribe ruling this country I believe beyond the Kalingin and Kikuyu because that's the way the country is going to progress but it will not be Raila Molo Odinga sorry to say he will not be the first low president to hold that it will be another person but not Raila Molo Odinga maybe his children or somebody but there will be another person but not him specifically because it's very difficult to change the perception of individuals very difficult it's very difficult because remember there is still the old population that has been there since 1984 they are still there in the exam because maybe they are in their 55, in their 60s they are both which is quite a number right then there is this in between population that is between the age of 40 to around 55 right and then there is the largest chunk that is 18 years old up to 35 years who don't even feel this vibe of Raila Molo they don't even because in 2002 maybe they were still in class 1 or class 2 you know so they don't know this the impact and the vibrancy of Raila then they are talking a little bit of a different thing so if you ask maybe my sister who is at 13 years old right now what is her perception she may not even have a clue who is Raila Molo or Dinga she may know he is usually mentioned on tv but she does not have the aspect or the impact relationally when it comes to Raila Molo so for me I feel Raila should retire peacefully he be grateful he had an opportunity to serve this nation and to fight for democratic rights where they were really fought for but and then he just sits down and says he has done his role he will be remembered just like they will remember Tom Boyer he will be remembered just as we remember other veterans that he really helped this country but he should if he loves this country if Raila Molo or Dinga loves this country then he should around 2022 don't introduce BBI staff don't manipulate the constitution unless changing the to benefit wajiko but when you read that BBI it's not benefiting wajiko it's not amen they're not even lifting up the burdens of the huge wage bill that is being being felt with this current constitution if he really loves this country then he should allow the course of this country come 2022 to take it course let him go home and retire I want us to finish with this final thing where Njeragia was appointment was revoked and based on what she had posted regarding Nairobi National Park she is seen at the New Posi Kwaapo and now I think it's something that we should be speaking to the youth what you post count count so much because what we know kachimba kachimba and now I'm a loose job a very good position and actually we are asking now do you think social media influences politics in Kenya yeah yeah social media you know it's the era of social media definitely social media has an impact in the 1920s it was before the 1920s it was the newspaper newspaper newspaper it was a way of communicating with the population when it came to the 1920s the radio came about so people would get information of the current affairs politics within that time drew the radio then come in the 1930s towards 1940s the TV era came on board and now the beauty of TV now brought we could see the person talking to us and there was that able there was that interaction so for a long period of time TV was the mode of transmission was the mode of transmission in terms of communication with the general public now the issue of television like we saw like for Donald Trump it can skew to a certain leader and block out another person right but now with no social media platform anybody can speak their mind without fear of being cut off I don't have to go to a major TV station for them to host me I can just create my own Facebook live video and I broadcast my opinion and if the people who agree with my opinion I'll have my own my own followings so and you would realize that even in the 2013 January election I think what made Uhuru and Ruto have a tip towards even victory is how the leverage on social media are like the card people there the card people who had the old kuhulu of that Although Mata Karua and Peter Kenneth had also tried to leverage on social media and they had more followings actually than even Uhuru Ruto but you see them they didn't engage in other aspect that's why people say Peter Kenneth was the president on social media but he only he did not blend social media with other aspects of the campaign but Uhuru Ruto leveraged on that and you see now with that social media present And they had a social media presence and then they went to the ground. It enabled him to boost. Donald Trump is a very good example of very... I think he's almost reaching one billion, quote & quote, Twitter's a most talked person. The fire's people on Twitter. So in conclusion, the issue of Paulin Jorogue shows you. I don't think it's her Tweet, not her Tweet, her Facebook comment that she made because she was airing her views like any other person can air their views, right? But I think the issue that came about is that when the youth or when Kenyans had, she has been appointed as a board director for tourism and yet the same individual has another job at Nepad as a communication officer, the youth who have been affected by unemployment were wondering these spaces why are we winding the same kind of people don't we have individuals who can fit in and you don't have to hold two positions at the same time so you are on one end working for Nepad but we are also on the tourism board you see that is what outraged the youth and what did they do the DCI of courts went and investigated something that can implicate because you see social media is used for propaganda to change an opinion to change a thought but the underlying cry that the youth had not because that a youth has been appointed to be part of the of the board but the cry they were having is this person has had other portfolios how comes is no other new person to hold the same same portfolio and and and beyond that polinjorog aspect they are not even digging into why are children of politicians being given these high profile jobs is it that among us the youth in this country they are not we don't have qualified individuals so someone even once commented insane so the sons and the daughters of high profile people are the one getting these jobs in government while you your sons who have degrees and masters are sweeping the streets and clearing the garbage in the street so i think that was the underlying what that was the underlying cry of people when they went to talk about polinjorog but then her comment four years ago was a good conduit for them to explain their frustrations all right we are out of time and i hope my director will allow me to read these comments very fast uh to the questions uh kenyan heart killer says of course uh we have to influence then uh mce head boy soja out and kutika chuka yes social media influences uh anod okunyuk says good morning all naivasha leksa iso serian malindi estate while representing uh klues dan kan klues says locked from oyaro estate um if we can get another one very fast ground politics compared to social media politics are two very different things and finally of course this is his excellency christopher alvin mokai he says of course it does that is why kenya is going to have its youngest president in 2022 let's see he has some dreams thank you so much for coming pictures and trying to highlight that we hoping kenyans will make a decisive information uh choice when it comes to 2022 uh voting thank you so much back home for keeping us company she has been my guest which is kairu political analyst um there ever hillary have yourself a very good day enjoy yourself and enjoy the rest of our programming goodbye