 Live from Seattle, Washington. It's theCUBE, covering DockerCon 2016. Brought to you by Docker. Now, here are your hosts, John Furrier and Brian Graceley. Okay, welcome back everyone. We're here live in Seattle, Washington for special presentation of SiliconANGLE Media's theCUBE. It's our flagship program. We go out to the events and extract the signal from the noise. We are here at DockerCon 2016. And next is Mariana Tessel, the EVP of Strategic Development, formerly VP of Engineering at Docker. Welcome back to theCUBE, great to see you. Great to see you. We had it, we saw each other last week at HP Enterprise Discover. Yeah. And they had an amazing deal a year earlier. They were talking about dockerization, all the Docker trends. And this year, boom, huge deal with HP. And it wasn't just a Barney deal or it wasn't just a surface deal there's some joint development on. This is a new role for you at Docker, even in the trenches, do an engineering, great success, congratulations. It's a phenomenal career. Now you're going to move on to engineer the ecosystem. So what's your new job? Tell us, what is strategic development? So as you know, or maybe you don't know, I actually have a lot of experience working with partners from VMware. And partners are extremely important for Docker as well. So I'm helping both on deciding some of this strategy, as well as working and developing our ecosystem and figuring out how do we work in the complex world, world green. So strategy kind of implies competitive strategy, company strategy. Is that in the mix? Because it's a 3D chess game going on. Docker has been very, very successful. You made the market. No doubt the success is behind us with the ecosystem. But Docker Inc. the company still has not really put the flag in the ground for a business model, yet you inked a deal with HB Enterprise, big deal. IBM's here, we got Cisco booth here. A lot of the tier one industry players are here with all the open source development goodness. So you also have some competitors potentially, co-opetition, what's the plan? What's your strategy plan for growing your ecosystem? Right, we have one or two competitors, but it is, as you know, we do have quite a few products that we are selling to the enterprises. We both have a SaaS product, Docker Hub and Docker Cloud, and we also have Docker Data Center, which we've been selling for quite a few enterprises. In fact, quite a few of them are talking. So you are selling that product? Sorry, no, so just kind of to finish up, quite a few are going to be talking here at DockerCon. But I want to say is that we have worked with HB and other partners to both create plugins into our existing products, as well as creating together a better solution, and a solution that integrates in the case of some of the hardware partners, it integrates hardware and software together, make it very easy for users to consume. So that's one strategy we're going to go forward with. We understand that when we go to enterprises and to data centers, we're not alone. There are other partners there, some of them existing, some of them are evolving, and we want to participate and be part of that, that what the customers are planning and what they're having there. So that's a key part, as well as understanding that, like I mentioned, plugins, users and ecosystem partners want to plug in into our platform. So we provided a plugin framework for them and we keep improving that to integrate to Docker and then to integrate to our commercial products as well. Yeah. This is sort of a new world. Docker's approach is different than say VMware's. You've got an open source component, you've talked about a SaaS component. As partners come to you, as you're trying to engineer this partner ecosystem, what do you tell them that it's going to make a good partnership? What would you like to see from partners? What makes it work? What makes it work so that customers get benefit out of it? What's the right formula for somebody that comes along and says we want to be on this huge amount of momentum that's going on with Docker? Yeah, I mean, you're right with the fact that we're starting from an open source project, but actually when it comes to partnership, some of it is not that different. What makes obviously a good partnership is that there's complimentary products, right? If there is a highly overlapping product that's going to be, you can still do a partnership, but it's harder. So we're looking for, I would say, complimentary products, but then also where there is enhanced value when you combine them together. And again, I'll go back to the example when you take hardware and you take Docker data center and you put them all in a pre-tested architecture that is validated, that is sold seamlessly, that is fully supported, that's a lot of value to the customer. So non-overlapping, lots of value to the customers and the third one is obviously desire to partner on both sides. So these are some of the criteria that we're looking for. Is there any particular white spaces that you see out there that are enticing for either entrepreneurs or partners to innovate on? I mean, that's the orchestration we've been hearing that, Kubernetes over the top, but there's a lot of talk about automation, policy, security, identity, the management of all the containerizations that's coming into the market is an opportunity, but it's also a challenge. Is there a particular thing that you guys say we Docker will take care of this and this is all open white space for you guys? I mean, a lot of people are trying to figure that out. Where does Docker, where's the line between what Docker wants to kind of get their arms around to provide value, aka competitive advantage, at the same time enable white spaces for partners and entrepreneurs? And then you can look at the unbelievable exhibit floor here and that gives you an idea. There's definitely a lot of white space in security and monitoring, even in management. Obviously anything that runs infrastructure, we are not intended to do anything there. So a lot of alignment there. Those are some of the examples. Again, people are more creative than probably I can give ideas and often people come up with great ideas that we haven't seen before of integrating with the product and value add, but those are some of the things. So there's a lot of opportunities. There's a lot of opportunity. I would say there's a question of, where is Docker going to go? And it's one question, but I also tell you, it's amazing to see some of the vibrant ecosystem already existing. So my advice, if somebody is new coming in and want to do another startup in this area is also to check what's already available because there's quite a few companies in all of the spaces that I've mentioned. So it's not a completely blank sheet at this point. So not a completely blank sheet, but some nice white spaces, got to be careful not to have too many people trying to do the same thing basically. Yeah, exactly. And this is still a new space and we will see more and more opportunity over the next few years evolving, both around the products that we're building, but also in how people use it and, you know. I'm really impressed with HP's messaging around and then their direction around composable infrastructure. And, you know, HP tends to do things. They're either, you know, they get away, had converged infrastructure right years ago, but I think they're onto some of this composable infrastructure message. And the notion is make the infrastructure invisible to the developer. And using containers as part of that. You were involved in that relationship with HP. What got them over the hump with Docker? Obviously a year earlier, they were kind of already kicking the tires. We had them on the cube. Now they're all in with Docker. What's the, what was the motivation? Just to add value to their gear? So, you know, actually let me examine it through the lens of the criteria that I outlined. So one, there is highly complimentary products between the two companies. They provide infrastructure, we provide software on top. By the way, they do have other software assets, but many of those software assets such as side scope, et cetera, they're actually integrating well with our products. So that's kind of number one. Number two, there is a value out to the user. Often there is a user that wants to buy infrastructure and want to use containers and having it pre-configured and resolved between the two companies is much more efficient than every customer trying to create it by themselves. And the third one, there was a desire in both parties to actually have really strong relationship and our relationship that we announced is very, very robust. It goes all the way from reselloem type of agreement into reference architectures and combined architectures. So you guys are going down, getting down deep with HP? Absolutely, yeah, we have it. I would say it's a meaningful relationship. That's, that's- Now, is there a coincidence that you were VP of engineering and now you're doing strategic development alliances? I mean, that makes a lot of sense to get more technical at the integration layer. Is that a coincidence or is that part of the plan for Docker to get more technical? I would say that many of our partnerships there has to be technical in nature and we have to understand how to integrate the product. So in that respect, it's obviously was pretty critical. So this morning during the keynote, lots of announcements, lots of demos. I saw a bunch of tweets. People said Docker really gets this idea of making the developer experience seamless, making it very simple. Simple was over and over from Solomon. That implies that the Docker's going to continue to integrate. We saw Swarm and, but then Solomon's got this famous, sort of batteries included, but pluggable and removable. Like, when you talk to customers, which side of that sort of teeter-totter do they push more towards? Do they want more simplicity, more integrated with Docker? Do they want more flexibility to see where networking might go? What do you hear from the market, from customers and so forth? You know, I would say it really depends on the type of customers. Some of them, especially the ones that are starting out or they have a lot of freedom of choice or they, again, just planning or development. Often they're happy to just take what's there and to move forward. The ones that maybe have particular need in, let's say, networking or they already have existing equipment and existing software, it's something that they understand and need to integrate with. So, I would say it really kind of depends on the layout of the customers, but I'm always surprised by the number of user or customers that actually say, I'm actually happy to consume it as is. I'm happy to throw out some of the stuff that I've been using before and standardize on that. And I will tell you another thing that I've seen is in big customers, actually it's not like one thing or in big users, you have some departments that will go a little bit more particular stack and some that, again, have maybe existing things they have to integrate with. So, again, everybody, depending on the need, our partners provide capabilities that are very specialized or that are really unique that customers really need and we want to integrate really well with them. So, number one question I get regarding the Docker situation, Docker madness, as I say, is that you got Docker of the company that you're executive at and also the ecosystem behind us. It's so damn confusing. Help me figure out, John, what's going on with Docker? They get all the money. How are they going to make money? That's kind of old news. You get to doing well. You got plenty of money. You're not going to go out of business. But really it's much more of a, where do I put things? IT guys are starting to think composable. It's starting to think like Lego blocks. Obviously cloud under the hood is SDN. You got infrastructure as code. Now the developers are all on a growth. A lot of apps being built, which means more containers spewing all over the place. So the customers are thinking to themselves, why do I fit where? What's Kubernetes? Where does this fit? What about this startup? What do I buy? I'm being pitched. I'm the Docker partner of Joyce. I mean, are you overbreeding Docker? Are we, are we, are we, is there a, make sense of it for us? One thing that I recommend users do is also try to think through their entire process and entire view of how they do development. And if they're truly embarking on this microservices and new app, then again, like this is an absolutely great tool for them. I mean, it's a great tool regardless. But I'm just saying, I think it's, it's good idea for companies to step back and say, how do we want to really do development? Are we really committed to this world of full automation and DevOps and microservices? And after that, looking at what you already have existing, what do you have as far as constraints? And then look at other tools that are there. Some customers, for example, they want to run Docker inside VM. And that's a requirement because they invested a lot in that infrastructure. Okay, well that, that sets some parameters. Others say, I want to be completely on the cloud. Others need a hybrid cloud. So I would say it kind of depends on your situation. Obviously we would like to see a full Docker stack running like completely Docker, but we understand that we live in a world where there is choice and there are constraints. And there is, you know. There's a lot of this reality of like the stack, which is case by case basis, some reference designs, but there's also a lot of noise. We were talking earlier. I mean, you got Cloud Foundry, I got Bluemix, I got Pivotal and all these cloud guys. Azure, Google's here. So like cloud game is separate from the Docker situation. Or is it? I mean, that's kind of the noise we're hearing. All this noise is coming in. You know, the way I think about the cloud, right, is again, if you look at AWS and Azure and all the others, you can think about them as an infrastructure, a very efficient, a very flexible infrastructure, but an infrastructure and we can run on top of everything. And then customers want to have a, users want to have a strategy where they have like a diversified view of their infrastructure and want it a little bit on the cloud, a little bit on prem, maybe some multiple clouds. And this is where the portability of Docker just makes it so much even beautiful for them to kind of choose this route. So, you know, I hope I answered your question because I forgot the end of it. All right, so we only have a few minutes left, so I'll go on the Microsoft question. So what's the relationship with Microsoft today? Do you have one, Azure? We have a very strong relationship with Microsoft. We, as you know, we have done multiple technical previews of the Windows integration. You're going to hear more about Microsoft during, you know, you can see sessions during the conference, but we understand that a lot of the users today are Windows developers. They want to deploy on Azure or they maybe have hybrid infrastructure and we are teaming up with Microsoft to figure out how we work with that audience. Where do you see the integration points for Docker right now that you're focused in on that you want to see stability for you guys and where's the free for all? Yeah, for the ecosystem. Right, I mean, we already have a plug-in. We announced up a plug-in architecture like months ago and again, it's the kind of thing we're going to improve. So if you have like a particular, and many companies here with our partner, technical partner programs, they integrate to that. If you have like a particular storage plug-in or a networking plug-in, you can integrate really well. If you have particular monitoring tool, there's a way to integrate as well. So those are the existing ones and I expect us to provide more and more entry points while those are exactly is like, again, some of them we know, some of them are we going to discover as we also discovered the need of the customers and also into our commercial products and understand how we integrate there. Mariana, thanks for coming on theCUBE and sharing your insight has always great. Final word for you to share is what's the vibe of the show this year? What's the big takeaway? If you boil it out today and tomorrow for the folks watching, what's the big takeaway nugget from DockerCon 2016? You know, I think it's really amazing to see the show grow from 500 people to years ago to 4,000 people. It's actually mind-blowing. The vibe is really, really, I mean, you can feel how vibrant it is, how amazing it is. I would still say the best attended booth yesterday was the Warriors game. You know, I never saw a line like this. Of course, yeah, and they lost, unfortunately. Of course, beginning from the Bay Area. Thanks so much, and congratulations on your success. 5,000 people here, close to 5,000. And now in a new role, technical integration at Docker. Mariana Tessel, EVP of Strategic Development Partnership Alliances. She's going to be setting the table for VMware, I'm sorry, Docker, we were just talking about VMware. Thanks so much for joining. You're watching theCUBE here. I'm John Furrier with Brian Graceley, live in Seattle for DockerCon 2016. We'll be right back.