 Hello, my name is Liam. I am being joined today by Dr. Mel Hauser of All Brains Belong. Hello, Mel. You're having me! So I have some questions for you, and I'm I'm so happy to have you here to ask them. Amazing! I'm so happy to be here to answer them. It's an honor. First of all, can you introduce yourself? Sure! I'm Mel Hauser. I use sheave pronouns and visual description. I am I've got pale skin, short brown hair, and I am wearing a like teal-and-white tank top. And I am the founder and executive director of All Brains Belong, Vermont. I am a new nonprofit 501C3 organization in Montpelier. That is so cool. Maybe I should introduce myself. My name is Liam. I use they-them pronouns. I I also have pale skin and even shorter brown hair now and I am wearing glasses and They are regular glasses. Everything else is part of my spamtin cosplay. I am wearing my spamtin cosplay to an interview. Love it! Authenticity. Yes, that exactly. I figured of all people you would be okay with that. Absolutely. It's my it's my most formal outfit. Win-win. Yes, but speaking of of the end. Well, let's get back to the interview. Why did you first decide to become a doctor? Great question. I actually did not always want to become a doctor. I wanted to do a whole bunch of different things and in fact I did do a whole bunch of different things before my road to medicine. But I think what all of the different things that I have done have all kind of had in common is that I really love people's stories. I'm very interested in people's stories and kind of figuring out what was on in people's internal worlds and like what makes them tick and understand their point of view and and and try as best I can to support their, you know, authentic best lives. And so I've been a doctor for the past 10 years and I I'm a family doctor, so I care for babies through older adults, you know, so people of all ages and often multi-generational families. That is so cool. Speaking of you, your bio on the official all brains belong website, which we'll get into what all brains belong is in just a minute. But the bio on the website says you were diagnosed of autism at the age of 37. How did this affect your life and your career? In every single way imaginable. Like many late identified autistic adults, I had had the experience of always feeling like there was something different about me and like in like subtle ways and I had no real lens for for understanding that and like many late identified adults like I was just kind of felt like I wasn't doing the thing in the way it was supposed to be done. But but but really then I you know when I came to learn that we all have different brains that do things differently and when a lot of times people first and when this is like super unfortunate, but a lot of times people first learn that they're autistic in the context of like becoming profoundly dysregulated and so like my experience in early COVID as a doctor caring for patients like sick patients in the hospital in the office and like homeschooling my then toddler and like anyway entered something called autistic burnout and where basically I lost the ability to mask and like started showing up authentically for the first time and because I like lost the brain the brain functions needed to mask and that is how a lot of adults first learn that they are autistic and I Can't wait for the day where people Learn about their brains without reaching profound levels of dysregulation Well, I I also have experience of autism. I am not a late diagnosed person I was diagnosed at two years old, which is nearly impossible for an assigned female at birth person and I Know what you're talking about in in some ways I Yes, it does affect all areas of your life and you don't even notice it sometimes But sometimes it's a good thing Yeah, can I tell you a can I tell you a story? Yes unscripted story. We've got plenty of time. Go ahead amazing, so I was having a conversation with my autistic five-year-old about like hey, I'm doing you know a Group with my patients like teaching them about autism. What do you think I should tell them? I'm working with people who like wonders if they're autistic or not and my five-year-old says Well, um, I have a really awesome brain I have the kind of brain that can see patterns and make connections Between ideas that other people don't make Proud because like yeah Yeah, that is a strength of many autistic brains and I think that if we can build a world where little kids Recognize that we all have different brains that do things differently and we all have unique patterns of Things that we're good at and things that are hard Um this way um, we We just build a life that works for our brain. Yes, that you must be so proud of her. She sounds very wise She's so wise like well beyond her years I have a quick unscripted question, but it shouldn't be too hard. Were you diagnosed during COVID? I was I was diagnosed in May of 2021. Oh good for you Thank you. Yeah, and so I learned during COVID. I learned that I was ADHD That came first a lot of times that is what comes first Because of all the stereotypes out there so So, so I learned I was ADHD and then six months later I learned that I was also autistic, dyslexic, dyscalculic and dyspraxic and had I I often wonder, you know, a lot of a lot of late identified adults talk about how if Only I had known this about myself my whole life I would not have felt so broken and defective. I wouldn't have felt like a broken neuro typical I would have just known that I was autistic and I do things differently Yeah, and then a lot of people who were identified in childhood they have the experience of It's not all so rosy because there are There is still stigma and there is still The assumption that there's like one correct and default way to be a human and That anyone else Needs to conform with that default There's you know, there's one right way to play and there's one right way to learn and there's one way to do the thing Anyway, I wonder like was that your experience like that that vibe yes, definitely I In I was despite my autism I was actually quite advanced in elementary school and there weren't many programs for people who were beyond Or below the standard Yes, and that's still that's still often true and so I a lot of oh, sorry I know that I spent most of my days in school either bored or frustrated I had a 504 plan and It was very long list of things that definitely I don't even know if they would be considered disabilities were listed as Disabilities and things for teachers to look out for So I appreciate that I had that but it was also very othering very othering right It was listed that I had a strong sense of justice and this was considered a disability like that like I think they're important stories to tell because It's just so ridiculous on its face right like so, I mean so so I have a What's anyway there? Anyway, I think that until we really as a society can zoom out and say we all have different brains that do things differently We're still going to you know anytime we have like a default way to do the thing so if the default is like Without shot not speak out against injustices. It's rude. It's like that's the default if you have the kind of brain that Recognizing recognizes inequity recognizes, you know things that are arbitrary and make no sense and like vehemently advocates for like What what is right to your nervous system like yeah? If we pathologize that we are missing out on supporting Like really important work to be done in our society you explained it so much better than I could thank you It's it's it's I think it's it's it's um Easier to zoom out and describe patterns when you're not talking about your own life sometimes yes very much so That is something you are very good at my my brain is a lot more disorganized Thank you And I I I think it's a lot of practice too And and I think that many autistic and I I have many things about my brain that is that that are Disorganized especially when I don't have enough dopamine But and or I don't have enough like visual supports So even you know, I appreciated you as a journalist that you sent me some questions ahead of time because there are many brains that process information fast visually and so Even even in the like forget journalism for a second like even my organization, which maybe I'll maybe I'll tell you about but but anyway, we are currently Hiring an employee like for a position and for all people Not just people who disclose they have a disability not just people who ask for this as an accommodation But all the people are being sent their interview questions ahead of time because that is Neuro-inclusive that sounds wonderful. I wish more places would do that Me too, and I think that whenever I have brought this concept to like because we do We do trainings for employers who are looking to become neuro-inclusive And or more neuro-inclusive and when I bring that up about the whole, you know Processing visually versus auditorily due to do people are like, oh, oh that makes sense. Oh, yeah, that never occurred to me And so I think it's just about like so many other areas of social justice there's this element of abled privilege and I've been really impressed by the community like our local community's openness to just learning about things that really haven't been talked about as much as other areas of Marginalization and especially when we think about the many ways in which people are marginalized and other than we think about the intersectionality of marginalization Neuro-divergence And and disability and acts of these topics are really important Definitely I have a bit of an impromptu story myself. I actually I Missed out on my first-ever job opportunity because in the interview I mentioned that I had OCD and Hopefully that won't be a thing in the future So meaning you disclose the disability and you were discriminated against yes I'm so sorry that that happened. Well, it worked out because I ended up here instead Hmm. Yeah, right like all the roads And and being able to zoom out and reframe that is really powerful and it was also So wrong and inappropriate that you were discriminated against. Thank you Yeah, and I think that there is So much stigma, which is why it is very hard for people to show up authentically, you know as their true selves in various Context of education employment socially because there is the fear of Discrimination and it's real. It's not like an irrational. Yes, definitely There are some places where you just can't be your authentic self at the moment and that's really sad and it's not safe Mm-hmm. I mean, I would love it if I could dress up in cosplay every day But that's just not possible at the moment Not in all contexts, but the idea would be that you are in an environment and to the extent that people have control over their environments and Some people don't a lot of people don't but but the idea would be to seek out environments and people in those environments that Support authenticity when when when that's possible Until we can shift the broader community conversation around our diversity and inclusion, which is exactly what we're trying to do here at all Brains belong so I Can tell you don't mean to tell you speaking of all brains belong. That's my next question What is all brains belong? Yeah so as I mentioned a little bit before We are a non-profit Bible and three organization. I'm up earlier We are a community health organization dedicated to supporting the well-being and inclusion of people with all types of brains because one in five people Learns thinks and or communicates differently than the so-called typical brain even though like I really don't think there is a typical brain You know, I think this is more like a continuum But you know, even though there's no default brain there's like many defaults in society in healthcare education employment so anyway what what all brains belong does is Kind of reimagines these big systems and provides healthcare education and community social connection opportunities in flexible multiple different ways So that people have freedom and choice to pick what works for them. So it is about one supporting the neurodiversity community and Shifting the broader community conversation around neurodiversity and inclusion Sounds wonderful. Um, that also answers my next question, which was what does all brains belong do so you're ahead of the game? Thank you. Oh, oh, yeah Yes, so like I but you know provide more more details I'll be happy to you. So so for for for health care myself and Sierra Miller's nurse practitioner and we provide neurodiversity affirming Healthcare we have primary we have primary care patients and we have folks who receive their primary care elsewhere who come to us for support around brain and nervous system health and the common co-occurring conditions such as various autoimmune diseases that are that are common in the neurodiversity community But we we take care of people with all types of brains infants through older adults So, you know, it's it's um, it's it's it's not only neurodivergent patients because as it turns out Universal design or having those like flexible multimodal options for engagement benefits everyone. So You know, for example, there's no right way to make an appointment Like you don't have to pick up the phone to call you can book online You know, you can email you can text we have secure email and secure texting So like people who have the kind of brains where it's not like a big deal To pick up the phone and make an appointment and stay on hold for an hour to do that Like if that's like people can do that They still might prefer to have options because so flexibility having freedom and choice like benefits everyone Which is why, you know, a lot of people come here Even though they don't identify as neurodivergent Okay, so that was daddy that also answers my next question I was wondering if you see all people are just neurodivergent people all people all ages birth through older adulthood And then our community programs are open to everyone even if you're not receiving care from us. So we have Social connection Opportunities like bringing people together based on shared interests like we have this this program called kid connections for kids age three to 17 You know open open to people with all different types of brains all about like customized Matchmaking with in pairs or small groups of people who share the same interests, you know So like if if if if someone's super interested in dinosaurs We will find you someone else is super passionate about dinosaurs that kind of thing And so because turns out when you bring people together based on interests not necessarily based on diagnoses like that's a more authentic Yeah, I wish that that kind of thing had been available when I was a kid I didn't make any close friends until Dungeons and Dragons and in my junior year of high school So that would have been very useful for someone like me, right? So if you had, you know, so so so autistic and ADHD brains Are mono-tropic Activate our interest rate and do some more intensely than all their brains And so if you bring if I'm super passionate about And All I want to do not that was that I was I'm gonna rewind I'm gonna try that again So um if I'm super passionate about fish and all I can think and talk about is fish and All I can take in information about that is meaningful and relevant to me in the context of my monotropic attention system is fish and you Bring me to a group where people are talking about cars and Turtles and pizza like my brain literally cannot engage with that And so if you bring me to a to meet a person who's like super passionate about fish Um, I'm gonna have I'm gonna get dopamine during that interaction And I have a dopamine-bound brain and so you bring people together who share that interest They both get dopamine and like, boom Can you tell me a bit more about what a dopamine-bound brain is? Oh, I would be happy to Would that bring you dopamine? Interest is brains. So yeah, yeah, I would love to give me that would give me dopamine to talk about dopamine for sure so anyway, so dopamine is a brain chemical that is implicated in attention, motivation, reward, pleasure And dopamine feels good to everybody But there are many many nervous systems that are wired such to really require dopamine for everything for motor coordination or starting and stopping an activity or a thought And so when the dopamine-bound brain does not have dopamine We call that inertia an object in motion stays in motion like the physics concept It's either foot on the break like I can't initiate the thing. I can't get out of bed in the morning. I can't Start and put on the gas Uh, I can't stop doing the thing. I can't stop saying the same thing over and over. I can't stop picking my skin I can't stop Focusing on that video game. It's put on the gas put on the break either way It's uh feels terrible to the dopamine-bound brain All right. I I think I understand. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah, you're you're you're very welcome And I think that like a lot of times things are thought about as like willful and intentional when really It is an involuntary or automatic thing that happens from not having enough dopamine So like a kid will get feedback that they are You know, they're not They're not paying attention in school or something. Well, it's because that topic doesn't give dopamine um, or If I don't have enough dopamine I am like, you know motor things like chopping an onion Um, like is really hard. It's like hard to coordinate. Um, but if I have enough dopamine or if I have like my You know if I have like music in the background if I've had like my protein and my movement And I've had restorative sleep the night before and I've done something interesting recently. Um, if I've taken my medications Um, all the different ways in which people get dopamine. Um, I can chop an onion So it's it's very it's very context specific and it's not intentional Yes, I I also love dopamine You probably require dopamine Yes, I know that for me my dopamine often comes from fictional characters, which is why I love cosplay so much Yeah, my current special fixation is spampton who I am dressed as as I mentioned before And that brings me a lot of dopamine So I'm so happy that you consider it an authentic self and allow me to do my authentic self right now Absolutely, and I encourage you to like seek out people and environments where it's totally legit to Where where whatever makes you feel like your best self However, I would this is not about me I would like to get back to all brains belong because it is such an important Organization and I know that one of the things you do is the vaccine clinic Oh, yeah, I actually got vaccinated at the at a vaccine clinic back in december and it was very wonderful I got the Moderna vaccine It was it was very nice because I am very afraid of needles I have been my entire life because my veins roll and nurses would have to hold me down to To vaccinate me or draw blood And I think that that's why I'm afraid of needles. But anyway, it was wonderful Going to all brains belong to get vaccinated Because they were so accepting they let me wear my special spampton glasses so I could get My big shot as a big shot And it was very respectful. I got a nice relaxing room to do it And I was wondering if you could tell me more about that because you sorry I was wondering if you could tell me more about that Absolutely So when we first launched This was right around the time when Covid cases were starting to rise the The vaccination had just been approved for kids and a lot of kids It became More it came to if I can rewind tonight. Can I can I? Oh, of course. I want I want to try again All right. So right when we first launched It came to our attention that there were many people kids and adults Who were unable to access vaccination because of healthcare trauma like that experiences in the past Needle phobia anxiety sensory processing differences like in the usual Places or settings in which vaccination occurs You know typically healthcare settings or like large, you know, like shopping malls or high school gymnasiums and whatever And my own five year old I was like there is no way that my sweet little love is going to be able to access covid vaccination like At a big loud facility like there's just no way that was happening So I thought it would be and it was um a a really Cool opportunity to demonstrate universal design giving giving lots of different choices to people Not because people disclosed any disabilities and requested accommodations But because it was offered to all people so People with all types of brains open to anyone who thought that they would benefit kids or adults You got to co-create an experience So you got to pick whether you wanted a brightly lit space or a dimly lit space You picked your furniture You told us what meet with what brought you joy. You told us what? What stressed you out so that we could make sure to avoid it Unless that thing is needles Well, yeah, we couldn't avoid it completely, but we might be able to support Let's say for example, um, you know your If if if if there was a way to um, you know Use a numbing cream before hand or use um, uh a tool called the buzzy bee that Vibrations kind of yeah, I don't know if you use buzzy bee, but I heard of it Yeah, so it's so it's uh, it's vibrations on the skin that kind of tricks the brand to attend to those sensations instead Anyway, same like legitimately Influences decreases the perception of pain. So like all this different stuff and because the dopamine bound brain needs dopamine a lot of times um when when when you uh, you you Support someone by giving them dopamine for example, if I know that you Uh have a monotropic focus on unicorns and I have like a unicorn stuffy and I'm playing the you know a unicorn song Um, you know, like you're literally going to perceive your sensory information differently You're literally going to have a completely different nervous system experience than if If you didn't have dopamine And especially because like, you know the story you just shared about like you had an experience of being restrained I mean that's so many people's experience Guess what if you have trauma you're gonna want to avoid not one you're gonna have to avoid your limbic system's gonna be like This does not feel safe. Yes trauma lives in your body Even though I've been an adult for a few years now And I can I can sit for a regular vaccine experience. That still doesn't make it pleasant The vaccine clinic is the first Vaccination I've had that was actually pleasant Which is because you don't really think of vaccinations as being pleasant It made something so horrible into something wonderful I got a chance to talk about what I liked And I and I was 19 when this happened. So it's not just for kids either It was a wonderful experience and it's just one of the many wonderful things that all brains belong does You are warming my soul. Oh, thank you Um, but that that leads me to my next question What are the ever kinds of programs that all brains belong does I know for one that you have a stuffy night Which I've been trying to attend but have never managed to we should do that again soon Yeah, so that was that came out of the kid connections program of bringing people together who love stuffed animals Um, and we had like facilitated small groups Or like the stuffies were interacting and they had like a stuffy dance party and it was it was anyway Just bringing people together You know in about the thing they love One of our ongoing regular programs is called brain club. Um every every week. It's our community education series different topics of everyday brain life That uh, uh right now we've been with the help of work of media We've been able to offer in hybrid format outdoors on the state house lawn and by zoom And um, that's that that's that's been I think a really awesome opportunity to like bring people together to share their experiences and learn about different topics and um and and and and has um helped helped in In small ways to really shift the perspectives Even of um people who've never thought about these topics before who get exposed to it in the first in the first context through brain club And we have um a number of like um educational trainings like we have free workshops for families on Parenting like neurodiversity affirming parenting. Um, we do trainings for employers about neurodiversity and inclusion Which I think is like, you know with with there's so many employers that are it's uh, they have a lens of Diversity equity inclusion, but like this is the missing piece. I think of the dei conversations and so that's been a really a really lovely opportunity to um, you know, bring in neurodiversity and access um into into dei conversations um and All of the archives of our um our free educational programs. They're all available on our website So you can just you know, it's free or by donation. Um, all the all the recordings are available Wonderful. I and I want to thank you for doing all of this work Thank you for helping me spread the word. No problem Um, when I was asked to do something for orca media, this was my first idea I was like I can help all brains belong and I'm so happy to have that opportunity That's amazing. Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, and this is probably going to go on youtube And I understand that you also have a youtube channel. Could you tell me a little bit more about that? Oh, yeah, so I personally so Mia's mel hauser. Um, I have a youtube station For kids. It's a neuro education Um, uh station. I don't update it regularly because I'm like Is he doing all the things you're doing this? I'm all yeah, I'm doing this. Um, but um, this is um, like talking about concepts of play social communication interacting with friends, um, like, uh All all the different ways our brains do things because I think that inclusion begins in fatherhood in preschool learning about neurodiversity and how all the different ways our brains do things like from From the ground up. That's how we build an inclusive community. Um, so even even kids with Typically developing brains. I don't want them thinking that their brain is the default. I want like Everyone to know that we all do things differently And so I like talk about these concepts in Language that I'm that I that that that is meaningful for for young kids And I have like figurines and stuff talking about the stuff I know you have a video series with an elsa doll explaining these topics and I found that very educational. I mean I wish that I had education like that when I was a kid Like I've never been a big elsa fan But if they had my favorite characters, I would have listened all day to that I would have listened to most boring topics if If like the radio from brave little toaster taught it Oh, I remember brave little toaster That's amazing the radio from brave little toaster. I think Was one of my first comfort characters either him or the care bears Oh care bears were yeah, that was That was a big like that might have been my like monotropic focus of toddler hood probably probably care bears I don't remember exactly. I was a toddler Yeah um, so The uh, luna went through a phase a my little pony phase Which kind of reminded me of the care bears in many ways, you know Because I've kind of brain that connects all the things to all the things. Yeah, I can see that Yeah, yeah, that's like one of our strengths, right? Like it's like that's that's um, that's that's some the systems thinking and like You know having kind of brain that drives safety from systems you build systems more more readily Um, uh, then then other brains, but the my little pony thing similar to the care bear thing was all about like the different personalities traits and strengths of different brains like to me Um, that was like, you know a pretty neuro diversity informed program Even though it doesn't use that language Mm-hmm. Yeah Yeah, do you have a particular favorite care bear on my little pony? My favorite my little pony. Um, well I have two and luna says that I am a Blend of this. So there is a twilight sparkle Who's like the the the studious scholar who like has a lot of brain rules and is kind of like pretty intense about them Um, but like, you know is gets a lot of good things, you know a lot of meaningful important systematic things done Um and pinkie that is like always on the go and yes And did you do yeah, those are my peeps pinkie pie is my favorite And my second favorite would be sunset shimmer who is kind of an antithesis to twilight very similar But all it became a villain and I I just I know all about that shimmer So luna is very interested in the subtle villain Like the villain who's like not evil But like is just dysregulated and ends up in situations Um that like do some pretty um Unhelpful things because they're dysregulated. I'm sorry for getting so excited But that's exactly what spamped in it is and I've never heard it described that way So I'm like my my thing is coming up now So you that feeling you just got that's dopamine So I love that you don't get to pick what interests you and so like you heard the thing it connected to your thing And now you're like a little bit interested. So yes, the dopamine brain has to do that all day long But yes, I just I love sunset shimmer for being an edgier twilight sparkle Edgier, but I always like just what like if if sunset shimmer could have genuine connections She would probably be Better regulated and would probably have a better life Sunset shimmer is cast in the um in this negative lens When really like sunset shimmer would be best to um like if she could have Friends and connection about her shared interests. She would probably be on a different path She wouldn't be on the villain path Again, thank you for putting it in better words than I can You are just incredible at this and this is a very important part of the interview obviously the my little pony section Obviously because that's like the real life thing. So when I talked to little kids about brains, um, whether it be my patient or my child, um, I find out what their monotropic focus is and I Talk about brains in that context because the dopamine bound brain needs dopamine in order to attend taken information Like meaningfully apply it in their lives. And so um, like for example, um Luna's now really really into Um, miraculous No, I'm miraculous. I know what it is. I've never watched it, but I know what it is It's pretty much the key to the I mean like my little pony I think is like has like so many keys to the universe which is like, you know, like Connection is the path to having a good life and all the different personality types and how you have conflicting access needs to negotiate like it's all these like big picture concepts, but um, so it is in I I think the show is just called miraculous, but it may have another name like oh miraculous like adventures or tales of ladybug Or something. I think it's adventures of miraculous ladybug. I'm not sure. Yeah. Yeah, something like that. Anyway So I've been watched Luna's been like super into this and it doesn't give me dopamine and it like Freaks me out. So like I pretty much avoid it But yesterday something happened in an episode. I was watching out of the corner of my eye with Luna and It was really showing that trauma for some nervous systems when not balanced by connection and support Really put people on the path the dysregulated path to destruction And that happens in real life like all the time And so bringing people together whether whether that be, you know, so many people experience trauma Whether that be like, you know, macro trauma or micro trauma Like it's all trauma in the nervous system that stays in the nervous system and influences the whole path forward but like connection and support Makes a huge difference. And so anyway in in miraculous The main villain I came to learn yesterday has a great deal of trauma and result in this regulation That puts him on a path where he thinks that the only way to feel good is to have unlimited power and dominance over other people And it doesn't really work out very well. Sounds very Machiavellian Yeah Yeah Yeah, and so I literally I just finished a term paper on Machiavellianism. So of course I wrote it about spampton Of course. Yeah, the uh, dopamine number needs dopamine after all One of the best papers ever written but I I get what you're saying. I I really love that idea for a villain And Yeah, yeah, and luna at five years old will watch of Like a cartoon and be like, oh the villain seems like she's Just dysregulated um, or um, uh, she'll make the connection between like, um, mother got full in Rapunzel And Maleficent in Sleeping Beauty. These are traumatized people Who are dysregulated and have no connection? Who go on the path to destruction? Wow, this this is just like the smartest child and I thought I was smart as a kid And and but like she's she is She's ahead of her time. She like she is literally and and and enough you you you are I imagine like I imagine you have always been you and so I can imagine that you were like a Smart little you anyway. Um, but like luna and luna is my guru of peace to the universe Is she your only child? She is my only child. Um, and when she was born Um, it was very clear to me that my environment was dysregulating her Um, she has the kind of brain for which things were just like way too loud and moved way too fast and Was just all too much And so I had never as a doctor I had never seen an autistic infant, but I I knew that I had one and we had um, amazing neurodiversity affirming therapists, um in in in our lives who Helped us support her sensory processing and like design A life that works for her brain And we have a very luna centric life and she's doing great. That is so wonderful I cannot stress the importance of having good therapists enough and I'm not just saying this is an advertisement for my occupational therapist mother It is very important to have therapists at a young age. I mean I Starting from the age of two when I was diagnosed I had therapists like 40 hours a week and now I was able to give my high school graduations welcome speech I didn't think I'd ever be able to talk but now I'm talking to you and So I just want to give a quick shout out to all the therapists out there very important totally and um, There there are I think that you know back back when you were a kid This was really before the at the the the the rising Neurodiversity paradigm had really kind of come to light and so sometimes Some therapies now are about Forcing neurodivergent kids to look more neurotypical and that is That can be traumatic and so You know in 2022 there are you know, there there there's a lot of different types of therapies that Are about figuring out What does someone's best self look like and how do we support? You know the modifications of the environment the support of skills the of different ways of communicating um That that anyway back that can make a huge difference. So yes shout out to all the therapists particularly the neurodiversity Yes, yes, definitely um Well, I have a few more questions left a very important one. How can viewers support a all brains belongs mission? Oh, man. Thank you for that question. No one's ever asked me that before. Um, honestly like I am I know how to be a doctor and I know how to Talk but like I am so Um, I have a lot of brain rules like I don't fundraise very well Like I never asked for anything So because I think that there's no right way to support this organization because you can support the organization with a With donating your time as a volunteer and we have an amazing volunteer coordinator Who will kind of figure out what gives you dopamine and what what what drives you and what you're interested in like Plug you in um to to to our work. Um, you can um, you know, but you know, uh, you can Support us by um, like on our website We have like a registry of supplies and stuff we need and like sending us little gifts that way is like a super big help and um, uh Financial gifts of any amount are Like as a startup nonprofit Can it really really gifts of any size make a very big difference to us and allow us to You know, uh grow our capacity for long-term success and sustainability because I think what we've learned um in our, you know, we we we launched eight months ago and we've been on, you know, uh, uh, like the The fast track we've really been able to do a lot in a short amount of time and the communities need Quickly it became clear that the communities need has outpaced our ability to meet it Like we get calls from, you know, random community members who need more services we're trying to build a Program a carved employment program for people with disabilities looking for project-based employment that where they can Work within their scope of skills and interests We are building support structures for kids who are unable to access their education in the traditional way we have all all all of these programs that um, that that's that we are so So grateful for the community support of these things and um, that's that's that's uh, that's That's another way that would be really really helpful to support our mission Well, I would really like to say I appreciate that you have for donations You have the ability to buy specific items I know there are some people who would want to make sure that their money went to a specific thing So to make that an option it it's kind of ties back into universal design You have so many ways to donate It's just I think the fact that you incorporate universal design into even these sorts of things is just wonderful Thanks Yeah, I have the kind of brain that I want to know what my donations are going to also So it was important to to to build that structure. Um, and and you know, there's even there's even a place that even, um, you know Financial donations like people can pick You know, do you go to the healthcare bucket? Do you go to the community programs bucket? There's We we really want people to have freedom and choice Over supporting the programs that are most meaningful for them. That is wonderful. And I have two last questions First what is your favorite thing about working at all brains belong? That is a great question My favorite thing about The day-to-day work at all brains belong is that Our team here and by team I would include not only the paid employees But the key volunteers the people on our community advisory board like you and our village our growing village of That that that that isn't is so invested in You know really creating this community of of learning and healing and connection like it's it's this whole team Shares of value of interdependence Meaning we rely on each other independence is I think overly glorified Autonomy is really important having agency and self determinism like that is paramount but interdependence relying on one another Is a core value here? And it's so profoundly normal to need and depend on other people and I I've never really worked in a setting like that before and That's That's what I love most. I'm surprised that interdependence isn't valued in more places because it seems so obvious to me that one person can only do so much I mean you It would be so obvious to me that everyone would know we all have different brains But if you don't grow up with that narrative um You don't know and so when I think about like the uh some typical ways in which Independence is overly glorified um, you know uh You know be a big boy Wipe your own butt You know, oh look you tied your shoes by yourself. Oh In like it's all well intention But we are um sometimes differentially praising independence and not um reinforcing the profoundly normal part of Having a culture of Being connected and relying on other people Yeah From toddler hood up I know I didn't learn how to tie my shoes until third grade and that was a source of embarrassment Which as opposed to um, wouldn't it have been interesting if someone had said there are all different types of shoes Would you pick the one that works best for you? Exactly. Why didn't I just use velcro? Who knows? Yeah, because because there's a because there must be a right type of shoe like what? um, so but that's that's a way in which um, you know People haven't kind of thought about it that ableism so the Belief that it is superior to be able to do a thing as opposed to not do a thing ableism is embedded in subtle yet profound ways In so many aspects of our society I had never thought of it like that. I always thought that I was just efficient for taking so long to learn how to tie my shoes Exactly. So that's an example of how neurodivergent people grow up often feeling broken and defective Yes, and one last question which is as I think has already been answered throughout this discussion But just to summarize why is your work important? Thank you for the question. Um The work at all brains belong is so important because one in five people Learns thinks and and or communicates differently Then society is designed for and that group of people has higher risks of or higher rates of Health complications of barriers to accessing health and education 80 percent are unemployed even those with college education This is a group of people that is being systematically marginalized in a lot of the major Domains of community life And so shifting the broader conversation About neurodiversity and inclusion is an essential part of building an inclusive society Thank you so much Thank you so much. I don't have anything else to add that was perfect Awesome. Thank you so much for this opportunity. It was wonderful and It was been it's been wonderful to have you this has been liam with mel hauser of all brains belong. Thank you for watching