 2023 presidential elections may end PDP, says former Vice President Attiku Abu Bakar. Also a clergy man, Elijah Yodele, says cabals and the state governors will break the party. And are governors in the southeast overwhelmed by insecurity or are they simply not working to govern? Well this is PlusPolitics, I am Mary Anacol. Former Vice President Attiku Abu Bakar has expressed concerns over the continuity of the People's Democratic Party, admitting that losing the 2023 presidential elections may send the party into political oblivion. And he was worried that he, alongside the members of the BOT, would be retired politically. Should another party win the election? Also, the leader of the INRI Evangelical Spiritual Church, Prime Minister Elijah Yodele, has said some cabals and state governors in the People's Democratic Party will break the party. He further added that the cabal would blackmail the party's national chairman, Iochia Aiu, and try to reduce him to nothing as they did his predecessor, Uche Secundus. Well joining us to discuss this is former publicity secretary of the People's Democratic Party in River State, Darlington Oji, and PDP chieftain and strategist, Dimola Olarewaju. Thank you so much gentlemen for joining us. Thank you for having me. All right, thank you gentlemen. I'll start with you Darlington. Now, just yesterday I was speaking with the chairman of the Equery Local Government area on the war of wards between the governor of your state and the governor of a dirt state. That's on the one hand. Governor Wike also has been in a war of wards with Governor Dave Umahi on the issue of the court judgment saying that he should stop parading himself as the governor of the state. Now, we also are seeing the governor again, talking to the former vice president, Atiku Abu Bakar, saying that he does not own the People's Democratic Party. Governor Wike seems to be having a very busy 2022. Well, for me, thank you for giving me the privilege to speak on some of these issues. You know, this is a transition period. We are, you expect a lot of things to happen. Governor Wike is not in a war of wards with any person. You know, when a man stand out and decide to tell the truth at all times, you will be misinterpreted. What Governor Wike simply means, in the case of Umahi, is that the law is very clear in the area of defection what will happen and will amount to the reason you could defect. You could defect when there is a crack at the national level of the political party. It will be a north-facing. But in this case, we are, you said, because PDP have not formally zoned the presidential position to the south-east, then it's now a proper or a cogent reason for you to defend. It is not. And again, when the governor is making a statement, I say that he knows the people that are behind it. Of course, Governor Wike, as a man that has messed up so much in this party, is to come up to say, you don't need to suspect people. You don't need to begin to state who are the people that are responsible. Members of PDP are responsible. And we are not shyly away from that. We are responsible because you won an election through our platform. There is no independent candidacy as of today or as of when this election was conducted. So because you won the election through a vehicle, which is the PDP, of course, you either abandon PDP and give us what belongs to us. So that is not the war of wars. As regards to the state governor, Godwin University, again, you saw clearly when the governor threatened the political party could be defeated. And he was talking as if it was the damn God or it was a life wire of PDP in the state and nobody could take that. Nobody can, you know, unleash threat on a political party that was already built before your arrival. What is even the issue? The issue of course, I know you know as a media person that the issue has to do with the structure of the party at the state level, local government level and world level. Elections have been conducted, Congresses have been conducted. People have already marched before you came in as the candidate or as the man who is seeking to contest the election. And of course, you know that there are people that are supposed to run the election under our political party. But people like Governor Wichelt said and had a lot of sleep last night to make sure that people come together. But why you run that election? Remember, the issue of harmonization, who would have asked us to say, OK, you take the governor and allow the old members of the PDP, the deputy governor, who says it is what you prefer, Philip Shahibu and have allowed you to run. Why come to dismantle what is already in existence? So what the governor says is very clear that people should not be ingrained, people should not be seen as people that are very ungrateful when a favor is being done on them. So it is not the word of the world. It is the sincerity truth that the governor is saying. The governor is standing out to say, look, he has invested so much in this political party. You remember when we were going on distinction or distinction during the Amoudi Sherif period? Who had the governor that stood behind? Where are all these people? Governor Wichelt was one of those that stood behind and invested a lot for this party to remain together. So when the man said, look, you must carry everybody along and a lot of people who are already in existence to be as a governor. We have a commanding in place. Why talk about destroying or disbanding the structure that is already in existence? Governor Wichelt is one man that will stand up on the truth and reverse people are comfortable with that. And that is why we are elected in two times to mount the leadership of reverse people and be our spokesman. And for us, it's the pride of reverse people. And whether the person likes it or not, Governor Wichelt is the most viable force in PDP assistance today. He has not erased, he has not gone astray. What we are saying is that when people do the favor, try to remain steadfast in your own part of commitment. Don't be what people assume you are, especially when one is we are using ahead of time by governorship, from a government who said, look, Obama said he is going to win this election. Maybe you are running around him to make sure he gives him tickets after which we are very sure that he will not stay in the party. And even if it is true, that is what he is doing. You can prove people wrong. You say, look, I can fight my fight here, have my disagreement here and remain in the party to build it to be very much stronger than what he meant. So why can't we all, the big government, begin to threaten the party? Nobody that is very reasonable in our party will take that, especially before the national chairman. Nobody will take it. So what has the governor done? What the governor has done is that there should be a little decorum in what to do. And he must respect people's own opinion. He is not a command structure. It is something that you bring up your own opinion and others will bring up the best brain we now have today. So for us, the statement started from the threat that was issued by the deputy governor of the state, Philip Shahidu. It is unacceptable by us and we cannot accept it as political. We have so far so much in this party. We are ready to rescue Nigeria and together we must build the party so we cannot leave it in the hands of any person that can threaten us about leaving. Everyone we are aware that we are not ready to stay here. So don't look for flammable excuses as a reason that we want to leave. I see where you're coming from, but it's interesting because it makes it seem like there are no PDP members in the state. Why would the governor, I mean, it's all fair that the governor at some point had to be part of the electioneering process that brought Governor Basaki into office. But then there are PDP members. There's the PDP leadership within the state. In fact, the PDP national chairman visited the state to try to somewhat circumvent that problem and bring peace. Why should Governor Wike be most interested in the state elections? I mean, there they have their party leadership. Why can't he let them deal with the state problems and face river state? If you remember what happened in the election, you will know that we had three days left last night. Wike was barely living in the jail. But that's not coming again. You will agree with me that of a state that came to river state to say that outside God in heaven, the next person are giving this opportunity is Governor Yesumite. And if there are issues that are cropping up, he owe me as a duty or as a responsibility to call his friend to order to say, could we just please put our hands together? Why do we need to, you know, chase away a part of people, especially people that has already been in existence. If PDP was not built by those in the state, which house was he going to run to? So, Governor Wike is now a visitor in a new state. But during the election campaign and when they were looking for where to be sheltered, Governor Wike was not a visitor. My simple argument here is that what we are saying is that make sure you carry everybody along. There is already an existing structure. Congresses have been heard from the world level, look at government level to state level. Why do you ask for the disbandment of such congresses that have been held in the past? Reason because you want to put those that you believe that there are people. But I can tell you as a governor, if you have to leave command, the influence will take your command. The party structure will come to eventually. What do you need to do? It is because you already have segregated the party before your rival. Otherwise, as a party, as a governor to state, I wonder who is the state party chairman that cannot come to you? Who is the state LJ party chairman that cannot come to you? So the reason is because you already have a nice set. And for us, nobody will come to destroy PDP. So that tomorrow you collapse the entire structure into a PC or whichever political party you want to do. What we are saying is that we must, as people of Nigeria, stand together to make sure that we rescue Nigeria from this impediment that has been begotten by our people through the government called a PC. And we are going to get Nigerian people that look we can enter a fresh agreement with you because governments is about social conflict. Now, in social conflict, you need to make promises to your people. Can you keep to them? So how we don't look at us that you can make a promise to the people as soon as you ascend it through, that you change. That is the question we want to correct in your view. OK. All right. Let me let me come to you, Daimala. It's interesting because the PDP seems to be having its own fair share of crisis, even at the national level. But let's come let's start with Oshun state. We saw recently a parallel primary that held within the state to governorship candidates emerged. Even in Lagos state here, we also know that a chieftain in the party has been also in the news talking about the fact that certain members of his group have been sidelined when it comes to giving juicy offices. I mean, recently the party Congress, so I think was held in the state and certain offices offices were given or voted for and then people emerge. I'd like to call names here. Now Chibadejaj, which we all know as a leader and a chieftain within the party has allegedly has said that, you know, forces within the party are allegedly trying to exclude his supporters from key party positions. So let's stay within the Southwest. We're done talking about the South South. The PDP seems to be fighting on all fronts here. And I'm wondering why? Well, I mean, because it's politics. What you describe as crisis for some of us, it's mainly, you know, the art of politicking. Everybody has interesting politics. Politics is not the it's not the family affair, especially when you have a political party as big as the people's democratic party. You have people with different tendencies. You have people with different different orientations. You know, you have people with different kinds of approaches to issues. And so what is going on for me is is a sign of a vibrant political party is a sign that, you know, everyone wants to be involved. Everyone wants to. Everyone feels that they are most qualified for positions, you know, but at the end of the day, what matters is that we all play by the rules and we all stay within the rules. What happened in legal state is not something that many of us are happy about. And we are laying our complaints, you know, through the agriculture, through the proper channels to, you know, our grievances. We are bringing it to the to the appeal panel, but to appeal panel who are bringing it to the NWC, taking it all the way to neck. And we are trying to explain that, you know, look, this thing cannot stand the way it stands. You shouldn't come out that way. So so that is in hand. But, you know, generally in politics, politics is an engagement of conflicts. Someone is coming from one direction. The other thing is coming from the other direction. You would have conflicts. You would have a clash of interests. And that's very normal. What is not normal, like I said, is when you do not play by the rules or when you do when you go beyond the rules. And example is what is actually not just it. For instance, you had a primaries. You had a Congress that was the venue was duly certified by NWC. I net was informed. I net was invited. Security forces were welcomed. They were invited. The entire electoral panel went to that Congress. I mean, we know much. If that's not something that I didn't make it. Now, you had another group of people who did not participate in that in that Congress, went somewhere else to another venue and then claimed, you know, that they have also produced the ungovernmental assurances and are now trying to use the cuts of law, you know, to to to win the ticket by back door metal. Of course, that's clearly not acceptable. That's not within the rules. The party rules are clear. You contest if you contest, you make your grievances known to the appeal panel. The appeal panel on that particular Congress was chaired by the National Chairman of the Party, Senator Dr. Iota Yu, he chaired the appeal panel. Dr. Mabayemi did not bring his complaints, but, you know, he's trying to use the cuts. And we have to say to the cluster, look, don't allow yourself to be used in this particular instance in Oshun State. The entire party structure is behind Senator Ademar Adelike and we wish him well. So what we turn crisis, basically, for us in the PDP, it's a sign of a healthy political party. It's a sign of a party coming alive, you know, coming more alive as elections drop user. You have various interests, those trying to push their positions forward. And that's basically what is happening. What happened in Lagos is not something that all of us, some of us are happy about. Chief Bonito is our supreme leader in Lagos State, is a foremost leader of the party and is somebody that we respect very much. And so what is being done to some of us who support him or who are with him is actually we feel quite aggrieved about it. But again, you know, it's politics, an element of conflict. And we will play the game by the rules of the game. When you talk about the fact that it's just politics, I'm trying to understand which part of it is supposed to be taken while sitting down because Chief Bodejad here is alleging that Avogi cannot win Lagos State for the PDP. He's even alleging that he might be a mole from the APC trying to crash the PDP within the state. Well, I mean, again, these are issues that we are working hard towards resolving. Do you think Avogi is a mole from the APC? Well, I personally don't have them. I haven't had much interaction with them over the years. So I cannot comment much about that. But I do know that, you know, Chief Bodejad is somebody who believes strongly in this political party and those of us who are his followers. We also believe strongly in this political party. And so if there are things that he has seen, then, you know, we have to. We agree with those things that because, you know, he is higher up, he sees a lot of things. He has been part of the Lagos establishment for much longer, even before some of us came into politics. And so if he says something is it, it is, then it is up to, you know, the other side to come out and clarify their positions by proving their loyalty to the People's Democratic Party. But as it stands today, the Lagos State Congress, what happened on that day was it was was was only missed, you know, basically was only missed. And we were trying to sort we were trying to sort it out. And at the end of the day, you know, we believe that a stronger and more viral People's Democratic Party will emerge from Lagos State. So talking about PDP fighting on all fronts. Now, there was supposed to be a meeting on Monday for the NEC, but then we saw that that next meeting was postponed because of some drama that happened at the National. In fact, we there was an upropt rescheduling of proceedings because according to reports, this uproar was triggered by some leaders in the south that had acts that those who defected from the APC into the party should not be given opportunities to pick up tickets to run for the elections in 2023. What's your position on this? And then I was doing to Darlington. Well, of course, you know, again, like I say in politics, I'm I'm I'm about six feet. If you ask me to to play the zoning of the political opposition, I will say give it to people who are both six feet. If I'm from the south, I'll try to play that to my advantage and say that, you know, zoning to the south, if I'm from the southwest, you know, which I am, I would try to play to my advantage by saying, give it to the southwest just so that I can imagine. I'll try to make sure that, you know, everything works in my favor, that the rules of the game are bent in my favor. But, you know, of course, at the end of the day, what we do know is that the Google Democratic Party is a totally democratic party. It is a party that believes strongly in Nigeria and it is a party that will provide a level playing ground for all the assurances to come out and contest, you know. So so I personally do not I do not align with the idea of zoning. And the reason is that the PDP has a political party, practice zoning all the while it was in power. And what PDP is no longer in power now and zoning is a construct of power. You don't zone what you are. If you do not have power, you cannot be thinking of zoning. So for me, it is it attempts to tie your hand twice, you know, the first one is that you are not in control of power. You are not in control of the federal policies, you are not in control of security, which are the very important crucial aspects of electionary in Nigeria. And then secondly, you want to tie yourself by zoning also. I think, you know, that will amount to PDP shooting itself in the foot. And of course, indications are that PDP is going to throw a level playing ground to everybody. But again, like I said, what is going on is that people are trying to zone things in their favor so that they might be the ones who will be the beneficiaries of it when in politics, you know, you try to bend the rules as much as possible so that, you know, you gain an edge over your opponent, you know, so that everything plays in your favor, basically. So that's what's going on in the People's Democratic Party. But like I said, it's a sign of a healthy and viral political party. It's a sign of a party that is coming more alive as trying to integrate constructs. And I'm very confident that what matters at the end of the day is that the party gets it right in terms of aligning with the wishes and aspirations of the majority of Nigerians. It's very clear that Nigerians are tired of the oppressive Congress. Nigerians are tired of the mission of the past seven years, eight years by 2023. Nigerians are tired of it. And so the onus is on the People's Democratic Party to produce a candidate that will be able to work in line with the desires of Nigerians. Back to you, Dalityn. And just to pick up from where he has just stopped, does the PDP have what it takes right now because, like I said, you're fighting on all fronts. It's... Yochaiyu is trying to douse tension almost everywhere he turns. And now the meeting of the NEC was abruptly cancelled and rescheduled because of the op-robe within the people in the south. And then let's quickly look at the former vice president here. He's spoken on the fact that losing the 2023 presidential election may end the PDP's reign ever in Nigeria. Again, he was also quoted to say that he's likely to get the ticket because he's never not been given the ticket to run for the PDP. Is former Vice President Atikua Bubakar the one to be able to win that presidential election for the PDP come 2023? First of all, Nigerians need to congratulate the PDP as a political party, a party that is not in power in the last about seven years now. He heard problems that will erupt in the party are quickly handled other than the uprogressive Congress that is in power and has all the confidantes of power of government within their domain, yet they could not organize ordinary convention since 2015 to date. It shows clearly that there are men of equitable characters. There are personalities in PDP that understand the proper definition of qualities and that understand at all times, especially during transition period like this, that there are a lot of issues that will crop up and needs to be handled. For instance, there was a crack yesterday, we agreed with you, but very quickly, we need to fix our acts and the next meeting is on. I'm aware that we're also aware that the next meeting is going on other than the other political parties would have taken them ages for them to come together. Again, I agree with the fact that the people of Nigeria are tired of these failed uprogressive Congress that made up promises to Nigerian people yet they would not keep to one. I agree that these are combination of people, aggrieved people or Nigerians that had only one soul agenda just grab the power and they don't know how to manage the power. Of course, like the average Nigerian we say, PDP does not need much campaign or PDP need is just to present a credible person than Nigeria's today. And my question is, do you think that former vice president Atikwa Buboka is that man? Because he seems to be, you know, parading himself as one who will be able to claim that ticket for the presidential elections come 2023? Of course, the answer is no from my part. You know, when a man speaks very authoritative as he has control of all the delegates in Nigeria, it does not have our own. But it's a grace of God. Some of us are delegates in that election and he cannot read our mindsets or decide how we are going to vote. In the last election, I didn't vote him. So he does not have the courage to decide that he will always win again. I'm sorry. You did not vote the PDP in the last election. Who did you vote? It was alarming at this point. I'm sorry. You just said something. You didn't vote for vice president, former vice president Atikwa Buboka in the last election. So who did you vote for? No, in the primaries. In the primaries, you know, I had prepared candidate in the primaries. I mean, it was a re-tambour of Sokoto State. But why he marches as the presidential candidate? Of course, we have no choice as party people. We rally grand support. And it is only in reverse state in all the practices of federation that especially in PDP states that APC will not record in 5%. The practices are there for you to change. It shows clearly that we are party people. That is to say that no matter how we may feel at the end of the primaries, if any person in march, of course, we are party people, there is nowhere to go to support the president. But the point I'm making here is that nobody can sit and talk to the president as if they have control of all the villages. Again, trial has been given before and they have seen the man called Atikwa. I'm not trying to run his personality to them. I'm saying that he's qualified like any other president. I'm also qualified to be the president of this country. That's the truth. But again, you do not speak to the president because you are not in the right sense of the people. Opportunity has been given to you in 2019. What happened? Elections will be won in a generation that cannot be won in Dubai. You can't put your own, you know, my chance has stayed at the end of the day. Because we are not the ITU people. At the end of the day, we stay away and teach others and they will carry out. Because we are playing practical politics. We are you, we're from a show of walking. And you must be here. Okay. All right. Finally, I'm coming back to you. Do you think that Vice President Atikua Bubakar needs to be sensitive when he's responding to issues about clinching the party ticket come 2023 because he seems to be very vocal about it. I mean, there seem to be a little bit of... I think... He seems to be very sure. And that shorty was also in the tone of his voice. I think Vice President Atikua Bubakar is a man who has been in politics for a long time. He was, as of 1989, he was on his way to becoming Governor of Adamawa State before he was stopped up to be Vice President at that time. And he stood up for his then deputy to become the Governor at that time, a Christian Governor in Adamawa State. I think a lot of people are allowing emotions to get into this issue of military politics all around the single personality of Vice President Atikua Bubakar. He is somebody who picks his words very carefully. When he speaks publicly, he's not somebody he cannot be said to be flippant, you know? You cannot see that Vice President Atikua Bubakar. You can't see he's picking fights with different people. You really find him in that kind of conversation. And what happens is that people usually talk about him because, you know, he is a political issue. He is the former Vice President. He is the former presidential president. Does that mean that he has everybody in the party at his whims and caprices? Because that's how he sounded. So, again, with all of you reeling out his CV, does it mean that he's the only one within the party that's going to claim the ticket? And where's the place for internal democracy within the People's Democratic Party? The internal democracy will play out as it always does within the PDP. The last time in 2019, VP Atikua returned to the party and in less than six months, he claims the party ticket by winning over 50% of the votes. That was when he was also returning to the political party. And so, even for a political strategist like myself, looking at the numbers, somebody who returned to the party within six months, he not only claims the ticket, he won it with over 50% of delegate votes, over 1,600 votes. I won 1,673 votes at that time, I believe. 670,000, but over 50% of the votes, okay? So, he agreed with the party for this title, for this young. It is only natural that you expect that there will be a certain measure of confidence. And look, it is nothing strange in politics. Even if I'm running for president, do you expect me to come out and say that I'm not going to win the ticket? If I'm sort of not listening, OG is contesting for president, like you said, you think it is, right? Will he say that, oh, I would not win? Of course, you'll be saying that you would win. So, that's how I will go. Again, that's politics. It's politics for you. He's only projecting an air of confidence. And I see the reason why anyone should have issues with that, especially within the people's democratic party. Well, we'll see how it plays out, all fingers crossed. So, I want to say thank you. Darlings and OG is the PDP and also we have been joined by Demolat Olariwadjuhi is a chieftain and a strategist with the People's Democratic Party here in Lagos State. Thank you so much, gentlemen, for being part of the conversation. Thank you very much. All right. Thank you very much. Well, thank you all for staying with us. We'll take a short break now. And when we come back, we focus on the continuous or rising insecurity in the South East and what the governors are doing about it. Stay with us. Thank you very much.