 Hi everyone, so glad you could join us for another episode of Most Powerful Woman in Sports, where the world's greatest marketers, media pros, athletes and coaches share their remarkable journeys to achieving peak performance. We'd also like to hear from you so join in the conversation in the chat and questions in the Q&A box. Today we're speaking with WWE Chief Brand Officer Stephanie McMahon. We'll talk about Steph's remarkable career and family legacy in sports entertainment and blazing a trail for women in the squared circle and in the front office. But first, some background on Steph. The WWE literally is in Steph's DNA. She is the fourth generation McMahon to carry on her family's tradition as a promoter, entertainer and business executive. She got her start early modeling t-shirts in middle school and then stepped into the ring herself. Steph also held down office jobs starting as receptionist, worked in sales and then headed up WWE's creative, including storylines. In 2013, Steph became the brand's chief brand officer. Stephanie, welcome to the show. It's so great to have you. Thank you. It's so great to be here. I'm hitting my video button. It's not okay. Now I can start my video. There you are. Now I can see you. Hey, welcome. So yes, thank you. Thank you so much for having me, Lisa. Of course. So you are like a true multi hyphenate. I want you to tell me a little bit how you got your start in the family business. You really started, first of all, this is like fourth generation, right? It is. My great grandfather was primarily a boxing promoter in New York City, disowned by his Irish immigrant parents because they wanted him to be a doctor or a lawyer, not a promoter. Then my grandfather was boxing and wrestling, and then my father came in and really took it over and made it, you know, the global media organization that we are today. I didn't even have a choice but to get involved. I mean, it's literally in your blood. I mean, did you seriously, did you ever think I'd want to do something else in my career or this was just like I was born to do this. I've always wanted to be a part of my family's business because to me it was a way to give back. You know, my parents were really busy growing wwe. And my mom was the CEO, and my dad was really running all of the creative my father is now the chairman and CEO. But it was a way for me to really contribute. You know, they were always on the road they were always working and I was, we didn't have a nanny, you know, at that time so I was with them and I was listening to the conversations and I was learning more than I realized at the time also just even watching our programming. I was learning about the psychology of the in ring product itself, because I've always been a fan, first and foremost but absolutely I had a choice. And I remember I was walking around, we have a pool and I was walking around the pool with my dad and I was about 1617 and he said so, you know, you're going to be going off to college soon have you thought about what it is you want to do, you know, for the rest of your life for a living and I looked at him. Like he had three heads and he said why are you looking at me like that and I said that I want to be a part of the business that I mean I've always been a part of the business I've worked reception while I was in high school like I was a child model as you mentioned I want to be here. And he was surprised and he says to this day he doesn't know why he was surprised but pleasantly so thank goodness. Do you think because well actually your, your mother was CEO so it wasn't because you were a girl, a girl at the time. That's interesting, but and your brother also is part of, part of this too. Yes, yeah, go ahead. But and he was more involved and it was always assumed. So I do think there was a little bit of that it was assumed that Shane my brother would go into the family business. And then at one point in time my brother actually retired from WWE and was starting his own business. And, and he is now back as a performer and then various forms or fashions so it's it's interesting you know family business is is wonderful in a lot of ways and it's challenging in a lot of ways. I have to ask before we get into it. What was going on at your house was there like total body slamming between you and your brother was like, I mean it must be a serious thing. And I was on the receiving end because he's seven years older. And he told me he was always going to be bigger and he was always going to be stronger so I just resolved to be smarter. But you actually did get into the ring tell me about that experience. What was that like. Well, I was forbidden to train to because I think there was a feeling a concern a legitimate concern that I was going to get hurt. But as I became an onscreen character and I really became this villain, you know which was the way the audience wanted to take me. They love to hate me I hope I hope that their first parts true. You know I needed to learn how to fall appropriately without hurting myself, you know because what we do requires a tremendous skill set. And eventually I was able to convince them and I started training. And I've been in, you know, maybe, maybe a dozen matches throughout my career I wouldn't call myself an accomplished professional wrestler. I played some very high profile matches because of my persona the character I play is the boss's daughter but I play like a super evil version of the boss's daughter taking a image of everybody. But I would say the hardest, or I guess the most lessons learned was when I faced Ronda Rousey, who is the first ever female UFC champion she meddled in Judica was the first American to do so. And that was her first match. She may not have been as skilled at pulling her punches, you know, at that point, not since he hit me as hard as she could because if she did I wouldn't have gotten up but that was, that was a real experience training with Ronda for three months getting ready for that match at WrestleMania. Man, I bet and so there's obviously a lot of training that goes on behind the scenes I mean it's very physical. So you got into this you did the stage what was it, what was it like being on stage at WWE match. Like before that match with Ronda or just in general. In general like when you went on stage what was that like seeing the audience and that whole experience. Well, I think I'm a natural ham. You know I've been in school place since I was a kid. I love to perform. But what I love the most about WWE is the interaction with our fans with our audience. I think WWE is truly one of the original interactive brands, even if you think all the way back to the days of the Roman Coliseum where the emperor would decide the gladiator state based on the reaction of the crowd. And the audience really influences what we do in the ring whether it's physical or whether it's verbal and if they're not responding if they're cheering great if they're booing great if they're silent. Not great. Yeah, it's important to listen to the silence to right because you have to know it's not working and then be able to pivot on a dime. So there's there's a lot of improv but I love the energy of it. I love connecting with the audience I love taking them on a ride or surprising them or getting them or they get me it's like it's the best. What would you say would be the biggest misperception about the WWE. I think there's various misperceptions, you know throughout the years. You know, actually come to a show, and you have the opportunity and Lisa you had the opportunity to experience it. And you can see, you know, this is a business first and foremost, like the in ring product itself are highly trained skilled professional athletes there it's more of a performance art, because it really is about eliciting a reaction from the crowd, you know, you want to take them on a ride, not unlike any other, you know, movies sitcom etc. It's it's protagonists versus antagonists with conflict resolution the only difference is our conflicts are settled inside the ring. But I would say just from a business perspective, you know, we're the number one sports channel on YouTube the fifth most watched YouTube channel in the world. We are number one right now on tick tock number one sports brand neck and neck with the NBA but we're number one right now. We have nine out of the top 15 most followed female athletes across all social media platforms are WWE superstars. We have, you know, our streaming deal with peacock domestically we have our core programming airing on USA and Fox broadcast network. We're in 180 countries and 20 different languages I mean this is a business we have deals with any Netflix Blumhouse you know we're really. It's a multimedia company and it's so I don't know that everybody knows that. You know all of those facts about our business and absolutely it's it's who we are. I mean, just, yes, you pointed out and thank you for that invitation I brought my 14 year old son to Smackdown in MSG and that was incredible and it almost seems like it's like that you're inside a video game almost but you see the physicality that goes on it's it's I mean it's acting but it's real at the same time like these guys. I don't know how they they feel after a match but it's intense but so so just to get back on to your career you went from from the ring back into the front office and what what was it like developing those muscles those business muscles that that you eventually, you know obviously grew into. Sure, well I, it's kind of all happened simultaneously so I became an on screen character at the same time I was working in sales and I was in accounting. I wasn't a high ranking sales person but I was on television so it gave me a little bit of star power you know when I was walking into those rooms, but I was terrible at it. I was not mature enough, I don't think, and you know this company is so much more to me than just a company it represents my family and it's like everything I believe in and I'm so passionate about it. So when I had people who, you know just didn't even care to listen not even necessarily that they had a preconceived notion I was all mad about it and that's not helpful in business you're going to get turned down a lot, you know you have to you have to be able to have it and take it and smile and be gracious and you know be persistent in all the right ways and those were some lessons I had to learn, but also, you know the transition I was used to live event production. And so I was used to late nights, really hard deadlines, you know you don't want to miss the headline no matter what, but especially when you're doing live television you can't we have an expression nothing goes wrong if it's live. That was something I had to learn as well that you know not everybody operates at that speed and pace and you know everything else and you know again I had to. I had to I had to learn a lot of lessons from a lot of feedback from people about you know the best way to operate in a corporation versus in a live production and ultimately it's like a blend. Did you feel that you were getting, I have a feeling you weren't getting special treatment there but were people harder on you because of it or was your father more demanding, because you were part of this family business and legacy. I think my father despises nepotism. And there's no way not to, you know, look at things that way I'm the I'm the boss's daughter, you know, so I do believe it is harder, the closer you are, you know, to, well at least in my family that the closer, you know that I am to my dad the harder it is in business the more you have to prove yourself. Yeah, but he has instilled in my mom did to those lessons every single day you have to earn respect every single day. Your name doesn't allow you respect you have to earn it. And I think that's true no matter where you work. But in terms of you know other executives in the company. I don't know that they weren't necessarily harder on me I think they're in a tough spot. You know family business is tricky, you know how are they going to give me feedback how do they know I'm not going to, you know, go do the wrong thing and find their back you know so it's so it's tough. Yeah. And you also not only tried sales or worked in sales but you also are on the creative side. And you wrote you were ahead of creative you wrote the story lines for some time. What was that like and how did that help. It seems like you took sales and creative and blended that into your current job I mean that's what being a chief brand officer is. What was that like being on the creative side. And creative is what I love the most. I am a storyteller at heart, and I think that, you know, most marketers, most people in brands, you know, understand that right because Maya Angelou has this beautiful quote people will never remember what you said they'll never remember what you did but they'll always remember how you made them feel and storytelling is about feeling it's about generating an emotion and an emotional connection with your audience. That's one of the key lessons that I learned on the creative writing side and it applies to absolutely everything in business. But when I left sales to go work on the creative writing team I was told by Vince. I call him Vincent business he's dad at home. It was where to first it's not anymore it's super helpful, but I was telling him at that time, or he was telling me rather. How much you love the creative, maybe in a couple of years you'll become a manager, you know, and you'll, you'll work your way up. And I honestly manager never even crossed my mind I was just happy to be a part of the team, and especially the core, the creative But that's everything. And within two weeks, the head writer quit. And I was told congratulations over the team I had never managed a team before never managed people a lot of learning on the fly there. And, and so that's that's what happened and I was told you're either going to sink or swim and it's trial by fire. I remember those two expressions very clearly. Yeah. So what do you what do you see now that you've been in a CBO for some time. What has been the hardest part of being in that role and what are some of the most rewarding parts of it. Well, for me, you know, it's funny because I don't ever put myself in a box. You know, I never think of myself only as one thing and what I believe is, you know, we're all brand ambassadors, I'm the chief brand officer but every employee should be the chief brand You know, hopefully if we're doing our jobs right, you know, we're, they're evangelizing naturally because they love the company they believe in what we do. And I think our fans is the same way. So, you know, I think it's, it's challenging to navigate a lot of what's happening in the world today, and the messaging and what to say and what not to say and how to do it correctly. And that's a huge challenge that all marketers and folks in brand are really feeling and who are you and what do you stand for. And at the end of the day, our mission is to put smiles on people's faces. Like that's, that's it and it's most simplistic. We are here to put smiles on people's faces. That's why when COVID happened initially, it wasn't a question of if but how we were going to stay on the air for our audience. You know, how are we going to provide and and our partners, but how are we going to provide some type of levity some type of escape. When I think about Connor Mahalek who was an eight year old WWE fan who lost his fight with pediatric cancer, and his dad telling me how watching raw and smack down every single week gave them that escape that they needed. When they came to the live event, it was just a couple of hours, but to be for him to be able to look at his son and see his son not suffer. Because he's just enjoying what he's watching. I mean that's such a gift and such a privilege to be a part of a brand that can do that. Yeah, absolutely. What about your kids? Are they going to get into the family business? We'll see. So my oldest and my youngest are the most interested for those who don't know I have three girls they are 1513 and 11. My middle daughter has absolutely zero interest. She has sat in the front row of WrestleMania reading a book. My youngest isn't is like, it's the Vaughn show her name is Vaughn and I mean, she is incredible and she has the personality for sure they all do. And then Aurora, my oldest has trains. He's trained to wrestle. She really, really wants to get in the ring. But she also told me and my husband when she was about eight years old, she said, Mama, I don't want your job. Daddy, I don't want your job. I want Pops job, which was just awesome. Like here's young girl who just like knows what she wants and she is going to go after it. That's awesome. So what kind of advice would do you give your daughters or would you give people listening and who especially for women who are interested in making a career and what what what was once and you know very traditional men sport now and just generally with with sports. Women are trying to break in and every every role. What do you have to offer them advice. Well, I think now is a unique time. I think that, you know, organizations are looking at gender equality a lot different they're looking at equality in general a lot differently and that gives us, you know, more of an opportunity, quite frankly to be seen. I think we can't be afraid, you know, to put our name in the hat, even if your job description doesn't put, you know, line up exactly. That's okay. Put your name in the hat, believe in yourself, know that you can do it and and work incredibly hard. I mean, that's what I always tell my girls is you can do anything in the world you want to do you can be anything, but you have to believe in yourself. You have to work really really hard at it and never give up. You know, I think that's important too. And that's not to say that every job is right you might be in a job and it doesn't feel right to you and you want to make a pivot that's fine. Yeah, you know, but but I think that to go after it, you know, I think that's the first thing, know that you can do it your skill sets apply, even if it's not again a literal translation. Okay, now we have one one last question we're going to go a little longer because there's there's a bunch of questions coming in and they're good. So here's one, if hopefully you don't have a meeting in just a few minutes but I'm sure you could wait. I'm your. All right, cool. So is CBO for the biggest wrestling company do you feel pressure to represent the industry as a whole, as well as WWE. Great question. And I think yes, you know, ultimately. And, you know, especially when I talk about the women's evolution that's happened in our business. Of course, a lot of what I'm talking about is WWE but I've seen it extend and evolve way beyond WWE and it happened because of every single woman who has ever stepped foot into what we call the squared circle throughout time. No matter what, what company they worked for decades ago, even back in the days of the carnivals, like those women, and I can't imagine the hardships that they endured it during those times but it takes every single woman, the sacrifices that they've made going on the tours, leaving the children behind just trying to make a name for themselves. And, and ultimately, you know, yes, we were able to do it in WWE and it's happening all around the world and I'm so proud to be a part of that. Yeah, so I don't know if it's necessarily pressure, you know, to represent these other organizations or the history of it I think it's more more of a privilege to be able to do that. But doing that, of course, within the WWE itself, there's more women in the ring. Are you also trying to change the front office culture? Is that already well underway? That's already well underway. We've had, you know, various female executives in super high ranking positions. Our CFO right now is a woman by the name of Christina Salem, who's just remarkable. We've had, you know, in the past our co-president was a woman or is a woman, and her name is Michelle Wilson. We have various different, you know, senior vice presidents, whether that's Sarah Cummins who's in charge of CPG or it's Claudine Lillian who's in charge of sales and sponsorships, you know, we really do have various women at different roles all throughout the organization. So absolutely, it's important. Okay, all right. Well, I could go on forever, but I'm not, I'm not, I'm going to let you get back to work. But before I do, I want to point out that you host your own live stream show with female quotient founder Shelly Zallas called Women in the Business of Sports. It's really great. Where can people find it? And when are you doing the next one? Well, the next one's not booked yet. Okay, please. It'll for mid-November, but it's on the female quotient LinkedIn and the female quotient Facebook pages. Thank you for the plug, though. Of course, of course. It's been a remarkable opportunity to really highlight all of the different aspects of business around sports, because there's the athletes, there's the referees in some cases, the trainers, then there's the executives, then there's the brands and the media. And it takes everybody, all of us coming together, not just women but men too, you know, to really drive the impact and the change that we want to make in the industry. And one of the key focus areas I think is really media. You know, currently it's like 4% of media time is spent on women's sports and we have to change that. Absolutely. Well, I'm really going to be interested in hearing your takeaways given how much you've already looked into this area of women in sports. So let's hear what you've got. Absolutely. So the first one is a lesson I actually learned from Miral Javadafar, who is a trainer for the Tampa Bay Bucks, and that's to be intentional. Right, and it's so smart, it's so simple, but be very intentional in everything that you're doing. You know, it's all about goal setting, right, and driving to those goals, but be intentional. And then the lesson I always tell my kids and everybody else is to believe in yourself. You can do it. Don't be a victim. You know, I think so many times we have this victim mentality of all the things that we've all lived through and every individual has lived through a lot of things in their life. You have to believe in yourself and your ability to do something. And then, you know, work ethic. And it's funny, Dwayne Johnson, the rock who also came from WWE, all the time his his merch it says be the hardest worker in the room. And that's what you have to do be the hardest worker in the room and I would add and the smartest. But you have to have a strong work ethic, if you're really going to be able to achieve the goals that you want to set for yourself. Okay, well stuff. Thank you so much. This was awesome. And always a pleasure to be speaking to you. Hope we can do this again soon. And so thank you for joining us. Next up will be NHL CMO Heidi Browning. See you back here on November 10.