 It's a show devoted to all things eSports. I'm your host, Catherine Norr. Today we're talking about Team 7AM and European Professional eSports. My guest is John Smith-Howell, the Managing Director of Team 7AM. Welcome, John. Hi, thanks, Catherine. It's great to have you back. I know you were on a bit ago last month to talk about the eSports Trade Association, but now we're going to talk about Team 7AM. Tell us about the team. Yeah, so we're a European eSports organisation, mainly concentrating on professional and competitive play, but we wanted to ensure that we had a community vibe and feel about us as that's something that's really important to us. We've been going for just over two years now, and we've seen tremendous growth in that last two years, which has been fantastic. And we're continuing to grow. We have more game titles and more teams than we've ever had before. And new sponsors and supporters, which is fantastic. So did Brexit impact you at all? Absolutely not. That's good. And you're located in England then? Yes, yes, I am, yeah. All right. So let me ask you, why did you name it Team 7AM? So actually, it was purely just for marketing. So I've been in the eSports industry for a long, long time. And I knew and seen that eSports and business were coming closer and closer together, and that eSports wasn't just about teams anymore and sort of playing with friends and competing, but actually it was moving into this business space. So when I wanted to create a brand, we wanted it to be something that was easy to say, easy to remember, and have a logo and a brand that was easy associated to us, taking in inspiration from the McDonald's and the Burger Kings and all these high street chains that you only have to see their logo and you know exactly who that brand is. And that's what we did. We took inspiration from that and created something short snappy. And yeah, this is it, Team 7AM. Do eSports athletes actually get up that early? I think they're more likely to go to bed at that time than get up at that time. That's what I thought. And so what game does Team 7AM play? So currently we're competing in League of Legends, Valorant, Rainbow Six, and Counter-Strike Global Offensive. Okay, and how many teams do you have? We have five teams. And are they professional or pro-am or how does that work? So our League of Legends team, the main team are professional. We have an academy team that back those up. Again, to just encourage bringing in those academy players, getting them up to speed and where we want them to be and then getting them into our main team. Our Counter-Strike team also play at professional level and so do our Valorant. Our Rainbow Six team are sort of, you know, just getting there. I would say they're probably at the semi-pro stage at the minute, but they're really fighting hard to get up there. And are you only playing in Europe or are you playing all over the world? So currently we're just playing all over Europe and of course, you know, the end goal is to be playing internationally. Okay, and what kind of tournaments have you been playing in the past year and how have you been doing? So the biggest tournament that currently we've played so far is probably one called the Belgium League for League of Legends. It's a European regional league and it's the only way that a team can fight for a spot into the European Masters. And so that is an invitation only league. There's only six spots in our league and we're very lucky to have an invitation there. We didn't do too well this season, unfortunately. We did finish last of our group. It was a very tough season for our team. That split has just finished and then we are now preparing for the summer split, which will start at the beginning of June. For our Valorant team, they have been playing all of the new European tournaments. Obviously Valorant is still a fairly new title on the scene and has seen the humongous growth from every aspect. So they're playing every tournament they can, including the Masters tournament, the VCT. So are your teams made up of only men or do they include women as well? So currently all of our players are male. We do have females in the organisation, but to us it doesn't matter if they're male or female, if they have the skill, the ability and the mindset that we would like, then it doesn't matter who they are to us, and they fit our brand, it's not a problem. Terrific, and so we always hear that no players are usually between the ages of 18 and 25. Is that the case with your team? Yeah, everybody, I would say maybe there's one or two players that sit outside of that, but predominantly between 18 and 25, all of our players. If we're to see that at some point the players will be older, or do you think it's always going to be between those ages? I mean, like my generation, I started playing in 1999, so I was well within that bracket, and then I still continue to play after 25, but you slowly but surely realise that you can't keep playing, you can't keep dedicating the same amount of time that maybe you did before, obviously things like careers and kids and girlfriends and relationships always get in the way. So ultimately you start to look at other areas of working with any sports. I think that gap will extend both ways, especially down as we were seeing a huge influx of the younger players that are coming in, especially within games like Fortnite, but that's expanding very, very quickly. I think in the next few years that it will be the norm to see 15-year-olds to sort of 25, 26, competing full-time within eSports. And what is your role with Team 7AM? So I'm one of the co-founders and I'm the managing director. So I lead from the front and try my best to guide and pull all of the strings in the same direction to try and drive and push the business forward. And what other player, I mean, what other personnel are involved? I mean, you have coaches and whatever. Yeah, like I said before, eSports is now a business. So like any sort of normal business that you would see, we have a senior team that makes up of different managers. We have project managers and team managers, and then we have coaches and sort of operations people that just support and get involved with anything they can. We have a community manager. So it's not too different from any of the sort of businesses you see out there. You know, we still have to do all the normal things and have a marketing department and look at graphics design and social media and brand awareness. We still have to have an accountant. So it's not too abnormal from a normal external business, really. And are your players, are they streaming as well as playing? Some do some do stream and some just play. I think there's still a huge gap between people that want to do both. A lot of the time that's hardware based. It's it's quite tough to stream on and play on one PC. A lot of the top streamers will have a PC that just streams and then they play on the secondary PC so that they don't have any hardware issues. So I think they're still quite mixed with with who can stream and play at the same time. So do you have tryouts or what are your criteria for selecting play? So we will hold tryouts, but most of the time we will scout individuals before that. And then we will go approach those individuals. We go through an interview and selection process like you would do for a normal job interview. We really want to understand their their mental health, their what they want to achieve, you know, what do they want to do? Are they just playing for fun? Do they want to compete? Do they want to go all the way? And these things are really important to us and where we can fit them into our team. And then, yeah, once we have a pool of of candidates as such, we will then do some tryouts and see who who can walk the walk. So why is mental health important? It's absolutely crucial. I think it's one of the most important things that you can take in consideration. Anybody that doesn't say that esports and playing competitively isn't stressful to me is lying. It's extremely stressful. And the reason mental health is so important is because there is a process of learning. You need to lose games to learn and losing is not easy. Whatever you do in life, people don't like losing board games of monopoly. Let alone losing competitive games that they're playing against other people or people that they know. And it's how you deal with that loss. It's what you do with it, how you process that process that in your mind and how you reflect on that. And that comes from mental strength and having the support of people around you like myself who have who have played at that level and been around for so long to to support them mentally. Let them know that is OK to have down days. It isn't. It doesn't mean that you're not good enough. It means that you're mentally tired and you need to take a break. And sometimes you just need to structure the way that you practice. Sure. And we do have a question from a viewer. Can you explain how someone making someone makes a living as an esports gamer? Do you live off the money you make from winning competitions? Do you get sponsored? And so was that as a player? Sorry, was that as an esports organization? Player as a player. So as a player, you would you would start to rely on a salary. So our League of Legends team will be our salary. So they will get a salary every month, like you would do in a normal job. Esports salaries aren't on the greatest at the minute, unless you're playing sort of wild class tier one events. Then, of course, the salaries are fantastic. But so is the pressure that goes with that. So initially, you would you would you would get some sort of salary. You would then get a percentage of any prize money you win, depending on who you play for and what organization and what agreement is in place. But most of them will most players will still back that up with another job, a part time job, or maybe they're in education so they don't need to work and they're living at home or in a good environment to be able to put the time in. Sure. And you how does that team make a living with shifted over to the team? Is that sponsorship and primarily? Absolutely. Ninety percent, if not more, has to come. The revenue has to come from sponsorships. It's still the big question that we have in eSports that is unanswered is how else do we monetize eSports? You know, sponsors is a fantastic way. And it's it's currently really the only way that we can achieve that. There is other revenues that will start to come in over the next few years, including TV rights, as we start to move into more towards the traditional sports and you have these huge TV channels who are picking up games in the vent. They're going to have to pay out TV rights, which will cause a big issue for Twitch, who, of course, you know, don't pay out at all when they're streaming or games. And so that will see a shift in that. But currently it is it is mainly just sponsorships. You can't rely on income from tournaments because you don't know if they're going to win. Of course, you can sell merchandise and that will also bring some profit in. But essentially, you want to try and keep your your prices down so that you can sell and have the have your supporters and fans be able to actually wear your merchandise rather than rely on that to make profit. And do you have any team houses? Not at the minute, no. So everyone lives independently, but do they practice together or with covid? Are they just practicing online? So everything is done online at the minute and has done, obviously, for the for the last sort of 18 months during covid. Of course, within the next year or two, we would love to get a gaming house and get teams together. And of course, arrange bootcamps so that our players can can ultimately meet and train and practice together and build that better bond and relationship. How has the pandemic affected your organisation? So it's going to sound quite horrible, but actually it's helped us massively. I think what it's done is it's it's shown the the retail world and the world that didn't have a digital presence. Before covid, that if you don't have a digital presence and you're relying on retail sort of sales or walk past your store sales that actually you don't have a business because people can't walk past and they can't walk into your store. So we've seen this huge insurgement of companies who now want to get involved in eSports when getting involved in digital presence. And for me, there is no better industry to rely on for that. With the eSports and the gaming communities have been with the first on the Internet and we've been doing this for a long, long time. There isn't a better industry that knows this as good as we do and how to engage and really put someone's brand where they need it in front of the potential buyers of whatever that may be. And as gaming has been around for so long and people of my age generation who is who are still playing as they're involved, well, we need cars and houses and house insurance and every other product that you can imagine that would normally you would see in a TV advert. We can now do that online because they're not watching TV. They're watching their screens and it's that transition period that we're going through. How important do you think the Gen Z market is to advertisers? Because I know that eSports really attracts younger people. But it tracks it. I think it tracks everybody. And I think if you look at the statistics from in the United States and from Europe, there is a huge percentage of people that sit between 25 and 35. And, you know, that is a prime market. Most of these most people within the age bracket have a career. They have a job. They have an income. They have disposable income. These are the these are the people that we really want to aim to. And that is that. And that's what we what brands are going to get to. That's what we need to advertise to. It's really important that everybody's involved. Of course, the younger generation as well, because we can also advertise to them, whatever that may be new games that come out or of anything really. No, is Team Seven AM selling merchandise as well? Yes, we currently just sell this jersey that I'm wearing now. And but we will be bringing out new new merchandise over the next couple of months, maybe some caps or some hoodies. Not sure yet. So tell us more about what it was like to actually be a professional player. It was it was really fun. It was pressured. It was but it was stressful as well. You almost it's like having an outer body experience because everything else continues on behind you, but your mind and your focus is only on what you're doing on a day to day and practice and developing your skills and reflecting on what happened yesterday. What am I going to train today? I played Counter-Strike. So for me, it was about developing and continues developing my aim, my reactions, my thought process about what I could do differently. I was always the in-game leader for my team. So I also needed to think about strategy and how we can overcome enemies and how we did that and taking consideration how my players and my teammates, how they play, what are their strengths and what are their weaknesses. So that was really tough. But I've made some fantastic friends. I think I could travel most of the world and land in most countries and have somebody that I could go and visit. I'm from someone that I know or have played with or have communicated with over the years. I don't think I would ever have a bigger friend base than I would have ever imagined without being any sports. And what advice would you give to upcoming potential professional players? I would say structure. It's really, really important that you have structure to your day. If you want to get out of bed at nine o'clock and start practicing, that's absolutely fine. But structure your day. So you practice maybe for an hour, an hour and a half, structure what that practice is. I'll take Counter-Strike as an example because it's something obviously that I know in and out. If you're going to practice your aim, then do that for 30 minutes, then do something else, then perhaps maybe practice your reactions. Then do something else, review a demo of something you did previously. Take a break, ensure that you're then going out, going out for walks, get some fresh air, come back, start again. Don't just sit there for eight hours straight practicing and playing because you won't actually improve. And then when you look back and you think, well, I'm not improving, I must be bad. It's not that. It's that the structure that you're placing is bad. You can structure it correctly. It's like learning at school. You don't learn at school for doing it 10 hours a day. It's structured into small sessions and then you have a break and then you have more sessions. It's the exact same process to get your brain to learn and this have this muscle memory. Just structure it out, take breaks and always, always review everything you're doing and think, how can I do this better? Okay, because if you just keep doing it the same way, you're not really improving, right? Well, this is it. And this is what Albert Einstein said, that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and getting the same results. So don't do the same thing over and over again because you are going to get the same results. You need to adapt and to change and try something new. And if you're playing for a team and you're in a practice game or a scrim or whatever you call it, depending on where you're from, those games aren't to win. It's the biggest mistake that every team makes. They go into these practice matches and they want to win. It's not there to win. It's there to learn. The only games you need to win are the league games and the official games. Everything else doesn't matter. It's all a learning process. Sure. And it kind of reminds me of being a triathlete and a swimmer for years. And I would go to the pool and I would focus on a session. I would just focus on how my hand entered the water or how some little thing about the head was positioned or kicked off the wall. And I would just really focus on these little minute things. And so it sounds like that's to become better as a player in East, or you could focus on these, break it apart and focus on these small skills. Is that right? Yeah, absolutely right. It's really important to break it down and to focus on those smaller elements. I think it will take counter-strike if you're playing deathmatch and you're practice with guns that you don't normally play with. Everybody will practice with the AK-47 or the M4 or the Desert Eagle because they are the standard sort of guns that everybody uses. But there'll be a situation where you need to pick up a weapon from perhaps an enemy that you're not used to playing with. What are you going to do with it if you're not good with it? So do something different. I'm sure that other people's weaknesses are your strengths and you will see much more improvement from doing that. And also in anticipating other movements of the other player. Yeah, it's really crucial and the only way to do that is just by keep playing and reviewing what you're doing. So why did they do that movement? What could you do differently? Should have you have took your time? Should have you have rushed further? There was some utility that you had that you didn't use. Again, another vital piece of information. If you're in counter-strike, if you've died and you're dead and you still had utility, well then why? Why aren't you using that to support your movements or to support your team's movement? It's not all about you. It's a team game. You've got some utility but your friend hasn't used it to their advantage. Maybe they have something you don't. Maybe he has a sniper rifle. Well then let's prioritise your teammate. It's a one-shot kill if he's using the AWP. So that should be our absolute priority to get to use as our weapon. That is our big weapon. Let's use our utility to support him because he will get those kills and ultimately we win the round. And you win rounds, you win games. So we have another question from the book. Does everyone have a role in gaming teams? For example, someone on offense and another on defense? Yeah, everybody has a role. I don't think there's too many games that I can think of that someone hasn't really got a good role. Whether those roles are variables and they will move and shift, I think there's a possibility, but in Counter Strike they tend to, and League of Legends, you tend to have one specific role that you concentrate on. And I would say that if you don't know what that role is, you need to review the style of player that you are. So again, taking Counter Strike, if you're somebody that's really aggressive and you like to run and do things really fast, well then you need to be an entry fragger. You need to be right at the front of that team and you're pushing in and you're driving that team forward. If you don't mind sitting back and taking your time and you have patience, well then maybe you should be lurking and waiting for that enemy to come to you. Every role is important. The best thing you can do is find out what role you're best at and how that then fits into another team. Sure. And I know you have a coach to what makes for a good coach? Support. Players are stressed, you know, mentally they're tired and you know a coach needs to be there as a friend. The coach is if you have a five man team, he's the sixth player. He is on the team, he is supporting the team, he is helping them and guiding them. He is there to show and to show you the things that you've missed that you didn't see. He can review your demos for you, review your gameplay, maybe help you with communication issues. The coach is a sixth player. He's just not on the field when you're playing those games, but he's just as important outside of those games. So tell me about European eSports right now. I know that Europe has been hard hit by COVID. How is European eSports doing now and what is its future? So European eSports is doing really well. I think we have a fantastic talent pool, probably one of the best in the world in most games. I think the biggest issue we face in Europe is funding. Lots of businesses are very reluctant to invest and when they do invest, they invest much smaller amounts than the United States, for example. And that is something that's been proven recently with League of Legends that the LCS has huge investments and huge money, but no talent pool, whereas the LEC has huge talent pool but no money. And that's a big problem we have in Europe. It's where that funding is coming from because businesses seem to be reluctant to invest currently. Do you think that that's changing or will change in the future? I think it will have to change as more global businesses get involved who are willing to invest in anybody in Europe or in the United States because they can. They have to join and get on the boat or they're going to be left behind and that's the choice that they're going to have to make. So I think it will change and there's TV rights and deals start to come into place. That will change. And I'll let you tell us how people can find you and get in touch with you and then we'll have to wrap it up. Okay, so on our website team7am.com or our Twitter at team 7am. They're probably our best socials that you can kind of reach us on and then you can join a discord. Feel free to come and say hello and yeah, engage with us. Fantastic. Well, John, thank you so much for being on the wide world resource today. Thank you. All right. And so, thank you to our viewers who sent in the questions and thank you for joining me. Make sure to tune in next week. My guest will be Dr. Christian Kusmetsch, an Austrian neuroscientist. We'll talk about new technology applied to training esports players.