 Welcome to Hard Questions, where we gather pastors together to take on your tough questions and answer them right from the Bible. I'm Tom Hollis, the moderator, and today our panelists include Dr. William Maw Glaze, Bethany Baptist Church in Pittsburgh, Ray Hypel, Providence Presbyterian Church in Robinson Township, Pete Giacalone, South Hills Assembly Guide Church, Bethel Park, PA, Anthony Gilbert pastor of another level ministries in the North Hills. Well, pastors, thank you for being with us today. We're going to talk about sex and marriage. I said sex and marriage. Yes, I did. Okay, we've got, and we're going to start with a YouTube question, guys. And you know what? I just want to say this, YouTube is a great way to leave your questions at the seat cornerstone. There's a lot on there, so you should sign up for YouTube. But here comes a question through there. It says we have formal marriage ceremonies now, but I'd like to ask about those marriages and biblical times like Abraham and Sarah, Isaac and Rebecca, Jacob and Rachel. How did they, how did they get married in God's eyes? Did they have a formal ceremony or exchange of vials like we do now? Genesis 2467 talks about Isaac brought Rebecca into his tent and she became his wife. This confuses me, especially comparing to living together today. What about those couples who have lived together 10 years with children now? Are they sitting against God? What is the difference between Old Testament marriages in those times versus living together without marriage in our society? Wow, a lot to talk about there. Patrick Glaze, could you start us out? Yeah, I was going to say that's a lot to unpack. But you know, when you look at the first marriage between Adam and Eve, God was there and it was an official recognition. They might not necessarily say, I take you as my wife or I take you as my husband, but there was a acknowledgement of a commitment to each other. So I think that when you look at the Bible, especially in those early times before you get into the Jewish catuba and all that type of thing, that there was some type of commitment, there was some type of acknowledgement. And even the person points out Isaac and Rebecca. And it's almost like they're saying that they just kind of went into a tent, had sex and they were married. But let me just share with you some of the things that happened before they did that. First of all, Abraham gave his servant a list of things that he was to look for for a wife for Isaac. The servant prayed for God's guidance. The servant talked to Laban, the father, and also paid a dowry. And so there was a lot of stuff that went on actually before they slipped into the tent. A lot of very formal stuff. Exactly, exactly. It wasn't like, because I think one of the things that this person is trying to point out, is it okay to just live together? Does that mean we're married if we live together for 10 years? They're pointing out Isaac and Rebecca. But again, there was a lot of things that went into that that showed a commitment to each other. And it just wasn't, they went into the tent and had sex. In Psalms, I found this in Psalms 45, 14 through 15, it kind of gives you some idea of a type of, she shall be brought to the king in robes of many colors. The virgins, her companions who follow her, she'll be brought to you with gladness. And so you see an idea of some type of ceremony. And but we do have good rules, don't we? Dr. Ray, when it says in Genesis 2, 24, therefore a man shall, so we have the rules of a marriage. A man's going to leave his mother and father cleave to his wife, and they both shall become one flesh. And then we see that in Genesis chapter two. So we have rules of marriage. Absolutely. And there had to be, like Dr. Glaze said, a formal commitment. We know that just because the Bible doesn't give us, you know, the different customs through the times or says, this is the marriage ceremony that thou shall perform or something like that. But we know Jesus went to a wedding feast at Cana. You know, there was wine served to the point where they had run out. So this was a long feast. And we know that in Jewish custom, and we know this from all sorts of writings, that the wedding ceremony would last about a week. And you get that. And he mentioned Jacob and Rachel, and that's mentioned in Scripture when Jacob worked for seven years to pay that dowry that you mentioned, because that was part of their custom. And then Laban, he gathered the men together, it says in Genesis 29, 22, and made a feast. And in the evening, he brings Leah. Of course, he's disguised Leah, and Jacob doesn't know it. We know the story. But the next morning, Jacob finds out that it's Leah, and Laban says to her, or to Jacob, rather, fulfill her week. And we will give you this one also, if you serve me another seven years. The week was the marriage week. So for the next six days, they continue to celebrate the marriage between Jacob and Leah. And then after that, they did another... A wedding number two. Wedding number two. But, you know, so they did have customs. And the Bible says that every matter shall be established by at least two or three witnesses. And we have that today. You have witnesses, a public ceremony. So all that has to happen. It can't just be like you said, that you go into the tent and you sleep together, and, oh, we're married in the eyes of God. That's nonsense. There has to be a formal commitment with witnesses. We are human beings. We have society. We have structures. And we need to respect those things. And that was the going into the tent afterwards, was after the ceremony, which you can't have a covenant without words. And in the Jewish... We'll say that again. You can't have a covenant without words. That's the commitment, right? That's the words. People say, why do I have to sign something to show my love? Well, that's the commitment, right? Exactly. And so after they would do that, they would go in and what they would actually do, they would actually have a sheet under the woman. And I don't need to be graphic about it, but then they would bring it out and show the family that a blood covenant had just been cut. And that's the reason why marriage can't be broken apart from death. So it's not just going in and it's like, I do believe this though. I know we don't have time to go into all this, but when you do come together with somebody, whether inside of a covenant or outside of a covenant, you do become one flesh. You're right. And then you do become tied to that person. Let me ask you about that. Let me ask you about living together because they asked as a second part of this question, what about someone who's lived together? They've got kids that've lived together for 10 years. I mean, isn't that marriage in the eyes of God? What about that? Because we need to address this because we see it so much. Almost everybody seems like lives together now before they get married. What about that, Dr. Glaze? What should we say about that? Well, again, you don't see a formal commitment in that. And I think that Jay brought it out and that it's done in the public, where there's two or three witnesses where other people see it. And so without that commitment before God, first of all, and then in the presence of others, to me, it's not legitimate. To use the term today, it's just shacking up, right? And where is the honoring of God in that commitment? Not only honoring of God, but honoring of God in your marriage. In other words, we're saying, God, I have a better idea. I have a better way. Well, the question I would always ask, I'd retort back to them and say, if there's anything, we've been together 10 years and we got a family that, well, why haven't you gotten married then? Because somewhere, if I can get in there and put them on my couch, I'm going to pull something out. Somebody's afraid of the commitment. Somebody's not willing to go all the way in. So that lets me know, too, you're not all the way in. And that means you know you still can get out, maybe 10 years, but you're still not all the way in. And that's a red flag for me. Yeah, that's a good point. And why didn't you bring up some, I know with this question we've answered before, that the divorce rate for those who live together is higher, a couple of years ago, you... Right, and as a matter of fact, the more a person is divorced, the higher the divorce rate is for their next marriage. So, yeah, there's a lot to be said about, you know, shacking up before you get married. Well, it's interesting that I thought about... You're laughing there, Jay, I don't know. Shacking up. Sorry, it's empty, old. That's the old, old generation there. But I thought of the woman at the well and how she was, you know, he said, bring your husband. And then he says, the person you're living with now, isn't your husband. And it was like living together didn't make, make that guy her husband, you know? So we're moving on to the next, good question, lot to it. Let's go to an audio question on marriage. What I'm wondering is, is that if one does not consummate their marriage, are they really, bless my God, are they to continue in that marriage? And what is God's view on this? I know Corinthians 7 says that if one chooses to stay with their partner, they do no wrong. But at the same time, spiritually, how is that one being affected? Or should I say both being affected by these decisions? Thank you. Okay, that's a really different kind of question for us, Jay. There's a couple of different angles that people are going to tackle with that. I think one of the things, though, is that first Corinthians 7, I wonder if she may be taking it a little bit out of context. Because it's not talking about whether or not someone should consummate their marriage or not. It's talking about if they're an unbeliever and they're already married, should the believer depart from them? Should they leave? And it's saying it's up to them on whether or not they choose to stay or go, but they're not under bondage in that case. So it's talking about that there. So I think that, putting that in with the consummation piece, I don't believe that's what it's talking about. Let's see the fit right there. It doesn't, no. So I'm going to say that there. But then with the consummation part, my question would be, what if somebody gets married but they couldn't consummate? It doesn't mean that they're not blessed by God based upon the sexual piece. I think you have to go a little bit deeper and find out why is the marriage not being consummated? What's going on? What's the root issue? I don't think it's just about consummation. I think it's really the why, not just the how or the what in that situation. So I'll leave with that because I know these gentlemen, if I want to get on that as well. Right. And I'm not 100% familiar, but I believe there is some Roman Catholic dogma that says something about the marriage and the consummation and that that needs to take place for the marriage to actually be official. So maybe she's coming from that angle. But to build off of what Jay said, sex in marriage is commanded. So it's something that we're commanded to do. That's very clear. In 1 Corinthians 7, let the husband render to his wife the affection to her. Likewise also the wife to her husband. But there could be something that would hinder that injury or something like that or maybe going into it. They know that, you know, they're not able to have sex due to injury or birth defect or something like that. So I don't think it's something that it's necessary, but if you're healthy and there's nothing wrong with you, you are commanded to come together intimately, regularly. The book of Hebrews says marriage is honorable among all and the bed and it actually, it's a word for intercourse, intercourse is undefiled. But fornicators and adulterers, God will judge to go back to our previous question. Sex outside of marriage, whether you've been living together for 10, 20 years, doesn't matter. It's still a sin. But in marriage it's commanded, it's beautiful and it's good, but it's not everything. If, you know, something happens, age, injury, I mean, that doesn't end the marriage. Let me ask this and maybe I'll move to this side too. Why does God do that? Why does He say it has to be inside of marriage? Was He going to, you know, put a stop all the fun everybody's having ever? Why does sex have to be within marriage? Well, I believe that there's protection. You know, within marriage. You know, for instance, you know, people that just go and move from partner to partner, they open themselves up for all type of STDs. And not only that, but I believe that there's a soul connection. You know, that when, and Paul talks about this in 1 Corinthians chapter 6, that when you're joined to a harlot, that it's more than just joining physically. I believe that a part of your person is joined too. And so I believe God put that in there, you know, again, for our protection, so that we're not passing, you know, part of us on to others that we're not willing to make a lifetime commitment with. Yeah, again, they become one. The moment a man and a woman experience the blissness of intimacy, they become one. It's amazing, guys, that even there are certain animals out there that will mate for life. Eagles. Yeah, yeah. And, uh, really? Oh, yeah. They'll mate for life. I mean, I know there was, but these guys are experts. Yeah, the dogs and eagles. What is that? A phornological? Anyway, I appreciate that. And it's interesting, isn't it that, you know, we, uh, we, I've heard it said that when there is, some people say, well, you got to have this experience. How do you know if it's going to work? But that can cause hardness. It actually can cause hardness. You think it's going to work, but actually can have the opposite effect. Well, we're going to take a quick break. And then after the break, we have a viewer asked, does God care about my sexuality? Stay tuned. Welcome back to hard questions. We've been talking about sex and marriage. Very interesting. A very important discussion for our society today. So let's go to the next question. And, uh, it says, does God care about my sexuality? Does God care about my sexuality? Pete. I think without a doubt, you know, when you, you know, he created us. There's a, there's a number of great books out there intended for pleasure by Dr. Wheatley. But in Proverbs chapter 18, verse 22, it says, let your fountain be blessed and rejoice with the wife of youth as a loving deer and a grace of graceful dough. Let her breast satisfy you at all times and always be enraptured with her love. And again, what was brought out just to. Pretty racy. Nah, I think romantic. You know what I mean? And I'm not, you know, trying to be super spiritual, but I understand what you're saying. And then, you know, if I'm correct, I think if you read the book of Song of Solomon, I think a man was not allowed to read that till he was 30 years old. And if you really take a look at the Song of Solomon, that is really talking about a love affair between a man and, and her husband. And God cares about our sexuality. I really believe he does. And for those who are watching and, and maybe having some difficulties, I would highly recommend Tim and Beverly LeHaze book, The Act of Marriage. I tell you what, it's an old, you can get it on Amazon. I'm sure it's just a couple of bucks now. I think there's millions and millions in print. Elaine and I insist, every couple we do, we insist that they buy the book and it's amazing that they go out and buy it. We had to read that at seminary. Did you read The Act of Marriage? What did you think? It was fantastic. Yeah, it was very good. Yeah. So, Ray, what's your take on this? I don't know, like in a certain sense, I don't know what the question means, like sexuality. What does that even mean nowadays? But, you know, I mean, I think Pete stated it. God made us in his image. Part of being in his image is being male and female. God says that. Genesis 1, 26, like God said, let us make man in our image according to our likeness and then let them have dominion, etc. And then, so God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him. Male and female, he created them. By the way, that's the first time we get in the Bible, mentioned male and female. Even though we know, we assume the Bible or the animals were made that way, it never says that. Never says male and female until mankind is created. And so being male or female is essential to being in the image of God. And everybody is unchangeably one of those things. No matter what you do, no matter what someone tells you, no matter what God forbid, permanently altering surgery, you might get every cell in your body is XX or XY, except for the one in every several thousand birth defects where, you know, that can get messed up, but that's a birth defect. We are still male or female. It's part of our being in the image of God because as we looked at last time, the two become one. Right. Just as God is one being three persons, so one man, one woman become one flesh and from that proceeds a third person completing sort of the human trinity, you know, when you think about it. And that's one of the reasons why it's so important that we have that commitment. Because when we prostitute ourselves or when we treat sex as just for pleasure, we're saying, this is what God is like. You know, God is unholy. God is corrupt. And because that images God when we're in that marriage that God designed for that kind of love. So Jay, God cares about our sexuality. And again, I agree with what Ray said is that so much of that word is so loaded with so many meanings right now. What's your take on this? You know, I think that when it comes to that, the Bible is full of how he cares about it. That's why he created it. If he didn't care about it, he wouldn't have created it. He created it for us. He created it for, within the confines of marriage for pleasure. He created it to procreate. He created it also for even comfort. We take a look how when Isaac lost his mother said he went in and he was comforted by his wife as a result for comfort. There's a healing. You know, Marvin Gaye had it right. No, there is a healing that happens when you come together with your spouse. That's a sexual healing here, right? I hope not. Wake up, wake up. I don't know where we're going here, everybody. I mean, in all honesty though, I mean, there is a healing that takes place. Like if you have a conflict with your spouse and you come together you know, it's amazing how people say just God care about it. Of course, that's why I put the parameters around it because it's meant to be operated in a certain way in a certain facet. In a safe area, right? In a safe area. And I think it's important as well that if you notice when you're dating, I don't know how it was with you guys, but my wife and I, we talk about it all the time. When we were dating, the devil would always try to, he would want to tempt you to come together. But then when you're married, if you get into disagreement, it's hard to come together sometimes because the devil knows there's a blessing in coming together the way that God created it to be. Wow. Good point. Dr. Glaze. Well, you know, I'll just look at it from the natural perspective. You know, why did God give a man the body parts that he gave to the man? And why did he give the woman the body parts that he gave? You know, I think, you know, the message that he's saying is that I created you distinct so that, and going back to the verse that you read in Proverbs, so that you can come together and enjoy each other. You know, so I think that there's a certain amount of enjoyment and to me, when two people of the same sex come together, that's a perversion of that enjoyment. And so definitely, you know, we God created us, you know, as sexual individuals and as Ray said, that's why he created somebody, one a male and one a female. So yeah, I think he cares about it. You know, he cares so much that he created them distinctly different. And the short answer is yes. God cares. And some of the outlines like Ray brought out too is that defraud not one another. So there's a time that, you know, a wife may need her husband's love or a husband may need and that's where, you know, and I highly recommend there are so many fantastic marriage seminars all across the country and I highly recommend that I think a couple should go to one at least once a year. Yeah, very good. Very good, very good council there. Well, coming up next, we ask, are there biblical teachings that are outdated? Wow, we'll be right back. I think this is a really interesting question coming up next. Are there any biblical teachings which you think are old or outdated can be ignored? And they gave one example, I thought of some other ones, but head covering, you know, head covering for women. Ray, help us out here. Well, I'm going to say on the one hand, there's nothing in the Bible that's old. There's nothing in the Bible that's outdated and there's nothing in the Bible that can be ignored. I get, like, scared even saying that. Oh, yeah, it's God's word, but I can ignore it. That's just not the way to ask this question. Are there things in the Bible that are ceremonial, typical, symbolical, things that were fulfilled that are not to be repeated? Absolutely. But that's not the same thing as saying, oh, it's outdated because we got to do what's new and what's hip. That's not the way we live our Christian lives. We do what the Word of God says and it doesn't matter how old it is. And so, you know, they give the example of head coverings in Corinthians and I think the idea of that on the one side, the custom of the way they were doing certain things and the fact that harlots were bold a lot of times and Paul didn't want them to be like harlots, but there was still there was still a principle even there that Paul said that men are not to look like women and women are not to dress like men, that that's an abomination. And, you know, I would go back to certain, you know, things in the Old Testament where we would see, for example, Deuteronomy 22 is a great place where someone might say something like this, but that's really the wrong way to describe it. When you build a new house, when you, then you shall make a parapet for your roof that you may not bring blood guilt on your household if anyone falls from it. Well, we understand they would go on their roofs and cool her up there in the, in the hot climate. And so you, you know, it was commanded to build a fence. Now nobody's going to build a fence around the roof today. They're building codes, building codes right there. But, but you do have to build a fence around your pool in a lot of places because of the same reason, because of the same principle. There's a danger to human life. And so while the, the, the actual working out of that principle may change. There are other things that are usually based on it, some principle. And let me just give you one other example. I know everybody wants to talk, but, you know, where he says things like you shall not sew your vineyard with different kinds of seed. You shall not plow with an ox in a donkey. You shall not wear a garment of different sorts, such as wool and linen. There were reasons for those things too, that they were showing forth, again, the purity of the Messiah who was to come from them. There were all sorts of kinds of, you know, commandments where, again, we would see typical or, or, or symbolic or ceremonial. Jesus is going to fulfill that someday, right? We don't still sacrifice animals at a temple and pour out blood a certain way and sprinkle it a certain way and put it on your big toe. And because Jesus fulfilled all those things. You know, and I appreciate that. I'd like to maybe dive a little more into the New Testament though, because we're living our lives in the New Covenant. But there are certain things that we don't do that are in like greet one another with a holy kiss, although in the 70s you never, it was all anything goes. But what about that, Pastor Glace? Well, I think that, you know, even that example, there's a principle that's in it. And the principle might be not, not to kiss somebody, but there should be some type of formal greeting. You know, whether it's a handshake, whether it's a hug, you know, whether I, you know, put my hand on somebody's back. And I think that what that does is show a bonding, a fellowship, a connection as far as us being brothers and sisters in Christ. You know, my dad invited a guy from the mill, the steel mill up to the church one day and the guy greeting him at the door, this is the middle of the charismatic movement. You know, he gave him a big hug, kissed him on the cheek. The guy walked right around, walked back out of the church. Okay. You don't kiss a steel worker on the cheek. I'm sorry. That just doesn't go that way. Okay. I have a couple men in my church and they love Jesus. They really do it and they're happily married. They got to say that. But they, every Sunday morning, they greet me with a kiss on the cheek and I told them, you kiss me one more time. I want dinner. Well, you know, and praise the Lord, that guy came to the Lord eventually. And it was, you know, give me your thoughts on this, Jay. You're not doing one of the things. Let me go to the head covering piece. I think with every message, there's a method of how it's carried out. And the head covering piece was all about a sign of being submitted as a wife. Do I think a head covering would even be wrong today? Not at all. I'm not saying the women should do it. I'm saying the method behind, the method, the method of how it's carried out was being submitted. It was a sign of submission. And that's what we needed. We have to look inside of every message and make sure that we don't lose the context of why it was there or the principle. And we don't do it for the sake of just because it was done before. In other words, we don't get into ritualism. Exactly. I think one of the more modern versions translates greet one another with a hearty handshake or something, which is pretty far from the literal translation. But good discussion. There's other things. I think Ray said the keyword, don't ignore the scriptures. Don't use that word about ignore. Understand them. Well, we like to end the program with the scripture. And today we go to 1 Corinthians where it says this. Food is meant for the stomach and the stomach for food. And God will destroy both one and the other. The body is not meant for sexual immorality but for the Lord and the Lord for the body. That's 1 Corinthians 613. Everything in scripture is something that God wants you to know about. Study it. Don't ignore it. Learn what he wants you to know. Well, we hope you enjoyed today's program. And we want to hear from you. You can email us your questions at hard questions at ctvn.org or you can call into our hotline at 412-349-4326.