 Look, one of the biggest mistakes people make when they start a fitness journey or try to lose weight or become more fit and healthy is they rush the process. Look, here's the deal. It's not hard to lose weight. Actually, statistically speaking, people do it all the time. It's keeping it off. That's the problem. Take your time. Now, this doesn't have a lot to do with the body's physiological mechanisms. Really it has to do with the mental part. Big changes are hard to keep around. It's hard to keep them to stick. So take it slow. Taking it slow will improve your odds of maintaining your success. You know, the irony of that fitness tip is that the slower what you would think is the slower way is actually the faster way. What I mean by that is that it's the tortoise and the hare. Well, no, like most people who say they want to lose 30 or 50 pounds, they don't just want to lose 30 or 50 pounds off their body. They want to lose fat. And so they think, OK, if I go really fast, you could lose somebody in a week's time, 10, 15 pounds off of a scale, but it's not going to be all fat. You're going to lose some muscle. You're going to lose water weight in there. And so this idea of like getting that you can go faster than the right way. It's not true. Like the right way is the faster way, although it seems slower if we just looked at the number on the scale. The fastest way to lose body fat is a very controlled balance deficit and taking your time where you just carve off body fat and you maintain as much muscle as you possibly can, which seems slow looking at the scale, but it's actually the fastest way to change body. It's misleading because you're losing weight and you're losing mass overall, but you're not just specifically targeting body fat and you're not going to be in a position where you're revealing your muscles and looking like, you know, you actually work out. Yeah. My famous line was, you know, you want to lose 20 pounds or just cut your leg off, right? People always laugh at that, but it's true. I think there's two reasons why this is a challenge. One is for the average person, when they finally get into the state of mind of, okay, I'm going to do this. It's usually because something happened that triggered insecurity. They felt, I don't know, bad about themselves or whatever. And when you get in that state of like feeling bad about yourself in that way, you can't wait to change it. You want to get out of your body. All of a sudden become aware or allow yourself to become aware of how uncomfortable you are. And so then you don't care what the process is like. In fact, how many times I've heard someone say this, I don't care how I lose it. I just want it off. I'll worry about keeping it off when I'm done. So that's the first problem and we can address that. But the second issue is that we're not addressing the real challenge. And this is true. The statistics and the data shows us, you ask any trainer who's been training people for a long time, they'll tell you this, losing weight is easy in comparison to keeping it off. Keeping it off is the real challenge. What stops people from keeping it off? It's all about the mental psychological piece. It's can I maintain this lifestyle? You're not going to make a radical change to your lifestyle and maintain it all at once. It just doesn't work that way with nothing. Nothing works that way. It has to be a process in which you learn and grow and develop habits and disciplines and slowly embark on this journey until you have accomplished what you want. And then the journey never really stops. But back to the first point, if you approach this with this, like, I hate myself, I'm gross, I'm not attractive, I'm inadequate, whatever, yeah, of course, you're going to rush it. You want to change that as fast as possible. But if you look at it and say, you know, I'm uncomfortable, and it's because I haven't really cared for myself, I'm going to care for myself. Now I'm going to do this in a way where I'm going to take care of myself like somebody I care about, then you're probably going to have a more balanced approach. You wouldn't treat your kid that way, right? You wouldn't look at your kid and be like, that's it. We're radically changing your life. Ew, gross. You're going to have empathy and be like, okay, let's go step by step and make this something that's sustainable. But if we look at it as the sustainability problem and not a, can I get their problem? Then I think people will approach this in a much more effective way. And you're right, Adam, that's the second part, which is how we sell it, which is also true. The right way is also the fast way. There's a huge myth that the wrong way is the fast way and the right way is the slow way. No, the wrong way doesn't work. You won't keep it off and you're going to lose a ton of muscle with that process and then you're going to end up in this shitty situation where you plateaued after 12 pounds of weight loss and then you're like, okay, now what do I do? Do you think that if we get tools that give you real-time data and feedback on what's happening in your body that this will solve some of this problem? Do you think if your clients knew that almost hour by hour, day by day, like, oh, today I built this much more muscle or I lost this much more fat or I lost this much muscle because I did. Do you think that when science gets to that and technology gets to that point, because I don't think we're that far from getting to this, where we get some real-time feedback on what's happening to your body based off of what you're doing to it at the moment? Even with like glucose monitors, we're getting close to where it's like we're getting this understanding. Do you think that will change this? Because I think that plays a big role, too, is I think a lot of times you think your people think they're doing the right things by this approach. And in reality, it's more than they need to a lot of times. It's harder than it has to be. And if they were only getting that feedback of, oh, when I do X, Y, and Z, this actually results in this, and oh, wow, when I actually just focus on these few things, this makes and this is easier, this, do you think that will change? I think if it's in combination with good coach, yes. I don't think it's- Oh, you don't think people will be able to interpret it? No. If it spells it out to them. Yeah, it's automatic. Yeah, I don't think it's an information problem. I really think it's more of a like, how do I do this? How am I going to feel? How do I deal with these feelings? How do I develop these new behaviors? So like you brought up the CGMs, when regular people or the average person uses CGM, the success rate is like they would with an Apple Watch or any other device. But when you combine it with a coach who they can point to, hey, did you feel a particular way at this time? Because I noticed you had the spike in blood sugar and then this drop and then they can make those connections, then I think we have, now we have a greater success. So now imagine a coach getting this report from their client and they can literally call them or talk to them and say, hey, what did you do this morning? I noticed this thing happened. Did you feel a particular way? And then they can make those connections. What do you think? Yeah, I think it'd be like anything else in terms of motivation waves. Because regardless of the amount of like great information that they even visibly see, I think that they would be motivated for a while and then like old behaviors and tendencies would kind of creep back and they would sort of ignore, blissfully ignore real data that's like right in front of them. I just don't see people like, unless they're actually like completely, it's their idea and they're like going all in and like they're trying to make a radical lifestyle change. Like I just feel like it will just follow a lot of the same patterns with all the rest of the tech. We have lots of really good information that tells you specifically like, here's your patterns and if you just change these things, it's going to have a massive sort of change in your life. Yeah, I think, I don't know. I think it's a bit of the interpretation for people like even like the CGM, like the reason why it requires a coach and help like that is because that people still are uncertain to what this means. I'm talking like when we get to the point where you can do, you can change a handful of variables in the day and then literally see the outcome from a body fat percentage, muscle gaining, muscle gain, lean, like that imagine how huge that would be. It could be and imagine how I think a lot of people would be stoked on it, but I'm not sure. I don't know. Like just the general population, I think is well, okay. So there'll be, there's a part where I somewhat agree with you, right? So there'll be a learning curve of like, it still will require some coaches to explain like why that happened, right? Because somebody might change two or three variables. I have no fucking idea why, why did that happen, right? So you'll have to have a coach that says like, see, this is what I meant. When you fed the body the way you were supposed to, you hit your protein and takes like I told you. That's it. You didn't, oh, you didn't go do two hours of intense cardio. You just strength trained. You didn't eat all that. Look at what happened and see, and then like, now let's run another day back. Or let's test your way. Let's starve the body tomorrow. Good, get on that treadmill, run like crazy. And oh, look, the scale went down, but look what happened. We lost muscle. And so I think that will, and I don't think we're that far from having tools that will give that kind of feedback to people. And then once the education is there of understanding like what that means, I don't know. I think that could be a big, I think you'd have to have the coach because just imagine this scenario, a person has the data tells them specifically what's happened to their body. They're busting their ass, right? They're working hard. They're starving themselves. Then they look at it. What? My body fat percentage didn't go down, but my weight went down. How does that work? Oh, I lost muscle. I give up. That's what you need to get from a lot of people. I tried all these things. It's not for me. My genetics aren't great, or this is just too hard. I can't figure this out. Or maybe they'll try one fad and the next fad and just get totally discouraged. Versus having a coach is like, hey, here's what's happening. The genetic anger. Yeah, here's what's happening. Here's the deal. Here's how you're going to feel. Because look, here's the bottom line. We have way more information today than we ever did. People are worse. They're worse off. Now, it's because the default is poor health. If you try to live a normal life and not be unhealthy, impossible, you have to live an abnormal life. You have to have a scheduled workout, and you have to inject activity into your day, whereas other people are just sedentary. You have to eat unlike everybody else. You have to pay attention to your body signals rather than numbing your body with every over-the-counter. Yeah, but imagine if you had tools that actually give you that feedback to where you're not, like an alert comes up, or it tells you, because we have that kind of capable. If we had an AI coach, maybe, if it was like, hey, today, do you do it? That's what I mean. Just feel like there'll be a guy that'll just use that data and be like, look how many Twinkies I can get to set it off. There will be that asshole. There 100% will be that. I mean, I didn't say we're going to make everybody fit. That ain't fucking happening. That ain't happening. I just think there's exactly. I think most people that hired me really wanted to try, really wanted to figure it out. And it just wasn't, they weren't connecting the dots. Yeah, but let me, exactly. I mean, I would love it, personally. I think that's. Yeah, but let me ask you guys this. Were there trainers who are smarter than you guys when you guys were trainers? Who knew? All my trainers were smarter. OK, well, hold on. What made you guys? No. Those are smartest. OK, yeah, but what made you successful? It was the guidance. I was good with people. I was getting, I was better at taking real simple stuff and getting my clients to apply it. And that made me successful. You were good at taking like every other smart trainer's ideas and make it more relatable. Yeah, that's actually the key right there. Yeah. If you want to be a successful trainer, this is it right here. Can you get the person to make the change that you want in a permanent way? If you can't, no matter what you know, it's a waste of time. Yeah, but I mean, I think that's because we're, I think the game will change. Like, I think that's what was so important now to a point, not completely, because it'll all still come down to behaviors. And you know my worry is though with that. Here's my worry with it is that people, because I know what happened with me with my phone. I already had a bad sense of direction. Now my sense of direction is completely gone. I don't know anybody's phone number. I've outsourced lots of things that I used to know to my phone. My worry is with these devices that people become more disconnected from their bodies. More like, oh, what does my app say? Did I tell you guys that? Yeah, what does this say? What does that say? Did I tell you I looked up getting a beeper? I actually looked up. There's a company that still sells beepers. I remember you talking about that. Yeah, I was like, you know what? For that same reason, I'm like, you know what? Maybe if I just fucking put the phone away and leave it at the house all day or leave it in the drawer somewhere, I just keep my beeper from emergency racing. We're going to text you boobies. Hey, dude, there's eight boobies. Remember that? I would. All day long from US also. Sometimes it's going to be dumb shit. 143. This is not working. Yeah, just 9-1-1. That's the worry, so I'm going to go to my phone. Otherwise, I'll call you later. All right, today's giveaway is Maps Aesthetic. If you want to win that program, you have to do this. Leave a comment below this video in the first 24 hours that we drop it. Subscribe to this channel and turn on notifications. If you win, we'll let you know in the comments section. We're also running a sale right now. Maps Symmetry, half off. The RGB Bundle, half off. If you're interested, click on the link at the top of the description below. All right, back to the show. Did you guys have Pagers in high school? I absolutely had a Pager. I had a Pager for like a minute. Why, though? Just one? I think I was drunk. It was a thing for me, from like freshman or sophomore year of high school all the way until I got a self run. Remember when they got cool and they got like different colors? Yeah, I had like different cases. Did you really? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. What was the brand? Two people texting me. Was it Motorola? Like, yeah, Motorola. I mean, there was a couple brands, but that was the main brand. Yeah, it was so, what a weird, like you got a, so you're in high school, OK? So you have a Pager. It started with doctors, right? Is that how it came? Yeah, people that needed them. So we were in high school, you would get a page and it meant to call someone back. That's all it meant. So you got to go find a phone to call them back or your girlfriend would text you. No, there's Pager code now. I mean, don't you remember? Like, that's what I'm saying. That's what I think, yeah. 143. Well, of course, you only remember those ones. What else could you put on a calculator? What else could you write on it? Miss me, call me, miss you, call me back, thinking of you, those are, there's all kinds. There's a whole, look at Doug. Look up. How did you think? Look up, yeah, 823. Look up. Oh, yeah, stupid. I was thinking of like, oh, I randomly know that. That's right, just full of random stupid facts. Pull up Pager code. There's like a whole, there's a whole. I feel like Adam was a whole language. There's a whole language all the time, just. We'd get thinking of you from him all the time. Yeah. There's like a low key reminder to get back to work. I actually, I haven't said that a long time to you. When Katrina and I first started dating, I would text her that and she would be like, what the fuck is that? Oh, on the phone? Yeah, yeah, what is that? You know what you could do? Honestly, you don't need, although Pager might not be a bad idea. I'll get a brick phone. I don't know about Pager. Dude, that's what my cousin did. Yeah. My cousin got a flip phone and all you could do is call. Yeah. And you can text, but it's old school text. We have to hit the number three times. Hug you, sleep well, he, he, he, like hug. There's all kinds of stuff. There's actually way more than that, though. There's like a. What? Why? He, he, he. Why? What is that? There's just all kinds. There's way more than that. There's way more than that. You guys didn't have to let, remember, what was the other, the pig Latin that we learned when we were like in elementary school? That's totally different. No, it's not. It's like you created a language. Like we, people created a language around Pager code. So, so it's funny. You break this up. Cause Jessica and I had a conversation before. LOL, right? Yes. Yeah. Oh yeah. You can't do that. Oh yeah, you can. You can do 707. That would be. Oh yeah. Look at that. Yeah, no, but it was before. Like that didn't happen until. But nobody did. Nobody did LOL. It was my point. Yeah. So, whole new. Jessica and I had this conversation thing, like last week and we're like, okay, let's do this. Let's only pick up our phones at distinct times and text each other only at those times, not check our phones, just turn off the TV as much as possible. Cause that's always like a, if you're busy with the kids or whatever and you want to, you know, have them do something for 15 minutes. So we tried the effort. It lasted two days, went back to normal cause it's hard. So today we had that conversation and, you know, it's funny is you realize when you're doing that, how much you randomly share thoughts with. I was just going to ask you, how often do you and Jessica text in a day? A lot. That's weird. Yeah. What about you? Well, we're in love. Yeah, it is weird. Here and there. I mean, I don't. That's why I think that's weird. I think that's weird. I text Katrina and Cortez. Wow. That's why it makes more sense. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They check with me every guy. I mean, do you, I mean, do you, are you, how often do you guys? No, not for, I mean, I guess. Yeah, she knows where you live, right? Yeah, she knows. Yeah, she knows where I'm finding me. You know, like, what's Justin doing right now? I tell him. I usually save that for content, dude. Yeah. Like I need content. Yeah. They didn't be able to talk about things. Well, we text each other. Yeah, I'll talk to you when I get home. Yeah. But then there's also apps and, come on, you guys act like you're a phone. No, you're weird, bro. Hey, check your phone. Let's see who's on the phone the most. I care. Well, that's different. Okay. Yeah, I'm not. Excuse me. My wife and I are not talking all day long. My wife and I talk when we see each other when we get home. It's like, we enjoy that gap, that small gap of like not seeing each other for a while. Because to your point, gives us something to talk about. You're texting your fucking wife every play by play. You guys get home when you just talk. I'm not doing a play by play. You guys talk about it. Yeah, let me text her when she, you know what I'm saying. No, we don't do it. But anyway, we were talking about it. And it just, you know, I was thinking about when we were younger, when you left the house, you were gone. That was it. It was like, hey, I'll see you at this time. And then you just relied on each other to show up. And that was it. That's why it's so weird. You were gone. That's why it's so weird to me when we get, when we get so like crazy about messaging like that often. It's like, dude, there was a time when you could literally go all day and not. What do you mean? All that's all we talk to the people that were in front of you. When my kid, so my kid, obviously I talked about how he was sick. He was at school or whatever. I can check his location on his phone. I could text him. I know, that's creepy. You know, and then I thought about him like all panic. Stockers, dude. Yeah, that's what we are. When we were gone, our parents were like, I don't know, you know, call me at this time, I guess, or I'll call you. And if you don't answer, yeah, I'll assume you're alive. Yeah. I mean, do you think that's been for the good or the bad? Oh, bad. Of course. Yeah. I think, I think people are safer, maybe. I don't know. Well, that's a fact. It's nice to know, you know, but also, yeah, you totally intervene and there's a big overreach there, I would say, as a parent. Remember when you go places with your parents? You guys were little, you know, maybe like you just, when you start to get a little freedom, right, 12, 13, you go to like a theme park and your parents are like, OK, meet here at 1 p.m. Yeah. And then you're gone. Have you ever been lost, you know? Have they ever left you somewhere? Are you asking me? Yeah. I get lost all the time, dude. Well, I know. I mean, like your parents like left you somewhere. Oh. And you're like, ah, panic. Wait, your parents actually left you? Yeah, but they didn't know. Hold on a second. Yeah, I was like, you forgot about you? Yeah, so you know that, you know that big flea market over here? Like, where the theater or the outside movie theater is? Yeah, yeah. That's a terrible place to get lost. Sorry. Yeah, so I was looking at something and then. Surprised you could get kidnapped. Yeah, I guess like some kid that kind of was wearing the same clothes as me was like kind of near them and they just moved on thinking nothing of it. It's like some home alone ship. Dude, and I'm like looking back and there's nobody. And I like, it took me an hour before I finally like reconnected and I had they had to like say over the loudspeaker. Really? Like where I was. How old were you? Yeah, dude. I was I was probably like eight. He's like 22. Hey, when you get older, it's your parents that get lost. Oh, fuck, we lost dad. Hold on. So you were you crying? I mean, I did. Once I find once they finally found me. I kind of broke down and let it out. Yeah, I was just like, why did he leave me? Like that classic kid thing. Or we mark it as a scary place. That's a scary place to get lost. Your parents ever lose you like that? Yeah, my parents. We were at my aunt's house. We remember my parents have four kids and we were rowdy ass kids. So we were at my aunt's house for a big family party and they had you ever, you know, you try to organize your kids to get to leave at a particular time. It's almost impossible, right? So they're getting the kids ready, but we'll throw them in the minivan. They jump in the car. They drive off and they forgot me. They drove off and they totally and I was literally home alone. They literally left me. That's how that happened. Yeah, look, it was that family. That's how that played out. Remember they're getting all the, everyone, the kids in the. And then my, my aunts like, your parents just drove away. I'm like, what? They drove back around, came back. And the, the story was always like, if, if I was even going to remotely like leave and go somewhere, like I was at like a grocery store. My mom would always tell me like, if you are gone, like somebody's going to kidnap you and dye your hair. Wow. And then you're never coming back. And I'm like, oh my God. And I would just freak out. You know, I would be like in the bathroom, like running, trying to find my, my mom again. But I would have worked. What about you? Did you, did your parents? My mom left me intentionally. I'm prepared. Yeah. I told that story. Remember I told you guys that story, where the cops came and everything? Remember when I was, let's see here. You got kicked out. No, that's 16. This I'm talking about when I'm like four or five. Like, whoa, what? Look at, we looked this up one time. Uh, when was Nintendo? Okay. When was it released? Right? What year was it? 1989, 88. So the NES. So when, when, when Zelda, the game Zelda came out. Okay. No, it was like 86. The NES. Yeah. It's like 86. Wow. That's 85. 85. Holy cow. So when that came out, Zelda, Zelda gets released, which I think is 86. So this, this I'm five. My mom leaves me home to go grocery shopping and tells a five year old, don't go anywhere. Right. So you're at home. I'm at home and then somebody, my neighbor, like four houses down on our block comes over and knocks on the door and he's got the new Zelda game and wants to come over and play. And being like a normal five year old, I totally forgot what my mom told me to stay home. Okay. And just went and then got caught up playing games. Oh, you left the house. Oh yeah. For like hours. Oh, wow. And when I finally came out of his house to come back home, there was like cops all on our street and our driveway. And my mom was like hysterically crying and running up and down the street. Now, what did she tell the cops? So, okay. I don't remember any of that memory is like served me as like for most of my like young childhood or an adult, young adulthood of like, you know, I fucked up in that situation that you did. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't until I got old, like a fucking grown-up man. I did the math and I went like, I was five. What the fuck? She doing leave me home at five. Yeah. Like I said, Max is four right now. I'm like, are you kidding me? Like I can't you imagine you're free. It's cool. That is that is like crazy. Listen, if you grew up in the 80s, you're just tough. Like if you survive that, you're not a pussy. You know what I mean? Like a lot of kids would have died right there. You made it. You know what I'm saying? You know what though? Hey, by the way, you know what the science on that says? Where when little kids, when their parents do something that's completely irresponsible or terrible, little kids always internalize it. They always internalize it as it's their fault because that's your caretaker. I think it was like survival mechanism. But a couple of years ago that like I realized that wasn't my fault. Oh, because you didn't do the math. Yeah. I just never cared to you. I just assumed that I was a bad kid for doing shit like that. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know, when I figured things out, it was when I tell you guys stories, you know, and I'm like, oh, yeah, my mom threw a shoe at us or the groceries around. I'm like, what the fuck? What's she got her shoes at us? I know. Courtney is always asking, what was your mom doing? You know, like, like, is she doing a bunch of errands? And she was like, no, she's probably at home. Like I was like thinking, I'm like, what was she doing? You know, I had to walk miles. We watched ourselves for sure. And when I went back, I went by that neighborhood with time, which probably it's like a ghetto now. It's in Modesto, which is like the armpit of California, right? So and it's like this shitty little town where we're at and like just a rundown neighborhood. And as a kid, like you make your perception of distance and size is so off, you know? And I remember going back there and then driving the route of walking to school, the school, the middle school that I used to walk my sister and I too. And it was like, you know, two miles. We had to cross a four lane fucking main road. Bro, I was third grade. She was first grade. It was fucking bananas. Oh my God. Yeah. And I'm like, I did the drive and I'm like, this is every day, you know? And then these memories come back of like when I got grounded one time, really bad. I had it, it was in fourth grade. And I was walking home from this long walk from school and got distracted and, you know, a kid. I mean, that's just, that's how a kid's brain works at that age like that. Like not even thinking like I have to come straight home. It's like some kid goes, oh, come over, I got the new vanilla ice tape. Let's go listen to it. Okay. So I, you know, cut a laugh and then go hang out for an hour or two. And then my mom's again frantic because I didn't come home. And she knew not to take candy from a guy in a van. I guess that's what they left this week. But I'm thinking that at that age and when I was younger, even like as a teenager going like, oh man, I was a bad kid. I did all this stuff. But then I was a dad. And I think like, I would never expect Max. You were a normal kid. Yeah. I would never expect Max to like walk two miles across a four lane highway. Oh my God. Like figure it out. And not think that somebody would go like, hey, come over and play with me, kid. And you would be like, okay, and just do that. Cause he would do that. I told you guys a story about like when we were at the grocery store and my mom and my brother was always a terror. And you ran off and he was knocking stuff off the aisle. I'm chasing him because I'm the oldest, right? Get your brother and I'm chasing him. And then I see my mom's shoe, you know, across the aisle, boom, hit him and he falls down cause she had to stop him. And this lady gave my mom the dirtiest look. And my mom grabbed the shoe and pointed at her and she's like, mind your business. Now, when I was a kid, when I was a kid, I was like, my mom's awesome, you know? Looking back like, oh my God, Bob, what were you doing? She's like, you try managing four kids at the grocery store. You know, I think- Fair enough. I just imagine you're practicing out in the backyard. Before having a kid, you can't help but judge those adults that you see do that. Then after you have a kid, you realize it. Totally empathize. And you just feel bad. Totally empathize. Like you just come and just like, oh man. Oh yeah. You ever see kids on a leash when people are walking around? You're like, how could they do that? Now I have like a two year old and I'm like, oh, where do I buy one? Yeah. That was a trend for a minute. It went crazy for a minute and then it went on. I think after a while- Now they make backpacks with this. They do, but it's still- Leashy. It was really popular for- Definitely a leash. For a minute. And then it kind of fell off because I think people started to realize like how ridiculous that looks like. Your kid is on a leash, you know that, right? Yeah. You can feed them little treats. No matter if it's a monkey backpack or not, it's still a fucking leash. You know how you draw it up. Time to pull. Yes, I think it like- Play and play. It fell out of favor for after a while. And then it was- And they're always just like, ah! Yeah. Trying to get off of it. This is how- This is how I would have tear my little- My brother was hanging off of the balcony. He was young. He was like three. And they make those buckles so you can't take- Because my mom had one for him. She had two though. My brother would literally jump off- He'll do anything crazy. She had one of those. I didn't think those came out until way later. No, no, she was probably one of the first- Oh, wow. She saw it and she's like, I need- She probably invented it, yeah. He was, listen, you don't understand. His son, by the way, it's so fun to watch my brother go through this with his son. If we put his son in here right now, if you took your eyes off from two seconds, he'd be hanging off the lights or something. Like something very dangerous. Oh, it was a China shot. And laughing. That was my brother. Yeah. So she had the leash on and he figured out how to take the child-proof thing on. And my mom is not paying attention, you know? She's shopping, she's watching this over. My brother took it off and attached it to something else. And she looked, lost him. Where is he? I like that. And then we eventually found him. I like that. Anyway, so here's what's interesting to me. I thought- Because you guys both can't have dairy right now, okay? Because you guys have to be constant. Can we have a moment? Yeah, well, it's okay. It's very sad. How are you doing right now? I'm angry. Well, yeah, you look really miserable. I was going to say, he looks angry, but you complain way more. So are you... What's your challenge with that? So what I'm really blown away at, because I mean, I've openly admitted my ice cream addiction and shit like that that I like. And I have a certain- You don't like dairy-free ice cream? No. What I didn't realize was all the little things like, I mean, like there's these crackers that I would have and there's a barbecue sauce that I would use with chicken. It's in everything. And I didn't realize how much dairy has snuck into so many things. And I didn't think that I was, like in my mind, I think like in my diet, I go like ice cream cheese. Like that's the main dairy that gets in there. Every once in a while, I have some sort of, I have it maybe in my coffee or, you know, but rarely, you know, or yogurt occasionally, cream cheese occasionally. They add it to everything from mouth to feel. Yeah, but when you start to like actually look at every single thing and it's like, oh, shit, this has dairy too. And then I go, wow, I was actually consuming way more than I thought I was. And I don't know, I haven't talked to Cabral about this or not, but the first initial part sucks. I've had headaches. My psoriasis is worse right now than it was before. And I feel like I'm like, I can't eat anything. Like it's a shitty beginning right now. So this is interesting because that happens a die-off, but I don't know why avoiding dairy would cause, so die-off is when you're treating like a bacterial overgrowth. And when the bacteria die, or let's say there's a fungal overgrowth and that dies, it sets off toxins. And so people will get this, what's it called? Herximer effect or something like that. Maybe they'll look it up. It's where you actually feel worse before. I don't know why avoiding an intolerance to cause that except for maybe your immune system not having something to attack because it's constantly being bombarded with dairy, doesn't have dairy, and so it's become more hyper-vigilant before it calms down would be my guess. So here's a mistake. I was talking to Katrina and I were talking with this last night and she, cause she was asking me, she could tell. She's like, are you doing all right? What's wrong with you? So I said, I think I'm gonna bit off more than I could chew right now because I also paired that with caffeine and cratum right now of pulling off too. Why? So I've been, yeah. Where do you have caffeine right there? That's cause this is part of me going like, I probably should do all of this. Yeah, I was, I was like the, cause my attitude is like this. Well, I'm gonna go, I'm cutting out this dairy. I've been inconsistent with my training and dieting was here's a good time for me to really ramp up and I like fucking 180 everything. And I was like, probably not a good idea. Yeah, you're making it terrible. Yeah, so yeah, reintroduced the caffeine back in. And I'm like, okay, I'm not gonna do that right now. Which is probably where the headaches probably came from. The headaches make sense. See, that's the Herxheimer effect, but that's from, look, people get fever from that. I didn't even realize that. But that's after you kill like bacteria and stuff like that. Now, what about you, Justin? You, you obviously it was very depressing. You're just angry. Yeah. Because what are you gonna eat? Yeah, and it's like, my kids are flaunting it in front of my face. Oh my God. Yeah, they're taunting you. Yeah. So like, I have this huge like cannonball of mimolette, right? And like, I started to like, I was eating a bunch of it. And then before I just decided to not eat dairy anymore. And then I was like cooking burgers for everybody. And then realizing, oh yeah, I can't put any cheese on it. And then I'm like serving it up and Ethan goes, and he's grabbing all this like expensive cheese I have there. And he's like stacking it, you know, on top of his burger, the like, you know, shaving it in the salad and like, anyways, it's just, yeah. I love your kids. I'm like, and I like, I like that they're kind of messing with me with that because it's like, it's annoying to be that guy that's like, oh, you know, dairy, you know. Oh, I'm the bummer. I'm the bummer in the group. You know that low key, like I didn't want to be that guy. I'm that guy right now. So I'm owning it and it's been what, six days or whatever. So this is what it is. I've actually had better acid reflux. Oh, that's a big deal for you. It is. And that's what's why I'm even more angry because I'm like, it's working. Yeah, it's working. You were hoping it didn't work. Yeah. So I actually have to go all the way through this thing. Yeah, because your acid reflux was bad. It was, and it got really bad. And I told you guys at the beginning of this year, it was just like compiling. It was like the worst it's ever been. So here's the kicker with this is, or not kicker, this is the, I mean, maybe the light at the end of the tunnel. Although dairy oftentimes isn't this, but I think you especially, or both of you guys, should be okay with this. Once you get the immune system to tamp down, you seal the gut because the inflammation is gone. Then you can reintroduce and you probably, you may not have any more reactions and you go back to having dairy. Although dairy often is one that people can never go back to, because you guys have always had dairy and never really had an issue. But it's just like an intolerance. It's not like I'm like allergic to it. You know what I mean? Like this is all bullshit. He's still in denial. He's still in denial. He's like, I just would be happy if I, hey, I'll just be happy if every once in a while I can, like one of the things I now have to do is, again, obviously I know a way shake is dairy, but that's kind of like my go-to thing at night when I need protein. Did you go to the organifier? Yeah, so now I'm like on the organ. That's all right. I mean, Organify by far is the best vegan protein. Vegan proteins are gross. They are, they are. And I already went through all the bone broth already. So I'm hoping that we still have some of that left in here, but I've been on Organify now. And I'm so used to having like a nice way shake at the end of the night. Now is your digestion better with the Organify? So I don't have digestive issues. Oh, it's all skin. Yeah, it's all skin for me. It's never been, I've never had any real major gut unless I'm like way off the rate, like if I'm eating really bad. Yeah, Organify is the most successful vegan protein I've had that I've recommended to people because when I recommend non-dairy protein powders, especially if I want a nice amino acid profile, A, they're hard to find, and B, when I do, they literally taste like someone mowed the lawn and threw the lawn clippings in the back. But that's the one. No, they're the best. I just, okay, so. And there's no artificial sweetener. Just nitpicking is that I really like Organify stuff with tardy stuff, like fruit, like strawberries and blueberries. So you eat vanilla with it? Yeah, so I can make my own. But at night, when I have my protein shake, I like savory stuff. Yeah, I want peanut butter and banana, you know, is what I want, and that don't go good with to me. And I've had it, like it gets by, but it's not the same. They make good cookies. The Organify protein powder makes really good cookies. Wasn't it you that made them? Or was that someone else? No, Katrina and I make, but we normally use whey when we do the cookies. Someone else made them. Chokey's mom, I think. That's it. Okay, was that the party? She used Organify? Yes. Do you remember those balls? Do you remember those like protein balls or whatever that we had at the, was it the? Christmas party. Yes, the Christmas party, those were Organify. Oh, I didn't know that. They were amazing. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah. Because Katrina asked me, she's like, do you want me to make that? I'm like, ah, I don't really like all the, because we make peanut butter balls, all the different cookies, but we normally use the whey, because I think whey just goes better with like when you're baking. But I haven't, I didn't know that. Yeah. Well, I asked Chokey to hook up the recipe on that. So I want to change direction real quick and comment on just real short, because I know people can get irritated with this, but there's a lot of, I've gotten some messages. People want to know our opinions on the vape Ramaswamy and how he's, what he's communicating right now, and kind of what's happening. He's kind of this rising star. So far we've heard the Republican primary debate, the first one. So what do you guys think, what do you guys think about that guy? You know what's interesting about, actually I'll say one comment. Yeah, go ahead. You know how people are attacking him? This is what I find interesting. The attack that seems to be sticking is literally under the umbrella of, he sounds too good to be true. Yeah, he's too smooth. What a crazy. He's saying all the things on here. It's not that crazy when you think about how it happened with Obama. Yeah. Yeah, but people still love him. There's a definite comparison to him. And people are still gonna love him back too, I think. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think he'll, he's no for sure out of all the Republican candidates, the most well-spoken. And I think addresses most of the points that I think that the party wants them to address. Like he's more. Not the establishment. Yeah. They were, I mean, when you saw their positions on Ukraine, for example. No, I'm talking about the Republican base. Not the fucking staff. I'm talking about people. Isn't that weird? Yeah, he's speaking to what the most people want to is the first one to raise his hand with Ukraine and stuff like that. So I think he's, I mean, he's, and he's what he's doing with, by not bashing Trump and actually supporting him. Because when you really unpack what he said about Trump, it's really like, okay, he said in this last decade or last, what do you say? He's the best president in the last, the timeframe he's referring to is George Bush, Obama, Biden and Trump. And if you're a Republican, everybody knows that Bush was fucking the worst, right? So because all the war shit, so that's out. And then you're not gonna have a Republican guy support Biden or Obama for sure. So he's not really saying much by saying that, but it comes off. It's just, so he's very intelligent. He's very tactical. He's winning over everybody. But I think the, so I have several of my family members that I do talk politics with that are like kind of like hardcore conservative. And their concern about him is that he's gonna be like an Obama. He's gonna get in office and he's gonna do a lot of things different than what he said. Than what he's saying. Yeah, that's the biggest critique that I think is sticking, the lack of experience. Although I think that's gonna play in his favor because everybody else up there has been in there forever and has done what? You know, nothing. It's just refreshing to hear people finish sentences. Yeah, I know. Now Trump played really smart politics because he's so ahead. He didn't participate, which makes him look like, I'm not gonna talk with you guys. You guys are all so low or whatever. And not only that, but I'm gonna run my interview at the same time and make sure that my base is gonna get a chance. So what's your speculation on what he's gonna do when the party gets narrowed down to two? Then he'll debate. So you think, so there's rumors that they think he won't even then even. Well, okay, that's a good point. It depends how high the hold is. There's a chance that he may like, pull this like move the whole way through and be like, why? Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I don't think he'd do well. You know what I think is really interesting is that Trump in 24 hours got over $4 million in campaign funds after he got that mug shot. No, it's up higher than that. It's six now. I saw- Well, it went in 24 hours. Oh, oh, okay. I was gonna say like that. Which is a record. Yeah, I just saw that this morning on like how much it, how much- He had to know that he'd like, even if he didn't need to take it, he was like opting in for that. Oh. Cause it's like perfect like- Press. It plays right into his narrative of being this outsider and- Right, crazy. Backfire. On the underdog, like he's getting a lot of new supporters, I guess, like the black community. Do you think he had the foresight to know that it was gonna play out that way for him? I think he had a plan. I think they were like, when they take that mug shot, you'd be ready to put this out, this out, and that out. And that's exactly what they did. As soon as that mug shot was taken, he sent out a blast to his followers, to his supporters, with the picture of it. And it's like, this is, you know, the political witch hunt, whatever. You know, give me money. I'm gonna fight the system. And he got so much money. I always wonder if it's like really the candidate or the person that we're talking about, or it's really like this team of people that is really all of it. Yeah. Like you interpreted it as like, oh, he had this foresight. Oh no. He thought, do this, do this. He's got a team. Yeah, they go like, this is what we're going to do. You're gonna get this. We're gonna take advantage of this. We're gonna put this out. This is how we're gonna spend. This is how we're gonna get ahead of it. This is how it's gonna, yeah. That's what I think. I don't think it's them. I'll say, he's right now in the primary, he's untouchable. He actually, his support with minorities exploded recently, which would kill the Democrats if that were to stick, although it almost never sticks. Would you say it went eight to 21 or something? Eight to 20%, that's a lot. Yeah, huge. But I mean, does it actually stick when they vote? We'll see what happens. He's still super divisive. So can he win a general? Who knows? I think if he made Vivek his running mate, that would be interesting. That would be really interesting. And it sounds like that's what Vivek is trying to do. Is it this October, the October surprise or is it next October? It's next year, right? Yeah, yeah. That's when you should expect the weird stuff. They're narrowing down who's gonna be the candidate going into next year. Yeah, so we'll see. We'll see what happens. It'll be very interesting. I mean, are you following, I'm not following it that closely. I'm paying a little bit of attention to it, but I'm not following that closely. Yeah, I like to just see what the strategies are and kind of how they're playing the game and look at the big picture. Because if I get too invested, I just wanna pull my hair out. Football season is starting for me, so I don't wanna give a shit. Yeah, that's where I'm going. Politics are sports for nerds, bro, I've been saying that forever. I should get into football, huh? You should. Is it less stressful? It's way less stressful. Yeah, way less stressful. There's not as much on the line when a team loses, you know what I'm saying? They're not trying to piss you off. And even when they do corrupt bad shit, it's just like, ah, it's not that big of a deal. They're like, oh, fuck, those are my rights. You just fucked away. It's like, oh, no. Yeah, it's like, you're not gonna get those. It's not that serious. Ah, the football wasn't that serious. We could get over this. Wasn't that a thing, one point with the football? The pay for money was cool. Andrew, are you doing the fantasy league with the boys? Yeah, we just need numbers. Okay, okay, I'm gonna. No, they're trying to recruit us. Okay, explain fantasy. I've never played fantasy football. What the hell? No, no, no, I'm not gonna defend that. That's not, that's like, it's like Dungeons and Dragons for jocks. Really? That's a good way to say it, yeah. Yeah, so it's like, yeah, I have this wizard and I have this, I don't know, which you have a team. The memes around, by the way, the memes around fantasy football are the best, I think, but there's so many great memes and things that go on. So what do you do? Do you only create a team with players from different? So there's 10 to 12 of us, okay? So if we were to play with you guys, we would all go around and you would draft players. So we'd figure out a way to go the order. You're first, I'm second, Justin's third, Doug's fourth. And you're up and you get to pick any player in the NFL to be on your team. For each position? Well, yeah, yes, but it's your decision on how order you go. You go running back first, so basically, and there's, so there's strategy. I mean, how do you win? So every week, those guys have ways to score points. So a quarterback throws a touchdown, he gets six points. If a running back runs for 10 yards, he gets a point. If a wide receiver catches a pass, it's a point. Like, there's all these ways to start whoever you want for that week. And so based off of that is how many points you're gonna get. Wow, that's stupid. I totally don't want to do that. It's brilliant, actually. It's actually really, it's a lot of money. People bet money. Yeah. Oh, lots of money. You know, this has been around well before the internet and stuff that people used to do this by hand at the newspaper. You'd open up every Sunday and kids have been doing this for a long time. It blew up once the internet hit and then like you could create this thing where we can all... Kind of gives you something to do while you're watching the games. I get that. It's like, I think it reminds me of when we used to watch a Super Bowl and you'd make all these like really weird random bets on like, whether or not the, you know, the coin toss or... Yeah, just like random things would happen in the game and you'd like bet on it and it just made it more kind of fun. I mean, we talked the other day about Balco, right? And we talked about what that did for baseball, like how huge that was, right? The whole home run race. Fantasy football has to... I would love to see like some stats on like what it's done. It is for sure elevated football because it, when it does... I can see why. It takes someone like me who would consider himself a football fan. And now you want to watch it all. All of it. Yes. And I would never do that. As a kid growing up, you watch your team. That's all you care about. You don't pay attention to anybody else's stuff. Maybe a little bit, but not like where when you draft players in the entire league, you're invested in every... And there's money on the line. You're invested in every some game. So now I want to watch every game. You know what you just, you brought up baseball. I saw, I didn't see this for a long time and I forgot how crazy of a disparity this was. The pictures of Barry Bonds and Mark McGuire and who else was it? Jose Coseco or Sammy Sosa. Yeah. When they like in the early part of their career and then towards the end. Probably. I feel like... They made their heads grow. They made their heads grow. It was the most crazy. I think Sammy Sosa looked the crazy. But hold on. Why did their actual skulls grow? Yeah, exactly. They worked because they were on growth too. They never proved that stuff because you can't... You can't test for it. You can't test for it, but they were on growth hormone too. Like the before and after looks ridiculous. Yeah, that's the only way your skull grows, bro. Your skull doesn't grow from testosterone. No. Yeah, it does from growth hormone though. So that, I mean that... You turned into a mutant man. That's the part that they never talk about or they couldn't even really, like in the Balco Scammer or that. They can't talk about that case. They can't prove it, so they don't even bring it up. But you know, your bones don't grow like that. All those guys grew like their bones. And that doesn't happen unless you're taking growth hormone. Oh my God. So they took it in combination with that. I think they can test for growth hormone now. Maybe you could look it up, Doug. I think they now have tests. Maybe like if they would... Yeah. Yeah, an abnormal amount. I'm sure they figured that out. Like IGF-1 or something like that. But I think they can actually test for, thanks. Speaking of science, while Doug looks that up, I was reading more interesting studies on terpenes, which, so terpenes are compounds and plants that give them their scent, but there's also... Their flavor too. Or flavor, but there's reasons why they have these terpenes. Some of them are too, are antimicrobial or will fight certain funguses or will attract certain insects that'll pollinate them or repel certain insects that tend to eat them. So they're present in plants. Now, why am I bringing this up? When you look at hemp or cannabis, which is its cousin, and you look at the effects of cannabinoids, obviously the most common one being THC, but then there's CBD, which is common. There's lots of other cannabinoids, CBC and CBN and other cannabinoids. When you look at their effects, if you don't look at the terpenes, you're not gonna get the full picture. In fact, I just read this. Terpenes oftentimes have effects like cannabinoids themselves, and it's probably terpenes that determines whether or not a strain makes you sleepy or energized or anxious or creative and not necessarily the cannabinoids. It's so funny because this explains what we've kind of known for a long time with how people would say, like you'd hear people say like, oh man, I can have, I love sour diesel for X, Y, and C. You're like, oh, I like this strain. And you would hear people compare two strains that would both be considered a sativa plant. Yeah, totally different. Yeah, but yeah, they'd have these different effects. So I think it highlights something that we were kind of onto forever of knowing that there's certain strains, if you're looking for certain attributes, oh, I don't wanna be sleepy, I don't wanna have energy, but I wanna be jittery, like I want this feel like there's certain plants or strains that you've connected if you've been smoking for a long period of time. Oh, I like the way that feels, but it's less to do what we know now with the sativa plant or the actual strain and more so to do with the terpenes. Now, why is this important? Because there's so many products on the market now that'll have CBD and CBD's got its own effects and potential benefits, anti-inflammatory, euphoria, sleep, enzylidic, right, helps with anxiety, but almost nobody is selling a full-spectrum cannabinoid-based product that's high in CBD, meaning they take the whole plant, they extract the efficacious oils, but what's also in there are all the other cannabinoids and the terpenes as well. So this is probably one of the reasons why we work with Ned. When people use CBD products and then use Ned, they're like, okay, I really feel this. Is the CBD that much higher? And it's like, no, it's because of all these other things in the plant that you didn't get with your just CBD gummies or whatever you've done. So the delivery of it's just better. It's not only that, but the terpenes activate the receptors more. So CB1 receptors can get activated by terpenes. There's an entourage effect with how they interact with each other. So if you're looking for beneficial effects of CBD, you're better off getting something that's got all that other stuff. You're gonna get more of an effect, more of a benefit. And there's a balancing effect. They show that it's more calming or stimulating. It's more of a balanced effect when you include all of those things versus just the isolated cannabinoid. When is it that the way it's found in nature isn't better for us? I mean, seriously, when is it? Give me an example of something that we have figured out and like, oh, when we mash this and change this, it's healthier. If you want a super strong, acute effect. Yeah, that, concentrated, yeah. But that's rarely ever what you should be doing. Something to stop pain immediately or something. Did you guys know the drug Metformin has been around for a long time? Yeah. It was based off of a plant that people had used for a long time. Were they, wasn't it? Fighter pilots are reason that. No, no, no, no, no. That's different to Metformin. It's another M. Oh, damn. It's a stimulant. Yeah. Medofinil? Medofinil. Doug, look at the origins of Metformin. Burberry, maybe? No, no, it's another plant. By the way, the NFL does do. Yeah, but you see it, 24 to 48 hours. Yeah. And they get a notification. You're gonna get tested in two days. Cool. No growth hormone tomorrow. So, yeah. So you really can't test for each year. No, that's. Although it's not a huge performance enhancing. No, but if you pair it with all the test and they're taking it, yeah. And with, yeah, you pair it with that, that's gonna make a big difference. Yeah. So, especially you're at that level, recovery and stuff. So Metformin is a synthetic derivative of French lilac. That's an herbal plant traditionally employed in Europe for diabetes treatment. So it is a, they take, they took what was effective in French lilac, which you probably could buy now if you want to improve your blood sugar. And then they created Metformin, which by the way, Metformin has been around a long time. It's one of the oldest drugs that's been around. And so we know what it does, what it doesn't do. It's one of the safer substances if you are looking to control blood sugar. Aren't they, so I know bio-hackers are all into that, but like beyond it just being good for. So I took Metformin. Okay. Yeah, because we have access to unlimited peptides. So you guys know I take every cell. I said, hey, I'm gonna try this. Well, what's the other benefits to it? Wait, Metformin is considered a peptide? No. Wait, I don't know. I get it, I got it from our people. I didn't know it was a peptide. They have Metformin, so you can use Metformin. So I tried it and it made me really tired. And I think what it did is it brought my blood sugar too low. And I started getting kind of lethargic. There's longevity effects, this is why hackers will take it. That's what I've heard, yeah. But then there's also potential issues with the muscle building signal and the mitochondria. So if you don't need it, I don't know why you would take it. What's gonna happen when all these bio-hacking people will only make it to like 69, 72, you know what I'm saying? Because we haven't had a whole generation of bio-hackers, all these guys that spend their whole life doing all this crazy stuff, and then they end up living one year longer. I love how they say their real age is 20 years younger. And then like, yeah. Metformin reduces plasma glucose and has been shown to increase glucagon-like peptide secretion. So, yeah, I don't know. I mean, if you go to age, look. So it triggers GLP-1? Is that what it's doing? Yeah, I don't think it's actually a peptide itself. No. But they do. So if you go to mphormones.com, that's our link, right, mphormones.com, you can fill out a form. And then these are doctors that will work with you with peptides, potential hormone replacement, like testosterone, growth hormone-boosting peptides. And then they also work with things like metformin. So, okay, tell me, you're the one who's tested almost everything out. What does your stack look like right now and what's your favorite that you're using right now? For building? I mean, for whatever you- No, no, I'm just gonna give you the categories. For building, I butamorin is crazy. I get really strong on it. Just sleep, I got on that, was it accurate? My appetite does go up, so it does boost growth hormone and so growth hormone helps with fat loss. However, your appetite goes up so much with it, I don't think it's a great cutting peptide, but if you wanna build and get strong, I get like, I'll gain five to six, maybe eight pounds of lean body mass on it and my strength goes through the roof. So I love that. MOTC, still love it, still absolutely love it. So although you do that in cycles. Remind me what MOTC is for, is that a new tropic? No, I thought it was a G. I thought it was a new tropic, is that a new tropic? No, no, so MOTC, your muscles release when you exercise and it really tells the mitochondria to ramp up its function. And so you get better blood sugar, you get more, I just puts me in a good mood. Oh yes, that's why you're paying in red light right now. Well, I was, I was, yeah. I stopped the MOTC because you do it in cycles and then you stop for a while. Okay. So I liked MOTC, I took epitalon. I don't know what that didn't, I don't know if that did anything, but that's supposed to lengthen telomeres, I don't know. Anything you didn't like? Oh yeah, I tried, God, what was that peptide I did, Doug? Do you remember the one that was, it was a norepinephrine serotonin dopamine reuptake inhibitor and it's supposed to be a new tropic? Oh that's the one he took to me. You just remember that was not the name of it. Yeah. Yeah, I remember what it did, it makes me crazy. I think it's a basic ass name too, right? No, it's Testofensin, Testofensin. No, I took the dose that they gave me and it literally made me feel crazy. Then I went off, then I tried a lower dose and it just affects my sleep, not good. It kills my appetite, which I guess some people like, but I don't like the way it makes me feel. I think I might already have a lot of dopamine, such as too much. Are you using it right now? I'm gonna be trying, actually I'm gonna be trying a new one, the NAD. Oh, that's not a peptide, but yeah, NAD is good. With in combination with CMAX, is the one I've been having the best success with in terms of. I like CMAX too. Yeah, just my memory recall. Oh, I'm trying CELANC right now. What? CELANC. What's that? CELANC is another peptide for brain function. It also boosts brain-derived neurotropic factor, but unlike CMAX, CMAX is more of a stimulant. CELANC is enziolytic, but both of them have similar effects in terms of memory recall and all that stuff. So I've been taking that. So test-offense, and you weren't that much of a fan of. No, it made me feel crazy, although a lot of people love it. I didn't care for dihexate really either. I didn't notice anything on dihexate. Yeah, I didn't notice that one as much. But the reviews on it are crazy. Some people just love that. Yeah, I remember they recommended it as one of the favorites like that, but I didn't feel, and maybe that's because I felt too much from CMAX that that felt, that that was like, because I noticed a difference when I take that. Oh, you know what? That's what I gotta talk about. The combination of BPC-157 and KPV, oral for gut health. That's the one I've been using. Holy cow. Is that the one that I'm supposed to do for my psoriasis that you said? On a cream. Okay. Yes, see if they can give you, yes, see if they can give you topical. And bro, you gotta, I can't believe you haven't done this. Well, I wanna, okay, so I'm gonna do my protocol first. I don't wanna do everything at once. I wanna do that first and see how much my psoriasis improves. Then I'll add that on there. Bro. If you look up the data on KPV. Well, let me write it down so I don't forget. BPC-157 slash. No, I know that one. We'll give you the other one. KPV. KPV, yeah, but KPV topical. Yes. Right? If you look at the data on KPV, on psoriasis and eczema, it's crazy. And BPC also for psoriasis and eczema is crazy. Oh, do I need to have the oral, huh? Not the, not the, cause I have the injectable BPC. See if you can get it topical because you wanna put it on your show. No, no, no, no, BPC now. BPC. I have injectable, but you're talking about the oral one. No, for me, for my gut. Well, if I'm doing it for psoriasis, wouldn't it be better if I did it with that? Topical. See if they can put it all in a cream. Okay. Yeah, see if they make it all in a cream. I think you might only be able to get KPV that way, but if you can get BPC, got all these letters. BPC. Well, and if I can't, I don't apologize to the audience for being selfish right here, but if I don't do this, I won't remember. BPC, if I do that and they don't do topical, then it's a pill. Continue to do the injection. It's still systemic. Okay. And then do the KPV cream on your skin. But anyway, the oral cap, the capsules, so I take capsules for gut health, remarkable. It's, and now it took a couple of weeks for me to really start to notice, but my gut is like so much more resilient than it used to be versus when I didn't take it. So it's definitely top three for me for gut health is that combo right there. And it's inexpensive. I know BPC is a cheaper peptide. Not sure about KPV, but great combination. So a hundred percent. But yeah, if you're interested in this kind of stuff, I need to say this every time, don't go online and go gray market. You don't know what the hell's in those research chemicals. Go through a doctor that goes through an actual pharmacy and then we have people at mp1.com. I wish I would have shared that stat. I read some stat on like actually the amount of like gray market stuff. That's like increasing right now, like fake shit, bad shit. I know. I know it's crazy. So I got a shout out that is really cool. On Twitter or X, what are they calling out X? Is it X? It's X. You're gonna love this, bro. All right. I don't even know. I hope you're following these people. Illuminati bot. All right. Bro, if you like, Are you shouting out conspiracy theory stuff? Yes. Oh my God. It's so good. Did you see my meme I posted the other day about that? No. With the like the chart. You're getting deep in it too, bro. You said some weird shit there. What did he send you there? I ask. I was gonna get this shirt as like tally marks and like none. You know what? So you know what? You're new to the conspiracy world. So you still buy everything. We sent us. I don't know this guy for over 15 years. Yeah, but you haven't accepted anything. You haven't let him do it. The last few years have opened you up. No, what did you send us? You sent us this clip that shows that Taylor Swift. Oh yeah. Looks identical to the state. There's a part of me that I like to just kind of like throw that like see what happens when I put it in the group thread with you guys. Because you want it to be. You want it. You want it validation. What's the one you just sent the other day? We're like, what the fuck? Oh yeah. So this pertains to that painting of the girl that's like, they're not even real. Yeah. So apparently like they did some digital scan like some guy online of the she just had to see if it was like to see yeah if it was actually her or not based off of like and if it's real video scores like a 6.5 or above or something like that 6.6 and scored like a 1.2 or something. So according to this analysis, it's not her. It wasn't her face. Yeah. Yeah. So I saw that. They traced the IP address to like. The White House. Yeah. Like two doors like literally the same street. So I saw that and then I saw the people that were countering that argument and they're just like you can actually if you dig on her you can find out about her. You know what though? You guys ever look at pictures of like Biden went before and now and look at his face or who was it? Jamie Foxx who came out and talked and they showed his face before and after and you're like that looks not like. Okay. Have you ever seen so you know Mission Impossible how they have those like masks and stuff that they get real sophisticated with? This there's a slave that won like Nobel awards for being able to literally like make mass of people and voice changing devices indistinguishable. Yep. And she worked for the CIA. So that really exists. Yeah. So there you go. So reconcile with that. So it's facts. Those are people. Anyway, the shout out Illuminati bot. It's good fun. Don't believe it. Wink. Good stuff. It's really hard to find on the go snacks that are high in protein, satiating and healthy and natural. Well, we work with a company called Paleo Valley that makes grass fed meat sticks. They're delicious. They're not dry. The macros are incredible. It's a great alternative to the crappy stuff you find at the gas station. Go check them out. The meat sticks from Paleo Valley. So it's paleo valley.com forward slash mine pump. Use the code mine pump 15 and get 15% off your order. All right. Back to the show. Our first caller is Jason from Nova Scotia. Jason, what's happening? How can we help you? Hey, how you doing? Good. So my name is Jason Murphy. I'm from Nova Scotia, Canada. I'm just going to jump right into my question here and then give you some background information. So I picked up listening to you guys summer of 2022. I don't think I've missed any episodes. So I've heard you talk a lot about walking and cardio and the signal that it sends. So my question is with the idea that cardio sends an endurance signal to the body that can conflict with the strength-building signal, at what point would the intensity level of walking shift from recovery and healthy movement to cardio and interfere with the muscle-building signal? So I'm thinking in terms of intensity, volume, how many times a week, frequency, number of steps, those types of things. And I'll give you some background and the reason why I'm asking the question. So right now, I'm 40 years old. I've got two boys. I've got a high intensity job working for a regional center of education. I own two businesses. I'm co-owner of a micro brewery and a property. I'm sole owner of a property development company. I've got an awesome girlfriend, so life's busy for me. I do like to run. So in the spring, summer, fall, I like to run twice a week, five kilometers. And that takes me between 22 and 1 half and 25 and 1 half minutes to do that. So back in 2022, I was weighing 250 pounds. I was doing a lot. I was trying to get 100,000 steps per week. I was running three times a week. I was strength training six times a week, eating 2,200 calories with the occasional summer barbecue where I got up to three, 4,000 calories. I wasn't happy with my results. Listen to you guys. I decided it was time to try a reverse diet slash bulk. Reversed way too hard. I did listen to your metabolism-boosting episode somewhere back in October and bought the metabolism-boosting pack, so I got the God to reverse dieting, power lift, anabolic. I will say through that reverse, I did get up to 275, but I did hit some PRs. I did anabolic. I followed it with symmetry and then it did anabolic again and I was able to squat 405 and deadlift 495. And after that in January, I decided I need to start a cut again. It went well. I did anabolic. I did aesthetic and I did phase one of cardio. In April, that April, I picked up running again one to two times a week. I aimed for 10 to 12,000 steps a day and I got myself down to 225 pounds. My squat was still 405 and my deadlift dropped to 455. So right now, my goal is to reverse back out of this. I wanna keep my weights below 240. I wanna get up to 3200 calories per day. I plan on doing it slow. I'm hoping to hit 3200 calories around January. My programming plan right now, I'm doing phase two and phase three of symmetry while I'm still running one to two days a week. So I still have a race in early October that I'm still training for. And then after that, I'm gonna head into anabolic advanced. And I'm gonna drop the running because I'm a fair weather runner. I don't like doing it when the weather's shitty. So I'm gonna back off of that. I guess my question is, again, at what point do what signal should I look for to know that I'm interfering with that muscle building signal? Because as I get into anabolic advanced and reverse dieting, I wanna build muscle and I wanna gain strength. Jason, are you like 6'5"? How tall are you? That's what I was just gonna ask that. I'm only 5'11", Chinks. Whoa, you're 5'11", you bulked up to 275 and then you cut down to 225? Yes. Holy shit, what's your body fat percentage at? Do you know? I don't know exactly. I've never measured it. I try and compare it to pictures. I think this summer when I was 225, it would have been right around 20%. Were you jacked or were you fat? Would you look like a 275? So I gained muscle and strength, but I was way too fat, way too fat. Okay, so you do not look like somebody who even carried that, you look way leaner than that. A 50-pound swing in body weight from 275 to 225 at your height is way too much. Yeah, yeah. So you didn't do a reverse diet, you just went, you just, yeah, you binge. And then the cut sounds a little aggressive and you're doing a lot of, what's your goal? What is your goal here? Is your goal just to move and be busy? Do you have a specific goal? I mean, I've got two young boys that are busy. So I want to be able to keep up with them. And I can now, which is good. I want to be strong, but right now, as I get into next summer, the long-term goal is aesthetically, I want to be better than I was this past summer. So I'd like to be 225 or less. And instead of 20-ish percent body fat, I'd like to be 15-ish percent body fat. Okay. Well, I mean, you can do all that with all the running and stuff too. So here's the deal. I'm gonna give you a general answer because context matters here with the question that you asked. If you're training cardio to try to improve stamina and endurance and you're pushing it, that's when it starts to interfere with strength training. It's typically interferes when you're pushing for competing performance goals. Strength and maximum endurance tend to compete. Now, if you're just walking and you're not training walking, like you're trying to go for crazy distance to improve performance, it's fine. It's probably okay. Now context matters if the calories are too low. If you're overstressed, if you're not sleeping enough, then that could also be too much. But generally speaking, it's fine. As long as you're not training to maximize endurance while you're training to maximize your strength. It sounds like you're doing too much and it sounds like you're going too far in either direction with all of this. This is actually a lot easier than it needs, or it's gonna be easier. Way easier. Yeah, than it needs. Like you do way more than you need to. You know what I love to tell somebody who's not like a hardcore, like people that just don't love running, but they wanna keep the current, like just focus on your mile time. Like literally, like you should be able to run a mile under 10 minutes. If you're a relatively fit person, you can improve that relatively quick. And I'll tell you right now, the very few times in your life, are you ever gonna have to chase anybody longer than a mile and you're gonna be just fine. Like this, people go from that to like 30 minute, 40 minute, these huge, like there's, unless you want to be really good at doing 40 minutes of cardiovascular and endurance type training, then there's no reason to train that. I would literally run a mile. Like I would run a mile and improve my mile time and keep it, find a place you love it at where you feel like, man, I feel good when I keep it under X amount of minutes and maintain that. And that only, you could literally do that every other day running before you train. It's that simple on the cardio side. And then the weight training, you don't even need to be doing as much lifting as you're doing. A full body routine, three, four days a week is going to build an epic physique. And if you can still run a mile under eight minutes and you're training three, four days full body, you can build an incredible physique. You're eating what now? What are you eating at 2,200 calories a day? I've bumped it up to between 23 and 24 now as I, you know, I'm trying to reverse. Yeah, I would reverse up to 3,000 while trying to build. I mean, for guy your size, you want to be around that maybe even a little higher. I wouldn't do a quick, I wouldn't reverse super fast. I would give yourself some time and I would just focus on strength and muscle. And I wouldn't worry so much about pushing performance and endurance walking is totally fine. You want to do it like what Adam said. I mean, that's, you know, you could do that a couple of days a week, no problem. Wouldn't be an issue. And that's pretty much it. It's your, because I've worked with so many people, Jason, I'm getting a very strong sense that you're the kind of person that overdoes it. That's just overdoing everything. Overdoing the diet, overdoing it when you bulks, overdoing it when you cut. You think? Overdoing it when you're doing the workout. So yeah, and with your reverse diet, you should not see a 50 pound swing in body weight. If you reverse diet properly, you'll go up from what your body weight is now, you'll go up maybe 10 pounds at most. Yeah. That's about it. And by the way, the reason why none of us answered the actual original question, which is like, where's the cardio threshold? There's actually a cardio threshold is what that means once your heart rate exceeds a certain heart rate, you then dip into cardiovascular endurance versus just, just moving. Just moving. Now the reason why none of us answered that is because that changes all the time. And that you end, and so individual. Yeah. So the more cardiovascular endurance adapted you are, the higher that number is going to be. So in other words, somebody who always runs all the time, they could get away with doing that and never even tip dip. Like they can get away with like a pretty good light jog and never even jump into cardio threshold versus somebody who doesn't ever do that. And then they barely do a power walk and they could dip into their cardio threshold. So it really has a lot to do with your cardiovascular endurance on when does it tip over from being just activity and walking type of movement versus cardiovascular endurance training has everything to do with where your level is. But again, back to my original point, if you just want to like, cause I have very similar goals. I'm over 40 years old. I have a kid. I want to be able to play sports with him and kind of run out. I want to be as, I want to be faster than he is until I no longer am. And so if I can keep my mild time down, there ain't much he can do that's going to burn me out to where I can't sustain that. And that is enough that I'm not ever sacrificing my gains or building muscle and building the physique, which is what I'm more passionate about. I'm more passionate about being strong, looking strong, feeling good, looking good. And as long as I can run around and play with him and kick his ass at most things, I'm pretty happy. And so keeping a good mild time while also building an awesome physique is in my opinion, one of the best ways to do that. There you go. Yeah, I feel the same way. I'll tell you, I'm there. I'm a, you know, hyper competitive person. And I do three races a year with my girlfriend and my friends. And I right now in the fastest of the group and I don't want to lose that. But I'm conflicted because strength training, being strong and building a great physique is more important to me, but I hate losing. So I do, I have a hard time giving up the running for sure. Yeah, well, you're gonna have to make a choice. Yeah, something's gotta get, something's gotta give. And it seems like you're kind of, you go all in on whatever it is you decide you want to do for time and you don't need to do that. You can literally have a nice balance of staying. And here there's nothing wrong with like keeping your mild time down. And then let's say, you know, get a wild hair and you're like, you know what? You're gonna have to go for a race for the next two or three months. And then you can shift your focus of strength training and being the super strong guide and now being more cardiovascular guide. That's what's beautiful about cardio endurance. You can shift that in a week. It's a very quick adaptation. Super fast. The strength training and building the physique and building the metabolism and sculpting a body, that takes consistency and diet and it's slow. And it's like, so I would put almost all my focus on that while also like, okay, as long as I can keep my mild time, so I can still do it under eight minutes. I'm fit enough that I know that if I needed to turn it on for a race in a month, I could turn it on and be ready for that race. That's how I would, if I'm you, that's how I would approach my training is I would always keep a decent mild time, but everything is focused around building the metabolism, building the physique, looking a certain way. And then when I get those, you know, once a year, twice a year where I want to go compete in a race, I know within a couple of weeks I can be ready for that race since I've been maintaining a good mild time easily. Okay, excellent. Thank you. You got it, Jason. Thanks for calling in. All right, bye-bye. Yeah, ultimately it's really just, are you trying to build endurance while you're trying to build strength? By the way, based on what you said, it's like building muscle and strength, slow to come, but also slow to go. Stamina and endurance, slow to quick to come, but also quick to go. Easy, easy both ways. That's why like it doesn't, and I tell you what, if you keep a good mild time where he could, he could- Yeah, you're fine. If he could just mild under eight minutes or even less, and that's seven or eight minutes of running. That's not a lot of running. No. Seven or eight minutes of running. Keep that volume down low. Yeah, you keep that right there, and then the rest is all focused on building a physique and training. I mean, I'm always keeping this in mind too, and even just doing like hit sessions and doing things where I'm like, a little bit of circuit training, a little bit of something to address just stamina in general. I think it's a good thing to consider, but yeah, I mean, it's, you don't really need much more than that to be able to just get up and go. Our next caller is Ona from Spain. Hi Ona, how can we help you? Hi guys, nice to meet you. Hi. I'm so glad to be here talking to you. I've been listening to you from six years ago now. Oh wow. Yeah, and you have been a really good guide and has big support in my journey. So I'm going to read my question. Well, I'm 38 years old and I suffer a menorrhea since my early 20s with no diagnosis. It's not advanced menopause or PCOs. I've always rejected taking bed control pills because I'm against it and I'm conscious of each side's effect. In fact, the last time I tried, I suffered from parasites, cybo and intestinal candida. Around my 30s, I was diagnostic with osteopenia and now it's already osteoporosis and doctors prescribe me HRT, which I want to avoid. A little bit of my background, I was a cardio addict for a long time competing in ultra trial running races until I broke my hip and I've got a prosthesis. At this point, I found you guys but I still push myself along with other forms of cardio such as swimming or riding a road bike for a long distance. Until I finally switch my mind and I've been lifting consistently for three years. But there have been season with more cardio with weights as you call rather than proper weight training. I just finished my abs anabolic and I started to enjoy this kind of training. My current weight is 42 kilograms and 8% body fat measured by my nutritionist with calibers. Last year I reached 38 and 4.5 body fat. Concerning nutrition and kind of restrictive either, I will say I suffer from orthorexia. Eating only cold foods, I never eat out, no processed foods and of course, prejudicing protein between 120, 140 grams per day. My sleep is off from years now as a listener of a Huberman podcast, I'm following all the right protocols but seems not to having any effect. My question is related to peptides. Would you recommend them to avoid HRT? Through one of your episodes, I contacted with Jay Campbell. He told me he has a private forum but his personal guidance as a doctor provides. Could you address me to some experts who can help me considering I'm from Barcelona, Spain? Okay, so have you been told you exercise too much, you don't eat enough, and that's probably why you suffer from, okay, so why are you asking us about peptides? Because I thought when you had this episode with Jay Campbell, I thought it was a good solution or alternative. Alternative to what? To astrogyns or to taking HRT or... Or not exercising as much and eating more? Okay, so I'm gonna give you, listen, I'm gonna give you the answer, okay? If you want the answer, I have it, but I think you know what the answer is. I think you already know and I think what you're doing is you're trying to ask if there's ways you could go around doing what you need to do by taking something else. I'm gonna tell you right now, a peptide's not gonna help you. Peptide, there are peptides that just end hormones, treatment that can help with bone density, but it's minuscule. I mean, you're young and you're already in osteoporosis, okay? Hormone therapy, peptides, osteoporosis, drugs that depress the immune system, they will increase your bone density in a very small percentage or at best, if you're lucky, they'll prevent the continual bone loss at best and they have their own side effects. And none of them would compare to a calorie surplus and falling maps that are symbolic to a T with respiratory... I'm gonna tell you the answer right now. This will do it for you. Whether you do it or not is up to you, but this will 100% fix the problem. Number one, you've already probably done this, but I would check for any nutrient deficiencies because if you have a deficiency in let's say magnesium or vitamin D, then it'll make it very difficult. So, and I'm sure you've already been tested, but if you haven't, it's a very simple test with your doctor. So I would get my nutrient levels tested. Number two, I would go in a calorie surplus. I would eat more calories, a lot more calories, a lot more. I would bump your calories slowly over time and probably get yourself a good thousand to 15 hundred calories more than what you're eating now. Number three, I would only do strength training two to three days a week and I would do no other exercise, no more cardio for you. The cardio plus the calorie restriction is what got you in this place. And what's happening is your body is eating away at itself. If you don't reverse those things, no peptide and no hormone on earth is gonna stop what's happening right now. And by the way, the advice you just gave will crush any HRT or peptide. It's better than all that. You'll see a reversal in what's happening within a four to eight to 12 week period very quickly. Okay, so guys, do you think that if I start to eat a lot more and just exercise three days per week, even if I avoid distractions or peptides or whatever, my bone density will increase? Yes, yes. As long as you don't have a nutrient deficiency, I wanna make sure that that's clear. Absolutely, nothing tells your body to build bone like strength training. And then you need to feed your body appropriately, eating two little calories, losing your period, which you also talked about here. No, yeah, 20 years ago, so. Yeah, so your body doesn't feel healthy enough to even be fertile. So it's not letting you have a period and now you've gotten to the point where your body's eating away at itself and the bone loss is a significant signal. And if you don't reverse that, it's gonna be very bad. So, yes, bump the calories, exercise less, no cardio at all. You can walk, but I would do no more running, no more cardio. No, I'm not running at all. I'm just walking and swimming sometimes. Swimming's fine. Yeah, that's fine. And I would lift weights. I would lift weights two to three days a week. So MAPs at Ebola could be the perfect program for you. And. Yeah, I'm already following. And that'll do it. That will 100% do it. All the peptides, hormones, all that stuff. You might not even notice anything from taking those if you don't do the things that I said. When you swim, how long are you swimming for? Right now, during the summer, because here in summer it's easier to swim about 2,000 meters. I don't know in yards how many, 2,000 meters. So how long, time-wise, half hour, hour, two hour? Like how long? No, it's 45 minutes, 50 minutes, more or less. Yeah, you're fine. You're fine with that. Ona, have you met with a therapist about your relationship with diet and exercise? Because you over-train, you under-eat. Have you talked with anybody? Well, yes. Yes, I have been in therapy, but not with one person, with a group. And my nutritionist is alert of that. So he tried to help, but it's difficult for him to push me to how many calories I need to eat, because he's always telling me, but I'm not following to the teeth. Yeah, Ona, listen, the answer is gonna be simple, but following it is gonna be hard. Right. Because you have a... Yeah, yeah, I know, yeah, yeah. But when I told you we'll do it, it'll 100% do it. And then, so even if I was going to explore HRT and PEP times with you, which I do see as a potential option in the future, this would be what I want to do with you first, no matter what. So I would want to give you the big rock first, the thing that's going to make the biggest difference. Because then, and only then, do those things really work? Because if you put someone on HRT or give them PEP tides, and they're still malnutrition and over-training, you're gonna see little to nothing from all that expensive therapy. So if you really wanna potentially benefit from those PEP tides or from either one of those, we've gotta first get this right here. We've gotta get the calories. We gotta get the calories up and just focus on trying to get stronger with lifting weights. And you're doing that with... And how many calories, how many calories do you think I should reach more or less? Where are you at right now, Daly? About 1,500. Yeah, I know. I would get 2,000. Yeah, I would get you up to 2,000 right away. And then slowly bring them higher little by little while following the exercise advice that we gave. Like a reverse diet or something like that. Correct, yes. I'd get you right to 2,000 right away. And then after that, we would be talking on a regular base. In fact, I wanna put you in our private forum. Are you in our private forum already or no? No, because I don't have a social media platforms. Oh, good for you. I don't use them. Just Instagram to follow you guys or Hubertman. But well, if it's because of the forum, I will just sign up and no problem. Yeah, I wanna give you free access, okay? Because I'd like to stay in touch with you as you go through this process. Because I do know how difficult, as simple as the advice we're giving and saying, I know how difficult it can be to follow. And so if we can be there for moral support, we have a great community in there. By the way, we've got at least a handful of people that have actually gone through the exact same thing before. So there's a great community in there of support, including us. And that, I'd get you up to 2,000 right away. And then I'd wanna hear about how his maps had a ball going. Where's your deadlift at? Where's your squad at? How strong are you? Have we added weight to the bar? And I would be encouraging you to get lifting heavier and heavier. Take your mentality. And cause it's gonna be hard to take your mentality and just turn it off. Take your mentality and point it towards getting stronger. Go ahead and become obsessed with getting stronger for now. At some point, we're gonna have to fix that as well. Okay, but for now, if you could take your focus and the obsessed kind of mentality you have with exercise and diet and put it towards strength, I wanna get stronger. I wanna see how strong I can get. That's gonna take you out of this initially. And I've worked with people worse off than you and we've reversed bone loss through this protocol. And they were worse than me? Yes. I worked with a woman who was so bad with her osteoporosis. It was basically an emergency situation. And we saw reversals to the point where the doctors got on the phone with me because it was just shocking that she improved the way she did. So I've seen this before. You could totally do this. The reason why you are where you are right now is because of what you're doing. So we know what the problem is. That's why I know you're probably gonna get great response if you get out of it. Yeah, but now for my mind is like to jump into the black hole, you know? It's like, okay, there is no H or I don't know. Sorry, because I don't know how to explain English right now, but well, it's really difficult for me. It's like jumping to the swimming pool, but you don't know if there is water or not, you know? Something like that. You have us. You have us. Anna, communicate with us through the forum. Look, here's what's happened. You've developed this friendship with exercise and diet and it's probably been there for you when other people haven't. It's been there for you for a long time, whether you're stressed or scared or depressed. You could always reach for that friend, but like a drug, this friend is hurting you now. So we have to just change the relationship. We just have to change the relationship. And one of the easiest ways to do it is to focus on getting strong. Just remind, just like the mentality you have with your, I gotta do this, I gotta do this. Focus on getting strong. If you get stronger, your bones are building. So if you can lift more weight in the gym, that means your bones are going in the right direction. Anna, how long have you been doing maps on a Bollock 4 now? Just one round now. I finished just the first round. You went all the way. Yeah, yeah, I already finished. Promise me, as you go through it again, to rest as long or longer than we say in there. In between sets. No, I'm doing it because. Okay, three minutes, three minutes longer. Go read a book in between sets. I don't care. No, between sets, I'm listening to you guys. I always listen to your podcast while I'm training. Anna, do you take creatine? Do you take creatine? No, no, I have creatine at home, but I don't know how to take it. And today I have asked my nutritionist, but he didn't answer me. How many grams and when and. Five grams, five grams a day after your workout or on the days you don't work out, just take it in the morning. Five grams a day. That'll also help with your bones. That'll help with bone density too. After the workout. After the workout and on the days you don't work out, just take it in the morning. That'll help too. By the way, if you forget to take it right after, it doesn't matter, just take it every day. Yeah, you can. Take it every day. No, no, don't worry. I'm really a stick on the supplements. Not like you. No, for me it's not a problem. I'm really conscious and you know, constant with the. Five grams post-workout. Yeah, it's actually, it's already been shown to help with bone density. So. No, no. That's why I already bought it. And I have to say that I'm happy about your answer because I prefer to stick on the nutrition and training than Astrogyne or peptide, you know, because it's side effects. I don't, I don't. Us too. Us too. We would always go that direction first. Yes. Yeah. I don't know. We're gonna get you in the forum, okay? Yeah, please. Yes. Okay. Thank you for calling me. Thank you very much. We'll be in touch. Thank you. Bye-bye. Oh, I feel for her. Yeah. That is tough. Yeah, yeah. She, I mean, the answer is very clear. Yeah, yeah. But the problem is, it's gonna be a really hard relationship for her to break. I mean, that's one of those callers where, I mean, you'd like to have two hours with her, right? I know. Because obviously there's something that led us down this path to, I mean, to push that far to where. I've trained one other person like her where I trained a young lady who was getting into osteoporosis because she over trained herself for so long and under eight for so long. She reversed it so quickly because she applied all that stuff. Because her body is literally there because it has no choice. Yeah. She's beat the shit out of herself for years and years and years. Hey, kudos to her for this. She's been listening to us for six years. She's just now done MAPs out of all of it. Yeah. Well, bro, how hard is it? Six years hearing that, hearing us talk about that stuff. The long play. Yeah. Right? I know. All right. Our next caller is Rachel from Pennsylvania. Hi, Rachel. How can we help you? Hi, guys. Thanks for having me on. You got it. So you guys have my background in question, but sometimes past since I initially wrote in, so I'll just update as I go through. Okay. I ran aesthetic in the spring and I was trying to lean out, but I was having a really hard time staying disciplined eating. I eat pound for pound in protein and I was trying to aim between 1700 and 2000 calories when I was trying to cut, but I was probably averaging closer to like 2200, 2400 and essentially doing well most of the day, but then just losing control in the evenings. And so I figured it was probably a combination of doing a little bit higher volume than I was used to and then just having a tendency to deprive myself a little bit. And then when I reintroduced things, it was kind of like a snowball and then a binge, that kind of thing. And so I wasn't really able to consistently get that under control all summer, but I decided to start maps anabolic at the end of July. And since then I've had a bit better control. I'm toward the end of phase two right now and then once a week I do a hot yoga class and then I also average about 20 to 25,000 steps every day. But essentially I have this issue where I'm flipping back and forth. I feel like every couple of weeks between being able to be really disciplined and staying around 1700 calories, but then going back to feeling like I can't stop eating or I want to eat past full. So I'm trying to figure out what the root of it might be and I'm thinking some of it might be a little bit behavioral, but I'm also wondering if my maintenance calories are higher than I think they are. And so when I'm cutting, I'm too low. So I guess I just wanted to see what you guys thought about that. I think that's a good guess because that would be my, so what are you doing to get 20 to 25,000 steps a day? What do you do for work? I actually work from home. So I, well, instead of commuting now, I used to commute like 45, 50 minutes in and out of Pittsburgh. So I get up, I'll go to, on the days that I don't go to the gym, I just get up and I go for like an hour walk in the mornings. And then when I take my lunch, I go for another hour walk. And then in the evening after dinner, I go for another hour walk. Okay. And that didn't, it wasn't always that way. I kind of started with like 15,000 or 10,000 and then it kind of grew each year. And so I've been doing that for like probably the last five, five years. Yeah, okay. Yeah, my guess is you're, I think you're burning more calories than you think you are. I think you might need it. You said there's some behavioral stuff. Have you ever dealt with like, like huge weight fluctuations? Does your, do you have issues with food where if you're really stressed or anxious? I mean, everybody does that, but do you find yourself? I think there's a stress from work and just like a life stress in general. As far as like huge weight fluctuations, not a ton. I mean, I had, I played soccer my entire life through college and I had, I had three ACL surgeries. So I'd have these periods of not being able to do pretty much anything for like seven months and then going back to being really active again. And then, so that happened three times. But since then I don't really run much anymore at all. I just stick to doing weightlifting. You have a, you have a lot of muscle. Yeah. I think you just need to eat more. Yeah. More calories. You might need more fat in your diet. Sometimes the fat's a little low, but you might need more. It sounds like you have a fast metabolism. You have really good muscle. I would try a reverse diet to see what happened. I mean, the picture you sent, you've got a visible six pack. How close are you to that, to that body fat percentage picture that you sent us? I'm probably getting. So, so whenever that photo was taken, that was right before I actually did a bod pod test. And I came up as 17.5 around then. Now I use an EKG scale and I keep all my factors consistent when I do it. Right now I'm like a couple of pounds higher and 1% higher than that. Then I was when I weighed during that time. You just, you got a, you, your body wants more. You're an ex athlete. I can tell you got a lot of muscle in your legs too. And you're walking 20. And the other thing too is you haven't been walking 20, 25,000 steps your whole life. Like you just are like doing that. So that's burning a lot more. If somebody was like, like if I talked to like a male carrier or like I remember I trained one time a soccer ref. He'd been one for like two decades. They've been doing that every day. They've been doing that every day for decades. Like their body has become adapted to that. And so it's not like a huge calorie burn for them. But if you are actively seeking out that many steps and you haven't been doing that your whole life, you've only been doing that say for the last year or less, that's a lot of calorie demand. Even for walking, there's a lot of calorie demand that you're and on a body that is built like yours with that much muscle, you probably need closer to 3000 calories. Rachel, are you eating whole natural foods or eating processed foods? Yeah, absolutely whole natural foods. I'm really into nutrition and cooking and all that. There are a couple other things that I should mention that I don't know if this will change anything. So I went off birth control after being on it for like nine years and I haven't had a period since February now. And then I also used to do more intermittent fasting but I haven't technically been doing it because I have creamer in my coffee. It's just I haven't been having that first like big meal of the day until around noon. And after listening to more research around intermittent fasting, I'm starting to hear more about how it could inadvertently affect your period as a female, so. Rachel, so all right, this is actually kind of simple. And I know what's happening here is for a female, you probably eat more than a lot of your friends and maybe even more than your boy friends. And you're like, am I eating too much? Like what's going on? First off, it can take a while to get your period back but you're so lean, that's part of the problem. You gotta go in a bulk if you want your period to come back. You've been an athlete for so long and I can see in your shoulders you're really lean. So I think you should go on a reverse diet and don't judge where it goes. I bet you're gonna get close to 3,000 calories would be totally fine. The easy way to do this, I don't know how long, have you still, are you still just doing the coffee and cream thing in the morning? Or could you throw a deal? Have a nice big breakfast. Have a good fat protein breakfast. I've been trying to like add that big meal earlier intentionally. Yeah, I bet that'll probably handle your cravings later on the day. If you have a nice five, 600 calorie breakfast, maybe some scrambled eggs with cheese, some vegetables, maybe some throw some steak in there, ground beef and that'll probably handle the cravings later. But you got to eat more. Your calories are too low for your body. You have higher nutrient demands. That's 100% where I'll go with your question. You look amazing though. You could totally compete. Yeah, you got the physique. Yeah, I always get asked. I'm just like, I don't know. I really love, I mean, I'm just such a foodie. I love to eat, love to cook. So I'm just like, I don't know if I want to sacrifice. Well, eat some more girl. Cause you got, yeah, you're plenty lean enough right now and you're moving a ton and you have a lot of muscle. And your intuition is right. What you feel is that your body just wants more. That's it. There's no, like, what you're probably thinking is your maintenance is probably a cut for you and you could get away with easily eating 2800 to 3000 calories. You know how strong you're going to get if you start eating a little more in the gym? You're going to be, it's going to be pretty crazy. Oh yeah, what program are of ours? All right, what are you running right now? What are you currently running? I'm in like the last week of phase two of anabolic right now. Okay. And then you, I see you ran aesthetic. You said, is that those two main programs you ran of ours? Yeah. Yeah. Give her a second anabolic, give her advanced. Yeah, give her anabolic advanced. Now, what's the difference? Is that like a four? Is that four or five days a week? No, it's four days, but it's a totally different program. Yeah. And there's like failure training in there. There's some cool stuff that someone who's advanced like you and if you are in a calorie surplus, I would love to see how you benefit from it. Yeah, you're going to love it. Throw some extra calories on, run that program next and then get back to us. Yeah. I have one other little question that sort of piggybacks off that. If you guys will hear it. Sure. I also had my resting metabolic rate measured in a lab and it came back that I burned just 1,400 calories at rest and it was like 18 grams of expenditure from carbs and then 137 grams from fat. Does that have like any bearing on how I should split my macros? Like I don't really pay. Okay. So I was going to get more efficient with my fats from that, but... You're overthinking it. I mean, you probably are, but so what? I mean, you're overthinking it. I wouldn't have you go that deep unless you're looking to go like super high-level competition and you want to get real ridiculous about it, but now you're overthinking it. Literally everything screams to me, you just need to eat more. But let's use that number for a second just to put some perspective of what's going on here, right? So that's like you could lay in bed and not move all day and your metabolism will burn 1,400 calories. We both know you're not just laying in bed all day. You're fucking walking for three hours and getting 25,000 steps. So you can just go ahead and add another 1,000 calories just from that alone. Minimum three hours of walking a day and then throw in a MAPS anabolic workout three times a week plus trigger sessions in there too. I mean, you're burning a lot of calories. Yeah, I guess I just wasn't sure since I've been doing the steps for like five years now. I wasn't sure how efficient I was at it and if it was really... You're overthinking it. You know how we know you're efficient? Cause you're shredded and you're eating 23, 2,400 calories and you feel like you're not eating enough. You got to listen to your body. One of the challenges that people make when they're fitness fanatics is they get so into the weeds with the numbers that they don't even listen to their body anymore. They question their body. I don't need to do a test on you to know that based off what you said you probably should eat more. Yeah, yeah. I mean, you're in an awesome spot though. Totally. I mean, you just annoyed like 90% of our female. I really hate you right now. You have abs. I don't want to get bigger really. I just kind of want to, I guess tweak some areas like my legs and my butt probably, but... Well, sounds like you got them damn good genetics. So, I can't help with that. I've got the Italian thing going on, so. Oh, there you go. Awesome. Well, I didn't get it. What the hell? What the hell, Rachel? Anyway, that's it. I would reverse. I'd go up in calories, lift. If you find you're building too much muscle, then I would reduce the intensity of your strength training or place more of it on the areas that you want to work on and then avoid strength training or do less of it for the areas you don't. Or this is someone who I'd let do cardio, you know what I'm saying? Go ahead and be catabalic and lose some muscle if you're getting too muscular, you know what I'm saying? So, you're in a good spot. Yeah. Thanks, guys. All right. You got it. Thanks, Rachel. Have a good one. Yeah, every once in a while I talk to somebody who's like, oh, well, everything's working great. Don't question it. I'm glad Doug pulled her pictures up too. I mean, I can tell she was fit, but I didn't know she was that fit. I mean, she's like abs popping fit. Now, her metabolism is on fire. Yeah. And what she's feeling is literally her body's like, I need nutrients right now. I mean, that was her initial intuition. Yep. She literally felt that. And it's like, oh yeah, you're so, that's it. And you may not think that to the point you brought up. I was like, you're eating more than all your friends, maybe even your boyfriend, eating that kind of calories. But I mean. Of course. That's the thing about it. You're a female. Ain't none of them that jab. You're sitting next to your friends and maybe even your boyfriend. Like I'm eating more than everybody. I'm eating too much. Yeah, make you a little insecure. But yeah, you're killing it. Look at all the activity she does every day. Yeah, that's a lot. You know, I wanted to point that out too. Like that's a lot. 25,000 steps, you guys. A lot of steps. Insane. I've had a handful of people. I do that per week. Yeah. I've had a few. That's true. That's actually real. I mean, that's what most people do in a week. That's actually more than what most people do in an entire week. She's doing every single day. And just because it's walking, it doesn't mean you're not burning. You're definitely burning calories, doing that in three hours a day on top of a workout. Yeah. And then a faster time with the body. That's it. Our next color is Ryan from Florida. Hi, Ryan. What's happening? How can we help you? Hey guys. Hey, so I just wanted to start things off by kind of saying thanks to everyone at Mind Pump and especially the four of you guys that kind of started it off for being some great role models in my life at a time that I really needed it and didn't have much guidance. I started my fitness journey when I was 16 and that's when I started listening to you guys. So for the past five years, you guys have had a major influence on my life and got me to where I'm at today. Cool. That's awesome, bro. Thank you. Yep. So for the question. So I'm the personal training director at an eSport of Fitness, which is basically like an LA Fitness. It's a $5 million facility with a thousand daily check-ins on average in Tampa Bay, Florida. I've been working for the company about a year now, a little over a year and went into it with zero sales experience and about a year of personal training experience. I now have sold about $500,000 in personal training invoice and have been the top producer in my district almost every month since I've started. Listen to every episode you guys have and say I'm in a synth way you guys were around my age. What advice would you guys give me to help me grow as a person, meaning like work-life balance, find a purpose, developing my relationships, as well as financially? And I got to just throw it in there because I've always wanted to kind of hear what you guys would have to say aesthetically in terms of lifting. My stats are I'm six one, 21 years old, about 205 pounds and about 15% body fat. Ryan. You're killing it for sure. So real quick. So what are you on the path? How much do you sell per month in personal training? Are you talking about yourself or your team? You and your team? So the way it works is I'm mostly the only one selling the personal training and on average, I mean, I've had a month where I've sold like 60,000 in invoice and then on average, I'll sell about like 30 to 45. You're killing it. Yeah, you're killing it. Yeah, you're doing a great job. All right, so I'll start with you're 20. I'm 21. You married with kids? No. Okay. Wait, wait, wait. Yeah. Stop asking me about work-life balance. I have kids here. Okay, listen, at your age, without the responsibilities of family, kids, that kind of stuff, work-life balance doesn't exist. Now, you want to have some balance so you don't kill yourself. So you still gotta get sleep and that kind of stuff. But if you really wanna like grow financially and crush it in the space, this is the time you test your limits. This is the time you work as hard as you can and you can see what you do. Trust me, you'll have time for work-life balance later on in your life. But now is not the time. When you're 21, what you wanna do is see how far you can push yourself. That's the goal. Okay? And that's- Work on the empire. That's number one. Number two, I would look for mentorship with people who are doing better than you that you could watch, observe and be around. This may be your manager and maybe your VP or your president and maybe someone else. But this is where you're gonna learn and absorb as much as possible. Cause with your energy and your success already, at your age, you can only go up by learning from people who've already been there before you. And that's where I got the most growth in my entire life was through mentorship. Now, do you have aspirations to grow further within the company? Are you planning on doing things off on your own and have any ideas of what that might look like? Yeah, so I do wanna get into a GM role where I'd be kind of like the main guy of my club. I'm not exactly sure if I'd wanna go down like the VP route, just cause I know like how much, like I'll take a lot of years. But I do wanna eventually kind of go in, I love personal training. That's what kind of got me into it. I like that one-on-one with people. So maybe branching out into doing that either on my own or within the company. Ryan, are you? I don't really know. I got lots for you, bro. It's like getting a chance to talk to you is like getting a chance to go back and talk to one of our younger selves, right? We all started in the space, 19, 20, 21 years old. We were all really young. We all were really successful at it. And there's lots of things if I could go back and tell younger self that I would tell myself. First off, are you a big reader at all? I'm not a big reader. I'm trying to read, I just started this week adding 20 minutes a night of reading a book, but not yet. Become one, become one. I didn't start till I was 25, 26. If looking back, if I would have started when I was 20, 21, I'd be that much further ahead if I would have become, I mean, the way you set fitness goals, set reading goals. So start chipping away at books, the same way you chipped away at getting stronger at your squat and deadlift and bench and stuff like that in your sales, okay? That's first and foremost, cause that'll serve you. The stuff I would be reading if I was you, if I was you, if you haven't picked up millionaire next door, that's a must read at your age right now where you're starting to do well and make some good money so you don't blow it all like I did. Make sure you do that. The other one is all things leadership. So I would 100% be diving into like that. That's gonna, and that serves you regardless if you stay within the company, you shift to GM, you move on and build your own thing, get deep in the weeds with leadership stuff like that. And then take advantage of the fact that you're working for a multi-million dollar company and that they were at one day made $0 and now they make millions and millions and be very curious to how they scale to that. Because one, it's gonna serve you in your current position obviously to know more detail about the company but really learn all the ins and out of what it took that company. And when you work for it like that, you have access to that, which is kind of in line with what Sal was saying, which is like, reach out to the VPs and DMs. Sure, but the point is that you figure that out. Like learn about the P&Ls. First engineer the whole thing. Yes, figure out why they spend so much on advertising, what things they've done in the past that failed them, what was the biggest growth years? Why were they, how do they manage X amount of employees? Where's the biggest profit margins? Like understand all the ins and outs of the business. You're in a great seat that if you're asking upper management, those type of questions, they're gonna love you for that. And that's going to serve you so much if you decide to go out and build something yourself. So reading like crazy, I would definitely pick up, like I said, the financial books, the millionaire next door, like I told you, leadership type stuff, hang on and learn everything you possibly can about how that company got built to where it's at. And you stay right there and keep doing what you're doing. Cause as far as where your body fat percentages and your size and the success you're having already, you're killing it right now. And piggybacking off what Sal said, this is the time when you aren't thinking about work life balance so much. It's like, I don't have any, you get to be selfish. I get to invest every ounce I have into myself. I don't have to think about a wife. I don't have to think about a kid. All I have to do is build me right now. And so every waking moment you have, you're investing in yourself. And if you're not, then you're wasting time. Yeah, Ryan, are you, how badly do you want to succeed at this? Like becoming, let's say a general manager. By the way, this is sport of fitness is where you're at. It says sister company to LA fitness. So there's multiple locations, right? Yeah, yeah. There's probably about 150 sport of fitnesses. All right, how bad do you want to be a GM? I'm going to tell you what to do, but you got to follow through. And it's almost guaranteed way to do it. Yeah, I mean, that's pretty much what's right in front of me right now. I want you to contact a person who would be the decision maker with that. And then what you're going to say to them is you're going to say, hey, look, I want to become a general manager as fast as possible. Tell me what I need to do and what I need to deliver in order to do that. And they're going to tell you what you got to do in order to become a general manager. And then all you got to do is hit it. That's the exact conversation I had with my leadership at the time. And they had no choice but to promote me because they gave me some lofty stuff. And I think they thought I wouldn't do it, but I went out and I did it. And then it was like, where's my spot? Where's my position? And managers love that. If you work for me and you said that to me, I'd be like, look at this son of a bit. Okay, here's what you got to do. And then I'd watch you do it. And then I'd be like, done. It's yours. Aesthetically, I'm going to give you advice that's going to help you both aesthetically and with your business and financially. So here's what I want you to do. I want you to be very disciplined and structured with your diet and your workouts. Not because they're going to make you shredded or look good, that's a good side effect, but it's going to help you with your work. If you have your meals planned out, if you have your food ready to go, you do whatever day off you have, you prep your meals, you take them with you to work, you start your day off with a workout every single day, whatever time that is, you go to bed at the same time every night, it's only going to make you better at work. That, and then the side effect of that is going to be the aesthetics. I got one last thing for you. I know I can sit here all day with you right here. I feel like out of your circle of friends, are you the most financially successful? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I'd say from, because I'm actually from Wisconsin and like I'm younger. My friends are in college still and I mean, out of them, yeah, I'm the only one making money right now. This is a big deal, bro, okay? And this also took me a long time to really start to, it was tough. And I still, by the way, talked to my childhood friends, but you really are the average of the people that you spend the most time with, the five people you spend the most time with. So actively go out and look for people doing shit that you want to do in your life. It's probably going to be people that are 10 years older than you, you're 21, you're probably going to be hanging out with 30-year-olds. And befriend them, befriend them, hang out with them, make time for them. People that ask me when I give this advice, I was like, how do you do that? Do you break up with your old, I was like, no, it'll naturally happen. You just make effort to hang out with the new friends that are doing the things that you want to do in your life and it'll just, it'll naturally work itself out. You don't have to have a breakup with your old friends. I'm not saying you can't still talk to your old friends like that. Just you want to make the people that you spend the most time with doing bigger shit than what you're doing. You will naturally get elevated in a group like that. You need to be the loser among your friends. I don't mean be a loser. I mean, you need to be among a bunch of like killers and be like, damn, okay. It'll elevate you for sure. It's amazing what, especially someone who's like you already, who's already motivated and doing well, you put you in a room where you're doing the least and you will naturally get elevated. If you, I don't know if you're an ex-sport guy with that, but it's like you playing whatever sport you like to play and playing either with a bunch of kidney gardeners or going out and playing with a bunch of college or pro athletes, what will naturally happen is you will elevate or you'll sink to the other level and that what happens to a lot of guys your age who are still stuck on the friends they went to college or high school with is they allow these good friends who they have, they love them, they love them like family, okay? And they allow them to bring them down to their level because it just naturally happens that way. Yeah, Ryan, one more thing I'm gonna add to what Adam's saying. This is important and you know why we're excited because it's not every day we get our hands on somebody. I'm gonna add two more things after you. Last thing I'm gonna say is this. Don't think you're missing out on anything. This is a big mistake, young guys with a lot of talent. They think, oh shit, I'm missing out, man. I should be going out and partying. Listen, you're a man. You're only gonna become more attractive, you're only gonna become more popular as you get older and more successful. You'll have plenty opportunities for that shit when you're rolling in money and you're successful and your buddy's just graduated, barely making 50 grand a year. So you're not missing out on anything. So if that ever creeps in your head, tell him to shut the F up and get out because you got a goal and you're gonna crush that goal. Vegas and Miami is way more fun at 30 when you're jacked and you got deep pockets, trust me. Just keep doing what you're doing, man. That's it, man. Don't overthink it. Stay focused and you're gonna keep crushing it. Keep us posted though, man. It's good to hear that we... Put him on the forum. Are you in our forum? No, no, no. All right, we're gonna put you on the forum. Yeah, I'll put you on the forum. I want you in there. Yeah, I want to keep up on you, man. Thanks, guys. I appreciate everything. You got it, man. I wish... I love, you know... Keep an eye on that. You get excited like I do. When I talk to a kid like that, I'm like, oh, shit, let's do this. Get it. Yeah, I could talk to him for... I mean, it's like going back and thinking about all the things that you do. I think we touch on the most important things, dude, because the hard thing is gonna be hanging out with your buddies who are not in the same place. And then the like, am I missing out on a trap? Yeah, that happens to the best of us. 100%. Kids killing it though. 100%. Look, if you love the show, head over to mindpumpfree.com. Go get yourself some free fitness guides. They're all free and they're all for fitness. You can also find all of us on social media. Justin is on Instagram. Mind Pump Justin. I'm on Instagram. Mind Pump DeStefano. And Adam is on Instagram. Mind Pump Adam.