 to solicit public comments on the town plan this is one of two meetings the second one will be at the beginning of the second meeting on September 13th where additional comments will be solicited and possibly depending on the nature incorporated into the plan. I'll open it up to the floor. Any comments on the town plan? Yes sir. And when we call on you please state your name so that way we can have it for the record. Yeah my name is George Holt Randolph. Can I approach the board? Give a hand after. Please. Comments. Before I start I just wanted to say the revised plan I thought was outstanding. The planning committee did a great job. What I liked about it especially was section eight which was the implementation of the plan. They have a specific plan. You know each one of the goals that are in the plan itself and I thought that was a good departure from the current plan. Some suggestions for further improvement. I've designed a couple of covers for the town plan. We'll see that right underneath there. The current cover is kind of bland but this may be more eye-catching. I can revise that any way you want if you want a different photo in there. The reason I did that we talk a lot about our capability is our strength economic as well as cultural education and the arts but there's some mention of our farming capability so I think this will add you know that we've also got strength in farming in Randolph. The second comment I have is the introduction. Right now we have a chapter. It's called chapter one and it's also called introduction. You might want to consider having an introduction up front before the chapter one. What I would recommend is something that would really go into what we're proud of in Randolph and you know we can talk about our educational institutions. We can talk about cultural assets and we can talk about recreation. There is something in the current plan similar to this but it was outdated in some respects and what I did I took out all of the non-relevant items and redid it like this. So I'm recommending that we have a separate introduction and have this as the lead in to the plan. There was some discussion about what a plan is supposed to incorporate. As far as I can tell we've done everything what the Vermont requirement says should be in the plan. The reason I'm seeing this introduction is good up front I think we ought to get rid of the current chapter one. We talked about all of the requirements for a plan and that's good while you're building the plan but once the plan is built it's not really necessary to carry that up front. I would recommend putting that as an appendix. Those are the legal requirements. The other thing is there was some comment about you know how folk was really appropriate to be in a town plan and I looked at a dozen town plans from other towns around. You'll see in there one from Essex and one from Huggerton and the Essex town plan has something like 65 photos throughout the entire plan and they've got a really nice cover it's got a lot of photos on it. The Huggerton plan that's a town that's only about one through the size of Randolph and yet they go into photos quite a bit. You'll see their cover photo and also they highlight one of their strength and that's the Huggerton battle field. As far as other comments inside the plan itself you may want to take a look at the Warrant Technical Enterprise Center as you mentioned in a number of places throughout the plan but I understand VTC is trying to get rid of that property so it may not be relevant once the plan gets up. The other thing is the Randolph Economic Development Council but all we say in the economic development chapter chapter 8 is you know we're going to hope that the council continues to do good things basically but there's not really any guidance you know what the council should do. The current plan had an attachment to chapter 8 economic development and that was passed to the beginning of the Economic Development Council back in 2012. The last item you have in there is what that attachment to chapter 8 was the Economic Development Council guidance. I'd recommend that you provide this once again to the council. There's a lot of things that's discussed in there you know we talk about possible tax incentives for new businesses. We talk about what was called an ombudsman at the time and that person was to speed up the permitting process you know they can walk new companies right on through the process to get them started. Right now they have to do it on their own it's a little bit tiresome and a lot of other good things in that so it's up to the board if you want to pass that on to the Economic Development Council for the time. That's all I have Dylan any questions? Any other comments? We're on the public hearing for the town plan when we move into the select board meeting if you want to ask that question. Yes. I believe that's only a town meeting where we have to authorize that so you're all set. Stagecoach did submit suggestions to Marty. Everything from physical infrastructure to financial support to joining forces and encouraging people to ride public transit versus using their own vehicles. The appendix about transportation obviously showing his age things have progressed since then so we submitted an entirely new appendix piece to Marty essentially bringing it up to what the current status of Stagecoach is. As far as in revision to policies within the transportation section which is chapter three. Integrating the land use of transportation planning including collaboration with Stagecoach to reduce energy environmental impacts of transportation resulting from development. Things like the complete streets planning system where public transit in space for public transit is taken into consideration in a piece of the planning everything from areas where buses can pull in and safely be out of the roadway so that people can get on and get off and also the bus itself is safe as well as bus shelters and things of that nature of an infrastructure nature and again for the construction projects as they come online or as they are conceived again utilizing those complete street standards so that there's space for people to use public transit because if they want it they can't access it then. Also as far as some action steps again working with Stagecoach to work especially the larger employers to encourage them to both support Stagecoach financially but also to have their employees access Stagecoach to use public transit to get to work whether it's LED whether it is broadcasting or whatever those are possibilities part of bus stops in the future those companies want to have their employees getting there at a given time and those employees are plastered in areas like Bethel, Randolph, Royalton, etc. there may be options that we could provide to those employers and employees which would reduce the traffic congestion which would reduce parking needs at those facilities etc. Also continuing our relationship with Town to Town is already a considerable and generous funder of Stagecoach and we are very grateful for that we want to continue that going forward in the fiscal year that just closed which is for us fiscal 18 close in June the ridership just in Randolph alone jumped well over 50% versus fiscal year 17 as a combination of our bus services and our volunteer drivers who are using their own vehicles to take people door to door for pretty much anything whether it's medical needs grocery shopping social things whatever the case might be but Randolph residents alone their ridership increased well over 50% in the last fiscal year alone. Just as an example that's due in part to the support that Randolph has provided financially and logistically. Thank you. Any questions or comments from the board? Okay any other questions or comments from the public? Sorry you can see it. Go ahead. I just have a couple of grammatical errors, it really makes a lot of sense to sit here and say I should have an error at the end, it's literally that amount of detail. Okay. Adopter of the UK, was there just forwarding them to you? Yeah. Or to Marty? Basically spelling corrections. Yeah if you share one with me and then I will share with the Rope Break Committee. On energy, it is, how do you see the, the, the appropriate, appropriate to think? Which is the attendance on energy. It talks about the fact that industrial wind power stays cited in Vermont. I think it's just a remnant from the last town plan type of language. And I just wanted to make the point that it really was not a relevant statement because industrial wind largely is dead in Vermont. It's just not. We have a governor who has a policy and with the Public Utility Commission it's not actively promoting large industrial wind turbine. So it was just an inaccurate reflection of the current state of the development that's occurring in the state of Vermont. So my suggestion was just to eliminate that sentence because it is just a little irrelevant in terms of the current status. Sorry, Brooke, what page are you on? Which sentence? It's Appendix E, the energy section, which is like 60 pages into the document. Yeah. It's just one of those attachments to the town plan. No, I'm in there. I'm just, there's a lot of, there's one paragraph that says include wind, solar, hydroelectric, et cetera, et cetera. I'm not sure if that's what you're referring to or something else. Let me grab it. Okay. Thanks. All right, thank you. It's on page 63. It's very last paragraph that halfway down. This is small and larger scale, commercial, small and larger scale. Let me try that again. Small and larger commercial scale wind turbines are being installed in Vermont. I think if you just take that out, it's a little bit more reflective of reality. Or if you want to leave small commercial scale, I don't know of any wind projects other than just like individual, you know, personal turbine seconds. I think that's really actively being cited at this point. Great. Thanks. I took note of the page, but would you also, when you submit your suggested edits, could you also point that out? Thank you. Just me. Are you all set, Brooke? Thank you. Okay. Jerry. This is a process issue. I don't think I'm alone in having difficulty finding the town plan until someone found it and showed it to me. It is on the website, but it took us a word search to find it. And I think before the next hearing, I hope that we can find a way to distribute a little bit better in case anyone actually wants to read it. I don't think I'm alone in saying it was very tough to find it. Okay. Thank you. Yeah, that's another agreement. I should be able to pull one up. Okay. Any other public comments concerning the town plan? On Jerry's comment. Does that mean that there will be another hearing? You'll do a second. Yes. On the town plan, it's noted that it will be September 13th. Any comments or questions from the board? Yes, ma'am. I have a question. I'm Joan Allen. Would you accept comments by a letter? Because I have a bunch of things that took me too long to go through here. And I just read the plan once because I was able to find it this afternoon on the website. So I really don't have time to put my comments until here. But I hope to be able to submit something like the two now in the next hearing. Is that a valid way to submit comments? Yeah, if you would submit them to Adolfo and Marty. Okay. I think that would be an acceptable way to submit them. I don't have to do with questions about what exactly you're planning to do with flood zones, flood plains. I wasn't sure if it was completely information or just not clear to me what the town sort of vision was for moving ahead, doing things, allowing certain kinds of activities in the river for desiccant river corridors. Okay. Yeah, if you could submit that. There may be follow up for clarification, but please do that as soon as possible for that reason. So that way we can balance back and forth. Okay. Anyone else? All right. I'll close the public hearing for the town plan and remind you that it is on September 13th. It's proposed to be at the beginning of the same board meeting that night. So similar to tonight's format. That's when it'll happen next. All right. September 13th. All right. I'll call to order the monthly meeting of the select board. At this time, we will take public comments. The public comments are for items that are not on the agenda. I want to announce to the select board the formation of a group in the East Valley, called the East Valley Community Group. Betsy, Ray, and Eric are also members of that group, as well as others. The East Valley Community Group seeks to promote neighbors, meeting neighbors, and celebrate life in our villages of Northeast and South Randolph. Our goals include completing a renovation of the historic East Valley Community Hall in East Randolph to serve as a regional resource in a collaborative on the needs of the East Valley inhabitants. We're going to be working with the RACDC. You shut that door for me. Yep. We've had several meetings with Adolfo to discuss our efforts going forward. And during the next month and weeks, we'll be mapping out our strategies and timelines as we move into this project. We wanted to announce ourselves as the select board because you're aware of the formation of our group. We're hoping that we can kind of support the select board in our efforts to renovate the hall. And we look forward to coming in and reporting to the select board on our efforts as we move forward. Any questions for us? Sure. Yes, you can. Since all three of you are standing, could you state your name? I'm Betsy Ray. Betsy. Eric Kenyon. Okay, thank you. There's a little bit of, there's actually two approaches to our committee. And one is certainly reviving neighborhood and the East Valley because the geography work was separated. And the renovation of the hall. So there's kind of two approaches going on. So there's a lot of different people helping with different aspects of that. The renovation of the hall, we're probably, I'm sure, different. These fellas and I don't know, will be in from time to time to give you updates, ask for money, more money, not working on some fundraising. Like we say with grant money and things like that. But we do want to keep you up to date on it. I know Adolfo is, and Adolfo is a busy man. And so we just want to kind of make sure you know that we're alive and well. And it has started some meetings with Adolfo and Julie around the grants and funding and getting a plan together with the buses. Yeah, just to follow up with what Betsy said, knowing that the town and Adolfo and Betsy, I mean, excuse me, Julie at RECDC are busy folks. We're all volunteering our time to help try to move this project forward. And so we're just looking forward to, you know, getting more involved in the community and working on the hall and coming to you folks from time to time just to bring you up to speed on where we are. Do you know where we're at? Not exactly. Well, you located some grant money here a couple of weekends ago for a structural engineer matching grant. And when we get that information, we'll have a lot more information about, of course, what it's going to cost. One of the things that we have a magic wand wish is that the structural engineer will think that it's okay to use the up scares of the hall. The fire marshal we've been in contact with the fire marshal, if he's had been at meetings with us and looking at what needs to be up to code for upstairs. The downstairs has to have the bathrooms. Just a lot more going on downstairs. So we might be able to start renting. All right. Thank you. Any questions? I totally support what they're doing over there. I've been in contact with Betsy back in March. So she's making, they're making a lot of effort over there. I've been following their email chain. And so they've got working with Paul Bruner preservation trust to work on some grant stuff. So I think they're the email list keeps getting bigger. So I think they mean like you guys are making a lot of headway within the community. Thank you. Okay. Any other public comments to be heard at this time? Any questions? I guess we don't have any questions. Are you looking for more questions for you from the public? Zach? Yeah, thank you. Yeah, so I'm sorry. Oh, yeah, Zach Freeman. I'm with the Rochester Randolph areas, the York's trails Alliance, the local outdoor recreation club here in the central Mon area and the town of Randolph and the surrounding towns as well. I'm here to just speak on behalf of the outdoor recreation component that's in, in the town plan for consideration. There could be a stronger component in there as we move forward. There's a lot of examples of other communities that have written a very robust and well rounded outdoor recreation plan. As you guys all well know, there's quite a bit of the energy right now growing in the outdoor recreation world here in town. And that does encompass the broad range of outdoor recreation sports. And with a little bit more verbiage in there, the town could do itself good with moving forward. One of the main things that's coming down the pipeline is Phil Scott announced Vorac. And one of the first programs of that a town here in Vermont is going to be named the outdoor friendly recreation town pilot program. And so I think if we had a little bit of a stronger, a stronger presence with outdoor recreation and it's time to apply for that. I think that Randolph has got a very good chance of learning that. I can share with you guys all of the details on that afterwards. I'm fine also with sharing another email that would have Gunnison, Gunnison, Colorado's parks and recreation plan that they wrote for their town granted the towns two and a half or three times as big as Randolph. But there's key components of that plan that really stand out and it's very well worded and helps all of the local clubs and the community move forward. So I would just in closing just if there's any consideration of a more robust outdoor recreation component to the town plan, I would be glad to follow up with an email and some highlights that could be added. Thank you very much. So I would just suggest maybe Zach forward that stuff to Delpho so that take a look at it. That be okay? Yeah, sure. All right. All right. Any other comments to be heard that are not associated with the agenda? Okay. We'll move out of public comments and welcome the chair so I can turn it over to her. We're at the approval of agenda and had a question about an agenda item later from Mr. Mazzucco. So we tabled that until we got to that part of the agenda. So we got to that item? Yeah. So around the consent calendar? No. Approval of the agenda. I do have one item that I was hoping to ask the board to consider adding under other business. It was a bid package that was submitted to the town for replacement of the septic tanks in the Randolph center garage. Town staff are just not able to pull the material together in time for the actual notice to be put on the agenda. So the board feels comfortable adding it to other business. We could certainly add it and discuss it. And if it doesn't feel comfortable voting on a contract that was not duly warned on the agenda. We can push it back to the next like board meeting, but the release commenced the conversation during this meeting. There was a question from the public on the agenda. I have a question. Are you able to tell us what the topic of the executive session is? Yes, it is a confidential communication between the town attorney and the governing body. You approve the agenda? Second. Motion to second. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Stand. Motion carries. Next we have the consent calendar. Motion to approve the consent calendar. Second. Motion to second. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Stand. Motion carries. New business. The dog complaint. Maybe the owner of the dog complaint. We have our animal control office. We have our animal control office. We have our animal control office. We have our animal control office. We have our animal control office. We have our animal control officer in the audience today, Milo, I would you give an update on how the issue started and where we are. There's an incident up on East Bethrill Road. owners who had a German Shepherd who was apparently off the property, on the neighbor's property, ended up getting into a dog fight, again, without the witnesses here. I have bits and pieces of details. The other, I guess, people lab mix. Another dog that was visiting or hangs out up there, ended up severely injuring the dog, dragging it out into the road, and the owners of the dog had to put down. The question, again, without having the actual witnesses and individuals involved, it's difficult to determine the details of Is this a vicious dog case? Is this, you know, the dog that ended up on the premises was off the property? Am I understanding from the owner of the pickle lab mix? I was expecting him to be here. He was adding feces dog on his porch, and the defending dog, the dog that ended up being put down was over on Jason's property, rooting for garbage, and then she went over to the other trailer where the pickle lab lives and sped it on the porch, and apparently that's where the attack initially took place, and another witness said they then saw them dragging the German Shepherd down the road. So again, still trying to weigh details about the owners here, and the witnesses, it's hard to know. What were the details about the German Shepherd? We have the town staff taking the report on Friday and began to work in accordance with the dog ordinance policy with the town to share with the appropriate staff members, the investigation, bring this to the attention of the board, hold this type of communication with the community and the board to investigate. We have had both Milo and also Marty, the engineer and zoning administrator speak to a number of different people, including the dog owners involved, also speaking to various witnesses, ensuring that the appropriate people were communicated with, in terms of telephone calls, Milo, you spoke with people over the telephone and told them that it's deceased and was hung up on. They had a history of complaints against the author, dogs were involved in a lot, and the owner stated he let his dog out, then pay attention, he went off property. When I tried to explain to him the dog ordinance and having his luck board hearing over the situation it's a vicious dog incident, he hung up on me, I called him back and basically said, yeah, I'll just deal with it myself and if the dog comes on the property, I shoot it. I've had other conversations with these owners that have just screened that with profanities so that's the amount of communication I've been able to have with them. I spoke with Steve Churchill, who's the owner of the pitfall lab I guess he's a rescue dog, he said he's gotten him trained, I've been emailed from Marty's method dog, he said he's a friendly dog. Obviously dogs behave differently when they're defending their property and when there's other dogs involved and they get a lot of brutality. As far as the ordinance goes, it's a horrible situation obviously all around. Mr. Churchill is supposed to get his dog registered today when I spoke with him this morning. He might get a rabies shot updated because it was a rescue and he didn't have the paperwork. I was expecting him to be very speak more on the situation over there. My understanding is that the full dog has been running loose and on their property a lot. Again, it's about this is all piece email that I've gotten from various people. Mr. Churchill, it's not called on the peace team it was called on the private side. As with Milo is sharing with the board we've had various conversations very in detail with all the parties involved. We tried to bring them here to share their point of view and their perspective with the board. Just given the nature of the incident we're not entirely certain if the incident occurred started on private property and then moved on to public property which would make this not a direct violation of the ordinance or if it started on public property and all dogs were on public property at that point it is more of a direct violation of the dog ordinance. Without the witnesses being here it would be a challenge to determine best course of action other than the dogs were not licensed and there was no proof of their vaccinations which is something that we're working on now. But the dogs that are still alive are problems. They run around and get complaints about them? I've never had complaints about those dogs. It was the dog that's deceased and those owners I've had for a long time numerous complaints about they would tie their dogs out and the dogs would barge for hours and hours and hours and they started letting their dogs out just a few weeks ago we went down there and the neighbors called us because their other dog St. Bernard was running loose they had just let it out and then left the property and it was running all over the properties on this buffalo but I've never had I didn't even know St. Churchill was living on this old property or that he had a dog and the other dog the smaller dog that I guess ended up participating in the new tag belongs to Santina that's young and I spoke with her the response I guess she hangs out there a lot but doesn't live there the response I got from her regarding registering your dog is I don't have the money and I explained to her well my suggestion would be to find the money and get your dog registered because by state normal coordinates unregistered dogs can be confiscated and destroyed so get your dog registered and the risk of sounding too callous hasn't the problem solved itself basically sounds like it if I keep the other one home but we can't order anything on that one or was that one that one wasn't involved right get that dog registered and I think there's not much that we can actually do about at this point that we're not going to see anybody here to talk about it so I'll give it any action to take view I think it's resolved so just for a matter of documentation is there a written warning that goes out to the owners of the unregistered dogs? Is that a physical record? is that just a verbal conversation I'd love to make sure I get your registered for your dogs and then at that point I'm pretty confident from my conversation with Mr. Churchill that he's going to get a dog registered he just needs to get a baby shot because it is not the certificate from the previous owners for me I don't know if she's going to get the dog registered or not from there we can either choose to Santina that we're talking about the dogs do we need more details do we need more details from us pretty much, well they didn't have the time oh we're gone they're on their own property I think we're done with the topic I think at this point the only thing to do is register the dogs I just registered mine I have one coon dog that needs a vet visit for a review shop sounds to me like that's what needs to happen I think that's pretty much it great it's done the agenda thank you you're in a meeting now next on the agenda is the general briefing from the director of reclamation seems to have stepped out come back to that I guess that would be me so again for the record Paul Haskell from my futures and resident up on Fish Hill Road I don't know that I have a lot to add other than the progress that's been made not necessarily in order of timing or importance but I met with Perry Armstrong earlier this week along with my colleagues and went over the details I don't know that we added anything to the conversation other than kind of close the loop on the various loose ends the application that is one way that you initiate the formation of a ready district from at least 20 voters in the affected area was I didn't know where it ultimately needed to land so I gave it to Adolfo that seemed like the best and Joyce wasn't in but I did talk to the clerk's office and we all agreed that was let's let the because there's not a well this is only the second ready that has been formed in Vermont so there's but I believe the process is somebody should at some point verify that there are 20 voters and there's there's a way of 20 voters on that list or more the other way that that can happen by the way is that the select board can simply on their own motion initiate the process so that's where we are with that in turn I've also provided to Adolfo a draft copy of the proposed bylaws for the district these are pretty much boilerplate for the most part the one other than defining the geography they are the exact replica of the bylaws that were drafted and enacted in the new very ready they describe the governance it's a little bit simplified here in Randolph because we're all staying within one town boundary in the end the select board will appoint five members to that the governing board itself can then add another four members need not be members of the district so that allows expertise that might be needed and then beyond that the business plan of the summary of the business plan for the proposed district is and our planned next steps as we move forward are to pre-subscribe how many people here know what the fuller brushman was some people who either are very great students of history are some of us who have been around long enough to remember when somebody would come around door to door selling brushes and eventually they would buy them online still as long as you have internet exactly some of us struggle with but we will do essentially canvas the neighborhood door to door our goal will be to pre-subscribe to have enough pre-subscription so that we have some reasonable assurance that we have 150% of what our anticipated debt service would be on building the network and 150% of greater of course the importance of that is the more margin that you have in terms of the perceived revenues the lower the interest rate would be and so we have had conversations with local financing with the local banks we will also be talking to VEDA the Vermont Economic Development Authority they have specific language that enables them to finance projects like this and the ceiling is several million dollars what we would need in order to qualify final steps are to build the network the ready governing work will continue in perpetuity to own that asset and manage it and provide governance to a policy governance it will be operated by a private entity and almost certainly that would be consolidated communications the quid pro quo for the quid pro quo in this is over lashing the fiber onto the existing copper and that rings roughly 25% of the cost of building a mile of fiber just by removing the step called make ready and it almost completely eliminates any of the delays that are often associated with that locations on poles they have to be moved up and down and sometimes that involves two or possibly three other parties who are involved in that and so eliminating that step eliminates a lot of money and a lot of delay and the construction with any luck will proceed before the snow flies a reminder that the fish hill stock farm loop that we are talking about in the tributaries this is and I told pork parent really wants to know that this is not the last thing we intend to do in Randolph and it's really just the proof of concept pilot project in doing this particular project and type of project here as you can envision the stock farm fish hill community really presents an awful lot of variation there's great sections of that road that are pretty darn vacant farms and quite great distances that have to be traversed and then there are other areas of it that are obviously fairly thickly populated and so it presents good proof of concept in terms of the financials the real key to this thing is the community organizing effort the going, the fuller brush, the going door to door whether it's virtually or in person and by doing some of the other things that we intend to is an excellent, you know, improving that model and bringing the subscription rate up to levels that we're talking about So going to the concept that the town has to improve the creation of this and then the town appoints board members of this how is this different than say the Burlington electric model or the Burlington telecom model? Well the couple of other models Burlington is a telecom originally was designed as a telecom department of town government but that one started, it has now been spun off to a private entity, another company but it was separate for a while in there when it created all that debt it was not separate, it was a department I don't want to relive any more but one of the big issues was the city actually whether it was inadvertent or not ended up financing a lot of that debt because they were paying bills that there wasn't. So if the town creates this and the town appoints members to the board, how can the town not have any liability? The town's liability is very specifically as far as financial liability, that's handle statutorily at least a dozen, well maybe I'm exaggerating, and at least four or five places in Vermont statute the towns engaging in telecom may not access the grand list or the towns finances which are a product of the grand list or specifically the financial future, or the financial any telecom district that's born can only cover its debt service from the revenues of the project and that's stated in other words, so if it goes bust it goes bust and for they thought that I'd predict that were that to happen, there would be no recourse to the town or to the residents the owners of the debt would be their only recourse would be to the assets that the particular project has, which are the fiber on the pole. And the connection, the other asset would be the subscribers. So the closer analog which I meant to go to is EC fiber and EC fiber is constituted under a separate also recent addition to Vermont law which enables a telecom district municipal telecom district to be formed, that's more closely modeled on, say, solid waste districts in that case the same language prevails that says none of the financial shortcomings of the organization will fall back on taxpayers. So it's a similar model, in that case it's the one thing that that type of model does create ability, it's only designed to take entire chunks, entire towns as it's and by the way there's another telecom union district that's attempting to be formed up in the Montpelier middle sex, several like half a dozen or more towns that voted at their town meeting to join those. The difference between a telecom union district and a ready district is that the ready district has a much more streamlined formation process. After that all of the processes by which for example the case of EC fiber as you, well no, you appoint somebody to be the town's delegate and alternates to the government board. So if electricity could come back to the town through should there be a failing of that project it would be the same thing that we're talking about here. There is a firewall very clearly between that organization and unless the town in some way acted in, you know, with negligence and malice of forethought the town would otherwise be in the same way that you're precluded from having responsibility to sort of waste district failings or any of those kind of things. Here's the little part of the story. So what I like about this concept is that this can happen faster than what EC fiber can apparently do for us in this region and the reason for that is that I attended a hearing down in Windsor three weeks ago Governor's staff was touring Windsor I was invited to come down and listen and testify on this situation about the importance of broadband access to the rural locations and so in listening to that conversation exactly what Paul's saying is that in order for you to get space on the pole there's a quite lengthy process and the lady who manages that process told us it's six months to get permission to be on the poles here. It's a long drawn out application process. It's cost them a lot of money. This project if this can work with Consolidated and they Consolidated becomes the managers of that fiber that's attached to the pole and it seems to me that's a no brainer right off the bat because they're the ones that control that space or they're part of that space anyways. So this is going to happen in their space so from this conversation and listening to people testifying about it the economic impact of this is there's actually realtors that were saying look we're taking people out to look at all these really beautiful houses and these properties out at the end of these back roads that for sale and they want to buy them but as soon as the kids pop out of the car and there's no connection they're not looking at that property. They're moving on to find something else. So this is a big problem around the entire state is how to get more broadband access to the rural areas so this model I think was created to help move this process along a little faster. So I don't foresee us giving up our position when we see fiber but I think that to create one of these reddies especially in this particular region over here seems like a good experiment to see just how this could work and maybe this is a faster quicker solution to get us to a better economic situation with those areas. So in that area Paul, how far does Comcast if that's considered high speed how far do they go out? I mean in what percentage is not covered in that area that you're talking about? So we've looked at that in two ways. One is the first one is they come up Fish Hill about the first mile or so. Okay. They come up Stock Farm just about to a little bit past Clover Hill road. So that's about a mile on that road. We're not counting in our preliminary assessment we're not counting on those sections adding very many customers though several of the people who signed the petition who live in areas that are served by them said we will sign up for you this service in Harvey. Well there's a lot of discontent with Comcast and I'll show you my own personal experience so you all know where I live. So I'm only like 500 feet off the highway. Comcast is at the pole below my house 300 feet away. They will not connect me. Now I'm relying upon a DSL connection coming out of BTC which isn't very fast so in order for me to actually get access and get data that I need in my office down here I'm calling my employee in Strafford asking her to log in to her computer because she's on EC fiber so that I can check my inventory at 7 o'clock at night and so this is a huge problem and Comcast is not interested. I offered to pay for the connection. I said I'll dig the trench I'll put the pipe in you know I'll run the wire for you and I'll touch it. They're very standard authors about expanding their network anywhere as there's not enough traffic so that I believe is why we're in this jam. NEC fiber has no intentions of going down 66 because Comcast is covering it. So if this is such a good idea why doesn't Consolidated Services do it on their own? Captain. I mean they are partners in this. I will tell you that about 12 months ago we were there at our house on Fish Hill Road when the fellow who was nominally the president of Fairpoint Vermont at the time. You brought two really good Vermont bottles of wine too. We had been in conversation with them for quite a while and now it was sort of we want to actually get down to brass tax on this. They're saying look internally we're not the least bit enthused about the kind of infrastructure that we're currently able to provide for most of our world customers. But we are if we can get access to fiber in the pole without adding a liability on our balance sheet and we get to add the customers the contract for the customers on the top end of the balance sheet where we're all in but we don't have we they Fairpoint now Consolidated just doesn't have the wherewithal to do their current model is to move to get more of the what are called DSLAMS digital subscriber line access something or other modules closer so that there might be one a little bit closer to Perry than VTC and that would change his speed characteristics a little bit but they would much prefer and their network is fed with fiber. It's the last model part of it that they don't do and it's really a function of capital. So along the lines of the report customer report for Comcast there isn't a great track record for Consolidated either why wouldn't we bid this out if time wasn't a concern why wouldn't we bid it out again taking that $6,000 to $7,000 a mile out of the project changes so the model we're looking at for example just to turn this around the other way model we're looking at is compared to EC fibers roughly $99 a month service we're talking about $49 a month because we're bringing the cost out of that that big piece of cost adds an awful lot to the financing model and it's pure dead weight and the question about fair point service, fair points difficulty of providing quality service is a function of not having the technology. Most of their complaints at least as far as their broadband side are complaints from people like Perry who have cell but live far enough away from the access point with enough traffic going on between them and that access point that the service suffers and falters the technology is just it's just too weak to do what it's doing. They would also tell you you put fiber up and you've eliminated 99% of the reasons that people call for service and complain about the service. And this appears to be the same one thing around the entire state it's about the speed and as the technology seems to increase and this is what I heard in Windsor it's just like you've got to get to this level of having the speed and this last mile of connection that's the weakest link in the whole system is getting to this last mile thing so with the fiber options it seems like that's pretty much why this whole ready situation came to light was to be able to provide these newer districts in my understanding was to be able to set up and be able to secure the financing and then using a company like Consolidated takes care of all the maintenance aspects of this so they're actually servicing the same area servicing the same territory but now they're getting paid to do something in my understanding they're getting paid to take care of what's already on the pole so they're already there doing it so they're able to probably maximize their efficiencies by doing adding this to the system and it certainly speeds the process up because I was floored when I heard it's like six months to get access to a pole and this is what EC fiber struggles are and they've got one or two people down there strictly that's all they're doing is working on permitting and applications to get on these poles and so here's Consolidated already sitting there they have that already so it's you're tagging there I mean it's a no brainer to my mind is you're already tagging their resource so seems like it's kind of seems pretty easy I don't know I mean the finance part of this seems feasible so like I said I'm a fan of trying out a space to see what happens it could be a model for other places in the state Well why isn't it a model for the rest of the Randolph that has the same issue you could well I mean I think this is a great place to start you know if you want to expand it if you want to expand it I mean there's nothing that stops us from going and expanding it right this one once this is formed it's a simple trip down here to say we want to enlarge the footprint to include Heppard Hill or for that matter to go clear to the other side of town and pick up a piece of territory there's nothing that states that when a ready is formed it's geography be contiguous so we can go from Stockfarm Fish Hill and then we can go to East Randolph we could go to Unate hit the pockets that are currently not being hit by podcast we're going to have a hard time not having Perry be on for us something I meant to touch on when we were asked the question what's it sort of what's in it for Fairpoint or Consolidated and one of the things is they're keenly excited about the notion that they would be able to move out of a regulated environment which their copper telephone lines are to a non-regulated now the fix for us the ready will continue to own and govern its asset and in the contract with Fairpoint will be language that provides a quasi-regulatory we want to have input on pricing we want to know that for example families are free and reduced lunch would be able to have a subsidy for their services that were available those kinds of things would be part of the the governance that the ready would provide so it would serve a quasi-regulatory and also to serve as an advocate for improving the technology if the networks there is capable of say 100 megabits and there's now clamoring in enough of a market for a gigabit network that would be conversation that would go back to Consolidated that we now want to in our contract we want to put that on a fast track has the town lawyer looked at any of this not yet no I don't know who is your lawyer work with a number of different attorneys but the one for this particular case would probably be Paul Gillies okay Barlow I think is with Paul Gillies he was the attorney for Newberry who looked at essentially this exact same package and our sort of legal counsel for Vermont Futures on this project is Paul Giuliani and you probably know there is hardly a piece of infrastructure in the state of Vermont with public dollars in it that hasn't washed through his office from one time to another and so we work with him closely on the drafting of the legislation that became the ready as we work with him on so it certainly has had more legal over the shoulders of me looking at it which would be good for folks when they sign up for this service once it's established and all that is there a minimum commitment time to have signed up for a year or two years are they obligated and my question goes to this really because you know I travel around the world a bunch and I kind of see that wired technologies becoming less and less and so cellular towers, cellular technologies increasing so one of the current concerns is as we add towers to town which I think we recently did and folks get more access to that are you going to lose your subscription base or are you paying for their cell phone and unlimited data plans and all that stuff I mean really good question and something that we've thought a lot about okay good but to answer more than that at least at this point we have not thought about it as a minimum requirement what we have thought about is for those people who come on board the connection costs are all born under that agreement coming onto the network later if you're a homeowner you say I don't know if I want to sign up I'll wait and see we're going to try to dissuade people from that so the coming in at a later date is going to be a lot higher investment side when they sign up initially that's going to cover a lot of the costs people are only going to be there may be an investment opportunity we haven't quite gotten to that point yet but I guess right between the lines if you sign up really meant some sort of investment no there's some thought about there being an equity stake somewhere in the model for people who become customers and we haven't really thought them way through but I mean at least on one fork of the model if you run the numbers out at some point this asset if it doesn't come to the too much to the trend you're talking about becomes an incredibly valuable because the one thing about Fiverr's got a book value of 50 years it's probably got a truthfully useful life of at least 100 years it's almost the quality of stuff that's available now is almost infinitely expandable you put a gigabit on it and then you can put a terabit on it and bandwidth but that's one fork and where we share that revenue at some point is subject for it and then the other thought is at least the other thought is for the foreseeable 20 years that will be have debt service payments to worry about the combination of the use case which is there will probably not in the next 20 years be wireless technology that lets you do high definition videos you know get your entertainment and do your home base business and your kids do that's still going to probably be until we decide to level for my get rid of all these damn hills and mountains wireless just has some inherent challenges so I just have one more question what conflicts are there that would prevent you to go to certain areas because obviously if you could go from here to the end of the street you could pick up 20 customers with 500 feet of wire instead of picking up 20 customers with 4 miles of wire so what are the conflicts you see to you basically doing your whole town and why the notion would be if you can find a customer base that supports the net service requirement we'd go anywhere and that could be right through town what our motivation is as the nonprofit sort of advocate for this is we really do want to push it out into areas of town that have nothing because part of it is we see it as that combination priming the economic engine priming the education engine converting some forms of health care to remote health care there are lots of things that are part of that and building the community is the ultimate I mean behind all of this we're still trying to figure out how our organization when it gets paid for this how it can actually get paid for what it really wants to do which is get paid for the increased prosperity and connectivity connectivity in the sense of human connectivity and social connectivity civic participation and those kind of things which are really what we're we're not really all that interested or at least I'm not all that interested in the technology I'm not all that interested in running the fiber company I'm more interested in knowing that you can work from home and your kids can learn the Japanese language from somebody in Japan and that Perry doesn't have to call a lady and strap her every night to find out what's going on which is kind of true and I wouldn't have happened if they hadn't gotten the fiber over there but when they got that she's actually her speed and her connectivity she can log on and she's looking at her screen like she's looking at her office I can't do that and one of the things that we like about that is I'm sure it's somewhat true of Randolph when I was in Sharon before I came here we knew that the level of the tunnel raised about two inches after 8 a.m. because of the large number of people that were leaving town to go work in West Lab and Hanover to the point where our volunteer fire department had one member who was actually physically to be found inside the town boundary on any given day and our fire chief was driving from Dartmouth college to a fire in Sharon which he claimed he could do in 20 minutes but it also changes the entire social structure of the town when parents can be home to meet their kids when they come home from school communities, neighborhoods have people that are there which makes them safer all of the metrics isn't any reason like why we wouldn't go anywhere else and often it makes an awful lot of sense to go through some of the more populated and even already served areas because that's the way the connectivity and the network design would naturally take you and if we can offer people a superior service at a lower price and in the end make the entire network work then that would be and so could it be the whole town? I don't see why not would it grow to that eventually perhaps? Part of that that could happen also is a little more complicated but you could actually involve the communities of Braintree and Brookfield into this but you have to have their town select boards be part of the equation but it could broaden, it could expand the whole situation across town lines we're actually hoping that by the time we get to that decision we may have another legislative remedy that is just to grow a lot more organically and quickly and frankly at this point as I've said there's not much connection between these things and the town, the underlying town except the original approval by the select board and then the annual feeding of the governing board when you make five appointments and so the logic of the underlying towns being part of it might be able to be made easier and streamlined and so forth but that's for downing. Comments? Questions from the audience? The one question that I have because this is a little bit sort of we're all kind of making this up as we go along but at some point we need to figure out how you guys pull the pin what is it that's going to at the next meeting be the I know we want to have the bylaws looked at we want to have the town attorney kind of have some oversight and I will make myself completely available to help Adolfo and meet with the attorneys and anything else just to answer questions we have, I presume we will at some point have determined that we have a valid 20 signature application and then at some point that all has to come in where somebody here makes a motion and I'm not sure I know exactly if I get a second in that's the step that's the challenge right there to get a second in all the details haven't been so I will work with Adolfo before I'm out with this I want to know from the legal standpoint where are we on the hook and where are we not on the hook and then from that point on I think that answers a lot of questions to move it forward also the difference in how this is set up the town truly doesn't have to claim anything it isn't doesn't have to go on our financials doesn't have to go nowhere that's what I want to make sure we're totally even though we don't develop it we appoint the majority of the board members it just feels like we've got so much control over this entity that there's a liability there somewhere well that's what you would think it's hard to be created and you appoint the majority of the board and case law of course is what determines all this well there's case law at least as far as the question of fire districts which is what this is modeled on the same kind of language where in fact there sometimes is even appropriation of town funds to fire districts so the relationship would even be closer and I think everybody the statutory language and the case law support that the difficulty at this point is there's no way to create another municipal structure the only two ways that it really can happen is a municipality sort of approves, authorizes births a municipality a sub municipality or the legislature charters and that's actually kind of where we're going with our other thought for now you just can't go out and say here's four points this is our district and we're going to form a municipality to put a sign up at the end of the road so you need a mechanism to do that but again the attorney's there okay thank you heard from the town's director of recreation she had a soccer assessment that needed to be performed tonight and had to leave so she asked if we could maybe push the director's briefing to the next meeting assembly permit for the new world festival sorry to interrupt and it's possible that a mistake was made some weeks ago it was under the impression that the East Valley community group was to come at 6.30 and they were here at 5.30 and it was only half an hour at 5.30 for something to change thank you very much board knows about the group and their work thank you so Tommy here from the channel of senate through the arts this is the new world festival we filed our permit request for the new world festival and it is essentially the same permit and for the event that has been in existence for a number of years now so we're requesting granting that permit for the purpose of having the 26th annual new world festival on Sunday of Labor Day weekend all those you have to answer any questions the town has been working with Tom we also have shared the assembly permit with the orange kind of sheriff's department with the Randall Village fire department with the health officer highway department we are awaiting signatures from all except for the Randall Village fire department who has already approved the only condition was that parking as stated in the layout keep to no parking on print street otherwise there were no exceptions from the fire department and I also don't believe there will be any I'm sorry not exceptions there will not be any objections from any of the other town officials make a motion we accept the permit for the new world festival approved motion in second all those in favor motion carries now we have a first class liquor license also for Chandler we have a first class liquor license for Chandler primarily for the purpose of and we also as you probably well know through the process have to get the appropriate health department approval and catering permit and we'll be seeking those as well through the DLC and health department primarily for the purpose of being able to serve beer and wine at Chandler presentations in the main musical and in the upper gallery moving forward we have been working for a number of years with local caterers including Shane at one main and folks at Valley Bowl Wayne to provide beer and wine for selected performances and just our board has decided to pursue this for purposes so we would be going through all of the betting that the DLC puts us through we have identified a number of people that would go through the requisite training on the DLC website to be able to serve and so this is the first step in the process any questions, comments, concerns, motions? Motion to approve the request for our local license. Motion and second all those in favor? Hi. Motion carries. Thank you very much. Good luck. I wish everything was as easy as this time. We have the Clara Martin project presentation and request. It's all about making good things happen right Tom? Yep, there you go. If I may I'd like to preface the presentation of the Clara Martin. No, it's okay. We have been active in hearing from Clara Martin project especially from Down Street, the project coordinators they have also been very active with sharing information with the Community Development Block Grant state agency that will eventually make an award would also like to add that the Select Board has previously heard about this project and ruled on essentially allowing Down Street to act as the agency that manages this program so we asked the project coordinators to come in and speak a little bit more about some of the troubles that they are experiencing with the renovating of the property at 28th South Main Street. So where we are at this point we have spent the last couple of years working on this project securing the funding that we need for it. We have secured the funding we put the project out to BID. We pre-qualified four different construction companies to help us do that. When we opened the BIDs last week there was about a $265,000 cost of pregnancy between our most recent cost estimator as well as what the BIDs came in at. So since then we have been doing the work with the low bid contractor to do some value engineering to figure out where we can make some adjustments or make some different cuts to close that gap. We feel we can probably close about half of the gap through that value engineering exercises that we are doing. The second part of the plan on how we are looking at closing that gap is actually to reach out to the funders who have previously provided their support in that. We've had some initial conversations with BHCB. They feel that they will be able to help us with some additional funding. We have had some conversations with the BCDP and that's one of the main reasons that I'm here tonight. They are willing to commit additional $50,000 towards the project but because of their funding it comes to use the town and then you separate that to us. So it's not an award that goes to us, it's an award that goes to you. They have previously committed just $200,000 to it. In addition to that we have had internal discussions with our Claremont Center Board of Trustees and we will actually be contributing additional funding to this as well too. If we can close this gap we will be able to close on the Federal Housing Trust Fund within the next couple of weeks and then we could potentially start construction in September with a tentative completion date May, June time of next year. So that's generally the updated kind of where we're at at this point. Construction drawings have been done. They're in place. We are working on all kinds of pieces of it. But we should be ready to go. One of you needs to get the responsibility done. So your request of us tonight is if we would accept the grant if it had $50,000 more on it. That's kind of a no-brainer. It's not the best in town anywhere. Let's just pass through money. Do you need an official motion to that effect? Do you also have to write a letter? We would need something confirming that the Board acknowledges the project is short of funding and approves the project and potentially increase funds through the state CDBG process. And then what will happen is state staff will then readjust the amount that they had initially allocated for this project, take the Board's decision into consideration and then increase the amount that is then added to the town's grant award. Similar situations before probably doesn't affect anything that we might want in the future. No, Nathan has been very... I'm just asking. I want to make sure that we're not going to be held hostage down the road for something that we might want this might play into. Other than that, I don't have a problem with it. So would you like a motion, an elbow, uprising you to send a letter to that effect? Yes, and it could be just anything is very general as the select Board motions to approve motions to continue supporting the Clara Martin project in their new round of fundraising. And then what I will then do is take a copy of the minutes, send them over to our state partners, and then they will then work to make the amendment on their end. So motioned. So I have a motion to continue supporting the Clara Martin project. This project has a name. Is it just Clara Martin project? At 28 South Main. At 4 28 South Main. Motion in a second. All those in favor? Aye. Motion carries. And we have a request from the Clara Martin center also to increase their water and sewer allocation. This is associated with the same project at 28 South Main. The problem that the town recently encounters with this request is not with the request itself, but with our continued fight or disagreement with the drinking water and groundwater protection district. That group, the drinking water and groundwater protected district has recently issued a permit to operate to the Randolph Village water system. The permit has a condition that says that we have this permit only if we are prohibited from allowing any new connections or increased allocations of the water, which now complicates this request. This is an issue that we've had in the past with them because of our supposed manganese issue. I have drafted a rather very strongly worded letter to the district that is yet to be sent, but essentially tells them the town is in compliance with US EPA standards. It's not our fault. The state has their own standards that violate US EPA standards, even though those were the standards that were adopted in the water supply rule. I have fallen short of threatening suit or filing suit against the state, but if the board feels that it is necessary to take that step, I will most certainly do that, but at this point our water permit will not allow us to have new connections or to even take action on this particular request for increased water allocation. We can take action on it. We can approve it. And then that gives you that the board has approved it. They're ready for it. You're holding us up. It just doesn't make sense. They throw that at us, but yet they're funding these projects. Sooner or later somebody's going to get their act together up there and figure out that this is just not right. Where's Jay? He's been there. We listened to this when I was up there in May. This is like a lesson. It's like a 2% increase in benefits. I'd like to send them a letter and ask them for their blessing. It's just ridiculous. It's a phone call. What's up with this? You're funding this project and now you're telling us no we can't? I have contacted our previous supporters with the economic arm of the governor's office and said you helped us with this other project. This is a similar situation where you're now holding us up. Many of the conditions that have been put in the permission or the permit to operate have already been completed with your repairs to our south reservoir making sure that it no longer leaks. So I don't I feel that the environmental group DEC and the drink and water protection district feel that they're doing a good thing but I think that we caught them in the situation where they moved too fast. They are now violating their own water supply because they're not following federal regulations. We are the last town to comply with the manganese issue. We're one of six. And if they now fold, because we're telling them fold, the other six towns that have borrowed money and mitigated their manganese issue now have a debt service that they pay and puts the state in a bit of a bind. We haven't said that we're not going to mitigate it. It has the top priority at the town. So nobody's told them we're not going to do it. We're just saying we're not going to do it on your timeline. We're working on it. We've met with them. We have, as a matter of fact, there's another item on the agenda that addresses one of the issues that they've asked us to address. So we're working with them. This was changing the pumping schedule and all these things. So aren't we doing all that? So I'm like, you know, I need to approve it and see better answers. What are they going to do? We're going to pull the plug on us and say, sorry, we're not going to help you. I don't think that's going to happen. Well, the board absolutely can approve it. There would be no case to find the town unless we actually started the increased allocation. So one other point. When do you actually need this allocation? I don't need this right now, do you? Do you need it to move the project forward or is this something where you could come back in, you know, six months? Giving them the allocation has zero impact on the system. Because they aren't actually using anything. So we can give them the allocation. They can meet their permit requirements. We're not anticipating actually being connected for some time, right? Yeah, we don't expect the project to be completed until probably May, June time. And nobody will know anyway. What? At the state level. What are they going to know? What are they going to know? But the paperwork will be good. In bathrooms? No, the meeting. The meeting. I move we approve the increase in allocations for water and sewer for 28 south main street. I second. All those in favor? I. I understand it was like 10,000. But we're talking. Okay, before we get into the next item, I'd like to move down to old business of Otterville Abatement for eight for our road street. Unless you want to sit through the rest of these items. Thank you. Aren't you learning a lot though, Shane? Every day. Every day. Especially this evening. That life never run for select birds. March is coming. Okay. So there's some history to this one. There's a lot of history. This is the property that burnt. Yep, back in 2001. And the service was not connected. So the fees continued to Well, everything was shut off to the building. So the roof burned off from it, the whole upper floor burned. Electricity was cut, cable, water was shut off. There was no utilities that were on. In, on as far as a faucet in there. But the water was still on at the street stop. It was not on at the street stop. It never has been on from the street stop. For as long as I own that building. Has it ever been disconnected? Physically disconnected? No. There's no plumbing in the building. There's, the building's been gutted. From the time of the fire fees continued because the service wasn't disconnected or turned off. The line was not dug up out of the ground. So then you came and saw us about 18, 20 months ago. Yeah, it was like probably two years ago now. And the board agreed that with the improvements to Eight Railroad Street that it was no more than a shed. And at that time they agreed to abate the bill as long as I dug up the line and capped it so I didn't have access to water. Even though it's been shut off and I haven't had access to water for 16 years. What did you have to do to the building? We didn't just say dig up the water and cap it. You were going to make the building. No, that's the second meeting. So the first meeting that I came to you agreed that was a stop building and I would be taken off the system. Okay, so I would have to dig up the line physically cap it at the main and then when and if I ever wanted to reconnect I would pay the allocation fee to reconnect. That was two meetings ago. The last meeting because I didn't want to have to dig up this line I was trying to negotiate with the board not to have to physically do that because literally I'll have to do it eventually anyway because that line is sold going from your system to my building. I'd never be able to put that building back in service with the line that's there anyway. So you came back because you didn't want to dig it up and then what's your what was the deal that was cut? So the deal that was cut the last time around was that if I made my building I guess more presentable the board would also wave the past water and sewer bill. I guess my argument is that I've been billed off this water and sewer bill and I get these minimum usage fees for the past 16 years and I've never had even the ability to use the Randolph I've never used a drop of water or sewer at the 8th railroad street so we went through all this argument last time and we had an agreement and we started with 12 months and you said no no no give me 18 but I gave you 18 in 18 months you were going to improve the way that building looked and in return for you doing that the town would forgive all the back fees but if it didn't get done the fees were all due and payable so now we're at 18 months plus and none of the work was done correct? Correct I came back and met with Adolfo and men and talked about the progress over there and I told them that I'd been extremely busy and that I hadn't had the time to side and paint the building and then I just referred back to the contract and the contract stated once I read through it a second time it said that I actually had to have occupancy through the town which was a different thing than what I understood from the initial meeting and I don't know if I got lost in translation when it got written up but that's a big difference between deciding painting the outside of the building so either way you haven't done anything and you set the deadline of 18 months we gave you an extra six months on top of what we had originally talked about and you committed to having it done I haven't had time in 18 months to get to it isn't holding a lot of water because we've been through this and through this and through this it's got to be resolved and I can't just keep saying 18 months, 18 months right but I mean as far as the appearance of the building goes I mean I have I put tens of thousands of dollars into that building to even get it to where it is now you know with the roof put on it gutting the interior getting all the garbage out of there cleaning up the exterior not the last 18 months but from the time that I purchased it up until now I have done a lot 18 months ago you sat here we had a negotiation and we had a deal and you signed to that deal and then you left here and did nothing until your time expired and now you're in here saying I need more time it is nothing that you agreed to in the building in 18 months how many times can we renegotiate something to I would wish that the select board would abate this bill entirely the simple fact that I haven't had you know any ability to use the water there ever and this building is just kind of crewing I mean like even the current bill that I have now I mean the past two balances 3800 outstanding interest is $1350 you owned that allocation to the system the allocation for that building for what was there and we had Marty in here on the last meeting would cost a third of what that bill is but it is there because of your inaction if you wanted to get rid of that allocation shut it down and walk away the time to have taken that action was shortly after the fire not now after we have had these details most of the time most people here even can't explain to me the whole allocation process that the town has on the books and this billing has always been taken back to this is an allocation billing and it's billed as a minimum usage month after month after month when I can't go into my building and turn on the water so you just saw us increase the allocation to the Claire Martin Center back to the Potter and sewer you get a minimum you get an allocation to your building and it's based on whether it's the size of the residence, the business, the uses, whatever and a lot of that comes from state statute you come in and say I want to do a restaurant in there we get those numbers from the state because you have to pay state allocation fee so whatever the allocation is I don't even know what the allocation is to your building and what the use was is what I'm saying so I don't know what your use was but I'm kind of going to agree with Trini here if you were not going to move forward with improving the building to get it to a point where you were going to use the allocation that's really not the select board or the town's fault the minimum usage is a fee that you pay as the holder of the allocation to have access to that allocation so if you want to go turn the water on it's there no I understand that and I paid for that it's not that I haven't paid bills on this property I paid $2,500 already in receipts that I can show you for this allocation fee that cost $1,500 okay this is an additional $5,400 on top of it which makes this allocation that's so valuable at $1,500 cost you know but it's because of how you've managed this that was your decision when that property burnt the decision was yours whether to disconnect from the system because you were never going to do anything with the building or to keep that allocation it's not fair to the other users for us to just say oh you're right you can hold your allocation and not pay any fees to have that allocation and someday 20 years from now when you decide to do something and want water back in the building just go and do the plumbing and turn the faucet on when you hold that allocation you pay that minimum user fee every month whether you use it or not and that's the fees that you have there but you didn't take any action to have it shut off or to be disconnected from the system so when you say if I had a new allocation it would be $1,500 you're right you should have disconnected shortly after the fire well no I mean like two years ago when you guys agreed that I'd dig it up at the source at the shut off you said you'd wave it doing that and that had nothing to do with improving the building that was the first meeting that you guys all agreed that all I had to do was cap it dig the ground up in front of the building to physically cap it and my argument at the time was well I can't turn the water on I can't use it anyway like what difference does it make if I dig the ground up and cap it physically at the shut off and I think it's more just a logistical thing on your guys' end that's what you want to see done and so I guess my argument is that there's two directions you can go in it and the second was a renegotiation because I didn't want to have to dig up the ground and cap it at the source but it sounds like to me that that's probably the cheaper option and that you guys had already agreed to two meetings ago Jean we sat here that night that you came back and didn't want to do that deal and you sat right here and you told us what you wanted and then you took a break and we went on to other agenda items and you came back and said I will do this but I need 18 months and we agreed there was discussions at every single one of those and went round and round chasing this all these same topics and we came to a resolution and you went away for 18 months with that agreement ok so on your end you just think that should pay the $5400 it was what you agreed to do well that's what you want is the money the outstanding balance is $38, $34.87 without the interest in penalties would you concede to the $38, $34.87 I'll rate you a check tomorrow and this will be concluded and then are you going to disconnect from the system or are you going to continue to pay the bills because then all my allocation would be paid up in full no you're going to get whacked at the minimum every month and then in my minimum billing I would have the choice of either digging it up and capping it to stop the billing or I could continue the billing at the minimum $135 a quarter from then on out but I would pay the $38, $34.87 and get this taken care of does the slip bird have the authority to do that without it going to the water sewer committee first I think it would have to first go to the water sewer committee and work its way up through the process because it's considered an abatement well I've been to several of those meetings and every one of those meetings they just make recommendations they don't actually rule on anything as far as voluntarily and then it comes back to the select board for the true bold and this was the same thing that happened last few times when you guys agreed to a partial abatement but I believe they supported it when it came to us that's what we need from them right so I think I would suggest that you and Delville can help you with that and then we can see where we're at with that situation and I think that's where I stand with this if the water sewer board decides or feels that they would support that then I think I would be fine but I want to hear what they've got to say my only requirement would be that at this point in time so we don't get caught in this trap again I would suggest that you disconnect from the system at that point that would be what I would want to see only because I wasn't privy to the conversations that were had here before that's just going to be his decision whether you think it's a good idea or not we're abating a situation here or we could potentially be abating a situation where he already cut a deal he didn't follow through with a deal so I would like to say if you're looking for the abatement I want another piece of the puzzle I want you off the system and you come back and you reapply for an allocation that's the only reason I'm suggesting that we take that into consideration only because you're going to get caught again that certainly could happen so when nobody gets caught in the same situation again that would be my suggestion that way there's no bill, there's no ongoing fees that aren't getting paid I don't know but the board at the time agreed that if that was done they would have made the whole pass bill entirely I guess you should have done it I guess I need to review the minutes of the two meetings that you were here so I have a better clear understanding of what actually happened but you know I'm going upon what Trini remembers and so she was there at the time it would be my suggestion that you you want to get abated that you talk to the water sewer board I think that's your first stop for them to see if they would have abated the interest in penalties piece of it if you paid the rest in full it sounds like creating some willingness through that committee they will receive the allocations and the funding needed to keep that system running making a recommendation to abate or to raise concerns with why when they don't want to I've been to the water sewer board several times over this with a request for the abatement on the interest to discuss it because at some point in time in the history it was actually illegal to charge interest in penalties on the water and sewer bill period and then so they abated it at that time the interest in penalties that was it and then the town went and updated their water and sewer law to allow them to continue to do it again and that's where all the interest in penalties are coming from so Shane just my perspective I mean if this was just a gentleman's handshake or something I would understand your request saying you misunderstand the truth is that this expired and now it's coming up and now it's to me it's written signed by you it's even worse than just not paying and I understand everybody's busy and growing a business I get it you know so I'm all in favor of the business that's the only thing I'm struggling with honestly is how many abatements is there $7500 or more to keep a $1500 allocation business choices made I get it right and so but that's the way I think about things is on a business level like I'm not the select board right I'm a business owner and when you entered into this agreement you made a business decision and then it was a bad decision in hindsight and now you want us to be responsible for your bad decision I don't think you're responsible for my bad decision but I want us to make you all negotiate it just seems like you know I wish that I could go back to people who I made agreements with and that were bad in retrospect and say oh you know what I kind of screwed that up can you give me something anyway because I was acting in good faith I just made a mistake and typically the answer is well no it's just done if I've been using water at that location all this time or even had the ability to use the water at that location all this time it's a little hex nut valve you have the plumbing inside you can use it no because it's shut off by the town it's never been turned back on and I'm not the authority to turn it back on but I'm just saying technically you do have the ability I'm not saying you would I'm not saying it's legal if you did the work you needed to on the inside and you called the town and said hey I'm ready for you to go turn the water back on it would be turned back on so you had the ability to access the water we've had this discussion we've gone through all these details we've hashed it and hashed it and it keeps coming out to you know we sat here everything was talked about you took extra time and came back and asked us to give you six more months than what was originally discussed you don't do that it got reduced to writing between you and Mel you read it you went through it with him you signed it you did all that I mean it's if you want to proceed and I also talked to Adolfo in May about coming in to get an extension and I tried to get on last month's agenda and I got it on my paperwork plenty of time in advance and I didn't get on the meeting before the contract expired and then the contract expired and I'm here the very next month so I was trying to get here and he's got the paperwork in his desk like you know well before last month's meeting I wasn't pushing it off to the last minute and I talked about it with him in May and I've been in his office I don't know how many times since then about other projects and it has come up and so I think your first stop is to the water and sewer committee to see if they'll abate the interest in penalties and then I think you have another business decision to make a couple of them because as of right now if you don't pay it you'll be back in the same boat you were in January of 17 it'll be back up for sale and then you get to decide to stay connected to keep your allocation or disconnect from the system and pay the monthly bills that's where I'm at same place I think that's what you need to do take your request to get on the water sewer committee's agenda and move there first when do they meet again? I don't know I'll speak with Marty and I think it's very much on an as needed basis so we can schedule a meeting thank you are you waiting for a specific item? North Randolph Road culvert grant B-Trans we have been working with B-Trans on the particular project we had previously brought it to the board asking for approval to apply for the grant we applied we were denied we were persistent and invited our representative to come down and tour some of our project sites he saw what we saw and well the grant was then subsequently awarded to the town and so if the board approves we can then make use of the grant and start working on replacing the culvert on North Randolph Road it seems to me your turn I don't know the exact location but it's way out there I'll get too far out there Mason Road comes to mind but I know it's way further out than that yeah it's on the other side make a motion to accept it is there any grant for the structure on North Randolph Road? motion in a second all those in favor? post stained motion carries state revolving loan fund agreement for the new well post street well project so this circles back to the work that we've been performing with the loan fund staff and also the increasing water grant water protection district one of the next steps is to investigate alternatives that will allow the town to grow for the future we understand that our north reservoir is for the most part beyond its useful life which is one of the reasons why it's leaking one of the proposals that we would like to investigate is to build smaller cell reservoirs so that we can use those and if we need more we can build them as we go along the state approved of that they also approved of our proposed plan to build towards the future with money being well the frugleness of the town being a priority so we just don't overspend one of the requests was that we then investigate these options through our existing engineering firm the Defrain Group Defrain Group came back to us and said in order for us to be able to investigate these options and work with what the town wants to do with drinking water and groundwater protection district it would cost an additional $30,000 this would be added to the $191,000 that was initially awarded or approved by the select board so we're not paying any debt service on it yet so it will all eventually be rolled into the total amount that would be due for all repairs taking the three wells, putting them in line, potentially building the new north reservoir and all the other connections that go along with it. So I'm sorry has any of that $191,000 been spent already or is this just an allocation? All has been spent, with the exception of roughly about $1,000 I believe but the entire $191,000 has been spent and then how does this gets paid for from water bill usages and stuff that's how it'll essentially get rolled into the total cost of the bill well for example if we do not apply for any grants if you do not apply for any free money so to speak it will all be paid for by the rate payers. We have had commitments from various state groups that have offered to provide low interest well they offered to consider us for a negative interest loan which would essentially be a grant in some ways we've also worked with the community development block grant staffers and essentially said to them we are going to be applying for grant money so even though the overall project would likely cost a million dollars we're hoping that all the grant money that we're able to apply for and the negative interest loan that we're able to obtain will bring that cost down considerably. We still don't know exactly what the cost of the project will be which is going to be an end result of a lot of the engineering assessments that needs to be done we tried, I tried to get some of this work done in house and our engineer felt that she would not be able to actually do all the necessary work because of some of the intricacies that are dealt with our engineering firm so we have to go, we can't do it any of it in house this is a time frame for having to take action on actually doing something before they say that North Reds War is just not operational so we don't have an exact, we know how old it is and it's over 40 years old we know that it has some rust issues we do know that some of the leaks are in areas where we really just can't access and we don't know how much it would cost to repair it because we can't see what the leak is. There's also a liner within the North Reservoir that we had to put in previously. There's also a considerable amount of sediment in there that is making it hard for us to just throw into the, they have these underwater drones that essentially would just go in there and look for a leak but because there's so much sediment in there from just sediment, anything that goes into the water will kick up the sediment and it just makes it hard to find the leak. I guess I'm just thinking that, I mean I'm not in the water district so I don't appreciate those fees that happen to folks but I have heard consider about a amount of concern about the bills that would happen when the new water treatment plan went in and then if we're investigating this, spending more money on this and then now planning on short term bringing some water facility structure in, I'm just wondering what that impact would be and concerns that those same folks would have. I agree, that was one of the points that we always, with the drink you want to grow out of projected district, will say to them we don't service the entire town and their response to us as well, this is a town benefit the town should pay as opposed to just the rate payers. So their response is the town should pay or you have to do this because our water quality standards say you're in violation of our water quality standards. We agree to disagree on those points. The only thing we agree on is that they feel we have to pay and they could potentially make us. Well they could make us and that they keep incurring fines. We could just continue to provide water normally but they could also stick it to the town by not letting us apply for state grants, other payments that we received from the state. They can get us in that way but we would still be providing water. We would work with them on another way of managing times when the water is being pumped from different places and bringing the new ones on and what not, which according to their analysis we wouldn't need the Pearl Street. They have since backed off from that. They did provide us the presentation that they showed us in Montpelier for that meeting. I then asked them to provide us with the raw data because if we didn't have to have our engineers do this work we didn't have to pay for it. Brian Redmond's response as the director of the agency said, well our staff will work with your engineers to come up with very accurate numbers but we are not going to do the work for the town. Essentially telling us we will give you the avenue to borrow money to have this work done but our engineers will not be the lead in obtaining this data. We will only help in obtaining this data. While you kind of got to do it, I'm not opposed to it. There was conversations about multiple sources of funding to work on the projects when we were there. So in that meeting they seemed willing to, even Josh Hanford's department was twisting around a little bit so they saw it as an economic development piece that they felt strongly enough about that we could work with. So we do the work and got to do something, right? I would make the motion to authorize a delt to obtain the additional $30,000 from the original Loan Fund for that purpose. I'll second that. Motion to the second. All those in favor? Aye. Abstain. Opposed? Tired? No, I just I'm not sure I understand the impact. That's all. The big impact isn't yet. Yeah, I know. It's the answers we get from the impact. Is that five, three zero, two, five, four? Four zero one. If you don't vote it's automatically yes. But for whatever it's worth I'm more frugal with the down's money than I am with my own and I am pretty, you know, so I have pushed and will continue to push with the state and I, you know, if the board would like it would share the letter that I drafted, you know, I would certainly pass it around for review but it is very strongly worded and it is accusing the state of really putting their foot on the town's throats because the water district does provide water to some of the town's poorest population and if we are going to ask them to pay an additional million dollars add that to water rates then it really puts a whole lot of pressure. They know this. That's why we were chosen as an opportunity zone. It's not rocket science. It was very surprising to see their requirement to not allow us to connect. What is the opportunity zone? The opportunity zone. So Randolph was designated an opportunity zone which is an opportunity for federal designation of the city. The tax credits should come from somebody who might be paying capital gains. So as an opportunity zone they can make an investment into this region, into this zone, okay, which then gives them these tremendous tax benefits over, you know, they leave the money in for over 10 years and they're not paying the gains. The rules are still being written but, you know, we were chosen because we were an area that needed some sort of special appropriation policy update. So I just, from the previous meeting I shared with the board that our attorney had reviewed the proposed changes but that his structural changes or formatting changes did not arrive in time to be able to include them in the packet. I just included the return document that the attorney had sent to us and the changes remain the same which is just the date at the top section of it and also the added language. That is all the changes have the vertical line on the left hand side of the paper. So the changes remain the same from what we had spoken about in the last select board meeting. Only now the return document is in a different form. The change, I don't have it memorized but the change would give the select board the opportunity to allow someone to have special appropriations request but if they also sought direct funding through the budget would give the select board the ability to then subtract the amount of money they receive from the budget from their special appropriations amount. Second. Hi. Hi. We have an agreement renewal for Orange County Sheriff outside of the district. Yes, this renewal happens every year for the request of the Orange County Sheriff's Department. It is just for traffic enforcement. There is a capped amount yearly. It is up to $15,000. This is to issue tickets. Demons, we like to call them because apparently there are quite a few of them in the areas that are controlled by the Sheriff's Department outside of the village. There is one change in that the previous agreement listed an amount of $42,000 in pencil at the very top. The increases in the total amounts. $43,000 to $46,000. The previous contracts, two contracts ago was $42,000. The most recently expired fund was $43 per hour and now it is $46 per hour. That $46 amount is consistent with the rate that we are currently paying for contract services in the village. If the board would approve the agreement it would be retroactive to the expiration of the previous agreement. Second, all those in favor. I have the item added, which is the bid for the septic to the garage. Yes. The town prior to my arrival had identified structural deficiencies in the Randolph Center garage. There were some old septic tanks that were mixing in with the oil disposal systems and it was just not a pretty site. There were separate issues. One in the storage area that was the former highway garage of the Randolph Center closest to Rand Road. That has already been corrected and resolved. This current contract would be for the area which we now use for the Randolph Center garage. There again is the failed septic system. We are forced to add some redesigning to have a functioning system up there. Our predecessor had budgeted upwards of $60,000 for the project. We received bids and the bids are in your packets which are well below what was planned for. We would like the board even though the lowest bid is $32,000 we would like the board to potentially authorize up to a $45,000 expenditure so that we could potentially also upgrade the apron that leads out of the garage and onto the dirt road area. We don't believe that we will use all $45,000 but because there are some variances where the apron on the outside of the building goes from its most narrow point from roughly about 30 feet to about 45 feet, we don't believe we're going to do that same apron because it may not be necessary but if it isn't necessary it would be upwards of $45,000 if it's not it will be well below that but contractor has said that even if we add that additional apron cost it won't exceed more than $45,000. So do we know why there's $16,000 discrepancy between the two bids it's pretty significant for such a defined project. Yeah, we don't know. Same scope they ended the same meeting, they looked at the same material, they looked at the same work, they had the same amount of time to submit questions to our town engineer it just came back. So when they submit bids back do they say hey everyone use this much gravel and this much whatever and this much I mean with them when they come back, is that a no? Yeah, they essentially just say that we will comply with the scope of the work that the town wants. There are a lot of firms that are very busy and prices and construction projects have shot up this year. Just big debt, I wasn't... for that amount of money it's pretty significant. There were some in the last project that we were that the board reviewed was the pavement project on Furnace Street or Furnace Road those contract bids also came back varying but just not by this much. Some that were considerably higher than the lowest bidder but this was a huge difference. We were detailed enough in our bid that went out, I mean in the respect that went out with the requirements to say. Yeah, that it will meet the requirements that we have to. By pathway isn't that us? The bid handles all the bid I believe so. So make a motion to approve the $45,000 allocation to cover the cost. Right, that's what you wanted, the $45,000? Yeah. Motion in second, all those in favor? Aye. Motion carries. Other business town meeting follow up. Did I miss one? You did. Wait until you see what you got volunteered for. Sorry, I'm just trying to make sure I've got this before you run over. At the last town meeting in March the residents had posed a question to the select board about the possibility of changing the date of town meeting from Tuesday, the day of voting, to a weekend day to encourage more people to attend town meeting. The town clerk and I thought it would be a good idea to bring it up for discussion now because we recently learned that there was an error committed by town staff in submitting a tax abatement form for consideration on the ballot. The Randolph Senior Center typically submits a question to have essentially their tax abated because they provide a service. Our town clerk believes that she received the form, if she actually says that she knows that she received the form, but does not know what happened from when she received it to the ballot process. We don't know if it was given to Shannon's predecessor and then it was just lost in the shuffle during that whole process. Because that form was never processed and the question was never put on the ballot, the taxes for the Randolph Senior Center are now in effect. They are on the hook for taxes for the property. The town feels that because the error was committed, at least is confirmed by the town clerk that she received the form. We don't know what happened. If the board wanted to hold a special meeting to consider the question posed by the residents, we could. And then also at the same time have the question posed to the residents of do we want to abate taxes for the Randolph Senior Center. Other options that we're considering is whether we could just allow the tax to continue, not put the property up for sale, and then at the next town meeting put a ballot question that says taxes for the previous year would be abated and then also taxes for the next agreement would be in effect, potentially making it a tax-free facility. I think personally, I'd want to vote sooner because if the town for over a reason voted it down, the impact would be greater. Wouldn't it? Or the known impact, the plan for the impact would be greater. It's hard to get people to donate to overdue debt. Whereas if you happen to raise the money to meet your property tax, it's easier probably to fundraise for that. That's a floor question, or is that a paper ballot question? Could be a floor question. Yeah. The clerk is still working to identify the actual, whether it's Australian ballot or floor, but she believes it would be floor. Have you had to confirm that? If it was Australia ballot, we could vote it in November. Yeah. That's what I was thinking. We could absolutely do that. That might be the most effective, cheapest way to handle the situation is just vote it in November. One more piece of paper to hand everybody foot. I don't think anybody's going to... I don't think anybody's... easy painless. There is also the issue of town staff looking to have available bond money from the Chelsea Mountain Road project that we completed that made available to the Elm Street Prospect Project that we're working on now. So we're also trying to figure out if that's something that we can put on a ballot. We have to bring it to the board later for approval, but It could happen at the same time. It could all happen at the same time. That is a ballot question. That's not a floor question. That would be the direction I would go for. It's easy. That solves those, but it doesn't solve the day to have town meeting on. No. One of the concerns that was brought up during the previous town meeting was that if the board waited until the next town meeting it would have to be held on a Tuesday, and then only then would the change happen, but then it wouldn't happen for the next town meeting day, which would be two years out. Why couldn't we make that a ballot question? That could be a ballot question. Could you make that a ballot question? I don't know if we could. I mean, I could double check. You want to check that out? Because if you could make that a ballot question and, you know, so then you could put on the ballot, you know, would the town... It could be a non-binding question. If it has to be. If it has to be. Yeah. And then it's kind of like getting a survey. You're going to have people that are going to want both. Oh yeah, it's going to go both ways. There's going to be one group this way, one group that way. Well, I do hear a lot of people talk about not being able to participate on Tuesday, because not everybody gets Tuesday off to go to town meeting. Or in the evening, because that was another comment was, you know, why wouldn't we do town meeting in the evening? Because you're near the end of the poll time. The poll time was the... You go through each of the questions on the ballot. So you have to finish before the polls finish. But some towns hold town meeting night before too, right? So... If the board likes I could explore placing them all on the ballot. Has a question. Does the board have the authority to change that date? The meeting itself, I believe it has the authority. You want to find that out for us? Yep. We can protect too. Until somebody says it's not legal and everything you voted on doesn't count. I'd be slightly reluctant at least that we should talk about a little more. Like if we do decide to put it on the ballot that, you know, it sound like a dolphin was suggesting that we might have three options on the ballot. But that just makes things really complicated. What if, you know, it's easier to imagine a situation where we could put two items on the ballot. Leave it the way it is or change it to Saturday. And the town votes by a significant margin to change it to Saturday. Or we, you know, put three questions on including the night before option. And those two options on Saturday and the night before then get split. And then it's less than keep it where it is. But most people still want to change the date. But then it's not really clear exactly what the will of the consensus is. I think we just do one option because we still have to do the meeting, the informational meeting as well. And that's the one we typically do the night before you vote. The two people that have questions on the budget. Right, but we're still required to do it. Change that so it was harder. What's that change? I don't know. And we can discuss, we could discuss the budget during town meeting. Right, so you could make a late night. You can now. It might get us out of half of it to do that meeting that we don't get anything out of. Or it might make the elbow a lot longer. Moving to a Saturday we make town meeting a lot longer anyway. The last one was like four hours. Kelly's coffee hour, we can have Kelly's dinner hour. I think the more people, the better. My intuition says that if it was longer it wouldn't be dramatically longer. I would certainly like to pursue it because I do think a lot of people feel like they don't get the opportunity. If you go to town meeting it's really obvious most people there are people who have the day off. It's because they're not working anymore. It's a huge percentage of the town meeting day is people who are retired. I would love to see them go to an evening or Saturday. At least give the people the opportunity. Now it's their choice. It's their choice. But you don't vote on like five things on the floor. There's a lot of discussion that happens. There's a lot of questions. It generally lasts a while so people get answers. We talked about the fire stuff for how long. Right. But we could have done that at the meeting the night before. I understand that. But I just don't think it changes. It just gives more people the opportunity to come. My only motivation for thinking that is to put it on a Saturday so that way no one can say I had to work. Except for those people who work on Saturdays. You know what's going to be the first gorgeous day of the weekend and nobody is going to show up. Probably want to go skiing or something if it's March. I think you should try it. It was talked about so it's been talked about for years. I like the idea of putting it on a ballot. With two choices. So let's eliminate Tuesday all together. And then see how many write-ins you get for Tuesday. Writing campaign comes out. We're all in trouble. So then we'd be saying that we're going to change it. We just want to know which day you want to change it to. If we change it. There could be three items. The first question would be do you want to change town meeting day? And then if enough people say yes then the two options come into play the night before or the Saturday before. If say for example 100 people vote 104 any of the options but the first question fails then town meeting day will still be on Tuesday. Is there going to be another ballot that we have to hand count? Or can it run through the machine? That one's a hand. Secretary of State wouldn't put that one on a machine. I like that. And we can really let people let us know what they think. Should we keep it on Tuesday? If not. I think it's good. Very positive. Doodle poll. Sometimes it works. But it doesn't work for those of us who don't get internet out there in the rural area. Yes you do. Just call Stratford. All right. So we need to go back up and finish a new business. I drew a box around it but that didn't mean we discussed it. So as you can see I'm coloring my page and got confused but I skipped short and long-term goals discussion. So this topic was meant to provide some feedback and direction on what we want to focus on as a board. What do we want to see focused on immediate versus longer term projects that some of us knew were going that I think does stalled. And to give adults some direction on where we would like to see some town focus. So he's not out there beating the bushes and trying to come up with it on his own. So a few of the things that I've heard to kick it off I guess is that we need to try and figure out a way to provide some more support in the economic development realm. We had the position identified in the town plan the economic development chapter. We've identified some funds to help pay for that apportion kind of what we think you know it's easy to say economic development position because that's a buzz word but what is it we want that position to do? What are the tasks that we're looking for? One of the areas I think that economic development Vermont falls down on is any type of help for the smaller business folks. You know we see it with the LED dynamics move, freedom foods, you've got folks that come in that'll help write grant applications and do all that. The small business development corp is there to help write business plans and whatnot for some of the smaller businesses but there's really not anybody there to help shepherd those people. The ability to get small businesses to write grants is pretty critical and I'll share with you why. So the other day, I think a week ago or so I received an email and there was a grant available to take your I don't know what the age factor was but they're writing grants to take XYZ year diesels off the road. So I don't remember exactly what the year was but I had two qualifying trucks so you have to write a grant application to get that done. Well I'm not a grant writer and nobody in my office is a grant writer but you know this could be a potentially worth as much as twenty thousand dollars to our business to be able to remove a carbon burning truck that they could replace with a more fuel efficient type of vehicle and apparently this is happening around the state because there were certain examples that I'd heard about where it's a fuel oil dealership that had just a regular oil delivery truck and it was like a 1998 I think and they took it out of service and he got twenty something thousand bucks to buy a new energy efficient high clean diesel unit. So but I don't have the ability to write that stuff but if there was a person in the community that you could go to who could you know help you could get some assistance for this kind of stuff I think it would benefit a lot of businesses and I'm sure there's more programs out there because I get brochures in the mail from Efficiency Vermont and they want to come you know assess the building and figure out what to do but you've got to write the grant and I'm just not that's not me. So you know if we had and actually we did do a little outreach and there's actually a person in Burlington who they and so you know we're going to set up a meeting with that person but you know here I'm working with somebody in Burlington and I think we really should be having this person locally. So I think that would be one of the things that this economic development position could work towards and but I'm not sure that the challenge with that though is what's the town's role versus what is like the Chamber of Commerce or somebody like that's role. I don't know that it's the town's job to provide somebody to actually write the grants for the business or to provide assistance and put them in that direction is what I'm thinking. I think it is their job to help educate folks on what's out there and what to do and who they could go to for help for that. Exactly. There's a difference there. Yeah and maybe that person maybe this is kind of what you're alluding to but maybe I'm saying it something more directly which we need that would be a person who is sort of constantly searching for these sorts of grant opportunities and identifies people businesses in town which might benefit and actually helps facilitate those connections also because that would be the particular expertise of that person would be knowing the business community within the town and being able to support them in that way because otherwise you have to come across these grants sort of happenstance. How did you find out about it? I sent an email. I don't know where they got my name from they sent an email. I saw that. I don't know. Do you think they probably went in? They did a search and they said okay who's got the vehicles that are beyond 2001 or whatever 2006 and at that point in time they said oh okay these companies qualify so we'll send them an email and say hey you're interested in taking that 2001 international out of service I'm assuming that's probably how it happened. No they can't sell your data from DMV but they must have select board. Okay well whatever. Anyways it's an opportunity for a business and apparently I don't know how they keep on perking up but to me those are valuable things if that money is sitting there we should be able to help businesses find that and so there may be other opportunities. I know my conversation with Trisha Follett up in Morrisville about what her role was for that community kind of a model that we ought to actually be exploring. She acts as a coordinator of all those different entities. She's involved with the arts council there she's involved with the chamber that's currently left and so she brings the arts people together she's working with the town's recreation department they're putting all these things on the park they have the summer long series up there where they're bringing all those people but she's also tagging all the businesses because she's using those businesses up there and I think that's the kind of person the chambers are struggling to even survive so a lot of this stuff is falling back onto this a lot of the conversations in the R3 meetings that are being had we've had representatives show up here from Browderboro from St. Albans sharing with us that's what their roles are in those communities they're actually working on economic development in their town employees in those communities to bring those people and those businesses together for sponsorship in these other projects is that the email from Deirdre Ritzer? probably is that the one? sounds like it I got this one last week so anyways I think there's also some grants that come to the town that we struggle with managing that that position should be able to help do also I think they also ought to be able to work with the different groups in the community when we do these public events that seem sometimes you see them and you're like why isn't this group involved or why isn't that business here that would make sense for them to be here because there isn't that one person that's able to say this, this, and this should all be at the table for this give me an example we're going to get that stage race that's coming it's going to start at the high school it's going to end at Ayersbrook Grote Dairy but there's no cohesive effort to work and support that to get people over there other than the biking community but right now there's an opportunity over there to provide services food, whatever that part of that's missing because we really don't have anybody that we can turn that fellow over to and say hey I work with this person because they can bring the community together with this project and shows us as a more vibrant community so we're missing that little element because right now it's falling upon Miles and I to try to figure out how to drag enough people together to, you know, can we get Sarah at the black crime to participate, can we get one main to participate so we're just trying to figure out I'm willing to throw up a tent but who are we going to put in it and I think if there was a community person involved in that who's doing what this Trisha Follett does in Morristown I think it would be a benefit Heidi has done some things like that right where some rep sponsored activities she's gone out and found people to you know, businesses to help be part of that but it would be nice if that was something that she didn't have to do she has lots of ideas about stuff which is more directly rep which would be great if she could focus on take that piece of that off her it's like sponsorship in the little league field how does that happen it's because the little league people go to the businesses and do it it used to be that way but it's a hard sell it's hard to get that now a lot of people ask for money now a lot of different entities that are we get hammered all the time so I'm just doing in kind services and it seems to work for everybody but I'm just thinking that this person that Trisha's role in Morristown really impressed me as to what she was able to bring to the table for the town what really is working for the entire community and the Delpho did you ever talk to her I did, yeah she and I had a long conversation about how she started with Morristown how her position kind of went from like part-time to the part-time she was going through a bit of a tip with the town manager at the time so she vented a little bit about him and I said well, conversation for a different time but she was very she was very willing to share some of the work that she's already doing some of the strategies that she's doing and then also said that you know that she was a little I think that she was kind of a diamond in the rough that Morristown kind of found because she just kind of grew for the position and thought that she didn't really have a job description she just created it as she went along it was a little hard for us to get that from her but she offered to help us build something build something similar to what she does there so this is the goal that we've been talking about for a really long time now sounds like we're fairly close in terms of finding money for it yep I mean what's really standing in our way at this point of just making this reality passing the town plan right? because that's what's in the town plan well, I don't think we need to pass the town plan to make this decision anyway, we can move the town plan really does put the teeth in it for sure because that's what the town plan this seems like well that has seems like it's like uncontroversial people want to see this happen in lots of different areas lots of different things so what's in our way how do we just make this finally do this now so I can say that we have we had budgeted for the executive secretary position of 40,000 for the year but some of the savings that we've identified through just consolidating the services we only had to borrow roughly about 5,000 of it to compensate for Shannon's current salary at part time so we have roughly about 30 to 35,000 it's a 30 remaining for that position plus the 15,000 that the economic development committee offered to use so now we have roughly about 45,000 so that's just for a portion of it we would have to find the salaries portion of it now if we made this a contract position 3 years with the potential ability to make it full time town position after that we could find a way to get away from providing benefits and we could be immediate we could find somebody right away and we could do that because it's a 3 year contract to see what happens from there and in that time we could work to find more money to make it a very benefited position in the future but in terms of having a salary without the benefits we could find that right away salary with benefits makes it a little bit harder to do and how much do you anticipate the benefits would cost depending if they're coming with a family or not roughly about yearly maybe 15 15 to 20,000 dollars it just seems like we should be able to find 15,000 dollars I think put it in the budget we're talking less than we do have 20,000 in the economic fund each year that's one of the others I have listed we also still are in the middle of negotiation yes I understand they want the world everybody does so well I'm supportive so we need a job spec that needs to be developed so what exactly do you want this job doing which is what we were just so I guess from my perspective there's two things one is I like the update to the town website although maybe the town plan could be more visible plan but I think an outreach to let people know about Randolph somehow would be beneficial I know that the squared thing is going and all that other stuff but getting Randolph out there a little bit more once we figure out what our message is and then the other thing is we as a company in town trying to focus and trying to find positions to fill it's really hard to hire skilled labor so we reach out to VTC I get people that are in Norwich the local school RTCC does a good job of placing students through some of their programs on the high school side not so good but making that connection between young people in the town and town opportunities I think would also be beneficial to try to keep people interested in organically from because I've got four kids and one of the four wants to stay in Vermont kind of thing right now it's hard well it's one of the reasons why I'm going to build a ski tow yeah right exactly because those are the kind of things that I believe that will bring people to the community and keep the people that are here now and I will tell you that the amount of support for that is somewhat overwhelming since I launched that last Sunday night my Facebook page has got over I think a hundred likes on it whatever it was called you remember Randolph when or something has got something like 130 today and the comments are just staggering and there's letters to the communities receive some letters coming from people in support of the project but the single overwhelming thing that seems to be coming out of this is the fact that it's about creating something for families to do here so when we talk about that you have that project we also have a growing group of people on motorized sports so there's that cold thing getting some of the class 3 roads opened up oh like dirt bikes ATV types ATVs, UTVs, that kind of thing there's been branch readjust recently opened up some of their class 4 and class 3 to motorized recreation Barnard has done that, Stockbridge has done that Ridgewater has done that and so there's certain areas where there's private landowners who are allowing that type of recreation to happen on their property but they need to connect their pieces to be able to put it together Barnard Stockbridge and Bridgewater I believe connected a lot of what's currently going on over there that's run by the quadrunners or something and they're part of VASA and so I've been over there numerous times and it's pretty cool you can get around the countryside get up on top of the mountains doesn't seem to bother the neighbors much they've got speed limits on the roads every now and then you see the sheriff over there and so there's some enforcement going on but I think that could be another asset that we could bring to the community for some of those kind of folks and there's a lot of folks here that own those things you look at the areas of New Hampshire they don't survive without it we bought property in Pittsburgh New Hampshire specifically for this and you can sit there in the afternoon and watch them go through there'll be a hundred an hour going through and they'll all be lined up at the local store, they'll be at the restaurants they'll be everywhere it's huge I don't think you're going to see that here in Randolph but I think it would be good to be able to connect the camp grounds to the dirt roads to let them get out to certain areas over our direction you could get on the trails some of the trails that are there and then dirt roads and get over to Chelsea where they're really clamoring for people to use the restaurants and they just got gas back in town which was a huge thing this type of recreation would bring a lot of users for those type of services to these small stores we'd see it on the snowmobile trails in the wintertime it's a tremendous boom for the Vermont economy and the summer part of this is actually doing a lot for the same reasons and I guess I don't hear any grumbling I've poked around and burnered a lot in Bridgewater and Stockbridge there doesn't seem to be a lot of objection to what's going on there I was actually shocked to hear the brain tree decided to open up some but it's a great thing that recommendation came from their conservation commission they found scooch about it and we felt that they needed to give it a shot so maybe we can do the same thing so when we do it now for the snowmobiles in the wintertime we're granting access to certain third class class 4s so that they can continue to move around so I think there is a trail across the State Highway across the right that's been there for years and it's a major connection for the vast system back and forth from east to west here from my house there exactly that's a very popular trail when there's snow there's a lot of riders that make that cross back and forth they can get gassed too though and that's been a major economic driver to the barn before that rinkers rinkers used to pay the fuel bill for the groomer exactly rinkers used to pay for the fuel for the grooming because it was so beneficial to them so yeah that would be certainly one to take a look at so we can have a conversation with rangery and chat with them about where are there things that they've got areas right now they've got that could connect to us that we could probably figure out how to move forward with one of the projects that was underway was updating all the town's policies and then putting them online so people could see them and know what they were doing I don't know where that that's not one of the glamorous ones but it would help us in certain cases when we were dealing with one of the cases with the PD we went looking for policies and they were scattered everywhere yeah that's what I think started that initiative of trying to pull them together update them and get them electronic but I think we lost that yeah I did hear it was one of the items that I do remember Mel mentioning to me before he left and there was a large folder of the size in one of his cabinets there was a company that came in and talked to us and it wasn't much five thousand for them to take them and update them and send them back to the board to consider and then put them out there one of the other things I think we need to do is to find the roles and responsibilities between the town and RACDC and we had that question I think at the last there was a couple folks that were interested in working on that but we didn't have any volunteers so they had sent back a thing saying they wanted to have that discussion also I don't know what the most productive format is for that but I think it would probably serve everybody if we got that a little better defined and well I have no problem having conversations with them I've had some here in the past so that's the direction we want to go in I'm more happy to sit on a committee to do that there's been some change in their board of directors too who knows what the direction is but I'm interested in sitting and talking about that if anybody wants to join me I'm more happy to do that they have invited town to either visit one of their board meetings to talk about the relationship I think one of the challenges is if more than three board members or more attend a meeting it has to be warned and that whole thing happens I think it's one of the challenges is how do we get their board and their director to speak with the board and our directors without the formality of a meeting and it's almost impossible to do that so we should do it it could just be a special meeting and I'll select board and town manager and RACDC executive board director the meeting could just be that I think that would be a good place to start could we do a little I'm sorry I doubt we would conclude all possible business in one meeting normally if we want to but it could certainly give us a framework an outline which then we could work on either two of us or something else but it seems like getting something in place where we can form a framework of how we're going to work together it seems like really I was just going to say that because in one meeting maybe a board member in Adolfo does some of the legwork ahead of time to kind of see their goals and objectives and mission statements and things like that so we can have a better idea ahead of time sort of come up with an agenda ahead of time working with them in the background data that makes a lot of sense do some more work I could do that Mike he said Perry I'm more than happy to do it I don't have the history that some of you have I'm starting at a different point so whether or not that's valuable or not I don't know whether it's good to not have the history or have history but I'm more than happy to have a conversation I think I know enough about what we want or what I think what we want to see certainly if things start someplace and they have been there have been conversations with them in relation to the R3 process so I've already been involved in some of that so and I've been part of that R3 process which has been coming to those meetings maybe I could join you guys on the other side Larry's got a little bit of the history so I'll set it together what else do folks have for $40,000 that's probably all they can do that's a different position this isn't still on that point persons well, I was hoping Heidi was going to stick around so I'll share with you some thoughts that I've got the part of the goal process but I'll give you a little overview of what I'm thinking with this ski-tow project so this ski-tow project is an opportunity that I saw that it's not about me making any money it has nothing to do with that as a matter of fact I personally would just as soon see an entity take it under their wing there's been discussion that we've had about creating some form of partnership with the town recreation facilities it's not much different than the skating ring or the soccer field or the tennis court but I know that had something not happened fairly quickly that property could have gone into a development situation and there would be houses sitting there instead of what I've got envisioning so my hope is that we can do a number of things here one is form either a profit or a co-op with this that I can actually turn it over to and get it to that point where it can be sustainable there's been a tremendous amount of people who have been willing to contribute a lot of stuff to make this happen I've got people who said they'll step up to the plate with dollars I've got people who are willing to do in kind services to get it running Bill McGrath recently offered to provide all the lighting for the hill who would pay to put it in place so I've got right now a company out of Sonopee New Hampshire called Star Lifts who came yesterday looked at the hill they've got a used handle tow that they could install in an approximate the same location where the old lift used to be my intention is to leave what's there because I think there's a tremendous amount of historical value to that and so they also suggested we put in a little small child's rope tow on a certain portion of the hill which they were more than willing to kind of lease to us at a relatively inexpensive cost to get the thing up and running about a thousand bucks just to have it was just like we'll set it up and you can have it for a thousand bucks and if you decide you want to own it we'll sell it to you relatively cheap so anyways we're going to move forward with this we do have to get an Act 250 permit which we've started the process on that and we have a Development Review Board hearing next Tuesday night to talk about what we're going to do up there I've had no opposition from anybody up there on the hill a couple little quick letters only concerned about the lighting issue but we assured them this wasn't going to be seven days a week and every day so it may be something along the lines of what other areas have done but my hope is that this could become a joint venture between the town and a non-profit to actually run it so this provides kids near the opportunity to learn how to ski or to do whatever they so desire because that is something that I know for a fact is out of the reach of a lot of families here so I think this is a perfect opportunity to bring back some history and create something here that could certainly, I believe benefit the community no different than the skating rink or the tennis courts or the pool which we need to fix but anyways that's the goal there so that's where I'm at with that so if I could find a swimming pool we'd buy a swimming pool but right now we've got a lift opportunity here so I don't know if any of you are familiar with the history of the hill a little bit maybe so it was an operation from 1936 to 1966 and then was taken out of service and Pinnacle was created and Pinnacle went belly up in 76 and so at that point in time there was no opportunities but anyways there is now yes you used to be able to jeep up Pinnacle you did yep you used to be able to jeep up Pinnacle long as you didn't get caught but anyways this piece of property does border the Ellis town forest one of the things that we're chatting about doing is having the parking lot available for summer use so that the parking lot could become the trail head for that part of the recreation area and also in the winter time the parking area could certainly be used to access the Ellis town forest for snowshoeing and cross country skiing or whatever Pat Tiger biking keeps on popping to the surface that's popped up a number of times and I've been talking to Zach about that and we think that's a possibility that that could be launched from there because that would be a great spot to take it off to so maybe that Ellis town forest property becomes a Pat Tiger biking trail which is turning to be a big deal right? I don't do it but everybody tells me this is huge I don't know how big it is it's big hopefully it will be I'd love to get it out there it's not going to happen with the other people do it too well so anyways so that is something that I would love to see the town become involved in so how we get there I'm not sure yet but I think it's a really good opportunity for not just for us but for the other two communities Braintree and Brookfield kids do so that's the goal here any other goals things you want to see done focus on moving on to managers report okay try to be brief I've got a large list here but I'll keep it short the first is I attended last or this week's meeting of the fire advisory committee spoke with the members about a potential tabletop exercise for emergency management the committee was open to having this tabletop exercise so now we're working with Vermont emergency management to see what their next steps are for planning this exercise we would include fire, police Gifford school district to plan something out with the next step of having a live exercise in the spring so we mobilize firefighters mobilize police mobilize everyone to run through the motions a railroad participates in those type of exercises sometimes too you're just putting here this is from my note I can check in with the railroad now it's going to come in sometimes if you wanted it to involve okay I need to speak with them anyways about railroad street so it is a good excuse yeah you're right so that's one approach that we have an update on the swimming pool repairs we know what the issues are we know that are going to cost some money we are working I've asked Bill to work with Marty to build an RFP for everything that we need to repair the swimming pool we have roughly about $50,000 identified that would be available to repair the swimming pool as soon as we complete the RFP we'll bring it to the board for review but the work that needs to be done includes new refinishing of the inside of the swimming pool we've knocked that down because the full glazing of the inside would roughly be about $100,000 so now what we're doing is just certain we're going to do some spot painting which is not a full glaze of the inside but just waterproof swimming pool paint that will seal whatever micro cracks are available within there within the pool itself actually not the biggest problem we didn't feel that the leaks were actually within the actual structure as opposed to the pipes so the project also includes full replacement of the pressure pipes that go all the way around or a section of it in the I believe it would be the east, southeast portion of the swimming pool just replacing that section and then also pipes for the skimmers that actually clean the water as it sucks it out and the pipes circulate the water back in and replacing four major heads that are on the deep end of the pool that were initially put in for potential expansion for water features things of that nature we're hoping that the bids come back within our budgeted amount if it doesn't then we'll try to find money elsewhere but the plan is that we are going to have the swimming pool completed and opened by next summer on the date when we normally open the swimming pool so that's the update with the swimming pool I have recently met with Casella a representative came in to speak to me about change in the state law that now allows waste disposal companies to charge for recycling one of the issues that they are facing is that China is no longer purchasing some of the items that they were collecting in order to make it easier for these trash collectors to continue to collect the recycling the state allowed these facilities to charge to accept certain types of recycling as a way to compensate that the companies are saying well we were charging a lot for trash and nothing for recycling but now with this change in the law we're allowed to actually charge for recycling so we're going to decrease the cost of trash disposal and it's apparently a way to keep them from going under so I've asked Casella to come in and present to the board of what their plan is for our transfer station the agreement that we have with Casella says that they are allowed to make changes to the fee structure if they give the town a 30-day notice I said don't make any changes until you talk to the board and they agreed to come to the next board meeting to brief the board on their challenges and what their proposed pay rate would be so that should happen if the board approves for the next like board meeting we had the first meeting of the ad hoc police evaluation committee we have the second meeting coming up first meeting I felt was productive Matt, Larry, we're both there we had some members volunteer to bring back some information including ways, alternative ways to fund the police department crime data that is collected by state attorney's office and to continue evaluating data as opposed to evaluating options so we want to see what the data is for the town and see where the data leads the committee and what decision would then best work for the data that's available I believe the Sheriff's department is also working on collecting data to present to the board for the time for the next meeting we have worked with our partners in V-Trans that our partners V-Trans declined a grant that we applied for that would provide us with sufficient funding to repair the culvert on Beanville Road it is not an imminent danger of collapse but it's a culvert that we should address relatively soon V-Trans is aware of the financial pressures they've allowed us to extend the existing grant that we have now an additional year that we had already extended an additional year beyond the life of the grant they've also allowed us to work with some value engineering to make it to make it structurally sufficient but also not as grand as was initially proposed so the way it was described to us is that we were being given the catalogue of culvert replacements where we really just need afford so we're being allowed to work on recapturing some of the engineering money that was available before to re-engineer the project and then work forward finding more money for the culvert replacement so we're working with them we're keeping them well aware of what our pressures are and they're working with us so we've got a good relationship with them East Randall Hall we had the community group show up today we're meeting with them on a regular basis they're aware that $400,000 for repairs to the hall is not easy to come by so they also are aware that they are not going to get in the hall this year potentially not next year and they're okay with it now so long as the town continues to work with them and help them through the process so we're going to continue to work with them I have a meeting scheduled with the Vermont State Police regarding our policing issue with the town I don't know what their offer is but I've heard that they could potentially be interested in some kind of partnership with the town I have spoken with Chef Baniak so he is aware that I'm having this meeting I didn't want to make him feel like we're blindsighting him even though he's helping us out at the moment so he's fully aware of what's happening but once I have more information from State Troopers I will share it with the board it could potentially be that they could offer a similar offer that water barrier received which is two officers there's 80 hours per week at $365,000 but I don't really know what they're going to offer or if they're even going to offer anything so we're still working on that and I'll share what I get from them with the board the Vermont Council on Rural Development has asked the board to recommend someone from the town to participate in the Vermont Community Leadership Summit so if there's anyone that the board feels would participate in working with Council on Rural Development on this particular committee they're open to accepting anyone that the board feels can work with them or would benefit from being a part of this summit I could just tell them that the board is considering it they say what the summit's on leadership doesn't get a local leader to participate in the Vermont Community Leadership Summit making it happen local leadership for the future of Vermont communities this would be held on October 1st at Castleton University I could bring it back up again for the next select board meeting if the board wants to have some time to think about potential options are they looking for a certain age group that we're targeting or are they looking for clear? just someone that they feel the board would be yeah no specific range I want to recommend I have been following up with the on-home roads initiative that I think started well before I arrived we do know that there is roughly just under 3 miles of the road that if we were to go through this process would be taken off of the town's Class 3 road system we would receive less reimbursement from the state it wouldn't be very much I don't have the exact amount but it would roughly be two, three, four hundred dollars and we would receive less but the benefit to that is that our highway department finds it very difficult from time to time to plow these one-home roads because some of them are very long and they do lead into areas that would be difficult to actually turn around and then come right back out to the main highway are they having a back out on a lot of these which makes it dangerous back right back out into the regular traveled streets with their equipment and they can't see they're basically driveways that the town has and for whatever reason we have them as Class 3s they should be Class 4s in my opinion because they're not travel planes for anybody and if you pull in you feel like you've drove into somebody's house yard because that's how they use it so it's our options are two we can change them to Class 4 which then we don't maintain them and whatnot or we can throw them up which means we just give them up all together they don't even become Class 4s how come we're still dealing with this what was the we never started the process to change them this has been going on for quite a long time a year this has been talked about for 20 years no but we but you guys started this before we get them all identified and that's about as far as we made it so what is the process do we want to try and get this done before winter so that I would think we would yes there's a goal there's a goal right there you're right short term it's a real tangible goal it's big because some of these we have to either send a truck over a pickup over because the trucks can't get in these yards or in a few cases it's a loader that we send over so they drive from the Randolph center garage over to the Chelsea mountain road with a loader to do some of these and they wouldn't fit our current road standards we wouldn't take them on if they were right does it require at least three properties and some other stuff right yeah I'll certainly follow up with and I know the process is in the orange book for V-Trans I'll follow up with the process I could certainly work this year to get the ball rolling and I think it's going to be the quickest for us to just change them from a 3 to a 4 a 4 because throwing them off we got to go back and do the land record research with them to begin with whatever a lot of them were through that were abandoned there's no really good reason like to not take the easy route you can go to class 4 and maintenance responsibilities and while we go through the rest of it even if we wanted to just give them off okay all I said is one of the things and that is all I have for this meeting next on the agenda is executive session second motion in the second all those in favor aye opposed stand motion carries