 RCR with Paul Brennan, reality check radio. Friday morning, time for our political panel here at RCR. Cam Slater, Marty Gibson and Olivia Pearson in the RCR house. Welcome all. Hello, Paul. Good morning. Nice to be here with my fellow... Panelists. Sound thinkers. Panel beaters. OK, so plenty to talk about. And let's launch into... Shall we start with polls again? Do you think? Yeah, look, I don't think we need to get into the numbers because the numbers are a foregone conclusion. But this week, we've had a one news poll and a news hub poll, both saying pretty much the same thing, that National Inact can't get there by themselves, that they're going to need Winston Peters in New Zealand first to form a government. There's absolutely no hope of Labour greens into party Maori getting even close to the required 61 seats. And even if they... The media like talking about... But they could form a coalition with Labour as well. Christopher Hick can spend a considerable amount of time in both the leaders' debates talking about the coalition of chaos. And of course, the media have picked that up as well. But if he wants to govern, he's going to need to have four parties. And two of those parties have got co-leaders. So you've got six leaders that are going to be... If that's a recipe for chaos, you can't find a worse one than that. A Hydra. Exactly. We've had three party governments before. They work OK. We're always going to have this problem as long as we have MMP, which is forever. So you'll hear people say, oh, we should have chosen STV. Well, we didn't. So let's just deal with reality. How's this for a bold... Well, it's not a prediction, but what if Act is out of the picture? Well, there's a distinct chance of that. And then I've talked about this and it really upsets Act people when you do. But with Seymour's, you know, cack-handed attacks against New Zealand First and Winston Peters, his vote has stalled. And in fact, it's probably going backwards a little bit. Whereas Winston Peters in New Zealand First vote has gone up. So, you know, there was a brilliant Tremaine cartoon yesterday, which has David Seymour holding a smoking shotgun and has stumps for feet. He's got stumps for feet. And in the cartoon, you know, there's these little characters down the bottom that are saying, well, you know, what's happened? What's Winston Peters done to upset Seymour so much? Seymour and the little character down the bottom says, oh, well, he went and talked to the Patriots at Parliament. The Patriots. The Patriots on the lawn. This is Tremaine in the New Zealand Herald. Yeah. You know, that is a watershed moment right there. They're talking about the people who went to Wellington and supported the protest and were there at the protest and backed the protest, Patriots. That's in the New Zealand Herald. Do you ever notice that when David Seymour was talking about reasons to have a strong economy, normally one of the first things out of his mouth is a really good reason to have one is that you get good pharmaceuticals. And I do wonder if that's the reason that he's shooting his foot off going after Winston Peters rather than doing what he was doing, which was working really well for him, which was pointing out what we could be doing better economically. You'd have to explain why, though, you'd go that way when everything surely points to that doesn't fly. Maybe he's getting sponsored by someone who really doesn't want people talking about it. Or do you buy Pfizer? Absolutely. I mean, for a Pfizer bank accounts. I mean, I can think of all sorts of great reasons to have a strong economy. You can provide better education. People's health gets better. You look after the environment better. Human flourishing. You get to afford things. Yeah. Yeah, you can eat good food. Having great pharmaceuticals certainly isn't the first thing to roll off my tongue when I think about a reason to have a strong economy. There's better ways to say that, like improved health outcomes. Yeah, he's very specific. Improved health outcomes is better hospitals, better treatment options. At the moment, the status quo, I'd much rather have a coalition of chaos as they keep. It's much more fun. Yeah. I'd rather have a coalition of chaos than a coalition of communists, which Labour greens into party Murray would certainly be. At the moment, the status quo is our government sleepwalking us into globalist totalitarian. So I want to see a coalition of chaos. I want there to be a massive spanner in the works. I want there to be a political fight for nationalism and the Kiwi way rather than calmly and quietly and civilly losing our sovereignty to supranational bodies overseas. Getting rogered in the point. How hard would it be for Luxon to say that when HIPKINS does come out and say it'll be a coalition of chaos? Just to say, hey, look, we're used to dissenting views being squashed by this government. You know, what you're saying is a coalition of chaos is just hashing out differences of opinion. He can't be seen to endorse Winston, though, Marty. That's the thing. Yeah, that's right. But what happens, though? What happens if the Nats get freaked out because it's Winston? We can only deal with Winston if act, you know, the road war. Could they go with the Greens? Could they go with the Greens in act? Well, if you look at the politics of Christopher Luxon, you could you have to be able to say, yes, you can't categorically say no way, can you? How would the net voters take that, though? It's like a bucket of cold sick. Of course, like a bucket of cold sick. And I tell you, net zero net carbon is Christopher Luxon's biggest issue. He cares about that more than he cares about the economy. So that phrase used, we're fixated on it. We're absolutely fixated on it. What a weird thing to say. Freudian slip. Well, given he presided over the, you know, the spreading of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere for how many years burning thousands of millions of tons of jet fuel everywhere. So he probably knows a bit about that. Yeah, but he woke up. He woke up five in New Zealand, though, at the same time. Yeah, but they still burnt the jet A1, didn't they? They didn't stop doing that. Look, he just wants, he's just so sopping wet. He's been standing in a puddle of his own making for so long that he's got mildew on the bottom of his trousers, up to the knees. Well, I mean, did you notice that Seymour described Winston as the least trustworthy person in New Zealand politics and said, we're not going to sit around the cabinet table with this clown? He then said that he wouldn't fight Winston Peters because it would be elder abuse. The guys are the guys and Winston retorted that David Seymour reminds me of a Chihuahua at the front gate, barking at every cat, human being or fellow dog that passes. Fellow dog. Oh, dear. But, you know, I mean, the polls, the polls, just to get us back on track for the discussion, the polls are emphatic. We're going to have a change of government. Right. And so now what we're doing is we're discussing what that government looks like. And I think there's a distinct possibility that New Zealand First may start taking votes off act. Acts clearly run out of national voters to take votes off now and they're stalled. And you're going to see a fair bit of the soft Labour vote. What remains of it go to New Zealand First 2, which, you know, you've got to hand it to Winston of all of, if you look at all of the campaigns so far, you know, and what have we got two weeks left to go? If you look at all of the campaigns so far, you've got Winston Peters is a standout campaigner. And it's not because I'm biased. I'm just looking at it analytically. So he had, you know, his horse ad. I mean, you had to laugh about the horse ad. That was so Northland. Yeah. But it's not the horse ad, Cam. It's the Southern Man ad. Yeah, that's right. But here's the thing, every time that they have a poll and we saw it on TV, one on the one news poll, we saw it on the news hub poll. They go, Winston's back in this. Guess what? The TV stations then ran. They ran Winston on his horse. At least he had his shirt on. Yeah, like Putin gone or gone or Putin, you know, but but the thing is, is he got. You know, free media, basically, that's what you get when you've got good pictures, when you create good pictures. Then you had Shane Jones singing this, you know, thing. And then his pirate shanty with a wig as well. With the wig, but it's spread everywhere. It's hilarious. And then you've got him getting again, free media as a result of the poll, as a result of the leaders debate on Wednesday night, where Hipkins attacked one of New Zealand First's candidates for saying something rather anodyne, really. And now it's all over the news that this candidate said something. And what's also all over the news is Winston Peters says, I back in one hundred percent handing an object lesson to David Seymour and how you handle comments from candidates. You back them, you don't throw them under the. And like some look what he did to Maureen Pew and who was the other guy. And there was another guy after that. Yeah, well, I mean, Winston's done that kind of thing in the past. Let's not let him off that. He's thrown people under the bus quite brutally in front of the media. Like Brendan Horan, but frankly, he deserved it. And Kim Coloni as well, I'm thinking back then. But but anyway, I mean, it's a new it's a new. She was one of his candidates that was very, very anti-co-governance and was very vocal about it. And OK, too embarrassingly for Winston at that time. That was twenty seventeen. OK. All right. But I mean, did anyone see the poll? You can. No, no, no, you segue to the next thing. Well, Dr. Alana Ratner sent a communique to the freedom movement photos yesterday. And I think her thinking is pretty sound and very much in line with my own. And I couldn't fault her very well written communique. She said in there, New Zealand first is no longer a one man band. It's senior leadership, board, candidates and members are mostly freedom people and that they get the reality of vaccine harms and its leader is ready to accept the baton and the responsibility the party has handed him. They are taking it to the government and the old media who have collaborated to shatter the country. With this absolutely crucial election, it's time to focus everyone on what's best for New Zealand. Minor party leaders who continue to tell their supporters that there is a chance of success are being very unfair to them and to everyone else. And she went on to say here come the emails. Yeah, she went on to say there is no loss of face and standing aside in order to achieve the best possible outcome for all freedom fighters and additional five percent of the party vote could be given to New Zealand first. Thus, there would be no wasted vote allocation of seats to other parties. Now, I mean her thinking is also in line with Guy Hatchard's thinking who made his case and he made six points of why he would advocate voting for Winston Peters. Those six are the inquiry into the COVID response. The freedom movement has failed to unite, which it has. Many policies are in harmony with freedom voters attracting good candidates as Winston has done, who are patriots and who get the enormity of what we're up against. New Zealand first is evolving beyond just Winston. And that's I have to say personally, I mean, I'm not the greatest fan of Winston for for being such a political pragmatist over many issues over the years. So the party evolving beyond him is very important to me. And also I'd be with you on that, Olivia. I'd probably be about where you are on that, I'd say. Yeah, because we don't have any political satire like MacFarlane Gadsby. So what we were referring to before with Shane Jones with a wig on his head, singing a shanty, I mean, that's as good a satire as you're going to get in this flipping God forsaken country at the moment. Or all that is beyond Winston. Winston is there at the moment, but he's triple vexed. God knows how long he's going to be around. I want to see the party evolving way beyond Winston, attracting really good people because they are patriots and because they are nationalists. That's a very good reason for them to be a banner. Well, it's anti-establishment as well, isn't it? It's, you know, national and labor. You know, when they say, yep, yep, and unison, they're the establishment parties that they go parties. Yeah, absolutely. And the media is on board with the status quo. Well, I mean, you saw that in debate on Wednesday night. They are the status quo, Marty. There was a there was a quick fire, a quick fire question session. And the amount of times that Luxon and Hipkins agreed on something. No, not again. Was far more than when they disagree. And when they did disagree, it was just on the implementation of the same thing. Exactly. Right. Exactly. So like, national is the same as labor. They just wear different shirts. Well, the the the the the different the other cheek of the same ass. That's a little Oliver. We need we need to look at it. We need to go back to good old fashioned lists of hierarchy of values. If people could list the hierarchy of values of what we need to vote for coming up and globalism, foreign investment, anti foreign investment, diversifying away from the flip and poison of China and anti the who and the UN with all their globalism is very, very high on my my hierarchy of values here. You know, somewhere along the line, we stop being our own country and gave ourselves a way to pragmatism of the worst variety. And I'd like to see that back. And patriotism is huge. And can I just do a little spiel on patriotism? Because it's not a language that New Zealand speaks easily. America does. New Zealand doesn't so much. We often hear call it jingoism, right? You are uncomfortable with it. Yeah. But really, I want to just draw from I don't know if you're familiar with the scientific fiction list, Robert Heinlein, who wrote The Moon is a harsh mistress and a whole lot of other novels. What's the monkeys discover? They can vote themselves bananas that don't bother climbing trees. I think that's great. That's one of his. Yeah. Well, Heinlein gave an address to the graduates of West Point back in 1973. And his whole thrust of that was patriotism. And he said that the man who is not patriotic is an evolutionary dead end. This is not sentiment, but the hardest of logics. Patriotism is the most practical of all human characteristics because it allows your nation to flourish. He said in that speech to the intellectuals who snare at patriotism as if it were just some mindless jingoism. When they say that, quote, patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel, unquote, what they never mention is that the man who made that snaring remark was a fat gluttonous slob who who was pursued all his life by a pathological fear of death. Now, I totally agree with that because I think it's now time for the freedom movement to truly rise up and be patriotic and think about their country and their countrymen and women and move to support the only party who will have a chance at taking the fight to the globalists. And that's New Zealand first is the question on, excuse me, on patriotism and the freedom movement. Do you think the freedom movement actually understand patriotism? Because if that's missing in their thinking, no wonder it's kind of all over the place. Yeah, good, good, good observation, Paul. It may be missing from New Zealand culture too much as a rule, because unlike the United States, as we've said before, we were we're not founded on being anti our government or we're not founded on a revolution. New Zealand has this very spookily comfortability with spooky comfortability with being kind of in love with our governments, thinking that they'll always act for us. But what we've seen in the last three three to 20 years is that they will not act for us. They will not act for us unless we force them to. So it's about time we actually learned to adopt the language of patriotism. And maybe that freedom movement would be more cohesive if they if there was an understanding of what patriotism was. Well, patriotism just means you love your country. Well, that's that's what I mean and and and have a generic consideration rather than having doubts and feeling awkward about that. Yeah, that we care about our fellow. Yeah, and not anyone who doesn't go somewhere else. If you don't like it, you know, Heinlein also said in that speech that patriotism is another way. It's a it's a polite way of saying women and children first. That's a nice way of putting it. Yeah, because, you know, our patriotic men and I know there's many out there that are now standing for the um, standing up for women and all that sort of stuff. They we women, we do need men to stand up for us. I don't care what any feminist says. We need our men behind us to stand for us. We need that. We need it for our daughters. Well, that's what I found interesting about the wearing frocks when the young leaders debate with Lee Donahue. We don't want cocks and frocks doing it. Do we the young leaders debate with Lee Donahue? The only the only person standing up for women in a whole gaggle of women was a guy. Exactly. There was that. That was such a beautiful slice of reality on where we're at. And we saw and we saw, you know, Chloe Swalbrook hurling out the Missandrist, you know, epithets all the time, you know, basically a bro this and cheer that and just so slovenly in the way that she speaks, not making any point at all other than to call Lee Donahue a racist for anything he said, you know, it was just appalling what was going on. He did that with such dignity. And he's talent. Yeah, he is. He is huge talent. And again, I take my hat off to Winston for letting him stand as a candidate. Nine nine percent and he's in. You've got it. You've got to look at the reasons that some of the things have happened to us that we thought were happening for a certain reason. I've made the point before about, you know, the CIA and the Rockefeller sponsored feminism not to uplift women, but to create division and to moralize their most likely opponents. And and it's the same with with all of the sudden fixation. These same psychos have got on with indigenous people here and in Australia. It's to it's to leach away patriotism. It's not to help out of a country that you're constantly told is oppressive and has, you know, been the reason for all sorts of injustices. So, yeah, you take the name away, you try and change the flag. It's to make it easier to get that that globalist rule in there. You talk about patriotism just a moment ago. I want to play this clip. It's Alan Ballard speaking. I think at the 2030 conference, we need to be putting a lot more into the retail agencies that are working on that. And frankly, in the medium term, we're going to need to prepare for climate refugees on a scale that is far more than we have ever thought of from coming from the Pacific Island. We're talking about potentially millions of people as they suffer. Climate change impacts in very difficult ways. So millions are coming. No, they're not 15 minute 30s. You know, we're talking about on the debate, they're talking about have you got the political will to move people out of these cities which are prone to floods? Yeah, yeah, we do. And it's the same with the islands. But that's just scaring. That's that's just catastrophizing. That's it's based on nothing. Those elite beachfront properties aren't going to build themselves over. Do you think he really believes that? He's a bank. Yeah, I think he does. But when they hang on, that's a good point you raise there, Marty. Here's a bank. If he's a banker, they're in league with insurance companies and that. Our insurance cover for houses on the waterfront higher at the moment, or just the same as any old house that's still loaning money to people who want to buy putting. They are. I think they're still in hot demand beachfront properties, aren't they? Yeah, you want to sort of buy about 200 meters back because in, you know, in in short order, that'll be beachfront. If you listen to these, you know, doomsayers, nothing they've ever predicted has come true. Well, if you really look at why the sea levels are rising on some of these islands, a lot of it comes down to fishing with parrotfish with dynamite that nibble up coral and shit out sand. And then we're also exporting sand. That creates the impression that the sea level is rising. But we've got we've got an old story in our family. My grandfather was a chief surveyor of the Wellington Airport when it was built in 1959. And there are people who refuse to move their houses because they had to get rid of houses to reclaim land to make the runway in the position it is. One person argued, well, there was a bunch of people arguing that if they filled that area in, it would raise the water level. Yeah, right. Yeah, maybe. You know, it's just fanciful that not a single prediction that they've ever made has come true. You know, we were told by Al Gore with his little diagrams and his stupid, inconvenient truth movie that, you know, by a certain time would stick. There would be no ice in the North Pole. Well, there's still ice there. Yeah, still there. And they keep looking at a bit of Antarctica. They go, oh, you know, if we don't watch out, the Antarctic will melt. Really? So have you checked the temperatures of, you know, the average temperature on a daily basis in the South Pole? Has anybody looked I have? Probably about the same, is it? It never gets higher than minus 10. Now, I don't know about you, but when I was at school, water freezes below zero, right? And so if it's always minus 10, they aren't going anywhere. It's just not going anywhere. Winston even had a comment to make about that. He said he authorized or got the deal to do the ice core drilling. New Zealand did the ice core drilling in the Antarctic. And they did the core drilling. They pulled it up and and and it showed that bananas used to grow there. Oh, dear. So I don't know. All right, then it's tempting to say all these guys are just dumb. They're doing a terrible job. You know, again, as I've said before, maybe they're smarter than you think and they're doing a really good job. It's just you don't know what the job is or who you're working for. You don't know what the mission is. You can make a climate model say anything you want. And the fact is that the funding only goes to climate models that say a certain thing. Yeah, we know what the mission is. Mission is total control. What is the end game? Yeah, it's total control. Flood New Zealand with millions of of people. Well, how are they going to get here? Right? They're going to come in the little banana boats, you know, sail across some of the places. You know, they're just it's just it's bollocks. Yeah, bollocks, bollocks, OK. No, but they'll they'll get here the same way that people are now getting across the American border. They're flown in. Yeah. So hang on a second. They're climate refugees and they're going to come here by a plane increasing the problem, which will cause OK. I mean, that's what we're up against. It's it's that the one thing they do not want is patriotic New Zealanders that stand for their individual freedoms. They're against that. And they're against the country standing up and saying, no, we're full. Sorry, you can't come here. Or it doesn't work like that, unless there is a true emergency. But we know that if they cared about our country, they would never have shut down Mastin Point oil refinery, would they? At least they wanted to starve us of. Here's the thing, right? They go on about global warming and global boiling and all that bollocks, right? Global bollocks. Where do people go for their holidays in the cold winter in New Zealand? That's right. They go to places that are tropical. You know, it has the Maldives closed up shop. And they haven't gone underwater. Issued snorkels to everybody when you arrive. Of course not. Right. Have the Dutch have the Dutch been subsumed by, you know, tsunamis of North Sea? Another six feet on the dyke. Yeah, exactly. We do mitigation is far cheaper than the bollocks that they're forcing out on us. And whoever dreamed up the idea that taxation would solve the climate problem. Well, it solves the government revenue problem. Is huffing the same sort of hope here when you're in hopeless debt? Yeah, but they're huffing the same sort of hope here and that a fair number of people out there are thinking there's going to be two million voters come out of the woodwork and all of a sudden and there's going to be 42 MPs from a party no one's ever heard of. Well, we got to that. OK, I had to come up sometime. All right. Well, there's one debate that we're sorry, Marty, I think you were about to say something. I want to. Oh, no, I was just saying. The solution always seems to involve printing billions of dollars as debt for our children and setting it on fire as a burnt offering to the to the climate fairies or turning up with a wheelbarrow load of it just to buy your next. It always involves the banks and money. One of the debates we didn't talk about was the Māori leaders debate and comments by John Tumahedi. Anyone have anything to say about that? Yeah, I've I've been interested in in in the stuff. As I said, not just as, you know, that Māori shouldn't have a say on on things that happen in New Zealand through our Māori lens. But my contention is that it's a remnant of of Māori culture as a slave owner owning culture to to think about certain people in a certain way. And it's interesting in the past, Willie Jackson has said, you know, the Māori party and us basically agree on where we want to go. We've just got different ways of doing doing it. And there was a very telling moment in that debate where Willie Jackson said it works. It's nothing to be afraid of. And besides, it's a process that began under national. So that's their take. John Tumahedi called it a halfway house between Māori and what is rightfully theirs. So he's basically saying co-governance was just a halfway step to the where we want to go, which is you'd you'd assume full governance. And again, that's that's this elite Māori idea where they see themselves as rangatira looking, ruling over tūtua or commoners and owning slaves, who, you know, if you look at a lot of their attitudes towards taxpayers in New Zealand, you know, you take the fruits of their labor without reciprocity. If you have a child with one, it it gains your mana. And, you know, what Ballantyne said after he was misquoted in that leaders debate this week was it's just those top elite. We call them the conspirators, the Māori separatists that separatists that want to base co-governance, come self-governance on a racial based future, and we don't want that. And so it's it's got to be taken out of the context that that we're given this argument that it's racist. If you oppose co-governance, I think it's some as I've said before, it's the visceral reaction of the people with a proud history of abolishing slavery to being treated like a slave. Yeah, we saw that we saw that to come up in a debate the taxpayers union had and that little communist weasel from the Herald Simon Wilson was calling Jordan Williams a racist because he was opposing co-governance. And to his credit, Damien Grant just unloaded on Simon Wilson and said to him, you know, it's not racist to debate a point. Yeah, it's not racist. You know, and actually had to make Simon Wilson back down saying that just because you debate something doesn't make it racist. And Jordan Williams is not a racist. And, you know, that's gone right round social media. It's not racist to debate it. Yeah, it's a very important point, Cam. And, you know, you could see in the leaders debate as well, Marama Davidson, you know, they've said this several times, the Greens, the money is there to solve this poverty problem. We've just got to go and get it. The money, you know, the money that's there being the money that's in the assets that are in the hands of wealthier New Zealanders. And John Tommy, he said this as well. You know, if our poorest people are paying a certain percentage of their income and their assets in tax, then, you know, wealthy people should pay the same percentage of their assets. And, you know, the other side, Marty, or the other side always has more impetus and passion to fight for their communism because they have a whole system to loot. Whereas the conservative, you know, us holding up the conservative way of life is as hard. You've got to earn your way. You've got to struggle to feed your family and run a business and provide for people and pay your taxes. That's much harder to go in and loot something is easy. And Marama Davidson did have that. We seize the precious and we want it. Yeah, yeah, she's a total looter. And but this is the thing that we can find discouraging. I think I know I know I do is that you're trying to uphold decent values for human flourishing. And then you get these looters that come in and they are far more passionate than we are in a way because they have a system to loot. They must be met by us with the same passion to hold our traditions in place. And that is a democratic form where we have individual rights. Well, and that's the problem that happens every time. But this is half the problem, Olivia. We're trying to have a reasoned rational debate, challenging ideas. And they're not about that at all. And you just have to listen to the words that they say. Yeah, I mean, the key question here, and this was raised during that that debate was, do you believe that that Maori ceded sovereignty to the crown? And Willie Jackson said, no, no. And John Tamahiri said, no. And Marama Davison said, no. Yeah, they've all taken oaths to the correct power structure. So we're having a debate. Was that disingenuous with a lie? And the one person who said he stood up for Shane Jones was Shane Jones. All right. And you know, but the thing is, is that we're trying to have a debate around these ideas and they're not interested in a debate. They're interested ultimately in using the point of the gun or the powers of the state to to to usurp democracy and return to tribal control of New Zealand. And there's no debate that that they're going to have. And we're wishing to have a debate with people that don't want to debate and are starting from a point of view that is a a heroic rewrite of really simple principles of the treaty, that they just deny history, they deny the actual words and have come up with a fanciful idea that Maori never ceded sovereignty, that they were an equal to Queen Victoria, the Empress of India. Yeah, and that is not in the treaty, the first Maori language treaty that's not in there. What's always a Maori version was different is the other thing that's and that's where Julian Batchelor does really well in his lectures, because he makes that point very clearly that he is actually upholding the original treaty in Maori. And that's the thing is when we're having a debate, an intellectual debate against unarmed people that are not capable of an intellectual debate on this, because for them, it's their starting point is that we never ceded sovereignty and so everything's stolen. So you're going to give it back to us. Yeah. Well, also, there's there's a commitment to telling the truth that can hobble you in all this sort of thing. So we're talking about climate change. Well, Antarctica is not heating up. It's not we're not dealing with people who are interested in the truth. They're interested in winning. Well, they're interested in looting a system. Yeah, off our dime. And and same with, you know, the whole climate change, climate alarmism, you know, you only need to see where the where the pilgrim fathers landed at Plymouth Rock to see that that is no more underwater than it ever was when they landed in the 17th century in America. You know, this is lies in order to take over the businesses and the wealth and the assets that have been built over 400 years and in New Zealand, over 200 years of European settlement, they want it all. The Marys want them. The Maori Iwi, not the Marys, but the Maori Iwis are looting that system and where will it end? I guess I know the answer to that. You only need to look at South Africa to see with the ANC in charge. That's where it ends the Congo, Rwanda. I mean, it's important that we get them to spell out where it ends. Like when John Tamahiri said, look, co-governance is just a halfway house. Yeah, mission. Yeah, how's that going to work? OK. Yeah, let's have the let's have the chat. Why was John Tamahiri even in the debate? He's not a candidate. Yeah, how did that happen? You know, he's a president of Rowery. Why did he had been suffered a bereavement of some sort? So he had to step back. Yeah, right. I can see that on a two-year billboard to be in a debate. OK, all right. So that's that overseas. We've got a bit of time. Let's get into this Trudeau. Rota, the speaker of the Canadian House of Commons and the the Nazi Honka Yaroslav Honka, who was in the Waffen SS. It now it turns out in and slightly embarrassing. Yeah, so surely. OK, so the speaker falls on his sword. Apparently the the guy honka was from his district or something. And someone obviously figured out this was a good idea. But would you would you do that and and and present a guy like that in your House of Commons? Zelensky did the fist pump, by the way. He was totally. Yeah, but he's not a Nazi, right? But would you do that if you're the speaker and not tell the Prime Minister you were about to do that? It's just weird or Trudeau is in on it. And he's any through the speaker under the bus. And then he apologised if anyone in Canada was offended. He didn't apologise for his own speaker doing it. And the organisation for all this was under his office. As if they would not have had his permission. You know, right? I mean, that nothing would have nothing that serious and that well televised with Zelensky sitting in your audience in your parliament would not be pumping. Yeah, that that would have gone. Trudeau knew they just thought they'd get away with it. But now, of course, it's made a whole lot worse because what's funny is that, you know, Ukraine needing to be denazified has always been one of the main reasons for Russia doing the war in the Ukraine and saying that the Ukraine was full of Nazis. Well, I mean, exhibit A was just showing you. So why would they be doing in your face display like that? They don't care. They're arrogance. They get the arrogance. You know, with the protest in Wellington, they said, if there's one Nazi in your rally, then it's a Nazi rally, right? And there's another one saying if there's one Nazi sitting at the table and another three people join him, there's now four Nazis at the table. Well, he was a Nazi in in Canada's parliament, promoted by Trudeau and Zelensky and. And all of them clapping like and all of them. I mean, my train train seals. The whole Canadian Parliament using those things that which ironically comes from our disinformation. There's something very wrong there. There's something very wrong there as a part of it. If there's if there's one Nazi flag there, you've got a Nazi rally. Well, they had a Nazi standing there and giving him adulation. And everyone felt comfortable doing a standing ovation. Yeah, but we know Trudeau's a Nazi. Look at the way he carried on. And if you read Adolf Hitler quotes, you can actually think, well, that is just Sinda Arten's playbook. You know, I mean, there's one. The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. I'm child poverty. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of children, the people happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation. Incredible, considering they were OK with those same precious children being an experiment for Pfizer. And the current Prime Minister refused to take the advice on the young ones. Right. Yeah, the messaging was too hard for Chippy. Yeah, he was one not to do that. And he did it anyway with Trudeau. Then it got a whole lot worse because his deputy PM, Christia Freeland, whose father is from that stock as well. Yeah. And she's a board member of the World Economic Forum, joyously celebrating Waffen-SS Nazi war criminal Yaroslav Hanka in their midst. According to emerging reports, not only she descended from Ukrainian Nazis, but she had family members who were also in the same Waffen-SS Ukrainian Galatian division as Hanka within the Wehrmacht. So, I mean, Poland and Jewish groups have denounced the Waffen-SS Galatian division for its role in mass murdering civilians and involvement in massacres during the war in Poland. We know how bad that was for just for historical context. Right. There's the SS and there's the Waffen-SS. Right. They were the elite elites. They were the top like first and they were going around doing the civilians. They had the SS logo tattooed on their bicep on the inside of their arm, right, with with their with their service number. Right. These these people were the top of the top. They were the elite special forces of the SS. And that's who they celebrated in Canada's parliament. I don't know if you saw it, but a couple of days before that happened in the House of Commons there, Trudeau to the speech in the anticipation of Zelensky arriving, where he's trying to say that we will always support Ukraine. By the way, Zelensky leaves with 650 million Canadian dollars. Anyway, just saying. But in that speech, if you look back at it, he there's something wrong. There's something up with him. He is like a possessed person the way he's talking. Which one? Zelensky or Trudeau? Trudeau. Well, I'm just waiting for the case. He's talking seriously, like in a Hitler sort of way, you know, sort of hysterical. And like he's possessed by this thing, it's freaky. Well, he must be getting close to resigning for to spend more time with his family. I mean, Dan Andrews has gone now. Ardern's gone. He won't have enough gas in the tank. He won't have enough gas in the tank. The other thing with that work on track, it's probably that the war for this is involved. You get a bit extra gas in the tank. The Russians came up morally on top of this, where Dmitry Peskov, who's the press secretary for Putin, said, such sloppiness of memory is outrageous. Western countries, including Canada, have raised a young generation that does not know who fought whom or what happened during the Second World War. And they know nothing about the threat of fascism. Well, he's probably right, actually. He's right. He is completely right. They it's only 80 years ago or so. Right. And now everybody's forgotten. Here's a 98 year old Nazi that some Nazi hunter has had to come out in Canada and say, hey, that man was fighting for the Nazis against Russia, you know, during that time. And here he's been celebrated in Canadian Parliament. It's just well, the polls are talking about the polls are talking about extra dining hooker now. Oh, good. I mean, I'm dying a ditch somewhere, the old bastard. Have you seen that the polls are moving away from the Ukrainians? Have you noticed that? There's some kind of. Skizzle, not wanting World War Three next to author. Maybe that might have something to do with it. They're a NATO ally, aren't they? Because Zelensky's gone. He's a walking dead man. You can't get you can't survive after throwing 500,000 of your young men into the meat grinder and losing 25 million of your population. His own country hate him. Yeah. If Chris Hopkins was saying, look, we will fight until the last New Zealander is dead, you think? Most of what? Well, you want to take him out? Yeah. I mean, OK, well, can you be the one to start? Well, they did try that. They did try that a year and a half ago, right? Two years ago. But you can tell. All I will say is that I'm no friend of Putin. I do not like that man. And I think what he's done is reprehensible. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe not in the context of a rupture, but I do understand. No, but I understand that for two years before that war broke out, he was petitioning the UN, the Security Council, saying we will not tolerate NATO advancement on our borders. We're just not going to tolerate it, and we will respond. He made a big deal with Zelensky signed, if we're to believe it. Boris Johnson turns up because old uncle Joe somewhere in there told him to and they rip it up. But I don't believe that that was signed for. It was in play and he was going to buy it. I've seen it reported that Zelensky had actually signed it. Well, possibly. I don't know that. I know that he had his. OK, for one thing, but still to blow that up to blow that up. But all the young people into the meat grinder. Yeah, yeah, Boris. That's on Boris's head because Zelensky for the sake of his nation and where there's people behind him wanted a peace deal. Yeah. And was talked out of it. I don't think anyone was signed. The Bidens have been shaking down the Ukrainians for years. So what you know, what's been going on there, right? Oh, back 2014, who doesn't want who to see what? Well, you know, if you go back to Adolf Hitler, it's another quote. It's the bio labs, a special secret pleasure. How the people around us fail to realise what is really happening to them. And there is that Dupers delight that so many of these narcissists in power have where they think, you know, you're so stupid, you deserve what's happening to you. Well, yeah, that's right. If you're such a smook and you let us do it to you, too bad, right? So yeah, we've got to start talking about how we've let people with personality disorders get to be in charge of it because they're promoted through media and propaganda to be something appear to be something that they're not. And they're they those types are attracted to wielding power over other people. Hence politics is a tool for the people of printing the money, ultimately, though. To to achieve their ends. And then there's class. Yeah, we won't go there. All right, we're coming up against time. What about just quickly back because this catches my eye, the traffic light system is being talked about again. And in this case, it's to introduce benefit sanctions. Who would use the traffic light system? Who can't read the room? A hoople head, a total hoople head. I mean, that that that term, that phraseology, that title has been completely discredited. I hate it. Has it has it been discredited? Maybe people feel safe and comfortable when it's used. Oh, it's a traffic light system. Minority. Oh, my God. Please give us a travel traffic light system, mummy. Well, I'll tell you how it works. It's the green, the compliant category meeting their obligations to prepare for a fine work. So there's no change to their benefit. People in the orange, which is some risk category, would have one or two breaches of their obligations and they face additional requirements and targeted support for the weekends. And the red light or high risk category have breached their obligations three times. And they'll face sanctions such as three strikes. Benefit, suspension, money management and mandatory community work experience. Managements. Please, Upston, Cam, you probably know her better than us. But yeah, that's never going to work. And it'll never work because the bureaucracy will work to rule, won't implement it, won't operate it. And everything will get changed. You know, all these wonderful motherhood and apple pie statements about how we're going to solve these problems and they come up with these fanciful things and they let the bureaucrats then implement it and it gets watered down. So it's never going to work. It's just fanciful to even think that it will. And they just really need to stick to simple stuff. But I don't think the National Party is capable of that. But using that traffic light system, it's like in those action movies, you've always got to have something that's counting down to an explosion. So there's always that counter going down and, you know, people get it that way. This is like the way they do the climate now. So it's orange if it's not that bad, but it's red if it's really bad. What if you're complying to everything? Are you in green? Are you? I missed that. Yeah, the problem that I mean, not enough if you've ever talked to someone who's been on a benefit and is looking at getting a job. They do what I I tend to call beneficiary maths. And what they do is they work out how many dollars they get paid on a benefit. Then they divide that by how many hours they're going to work and look at the difference and arrive at the conclusion. Well, I'm only I'm only getting paid two dollars an hour to do this job. Why would I work for two dollars an hour? Yeah, that's a point. Did you see Winston Peters talk about Jobseeker, the Jobseeker will be limited at two years in your lifetime to be paid an unemployment benefit. I mean, that's that's very extreme and a good way. That's a Clinton, Bill Clinton. Well, just just I don't I don't know. I mean, I think it is. Yeah, but but, you know, the idea that limit because I I mean, I know people in my life will be sort of on the outskirts of my life. But they've been on a form of benefit for 30 years. And nice that we could help. Yeah. And they're too. They're rare and delicate flowers who are often artistic and they can't do a normal job anywhere. I mean, I've done every job from caregiving to selling to selling cars. I mean, I have done you name it, I've done it. Things I wouldn't even admit on air. Maybe we should play a game of bingo. You've been in the green zone all this time. Well, we're just the employed zone, you know, for pretty much most of it. Did you get to collecting them eventually? I did that. Yeah. But eventually, well, Bob Jones actually said I sent him a letter once and he mocked me for being a used car salesperson. I've been a used car salesperson. It was a horrible job, but it downloads some software into your brain that is so good. It was quite a good job. It was, you know, I mean, you know, I had three children to provide for. It was it was great. I got commission as well as a stipend, as well as a company car, as well as company laptop and battery paid for. It was actually not a bad job. But anyway, remember Billy T's workers often as well. Remember Billy Billy T's sketch, the used car sales sketch with the Markzware Zephyr and everything that's classic. You know, with with the work with the work, you know, getting back to work, it's hard if you haven't been working to get back to work. And it's like when someone is super fit, take someone as a couch potato and tries to get an exercise and just flogs the shit out of them. The next day they saw as hell and they never want to do that again. You've got to sort of do it so you just say to someone who's just getting started. OK, get your shoes on. Let's walk to the end of the street and back. You feel better. You feel good. Right. That's all. And that two year span in a lifetime could work in that way. Yeah, that seems fair enough, doesn't it? But if you look through Māori Faka Toki, there's there's all of these odes to the joy of hard work, you know, they could use that as well. Well, I mean, we're we're going we're going to come under harsh austerity because as far as in Irani, who's so brilliant, Paul, every week is pointing out the system is going to it's going to matter of when according to it's just a matter of when and then we'll get austerity measures and goodness knows what that's going to look like. I think we should get that over and done with now, but we need to deal with beneficiaries because, you know, yeah, I mean, a hand up turned into a flipping multi-generational lifestyle on the dole, didn't it? And I'm pleased to see that Winston has at least got the nuts to address that going forward because it's a very important one. You can't have people leeching off our off of its classic Marxism, you know, each according to their ability to each according to their need. It's like another person's need should not have a claim over my ability or your ability or anybody else with a falling birth rate and add to an already falling birth rate at twenty eight percent reduction in live births. No one's going to be there. There just won't be the population to support it. Thirty seven percent increase in people to disable to work. And, you know, you can see that on the news. And ever since Marie said that, I think about that every time I hear, you know, someone on the news saying, oh, well, you know, we've got this drop in consumer confidence. Normally that leads to an increase in unemployment, but we're not seeing that. That's why. Well, why is Auckland Airport in chaos? Someone tell me why an airport that's been operating for 50 years now all of a sudden can't handle the normal flow of traffic. I have I have no competence. And maybe they don't have enough people. Where are they? Thirty seven percent. Before we end, Paul, can we go to my fifty seven year old man who? No, I think that's a brilliant place to end. Let's do that. It's a nice positive story because everything's so dire. I know as we need it for all the Waffa Nessie stuff. Yeah, no, no, nothing's involved in this story. Fifty set three. So a former farm manager has written a book called A Journey Toward Literacy, proving it's never too late to learn. So during a 40 year farming career in the Deep South, Michael King Potiki devised an elaborate bag of tricks to hide the fact for all those years that he could not read that amazes me how people can do that. It's incredible. That's not a stupid man. No, that's a smart man. That's that is a very smart man. But he said that I told little white white lies like I didn't bring my glasses. And that's how he got around things so that they would read things. That's actually quite a good, simple one. Yeah. Yeah. And but but here he was saying that I was embarrassed of myself. And if they knew that I couldn't read or write, what were they going to do? Fire me. Would they say that there's no job? And so he was scared of it. So he told all these white lies to get around the fact that he couldn't actually read. And he's 57. So that would have been when we had a world-class educational system. Right. So you can only imagine how bad it is now. And we were sent something the other day that said that 15 year olds, 35 percent of them struggled to read and write. 35 percent in the new education system. So it's it struck me as sad. But all I want to say is to Michael King Potiki, good on you for learning to read when it was of a value to him to want to be able to read to his grandchildren. That's very special. It is. I mean, really. And the whole world opens to you when you can read. And we don't think about it because all of us can. But think how shut down somebody is from and the mental gymnastics. One has to do to keep up the pretense. No, it's you think about that. You have to cover every track all the time. Even more, you think about we've just had six years where the most numerous numerous occupation in our parliament's been teacher or ex teacher, and it's gotten worse. Our literacy and numeracy has gotten worse. And yeah, it has real consequences in terms of kids rather than embarking on a challenging career that's useful to society. Ending up in jail or angry to get angry in poverty. Yeah, it's it should be an urgent priority. Yeah. And that guy, that guy was always employed even without being able to read. He was always employed. And there'll be others like him. But he's been limited. I mean, when I was at university, I bordered with a family where the husband and the family couldn't read functionally illiterate. And he was a B grade mechanic. And the reason why I was a B grade mechanic, even though he was a brilliant mechanic, was that in order to be an A grade mechanic, you had to sit an exam. Of course. Yeah. And so his life, his entire life and that of his family has been limited by his inability to read. It's a disabling affliction. Is that an inability to learn or handicap or not wanting to learn or no, it's look, it's just a failure of the education system over decades. This guy, this guy said that he went to a teacher when he was 12 years old and said, I really want to know how to read. Could you please teach me? And the teacher said, no, you're too old. Oh, great. It was 12. No one left behind. Can you imagine it must have been humiliating for him to admit that to a teacher and ask that help and then get rejected? And then get rejected. I mean, mind you, anyone can learn to read at any time. There's that too. OK. Well, it's easier if you're young because you've got brain plasticity and learning to read it basically co-ops part of your brain that's used for hearing into your visual system. So there's a bit of messing around with your brain. That means that it's harder as you get older to do. Your reading and writing is not natural. It's a learning thing. Oral is natural. But no, but it gives you the ability to conceptually think and conceptually formulate. It doesn't come easy like just learning to talk to us. No, you've got to do it. And, you know, kids, it always amazes me when TV is so good, how into reading stories kids are. And if you read them a story, they'll ask you about characters subsequently in a way that they don't. If you if you if they're watching it's richer. And I've talked to a few home schooling parents on this program. And a few have told me because I've asked them, well, how do you do your curriculum? And really, they say if your kid can read and loves to read, that's kind of most of their education right there. It is. It is. There's no need to go to university when you can read. Yeah, aside from the piece of paper that the Bachelor of Arts or whatever gives you, you you can know your world, profoundly know your world if you know how to read. We had a gaslighter of the week award. Maybe we should have another award for people who. Really impress. Like that chap, like a fifty seven year old man that decides, no, I'm going to read to my grandchildren. That's what I want. Hero sort of. No, I think it's a positive idea because gaslighters always focusing on the negative. And I think we really from games later. I think we really should celebrate people who have, despite adversity, broken free from the life that crappy useless teachers have sentenced them to. Yeah. And that's the reality of it. We've lied to ourselves for decades in this country, telling the world we have a world-class education system. And if you ever want proof that we don't, it's this man. Yeah, I used to write media for the Polytech in Gisborne and I wrote a lot of stories about people who were the first in their family to get a qualification. And and the joy that it gave them in the pride was was so touching and moving to to see it really affected me. And I I guess it drives me to be cross about the failure of the education system, generally. Well, I know when in a previous relationship, my stepdaughter, she was there under our care and it was me who picked up that she could not read. And I picked it up because I used to read to my kids and those beautiful girls when they're in my care. And I noticed that she was cagey and a bit, you know, she would get anxious, she would get really anxious. It turned out that she couldn't read. So I, you know, tabled that with her father and we sent her to Kit McGrath and sure enough, she was one of those kids that was such a people pleaser that she just fell through the system by being helpful, really lovely girl. And she ended up suddenly just being so relieved because the whole world opened to her and she is a lawyer now. Wow, yeah, cool for you. Yeah, I think that's a really good note to end on. Yeah, this week. Yeah, positive. Yeah, in the green zone, the green zone, not orange or red. All right. Yeah. OK, a traffic light system for success. Maybe we should adopt one political panel traffic light system. Well, maybe. Yeah, can you work out how we can integrate? I think it just needs to have two lights. We don't need to have an orange. It's red or green. You've got to say blue. Go or no, go. You either can or you can't. Yeah, that's what Yoda said. Isn't that what Yoda said? Yoda. Yeah, I mean, he said there is no. Do or do not. There is no try. Do or do not. There is no try. All right. OK, well, that was an interesting political panel for this Friday morning. Thanks to Marty Gibson. Thanks to Olivia Pearson. And thank you to Cam Slater. And we'll do it all again in a week's time. No problem. Thank you, Paul. Have a great week. RCR with Paul Brennan, Reality Check Radio.