 και νομίζω πως να πρέπει να πειρεχνουμε βιση τώρα. Εντάξει, είμαστε βισης! Είμαστε Νίκολα! Είμαστε δειδητολικά στους Νανατεχνολογείους 2022, και είμαι ευκολο να τα δω. Είμαστε εδώ σε προσφέση μετά τρεις μιλών. Εκόπτευα είμαστε στην ταξιδέτηση, μπορείτε να βαθείτε εδώ, όπως την ΕΚ, και προσπαθούνται στις συμβασίες στις κοινωνικές ελεκτρώνεις και προσπαθούνται στις κυκλούδες για την εξαρδευτική εργασία της κυκλουσίας για να συμβείται η στιγμή. Ξεκόμαστε, είτε εδώ, μέσα από το εξ-πο-αρια, είναι η κλείδη της χρήσης της χρήσης Απήρχε να δούμε και να συμβείτε με κάποιες τους κοινούς που μπορείτε να μιλάτε γνωρίζονται. Αυτό είναι πολύ καλό. Αυτό είναι ένα πολύ σημαντικό σημαντικό τοπικό. Επίσης, όλοι θέλουν μία ενεργία, μία σωματική ενεργία. Ναι, ναι, ναι, από όλα τα ενεργία, όπως από τα Αγγρυβολταξία, από τα Μετρανία ΕΝΑ, από τα Πέργολα. Είναι εδώ, ναι. Έχουμε αυτή η σωματική ενεργία, φωτοβολταξία, και όλα τα ενεργάζονται. Μπορείτε να δείτε εδώ, για παράδειγμα, αυτές αυτές τις ενεργάζοντες ενεργάζοντες φωτοβολταξία. Μπορείτε να δείτε αυτές άλλες άνθρωποι, like... άνθρωποι από... τούλες, μόνητορικές, τεχνοίκες, καρακτηρισίες, τεχνοίκες, άνθρωποι από Σεμιλαύ, Χριστώφ. Είναι εδώ, γνωρίζονται Χριστώφ. Πολλοί από OIT, ok, το κόμμα, είτε έχουμε τεχνοίκες. Εδώ είναι ο κρίστος Βαρλάμις, και ο κρίστος Βαρλάμις, ο κρίστος Βαρλάμις, στους ειδίες θα συμβουλίσεις, και να συμβουλίσεις και άλλες άνθρωποι. Χιτάσος, γαλατσόπουλος, αλλά και το λάμπο της Νανο-τεχνόλογης. Πολλοί μετά ξεχνούν από αυτό. Είχας ο κόμπος και ο κομπος, το γνωρίζονται αυτό. Ο Χρίστος είναι εδώ, και Χρίστος, έχεις κάποιες σπέσεις εκεί, με ένα μπότα, δημιουργείς ανοίγησης, θα δοκιμάσεις αυτό, και δείξεις, Χρίστος' δημιουργείς. Άλλο, Αλέξαντρος, πριν να πάμε εδώ, Αλέξαντρος έρχεται για το BL-Nano Biomed, δοκιμάζει, δοκιμάζει, δοκιμάζει, δοκιμάζει, δοκιμάζει. Αλήθ subsequently, ρω γι' αυτό. Δεν говоря προςouter μοτοσύντατες. Εoryξα στον υμιά erhöτο, δημιουργείς την πρόσπαση του χράου, να είναι για δημιουργείς ます Are killer, όπως που Root impact one but you can't be able to, for example, give lighting in several applications like boats and so on that can be used in power consumption devices. So you can stop producing energy, though? You try to, for example, put the voltaξ, a very high efficiency already... Αλλά η Ιηστορία, όχι δημιουργήθηκε, δημιουργήθηκε πολλές πρόσφυγες. Προσφυγήθηκε από αυτές οι άνθρωποι που βρίσκονται από την Ιηστορία Ιηστορία, αφορά 40 πρόσφυγες σε αυτήν την πρόσφυγή της Ιηστορίας και κονέξει σε όλο τον κόσμο με άλλες ασσοσιασίες, όπως η Κωρία Ασσοσιασία ή η Ζαπάνια Ασσοσιασία ή η Γερμανία ή η Αφελήν από την Φρανσία. Αυτό είναι ο κορυπτήρος της κορυπτής, ο κορυπτής της κρατίας της Καντηφαραδικής, που βρίσκονται από την Ιηστορία και η Βακελος, που κάνει βίντεο σήμερα, δείτε. Απ' αυτόν, ένα άλλο εδώ. Είναι το Τόμα Σκολμπρος από Ποατέμα. Είναι εκεί, τώρα. Γεια σας, Νίκολα. Είμαι εδώ για πολλές χρόνια. Στο 2000 χρόνια ξεκινήσαμε αυτήν την οικονομική ελεκτρονική. Βέβαια, νίκολα, σήμερα είσαι καλύτερα να συμβείτε. Στην στιγμή με την οικονομική ελεκτρονική, αλλά και με την οικονομική ελεκτρονική και την οικονομική ελεκτρονική. Υπάρχουν άλλες λίγος εδώ, αυτό το ρομπότικο, που έτσι έτσι... Κύπριος, κύπριος, όχι, η κομπανία, οι άνθρωποι προσπαθούν να προσπαθούνται το σύστημα. Μπορειάζουμε να συμβείτε, όχι, καλά. Λοιπόν, στις εβδομάδες, θα κάνουμε βίντεο. Θα δείξω πριν να κάνουμε ένας εξαγραφό. Λοιπόν, δεύτερα. Και από άλλες κομπανίες εδώ, έχουμε ένας άνθρωπος να προσπαθούν τον Ιησонов, από επαφάνεια, είναι Παντελίς, έκανε, είναι δεύτερα, είσαι δεύτερα. Ευχαριστώ. Εσύ, είναι και Παντελίς. Είσαι δεύτερα. Τα έντονα, καλύτερα. Κάτι εδώ φεύγει από μπέκτορες, από αρτάνες. Καλώς είσαι δεύτερα. Ευχαριστώ. Ευχαριστώ. Do you know The family came, all the family. You know Adonios, Adonios can give you all the information about the Expo or the Coference. How they think it's going. This lady comes from Aristotle University also. We're here in this booth prepared for several labs from Aristotle University. Ok you're welcome. Okay, so let's see what's going on inside. Do you like to see it? Inside one of the rooms? It's busy right now in the lectures. I think so, because they just started after the break. Many breaks, let's see what they look like inside. And it's the whole week. It's the whole week started actually on last Saturday. July 2nd, with the schools. We have a lot of schools. We will see a bit later. Let's take a picture. So lectures, the whole day. All days lectures. You have actually several rooms. This is one of the rooms. But as I told you before, the whole event after the technology started on last Saturday, second of July and up to Saturday, next Saturday, July 9, we ended with the schools. We have three schools on nanotechnologies, electronics and nano-medicine. So things are going well, ok? Because I suppose also you test all the systems of your machines. Yeah, hopefully we can watch this live and post the comments. So how this goes because you transfer all these machines, these fantastic smart systems, ok? So let's go inside again to find Chris in order to visit for example the parking place, which is outside and in parallel to say a few words about the school or some other details about the conference. Because the conference, the whole conference, the whole exhibition started as I said on Saturday, second of July. It involves three conferences, the nanotechnologies conference, the organic print electronic conference and the international conference on 3D printing and bio printing. Beside this one you have the schools, ok? This is the most important technology event right now in Europe. Yes, it's one of the most important events in Europe and especially in the world of nanotechnology where you see all these vertical things going in parallel, starting from schools and going to business, from conferences to mass-making events every Wednesday. Every year you have this mass-making event, a bit-to-be event where technology people try to work together with a lot. You are welcome Dr. Saroniki. Thank you sir. And to nanotechnology. Thank you sir. Ok, this is Gelder... We will do a video interview after. You can come and do video interviews. Yes, of course. Whenever you like. In English, German, wherever you like. Whatever you want. Cool. See you later. Thank you sir. Ok, alright. So three conferences in the international conference, the school, the mass-making asset will take place on Saturday. So you can see this amazing thing. A bag with energy producing and OLED in order to have this aesthetic design. Inside there is a battery which provides the energy anytime to lady ok, for example. So also this one, you can see this OLED application. It's not only photobotite but also OLED. Say a few things please. Let's say a few things just now here in front of your booth. But also say a few things about the parking place. Ok. This larger let's say application you installed outside of this building. Yes, ok. Thank you very much. This year we showcasing our demonstrators for agrivoltax applications. So we pair an agrivoltax solution for greenhouses and OPV. So you are able to generate power and develop crops at the same time. This is our demo case, our biggest greenhouse. Ok, this one. Can we walk over there? Yes. So actually this is somewhere in Thessaloniki. Yes, yes. This is in Thessaloniki. We will check it maybe one of these days. We will check it. We will take a closer look into that. So we can walk inside. You can see it's a bigger installation with already grown tomatoes. You see tomatoes are red. We also have our... And this to help to light them 24 hours a day? Or you bring more light when it's dark? Exactly. With organic photobotites we are able to manipulate how much irradiation and heat goes actually on the plants themselves. So they grow better. They don't produce heat burns. We have an increased yield of up to 30% for tomatoes. Not case. Ok, and what is this one down there? Ok, this one is our solar window where we have implemented organic solar cells inside the window frame. This is perfect for building integrated solutions where photobotites can be placed on different building elements. But in this case we put them inside the glass. So they are inside the glass panes and you can take it and install it on the building. Nice. And you have some demos around here of this glass also. Yes, of course. The demos are back there. We are going to move over there. Let's go. This is our demo glass right here. This is our bigger frame, our bigger window. So this is a complete aluminum frame with glass. And photobotite panels are incorporated inside the triplex glass. So everything glued is protected from the elements and is able to generate renewable energy. It's transparent? Yes, it's semi-transparent. You can see it's above 35% transparency. You can see. Behind it you can see me. Alright, so it's important to keep the shade in the buildings when it's very hot? Of course. If it gets very hot and buildings, people are not very comfortable in high heat and high sun. Behind the glass is actually very cool. And this is the next generation of building integrated panels. You can see it over here. Okay. This is more uniform in shape and color. There are no stripes. And it actually has a higher transparency. Are you able to do mass production? Yes, yes, yes. How is the state of sustaining this to mass production? We are able to manufacture it in a roll-droll format. So we use a very big roll-droll machine to produce this in high volumes. And we are able to address the market needs. So this is a panel. This is our next generation of building integrated panels. Can I buy this and put it on my house? Yes, you can. What's the price? You can contact us. And you can buy it directly from us. If I need 20 meters. Yes? You can buy it. For 20 meters? How about is it going to survive the snow? It can. We already integrate this in polycarbonate sheets or even glass to protect them. And give them the ability to survive in the harshest winter. And is it going to last 40 years? What's the life expectancy? Not even glass will last 40 years. We are around and maybe above 10 years in lifetime. And then I just put a new one, right? You just put a new one. And the next gen in 10 years will maybe have more... Maybe triple the efficiency and double the lifetime. Nice. And will be easy to upgrade? This is very easy to upgrade. Easy to install. And put it in many different applications. So it's very easy to remove it. As it is to install it of course. You can remove it and put a new one. What do you want? Is it cheaper than conventional? No, we cannot compare it to conventional silicon technology. This is much more mature in terms of efficiency and technology development. So it's high efficiency? It has higher efficiency for organic modules. Okay. Are you able to say that eventually it will be the highest efficiency? Or maybe. Compared to all the other technologies? It's very difficult to compare technologies between themselves. But we hope we have a lot more applications for this type of modules. And hopefully one day we can match the silicon technology performance. Nice. Yes. And I heard that you even have a crazy setup outside in the... Yeah. We can go check it out. We can check it out. Yeah. Nice. Alright. And you have a bunch more stuff at the booth. But maybe we'll check back during this week, right? Let me take one of these panels with me. This is the same type of panels that are integrated in the parking itself. Okay. We'll see more outside. Let's go. Okay. So has it been busy two years? It's actually, yes. Three years since we last met. Since we last met. Yes, it was 2020. Since your last time here. 2019. Yes. Yes, exactly. Right now it's more people here. More people on the live event. Okay. Some people actually on the remote. But we are very pleased with the results this year. Let me put my sunglasses on. Great. And we can walk outside. It's very hot outside. Cool. It's the best place in Europe to work on solar technology. Yeah. It's very good. We have one of the highest... The radiation here in Europe. So we can understand this. It's a very good place to develop solar projects. Everybody in the chat. Let me know if the quality is good. And ask questions we can ask. Let me know in the chat. So this is the parking installation that we have this year. We can see this is the type of format of panels that we use. So we take these panels. We prepare them with cables and diodes and stuff like that. We glue them on the polycarbonate sheets to protect them. It's glued from the inside to protect them from the elements. Let's say heavy snow or maybe hail. And then we connect them in series and in parallel to form electrical strings. And all this energy, all the energy that is produced here is stored in batteries. This type in this case is a small battery type. But on a real type scenario we have a lot bigger battery. So we can manipulate the stored energy as we like. So we can use it for illumination, for let's say camera setups, closed circuit TV. Or even Wi-Fi broadband services and stuff like that. The biggest challenge is how we can supplement the charge for electric vehicles. So for that reason we can pair an appropriate electrical charger. That can use renewable energy produced here on the site. To actually supplement the charge for electric vehicles. So this roof is going to help charge the car? Yes, exactly. How much of the charging is going to happen through the solar roof? It depends on the car. Yes, it very much depends on the situation and the car itself. But it can supplement very nicely the charge of the car. And at the same time have a very nice shade where it's cooler here underneath. The whole parking should be like this. Eventually the whole parking should be like this. Here under the photovoltaics maybe it's 10° cooler that's on the sun. It's important to be cooler. You save energy cooling the car later. Because if it gets too hot. This is a passive advantage. Because not so much radiation goes through the panels. The panels have the added benefit of cutting 100% of UV radiation. So no UV radiation reaches the car and people underneath the panels. So this will help actually not put too much heat stress on the car. Nice. So what's the price for this 20-meter or something like that? You cannot say. I cannot say. The price very much depends on the specific situation. It would be nice if people could cover their roofs and their houses for affordable price. And just connect, save some money and energy. This is our main goal to provide sustainable electricity. Because we are able to provide this in high volumes. And now we are trying even more to increase the efficiency and power output. And also the lifetime. To be able to implement this kind of technology in many different formats. So building the great photovoltaics, Aggrovoltaics with OPV, Electromobility applications and so much more. But the question is when do politicians jump in or companies and place a big order? This is already happening. This is a technology that we need the public to know more about. That's why we do all these events and we participate in so many exhibitions around the world to educate the public and actually get the big investors, attract their interest and actually make them develop projects with this kind of technology. There's one question. Can these be put on top of electric car roofs to charge them while you drive? Yes. We have dam projects with a large car manufacturer here in Europe. That was around 2016. These were some preliminary projects. The technology is very much more mature nowadays. And actually we are planning to do even bigger installations on cars and other types of trucks, of transport vehicles. How good does this work in cloudy countries compared to other solar panels? Yeah, compared to other panels it works very good. I think maybe it can lose around 30% of its efficiency but it can work even on cloudy weather. There is no problem for that. Are you able to say some numbers in terms of efficiency? Yes. We are looking above 6% for the fully printed panel, for this type of fully printed panel, for this one. 6%? Yes. It's above 6% actually. Last year it was around 5%. This year we are looking above 6%. And we are more than 7.5% in the lab scale. So the small scale that's already in research and development. How do you get to more and more percent? What is the trick? The trick is to improve our process, our printing process, the improvement in materials and our know-how actually on how to print them and increase the yield of production and the power efficiency of the photovoltaic panels. So is it kind of like the materials you use, the mix? It's a mix of materials. Currently no. We do not have perovskite under consideration for a large scale format. This organics is the largest scale that we use currently. But the efficiency and the improvement in power output is a mix of better materials and better process. So we are able to produce a better panel, a better OPV. Nice. Do you have this on your house? I'm developing a project. I'm developing a project actually, yes. This is under development. Yeah, I really want to see affordable solar. Yes. And easy to just like place an order online. We get a little roll. Yes. And maybe you could even install it yourself. Like a DIY. And not be afraid of insurances, regulation. Just put on your roof, plug it in somewhere. That will be maybe the next step. Yes. If we develop some kits, DIY kits, so anyone could just place an order and install it in windows, let's say sunshades, carports like this one. A lot of different applications. I'm just going to say number, but I don't know. It'd be nice. 1000, couple thousand, I don't know how much you need for this size. This is more than a couple thousand euros, because you have to consider the different materials, the parking, the development side itself, the OPV installation. Maybe 5000. Maybe more. Maybe double that, maybe double that, yeah. But we're always trying to have a better performing product with lowering the cost at the same time. If you buy the panels and do it yourself, install it yourself, different price, right? Maybe you can save some backs, but okay. The main cost here is the photovoltaic panel itself, not the installation cost. So that's why we're driving, we're trying to drive the cost down for the panel itself. EU, the EU, Greece, everybody should put billions into this. They should be like, hey, this is a top priority. Let's get some European solar technology out there. And actually green technologies is in the core of EU policy, European policy, sustainable technologies for solar and more especially RES. So yes, the policy is there, and now we need even bigger investments for the technology and the actual projects themselves. Nice. So that's what the conference is for, right? People are meeting, you're meeting with the regulators, you're meeting with politicians, you're meeting professors, you're meeting startups. Exactly, this is a very large multi-event where scientists, engineers, policymakers, everyone comes here to see the new technologies, what are the latest developments in solar and especially OPV. So a lot of very storming, a lot of ideas getting developed right here right now. So let's hope this year we get more and more ideas, better ideas, and actually we have a very positive impact. Can these be used on their own, not needing a battery? You can use it directly, but it's best to have a battery. So you can produce electricity around maybe 10 to 12 hours a day. You can store it and then you can use it later. The battery is also a cost to consider. It is a cost, yes, of course. A good battery, you need a big, full project. Yes, for the whole project, the cost of batteries maybe 30 to 40% or even more. Alright, and maybe we can go back to your booth. Yes, let's go after our booth. And at the back also you have some more demos. Yes, let's go. Is it fun to see people? Yes, after all these years with COVID situation and stuff like that it's very good to see people, discuss with people because there's no substitute for actual conversation. Okay, so... There's one question. So this solar is better than wind power? I cannot say that it's better than wind power, it's supplementary. Wind power is a completely different thing. These technologies are all renewable energy but nothing is better than the other, okay? We need everything. Exactly. Let's go and look at your insulation over there. It's like different kind of use cases, right? Yes, we have different kind of use cases for organic panel. Let's see. This is a retractable pergola. Let me demonstrate. We have implemented the photovoltaics in the covering material because they are very lightweight and flexible so they can be integrated anywhere. You can retract it, there is an electrical mechanism that is also able to operate with OPV power. And you can actually set it up to cover a very big area. This is a small one that's for demonstrative purposes but you get the idea, okay? OPV panels are installed on the covering material and at the same time provide enough shade for people to be comfortable underneath so no UV actually reaches people staying downside and also you can generate electricity to power up electronics, charge your devices for lighting and anything else. Let's move to the next one. This is our pergola bed, specifically made for tourism here in Greece. Here in Greece tourism is a very big thing, okay? So we try to find different applications in the specific niche market that requires new projects that can have some added value and added benefit for the customer. In our case we have implemented OPVs on the roof, again on the roof of the pergola, the wooden pergola and we can operate a small refrigerator down here and also people are able to charge their devices through dedicated USB ports and there is actually a 12-volt port to operate different other things. Nice, so it's like really for the beach. Yeah, this is for the beach, specifically for this kind of setup, yes. Exactly. Right here we have our solar bus station. This is for projects that we have developed here with municipality here in Ytosaloniki. In this type of setup the portable tykes are embedded in two seats of polycarbonate so they are fully protected against snow, rain, hail, even extreme heat. And we can produce enough electricity to power up the advertising port in this LED, in this scenario. And actually there are not two but four USB charging ports to charge your mobile devices, let's say phone, smartwatches. When you wait for the bus you can just plug it in and have a quick charge. And all the electronics this is not set up completely right now all the electronics are embedded in this system so it's all in one system and it can be remote installed in many different scenarios you don't need to be tied to the grid, ok? You can just have a battery and portable tykes and you can power up all your setup. There is also an LED stripe right here that is used for nighttime illumination. So it's just a question of replacing order for hundreds of these and all the different local governments all over the world. So for the smaller to the larger project the developer has to come to us, ok? We can develop the whole project or bring more people together more companies together to build the bus station we build the portable tykes and then we deliver it to the client. Nice. There's one question here Solopar came a long way since my solar calculator. He had solar in his calculator in the 80s. This was a very good design huge advancement, ok? It's over 30 years or even more of development this is the third generation so we have gone through third generation second generation of thin films this is the third generation fully printed, organic solar cells. Nice. Should we walk back to your booth? Yes, let's go. So we're looking at those cool curses What's the brand? Gucci? No, we can't say on camera. But you could work with them. They contact you? Not them specifically but we have done contacts with developers it's actually huge to have a brand name on top of that, ok? The main idea behind this is how you can use a system that generates electricity in a portable format, ok? So this is not specifically wearable but you can see it's very lightweight all electronics are implemented inside the bag and there are charging stations so you can plug in your phone to charge and it's also light for nighttime illumination On this type of human spurs this is one demonstrator this is the other case of our setup where there is a dedicated USB port here to charge your device and actually there are lights you can see that you can use for signal purposes and the full organic solar cell is implemented very nicely on the front of the bag And as a whole function are the demos at the booth What is this motorcycle jacket? And the bag Sorry about that And let's continue Ok, so we have been contacted by several motorcyclists and they show for flexible lighting they show the advantage in the actual in the actual jackets So we have incorporated a film strip, a very lightweight this is less than a hundred less than a hundred of a millimeter in width that is incorporated very nice on the back of the jacket and this can illuminate in the night giving more an optical signal signal to the other drivers as there is an actual person on the motorbike And we also have done the same work on helmets So all this flexible lighting is incorporated in the cell of the helmet and it's able to illuminate You can see we are operated So you do flexible solar it's a civil lighting We do flexible solar lightning or lead, electro luminescence We also do flexible sensors flexible antennas RFIDs and stuff like that We print a lot of different things I got a couple questions in the chat What's the cost per square meter? Right now it's more or less 1000 euros per square meter For the solar? Panels, installation, cabling and everything including Alright And here How much power does a solar output is a 6% you talk about? This is a 6% efficiency It's around 25 watts per square meter Of install capacity Can install in other country to produce a solution You can work with every country We can work with any other country We work with a lot of European Union countries We work with USA, different countries So everything is possible here Nice Let's continue You were talking about this helmet So that was more about the display No solar? No, there is no solar here We are trying to do it But the main case here for this type of applications is how we can use flexible lighting that we could use in this type of installations And the last one that I'm going to show you is the jacket that incorporates flexible lighting Let's see There is another one of these safety jackets Okay So in this instance we can provide a signal, an optical signal to say that someone is here There is a presence of a human here Okay You can see everything is incorporated It is very lightweight So anyone can carry it with them So about safety Everything about safety Even with the helmet and the jacket, the motorcycle jacket it is all about safety You need that extra optical signal especially when the night conditions there is not enough light Anything extra can benefit What is the partnership that you do with yourself the whole role to manufacturing We have a very strong collaboration with Lab for Thin Film here in Thessaloniki the LTF Lab from the Aristotle University of Thessaloniki We exchange a lot of knowledge a lot of R&D so research and development and we produce everything here is produced in a role to role format Nice Is it going to be busy week? Yes, busy week A lot of very interesting talks and topics here A lot of very interesting people Some new, some okay we have met again but it's great for networking and meeting people always Nice That's awesome Maybe I can introduce me to one of your friends around We can just continue the live stream Yes We're going to continue the live stream Should we continue? Okay, we're going to go Let's go around Let's see who's available to speak Maybe I'm going to go live stream a little bit the lecture Yeah, okay, okay That's a very good idea Thank you very much You're welcome Welcome everybody here in Chasaloniki I'll be doing interviews with all these exhibitors during the event and now going over to check one of the lectures if I can connect the sound so you can listen in the lecture this way I'll put you in a break for a second on 100 likes That's a good idea Many years to use I'll go in OET, can you find it? Put it on the chat I'll put it on the chat if you don't put it Find it I'll put you right back as soon as I got some in the lecture room I'm trying to do that right now Maybe a few minutes See you Thanks for watching The lecture is going virtual right now You can actually join it on the Nanotechnology Technology website Alright So we'll be right here So please introduce yourself I'm Tobias from Cyprios We do lab automation equipment We have this new spin coding robot in our portfolio It automates the whole step that is usually done manually It can move substrates around It can automate the pipetting and so all the very tiresome work where you as a PhD often have trouble and make mistakes can be automated in this setup and our goal was to make a system that is suitable for every lab so we offered starting at 36000€ For every lab Every lab do something like this Yes, every lab more or less that works with inks and printed electronics also works with spin coding and yeah So what is it doing right now? It just took the tip, now it opens to take the ink It goes down, detects where the ink starts takes the ink puts the lid back so that it doesn't evaporate and now it will eject the ink on the spin coder and all the timings and everything the volumes can be set very accurately more accurate than you would could do it manually So with microliter precision or millisecond precision in the timings for example for perovskite deposition quenching steps that are really time relevant here you can do it very accurately and reproducibly everyday Accurately reproducibly the quantities is precise and you can do for example 100 identical samples that would be very tiresome but if you want to do stability testing also you need a lot of samples and here you can do it fully automated with the same quality and the next day you can collaborate with other labs for example exchange recipes that other people then can also reproduce very easily Is this the information about it? Yes So what do we see on this brochure? Here we see the flyer and the different applications where it's suitable from semiconductors perovskite, photovoltaics, batteries fuel cells, OLEDs lighting sensor, display applications you name it we can do all the customization to suit these different technologies and adjust the lab help for your needs but SkiPrius sounds like a Greek name Yes but it's a combination of science printing of semiconductors so it's an acronym for that Where are you based? We are from Nuremberg in Germany Alright that's where I was just like last week at the embedded world That's a big conference there It's a cool field to be working on the printed electronics and helping that field It's a very active Yes definitely A lot of different inputs from different groups It's very active the procedures they change very often We need to develop new equipment all the time Here we have the unit with an improved ceiling Now this is for example for handling very volatile solvents like chloroform so that you can heat it but still it will not evaporate and it will keep the volume constant and then when you need it it opens automatically so you can integrate it also in the spin coding robot then we have measurement units to integrate so there are a lot of components that can be integrated and added to the spin board system Do you have many customers? Yes we just started this year with the system on the market but demand is already very good and it meets our expectations This is your booth the whole area here? Yes the whole area is our booth What automatic research Is that your slogan? Yes We have also equipment for example for doctor blading Usual manual doctor blading when you go to larger sizes then spin coding and would like to make modules and here we have a measurement unit that has a lot of small SMUs to measure up to 72 solar cells at a time so this is a stability measurement setup for solar cells Stability of solar cells? Yes so all the cells you can illuminate them here you can put in like 9 substrates at a time in one of these holders and all of them can be kept in their maximum power point individually that's something that is very often needed for perovskite research So a lot of people are researching perovskite right now Do you want to make the best solar? Yes definitely and the efficiency is already quite high but the stability is one of the most active research fields at the moment so here our setup has also meets a quite high demand and can help a lot of labs to increase the throughput Is this in full mass production this solution or is it like a prototype one of the first ones and people can get it later No this is we are now selling it it's already on three continents distributed in this short period after a couple of months a lot of customer demand from San Francisco to Singapore where we already delivered systems Cool Alright, thanks a lot Something you've got to talk about I think we're fine We're good Cool, thanks a lot Going over here to try to film one more interview In the chat if the cold is good the sound is good I'm hoping to bond Cosmo with Vodafone to get a stable connection here Okay, hello I'll switch like this Alright, hi Nice to meet you Please introduce yourself Okay, I'm the elder one My name is Martin Krebs I'm physicist and electrochemist I'm working for Wata three years but now I'm retired and this is my successor, Nicolas Bucher Well, in my retirement I continue to work with printed electronics because I did it for a long time and I support Wata and I am looking for new applications for printed batteries and other printed objects Printed batteries, it can work? It does work actually My name is Nicolas Bucher I'm with Wata as the head of final projects the successor basically and we continue the story that he started from research projects now at the doorsteps basically of commercialization Printed batteries as you can see here is the novel technology that we have at the moment and basically it is a super slim energy source which can be used in different applications we have identified nowadays with the trend for internet of everything with the trend of ever sensing basically this device is the enabler of such technologies in sports and medicine basically in tracking and the device, the battery source is designed super slim with a certain capacity which can be integrated in different shapes as you can see here so it's basically connected with printed to it can be connected with digital using some wifi Exactly NFC and so on it goes on a patch basically if you with the internet of everything or the ever sensing with sports trackers or with having medical applications for a smart patch for example it can be done in any shape to for example measure temperature can be measured for heartbeat oxygen level application that we have also identified is of course in type of tracking sensitive good for example think about all the vaccinations that are shipped around the globe at the moment by minus 80 degrees C to track these that it has still the same condition as initially it can be equipped with a smart label power sourced with our printed device and in that tracked over the full globe reachable at any time via the mobile network and it is designed to be long lasting for the critical time scale of 6 months or something like that and that is the important thing we have to find applications which are feasible which the customers is needing because if we have a kind of market push nobody takes care of but if there is a market pull an application like this LTE label which can send messages via mobile phone net this is a thing that people need constantly looking for new applications where these electronics can be used So how advanced is the printed battery? You basically as I mentioned at the doorstep of bring this into market we are now collaborating with partners at the moment we are able to produce prototypes of several hundred to be sampled so from the technical specs we so basically we have now a facility where we can already produce these prototypes we are at the moment going into the next step of a pilot line so with that we could produce several hundred thousands of this and in collaborating with other partners we are highly interested in the technology we think we have market penetration around 24 to 25 What does it actually look like does it look like like this one? Exactly So it is super thin it can be any shape but let me go maybe back it is something like that shape it can be a smaller shape but it can be addressed to any shape as you want that is basically advantage of the printed technology if you want to equip it to your breast in a butterfly shape if you want to you can make it the thickness no it is think carbon primary battery so it is a super cheap very high power application but only for one discharge that is a huge difference that needs to be considered That is what we tried in the past very quite often to apply any rechargeable system that is usual in the market nickel metal hydride lithium-1 but that creates great problems so in the moment it is not possible to print these batteries but on the other hand we see that there is no market for secondary battery Each customer ask for primary battery that has a lifetime enough for let's say 6 months, 12 months and then it is deposed because our battery doesn't contain any hazardous substances the zinc is in it and manganese dioxide is in it so no hazardous substances and that makes it green and environmental friendly what do you say, carbon? zinc carbon thin carbon zinc zinc is that like the tin can something like that what is the difficulty of using something like lithium ion rechargeable on this form factor basically it would make the whole device more expensive we are doing some research in that direction but the lithium ion technology as you can see from the markets that we address we basically want to go in something where you can easily integrate it and easily also don't have to be concerned about disposing of it so a primary source for example is here the the energy supply of choice it makes it much more sustainable because when you have a recharging system we would use more hazardous components which you would need a recharger itself so it makes it much more complicated and the whole production process needs to be under certain atmosphere the atmospheric conditions has to be in a dry room so this makes it super expensive basically it would be too high of its set for this type of applications and zinc you find it everywhere? exactly zinc is basically everywhere it is in the battery technologies 150 years or longer so basically there is no shortage in that carbon and manganese dioxide in that sense is also super available it sounds like all the stuff I take in my vitamins no manganese dioxide it is a special material for painters it is a brown color for painters manganese dioxide is additive for the health you get more healthy if you have a certain dose of zinc it is the same magnesium from chocolate you are talking about different it is manganese manganese is a different element not to be confused with magnesium but manganese your normal alkaline batteries are basically same materials basically this is what you can buy at the supermarket the same materials in the batteries is basically processed in this device it has a water born process it has a water based electrolyte also a huge difference towards lithium ion batteries which have organic electrolytes which are hazardous once they have some leakage can you talk a little bit about your interest in the industry what you have been working on before this project or for my case it is quite easy when I finished my Ph.D. at TU Claustal in 1989 I went to Warta and found that is the best job that I could get and so far there was no reason to change and that until general of this year and now I am independent battery expert battery consultant and see many interested partners who want to discuss with me about battery technology so in all these years Warta did many chemist trees different combinations of technologies yes Warta micro batteries that is the company in Elvangen they have a lot of electrochemical systems think air for hearing aids silver oxide for watches they have lithium manganese dioxide coin cells for electronic devices so I think in the field of portable devices Warta is a wholesaler and very good in each of these product branches and what kind of discussions you can have here the nanotechnology conference for us the Isfui is more interesting because Isfui is part of the nanotechnology conference which concerns the printed electronics and we see that a printed battery cannot be sold itself it needs a printed smart object and vice versa printed smart objects with a button cell does not make sense and so far it is a one to one relation between printed electronics and printed batteries and that is what is discussed in Isfui that's the reason why I'm at Isfui since 2009 and I like the place and I like Stegios Logotetidis many experts here many experts for many countries many universities versus complete Europe and it is very interesting and informative and it is a chance to show what we are able to do especially we have a workshop on Tuesday five talks and I am leading the workshop it goes for printed electronic goat goes to market and that is the most important issue in the moment how can we bring all these good investigations inventions patterns and how can we bring it into the market and here this is the best example I mean you started the research on it around 2012 so basically 10 years in this research and now we are basically right at the point to have ready to market sample being in discussions with interested partners from industry so this is to our opinion a really nice success story of one of Vata's product to be what is the trick to get it to mass production do you have everything lined up do you have the partners who are going to help to do the role to role manufacturing this is basically the goal at the moment we have it still in a prototype production but everything is basically all ready at shelf prepared that we are in discussions with the interested partners from logistics we are now going the intermediate step in a pilot line this will be still sheet to sheet but we already have with our approach engineers the plans ready to go role to role and then basically this will be in a scale of millions we will change the world I hope so basically I expect you actually every 8 billion people need batteries need energy power solar wind all the different power technology that changes the world when you do things in a smarter way that is useful for many people absolutely and especially for the environment when I compare the batteries 100 years ago it has mercury it has cardmium it has lead in it but now all these hazardous substances are removed our battery is really a green product and in so far I think it is the best product for our battery there is one comment right here more dense batteries are usually more dangerous to handle I wonder how these batteries react in a crisis the printed batteries it is easy to say I mean I can punch through it still there is nothing to be worried about I mean if I go for lithium ion battery technology which is really a dense energy then of course I need to fulfill all the safety requirements but here basically I go into area the battery is super thin it is below 0.8mm and we are going even lower still here basically the energy comes with area so the capacity is per square centimeter and as you already said from the from the substances used, the chemicals used they are environmentally benign we have a water based electrolyte so basically comparing to lithium ion batteries if they get in contact with atmosphere with ambient atmosphere with water based atmosphere they will react but primary battery doesn't so you got everything figured out everything lined up I mean we will further develop and decrease it the capacity but now we are basically at a critical point where we see we are ready to partner up and to bring it into the world and if people have new ideas they can contact you absolutely please look it up you can find it printed batteries at the water home page you can easily connect with us to discuss further applications and it's just now it's the time that's what Martin said we see a huge market pool because the development of the electronics of printed electronics or the chip industry it uses less energy it gets smaller and smaller and we are getting more and more connected in our daily life we are getting connected with health trackers we are getting smart patches we are getting internet of things into internet of everything and here basically this is a nice piece we support this because all of it needs energy source add this video about the ARM devices and kind of like the chairman of the company that owns ARM talks about trillions of IoT devices they all need batteries they can run them without if you want to be independent if you want to stay independent you need a battery you basically have a certain type of battery useful the lithium ion battery technology is very useful in certain applications but in others we see this battery also very important to fill the gap and being in that sense even more environmental friendly and recycle recycling we already use a huge share of recycling material already on production and it is recyclable at the end as well for these type of batteries the recycling concept is available it's the same concept as for manganese dioxide batteries alkaline batteries which are in every supermarket so we can use the same recycling processes as these under other things so that is quite easy καλώς καλώς ευχαριστώ καλώς καλώς καλώς και αυτά ευχαριστώ καλώςαφερα και θα δω η εξεγραφή για την εξεγραφή και ευχαριστώ να κάνουμε κάποιες πολύ καλόνες εξαιρετικές εξαιρετικές να βοηθήσει να κάνουμε τις καλύτερες εξαιρετικές εξαιρετικές. Αυτή είναι η στιγμή. Εγώ like. Ευχαριστώ, θα θέλω να βοηθήσεις. Εντάξει. Θα σας εξηρετικά να βρήξεις για μόνο τη δεύτερη στιγμή. Ξεκινάτε. Θέλει να το δούμε. Μετά από μήνες. Μετά από 3 μλήνες. 10 μλήνες. Παρακάθασάς να εξερετήσω. Γεια σας. Είμαι Φασσίλ Βαλί. Είμαι εδώ για να εξερετήσω Κάουστ. Κάουστ είναι ο Κύριος Άμπλολα Υνύβεστρια και Τεχνολογικής. Αυτή η Ινύβεστρια was established in 2009. Βέβαια. Νομίζω να μιλάτε με τη μουσική. Αυτή η Ινύβεστρια was established in 2009. Αυτή η Ινύβεστρια was established in 2009. We have more than 200 faculty at this moment. And our university is located in Saudi Arabia. Really on the Red Sea shore. And it has a beautiful campus. And if you see in the background maybe you can see the pictures of the campus. It's a huge campus. The university is offering masters and PhD degrees. Are the students only from Saudi Arabia? No, the students are coming from all over the world. It's not only from Saudi Arabia. Right now the COST has a representation of 110 different countries. People from 110 different countries. It's not only for the students but there are a lot of research happening. So that means there are a lot of postal and research scientists as well working there. One of the unique things COST has is the facilities. They have one of the best facilities in the world in terms of equipment. And scientific equipment. So they have what we call it co-lab facilities. These co-lab facilities are very much directed towards the equipment which are being used for the researcher. For top-notch research. For example they have transmission electron microscope. They have scanning electron microscope. More than 10 NMRs are there, XPS. Supercomputer and so on. And then there is research centers which really focus on different research topics. For example what we are presenting here today is COST Solar Center. So COST Solar Center is very much focusing on research related to solar. So it is not only organic solar or perovskite solar or silicon. But what we are trying to do is we are trying to cover the full value chain. We start with materials. We try to make the devices of these materials and then test the devices with equipment. But also we do a lot of outdoor testing as well. Then we go to the industry. We try to understand from industry what are the challenges they are facing in the Middle East or in Saudi Arabia. And then we look into what can we do to address those challenges. So one of the most important thing for Solar Center is the flux of the students. So we have for example right now more than 35 students. And I am very happy that today we have one of the students who actually come from Greece. And I want to introduce Lazaros. Hello, hello. My name is Lazaros. And I am a new addition to the COST Solar Center team. From my experience in COST is like a 5 month experience. I was stunned about the facilities. I was stunned about the research there. And I am really really happy to have the chance to work under my professor Thomas Antopoulos. And do a very unique project that I am part of. As a PhD student in COST I can comprehend that there are many many many opportunities for me right now and in the near future. And what COST offers in my point of view is something unique. Because it gives me the opportunity to work in academia. And also links me with the industry and other academic places that can continue my journey. So what I can say in COST is I embrace you. You can join for more information. You can also ask whatever question you have in mind. Saudi Arabia in my point of view is a great country. And I am really happy to have the opportunity to be a part of this team. So Faisal will continue with our research team. Ok. So I think the most important thing what I want to show here is in Solar Center We have a bunch of faculty working. And they are experts on different fields. For example we have Frederic Lacroix who is our center director. He has a physics background. We have Stefan Devolf who is coming from the material science. We have Martin Heaney. Martin Heaney is a chemist. So if you see they are working in interdisciplinary research trying to make it sure that they will come up with innovation which is required for the kingdom and for the Middle East. Also they are trying to come up with some training programs. For example Solar Center recently started a PV design school where students come from within the kingdom and they have the opportunity to learn about how to design the smaller unit for household or for the industrial use as well. So these things we need to do to make it sure that we as a research institute is not only doing the reset but also creating an impact on the society. Thank you. This is a huge priority for Saudi Arabia to get solar to work in a big way to our whole society right? Yeah. And not just rely on oil for future. That's true. So what we call it Saudi Arabia has a vision 2030 and in this vision 2030 Saudi Arabia would like to achieve 60 gigawatt of electricity through renewable energy sources and the two renewable energy sources which they want to focus right now one is PV and the second one is wind. So the whole thing started in 2019 and today Saudi Arabia has given contracts which are around 4 gigawatts. These are the projects which are already in the installation phase. Around 300 megawatt is already into the grid from last year. So things are changing very fast. You are absolutely right. But what kingdom wants to do which is a little bit different than Europe kingdom wants to make it sure that they would have the full value chain into the kingdom. So they want to produce the panels locally. So they want to have a huge interest towards the local contents. And that way Saudi Arabia is considering that they will slowly start moving from the GDP which is right now based on oil towards the GDP which is more based on other technologies as well. This could also be export because you can have so much sun with a big cable going to Europe whom you can import solar energy from Saudi Arabia. So I think maybe things are a little bit different there. For example there is a big project of NEOM which is going on at the moment and what NEOM wants they have a different approach. They don't want to give electricity to other countries. What they want they want to use this electricity to produce hydrogen and then ship this hydrogen in the form of ammonia to other countries. And for example in this project there are big companies already involved. Aquapower, Air products, Ramco they are working right now producing the electricity from PV taking it towards hydrogen production and then moving the hydrogen in the form of ammonia to different countries. So this is actually happening. And the students see results in their studies and their work they see actual applications, actual market and not just learning something, people talking about it but we need to see the market also, right? So you are absolutely right. We used to have things really on a small lab scale but now if you really want to make students motivated that their lab scale stuff can move towards bigger plants and change the world then the motivation level will be different. And what is happening in the Kingdom when you see the bigger companies they come in and they start making the plants towards getting the hydrogen on a bigger level, producing the electricity using the PV or the Gigawatt scales then everybody thinks, yes, things are changing and what they are working on is actually implementing very soon or in the near future. And is it kind of discussions you have here with the different professors different universities, different startups to bring in new tech for these students to work on something exciting, right? So these kind of exhibitions and these kind of conferences are a very unique opportunity because we all have different expertise and when we come all together we start realizing that we have this part and the other company or the other research group is working on a separate topic and if we combine these things we may have a solution which we don't know before we arrive here. So I think that is the unique part of the conferences and this conference I would say that every time we are here we always find out a couple of things happen with us. We see some students who are very interested to join COST for example then we meet people who thinks that they can work for COST and then we meet people who thinks that they have certain equipment which they can give to COST or solar center which can be used in our research. And the most important last but not least we also have opportunity to meet with professors who are working in a little bit different areas but these areas are also important for our research. So this research collaboration which comes from these discussions is also very valuable. Alright. And I'm guessing Saudi Arabia wants to do more and more partnerships around the world. Also they're opening up tourism to have people come in or many countries can come without visa and stuff like that. And hopefully there's no more COVID. People can just go and do business. And the society, the young people in Saudi Arabia they want to connect with the whole world. That's a very, very right observations. Saudi Arabia is changing very fast right now. Saudi Arabia, you know, it's great to be part of Saudi Arabia right now because you see the actual cultural changes are happening in front of you and they are really very fast. So tourism, yes Saudi Arabia have not only opened the visas for tourists but they are also providing a lot of facilities for the tourists. They bring a lot of world attractions. Formula One was in Jweta. There was a Riyadh season. There were a big musical show happening in Riyadh. They discovered a historical place and they opened it for the tourism. Al-Ula is one of those historical places. They are opening all these historical places which were I would say was quite hidden from the world in the past. And then let's don't forget, the Red Sea itself is a great place. So what they are doing, they are building a lot of resorts next to the Red Sea so people can go there and actually figure it out what is the Red Sea. Scuba diving and all these kind of things will be available for their tourists as well. I heard about these huge new cities using hi-tech, using future technology being planned or maybe they are actually being built. And that city for example is called Neom. So Neom is a 500 billion dollar project. So the Arabia is really working on this which will be a very unique city in the world which is 160 km a line, what they call it. Everything is built in one line. So there will be traffic free zone or traffic free city and 100% renewable energy. So when I say 100% renewable energy that means that they will only use PV and wind. Now is this really happening or are there only the videos? I can tell you, I was on the ground and I really see things are moving on a very fast pace. So there will be a very special public transportation system or self-driving system or something like that, right? Like a totally rethought city, not like a city you've never seen before. That's what the planning is all. I don't know what kind of the transportation system will be there but they are very open there and they are looking into different possibilities. They call it the line and they want to make sure the line will be something unique in the world. And when it comes to the houses they are looking into very energy efficient houses as well. So yes, it will be heaven for the tourism but it will be also eye-opening in terms of the technology. Nice. So looking forward to a lot of exciting future and new collaborations, new partnerships, new noble price coming out of the University of America. Yes, hopefully. Hopefully. We are ready to determine to make an impact. Cool. Thanks a lot. Welcome. Thank you. Thanks for visiting us. And I'll put you on a pause for just a second. So please introduce yourself. Yeah, my name is Thomas Kohlbursch. I'm Vice President of Koutima Coding Machinery. Koutima Coding Machinery is working in DeepTech so we build equipment for printing, coding and laminating. So these machines we see on the background here, is that your machines? Yeah, we work in different areas. So most of our pilot lines are being used for lab-to-fab development. We are working specifically with startups with technology clusters like here, the LTFN in Tessanoliki, on products like Organic Photomotakes, on nanoprinted surfaces. But we are also working on new technologies like Green Hydrogen and battery technologies. What are these machines we see behind you? The clicking code. Yeah, the clicking code is a patented Koutima system. This clicking code system can be adjusted in size. We can add additional features at a later stage of the operation. So the customer can start with a standard configuration and then we can add additional features at a later stage. Our most versatile, flexible, patented lab system we offer to our customers. And the roll-to-roll nano-imprint? Yeah, the roll-to-roll nano-imprint is the system to do roll-to-roll nano-structured surfaces, for example for optical light guides, for surface modification. And this system is used by the display industry, by the label industry for specific features. And here we have dedicated systems. We are also now installed at the LGFN Testoliki. Nice. So you enable all kinds of future technologies that are going to be exciting like flexible solar, flexible all-ats. Yeah, exactly. And this we do already, if you speak about flexible solar, this we do already since 2003, working on first OPV devices. We did the first printing unit for OLEDs in 2008 at a university in Finland. So we are always very early at the technology stages people are working on. So what's the way to get this to mass production so the whole world gets impacted by this technology? The way to mass production is our approach not only to build equipment. We have Europe's biggest R&D center with 12 pilot lines. We're doing a lot of pre-engineering for our customers. We have a whole service range for R&D development. So the combination of equipment, R&D services and also our global network is the key. Nice. What kind of discussions do you have here at the nanotech technology conference? We have discussions here since 2008 already on new technologies, specifically on the topic of OPV, specifically on the topic of green hydrogen, fuel cells and batteries. And we are focusing here also on networking with our RTO partners, finding new project proposals for Horizon Europe. That's a big effort here in these next days. Do people have new ideas, what they want to do with your technology all the time? Yeah, I think that's the key of the company. We are always walking around, we are speaking to people specifically here from the R&D institutes to find new ideas where you can use rotor roll printing, coating and laminating technologies. What do you think about, like let's say I want to have solar on my roof. Is it going to happen? Can I just get this kind of solar soon? It's happening. We work together very closely here with the university, with Stegos Lugithidis. We work with OED, which is using our equipment here at LTFN. And we are already shipping solar cells to customers globally, specifically on the OPV topic. But here OED has new technologies in the surface modifications of these solar cells. So they are not only on the roof, they are also in agriculture being used in a lot of different applications. Is it crucial to have efficiency that's at the level that makes sense per dollar for people to just say I want billion units? I think the more important thing is efficiency for the whole day, where OPV has advantages against silicon technologies. The other advantage is it's lightweight. You can design every form you need. And it's a printed material, so you also can do printed structures which fit into architectural designs for example. Because you want to have something that costs a few thousand dollar, you cover the whole house and then you give it ten years and you switch them again when efficiency is being a whole bunch more. Yeah for sure, that's one approach. The approach is also to have smaller lightweight devices for energy harvesting. For example powering the internet of things, powering standard devices. So you're not using electricity, you're directly using solar energy to power your devices in your house or in your car in other places. What's the other big use cases you see? Solar, OLED? Yeah, the biggest use case at the moment in Europe is green hydrogen. With all the surroundings, political surroundings we have, there was already a big initiative on green hydrogen from the European Commission. And now with the topic of getting faster out of fossil fuels, especially gas supply from Russia which is not taking place anymore, green hydrogen will be the big hype topic here till 2030 or 2050 for sure. How do you enable the green hydrogen with your technology? We do catalyst coatings on the membrane for palm electrolyzers. So we are at the moment at the forefront on these production lines, road to road, which are being already installed at the moment in Europe, but also in North America. Can you talk a little bit more about these catalyst membranes and all this? Yeah, our company is working in fuel cells and electrolyzers since 20 years. So we are able to cast the membranes so we can produce membranes which are being used for electrolyzer technologies and fuel cells. And of course on these membranes you have to bring the catalyst from both sides and that's also a coating application and this we do since 20 years. And we are now going into let's say two meters of working with in the operation faster speed industrialization of processes including quality control using AI to get very good results. So you couldn't theory road to road print the solar panel the audit lighting the fuel cell hydrogen system the whole thing can be printed? Yeah, that's basically the idea and that's the thing we are doing. And of course if you use solar energy you have to store solar energy and the best way to do it is to use electrolyzers to make a hydrogen. So the whole green tech future is printed? It's printed or coated that's basically the idea and it's on flexible materials and it has to be scaled up specifically in green hydrogen as soon as possible So we are launching the net zero targets the European Commission wants to have in 2050. How is the efficiency for something that you do compared to something that's mass manufactured in China that's like molded kind of things and stuff? In electrolyzer technologies we still have a big advantage against the Chinese producers because we are already if you look into solar applications it's compatible because I think a lot of production technologies will come back from China to Europe. So we are speaking about a local European production to be independent from any supply problems or other problems here in Europe. Yeah, independence is a good thing to have sometimes when it's unpredictable political environment in the world So you want to have stuff happen in Europe and this is the place to be right now in Europe the nanotechnology conference is the most exciting thing right now. Yeah, because you have here the university you have solar, you have wind energy and you have already activities from the LTFN and OED on electrolyzers and fuel cell technologies. In Denmark they are talking about doing huge islands for wind power and they want to also put hydrogen and ship it over and stuff like that and I just spoke with these guys over there in Saudi Arabia, they also want to do solar and hydrogen and ship it. Yeah, if you see a hydrogen every country who is using electrolyzer technologies is using renewables to make green hydrogen will be totally independent from fossil fuel. So they will be also independent from other areas where fossil fuels is being produced. On the other hand, countries like Australia like Saudi Arabia like Denmark either have a lot of solar energy or wind power and then can produce hydrogen and export it to countries which don't have so much solar power for example. That's also a big opportunity in Africa if you see the connection between Africa and the European Union already being discussed we have big solar farms in Morocco and Tunisia and then shipping the hydrogen to Europe. So it will be complete new value chains globally in this type of operation. So everybody is talking about it is Germany and the EU are they all putting the money forward actually requiring this to be done? Yeah, there is the Green Deal from the European Commission there is additional funding for hydrogen production and also developing hydrogen technologies in Europe there is an estimated 3 trillion market globally on green hydrogen to replace grey hydrogen to replace fossil fuels to 2050 and there are already 39 different programs globally on hydrogen economy from countries like Japan United States, Europe So it's accelerating growth of the technology Nice Is there something something you forgot to mention? No, I think we covered the hot topics Are you gonna have like presentations here? Yeah, I will have a presentation on Thursday on the production technologies for fuel cells and green hydrogen and my colleague will speak about sustainable packaging also in a talk on Thursday Cool, thanks a lot Okay, thank you Alright, I'll put you on a break for one second in the chat We're back right here Please introduce yourself Hi, my name is Alexander Legand from the company Nanostripe in Germany I'm the sales manager for Ymer mainly then for Europe Middle East and Africa but just yeah, without central Europe And so what we are doing is then we are just producing the world's most precise 3D printer just based on two-fold on conversation and the point is then it's always a little bit difficult just to explain in words and so much easier if you see some pictures that's the reason why I just I hope you are able to see then your laptop that you just get a bit a better idea than of what we are doing So here we are spinners from Karlsruhe Institute of Technology and company Nanostripe and so now since more than 14 years in the field and so we have in the meanwhile then Yeah, I'm just trying sorry, I need to gimbal right now Yeah, it's better Okay, so company Nanostripe and so we have installed now in the meanwhile then more than 250 systems worldwide and so half it for example in Europe a lot of our customers are university based but we have then more and more we have more and more industry customers but typically they don't want to be named and so after a while we decided then that it's necessary then especially and also for the name industry customers but applications then to Sorry Let's try to bring the Whatever you like just give me some hints but I should do Yeah, then you stand right here Sorry to check One second, try to get it to the gimbal Sorry, we are right back Should we start over or do you want to continue? So you were saying most precise 3D printer Yes, sorry, company Nanostripe most precise 3D printer and a new model platform and we have more and more industry on one side and we have a quite range of different applications so we decided to create then for each different application area a certain model and so that's what you see over here so one typical application goes to a micro lens erase and then do for example print the so-called golden master do replication We have different projects with different industry customers then to do replication I'm not sure if it's possible to see so as an example So we provided then here Are you able to see should I Yeah Sorry, yeah So this is a typical example that with one of our project partners So we provided the golden master polymer and we used for example hot embossing then just to replicate that So this is a replicated sample of micro lens erase then diffusers and defective optical elements So this is through a 3D printer So this is replicated and it was originally produced then of the first So we talk about small details Exactly, absolutely and so let's go back You still can see the laptop and you see here in scale bar So we speak of something like here in the microns and then with square millimeters up to square centimeters what you have seen before and in total it can go down to something like 100 to 200 nanometre lateral feature size but of course you can also as well then print larger structures so what you see over here if you decrease resolution you can increase the printing speed then larger volumes in a certain area Again examples for that So for example for this So object here for us is a quite big one and so you can then this here is printed and with around then so in something like 13 to 14 hours print time What would it be for this kind of thing So before it was then if you have higher resolution on that then it's impossible to print that at all Because the advantage of printing something very very small is you can do all kinds of stuff for that So the advantage then of course is then if you can print something with this high precision that you have depends of course on the applications So for example then if you work with in photonics you would like to have corresponding then or in the area then in the wavelengths for example or for the microlens erase then of course you have to then need certain parameters so for example you would like to have so surface smoothness down in the 10 nanometer and below area for example So more example then So as well then give an example then that it's possible then to do for different applications are the models So this is an example then for applications for the quantum expire model as a 3D bioprinting system So a light based one So you can print with embedded cells from the beginning and have achieved then cell viability rates then of higher than 90% So after for example in 4 hours And so what you see over here is then in green are the living cells in red are the So the red points over here are the dead cells So this is in scan through then in set direction then through different layers of the embedded cells And in red here So this just mesh over here So this is the scaffold that was printed to support then the cells Or of course what you can also always can do is then to print first the 3D scaffold and then later on place cells on them for tissue engineering for example Or for example also some of our customers use the system then to provide vascular models because the point isn't always the longer the lifetime then should be then after a while what you have to do is then you have to provide then just cells with nutrients for example And like this you need somehow or you are interested in very often to print vascular models to support then with nutrients Or other application areas then you can print as well then a master for microfutics and then use that for replication and like this create channels and later on then to print fine elements into these channels like mixers or then just filtering elements or what you see over here then to provide then here cell cages or cages or cells or for example pillar elements then to later on enable anchoring points for the cells Or other application then so you can go into photonic integration circuits and so therefore it's interesting then to print new elements photonic elements micro lenses then for example in this case here on top of optical fibers so what you can do is then so you can print either then developing an optical fibers or on the other side then you can print then elements then on photonic chips to connect then here to send signals data rates then from one side to the others and for example then for a special wavelength we achieve then data rates of better than one decibel then for example or a typical example is then what you would like to hear is then you would like to have cost then to print automatic that means then on the right side we see here the original design on the right side so you see then here might be difficult to see then here the unlimited core of such a fiber and what we do is then that we print that we choose then in the software the starting and the end point and the software automatically then looks for the core of the fiber to print automatically the lenses that you see here on the left side and this is how the result looks like so parallel printed lenses then parallel to each other to provide then to parallel outputs and you see that you obviously had a good result in printing by seeing then that you achieved parallel beams with it or the other way then for photonic integration is then to print then coupler on top of photonic chips for example then on creating couplers then lenses out coupling lenses in coupling lenses or what you see over here is then to find automatically then markers that are showed here to print in this case here edge couplers directly here at the edge of this wave guide and this is again then how it looks like so this is the original design this is the printed result shown under an SEM picture for the details and so this brings me at the end to the motor think big and think big and print nano thank you very much for your thoughts of people having and coming to talk with you and say hey I'd like to do this can you help me do that and as many different ideas so what we do is then so we sell equipment and so but very often so if people tell me what they would like to do is then that they forwarded them to customers our equipment to enable them to print their ideas vertically you can print anything that you have an STL file, a 3D cut file and just to give you one example then just so we are part of another company company Byco Bioconvergence and their ideas then at the end that they are able to print just organs for humans then for transplantation because a lot of people then worldwide have very long just waiting lists and have to wait very long times until they are able to get the operation then or just for a between to provide then again human on a chip systems then for example to improve truck testing on one side to just decrease then the turnaround time for truck testing on one side and on the other side and also if you are able then to do just body on a chip or human on a chip testing then you can also avoid then of animals then for truck testing or for example testing then of other media then of course then for now for cosmetics, sorry, yeah What are the materials you can use in the printer? So the principle behind is then it's two photo improvisation so the first step you would work with polymers and then of course if you are interested in other materials you have different possibilities like to use this polymer then as a template and then later on use other techniques like coding techniques then to have access to gramex or for example then also then just center your product then to get class for example then as another step or for example then use electroplating to have access to metal like just gold, copper or nickel In medicine what do people want to do with a printer that goes that small So for example what you would like to do is then either to print to use it for your human on chip model to print fine elements in it like mixes or filters or for example then you also can do then there are some other work done where people just print movable parts like small micro pots that deliver trucks inside human body to a place where they should go to for better truck efficiency Would you actually print things that go into the human body? Yes, that's one game of different researchers than worldwide And your machines are ready for that? For the printing yes So for the printing testing yes and it was also used then for animal models There was some first work done as well then at least for human testing And do you see anything about the price of the printer of the machine? You have the quantum x-align, x-bio x-shape, those products So these are products that can be bought and so just to give you a price range and in total so we speak of prices then just going up depending on the more difficult, sorry, the more different just positions you can add but of course it can go up to something like 800k€ and the core model starts at around 450-500k€ and we have as well done just our work cost for academics the photonic profession GT2 system and this just has a price range between 350k€ up to 450k€ And I guess you have some very cool and interesting customers that are doing very secret projects with those kinds of very advanced R&D and you are involved with them I guess So of course a lot of our customers is in our university research centers and so if you look just for the world universities ranking then you see out of the top 10 9 of them are our customers already and then for corporations then for example for industry it would be then micro lenses if just if you have a look then for your mobile then you see that as a lot of research done always to improve for example the cameras inside the mobile Can you say a little bit more about Baiko? So the company Baiko is then just stands for Baiko Convergence it was founded then in around 2016 then just as a company selling and they went into the just US stock market to just gain money or just to get money then to buy different smaller companies like for example the just a company Nanostripe and the big vision then is just to void on one side then animal testing and on the next step is then for the future is then to do organ printing for humans And enable a new advanced technology Absolutely and of course then for different applications like we mentioned life sciences, we mentioned medicines then on one side and then of course then always so the imagination is then the limit so everything what you can have to remind and as an idea to print what you can do for the sketch you can just try to print that and so the other applications then are typically then photonics and or I mentioned microbiotics then also people just in general people do for example as well MEMS and you world leader and exactly this stuff you said this is the most precise so on one side we are then world leader in terms of just machines then on one side and of course then technology leader as well then in terms of then the most precise 3D printing then possible technology based in this case based on two photo polarization the feature size is going to 100nm and fairly below that Cool Anything we forgot to talk about? Not from my side and of course then if you have questions then I think it makes more sense then to place them directly here at the booth and to speak directly to go for details Cool, thanks a lot Thank you very much Have a great show Thanks I'll put you on a break for a minute So please introduce yourself Myself exactly or the company Yeah, yourself, the company, everything Well I'm the founder of the company which is existing now for 41 years and the company started in 1981 from me I'm an electronic engineer and I have background of theoretical physics So what have you been doing? What kind of We have done a lot of I'm an electronic engineer in fact and I was specialized in cybernetics We started 1981 the company in the very beginning we started with a lot of innovative ideas working with the five factors that they are very important in life like temperature vacuum humidity and light and illuminance and we launched in the very beginning chambas, growth chambas and we were the first ones using microwave humidifiers for better spread in the environment of the chambas Anyhow feeling the pressure in a way or the demand in the market for more innovative products we started producing fresh dryers What is a fresh dryer is a unit which can be small as for laboratory equipment as a laboratory equipment or it can be also for production plant What the fresh dryer does is that he manage with special conditions to pass a product from the solid phase to the air without passing in the liquid phase so this means that we freeze the product and why we freeze it because in fact if we have the conditions of very low very low vacuum in a chamber then the water for instance in almost zero degree centigrade this means that the product the natural conditions of the product are not disturbed this means that when the product is totally dried the product can last for many years it is a preservation of the product and that is the fresh dryer does Is it only about preservation or you can do many other things You can do a lot of things You can do a lot of things We have made a lot of applications We have done applications from food industry to food industry We have done applications in archaeological findings clothes papers bones and so on and also things about the nanoparticles which are a very important factor and that is why we present our products in this exhibition What do you do with the archaeological findings? For instance if you after a lot of years in a cave you find a cloth finding a cloth for 2000 years old inside the earth When you take it out in fact in the air this is destroyed almost immediately You can preserve it if you put it in a fresh dryer You can preserve it forever I can count you a lot of applications So the main application is for pharmaceutical products because they are preserved they need to be preserved and they need to be sterilized also Our products are spread all over the world We have facilities in Germany and in Greece The products are 100% made by us and we came to a level that the quality of the product we preserve we present in the market they are top quality we sell products I couldn't say the best of the world because it's always something better than you but in a way we have customers from Indonesia to Paraguay and from Turkey to Italy France Great Britain, India Yes Why not China? Up to now they were not we wouldn't have any customer in China but I don't think that we afraid Chinese products we really don't afraid Of course I cannot blame Chinese products there are good and bad products everywhere in the world but nobody can say that the European products are for sure better than the Chinese products I think the tradition in Europe and especially in Germany where we are based we are let's say in Germany famous for the absolute production You don't have a German accent? I'm not a German I'm Greek but I'm a German citizen for many years and that doesn't mean that I don't have the attitude of the German society It's as cryo You have to do with cryogenic? Yes, yes It's cryo because it is deep the product is getting into as a deep frozen product and then we follow the procedure So I know it's a strange crazy question but can you freeze dry a brain and wake it up like a thousand years later? I can't say this because this is something else which is beyond my knowledge but of course in cases that they freeze dry brains now if they bring them back after 100 years Yes But you can do that right? They do cryogenic stuff Definitely yes And with your equipment? To such an experiment we didn't do it but for other experiments I can tell you that we have done a lot Done a lot? Yes Some things you can't talk about? No, no, no But there are cases that of course we are not supposed to to launch them outside Yes, exactly Exactly A lot of experiments Experiments For instance we have a lot of installations in university laboratories and of course what they do we don't know because they buy the units we give them the knowledge to use the unit properly but afterwards we are not involved but inside the factories where the products came to us mainly before they buy the units because we make experiments of course they know what they are going to do So when you freeze dry something in the machine like this you need to keep giving it power at the constant rate for it to continue The fact is that every of these machines from the very small to the very big one it has a cycle which is giving the result So you put the product frozen inside and then you get the product after the process is finished you get it as a dry product You get it as a powder or you get it as a dry product and for instance you can dip freeze strawberry put it inside and after 15 or 20 hours it depends how you put the product inside you get a product which is totally dry and it has all the properties which the natural product has the smell the aroma the natural properties everything You put just water on it and then it becomes exactly the same and this means that all the properties of the product are remaining inside that's why for instance the people flying to the moon they get this kind of food the food they get is freeze dried they put a little package put some order and they're good and they're not getting sick no definitely not and these kind of applications we have done a lot we have a lot of companies food industries that they have ready made meals which they are in a packet you just open it put it in the water make a boil, finish So you work with the people but companies we we solve units they have project for this kind of operations you can just put it in a packet which is not coming into the environment it's not attacked by humidity and because the temperature is not a problem mainly the humidity because one of the factors that the product is destroyed is the humidity the active water which is included in the product this makes the product to be destroyed so water is evil yes not always what's happening with the water why does it do that stuff because when the water is inside the product then the product is exposed to different let's say process which makes it to be destroyed after a while some processes happening H2O exact this is something for instance which belongs to the biology and the chemistry so water is life yes let's put it that way so you just put it in one of those IKEA ziplock bags yes you can do that also but when the product after the freeze drying process is going to be preserved it can be for 20 years it has to be sealed inside packet completely plastic you need to suck out the air or it has to be a neutral in a way gas inside but better of course air contains humidity also mostly and air also it can create problems to the product but water is not good air is not good i thought these things were great they are great because they bring life but a product which is let's say going to be destroyed it's life created inside another type of life which starts destroying the product so here the nanotechnology conference what kind of discussions you have with the people up to now we did not make any discussion but it's for sure that the nanotechnology products are also freeze dried products in our products and the sorry about the cut let's try to continue what we were talking is that the question was what is the relation and the correlation between freeze drying products and the nanotechnology and a lot of products regarding nanotechnology are freeze dried in a way and they are used in electrochemical, environmental and engineered materials and specially in pharmaceutical industry so we are glad and we show this demand in a way worldwide because all of the governments around the world they spend a lot of money in university programs to develop nanotechnological products and you have something on the presentation here sometimes you talk about something on your laptop i have a lot of presentations regarding several things i can give you what is our company people can find you on your website yes, definitely and that is what we do less moisture, best quality less bacteria longest self life less less radiation optimum logistical cost because less weight so in fact the industries we do work with they are food industries for food products they are pharmaceuticals which is a great field there is a lot of stuff yes yes, i will put a link to your website yes, of course yes documents all these applications we have done nice so you have been busy yes indeed despite of the general conditions worldwide we have been busy absolutely and those 41 years you have not been doing freeze dryers we have been working with freeze dryers and that was almost all this time we started initially working with dealers because beside the engineering work we had some dealerships and this was the inspiration to start doing ourselves we are engineers we knew the subject and we started cool, thanks a lot thank you also i hope that i gave you some facts i am sure we will do some time checks over there i think i need to do a break right here thank you very much hey live chat i try to queue up the next please be in a break for a few couple minutes so please introduce yourself i am already introducing myself my name is Timios Mitziadis i am working at the University of Zurich together with ATH and i am in the institute of oral biology touching all the fields that have to do with biology of the mouth so what's the latest discussions you have around here discussions we have not much because just right now the meeting is starting but we have some new developments let's say in the field that i can introduce to you one big development the last 3-4 years it is a formation of dental tissues on chip it is this tooth on chip that we call so we can recapitulate all physiology and pathology of the tooth in a very small area and to analyse and we can use it for diagnostic reasons as well so it is helping for the regeneration of the tissues are you creating synthetic teeth really it is first of all about the living tissue it is about the dental part it is the inside of the tooth this contains a lot of cells a diversity of cells that can be from fibroblasts to stem cells to endothelial cells to neuronal cells to immune cells and to even epithelial cells we have done the single cell RNA analysis sequencing last year this paper has been published and we have analysed the different cell populations in the genomic level of the whole human tooth this has been done for the dental pulp and it has been done for the tissue that is surrounding the tooth that is the periodontal part so these two cell populations are important because they are keeping alive the tooth so how does your research become something that is used in the world is it actually used already no it is not used they start as some people to create when you say organ on chip most of the companies or universities they are not many but they are in America mostly in Harvard so they try to recreate the liver the pancreas or they can recreate the brain or the heart are tissues of prime importance as it is well understood and they are trying first of all to analyse this in order to see how they can do how they can deal with pharmaceutical substances or to make some prognostic they are trying one of the first group in the world to try to make this on recreating the tissue of the tooth so if I can advance a little bit these organ on chips that we can have different chips of different organs we can put all together through micro fluidic devices and to communicate to allow to communicate between them so we can connect the tooth organ with the liver, with the heart with the brain, with the articulations and so on like that if for instance we have an inflammation a bacterial inflammation in one of the organs we can go to see what is happening how this bacteria from one organ they can influence the physiology of another organ and for teeth it is well known from the past that when you have severe cases of inflammation of teeth you can have pericarditis you can have arthritis you have a lot of other manifestations in the body this is the time that we can prove because this was something that we can observe but we could not analyse deeply but now with this new technology we can go to analyse and we can see what are the effects in the other organs it sounds a little bit like reflexology where you have some nerve endings and the teeth that are connected with the rest of the body and I will tell you what we've figured out in this that means when you are making for instance in the teeth one hole, you are going to the dentist the dentist is making a hole you have a reaction of the tissue of the dental tissue of the pulp because you have nerves and you have vessels immediately this reaction is going to the brain and after because in the brain you have this trigeminal gaglar this face is from the trigeminal gaglar is projecting to all other tissues around the tooth so it's not just the tooth you can have the other eye you can have the salivary glands you can have the ear and so on and of course can affect other organs through all this stimulation of a neuron from the tooth so yeah it is something like that as well So when you have a problem with health in the future you just go get a special bluetooth and it will fix you or when No it's not a bluetooth really this bluetooth is just for let's say it's nothing to do with science fiction here but it is really you try to figure out what is happening in the tissues because you have human tissues inside you can try to see what medication is doing and I will take an example here for instance you have a leukemia of small kids that are 5 years old and this leukemia of course you are giving drugs in order to heal this disease So what is happening then You are giving these drugs you can see that the hairs are lost the hairs of the kids the same you can see when women that they have these breast cancers they are taking this chemotherapy and the hairs are lost why they are lost because these drugs they are affecting the stem cell population because hairs they have stem cells that's why they are grown continuously but it's not affecting just the stem cell they can affect as well the teeth for instance the stem cells that are existing in the teeth in 5 years old so you can have deteriorating teeth by the administration of these chemo chemicals that you are giving for cancer that are not really rainbows for the social security and this is a pity because it is not something that is responsible the patient but this there is nothing yet there to prove that you know these drugs they are affecting and I don't know many articles or researches they are focusing towards this area in order to see how these drugs they are affecting other healthy tissues in the body Are you able to develop some kind of choose and the gum area or something for people who have problems that need to have something completely different or is that not the application here No, you can have all sort of applications the technology now has advanced a lot we know a lot about stem cell and plasticity of this we know about innervation and vascularization of these tissues and we can have this printing technology that can help enormously so this all we can do but we need for this a lot of money and of course we have to be focused it is not just one laboratory or two the world that they can achieve these things you have to have a coordinated action that is direct and let's say in case that we are in Europe from European community to throw money inside in such big projects in order to to go further with these new developments Are you like doing something cutting edge in this field you're like researching stuff that nobody's done before Yeah, all these that I'm speaking about is cutting edge, is nobody that is doing we are doing this and we have this appearing in original publications actually just to tell you how original it is I will tell you what we publish in just the near past we recreate by taking human dental stem cells we replace the mammary stem cells and we place in this position the dental and after the mice they develop true mammary glands with the dental origin and it is not just the mammary gland as the tissue but they have done as well milk they were milk producing so I don't know the quality of the milk of the milk tooth compared with the mammary gland but for sure we could replace so this is something original that nobody has done it and we saw that they have a big plasticity and we can use maybe for diseases if you have a cancer in the breast maybe you can use stem cells from another organ in order to replace the damaged tissue in the breast these we can imagine for any sort of organ Yeah How do you define priorities like what you really want to to achieve or to do first and who decides this Yeah, this is in any case it is a direct and I believe by the country always what they want to have because they are financing and you have to go to get these competitive grants if not you are getting nothing and you have as well the European funds that are directed you have a period that they were throwing a lot of money for stem cell after you have another period they were throwing a lot of money for nanotechnology and you have all these new developments that are happening that they try really to promote so it is a kind of guidance from the top that they are trying to see what are in the society they need if we have a cancer in France I know that when it was Syracca he throw a lot of money the research on cancer I don't know if it was very successful or not but yeah it is something like that politically driven if not we cannot make science in our days just for your fun we have fun doing science but in the limits of this that the public is waiting from you because we are waiting some products as you said and these products has to help the humanity Is there sometimes a government who says here is a billion dollars but I want a product in like two years yeah you have this of course everybody knows that you cannot have it in two years but you can have through trials first of all you have to analyze this product in conditions that are not in living animals after you have to have a sort of small animals or big size animals and by then you are going to humans that you are going to make trials but in three levels let's say you have phases it is until phase one phase two and phase three in order to go to commercialize and to be applicable some people skip the phases this is not so good and we had some some countries maybe want to skip them but this is not yeah maybe I understand this because there is maybe need to make all money but this can happen you know that means we had okay I give you an example what was the example the example it is about this covid and you have this kind of vaccines that they have been created very in the very quick time so it was not so much time but in order to have these trials and this delay if we have these trials from before it will be more secure about these vaccinations and so on so this that happened now we have created this and the people the society was anxious if the results are really true or really we were the experimental models so it's something like that we have really not to push we have really to take all our time and you know I'm living in Switzerland and Swiss people they are taking their time for reflection and everything because they like to have something good and solid by the end so this as well and yeah I prefer to have really good arguments and solidify the results in Switzerland we say there's no fire in the lake there is a fire in the lake as deeper they say smoke on the water because this happened in Motree and they wrote this song there so yes there is fire in the lake sometimes What do you think is the most fascinating topic at this conference Fascinating topics for me it is these photonics electronics because it is a new source of energy it start to be explored a lot and it is a new direction that we are going right now it will be nice really to know what this light is doing as well to the cells what they are doing how they are affecting our psychology because we know that light is very important and the people in the north when they have this black or a dark weather they are completely depressed so it means that it is very important but maybe we are not doing so much of experimental experimental work there and you like coming to the nanotechnology conference with your friends I adore it it is as you it is the same for me because you are meeting people it is a relaxed atmosphere you see all the new technologies how they are advancing it is very friendly because you can go out after you have dinners that everybody is intermigling you have social dances and even when you are drinking some kind of Greek spirits let's say Metaxa or maybe other so you are in a kind of euphoria so yes of course everybody would like to be in euphoria that's how you get new ideas exactly this told me my professor my tutor when I was starting my PSD and he saw me drinking a small uzo and he told me don't worry you can continue because ideas are coming like that and this is also a place to maybe start new projects of course projects you can have if you are aware about everything and you are informed and you have the good question let's say because you have to have a question not to do for doing if you have a question I believe in our days you can have thousands of solutions you have this technology that you can tackle the same problem from different ways and the problem is not a Ronaldo that is running out of you and you cannot catch you know we can catch everybody and it's really this is the good thing of our times of the new generation of scientists that are going to come that they have in their feet the tools for doing everything So I like those electronic tooth brushes and those kind of like water pressure kind of things and I wonder can you get like a smart tooth in the future with some kind of machine and then if you need more vitamins or if you need more some medicine or something it goes through the tooth Yeah it is not the vitamin and so yeah you can create this instead of to abolish let's say the toothbrush electric or the manual one and to abolish all these tooth pastes and so on maybe you can do something with the photonics or this new material graphene or whatever they have you can place it maybe during the night as they are doing for orthodotic treatment for people and you can have it and after you have a demacrobial modification in the mouth and you have not any reason after to brush the teeth because it's already clean so it's something like that that I can imagine in the future So you can have a graphene Yeah I don't know I'm not a specialist on the material now but I believe there you can have it, yeah This strange couple years what happened and some people say that there was nanotechnology and some of the vaccines and everything Do you think people are talking a lot about this at the conference They are talking actually I hear and I was reading interviews with Stereos because he developed some sort of mask for briefing and so on that they have this kind of utility the nanotechnology and of course fortunately the nanotechnology and the new technology for this advanced the genetics and so on they were so advanced because you saw the world producing bacteria vaccines that before we were need to have it in 3 years time or 4 or 5 so this was very quick and this quick we saved possibly a lot of millions of lives I believe that technology really help us and this is the good thing of science that we can say ok we can go of course science has to be dealt by people that are scientific not by politicians alone you have really to give a solid arguments and not to use it for any political decision going against so it is very dangerous but I believe we had a good balance during this one or one year and a half and the situation has been resolved the best way hopefully we are by the end now and don't you think sometimes the solution is in very old medicine and sometimes maybe it's better than doing some of the new crazy new stuff yeah I believe that you have to use both for instance I will take you an example you have the x-ray they invent the x-ray more than 100 years ago even more and you have developers now that you can have imaging systems that are very complex and these are adding more value and you can go in more details and so on but nobody has suppressed yet x-ray similar for this old medicine that you say or the medicine of my grandmother because she had this empirical medicine that people that were doing without dealing with the doctors still we are keeping this we are drinking tea or we say ok we have a problem something take this and take that so we are following this and of course we are using all these new advances from medical medicine and whatever is making you have a lot of students students I have a lot it is fortunately and unfortunately I don't know because it is a bigger responsibility first of all to have master students that they are trying to give their best and yeah that means we have the first prize from the university 3 times already and we have just recently in Prague there was a meeting specific on tooth and we have one of the PSD candidates took the first prize there so yeah we have students but they are doing well and I am happy for them that means for me I am the most happy person in earth if my students are doing well Does it happen that the students have crazy ideas I am not going to say crazy but very advanced and they are very ambitious want to do something and then you help them do it or you help them know what the limits are I tell you how it is when somebody is going because he cannot do whatever he likes because all this we are paying money to them and all this money are coming from grants so the student has to take a project that is according to the grant once you are giving this personally this I am doing I am leaving to read for one month and to instruct about this topic and after I am asking what is making turning on which of all this he likes to do because if he likes or she likes something more it is obvious that the result will be much better because he is going to work with more enthusiasm it is in the heart the topic of course there is this tendency to open up like that with ideas yeah I am reading this article and I am bringing this idea it is a kind of ventalia not as the Spanish Ventalia but this as well me or the more experienced people were there to close and to drive really in the target because you have to follow always to have the target you have not to lose your vision from where started from the beginning and this is the most important part to understand for the student that has to work towards one target and that is all of course we are not abolishing smart ideas if we say we say give a try see what is happening and so on it is not really to you have to leave the student to feel free as well to do his several things because he is creating his personality like that they want you want them to have the biggest impact and by having the biggest impact sometimes you have to be focused yeah the impact is coming for instance if you have a problem that is the COVID you have to look about tetanos you have to look on COVID and this you know they have to be pragmatic, realistic and to go towards this end and actually I can tell you this when I was in Yale I was in Yale for some period as postdoc and there was a very rich lab of Spiros Artavanis Chaconas and they had a lot of money and I was asking from the experiment you are so much money because they were spending a lot of money that Mia was coming from more modest labs in money from France that they have not and in France I adopt this Cartesian logic that means there is one fly on the world you know that there is so you have to focus to see where is the fly after in France they give you a gun with one bullet and you have really to take the target and if you are able you have really to kill this fly that is in the world with this one bullet in America this that I saw you know that there is a fly in the world you don't know where it is so you are going in Midrages and you are shooting to all world and you say ok the world is not existing anymore hopefully the fly as well so it was something like that for me so you have to be always focused in what is the question and this is going to give you the highest impact and for this you don't need so much money if you are really thinking carefully So can you apply the French fly gun method to the Americans? Yes of course and the Americans are applying but you know in some very rich labs that they lost the sense of money and so on yeah they say we have it why not to do similar in Switzerland but in Switzerland you have a control that means they are not allowed you to make this kind of extravagances Sometimes when I look at the Americans and the budgets and the profits it's so huge but sometimes I wonder to get scientific results and to get products that pretty change the world maybe you don't need that much that many billions maybe you don't need so many millions and so on it is a question really of balance always I will tell you what is happening in America you can be very successful and the limit is the sky after this is true but you have the opposite it's the bad if you are unsuccessful in America you can go to sleep under a bridge this is America no airbags you are going to Switzerland they give you money to make your dream a reality but you have two airbags one airbag on top so it's not sky your limit and one airbag down so you are never going to be left alone if you are failing in some project so you are in something between so maybe it's a cruelty in America but you can see much more successful people there because there is the sky in Switzerland you see but it's a collective effort of very big brains but they cannot reach as fast and as easy as in America to get a lot of money of some invention and so on can you make a bridge take the American money put it in Switzerland and then everything is good and you will be good for Switzerland yes of course I love this idea but they use their money more smartly they can dominate the world they can bring solutions that really help billions of people I believe that they don't want to dominate the world the Swiss people are very peaceful and they like to live in Switzerland but they like to live a comfortable life as well and this is giving the advantage of living a comfortable life but by having everybody allowing to have this sort of life that in some other countries in Greece right now or in Italy you have some people that they will dream of this life So what's the bridge between Greece and Switzerland for example how do you compare the systems In Greece it's completely different Greece is not it's a poor country Greece it's very rich in resources you have ok the sun that is you have the water and you have all these products by nature that are functioning really perfectly but industry is not existing in Greece in the same way we cannot compare now Switzerland on Germany or England or whatever else we are trying hard now we have the computers we have possibly this mathematical where it's going in the future science so people with very small money they can make possibly very important contributions So this is something now that they have to see it's not me I'm not a politician but this has to be seen by politicians in order to develop but it has to be a program of not even medium but a long term program 20 to 50 years to come and it has not to change every time with any government I don't want to go into politics right but is Germany having the best long term plan in Europe I will not say so because when we are speaking in the university in Zurich it is about 30 years ahead or 50 years ahead I was in England in London and I was there and they were going to do the courses after 20 years so I believe all countries they have all these very solid characters they have long plans and so on Greece as I said it is a new country because ok it was free let's say 150 years ago it's not so long and we have a lot of wars and Balkan wars and civil war and we have many things like that here to develop people in Greece are really willing to go ahead and they are going out they are learning a lot they are going to America, they are going to Germany they are going to London they are going to Japan even and so on I found some Greeks there so they are travelling everywhere and they like one day that their country is going to be one prosperous other countries in the world and sorry I don't want to go into politics but that's the EU system of funding research is it a great success does it need a lot of improvement for the EU I cannot blame the EU for something it is good for Greece and for Italy and for some other Mediterranean countries because right now the most of the budget for research and so on and development here is coming for projects that are coming from European community so I cannot blame European community for this because I don't know how could exist Greece and this so again this is without any political tonality in this I don't want to put any political but yeah the money that we are getting we are getting a lot of money because ok people are doing well here in Greece or the projects are competitive they are getting the money and after they try to lead by lead to improve things in Greece yeah alright does Switzerland work with the EU or is it outside it's outside there are some discussions if they have to join and so on but for when we have with our creating groups yes for research these that they are doing the confederation is giving money to if a project is successful and you are playing with other groups of Switzerland Europe they are giving you the money and you can realize together this project yeah yeah there is and you have these cooperations between different countries for instance they have Switzerland and Croatia now it's open Swiss Japan and so on so you have these third countries as well as they call less privileged let's say all these yes it's very nice thank you very much it's nice to see you again no it is good no it's ok it's fine ok go thanks a lot thank you and the chat I'll put you in a break for a second yes hey for anybody who is watching sorry for the wait I'm trying to queue up the next interview so just wait for a second there might be the what's called the lecture room is finishing up a couple guys coming out maybe I can get the interview in just a few couple minutes please wait longer