 Welcome once again to the Breakfast on Plus TV Africa. Our first major conversation for today goes to a review of the presidential candidates gearing up for the 2023 elections. About 48 hours ago, Bola Ahmed Timibu, former governor of Lagos State, of course shared that he had spoken with President Wama Dubwari and shared his intentions to run for the seat of president. Just yesterday, governor of Eboni State, David Umahi, made a similar statement. We're going to be having a conversation across those perspectives and of course even more. This morning we're speaking with Ibrahim Oshinoa, who's a former member APC presidential campaign. Good morning, Mr. Oshinoa. Thanks for joining us. Good morning, my dear brother. Good morning, the House. Good morning to you. Thanks for joining us. We also have Gideh Johnson, who's a chief lecturer at the Andrian Institute of Journalism. Thank you for joining us. Gideh Johnson. Good morning. Good morning to all of you. Good to have you. Good morning. Mr. Oshinoa. Good morning. Thank you. It's a pleasure to be with you. All right. I'm going to start with, before we get into the concrete discussions, let's get this question across board for both of you. When Bola Ahmed Timibu, of course, and one of the statements that he made, as I quoted as saying, saying that he wants to continue from where President Buhari has left off. He wants to continue with the president's legacy. What exactly does he mean? I'll start with Mr. Oshinoa, if you can respond to that before Gideh Johnson goes on. So what exactly does he mean by that? Okay. Good morning. Mr. Oshinoa, I would congratulate the leaders for hope and to declare this intention to lead that trip. I try to make this a lot by himself to serve this country at this very push time. That's by the fact that President Buhari has done a lot in terms of development, in terms of strategy, in terms of security, and many more. And what he actually meant by that is he will be showcasing in the forthcoming declaration. He will declare to the endurance at the appropriate time, in the very near future, he's going to address setting the agenda, declare his intention to the endurance, apart from the president who is the president commander in chief of our country, and a party leader, he will still address the endurance, because the ball stops at the doorsteps of ordinary endurance who are listening to us. So the declaration, what you're going to do by that, I will keep you to guess that or your public suspense so that when we let the cathartic be able to see our actual performance by that, but generally speaking, I can tell you for free that it's a good day for me. It really meant so well in terms of increasing the presentical potential of the country, increasing the global economic crisis, increasing the present solution to the global economic crisis that many of us are trying to solve, including extending what he has done in Lagos State to the national government, there are a lot of things that he meant about that. He's going to come on, he's going to announce when he's going to be there, and you journalists and every other stakeholder in this country will definitely invite, I will invite you personally and my dear brother, the other speaker, the lecture inviting you to declare, and questions can be posted on national issues and domestic issues, its agenda, its love for this country. We can take that word from Meshawar, he loves this country, he has built so many people, including the ambassadors, president, vice president, as well as other people that are in their sources. A lot is coming, but he's going to showcase me. Let's have GD Johnson also respond to the same question, you know, when Ashouadjou says he wants to continue with President Gohari's legacy and continue for where he stopped and some of all of that, before of course also mentioning that it has been his lifelong ambition to be president of Nigeria. GD Johnson, you know, what do you think that that means? I've seen people say that, that sounds like a threat. Well, as far as I'm concerned, everyone is free to aspire to any post that's the fundamental right that God has given to you, and the concern has provided for us long since we don't have any criminal code against you. We need to aspire to be the highest of these. I believe every Nigerian should aspire to become president of Nigeria, so that's his aspiration, that's his desire. However, I'm looking at what he said concerning that he's going to make a declaration to Nigeria. He has already declared, they use the platform of the state house to make that declaration. What, what are the declarations that we're waiting for? He has gone to see the, the, I don't remember that, it's the president that will have, that will determine who will become the president, and the governor of, like you said earlier, the governor of a point, state point yesterday, went on money to see the president, and if he's democratic, governance that will practice, I think that they should make their, their aspirations and their visions for Nigeria as far as I'm concerned, the president only has one. It is Nigerian without the term who will become the president, and the president belongs to, to the political party to belong to. However, it's Nigerian outside, whether they are ready to go along with that party, or they are not ready to go along with that party. With respect to him continuing the legacy of President Mohamed Bari. Yeah, which would be very interesting. Mr. Boshino has said, or not Boshino has said that he's going to invite us, and so that we can ask questions that I want to ask, because I want to know the legacy that he wants to continue about. Is it insecurity that we are being nurtured? Is it the economic crisis that we are being nurtured? Is it the various form of taxation that has been, and levels that have been imposed, that has imposed every putting on Nigerians in the last six years? If he wants to continue with that, and Nigerians in their own wisdom think that they want to continue with that, well, it's, it's left on Nigerians to continue with that, but on the last, he went right to tell us it's life, lifelong ambition. As far as I'm concerned, when the coast is clear, when this presidential candidate comes out, what we are going to ask them is their vision for Nigeria, not about their ambition. We have seen people that have aspired to become president, just for you to be on record that they are president of Nigeria, they're not in to shoot for it. I think moving forward in 2023, what would you ask the candidates that are fighting themselves to be the, what's your vision, beyond your ambition, what's your vision for Nigeria? What, what are you bringing to bear on the Nigerian citizen? What are you going to do for Nigeria, to take Nigeria forward? And those are the things that are the questions that we are going to ask, beyond our life-long ambition or not. Okay, so, so, also to just add in there, I'm also thinking that, you know, we need to move beyond the question of what the vision is, and that's how we, they intend to achieve this, because over time, we've seen several statements, I will do this, I will sort the economy out, I will give, you know, 200 million people a job, but the question is, how do you intend to do that? We need to be able to see, you know, the plan, step by step, you know, quarter by quarter, and day by day, if it's possible, on how they intend to achieve all of this. But let's come to Ibrahim Oshuono, what are the chances of the, I mean, what are the chances of Bola-Ahmad Tinnabu becoming the flag bearer of the APC? Now, looking at the political rank orders going on, all of the tussles in the APC, and the fact that you have all the peasants in the APC that also have interest of becoming, you know, the president, so what are the chances that he will become, you know, the flag bearer of the APC? Thank you very much for that question. You know... Mr. Oshuono, we seem to have lost you there, can you hear us clearly? Okay, maybe we'll probably just, you know, move the question to Gideh Johnson. Gideh Johnson, can you hear me? So the question is, do you think that, you know, Bola-Ahmad Tinnabu stands a chance of becoming the flag bearer of the all-progressive Congress, as regards the 2023 presidential election, looking at all of the issues with the APC at this point in time and all of the contending interests? Now, if you look at the political antecedents, it's a network, it's a political network, and the financial must do, which he has, the political leverage which he has built over the years, he has chances, he has chances as taking the ticket. However, if you look at the Nigerian political landscape, it is beyond having the resources. And we are recalling that in 1988 when Abyola aspired to become, to become the flag bearer of the National Party of Nigeria, I knew how it ended for Abyola. And from a historical point of view, and we have always had reluctant questions, it's not usually the leading candidates, I usually might, as the presidential candidate, I can go down memory lane. In 1978, Shagari wanted to be a senator. Shagari wanted to be a senator. In 1999, Abyola was not even interested in presidency, was trust on him. In 1993, Abyola did not have any aspiration of becoming president. In 1999, becoming the president, until all the presidential candidates were banned and the parties had to look for new candidates, that's how Abyola emerged from nowhere to get the SDP, the SDP ticket. If you look at 2007, Gya Agua was not interested in the presidency. 2011, Junatan was not interested. In 2011, Bwari wept and said, he's not going to contest the presidency, until they went to look for him in 2015. So, you check from a historical point of view, the president actually gets the presidential ticket of the party, and the president actually wins the election, and usually reluctant president, and not usually the leading candidate, that you have. Whether Shagari will be able to predict that things is there for us to see. However, if you look at APC, if you look at the dynamics of the APC, APC is going to have its convention this year. They're going to have presidential primaries this year. How are they going to manage those two major party functions? I don't know, and I hope to be able to, because the party that won the 2023 election is the party that comes out of its presidential primaries with less crisis, that is able to manage the party that wins the presidential election. So, its chance is in APC. Its eye, however, the dynamics and the murky waters of politics is beyond having the resources, is beyond having the network, is beyond having the leverage, and thinking that, well, I have the leverage, I have the network, and I have the resources to muzzle that in Nigeria, the Nigerian presidential ticket, and President has never shown that history, history is working against him in an utter sense, but I hope, let's see whether it will be the jinx breaker that you have in hand with them, with the present governor of Canada on the second one. All right, so I think- And you know, you're still with Ladojada, I think I'll be there on the second time against all odds. All right, so let's bring in Ibrahim Mushuwan or at this point in time. If you can hear me, what are the chances that Bola Akma Tinnibu will become the flag bearer of the UAPC? Okay, let me just quickly make this especially clear that I won't be able to make some few points or signing actuality chances becoming the candidate of our party. Like what my job directly said there, he has all the takes, he has all the purpose to be the leading candidate, and of course, elections, elections about winning an election for a party is also contributing to factors of you nominating a credible candidate, candidate across our board, from the North Central and North East, not West. Of course, that's what I do have there, but I will be a little bit cautious because a lot of people are still going to come out to contest. You can see the graph, Ladojada Ibrahim was there, who knows today who's going to come out next to contest? Who knows who's going to come out? And I can tell you for a few people, few governors, former governors are still coming, going to come out, declare their intentions to the president from the South West, from the South South and the South East as well. So the parameters for making a final judgment on who becomes a party candidate right now, of course, it's not really going to be substantiating. What I can say for now, based on my experience, what my job brother and the other side said there, Abila of course has been longing, you remember in 1993, he actually wanted to do context and election. In 1993, he has formed his own group and aspire. That's why hope 1993 is able to defeat all of them with his vision, with his experience in private sector, you know, coming into financial acumen and all the things. So I sure as all these things, it's well prepared, but we can't really consider, you know, give a final, I don't know who is going to clinch the ticket right now. Let all the candidates, he has, you know, he has also set a pace for who wants to come out now. You are free to come out, showcase. I'm calling on also, but not fire me. Who is also, you know, probably partially intending to contest for the office of president. He's a page dealer. Why not? Let's see people like that coming out, showing their intentions, then at the appropriate time, we'll be able to bring out the cast and the table that who is going to be this, who is going to be that. What are the chances for ABC? Comparing actually with David Humayne right now, I don't think it's appropriate in terms of, you know, performance, in terms of even political structure, in terms of even networking. Of course, you know, actually, of course, definitely it's on on on on the way should nine to 10. You understand? So I would like to keep few, you know, aims right now until we see other, you know, candidates coming out. What's up? You know, we see a lot of candidates not growing up. Yes, please. Mr. Sashino, is Ashowaju's ambition and, you know, the idea of him running for president, is that, you know, would you describe that as a way that the APC can hold onto power or what is actually best for Nigeria's next eight years? You know, you know, holding onto power does not depend on any political parties. It's all this, it's all Nigerians. You are not all determined. You know, it's a matter of number. It's a game of number. Nothing more will determine who is who is going to be the president. You know, don't forget after nomination from each parties, you know, you still going to go to the general people, tell them what your intentions are. If they are convinced, they will vote for you. If they are not, they will vote for the other side. So it's all Nigerians. You are not all determined who will continue to live. Of course, the present government has done its best and still doing, and at least credibly, well, I can say that the government, based on the circumstances and, you know, you know, global pandemic, you know, economic factor and the rest of it, that's so, so, so, affects this government. Yeah, but the government is... This is what I'm asking. Mr. Ashina, well, you would expect that the political party that truly loves Nigeria will put its best foot forward, either because they want to win the election or because they truly want to see a person that would move Nigeria to, you know, a better place. So would you say, you know, from what you've seen, that Volame Tinibu might be the APC's best foot or best candidate? Absolutely. Absolutely. You know that about them. He has the network, he has touched so many lives. You know, he has the, you know, background. He has the history of performance. Lagos is a very, you know, cosmopolitan state. So it's very hard to, if you can manage Lagos, the way he did at a time, you know, you can imagine, you know, for your allocation to be held on for so, almost about two years, and you were able to pay salaries, you were able to do so many infrastructures, set up, you know, pays. Every mentor in 1999, Lagos, it was a mess. Everywhere was a mess. It was a mess. He is able to, people, provide so many things in terms of investment, raise the idea from just mega 800 million to 32 billion every month and turn around so many things in Lagos state. So he is able to do that. And it has not been in office in almost about 12 or 13 years now, or more than, since student around seven years. He has not held any political offices. It was after so many, so many, so many, so many opportunities to, you know, he said no, they would like to stay in Nigeria and he would always love to build so many young talents. And that's what he has been doing. So from the North-South West, he has the network. He has the political appeal. He has the voting attraction. So if our party nominates him, why not? He's a good candidate. But of course, the party determines who flag is ticket and whatever the party at the end of the day does, that's what, as a loyal party man, that's what we're going to work with. And I trust the judgment of Governor Monee and for eventual, anybody that comes in at the party chairman, they would use all the votes and support our candidates with the election. Yes, Monee. Jini Johnson, do you agree that the APC is putting his best foot forward, you know, in the person of Bola Medinupu? And of course, Misha Musashino was an analysis, you know, that he has helped a lot of people and he has, you know, done that work. My brother is on my part of the world, he's on my part of Nigeria. There's a particular thing in Alokuda, like that time, the day you throw your hat in the ring to contest an election, that's when you will be picked and killed your grandfather. And then you knew whether somebody has run man in your family. And some of the hidden secrets that you never knew about come to the fore. It's interesting when this election comes into focus. And because we were asked questions, some of us were, I'm really question, you are true. And people tend to use leakers as a clue for the day. I don't know what leakers are talking about. There is Jack on the leakers, Austin Ngu, Fashola, Amber Deja, and there's some of those leakers. We brought these records to bear because people will just ban these some sudden things and they'll say, only fools are going to use. The evidence of what they've done with cut-off sentry with leakers would be what we used to serve as a test piece in asking them questions, whether they are the best for Nigeria or not. If what they have done in the last 25 years for a cut-off sentry in bakers, if it's good enough for leakers, then we see whether it's good enough for Nigeria. So we ask questions beyond, we have made people, we have done this, this is Nigeria, this is all of that, this is all of that. All of those is the questions we ask, we have that. What are the best candidates? Like he said earlier, there are other candidates that are to come, as I'm concerned, and I like his word, the one he said that firemen should come out. I see no reason why the vice president should also come out. I haven't done 20 years in public service and 12 years as a general of the federation and the vice president for the last eight years. So I think the vice president, Yamio Shibati, should throw his hat in the ring. Then I decided, let the space be open so that as many people that will come, then the party would decide who is their best candidate. If you ask me for a fact that who is the best candidate based on what we have, he has said that he has not done anything since 2007. I've died left as the governor of the state. So judging by that credential, you agree with me, and Yamio Shibati asks a better credential than Bola Meji Numbu, except we want to argue with proofs, except we want to argue with evidence. It's usually judging by that. Who has been involved in public governance? Who has risen to the point of a vice president, to the president for eight years? So that's my view concerning that. But let more candidates come up. Let people through to you. Let them do their art in the ring, and let the party members of it decide who should be the best candidate that will spread their flag against other flagbearers of other party. Okay. I'm sorry. Next, Ibrahim Oshun. Ibrahim, can you please just hold on for a bit? I'm coming to you now. But just to add, I was hoping that Gidej also would have answered that. The question of whether it's enough, I mean, it's okay to use the template of Lagos to judge the 36th state of the Federation, including the FCT, talking about different ethnic groups and different persons, resources naturally, I mean, differently and down, and all the peculiar issues that were faced with. So the constant reference to the Lagos template and the Lagos experience, using it to judge the entire country, I really don't know if that would actually work, because Lagos is Lagos, and we're talking about the 36 states now. The Lagos, the Lagos. That's number one. That's number one. That's number, it can't be meaning Nigeria. Lagos is a state in Nigeria. We understand that it's a very vast city. We understand the economic viability and what have you, but you can't use Lagos as one state to want to say, because you actually made progress in Lagos, it means you will make progress in talking about the entire states of the Federation. But that's on the one hand. The other question now for you, Mr. Ibrahim, is do you think that the president is fit? Because recently we have President Muhammad Bawari asking, saying that the work of the president is tiring. And looking at his age, you want to also tell that he's really tired. It can be so much. We've also had issues of health challenges with Bola Ahmad Tinnibu. So do you think that he's physically fit, he's strong enough to be the president of Nigeria? Now, quickly, let me quickly address what my dear friend and brother said, Mr. Ibrahim. Look, I'm a Lagosian too, but Lagos is not London. Lagos is Lagos. We are a lot around when he became the governor of Lagos. Let me tell you something about Ashwardo. You know, a lot of people have been, and it happens where you go, when you have what others does not have. Ashwardo is a special being. It's very rare. It's very rare. Among his colleagues that were governor in 1999, none of them, as of today, pulled the cloud or have the influx of tenacity that he has as of this moment. None of them. Go and check them. From 1999 to today, most of his colleagues are ministers, senators at the point. Still, they have no capacity that he will say. So there's element of jealousy, you know, everywhere for him. I can understand that. People, even in your community, when you do something exceptional, when you have ideas, when you have what it takes to make things around, when you have what it takes, do what others cannot do. You develop some natural enmity. Even in your close family, you have some sliders. So Ashwardo knows that. You know, I'm not saying he's a perfect man. He has his plot. I'm saying he's on the national TV. He has his plot. But for now, in Lagos, I can tell you that what he has done in Lagos is, for now, no record. In this country, no governance of his age, but in Caliban, some of his colleagues, none of them can match his status. And that's naturally yes for me. Now, let's go back to what Mr. Agides said about, you know, what he has done. When the campaign comes, I stated earlier, it's going to come up and tell you as agenda. I'm not going to say that for him. He's the one that wants to, I'm not telling us of him. The office of president is not a joke. He's not a chiseler. He knows what is at stake. You know, he's a leader in this country. He's not in Lagos alone. There's no way to be Ashwardo who steppes food. In Nigeria, in Africa, that nobody or hundreds or thousands of people will not get out to recognize him. That's what they call politics. That's politics. So it's having enemy in Lagos. Some will say he's not in Lagos and some will say it's this, some will say it's that. That is politics. I don't think so. So let's have you share your thoughts on the second question. Let's have you share your thoughts on the second question for the one-to-one. I'm coming, please, let me finish, please. Hold on, hold on, let me, please, let me finish. Let me finish, please. It's ready for that. We are prepared for the election. This is an election year. We are set for it. Now, Ashwardo is talking about his head. I don't know what, you know, a media needs to happen this, you know, I said it probably on the air, I just sort of, somebody's not doing what you're expecting to do. You tap down as medically unfit. How do you know somebody's medically unfit? It's the medical record that would determine. He went to London recently on a native surgery because that means it's not fit. It doesn't mean it's not fit. You can be your 40s, you can be your 50s, and you have medical talent. That's not, that's not, that doesn't mean that you are not fit for office. But when the time comes, like I said, then they will post questions to you. And I can tell you, it's ready to answer all the necessary questions because he asks for you. He said he wants to lead this country. So he knows what he's saying. But Mr. Jeneb, most of your questions and many other negotiations and engineers wants to ask questions. They should be patient. When it declares, set up his agenda, then you can query that. Do query it and the campaign council will respond appropriately. We need your vote. We want you to come from the first party primary. We are still coming to Nigeria. Who had the final say and final approval of who is going to become the president of this country? So it's very easy. Lagos, for instance, most of the GDP, Lagos GDP is modern, it's higher modern in so many African countries. I can mention and mention many African countries that the GDP of Lagos is a country. To lead Lagos is not a job. It's not a choice thing. So try to lead it in that. And till now, after living off it in 27, 27, till now, no, none of these age mates who are governors can still get, I can match this gas plan. So let's wait. You will still get a lot of things to hear from it. Like you said, obviously it's a bad news. It's a product. I'm saying it broadly. It's a product. And if Professor Jeneb wants to contest, it has to come down. What's up there? Let me come down. They don't see any agenda. If you don't know that, so that's what I mean. All right, hold on, hold on. Mr. Oshina, because of time, let's also go to G.D. Johnson to, of course, have his thoughts out there. Something I'll also quickly mention is, you know, you just mentioned that he went to London. That already has set a bad precedent for a person who is trying to be president of Nigeria. We've complained over and over about President Muhammadan Bari going to the UK for medical treatment. Bala Mettinibu did not fix any healthcare in Lagos. Good enough for him to receive treatment here in Lagos that he loves so much. He still goes to London for medical treatment. And that already, you know, should be a red flag to any Nigerian. G.D. Johnson, quickly show your thoughts just before we wrap up. The Lagos, they are referring to as a country that couldn't put the health sector in place when to receive a treatment in Lagos. As far as I'm concerned, I have no regret for Oshina. I have an admiration for his political sagacity. Not that about that. I mean, not a proof of some style to governance and politics. To politics. But when it's time, like I said, we surely ask those questions. And when people are saying that the Tinnumun made this, Tinnumun made that, Tinnumun did not make anybody. It's Lagos. If Oshiba Jyudidot performed critically well as an attorney general, would he use him for the second term? Would he recommend it for the third term? Would he recommend him for the fourth term? It's like people saying, okay, your friend if I really does meet in Numbu or somebody made somebody, or Bari made somebody, nobody can make anybody. And some of these things that people use in the political landscape is insulting and degrading. The fact that I worked under you or you recommended me for a post, if I'm not good enough, you would recommend me. So it's a symbolic relationship. You contribute to me, I contribute to you. And that's the way I see it in the political, in the political landscape. As far as my colleague has said, it's a Lagos, it's like a country. And we have said it. They said, oh, there are no people that have this political, no doubt about that. No doubt that across the set of 1999 governors, some of them are still in church nationally. And I've said it over time on national TV that the major problem we have with our fourth report week is the class of the governors. The class of the governors that we have had in 1999. And all these people, they come out. I tell them, when they come out, we ask them to come out with the code of conduct, the rule from the field in 1999. They form the field as the asset declaration. That's the one who asks for when it comes to that. Because moving this nation forward is beyond using rhetorics and playing on sentiments. Oh, we build this person, we make Lagos to be a Dorado, we make Lagos to be this, or we make people, we have made ambassador. We don't need that. What we need is someone that will turn Nigeria around. When was United Arab Emirates, when was it established as a country? These people go to London for medical facilities. When was it like that? It was not like that before. The King of Saudi Arabia used to come to University College of Hospital in the Padreau. Same for Louti here in Nigeria. So we want to turn around in Nigeria. Beyond personality, we want to talk about policies. We are talking about personality. And when people talk about personalities, they gloss over public policies. And it is policies that shape the life of people. So I'm not interested in talking about personality. What are their policies and what are their acts? And we will situate their policies of what they have done, their antecedent. All right, Judy Johnson. You know what I'm saying? They antecedent to see what they would do for us in the future. Those are the questions we are going to ask. They are going to ask them questions. All right, we would have to go down. With respect to what they have done, what they have opportunity, and what they would do for Nigeria. Absolutely. Judy Johnson would have to wrap up here. Ibrahim Moshino, we always enjoy speaking with you. Judy Johnson, same also. Thank you both for speaking with us this morning. And as of course we inch closer and closer to the elections, we would love to have another conversation with the both of you. Have a really, really great day ahead. Thank you. All right. Stay with us. Moving away from politics now to talk healthcare. There is a Simeon Surge in the Las Afiva cases and fatalities here in Nigeria. That's where we get into next here on The Breakfast on PlawstTV Africa.