 I want to start with Amy Varone. Amy is one of my favorite people. We share an affinity for Roosevelt and Roosevelt's 19th-century journey across the American West. Amy is the chief of cultural studies at Sycamore Hill, which is, as you know, the great mother load of Roosevelt, Vienna, and Valerie Nailin and I have had the chance to go to Sycamore Hill a couple of times and to work with Amy and others there on the digitization of the Theodore Roosevelt papers at Sycamore. And Amy has an open invitation to come back here as often as she wants. She's going to talk for a few minutes about life in the White House, life above the shop, life above the store for the Roosevelt. So I should just tell you that she had a Rooseveltian experience in getting here. She flew to the Bismarck yesterday to be with us and was rented a car to drive to Dickinson to be at the opening little dinner that we had last night for the presenters. And halfway from Bismarck to Dickinson, she had a flat tire. And so luckily, everything worked out all right. But Roosevelt would be proud of you for persevering because of that little crisis. Thank you. Anyway, let's begin with Reichenbach's tour of Amy's world. Thank you. I'm inviting you to come and spend two hours talking to you about the Roosevelt in the White House. I'm somewhat less happy when he was like, two hours, no way. I'm going to talk first about most probably the most important achievement of the Roosevelt's dwelling in the White House, and that was to oversee the renovation of the building. The White House is both a family space and, of course, a public space. And in its position as sort of the nation's face to the world, Washington has a big impression on foreign visitors for the diplomats, sort of the structural face to go with the empire that these folks talked about earlier today. Cornerstone of the White House was laid in 1792. It was designed by James Hogan in Irish and American, the work of George Washington, to lay out the initial design. What I find fascinating about the White House is that every person who's lived there has changed it. Of course, the biggest change for the White House came in 1812 when the British burned it. The stressor itself did survive the stone exterior, but the entire inside wasn't gutted, but rebuilt, obviously, and improved. By the 1920s, it had these colonnades added on the other side of the building to provide sort of formal entry to the building, guests would come and walk up on the colonnades to, usually to the east side. By the 1860s, when Lincoln was president, they had started adding conservatories on the west side of the building, mainly for entertainment and to have parties to grow some food through the house, but really just for entertainment. I find it fascinating that the country was at war at this time, and yet there is no fence on the White House. There's nothing to keep people out. And throughout the entire 18th century, 19th century or whatever, the White House was treated as a public park by the citizens of Washington, D.C. And even in the 1890s, the place was unfenced. After two assassinations of presidents, the place was unfenced. It was not until one of these visitors walked into the family garden area and picked the Cleveland's baby roof up out of her carriage that a fence was put up. And it began to be limitations in the access to the house. 1900, they had been talking in Washington for more than 10 years about renovating the White House, just both in terms of upgrading family space. The more important they're looking at is ceremonial purposes to house. Congress allotted half a million dollars for this project, and they selected Charles McKinn, who was the head architect in New York firm, Kim Mead White, to come and do the actual design. This is Charles McKinn in the middle with his partners, William Mead and Stanford White. They worked with Mrs. Roosevelt. They did not work with the president. He was busy running the country. And she worked with them both in planning the family spaces, but in looking at the functional necessities that the White House lacked at the time. This is the first floor of the White House. Any of us who have watched West Wing probably seen this. Basically, visitors could come in through the North of Portico, and to vestibule the East Room, which of course is very famous, the color rooms in the back, and a state dining room, a family dining room here also. This is the Portico, the vestibules it looks in, right at 1900. As I mentioned, every president has left a mark on the house in the 1870s, Chester Arthur, that New Yorker had hired the New York firm of Tiffany Company to design stained glass windows for the entrance hall, which actually prevented people from seeing to the other hallways and other rooms. This is a color illustration that gives you an idea of the impact of that impact. By 1900, this was considered old fashioned. It was out of sync with what they were looking for in the White House. With the Kim leading the project and Mrs. Roosevelt's input, the renovation of the White House basically was done in conjunction with something called the McMillan Plan. Washington, DC in 1900 was basically accessible, which is a rude thing to say. Streets were unpaved. They had open sewers around the White House and the mall. It was considered a hardship posting for the diplomatic corps. The British especially, they had permission to wear tropical outfits and shorts because the weather was so easily. And this was mainly because Congress only met in Washington in like October through May. Once the summer started coming, Congress returned and they left town and it was just the citizens who had to suffer for the city. It wasn't until, I think it's 18, 1916, when Woodrow Wilson kept the Congress in session all summer. They had to sit through July and August in Washington while they considered the income tax legislation that they finally came to realization and admitted, yes, something had to be done and they had to spend money on upgrading the city. There is still concern of the McMillan Plan was an effort by Congress to look at the layout of the city and to figure out how to make a ceremonial city that was worthy of these dreams of empire and worthy of competition with European capitals. So what they did, instead, there were actually people saying we should go to palace with the president, copying Versailles, there were people who said, no, no, that's a bad idea and what they came up with was the idea of a classical architecture, a neoclassical Greek revival style harkening back to the Greek democracy and how its ideals could represent the United States in this new era. Since we see it's quite a change from the previous sort of arcade amusement park look. To the classical entry hall and this is the style that the White House has really been kept in for the last century. This is the picture of the East Room which of course is the main ceremonial space. There was a rather famously remarked that it looked like the lobby of the Willard Hotel which was just down the street and this is the lobby of the Willard Hotel. And you can see, yes, it does look just like that. So it too got a sort of Christian revival redo and they took out the stuff furniture, they opened the space up and it's become very adaptable. That they can move tables in for presentations, they can move seating in. Mrs. Roosevelt instituted a series of musical events and they were adjustable as they needed to be whatever programs were offered. This is a frightening picture of the Blue Room which is an oval room. It's one of the little reception rooms in the back, a little bit green on the red room. And it got, I think it was the most immediately reliable hotel. And it's much more lovely in these colored postcards. I do have to confess, this is a red room and it was also that redone in the 1870s by Tiffany and Company and I like this. I think they should have kept this, but they didn't. They went for a while on us and started putting in portraits of the presidents and the first ladies throughout the first floor. This again looks like a little hotel, it is the East Room and at the time that the Roosevelt's moved in it only held 60 people for dinner. Obviously that's not a very big state dinner and again they opened up the space, they took out a wall between a hallway and such and it was spannily and it would seat over a hundred. Of course, one of the few areas that T.R. got anything he wanted was in the decoration of the state dining room. And that is with the hunting trophies? Which were his hunting trophies. We were close up to some of them. I particularly like the bear. He looks very happy to be there at dinner at the White House. But there were some people who did not approve and this was a commentary and newspaper notice thing. All of the animals had T.R.'s face so they could not actually eat anyone who came to dinner. This is the family dining room which is the last main room on the first floor there and you can see the love of all paper that was put in, I think it's by Mrs. McKinney. But that room also got a facelift but I think the most amazing thing at the end of the renovation was that all of the rooms looked alike. They were actually matched fairly well throughout the building. Just going to give you a quick look at the second floor. We're not actually going to visit the second floor. But you can see this is the problem. This is what Mrs. Roosevelt felt that they were living on above the store. Here are family bedrooms on the west side of the building and here are government offices basically on the east side of the building. A press would come and hang out in the hall and talk to the kids, the kids were playing. Foreign dignitaries were often the targets of the Roosevelt children and their spitballs which was also not a plus. And they didn't really change the rooms up here much. Mrs. Roosevelt simply shut them all out and all of the government functions were removed from the upstairs and moved to the new wing. This is the White House. You can see those colonnades which were really ornamental earlier became actual wings. This is the east wing. It became a formal training area for the public. Previously, carriages had just come by and dropped people off at the end of the colonnade and they'd walk in and there was not enough cloak room. There was no one to organize the coming and going visitors. This new east wing actually had a series of cloak rooms and had an electronic connection to the stables where the carriages would park. And so as guests would park, they could actually send a note, send a message to the stables of which carriage should be brought up in live order so that they'd brought a lot of order and function to the White House. It's really on the west wing that we are most familiar with the White House now. It's even served to the client for us. When the Roosevelt's moved in, there were these large conservatories and they'd been built in various stages. Since the 1840s, they were all disassembled. There is, you know, human crying in newspaper that, oh, they were wasted, they were thrown at the tellmaker or something, but they weren't. They were reassembled at different places in Washington, D.C. You can still, if you go to Washington today, visit one of these conservatories. It's right by a reflecting cold little, the capital, and most of them are shipped off to the National Arboretum, but they put in new office buildings, new office structures, and this became the formal west wing. The executive office building housed the president and his cabinet meeting spaces that housed his clerk's offices, which I'll show to you as far as I'm concerned. Staff areas, you know, he said the president's office, which is over in that far corner, is not oval. The old office doesn't come into the White House until the later Taft administration, and even five years after the Roosevelt's expanded the space, the workspace, they needed more workspace, and so Taft expanded it, and what he covered up was, I'm sorry, this is an image of the President's office, but what Taft covered up was the Roosevelt's Tennis Court, that Mrs. Roosevelt was concerned that the president would just basically sit around too much, and so she actually told people when they came to visit him to go outside and get tennis balls with him. So he would meet diplomats, he would meet government officials out getting tennis balls back and forth on this sandy court outside the office. His door was just outside over there, but he could go directly out of there. He could also bother all the staff and get tennis balls against their windows, which is not funny. His unofficial advisors, his just sort of friends in the White House and the newspaper men, they were actually known as the Tennis Court Cabinet, because they were the common hangout and talked with them behind the scenes, the way FDR would have had a kitchen cabinet, who used to come and sit in the ice cream in the kitchen. But when they left the White House, these group of friends got together and they gave him this sculpture of a cougar and finding a man named Alexander Proctor and just wanted to keep that in mind for later. Mrs. Roosevelt ran, not just the White House, but she ran Washington Society and the position is First Lady and speed up just a little for the number of members looking at him anyway. Life in the White House is very formal and there were invitations for any and everything. You didn't just drop in on the president anymore, you couldn't just jump over the fence and come in, you'd get arrested, which is a good thing, probably. But there were lots of it. They were entertained all the time and there were formal invitations to everything, whether it was a steak dinner or a bowl or even a garden party. Mrs. Vue, the garden party at Safflon, the president. He went somewhere, he went in a carriage with a livery coachman and footman. He didn't just go out and visit his friends anymore. I know this is going to get said to a lot of people here, but he loved riding, as we all know, and he did go riding almost every day, certainly several times a week, but he did not choose to use a western saddle. He didn't wear cowboy boots. He wore a formal riding attire and you can see it almost in the picture. He wore John first and he wore a bridal coat. He had a blanket with his initials engraved on it for the horse. Even worse, guests who went along and received a little card, it was a protocol instructions, rules of the road for riding with Roosevelt. And he literally got handed a little card and it said things like, whoever the president chooses to speak to must ride on his left, slightly behind him, the right stirrup, behind the president's left stirrup. When the president was done talking with you, you were to fall back and the next person would come up and take your place. It was a very formal sort of activity, which I know is really keeping it in the market kind of stuff. I just wanted to show you who lived in the White House, of course. It was Joseph Roosevelt and her husband, Theo Roosevelt. He was a portraitist by Francis Benjamin Johnson, who was a Washington society photographer, had great access to the White House from the 1870s into the 1910s. Alex Roosevelt was her brother, Ted. That's Ted with Eli the Blue Macaw, who was one of innumerable pets who lived in the White House. Kermit with Jack Dawg, who was Theo Roosevelt's favorite dog of the dozens that they had, his sister, Ethel. Archie Roosevelt on his bicycle and then Clinton Roosevelt who was sitting on Archie's pony, Algonquin. Algonquin made the news, he's the pony that got to ride the elevator in the White House, that the White House staff loved the Roosevelt cats. And he had no problems helping them sneak the pony upstairs to visit Archie when he was sick and helping in their other little escapades. This is actually my favorite White House portrait. This is Jack, I vanished in the yard at the White House and William Kleinings, who was a Washington society photographer and took lots of pictures of the TR. One of the times he became a photographic president in the White House, Mrs. Roosevelt had to go out and photograph Jack in the yard. I'm just, obviously Jack deserved this portrait. Formal portraits, there were formal portraits done of Roosevelt in the White House that are in question now. This is a portrait of Mrs. Roosevelt, painted by Cecilia Bow of the Philadelphia portrait painter. And notice her daughter Ethel is in the picture and Ethel was not supposed to be in the picture, but Ethel just kept coming and sitting with her mother and sitting with her mother and sitting with her mother and getting in the painter's way basically. So she added her to the painting. Before you go on camera, I asked about the tusks. Yes, this is the North Room at Sagamore Hill, this is a room that was added in 1905 in the major company. The short tusk is one of the elements that TR shot in Africa on this far, in 1909 and 10. The taller tusk is one of a 10 foot high pair of tusks we had at work, a gift to him from the King of Siam, actually. We borrowed this portrait 15 years ago, we were a bit of a borrowed for a while from the family. It's still in the family, instead of in my country, it's at Sagamore Hill. This is the official portrait of the president, painted by John Singer Sargent, and talk about annoying portrait painters apparently. Sargent kept annoying TR all day because TR was used to sort of being the man in charge. And he had Sargent following him around, and at first they posed in the old office behind the desk, and then he didn't like those sketches. Then he posed him outside, he didn't like those sketches. Then he posed him upstairs in the hall, he didn't like those sketches. And so TR was coming downstairs to a meeting, and Sargent was coming back in to paint him some more, and TR just sort of slammed his hand in the background and said, aren't you done yet? And Sargent said, that's it, hold that pose. And so he painted him on the steps of the William House. Now just one quick diversion, and then we'll stop. To go back to that state diagram, you can't tell, the postcard's not clear enough, and I couldn't find a picture of them. But here on the White House, here on the mantle, there are lion's heads. You know, lions are very conventional in architecture. They show up a lot as decoration. And TR didn't like them. He didn't think they should be using lions for architecture in the United States, because there aren't any African lions roaming freely in America, or there shouldn't be any. He actually said that he knew it was convention, but he thought that we shouldn't follow convention because when it was silly. And even now it's a little New Yorker. TR did not like the great lions that are in front of the New York Public Library. He said they look like they're having an epileptic fit. And if they were a disgrace to fit, they haven't worked. And trust me, New York, that can get you wish. And the unfortunately worse ones. What he did like a buffalo, as you all know, of course. And we had a number of buffaloes. This is a buffalo head. It's in the north where I'm staying. And Mark Hill, it's one of two when I decided to fire a place. We also have a buffalo art throughout the house. This little statue, which he bought at Tiffany's, is actually sitting in a full case position so that he could look up from his desk. And it sat in front of a portrait of Mrs. Roosevelt, which is his favorite portrait of her. So he could look at his lung and his buffalo at the same time. I'm short, no. Anyway, sorry, we've lost the last two slides. What happened was that TR went to that man, Proctor, who had done the earlier mountain lion statue. And he said, I don't like these lions. I want to see them replaced. So when he had objected to the lions, Edith and Charles and Kim, he does laugh at him. But he had Proctor carved buffalo heads and cut out marbled lion heads from the safe dining room fire place and put the buffalo heads in their place. And apparently on the last day of his administration on March 4th, 1909, as they were leaving the White House, he said, oh, Edie, I have something to show you. And marched her into the state dining room and showed her that he had put his buffalo there. Anyway, I'm sorry, I don't see the picture. First of all, thank you very much, Edie. Thank you for taking up the time. I would please take that stool with you, if there are steps to the ground because of the paint. But we so appreciate, Edie's the chief of cultural resources at Saganmore Hill. Your boss is here, too. Yes, my boss is here. He's hiding in the back. He's the superintendent of Saganmore Hill. We're delighted to be here. He's got to say one word about sculpture. You know, Proctor has two TR sculptures in North Dakota. One is the equestrian through Roosevelt that up in Mayot and Roosevelt Park, you've probably seen it at the United States Fair, that there's an equestrian statue of TR in Mayot. And that there's a miniature of that same equestrian statue in Madad, in front of the old MPD boat, where the Five Nations Art Gallery is. That's a miniature of Proctor. Proctor was a very prolific sculptor. And the other large-scale equestrian identical to the one that's in Mayot is in downtown Portland at Roosevelt Park there in front of Roosevelt Hotel. So Proctor is a very big deal. But let me just quickly, before we get to Steve Gordy, say this much, next year, we at Dickinson at the Roosevelt Center are hosting the National Theodore Roosevelt Association Annual Meeting. That's the group of Roosevelt lovers and advocates who live all over the world and they gather once a year in October to celebrate Theodore Roosevelt. And Dickinson State, largely the work of Sharon Hills, are applied to the TRA that they would come here next fall for their annual meeting. And we were delighted to discover that they'd agreed. So they're all coming here a little bit later, but next year at this time. And we'll be hosting them. And we'll be doing some of the activities out of the Dora and many of them here. We have a couple of very special things we want to do. Let me just tell you about one, because any of you talk about the sculptor reminded me of this. Well, on the 4th of July, 1886, Theodore Roosevelt came to Dickinson and he delivered the 4th of July oration here. You're probably aware of that. I regard that as his first grade national speech. That's the one where he said, like all Americans, I like big things, big prairies, big forests and mountains, big wheat fields and railroads and herds of cattle too, big steam boats and factories and everything else. It was a big speech about America's physical greatness. And he then said, of course, with that physical sublimity comes a moral responsibility, become a nation equal to the mountains and the rivers and the grandeur of this continent. He gave that speech here at Dickinson when Dickinson was just a village. In fact, it was the first ever 4th of July celebration in Dickinson and that speech was delivered. So what we wanted to know was where did he deliver the speech? Well, thanks to our own staff, we have discovered, it was Carl Larson, America's professor of English here, discovered that the speech was actually delivered on what's now the County Courthouse lawn. So where you know the beautiful Star County Courthouses, I think it's one of the most beautiful pieces of architecture in Western North Dakota. Right there on the southwest corner of that lawn was the spot where Roosevelt delivered that speech. So what we're going to do when the TRA comes is unveil a sign, a plaque and we hope the first pedestrian statue of Roosevelt in North Dakota is an equestrian statue, but there's no pedestrian statue of him just standing. So we're going to have a competition and we're going to have a pedestrian, slightly larger than my statue of Roosevelt, but it will be commissioned for him in 1886 as a young man, not as the adult Roosevelt, but as this young, somewhat greedy Maverick cowboy. And we're going to then unveil that statue and that sign and that plaque in cooperation with the city of Dickinson, Star County, and the Theodore Roosevelt Center at Dickinson State University. It'll be the first pedestrian statue of Roosevelt that was coded for the only statue of Roosevelt from that era, from the 1880s. So that's going to be a huge and wonderful feature of next year's Theodore Roosevelt as opposed to put that on the last week in October and Dickinson will have something really extraordinary to show. Now, I'm the assistant professor of political science, Stephen Doherty. Stephen Doherty is going to come up here and give us a few minutes on the square deal, Professor Doherty. Thank you, Mike. Yes, I'm going to talk a little bit about the square deal. I'm familiar with this term. Some of you might be the first time you've encountered it. I think the square deal can be thought of in two ways. First of all, Roosevelt's a basic, domestic program. I hope that this presentation can discuss in specific some of what Roosevelt achieved as president, some of the legislation, some of the programs, some of the objectives he wished to achieve. But the very name of it, the square deal, indicates something else. A square deal may be the union between governments and the individual. The individual might have a fair shot. Roosevelt ceases not just in terms of specific programs and that sort of thing, but more in terms of these programs will allow each and every American, in his view, the chance to achieve, the chance to take advantage of their skills and abilities and to make the most of their life. That's the least the way perhaps an individual gets to be. He first used it in his 19th campaign. He first used the term, go understand and run for office and it was a very successful candidacy of the presidency. As you know, his first term had come at the death of William Kimmel, his second term he turned to the very successful re-election campaign. Before I get into the square deal, though, I'd like to just speak for a few minutes about why the Roosevelt and his policies are so important. Why is it we're having this symposium? I would ask all the people to come and thank you for coming. How many of you would be excited about coming to a lunar film work? I don't know if you'd be here. I don't quite... In some ways, I don't think they achieve some of the things that Roosevelt did and that's why we honor him and that's why we have such a bunch of focus, attention on him. What makes him such worthy of this status though? We're going to create a story that's going to be discussing some of the specifics of his life and things like that. But as a political scientist, I'm always interested in what fable of self-identity is about. I don't know if you'd be here. I don't quite, in some ways, I don't think they achieve some of the things fable of self-identity, institution of presidency, how do you change American politics? I think he wasn't basically the right person at the right time. I think he had the right qualities and the right concepts of leadership to accompany a whole lot of social change, economic change, and things that were happening at that particular time. Some of these qualities included simply his gift for leadership and his talent for innovation. Roosevelt was, in some ways, unlike perhaps the individuals I've discussed before, just a great person for the purpose of getting people to follow him and he kind of made that. He was wonderful at gestures and activities and the creation of persona that people wanted to follow. He had that particular skill that he knew, rather than just to go, he wanted to start with. And he knew the dramatic gesture, the way he knew this umbrella, the bold speech, the smile, all the things that he was able to do there, that sort of gift of leadership, the need for people to follow him. He cultivated it with some of the grand years since he did it in his life, when he charged up San Juan Hill, come out here to the West. Come out here to the West and associate himself with the West at a time when most people were beginning to move away from kind of physical activities and strenuous activities he even kind of reveals in it. That creates an attractive persona. Another thing about him was he was a great innovator. There was another part of him, the leader. Parade Arnold doesn't screen copyright anything because I actually got some of this information from his book. Some of the things he did as president were new and exciting and interesting. He was the first one to manipulate the mass media in press conferences. He would also consult excellent social scientists and bring the White House finding new policies by new ways of approaching things. He had this sort of grand ability and innovation. He also, I think, was very, very capable of grasping the world around him, especially the social and economic change that was taking place. It wasn't all that it takes over. At a time of the turn of the century that particular kind of calendar issue was accompanied by just a massive change in American economy, American society, the world, technology, all these sorts of things. So he has this ability to truly grasp the world around him. I always maybe used a caveman metaphor. At some point in our prehistoric history there was a caveman who knew what demands looked like. He knew what it was through the spirit. He knew how to cut and sit and turn it into something that his private eating was probably greatly on him because of that. And in some ways Roosevelt knew how to deal with the struggles of his time, maybe the great man of his time. Now some of these new forces include, and I think they would all culminate in a progressive movement, first of all in insuring economy. This is a time when America is industrializing, reaching the point in its industrialization where you have unlimited growth that we saw in the past, the amount of carving off the wilderness and harvesting natural resources and doing those things. It's beginning to be short. The economy is getting more consolidated around a few industries and not as much violent growth as you're seeing in earlier times. That has to be dealt with. He's also dealing with a much more educated and literate and informed population. There had been educational reform. There had been more people seeking education, learning to read, paying attention to politics, paying attention to government, having their informed reviews on what government can achieve. So he's dealing with a different type of person. Previous to this, I don't know if as many people have been interested in politics, or if you're reading about it, his literacy was not that high at a different population at this time. We also see an active labor movement at this time. Working people are beginning to affiliate, to organize, to press employers. This phenomenon is happening around the world. It's happening in the United States. This is something Roosevelt is dealing with. In a general sense, dealing with a larger little class than the previous to this, it's something very simple. There are some wealthy individuals who've been around the world, and a lot of, we call them getting class, and not very wealthy people who simply kind of try to survive. We have now a middle class. We have individuals, not of either class, beginning to become more literate, beginning to script themselves, beginning to start to make demands on politics and government. Roosevelt sees these people, he sees the possibility of utilizing these people to create a new presidency, a new type of political party, just a whole new approach to government. This is part of his genes, this is part of what he sees. This progressive movement, Roosevelt is part of it, and will attempt to harvest it for purposes of both changing the country and also empowering himself politically, using these folks as a way of creating a powerful place for himself, a powerful new platform for the president. What were some of the things that were needed to be acted on with the square deal? Obviously concentrated wealth was no major issue. This still was a time where there was a huge amount of wealth invested in the people. Think of Jake Morgan, think of Maddie Carnegie, think of people like that who literally had billions of dollars, and many people still had a very big income at this time. So you have this concentrated wealth. Jake Morgan famously had to carry on to the stock exchange, an indication just about the power of the concentrated wealth he had. This is something the middle class has been making some changes on, and this is something Roosevelt has seen potential, great potential in dealing with these issues. Also the development of monopolies in a similar vein, much of the economy was concentrated around a few large companies, U.S. Steel, all of these companies had a monopoly that is no competition, completely dominating these particular industries, because it happened in the economy decades before that. This is preventing wealth from being spread around to as many people as Roosevelt would see, but also he sees it as no competition, Roosevelt being the person who believes in the square deal, equal chance, likes the idea of people needing an opportunity to take advantage of their skills and not lose our course, definitely trust sometimes they call definitely a challenge to that, so he sees that as a serious problem. Also, this is a time in our history when we're starting to see more pollution, environmental degradation, we're starting to see the negative consequences of industrial development, we're starting to see wider pollution, forest being stripped, things like that, I think some of the other panelists might mention this as well. It's happening, at least we're proceeding, and of course, Roosevelt, as you know, is a nature, when you enjoy nature and hunting and things like that, it has a sense about this, but he knows that this is also becoming a major concern. We're also seeing, at this time, mass produced goods, going into this type of economy that's producing more consumer goods. In 1800, people probably produced most of their own clothing, most of the things they needed to live. They caught and grew their own food. Now we're starting to see mass produced products, especially food, drugs, things like that. These are not always being produced in the most safe, cleanly way. There's a great bucket this time, I'm kind of familiar with, the horrific count of what life was like working the Chicago stockyards and people eating the products that came out of that. So this is another one of those particular problems that Roosevelt sees at the time. So Roosevelt, running for office in 1904, makes these, his major issues, makes these kind of the major focus of his promise to the voters and went in power. He will successfully push through many of these programs. Some of them include the Food and Drug Act, the first act that deals with those unsafe consumer products, that deals with the shy medicine, the bad food, the tank food, the unsafe consumer products that passed on Roosevelt's first term. He also strengthens the ICC, the Interstate Commons Commission. It is the first inter-tent trust organization. It's the first kind of business, an economic regulatory agency that we have in the country. Roosevelt makes it much stronger than he has it for and empowers it to attend more action against monopolies, against decreased competition. Roosevelt, as you know, is a famous trust buster within the course of his time in office, in those monopolies. Also, the Elkins Act, which is a defense of public land, tempted to take certain land, they will take it off the markets of the conservative, prevent it from being turned into a natural resource market that allows this for other purposes, for later use, perhaps for recreation and other things like that. So those are some of the specific programs of the square deal. What exactly is he hoping to achieve? So I'd like to address some of the things that he hopes to achieve with these programs. First of all, I think he wished to preserve capitalism. Roosevelt, at his rudeness despite being a progressive, still a believer in private property and capitalistic endeavor. But he saw in the trusts and the corruption in some of the problems that private industry was exhibiting at the time a possibility that capitalism might be undermined for later ambitious people to use to achieve things as Roosevelt felt he had. He went quite well for himself. He was a great radicalist. He was a great radicalist. Keep in mind the politics of the time of the high kind of attractiveness in certain areas of the world, of ideologies that Marxism and things like that and some communitarian ideologies that Roosevelt wishes to keep from coming to America because he doesn't agree with them, but he thinks that capitalism is going to be unrestrained and continuing to have these problems then it's not going to be good for capitalism. He wishes to have the labor movement become perhaps more patrolled, less radicalized, more willing to kind of sit down and become a partner with business and help set by major reforms. They will be offered the square deal from the chance to compete, the chance to do well on their own development, wanting to of course take over the entire system and things like that. I think he links free enterprise and the preservation of capitalism also to patriotism and nationalism. Roosevelt had a passion was as earlier this morning people discussed the great desire to make America a huge power for us to go on our grand adventure to succeed in becoming the great power he thought we were and divide the country, class driven country country with that type of feeling a strong power needed to work in the middle class to be behind some of the things he wished to achieve for the country. Also protection of environment for the recreation of the strangest life that he himself would develop to build in his ability to balance his own strength and that he wanted more people to do that and he wanted that land available for other people to do the same and he came here of course in nature he saw that as kind of a proving ground in to be able to achieve the potential so he wanted to see that in particular if you're willing to say. And I think in a political sense what he wanted of course was a strong middle class following. This was where he saw his potential support coming from. Up to this point Roosevelt had dealt with a politics in this country and politics that was largely regional in quality regional divided by region north, south, west he wanted to create a national constituency. He also wanted to have a base on support for himself and his presence. These programs would reach out to the people get support for him. Previous to this had truly been a partisan type of politics the politics of patriots, the politics of parties voters voting for the party first and the candidates second. Roosevelt for the first time offered them an attractive charismatic figure with which to identify outside of their own parties. He was a Republican and a part of that but he wanted to have that sort of a following not just people voting because they liked the party. And he also really had the ability to deliver on this. He manipulated the mass media he mass marketed himself as the president and first really I think he realized that I can go out to the people. He also had a mass media that would allow him to do it. The chance to reach out and develop this national constituency. And I think this is why I'm glad you're here today and I'm glad that we have this approach here. Thank you so much. Thank you so much Steve Jordan. I'm going to get right on to Gary Thomas. Gary Thomas is an Associate Professor of Geography and Anthropology and he's participated in life. Steve has been in several of these symposia before. Today you're going to talk about a few of them and give her a big show on the development of the U.S. course. This is an interest that has grown up on me. I didn't come to the University as a pinch show expert or a Roosevelt expert by means and quite an expert statistic. No doubt delving into this for the past four years I've become increasingly interested in the Roosevelt family. Did Roosevelt in particular and his poetry regarding the conservations. And although he was incredibly charismatic and progressive president, a new kind of president and a new kind of man in that office that reshapes our concept of modern presidency he didn't do this alone. And it was his allies, his chosen allies in many cases that helped him to facilitate his vision and also to formulate his vision and I would say that would be true of Pinchope. Roosevelt shared much in common. They weren't that far apart in Asia in seven years difference. Roosevelt born in 1858 and potential in 1865. They both, we could argue with the patrician coming from well-established families. They both were educated from some of the finer institutions Harvard and Yale respectively. And they both had a vision that encompassed embracing the common man and that common ideal of America as part of racism and their ideal. They're also grounded in what I'd argue is a modernity. The Australian art critic and art historian Robert Hughes wrote a book back in 1980 called The Shot of the New and in that book he's arguing that where do we draw the line where do we start the modern movements and he likes to trace back to 1889 as a building in the Eiffel Tower where an engineering marvel becomes also either regarded as a work of art and the kind of symbolism of achievement in a society that we went from purely aesthetic and artistic to the celebration of engineering and the model of science and encompassed within that is the idea that technology in a sense offers traumas. It's kind of ideological freedom from the kind of labors that people have been engaged in in the past and in a sense I think we see something of that spirit in progressivism when the ideas that are ideas that are informed by science better management strategies are embraced and this would be true from the standpoint of Gifford Binshaw. And he came from a family who ironically could be I think to be lumber variants from Milford, Pennsylvania and a regal household Ray Towers and his father James Pinshaw had suggested to the relatively young Gifford that he should perhaps pursue a career in forestry and it really wasn't a place to do that in that sense although he did attend Yale he as a post graduate he went to Nancy France and studied forestry in France and he was also influenced by a number of others the grandness in Great Britain was a pioneer in British Forestry one of the factors that Pinshaw was exposed to was that many kingdoms that essentially collapsed through exploitation of their natural resources. It was kind of a precursor to this to some extent in American history of Marsh this is Perkins Marsh who was the ambassador to Italy and Turkey during the Lincoln administration and wrote a book in 1864 where he looked at man and nature and the exploitation of resources that Harvard University published 100 years later he publishes this work one of the factors that Marsh looks at is that the New England landscape in this case of Vermont is decimated by locking operations bark tanning operations and then later the charcoal processing and indeed the forest is laid waste and America of course is a bountiful place and people move on to the Midwest and then of course ultimately places like Minnesota Wisconsin and ultimately Pacific Northwest. Fortunately we had a visionary's life in show who began to recognize that it was important that we protect these vital resources that they could be sustainable resources so at the conclusion of his studies in France he returned to the United States essentially of hanging up a shingle and becoming a consultant and a professional forest but fortunately he had the economic resources to be able to do this one of the places he works is at Vanderbilt Forest in Vanderbilt State in North Carolina under George Vanderbilt spent several years there managing back forest resource and he becomes a consultant to a commission that studies American forestry which was housed in the Department of Interior moving from this position under the Roosevelt administration he enters this division of forestry and he argues that this should be part of the Department of Agriculture so normally in 1905 under the Roosevelt administration move the Department of Forestry becomes the U.S. Forest Service and if it becomes the chief forest I have a few statistical pieces of data written down here about how this transformed from 1905 to 1910 during the five years the six years of the tenure of Gifford Pinchot it went from 1905 where there were 60 forest units comprised of 56 million acres in 1910 when there were 150 units comprised of 172 million acres so it was more than a three fold increase during this period Pinchot was moved into this position from being asked to help develop a plan for western forests under the National Academy of Sciences under the National Forest Commission he becomes an advocate not just for the preservation of trees but recognizing the various dimensions of the forest that it was imperative for effective watershed management that it was good for soil retention that the forest could be sustainable entities that could serve in many ways and although he also was an advocate of private enterprise he didn't want to see these private resources exploited to such a rate that it wasn't going to serve in the coming period and I would argue that service to the coming period was probably one of his primary themes in this sense he and Roosevelt I think saw eye to eye in many ways the firmancy of Pinchot was one that might be described in his book conservation which originally published in 1912 where in one essay he argues that the United States has undergone three great crises the first was the American Revolution itself where that was going to be a success the second was the Civil War and the third as he says in this paragraph in the third great crisis of our history which has now come squarely upon us the special interests and the flatless citizens seem to have united together to deprive the nation of the great natural resources of its great of the great natural resources without which he cannot endure this is the pressing danger now and it is not the least to which our national life has been exposed a nation the product of liberty made women a nation divided may be none but a nation whose natural resources are destroyed must inevitably pay a penalty of poverty, degradation and decay no less than the of an imperative than what we had encountered in the Civil War and in the Revolution he felt that the cycle of conservation was critical and certainly was one of its leaders in doing so he encountered opposition from both sides of the spectrum John Muir who we explored to some extent in previous symposia was certainly an advocate for preservation of wild lands and played a bigger role in establishment of several national parks and certainly had Roosevelt's ear but not he didn't serve as the close advisor that Penn showed yet on the other hand so we have the presentations that Penn showed openly embrace and we also have those who are advocates of free market enterprise which we go in to exploit these resources he fell in the middle arguing for his conservation conservation ethos and I think in that sense became arguably the major ally in terms of domestic natural resources policy so I think I'll leave it at that and let the question begin all right we don't have a lot of time we've set the table here I just want to start with Perry Arnold Perry Arnold was here as our keynote last night not everyone of you was able to hear him if you weren't here I'm so sorry because it was a terrific talk I was talking about the Danian University so you've been listening all day give us a few comments about what you're hearing this is kind of like asking this is like asking anything for random observations so let me say something about the viewing camera one observation on international affairs then I'll say something what's something about the viewing camera was talking about this version of American quasi-colonialism that you see beginning really with Roosevelt being out of the Spanish-American war that as we talked about the comparisons to the American experience against the European experience that one of the things that was not observed was the factual rational perception that Roosevelt had that this wasn't just like Germany trying to get a piece of Africa but he had a strategic sense that the United States needed control of a set of Caribbean islands and even control of the Philippines and the reason was Japan in the Pacific and Panama now in the Caribbean was thinking of these possessions or dependencies for very particular strategic reasons rather than just the kind of larger cultural kind of cultural psychological aspirations of a great nation at the turn of the century so that I think what's notable about the American case is that for all of its ambition perhaps at the turn of the century it was a very different kind of imperial ambition that we see in Britain Germany and France it was Japan that would develop it later it was much more focused in that sense it was perhaps more rational in strategic so that on the earlier panel on this panel the I guess it's a different pinch of peace that I think is we haven't talked about conservation but really all yet so I think that there's a lot that's very rich in this different pinch of peace that the just a preformed observation that the show Roosevelt relationship is extremely rich it's really close there's an observation that Roosevelt makes about pinch of that is both the media a pinch of but also celebrating of it Roosevelt says a pinch of that there's no man there's no man I would all want to go to battle then give for pinch of then he adds about pinch of that there's nobody who will be more ready to give his own life at my direction then give for pinch of and so I mean there's this kind of weird psychological vibrations to God and and pinch of was this really horrible figure in the administration that was sitting in tune with Roosevelt's the principle of conservation but also was giving him enormous amounts of expertise precisely because he identified that Roosevelt had the ambition but pinch of had both the ambition and the expertise to create this dynamic conservation policy under Roosevelt one final point on pinch of and it is of course what Roosevelt saw as taft misuse and firing of pinch of is abandonment of pinch of in taft's presidency that is perhaps the single most important thing that breaks Roosevelt from taft and leads us to this kind of bizarre explosion in the 1912 election where Roosevelt breaks through the republican party creates the oppressive party and runs perhaps wanting the presidency but maybe one even more to destroy taft which did so I think that that's worth talking about more the conservation piece, the pinch of piece there was a conflict over in the lands primarily in cold fields in the western lands by former Seattle mayor and Ballinger and the Ballinger when he moved into opposite of the interior and ultimately becoming secretary of the interior has three million acres of land removed from his public resources which is near attention in itself but then later there's disputes over giving preference between access to cold fields which pinch of speaks out openly against and ultimately this result has been fired during the taft administration which imperiates here to Roosevelt and in part some argue may have led him to formulate the full most party and run opposition to taft so that's I think I focus on pinch of during the presidency but it's a continuation of that that suggests how important it was the Joe was so appalled that he actually traveled to Europe to meet with TR at the end of his safari so he'd get the first word in on what had gone wrong in that crisis we have some time for questions this is the audience's chance and David Godchalk hasn't had a chance yet to field questions so let's begin here well just happen to have one for Don Godchalk do you have any thoughts on the the Lily White character of the of the progressive party in 1912 and the rejection of the black delegates and more broadly do you have any thoughts on how come the progressives didn't make common cause with blacks it seems like they have an unnatural community of interest but it never developed why didn't the both of the progressives embrace the African-Americans okay I guess I guess regarding 1912 the Lily White the progressive party obviously that was something that angered the voice very much was his attempt right to encourage Roosevelt to really emphasize the importance of black rights and also to seek back black delegates I don't think though among other progressives I don't think the racial issue was as important to them in many ways it wasn't something that most of them paid attention to outside of the NAACP the point of my question is I wonder why not it seems to me that they have a a lot of common interest the disfranchised blacks the disfranchised poor disfranchised regular people so do you have any thoughts about why this coalition didn't form please hold the mic about four inches to make it so much easier for dust I guess it's interesting because if you look at the south progressivism starts out as a movement primarily for whites in many ways blocks African-American progress I think that Tom Watson populists really attempt to bring the two races together around a platform of reform received in the south you know so much trade and went down the feet so quickly that I think that served as an example to other people of the difficulty of doing that you know so I think in some ways there wasn't a sense that by racialism was the path by which you could get things done after the fall of the populists and you know I think that both Theodore Roosevelt I think that race relations were important to him I think Indian policy was important to him but I think and you know I'm not I know more about African-Americans that I know about Theodore Roosevelt but my sense is that what William T. Hagan said about his Indian policy is probably similar to his African-American policy that Theodore Roosevelt knew a lot about the issue but he wasn't that wasn't necessarily his largest priority at that time and you know I don't think that African-Americans were really I mean I think that the issue of race informed his policies and informed his ideology but I don't think that he was really committed obviously to the racial issue and I don't think that was of central importance to him microphones hold them about four inches away and try not to use that hand for gesturing if you can because it's really hard for Dustin to try to keep this out there was an argument in 1912 amongst the progressive party leadership on exactly this issue and there was a minority voice that you who would resonate with your view and Jane Adams their social worker from Chicago was a spokesman for precisely the argument that the progressive party must speak to the issues of African-Americans and she was overruled by the normal standards one of the one of the aspects of progressivism throughout and David's pointing at this is that throughout the history of progressivism it's particularly intented to black issues and it's related to the sort of Jim Crow laws about voting and the stuff keep in mind that progressivism is really interested in sanitizing the voting process which made it very easy to then excise the poor the black from the ballot box so they're not always good guys correct I think it also has to do in this great way progressiveism was also about the end of patronage which was the way lower middle class people could perhaps get a chunk of government employment and so I don't know progressivism was a lower class middle class movement in the north I think most of the African-Americans were still in the south had no political advocacy so maybe there was no utility in kind of backing the progressivism let's take a couple more questions here we have a question for any or all members of our panel we're talking about domestic policy in the era of Roosevelt Joe interested in the populist movement of today the Tea Party movement how would Roosevelt have looked on the Tea Party how would Roosevelt have looked on the Tea Party anyone who wishes to take that as I said last night to a question similar to that a counterfactual we can't be wrong right so that so I would guess quite disparaging I mean Roosevelt was a man of elite education aristocratic background thought from this brought to the high culture and I think you can see none of those values that he prized in the Tea Party movement besides nor perhaps even the respect for facticity if I might point for it plus, Roosevelt is pro-government he's an anti-Jepersonian he's a Hamiltonian that is an essential tool on that point they place thinking Roosevelt in letters and in his published writings he would go on somewhat about how Jeffersonian Jeffersonianism was a vein of American history all this nonsense about decentralization Hamilton kind of writes no limited government for Roosevelt no, he loved government he loved government, he wasn't afraid he believed in the power of government to do good and I think that he would obviously want government to be efficient, government to be effective in what they did but he certainly did not believe in eliminating government from daily affairs of Americans I remember, I mean Jefferson's constitutional theory was that government could only do those things that were specifically enumerated in the constitution of the United States he brought up the fact that Roosevelt's constitutional theory was that government could do anything that wasn't specifically prohibited by the constitution these are diametrically opposed views of government, the Tea Party is I believe a distortion of Jefferson's point of view but it's on the Jeffersonian end of the spectrum other questions, yes here do the African American leaders ever think that Roosevelt was playing them for strategic reasons by inviting Booker T to the White House and so on I think that I think they okay, let me go back I would say that Roosevelt kind of did it without realizing the significance of it at the time and I think a number of them realized that he didn't know what he was getting into I think that somebody like Du Bois was probably very distrustful of Roosevelt and the tricky thing when looking at African Americans' reactions during this period is like all political reactions they used Roosevelt often to push their own agenda and so they turned Roosevelt into something that he wasn't and some of the cartoons I showed for example they emphasized how Roosevelt was against segregation and was a really strong advocate of putting him into disgrantizement where he wasn't really that publicly involved in those issues so I think it's really hard to think about African Americans and I think when we quote from African Americans because they're so disempowered they often use language and they often use public opinions that where they tried to push an agenda and turn Roosevelt into something that he wasn't necessarily I don't think that and the other thing too is because African Americans are disgrantized during this time period a lot of black leaders aren't that interested in politics beyond the complicated nature of patronage and things like that so I think that they saw Roosevelt as a potential opportunity to turn things for the better in the long term but I don't think do voice or leaders like him really thought that he was necessarily from the beginning way out for African Americans but I think they came to embrace them as having a potential problem for promise. Let me ask a follow-up question about Brownsville that I was thinking about while you were lecturing Brownsville incident occurs in August of 1906 Roosevelt dismisses all 167 of the African American soldiers several investigations occurred at the time that showed that it was very unlikely that they had been responsible for this he was challenged by members of his own party he was challenged by the press by African American leaders and when you read the literature it looks as if at some point in this process Roosevelt realized that he had really overreacted but he wouldn't back down why do you suppose he couldn't at any point in this process say wow let's pull back and maybe find a compromise or exonerate some people here that's a really interesting question and I would say the striking thing is that part of his support for black civil rights were these issues where he got back into a similar corner if you look at for example he didn't anticipate the public reaction to Washington he didn't anticipate the South's response to the appointment of William Crom and he didn't really anticipate what would happen in the Cox situation in all those three situations he dug in his heels so it's interesting that in some ways the most symbolic triumphs for African Americans were periods when he really dug in his heels and then Brown spills a similar reaction for his position but he got back at that gridiron club meeting you talked about before where they got into a slathering shouting match and there was one of the most undignified moments in his presidency I think it was just impossible for him to admit a judgment and after a while it probably just escalated out of control where to go back on his decision would paint him in a battle line Questions? Am I missing you? Amy tell us more we were so sorry to cut you short you have so much to say about this for one thing there was a scandal involving white and that whole firm that did the remake of the White House was really involved in this how much of the White House when we go to it today is the Rosenau remake you know the general White House decoration with the classical revival it's really survived the last 100 years there are a lot of physical changes certainly the Truman renovation you know that took place not because the carpets were ugly but because the floors were falling apart and so during the Truman administration they literally had to gut the house and you can see pictures where there's a metal framing inside the building holding the walls up and you know they also made changes at that time like daddy's bomb shelter and things for the president what's interesting but after all that work is they did basically put back the 1902 House and so in terms of Truman's decoration it is very close now obviously every president chooses his own colors and the carpets change and the curtains change and the paint changes but in terms of the structural framework the skeleton of the house it's very much the Rosenau house just another question about Sagamore you know we see that picture of those images of the bison on the wall and we North Dakotans I hope you don't think we're parochial but he shot his first ever buffalo and we wonder which one it is do you happen to know we're told in front of the mythology that that buffalo head is in the North room do we know which one he shot here? I bet actually if we look at the catalog we would know if it's the one left or the one on the right he shot both of them in the Dakotans but we do have just a full head well we like that one back sorry alone perhaps not committed to it's like it's like an Elgin marvelous he removed it from North Dakota we just want it back I think it's a little different to Elgin marvelous back here how much weak attention was it the other one? how much of the American people know about the remake? they certainly knew and they followed it in newspapers and there's a lot of news coverage in Washington and across the country it's probably a lot of news coverage because one of the things added to the new executive wing to the West Wing was the first actual press room before this the newspaper reporters had sort of loitered on benches or spare chair around the building and just not had a place to gather and so they created a press room and they actually like sit in out of the rain and drink coffee and do their job in terms of in Washington specifically the changes were very well received in terms of people who had come to the White House previously and never gotten their coat back or waited five hours for their carriage to be brought up to the door so they could go home there's a lot of conversations about how well the public perceptions ran and how well the state affairs ran and there was a lot of commentary from ambassadors and people like that their staffs and I think for most Americans there was a great deal of pride in how the building looked that suddenly it's like sort of worthy of a world state to worthy of an empire that you have this house that represents them to the world and I think it's funny for Americans probably we would think that the capital would be a symbol because that represents our government but for a lot of people in Europe it's still focusing on an individual and on the presidency I know this isn't your field White House history but isn't it true that Edith was the perfect person to do this because she was exceedingly frugal and she was not spending it No, no this is really what was very frugal and she counted every penny of her own expenditures and of the White House expenditures it's actually interesting that there were times in the remodeling process where she felt that different pieces of furniture were needed that were not budgeted for and she purchased them and at the end of the term when they were leaving the office there were one or two pieces that she could purchase that she decided to take with her and I know some of the, shall we say yellow newspapers in Washington said oh, Mrs. Roosevelt is stealing furniture which offended her immensely and she refused to take her sofa she refused to take some bookcases that she had had made and paid for herself and she was really offended by that President Taft very gracefully followed up and he paid to have copies of the bookcases made and sent her the originals and she sent her her whole sofa which is in the North Pole where you can sit and look at the buffalo under our buffalo, that's great are you here at the last floor, Director? similarity of these kinds of things did anybody ever figure that out? the comparison between the Russian pogroms and anti-Semitism and American race that would definitely be the case they called the Atlanta race right an American kiosk in addition to that you know a lot of the early leaders of the NAACP a number of them were Jewish they were either Jewish or they were socialist for example William Walling and William Walling who was really played the engine he was really the engine behind the scenes for the failure of the NAACP had written on Russia and a number of magazine articles his wife was writing a novel based on a series of pogroms that took place in Gomel or Homo, I think it's spelled with a G and it's also spelled with an H and I'm not sure how to pronounce it but she had written, Anna Strunsky had written a lot on that and they were both very committed to ending those rides and when race rights started taking place in the United States they were afraid that the United States would fall apart like Russia was falling apart and they embraced the NAACP as a way to battle racism but also violence that they thought would lead to a revolution like what was taking place in Russia so there was a very strong connection that was made and it's also striking that just as what took place in Russia a lot of times the people who were targeted among African Americans were those who had saved money and were achieving and there was a lot of economic jealousy in addition to ethnic hatred towards them so there's a very clear connection and I'm actually giving a presentation on that in L.A. in two months I mean, you know, I feel more Jubilee you know but let me ask you one last question because we won't get another chance David, you know, at the very end of this life there's this weird event that happened after the East St. Louis rides Roosevelt's on stage in New York with Samuel Gompers and Samuel Gompers, the great labor leader is defending the white backlash against African Americans in East St. Louis and saying that these workers were really only trying to protect their labor this is an infiltration of undesirable alien workers who drive down wages and so on rhetoric we hear from time to time today but Roosevelt went nuts and he went up and shook his fist what do you make of that little scene at the end of his life I think that's obviously a very complex issue and it's one of the biggest issues I think and that's really emphasized in Dalton's book is the degree to which Roosevelt's racial program was a factor of political possibility versus what he really believed and obviously, once he no longer is president you know, in the 19 teens he has an opportunity I think I think the fact that he no longer faced the political pressures that he placed when he was president and perhaps some regrets about what he had done with Brownsville that I think he was freer to move towards supporting African Americans more and I think he was especially afraid of racial violence like a lot of Americans were because he feared that it would threaten America and you know, threaten democracy and threaten civilization in many ways I think he saw this as a potential rise of anarchy in the United States So I think that this sort of last moment of his life he's being authentically offended by the notion that we could defend anti-black activities in the St. Louis Right, and I think he was very against violence and he's spoken out against violence very early on at the same time especially in the early 1900s he was convinced that African American right posed a threat to white women I think in part because he was casted to a lot of publicity and a lot of the news articles that were pumping that up when it really wasn't the case Harry Arnold Steven Dougherty Gary Cummings David Godshaw Amy Everone We thank all of you for the story Thank you so much