 Yeah, I mean, we don't need to vote on utilities, I don't think. No, I was just putting it in there and maybe it's just a heads up everyone can take a look at it I did kind of mostly finish today I was just going through adding in where the goals. So, that was the only piece with that. In the strategies, I did the links back to what goals they support, because it's actually a unique chapter in that it's got like 20 goals. So you've got like four aspirations and 20 goals and then you only end up with like 15 strategies so there's fewer strategies to support a lot of goals because there's so many different utilities and so many different facilities and so many different other places that as you start putting things together, or the utilities and the facilities that it ends up with a lot of goals but very few strategies. So, I guess that makes sense when you start thinking about it. Yeah, should be interesting it's really important part of the city that people don't think about very much. Well, the chapter is not written I'll start working on trying to actually probably I'm going to keep working on doing implementation strategy for the community services. Because I have a lot of drafts that are out and I'm going to start prodding a few people to get to get those back so we can get those kind of compiled into a document so we've got that. So. Well, I'll just go and call the meeting to order, you know, we won't have a quorum at first, but if Aaron pops in we will. So, yeah, I'm going to call the order the Monday September 26 meeting of the molecular planning commission. Right now we're not going to be able to approve our agenda. We only have three out of seven seats. We're available here. Currently we are down to planning commissioners so it's it's on. It's on five of us to make sure that we have a quorum of four. Every meeting so it's no surprise that that you know we don't necessarily aren't necessarily going to have a quorum always until we get those seats filled. So now we are not having official meeting this is more of a working meeting of planning commission, where we'll just follow what would have been our agenda and and discuss it, but there will be no voting and no, no major decisions made for this meeting. So with that. We have Gabe and I have to remember to show up Wednesday for the reappointments. I'm assuming I'm assuming you're planning to seek the reappointment Gabe, just to clarify. Yeah, I didn't realize I needed to be somewhere on Wednesday what is that at the city council meeting I've got other appointments already set up. Yeah, it's the most important thing is for you to put the application in. Okay, on these website, which is, you know, the same thing that you would have done the, you know, not too long ago, when you apply. And then you're not there. If you're not there, Mike and I can vouch for you. But yeah, they can't, they don't have an application they can't vote to report here. All right, I'll make sure I get that on. Well, I'm glad I said that. I don't know if I have any other updates other than to say that we can maybe spend a few minutes later but I just scribble down some things for the beginnings of an arts and culture chapter. I tried to hit the high notes but there's definitely gaps to be filled in from from where it is right now. I don't have anything else anybody else have any other updates. So if that's not on the agenda, you know, I do. I think I mentioned last time, I have a new intern, or maybe I didn't. But I do have a new intern. Name is Jake peel. He works, he's grew up in Williamstown, it's going to UVM, and is interested in municipal planning so he's going to be interning this fall, and he is going to help out with the public safety chapter. So it's good as one of our chapters we have left and he's going to help to work on that in that chapter really has a number of sub sections that have to kind of get worked through. I mean obviously you can go please fire EMS. The dispatch. Those are the ones most people can think of but there's also kind of emergency management emergency planning, your hazard mitigation plans and those types of things. So the work of the Justice Center. The Justice Center has some community services and they also have some public safety because because they do the restorative justice and reintegration programs so they work very closely with the county district attorney as well as the police officers to go through and decide who's going to go through a restorative process and who's going to. And once somebody comes out of prison then we need to go and do some reintegration programs and so we've got a number of those types of programs. The community justice also does some community services so they'll have some pieces and community services but so they're, that was six and I think there was a seven that is a part of the public safety. Oh, building inspection. So the building inspector is really most of that work is a building inspector and health officer, really both of those functions come back to public safety. So we have them to ensure building safety fire safety, and those types of pieces so those are the really seven sub chapters that'll go into that and so Jake will be working on that with me throughout this. This semester, so that'll be a big help for me and hopefully a good learning experience for him. And se group has been in touch with me about the plan stuff. They've been working together historic resources. And we've been getting them a bunch of pieces that they've been asking for so they can come up with a template draft that they can bring I think they're at the next planning commission meeting in two weeks. Well it's two weeks in a day, because I think in two weeks, which I'll remind everybody now. The next meeting is indigenous person slash Columbus day. So our meeting will be Tuesday, which may be an issue for Ariane because I know that's the RPC night so I don't know how that'll work out. But we'll keep an eye out. Okay, so the 11th. Yeah, so that's all I have that's not stuff on the agenda here. Okay, thanks Mike that's helpful. And if you're, if your new intern happens to see this welcome aboard. Well we don't have any members from the public here so nothing to discuss their people. I don't I don't know what kind of applications have gone in for the empty seats but again I would encourage everyone if you know anyone who you think would be great to work with here and who has related skill set, which there's a lot of those to apply. When I checked last week Kirby you were the only one who had applied. I would send out a personal invitation to somebody who sounded like she was very interested in applying so I think that would be hopefully so we've got if it games applying in your case reapplying and you're reapplying that leaves us to vacant seats and I would hopefully think we've got one. And I know some other people I think john had said he had somebody in mind as well so everyone else can keep thinking thinking of another person that would be great. All right, thanks. Yeah, I probably need to do the same we need to reach out to people. Okay. Well let's, let's just hop into this utilities facilities strategies that Mike's drawn up for us. That's going to be most of what we have to do tonight. So, take it away Mike. All right, let me see. So there is one of those long written versions. And then I did go in and put it into our format in the template. Thank you. Mike your audio is a little garbled for me. Same same for our it seems. It's still. Still still garbled. Yeah. It just started with the sharing screen, which seems unrelated so it's pretty weird. Yeah, well, why don't you, I mean, why don't you share the screen and see if that helps. It's a little better, but it's still, it's still kind of garbled up. There's some other device that's messing with it by myself in the council chamber. So, the thing is, I'm looking up the wifi so usually that shouldn't be an issue. It's a little better now. It's a little better. Oh, what's there so they can start looking at it. You guys can start looking at it. So it really is broken into four sections it's utilities and facilities. But what we look at for utilities are the four municipal utilities water sewer. Wastewater and district heat those are the four utilities that we have. That's one chunk our public facilities is the second chunk. So that is all of our buildings are our garage, our city hall, the recreation facilities all the built pieces that we have. And this goes to a lot of the conditional use review talks about, you know, not exceeding the capacity of facilities. So, you know, we only have so much facilities. It also then includes private utilities. This chapter talks about a few of the private utilities, the big one being electricity. But we also have telecommunications, which is less important here in Montpelier than it is in other communities and other communities it's really important to be talking to telecommunications because they don't have broadband and they don't have cell coverage. In Montpelier we have multiple options for broadband and multiple options for cell coverage. So it's less of an issue for us but we still talk about it. And then the last the fourth piece talks about those services that are not municipal that not exceeding facilities and the solid waste management district so there are a couple of them that are required under statute that we talk about so those are four of the big ones. And one of them, we don't expect any of them to be an issue. So, most of this is pretty brief, but they're all kind of required to be in there so we have these four big categories of aspirations. In order to cover those four on the next tab you've got the 20 different goals, and most has just broken down the utilities are broken into making sure we've got, you know, quality and quantity of water. So you've got the what's the service that's being provided the water the sewer. And then we talk about the second goal is talking about the infrastructure in the buildings. So, you know we want to have clean water, we also want to have pipes that are maintained and a treatment plant that meets standards those types of things and then the third goal of that is the goal that kind of catches the financial financial part of it it's got to be affordable. And it also has to raise enough money that we can maintain the system so there's kind of these three different things and that applies for water sewer. And then we have the heat and wastewater so you kind of have four different, you know, to know that takes up 12 goals because each one has those three. And then again we've got a set of goals for those facilities and other services, and then finally, I don't have the exact count but I think it's like 1516 strategies. So we actually have fewer strategies than we have goals. So most of those are things like having utility plans, having the capital improvement plan which we've talked about in the past, how we how we fix and repair things and a lot of the utilities are part of the improvement plan so getting a regular plan for replacing water lines sewer lines. Separating combined sewers to CSOs. And then there are a number of other things that are also after that, that we can that we have mentioned in the past about infrastructure. Economic infrastructure programs and so most of those kind of are pretty straightforward. They're all in there so people can kind of take a look through and see what they see if there's any questions in it but that'll be something for people to review and we can approve at a future meeting. But I'm not going to go through it all in detail. Most of it's pretty straightforward. So I had a couple questions. I mean I didn't see really there being any work, you know that needed a lot of modifications it was pretty straightforward but I do. So we've got in our housing goal we've got you know goal I think 30 units per year I can't remember where we came out on that but we have this desire to increase housing. And my question just looking at the utilities is, you know, it all is really talking about maintenance. Do we have sufficient infrastructure to support the housing goal that we set up and if not do we need to put some language in there just to acknowledge that there will need to be some additional investment because one of the things you're always going to get pushed back on from the community is oh we don't have enough resources we don't have enough infrastructure to do this and I don't know if we do or don't we have a lot of excess capacity maybe it's totally fine but that was one question I had. So big, big picture we have enough capacity, our sewer plants and our water plants are both operating, give or take 50% capacity, so you could double the size of Montpelier without exceeding the water in the sewer plant. We have plenty of capacity where this starts to fall apart a little bit is in the in the either the size or the age of the distribution lines and those types of things those are those are the issues and that's a little bit where the programs come up. Where we try to use these programs to try to improve that's what TIF could be used for if it's in a TIF district, but we also tried to just have an infrastructure program where we could kind of do these many TIFs and we did that for Caledonia Spirits where Caledonia Spirits couldn't be built without moving and replacing the sewer main that crosses the river. It actually comes down Berlin and then crosses the river there and then comes up goes under the railroad tracks and goes down Berry Street, and it, it was an old line it was located in the bad spot so we moved it and and replaced it for, you know, a number for a decent distance. Part of that was paid for by basically borrowing money and then having the revenues from the new distillery basically payback the bond. There'll be things like that but it's we don't need to say anything different. The program is described in there and it's just going to be used in different places I think if we identify things and plans that come up and say this there there is a, you know, development potential in an area that can't be recognized because there isn't enough sewer or water. Like anything that's in the rural district parts of Elks Club property. It's in the rural district because it doesn't have access to sewer and water well, we could change that habitat for humanity can't be built up on Northfield Street without sewer and water. So utilities extending sewer and water into places that don't have it. We've got some programs to do it but you know it may come out in our plans that we need to either come up with more money or come up with more plans or come up with more policies. To say something like, like expand where appropriate or you just think that the discussion at TIF and many TIF above is that that's sufficient. I don't know I guess we'll have to see if there's some things that, again, like we've talked about in some of these other chapters is some things that are really fit well into a discussion of the implementation strategy. Then there's some things that are really focus well in a chapter discussion and this may be one where we talk about when we talk about that section where it's like how how this chapter relates to other chapters. Most of our all of our chapters have that section where we talk about, you know, how does historic and housing, you know, or historic and economic development either support each other or conflict with each other and I think this is a that would be a good place for us to have that conversation of, you know, with with such a big goal and critical goal of increased housing. You know, the reason we have high density housing, there's one reason we have high density housing. That's because we have a sewer district. We have sewer as an option. That's why, you know, there aren't a lot of communities in the state that have sewer plants. And that's why they don't have high density housing. We can do high density housing because we have that and where we can, you know, where we can run sewer lines and where we can extend sewer lines is directly connected to where we can also have high density housing so That sounds fair. Just was it was just a question. I think having that chapter heading or something like that is, and we don't even know you don't have to promise the world is just the idea that we might need to do some expansion. The other thing is probably just to redirect redirect to me so when I when I think of infrastructure. I don't know why it was I mean I'm reading about the buildings and these other things I'm just thinking, you know, the biggest infrastructure thing that I see is roads. And where is that word if you guys already talked about that another chapter and that's, that's the biggest problem I feel I feel like we've got infrastructure wise but I probably not in this chapter right. Yes, but there's a whole special chapter on transportation. So we've got a whole chapter that deals with the roads and the complete streets such roads bikes pedestrians also includes things like public transportation and that's already finished out that's already I could just go read what you're already worked on. Yeah. Yeah, okay. Thank you sorry for interrupting there a few, you know, other things to say. No that was that was all I had to say if there was anyone who has questions now we can take them. Otherwise I think we'll just kind of tackle it. Oh, I guess I'm not moving enough I didn't even know there was a light sense. Yeah, that's a whole lot of things are on did you have anything. Well, sort of related to what gave was talking about I just I'm looking at this for the first time and I see some language about yeah like what does it say continue to maintain a balance between, you know, residential development and the capacity of various systems so I just worry about that being, you know, like, you know, maybe we're starting not being used by people who oppose housing I just think we need to word it carefully it's not that I've opposed to the idea just want to be mindful of that. That's all. These are all drafts like every other chapter so as we get to it. And as you go through it if you, if there are things you can highlight them and say this. These others are good this one I think needs some tweaking and we can certainly go through and make edits to reflect what what makes sense. Some of this rejiggering at the end kind of was was kind of a little bit quicker and I may not have fully fully captured everything. I gave an R and do you do you know what strategy and or goal has the tricky language. We can go ahead and market now. For me it was on the goals it was. I think all the goals under D. Continue to maintain a balance between schools and the library and CB MC. And then I guess the last one about participating in the solid waste district. It was fine but it was those, and I don't. Yeah it was 1718 and 19 and the goals and I don't off the top of my head have language to suggest but I can, I can think about that or other other thoughts. Yeah I mean maybe the problem is maintain the balance because it sounds like we're at capacity or something. So if we could change that to something that implies surplus. Because we have no evidence that any of these that development is an issue for any of these. So far so I think I think it is just a matter of semantics how we word that to go and reflect that that it's not like we have a balance right now. We actually have capacity to it is interesting you know having sat and some of these hearings now that the plan is used as a weapon. So we do have to be very careful about language that we might think oh it's, it doesn't it's you know it doesn't matter well, it does matter because somebody would pull out what area on just highlighted right and say well you know this clearly is an imbalance. We need to hear something just like that and say, okay well that is that really what it meant we don't define what balances right so yeah I appreciate that room. That's true. Unfortunately true. Okay I threw a note in there, we don't have to come up with the answer now but I wrote change maintain the balance to something that clarifies that we have surplus capacity. Okay. So, so Mike I was going to ask you about, so the stormwater changes. And can you give us some background about why there's, you know, new, new stuff in there relating to stormwater. And, you know, what Montpilers already planning for the future for that, and, and what plans we have just just to. Since that's a new thing I thought it would be worth getting a summary. Stormwater is a little bit different. Considering it's a, it's not fully its own utility yet so we have a sewer water in a district heat enterprise funds we don't have a stormwater enterprise fund yet, but we are in the process right now creating a stormwater utility so we can separate out those funds. There are a lot of state and federal goals. We aren't kind of getting in the weeds, we are not what would, what the, the wonks would call an MS for community which is a municipal storm sewer system or something like that so it's got four s's so it's m with four s's so they call the MS for. And that's, there's a federal water clean water rule that applies to any community with more than 10,000 people which we don't have, or otherwise assigned by the state or federal government. So we've always kind of trend been trying to avoid anyone who's an MS for has to have a stormwater utility. And so we've tried to keep our waters as clean as possible so we can avoid being an impaired watershed, and therefore avoid getting tagged with that, and having all the federal requirements to go along with it so we're trying to basically be good so we can avoid having to to meet extra, because there's a lot of that comes with a lot of costs. So we're trying to basically do everything that an MS for would without having to actually be an MS for so that's why there's a number of things that we're doing, including having rules and our zoning to help regulate so unlike sewer and water where we really don't regulate them through the zoning stormwater we do. And it's going to have some utility requirements and it's going to have some other costs, and that's going to go to maintaining the those pipes under the ground right now your sewer bills pay for a lot of the storm sewer pipes. So they're kind of you know, it'll all get start to get separated out to help balance out make sure that your sewer is paying for your sewer pipes because you're not going to have CSO is combined sewer overflows anymore so you should have all the storm sewer going through the storm pipes and all the wastewater going through the wastewater pipes. So, everything will have its own fund everything will be taken care of everything will be regulated so it's really meant to take our storm water quality to another level. So there's a lot of new stuff in here that's why there's a lot in here is because we're kind of at an inflection point. Our water plant and our water system is in good shape other than some very old water pipes that keep blowing up on us. Our sewer plant is now been modernized. And it's finishing up it's going through phase two will have, you know, a state of the art sewer plant. Pretty quick. I mean it is state of the art but it'll be, you know, finishing up really being having some new things with it. So that will be really top of the line. And then it's really now coming down to starting to make some big investments in our storm sewer in our, yeah in our storm sewer system so what can we do to improve this system to make sure that everything's getting treated. We have new state requirements that what are called general roads permit that's that's something new that's also storm water how well are we regulating the water that flows, you know, off of our roads. So there's a lot of new state requirements a new new federal requirements that we have to meet. And there's a lot of work going, a lot of planning going on at DPW right now to kind of prepare for that get stuff lined up and that's why in the plan you'll see a lot more kind of stuff that's in there on storm sewer that you don't see in the other ones. Thanks Mike. Has has the, the infrastructure transition started over like away from the CSOs for CSO reducing the number of combined sewers has been going on for more than a decade. Okay, I think at the start. I mean I'm just giving ballpark numbers I think there may have been 60 combined sewer overflows in the city. And some of them were very easy to kind of break apart and to separate and to take care of things and, and over the years they've gotten it down to like six, maybe. So I think they've eliminated most of them. And now there's a number of places where they're just in the ones that are left are the hardest ones to separate. So there are a number of things to try to reduce the amount of water going into it. So, for example, there are a lot of roofs that are still tied into the student tied into the sewer. And so if it rains hard and you've got a big roof, like a state office building might have a combined sewer half of city hall does. Half the half the building has been disconnected the other half hasn't so if it rains hard all that water goes into the sewer pipes, and if it exceeds the sewer pipe then it dumps sewage into the river. That's what a CSO is. So by separating the storm water out of it, then it doesn't overflow in a storm. That's the whole point of trying to separate them but some of these are easy to fix and some of them are very hard to fix. And so that's what they're working on the big East State Street project that you may if you're paying attention to DPW newsletters and stuff. That's going to be a big project for next year where they're going to replace all the pipes going up East State Street is going to be a huge project. $789 million. It's a pretty big project that will separate one of our biggest CSOs that we have remaining it's really, you know, it's kind of it's challenging, challenging place to separate them if you don't have a storm sewer pipe to tie stuff to so they're going to that's part of that big project so there are a number of these larger projects to help eliminate the CSOs because we know, first of all we have to, as a part of the Clean Water Act but it's also it's a hard project it's a goal that the city has had the goal the public works has had to eliminate all the CSOs. There's a big big difference in the water so far we've gotten it down to, you know, what probably was an event every single time it range to, you know, a couple events a year depending on how hard we get rain. So they've been doing a good job but until they get it all done, we're going to continue to hear about every every time we get a combined sewer overflow there's going to be complaints and, you know, not wrongly. There's only so much you can do, and you do project at a time to separate them out. Well, thanks. I didn't realize how far along we were and addressing that actually, I thought we had farther to go so that's wonderful. You know, I think the projects that are left are big projects and they're going to be hard to do, but in total numbers because they've been working on it for so long. They've gotten out they've done all the easy work now they've got the most expensive and the hardest ones to do. So the other question I had was, there's something relating to monitoring green mountain power. To make sure that sticks to its net zero, you know, promises. I recall John having an issue or maybe Aaron with the city being dependent on green mountain power so I just thought I would just like flag that one because I guess I've had issues with putting something in the plan that's relying on them. But I don't know, what are you, what are you thinking about having this. There's a strategy number 16 continue to monitor green mountain power for sure it meets the commitments to be net zero by 2030. How do you feel about that being a strategy since it's since it's not something we're doing. Well, the part we're doing is what, like, watching the active part is GMP. Do you guys have thoughts about that or I didn't notice that I wasn't like I wasn't sure about the aspiration and general about private utilities like how not sure what a meaningful like strategy for the city of Montpelier is but obviously they're tremendously important so yeah I wasn't sure. Yeah. We have some kind of leverage to and to enforce or something or I mean they're they're kind of a monopoly right. Yeah they need certificate of public good so they. They have plans to be net zero by 2030 and so a lot of what the energy committee is doing is under the assumption that green mountain power is going to meet their, you know if we're going to be net zero by 2030, or by 2050, then we need all of our electricity to be net zero. Because we're completely in GMP service area then in GMP themselves have said they will be net zero by 2030 so by them meeting their goals by 2030 we're going to meet our 2050 goals for 30% of our energy portfolio because you've got electricity you've got home heating and you've got transportation are your three big sectors. So if GMP is going to be net zero then we've, you know we've already checked that box. So, a lot of what, you know it's if there's one strategy that goes along with it and that's just to watch the certificates of public good, and presumably if they're going to default on their promise then you know it'll be in the seat. The certificate of public good process and it'd be up to the city to decide if they want to pay a lawyer or a lobbyist or just get people involved to go through and file motions with the public service commission to try to get them to force GMP to keep their promise. As I said I have no information to believe that they're not going to be meeting their commitments I think our job is just to keep an eye on the CPG things and make sure that they will. And it's a required it's one of the required pieces, some of the pieces that are in the statute that layout you have to talk about certain things one of them is the electricity so we do talk about it and really the only thing we do is just monitor them to the extent that, you know, because we don't really have issues. Other communities will have more issues to make sure, for example, three phase power might be important to have at an industrial park or, you know, we're a farming community and the, you know, the dairy barns can operate much more efficiently with three phase power and we're going to work with X, Y and Z to try to get this power run out to these barns so that way they're operating more efficiently and more cost effectively. So the utilities can be a much electric utility can be a much bigger topic in other communities for us. We have we've got power. You know, whatever we want, because we've got a lot of power, a lot of substations lines everywhere. It's not really an issue so we don't plan a lot for it, a lot of us, you know, very small plans same same thing that we do with. You know, the library and the hospital and, you know, in other places. You know, it's healthcare and health services may be a much bigger deal if you happen to live in a town that's 40 miles from the nearest hospital then you know where's your rural rural health care, get provided by not an issue again for us. But we're still required to talk about it in our plan so that's why there's these little things that just pop up might just pop up once to say make sure it doesn't become an issue in the future, we don't expect to become an issue in the future but we will promise to keep an eye on it. And if it becomes an issue will do something about it, even though we're never going to exceed the capacity of the central medical center. You know, our population won't grow so much that we exceed the capacity of that hospital to provide service. We're just this county isn't growing that fast that that would ever be an issue, and same with a number of these these things that we're required to talk about. So. Okay, yeah I just wanted to flag that one side. Yeah I think it was Aaron who had some issues before but don't have any personally don't have any recommendations for that. Anybody have anything else on utilities plan or. Yeah, not now but are we going to. So what's the next step is Mike going to rewrite some of it or do we go in and edit or sorry, I've forgotten our process. Well, it's a little weird since we don't have a quorum right now. I would take a deeper dive and maybe maybe consider voting it out if you didn't have anything major to change but since since voting is off the table we are going to have to revisit it. But if, but if yeah if you have comments and things I'd say yeah we put those in there now like I put in that one note, just so that we can get through it quicker in the future, get the plan done faster. Good to you Mike. Okay, well, all we have left for tonight is to take a quick peek at the chapter that I wrote this afternoon it's just has one page right now. I can share it. What I, what I did was I just took, you know, try to follow our regular format, I only did the first three major sections I know we have some others like maps and things, but just got to start it at least. I mean, full disclosure, I put less than an hour into this. It's just just a draft but I think it touches on the big things from the chapter and it touches on the big things more importantly probably from the arts and culture master plan. I took out the substance which were which was just the main, the main things that they are some culture master plan wanted to achieve I just hit those in the intro. And it sounds, I mean when I read it is that sound a little repetitive because I feel like there's no, because you talk, I just talked about the aesthetics of the built environment constantly. But it, but in a nutshell, you know, it's arts important because it makes our built environment reflect our values and vision. The plan helps make art focused, which commentary I don't know it's a little bit of an oxymoron, because I think art is supposed to be free or whatever. We're, we're focusing the art and directing it to capture the energy that's in our values. One of their major goals is to enhance character and attachment to city. I tried not to be too verbose about it, and just just kind of hit the stuff. So you could probably go on and on about attachment to the city I just left that pretty short. So focus on high quality art, which is why I use that phrase to enhance the aesthetic quality and help her and help her build environment stand out from other places. And under that they had community vitality and involving a broad range of peoples I feel like that's that's a little bit redundant as mentioned a couple times here but it's just kind of the way that I tried to follow how they organized it. Value artists and artistic processes we've talked about this before. And there's there are a couple of strategies relating to that so it has its own part but I think that this, because we had talked about how do you connect artists themselves with a plan that's supposed to be about city planning which is not supposed to be about individual people. So, to whatever extent, it this this connects that by talking about having a plan that creates opportunities for artists and involves them in projects. So that's kind of connecting the the built stuff the development stuff with the people. And then there is there was mention of use of resources which there's part we have strategies related to funding and use of resources so I threw a little bit in there about that. And those are just kind of the high points, any of any of these things could have further elaboration. I was in a hurry and I didn't really see a need if we don't, if we don't, you know if we wanted to be succinct, which a lot of the times we we talk about how we wanted to sink so this could be expanded or not, depending on how people feel. In the chapters, I just quickly chose economic development, transportation utilities, and then, and then I tried to accomplish something with community services natural resources, but I'll be the first to admit that this paragraph is a bit of a stretch, and it was about linking the built environment with the natural environment, and it took a little bit of speculation on my part to say, Well, some of our art will probably be a blending of the natural environment with the built environment. I mean, we're not specifically calling for that but it seems like the kind of thing we do. So those are the those are the connections that I pointed out I think we talked about some of these. Again, this stuff could be fleshed out a bit more. I thought about a way of connecting the parts of this plan. I thought about using using storefronts for art displays that that could be something that could be talked about here related economic development. I didn't include that but I did include you know how it touches on tourism. It brings people like there's the events that bring people in and then there's the art making us look prettier so those are kind of two distinct things both related economic development. That's, that's about it. And then past efforts was I actually couldn't quickly find when the public arts commission was created I thought it was last year maybe but it's some of the dates on the website they use went back to 2018. I think it might be 2020 event or 2019 when it was formed. So what we'll have to track that down to make sure that we leave the right dates there. But then this this is just the most recent stuff. Again, it could be fleshed out. And that's my quick intro to this to what we have here. Anybody have any reactions. I think we're going to go down and then start shuffling them around because that's what will probably end up happening because the next section that happens after the one you have there talks about what are aspirations and goals and what are our strategies so we kind of convert what's in the implementation strategy into a couple of paragraphs that kind of go through and say, So these are our goals and this is what we're going to do about accomplishing our goals. And I think up top that's where some of the introduction may get pulled down, and I think the only difference on top that I might look at is usually the two things are trying to talk about in the introduction one is why, why is this important. So why is arts and culture important and I think you've talked about that you've got that. And then there's a little bit of, you know, what's, you know, why is this or what's unique about Montpelier or why is this important to Montpelier. And there's a little piece in there. I think that we kind of have to touch on, maybe a little bit of. I think the fact that we've got a lot of these cultural pieces that are out there, you know, whether it's the Blossomation Theater and the studios and there are a lot of things that are good about Montpelier and the arts, but there's also kind of, you know, this odd fear of not having any public art, you know, up until the public art master plan. Those are remarkably, you know, empty city and I don't know how we're, how we'll say that in a positive way but, you know, it was certainly from a professional planner standpoint, you know we we go through and say that you know the cities Montpelier missed the city beautiful you know that other communities had which you drive through you go through any downtown from, you know, 1880, 1890 up through 1910 1920 was the city beautiful movement is a big period of time where there was a lot of investment throughout the country and beautifying and celebrating our, our communities so that's when the statues of George Washington were built and, you know, there are a lot of these types of art and monuments and statues were all erected in that window and for some reason Montpelier didn't get any. We have no grand fountains. No great statues, you know you go just go down the road to Berry City and you've got the Burns Memorial we've got the youth triumphant we've got the statue the Italian memorial there for the Italian art car the carvers memorial there their their statues all over the place but yet Montpelier doesn't have a single statue, even though it's the state capital so it's kind of a unique so that's one of the things we're trying to change is is to try to bring more art to Montpelier that for some reason we haven't had. I think the art commission is doing a fantastic job for having a limited budget they have really managed to get a lot of projects rolled out. So, certainly, I've been impressed with the amount of impact they've had so. And that's I did I made sure to point out here and this kind of goes actually what we were talking about earlier about people weaponizing things. Just to just to make sure that it's clearly written in the plan. And try to talk about how you know our plan here works with the public art master plan. And to be clear that we want this to be in conjunction with that plan and to supplement that plan and the work of the public art commission wouldn't want anyone to use anything we use against their efforts or vice versa. I didn't be I was sure to include that at least in that summary past efforts. This can maybe be called out because you're talking about moving stuff around maybe it could be called out to the intro in fact to to put a higher emphasis on our intention of how this could be how this should be taken or used. Certainly not to limit these efforts. Anybody else have any other reactions. Mike, and well, I'll stop and ask that question first anybody have any other reactions. Oh, what's that. I just say I thought it seemed good. Thank you. So so Mike what do you want to do for like next steps do you want to take this and expand on it or would you like me to try to expand more. What works for you. I would say probably over the next two weeks I probably won't be jumping too much into this one. I'm going to probably be focusing on the implementation strategy but for for community services, because I really want to try to make sure I'm getting these last pieces ready. The community group starts moving forward we've got the pieces to either I've got to write the utilities and facilities chapter or I've got to do the implementation strategy but I've got to get those two pieces rolling but we're in pretty good shape between and I'm and I'm also obviously helping Jake with the public safety stuff because he's getting kicked off so I don't I won't promise to be getting too much into this but the more ideas that get put down. The, you know, even if it doesn't have a something even it's just a, you know, a chunk that's in there then that really gets us going in a right direction because then I then I've got things I can start moving around if if you're ready to just go and say here you go Mike, start putting it around and make a chapter out of this, the more pieces or whatever that we have then easier it'll be for me to start to tell the story. And then again it's back to you, you guys usually take these things and kind of beat them up for a bit. And that's fine. So that way we're ready to go. Okay. I threw in just a couple little notes there at the bottom for things we just talked about. We can do that more. Yeah, I certainly wouldn't expect a two week turnaround I think our next meeting is to be pretty full because se group will be presented. So, um, yeah, no expectation this chapter needs to be completely done. And we also have another meeting and the other another presentation right for in the other October meeting. So historic preservation commission will be showing up. Yeah. So, so yeah there's time to work. If I can think of anything more to add I can go back and try to try to help give you some of those like nuggets to work off of what you were saying. Yeah, I haven't read the arts plan, not certainly not as well as you have so I would count on you to make sure you pull some of the pieces out that are the most important and I can try to get in and work with them. Yeah, I think I think I haven't pulled out all of the extra elaboration and detail but definitely the main, the key takeaways are in this. Does anybody have anything else for tonight before we sign off. Okay. No reason to turn because this was never official. But if nobody has anything else we can we can sign off.