 Well, today is a special day for us because it's Greg's dream is coming true. We're going to talk about Bigfoot. So Greg's found some good videos on a guy who claims to have seen Bigfoot. Greg, why don't you tell us what you've seen or what videos we're going to watch. So I asked people, what's a great video for Bigfoot? And they said there's a guy named Mike Woolley who was in Louisiana who saw Bigfoot and he's believable. So I went and found that video and then we found some other supporting videos. So we got some really good stuff here for you. I think the first video is going to be something he did for the travel channel. His last interview, unfortunately, Mr. Woolley passed away in 2019. Otherwise, we'd be trying to talk to him. And then the second is from a movie called Skookum, which is Hunt for Bigfoot. And then the third set of videos will come out of a 2019 interview with the Bigfoot Explorer team going and talking to Mr. Woolley among his last interviews. My name is Mike Woolley. I'm from Key Child, Louisiana. I had an encounter back in December of 1981 with a Bigfoot while deer hunting. It was a beautiful December day, perfect weather for a hunt. Temperature was about 30 degrees. I got to my deer stand that evening, about three o'clock, got on it. And I was sitting there and I was facing to the north. And my deer stand was located about a mile and a half down Old Login Road and off the main highway, secondary highway. And what I would do, I would park my truck halfway down the Login Road and I would walk in the rest of the way because I didn't want to drive my truck down and spook the deer. Well, it must have been, I hadn't been there the more than 30 minutes. And this little young doe deer come running from the east out of some bars and brush that there's no way a human could walk through that. But she come up to my deer stand and what was so amusing, come up to my deer stand and lay down up and actually touch in the deer stand. She was ringing wet, was wet. She had been run, something had been running her. And the first thing hit my mind, it was a big buck. And I said, I'm going to kill me a big buck. What do you got? So I'm going to tell you that every war story a person tells over and over and over. They will de-conflict that war story to the point that every time they tell it, they're going to know what other people want to hear and they're going to tell it. So no, no surprise there. If you ask me about a war story, if something happened to me in the first Gulf War, I can tell you all the details and I'm probably going to chase to do the same. We're going to think about the mechanics of what we should tell you to make sure you understand how things were and give you pertinent information. People do that all the time, they de-conflict. And if you tell the story for 38 years, you're going to do that. So no surprise there. There's one factual inaccuracy in here that just didn't happen for sure. Deer don't sweat. So it didn't come up running, ringing wet. They foam at the mouth, they pant like a dog. So that's not a fact. But I've heard him in other places say the thing was panting and foaming at the mouth. Looks good. Everything smooth. He's illustrating. He's saying what he thinks. His sentence structure is pretty consistent. The and does are just part of his normal delivery. I've watched not just war stories, but if you've been around hunters much, this level of detail and the way he's telling the story, I've heard that a million times the deer came up and it laid, like I care what happened before you pulled the trigger and killed the deer. But to them, it's a big part of their hobby, big part of their day. So it sounds like a normal Southern guy telling a story about hunting. Scott, what do you got? All right. He's given quite a lot of detail, which is fine. Like you said, Greg, there's no sweat. So right out right from the beginning, that's a little bit of that. That didn't that didn't sit right with me. And then the reason you feel that you understand everything really clearly is because of the picture he creates in your mind. I train people how to do that. And so what we're seeing is a great techniques. And it's the old bulls technique. That's where he repeats things. President Trump does that as well. He repeats things. He'll say things two or three times. This guy talks like he's wearing a wire. He keeps talking about a deer stand, deer stand, deer stand. Every other word is deer stand, it feels like. Then he talks about the old road. He talks about the road again. He repeats several things. So his patterns are to create a picture. And so I'm sure he's a great storyteller as well. And we don't see a lot of movement with him. Not a whole lot of movement. Not very many illustrators. His head moves a little bit. That's about it. And again, he's creating really clear picture with words. And it works. I think it sounds believable right then. Chase, what do you got? Let's break it down. Blink rate, which we typically associate if someone's blinking more often, or their eyes are blinking more often. And we associate that with stress. It stays consistent throughout this video. There's narration with the head to the right, this tilting when he's narrating where something is. And it's right on cue as eyes move consistently to the same direction as he's recalling the entire story. There's a single shrug in here. And when somebody does this, this sometimes indicates they lack confidence in what they're saying. In this instance, it makes sense with the behavior because he's discussing the amount of time that he's spent there before this incident happens. I would say this is generally a mostly believable story. That's all I got. Mark? Yeah, I got to say the same. And it's great because this starts so well. It's clear. It's consistent. It's assertive. It's direct. There are, I would say, no deviations from what you'd expect or what's set up. So it's pleasant to see because normally straight off the bat, we're like, oh, there's something going on here. But right now, it seems very, very true. It came to mind. I'm not sure whether Prince Andrew should have suggested he was a deer. I haven't thought of that particular alibi. It's worth thinking of. I give you that one for free. The next one will cost you, sir. So to your point, Scott, and I think you're right here, there was a German propagandist who said, repeat the lie enough and people will believe it. And that's the same for us. When we tell stories again and again and again and again and they adapt over time, they suddenly become even more believable for us as well. So part of me doesn't want that to be true. And part of me says, if you're right, Greg, this is a story he's told time and time again. There's an option that it has adapted over time and it may not be so accurate. But having said that right off the bat, looks very, very good for me. I'm excited. My name is Mike Woolley. I'm from Keatshire, Louisiana. I had an encounter back in December of 1981 with a big foot while deer hunting. It was a beautiful December day, perfect weather for a hunt. Temperature was about 30 degrees. I got to my deer stand that evening, about three o'clock, got on it and I was sitting there and I was facing to the north. And my deer stand was located about a mile and a half down old login road and off the main highway, secondary highway. And what I would do, I would park my truck halfway down the login road and I would walk in the rest of the way because I didn't want to drive my truck down and spook the deer. Well, it must have been, I hadn't been there no more than 30 minutes and this little young doe deer come running from the east out of some briars and brush that there's no way a human could walk through that. But she'd come up to my deer stand and what was so amusing, come up to my deer stand and lay down up and actually touch in the deer stand. She was ringing wet, was wet. She had been run, something had been running her. And the first thing hit my mind, it was a big buck. And I said, I'm going to kill me a big buck. So when I raised my head back up, I was turning my head and out of my peripheral vision, I seen something hopped to a tree and it was tall, about seven, eight foot tall and it was black, real hairy, like a gorilla. And I knew it wasn't a gorilla because there was no circus in town and I knew it hadn't escaped and I knew we didn't have no gorillas running loose. So the first thing hit my mind, it was somebody dressed up in a suit trying to scare me off my good deer hunting spot. Well, immediately I go to talking to this thing, telling it, take the head off, get out of here, don't come back. This ain't no joke, I don't find it funny, just leave. Well, this thing was just eyeballing me and looking at me and really giving me some sinister looks. And I knew right then I said, something ain't right. Well, this went on for a few minutes and he must have been about 20 yards from me, 15, 20 yards. So I take my rifle, I've got a high-powered rifle with a high-powered scope on the rifle and I looked through the scope at the creature and I knew that after looking at it, I was in a situation because it was cold, the moisture was coming out of its mouth, its nostrils, it looked really, really human. The face was human, the eyelashes, I could see the eyelashes, you know, the eyes, the teeth, the teeth were big, big teeth, flat teeth like our teeth. So anyway, I'm sitting there and I'm looking at it and it just, it's really pee-o'd at me. And it lets out a roar like a lion. What do you got? Yeah, look, I'm still the same, roughly the same cadence, calm, assertive, direct, so I'm really enjoying this because it still feels pretty good. The main worry that now jumps out to me is so anyway, well, well, there's a little more kind of jumps from moments of the story to other moments of the story. I'm a little bit worried by that, a little bit of lip-licking that we weren't seeing before between that. Again, none of those things, it's not enough to say, okay, now it's started getting deceptive, especially when there's such a good baseline of the same cadence that he had before. Again, though, you know, how many times has he told this story, adapted it for himself? How true does it feel for him? Still, I'm pretty, still pretty excited by it, though. Chase, what do you got? So let's cover, let's cover the deception indicators. Then I'll cover all the truthful indicators. So right here at the beginning, we start with some lip-licking. This is a hygienic gesture. It's made to make us look more believable unconsciously and all these behaviors are likely unconscious. Then there's more lip-licking at the visual description of this creature. There's word repetition of high power, scope, eyelashes, human, teeth, teeth, teeth. There's a blink rate spike and when we say blink rate, how often someone's blinking stress, right at the point of detailed recall about the face, which are kind of maybe just the orange, dark orange flags to me here. Let's go through the truth signals. There's a smooth, even tone. Comfortable editing his own words, mid-sentence. When people who are being deceptive are very uncomfortable going back and editing as they're talking. Comfortable using a combination of simile and metaphor in the same description. Calling the face human. It was like a human face. It was a human face and had a human face. Blink rate is steady throughout except for that one point and he's comfortable ascribing meaning to emotional expressions on the face. He doesn't say it looked peoed. I saw the face and it looked like he was mad. He just says he was peoed at me. So I think the truth might just outweigh the deception here. Scott. All right. Again, he's being very repetitive. Pay attention to that as we go through these. Listen to the times he repeats the same words. Changes the phrase a little bit, but it's the same words in there. This helps create that picture in your mind. When I'm training entrepreneurs to create a picture that they can take home and give somebody else to their person, their husband, their wife. So they can say, here's what we're investing in or if somebody goes back to their office and says back to the company and says, well, so what are we going to invest in this or what? Yeah, we are because it looks like this. They've got to be able to pop that picture out and pop it in somebody else's head. And that's, he's such a great storyteller because he's doing that wonderfully well because this is the way stories get started. And there's old Willie, here's what happened to him. And you can tell just you can right now from what you've heard so far, you can say what's happened to him and what he saw. You can talk about that deer and how, how he was sitting on a stand. And you saw all those things because those create specific pictures and pictures in your mind. So I think he's doing a great job here. And I think, I think there is a little, we can see a little bit of iffy in there, but boy it sure sounds good at this point. All right, we good? What are you going to say, Greg? No, I haven't gone yet. Oh, I'm sorry, man. I'm thinking about you the whole time because I know you're loving this. I keep thinking you've gone. Okay, what do you got? Well, you know what? Like I said, when we first started this whole thing, I think most of the big flip things I've seen are very easy just to take apart. So far, this is good. I mean, his story, his storytelling, it's not abnormal for a hunter. Like I said, I always said in the beginning, when we first started doing this show, I would say to you, pay attention to war stories and don't believe any of them, because none of them are true. The basis is true, but all the details are not reliable for a couple of reasons. Every time Chase and I would sit and talk about a war story, we would have to ask. I'll ask Chase a question you might not have thought of before. He has to now go back and fill that in. Now, that doesn't mean that he's making it up. He just has to fill it in. So it's not his memory anymore because he's going to sit and say, well, it must have been this. And so he'll fill that detail in next time he's talking to somebody with a like background. Now, we speak a different language because we're a generation apart in the military. But if you were talking to someone in his same generation, he would fill in those details. And as Chase, you brought it up first. Every time you open a memory, you edit that memory. Every time you touch it, you're editing it. So we're not going to get 100% accurate ever. And the more times you tell a story, the more times you're going to fill in details like that. Now, but what he is really good at is he's making a picture, like you said, of exactly what he remembers, what he remembers this point. A couple of red flags for me, but clusters are what we look for. A little bit too much eye contact. I usually say romance or when I did the true crime workshop, too much eye contact suddenly makes me think the person's trying to hypnotize me with their eyes and their story. And so I'm a little cautious. The other one is that blink rate that goes up. And it's around when he's talking about the face and the 20 minute time zone. And those two are the only two things I see that make me want to go after him and say, okay, wait a minute. He does an uncharacteristic stumble when he's talking about the teeth and who knows why. But so far it looks pretty good. It looks pretty believable. He punctuates with his head when he says somebody in a suit and a good deer stand. You can tell he's told this many times. That doesn't make it untrue. Many stories we tell will still be at their core true and still adjusted over time. That's what I got. You know what's interesting about that? About when you're saying the differences in the generation between you and Chase. When Brad and Chase were telling those stories about where they rolled the jeep or something happened, when they were telling war stories, they would add stuff to remember this happened, remember that happened. Oh yeah, you're right. Oh yeah, you're right. Because they're together. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And one won't remember because where Brad was sitting in a different place then Chase was sitting. So something completely different would happen at that. Which is why when you capture prisoners, you separate them so they don't pollute each other's stories, you keep them sterile. And anytime we talk to people, we are careful that we listen. And if we hear the same story, we know it's concocted. Because they'll have different perspectives on it. The core story will be the same. But their perspectives will be very different. That was an unbeaten out of jeep. I was going to say jeeps went out of service long before. Yeah, jeeps went out in my time. There we go. There it is. Nailed it. So when I raised my head back up, I was turning my head. And out of my peripheral vision, I seen something hopped to a tree. And it was tall, about seven, eight foot tall. And it was black, real hairy, like a gorilla. And I knew it wasn't a gorilla because there was no circus in town. And I knew it hadn't escaped. And I knew we didn't have no gorillas running loose. So the first thing hit my mind, it was somebody dressed up in a suit trying to scare me off my good deer hunting spot. Well, immediately I go to talking to this thing, telling it, you know, take the head off, get out of here, you know, don't come back. You know, this ain't no joke. I don't find it funny. You know, just leave. Well, this thing was just eyeballing me, you know, looking at me and really giving me some sinister looks. And I knew right then I said, you know, something ain't right. Well, this went on for a few minutes. And he must have been about 20 yards from me, 15, 20 yards. So I take my rifle. I've got a high-powered rifle with a high-powered scope on the rifle. And I looked through the scope at the creature. And I knew that after looking at it, I was in a situation because it was cold, you know, the moisture was coming out of its mouth, its nostrils. It looked really, really human. The face was human. The eyelashes, I could see the eyelashes, you know, the eyes, the teeth. The teeth were big, big teeth, flat teeth like our teeth. So anyway, I'm sitting there and I'm looking at it. And it just, it's really peed at me. And it lets out a roar like a lion. What's your name and where you're from? My name is Mike Woolley. I'm from Keatshaw, Louisiana. All right, Mike, so what got you interested in Skookum? Well, I was, I used to do a lot of deer hunting. And I had some sightings while I was hunting. And it really kind of was weird to me seeing these creatures. And I was more interested in them because, you know, being out in the woods hunting all the time and seeing a few of them, you know, I was kind of uncomfortable. I didn't know what they was or where they were from. So I wanted to get more information on them and try to learn more. But I was afraid to say anything because of the ridicule. I was kept silent for over 20 years because of, you know, what had happened to me. And here recently, about 2000, all the shows started coming on about the Sasquatches. You know, I saw people that was, you know, getting on TV and telling their stories. And, you know, the same thing basically happened to me. All right, if you don't know who we are, we're the Behavior Panel. And I'm Scott Rouse, I'm a Body Language Expert and Analyst and I train law enforcement in the military in interrogation and body language. And I created the number one online Body Language Course Body Language Tactics.com with Greg Hartley. Mark. I'm Mark Bowden. I'm an expert in human behavior and body language, help people all over the world to stand out, win trust, gain credibility, every time they communicate, including some of the leaders of the G7. I am Chase Houston in 20 years in the U.S. military. Read the number one bestselling book and behavior profiling, influence and persuasion. You can just type my name into the app store to get advanced training in all that behavior stuff. Greg. I'm Greg Hartley. I'm a former Army interrogator, interrogation instructor, resistance to interrogation instructor. I've written 10 books on body language and behavior, put together number one Body Language Tactics.com. Course with Scott Rouse and I spend most of my time on corporate America. All right, Mark. What do you got? Yeah, so look, just a couple of rules of thumb, and they really are rules of thumb, upward inflection and downward inflection. A downward inflection can denote certainty or command or finality to it. An upward inflection, more questioning, potentially a little more uncertain or looking for approval of it, or open to other input on it. Interesting, he says his name might woolly, and there's an upward inflection on it. Suggest to me he might want some reassurance, not about his name, he knows who he is, but some reassurance as a person, as he's being interviewed in this situation. Louisiana has a downward inflection. Louisiana, the state, does not need any assurance of what it is, so that's more certain. Deer hunting, downward inflection, and then we get our first uncertain upward inflection on creatures. So he's not quite sure what this thing is that he saw, though later on after uncomfortable, ridicule, silent, we get Sasquatch, so he is able to call it something. He's able to call it something, but it's still a creature before, so there's some uncertainty there. Happened to me, downward inflection. Look, so there's some certainty that something happened to him. He definitely isn't certain what he is, what it is, but he is prepared to call it something that other people have called it. There, that's all I got on that one. Scott, where do you go? Say Sasquatch again, Sasquatch, say it. Sasquatch. Okay, he goes straight into having seen a bunch of big feet, not just the one. This is a situation where as it goes along in these videos, you're going to hear how he's added just something here and something there and something here, and over the years this thing blows up into this big story about big foot, you know, you know. So we see very little in his head movements still, not a whole lot going on there, and right here he tells us the reason why he's telling this story, why he's into big foot because he thinks he can get on TV and talk about it, like all these other people had. He's like, I got a story like that, I can tell my big foot story. And it might have been a situation where he was sitting there with his wife and he said, you know what I want to do? I think I'm going to tell these people this big foot story. She said, don't do it. He's like, I'm going to do it. You dare me? I think maybe that might have triggered him going on TV as well, the combination of the two. And we're going to hear him going from seeing the big foot for the very first time to all these intricate things that happened where he's almost damn, big foot's almost his brother-in-law, and they go out and have a time-shared hilt in the head and all these things because he gets, he starts adding that many things to it. So it's, it's starting to, starting to smell a little bit here. Greg, what do you got? Yeah, I won't cover all that because we've got a lot to go in this show. But I will say this, I can see uncertainty in him. Mark, your point when he lilts up at the end of every one of those bump, bump creatures and you pay attention. His eyes are downright eye accessing. And we say that's emotional. That doesn't mean he's having an emotional moment about big foot. That means he may have uncertainty and he's got to be cautious and he didn't want to be whatever. Look, a lot of times these stories start, I'm a Southern boy. I grew up in places where there's always some thing in the woods that really doesn't exist. They're like Black Panthers running around and that, as they call them in Georgia and those kinds of things, mountain lions, those kinds of things, they really don't exist, but they're such a big part of folklore that people just keep going on and on and they keep expanding on it. You know, there's whole families of them and that kind of thing. I think what we find is often the genesis of what somebody thinks was a big foot can be simple and explained, but if it doesn't get explained, then it becomes part of that person's lore and they have to keep expanding it and keeping it alive. I tell everybody's story of the kid that was with me, a young PFC in the woods who saw a big foot came and got me and took me to see the big foot because I told him no way in hell there's a big foot out here. And it was a deer eating acorns out of a tree. Well, if I lived in the Bronx my whole life and I walked up and saw a deer walking around on its back legs, I might think it's a big foot too, but once you cleared it up, now he's like, oh, that was stupid. If you never saw it, never figured out what it was, he might tell the big foot story the rest of his life. Chase, what do you got? Yeah, so this social pressure he's worried about, the technical term for this is called folkways. This is a psychological term described what we should do, how we should act in certain social situations. They start getting enforced in elementary school when we make fun of someone for wearing a shirt that looks out of uniform or out of character for everybody else. So these are called folkways. At the large end, like murder, we have punishment. We have social punishment for doing and breaking norms. That's what that is. I want to get one thing out of the way here. I'm biased a little bit. I kind of want big foot to exist. I want to think that there's something cool out there. There's another creature. So I'm going to do my best to be unbiased in here. But I want to get something out of the way. When we make an analysis here, it's based on what we see. So keep in mind, we didn't ask the questions a certain way like an interrogator would. The way the questions are asked plays a really big part in how a person responds in a behavioral sense. Somebody's first time on camera, you're going to see a large fluctuation in that person's behavior. So like we see emotional accessing here, when he's talking about how strange it was. And in this video, we're seeing a few behaviors that might look like stress. There's chest breathing. There's a sharp increase in blink rate, which is a stress marker when he's initially discussing the sighting. And if you're learning behavior skills for the first time, it's easy to spot these things. But what might be difficult is spotting them starting to happen and identifying context. In this case, the breathing is consistent the whole video. So it could be the presence of the camera, the interviewers might just look like dicks. One thing to pay attention to is that you'll hear a lot of experts describe behaviors to you in a way that makes them look like a still image in your head. This is bad. So what I'm looking for, what you should be looking for are changes in behavior. So if you're a pro pilot means you're a change detector first. So when are these behaviors starting to occur and when does the change happen? All right, so state your name and where you're from. My name is Mike Woolley from Keatshaw, Louisiana. All right, Mike, so what got you interested in Skookum? Well, I used to do a lot of deer hunting and I had some sightings while I was hunting. And it really kind of was weird to me seeing these creatures and I was more interested in them because you know, being out in the woods hunting all the time and seeing a few of them, you know, I was kind of uncomfortable. I didn't know what they was or where they were from. So I wanted to get more information on them and try to learn more. But I was afraid to say anything because of the ridicule. I was kept silent for over 20 years because of, you know, what had happened to me. And here recently, about 2000, all the shows started coming on about the Sasquatches, you know, and I saw people that was, you know, getting on TV and telling their stories. And, you know, the same thing basically happened to me. And so why don't you go ahead and tell us about the experiences that you had? The first experience, I had a visual before this one, but I wasn't sure it was a bear. But the one that happened, the physical experience, was back in December of 1981. I was deer hunting. I went down the main highway, turned off on a secondary road, went about two miles back in a game reserve and took a left down the old logging road. The old logging road went about a mile back and dead ended. That's where I put my deer stand at the dead end. And I would park my truck halfway between there, about a half mile more, you know, because I didn't want to spook the deer driving in there. Well, I was sitting on the stand one December day. Temperature was about 35 degrees, nice weather for deer hunting. And I was facing north. And the timber to the right of me was real, real thick. You could even walk through it. There were so many bars, so many tight trees. Well, I was sitting there and I was looking north. And this little young doe come running up to my deer stand. I mean, she was real, real young. Usually deer run away from you, but she run up to my deer stand and actually lay down in front of my deer stand, touching the deer stand. It was a lean two ladder up against the tree. Well, she was panting. She was just foaming at the mouth. She'd been running hard. Well, the first thing that entered my mind, there's a big buck chasing her. Well, out of my peripheral vision, I saw something to the right of me, about 20 yards. And as I looked, it jumped behind the tree. And when I looked, it was a big black, tall, hairy, gorilla looking thing. You know, standing behind a tree, looking at me. And I first thought of somebody in a suit playing jokes on me. So here I am, you know, I'm chewing this thing out. I'm telling you, hey, you know, take your head off. This ain't no joke. You know, I'm sick of it. You know, you know, maybe mad. Get out of here. Well, this thing is just looking at me. You know, as I talk, it's looking up and down and checking me out. And so this goes on total 15 minutes. And I get to looking at it and the hair is just real shiny, you know. And I'm getting to thinking, man, somebody did a good job on that suit. And then questions started popping through my head. Like, is there a circus in town? Did a gorilla break out? You know, no. How could somebody come from that direction and stick as tight as it is? I couldn't even do it. You know, no. Well, all of a sudden, this thing, I got to noticing its eyes. And his eyes was real, real evil, real sinister looking. You know, the look it was giving me. And I was thinking, how can a human do that? Greg, what do you got? Now he's got my attention. He starts off talking about the one that happened, the one that happened. And he almost says that really happened, almost says his root. And he stumbles over some word there. That's a push-pull word in my world. Well, what do you mean the one that happened? I thought you said this had happened many times. You'd seen creatures. So I'd start poking him right there. This is starting to come apart for me. Then he goes down this typical hunt story. And look, watch his hands. Watch when he illustrates. He illustrates when he's talking about the deer. He illustrates when he's talking about the tree stand. When we say illustrators, we mean you're using part of your body to punctuate your thoughts or words. And you can see him doing that when he's talking about the deer and the lean-to tree stand. There's no hand movement when he gets down to talking about this critter. You know, we don't get any of that. I agree with you. This is a BS technique, Scott, to anchor on certain words and bring you back to those when the time comes. And then he gets to the whole thing about his gun. He rationalizes what it should be. I think that's a good example, Scott, of what you brought up earlier. If I can rationalize what it should be and then eliminate those, then it must be Bigfoot. You know, it could be a person in a suit. No. Could it be a gorilla that escaped? No. Could it be something else? No. Then it must be a Bigfoot. So I think we're seeing that storytelling starting to come apart. He also changes his time from 20 minutes to 15 minutes in the other story. Now, that's not really pertinent to whether he actually saw this thing or not, but there are details that are different in the stories. I think it's because he's going to do a movie. He's trying to keep it concise and clear. This is going to be in front of the whole world. He's thinking the other one for the travel channel don't know what he was thinking at that point. But the story doesn't sound quite as believable as it did with those edits from the travel channel. Mark, what do you got? Yeah. Yeah. So I'm concerned that he starts to want to tell another story and then discounts it and goes to this one. I do like, however, that he starts to... I mean, I like it in terms of his storytelling in that he starts to describe unnatural behavior of other animals before the main player comes in. And it's a brilliant storytelling technique. And you'll see it in films across history. Before the big monster player comes in, the earth or other creatures on the earth will start to behave abnormally. Wind will blow in weird ways. Little creatures will run in odd directions. Birds will go silent. And weird stuff happens before the unnatural starts to come in. That's a great piece of storytelling there. Jump behind a tree. There's a very strong illustrator there, but out of frame. Out of frame. And he's got quite a wide frame. So often we see that when somebody is willing to gesture a long way away from themselves, they might be distancing themselves from this situation. But verbally he's not. He's really a direct as well. But why put it so far from him? I don't like that. The gorilla reasoning. I like that there's reasoning there. I like that he gives a, you know, could be this. But just as you say, Greg, he then discounts rather than going, here's the reason for it being Bigfoot. And then we could discount gorilla by going, yeah, there's this reasoning for, but he just kind of negates it. I don't like that. I do kind of like that he gives it a theory of, he creates a theory of mind for the creature. It's sinister and it's evil. And that's usually pretty good if somebody's come up with a psychology for it. However, in videos that come up, this whole personification is going to escalate to some extraordinary degrees. So hang out for that. Scott, what do you got on this one? Yeah, I agree. That anthropomorphic turn into a human thing is starting to get on my nerves too. But now we've added, the part from where the deer was sweating to where now it's foaming at the mouth. So somewhere along the line, somebody said, hey man, you got to straighten that out. That's, it's a deer foaming at the mouth while sweating. Now he's added shiny hair and somebody in a Bigfoot suit or in an animal, some kind of suit. And he says he was hollering back and forth at it for 15 minutes. That's a long time. That's a heck of a long time to be yelling at anybody back and forth or hollering at something for 15 minutes. And they said, no, he didn't shoot it because it looked too human. But he didn't shoot. He wouldn't have shot in the air. He wouldn't have shot near it. He would have shot it. This guy would have shot. I'm under the impression he would have shot whatever it was. If he thought it was, wasn't human, being a bear or whatever, I think he would have shot it. There's no animation in his voice, no big illustrators. And the temperature he's talking about goes up five degrees. It was from a perfect 30 degrees before and now it's 35 degrees. But I think we saw the video from later on. So I think it's gone down. So here it's 35 degrees and in the later video, it's 30 degrees. And a lot of this is probably true because I'm seeing a lot of indicators of truth here. Where he's talking about where he drove, how he parked and how far he walked, those kind of things. That's the truth part of it because you got to mix these things with the truth so you can really say, oh, you know how far this is this. All these things happen. And he tells that. And so it looks and sounds like the whole thing is going to be true. And his skill at repeating the same thing has really gotten stronger from even the first video there. So he's got that old classic story telling down where he can create that picture in your mind. Now he's gotten to where he tells the story and as he goes through it and realizes it wasn't human. It wasn't human. He still doesn't shoot it even though he knows it's not human but it's too human looking. So he goes from knowing there's no escaped gorillas to wondering if there were any escaped gorillas. Or I guess here he was wondering if from knowing if later on that there weren't any. This is just a master storyteller. I don't think it gets much better than this. All right, Chase, what do you got? I just you guys covered all the markers that I had. So I'm going to cover every single truth signal in here just to make this interesting all of the truth signals that might be present. And when we say truth, we mean that person believes it. Let's make that clear. So it's kind of similar to the initial video. He's comfortable using his head as he narrates the story and he's using his head to say where things are. He's comfortable with the story. The details seem extremely similar to the initial video. A couple of things that change that kind of like Greg talked about war stories. This tone of his voice varies with baseline. And I think it's consistent with an incident recall. So when he starts telling stuff, this is just great storytelling here. And this body narration with the story. There's the deer foaming at the mouth. He's there's some narration there. The tree stand. And what he says out of my peripheral vision there was a short little eye and hand move together. So hands and eyes kind of move to the same side. And as human beings, if you believe you're alone and you see movement in your peripheral vision, that's a big deal. And when you're maybe telling the story to help someone realize how big of a deal it was, that might be the reason that he's kind of doing this and maybe gesturing out of frame. Just just throwing it out there. But the eyes were wide in surprise when he's mentioning gorilla looking thing. When he says the hair is shiny like this. He does this little gesture, I think without even if there's no rehearsal to that, I don't think whatsoever. But when he says there's a sinister look in face, he matches it with his eyebrows. You can see him squint and narrow his eyebrows. And he does it so quickly that I think he is unconcerned with our awareness of that facial expression, which suggests unrehearsed behavior. And in behavior profiling, I try to pay attention to two main elements. Number one, things that are hard to fake. And number two, things that are outside our awareness or things that happen unconsciously. And I think a lot of those are what I saw here. So just keep those two things in mind as we're moving forward. That's all I got. Oh yeah, okay. I give that to you, Chase. All right, thank you. And so why don't you go ahead and tell us about the experiences that you had? The first experience, I had a visual before this one, but I wasn't sure it was a bear. But the one that happened, the physical experience, was back in December of 1981. I was deer hunting. I went down the main highway turned off on a secondary road, went about two miles back in a game reserve and took a left down the old logging road. The old logging road went about a mile back and dead ended. That's where I put my deer stand at the dead end. And I would park my truck halfway between there, about at the half mile mark, because I didn't want to spook the deer driving in there. Well, I was sitting on the stand on a December day. Temperature was about 35 degrees. Nice weather for deer hunting. And I was facing north. And the timber to the right of me was real, real thick. You could even walk through it. There were so many bars, so many tight trees. Well, I was sitting there and I was looking north. And this little young doe come running up to my deer stand. I mean, she was really, really young. Usually deer run away from you, but she run up to my deer stand and actually laid down in front of my deer stand, touching the deer stand. It was a lean-to ladder up against the tree. Well, she was panting. She was just foaming at the mouth. She'd been running hard. Well, the first thing that entered my mind there's a big buck chasing her. Well, out of my peripheral vision, I saw something to the right of me, about 20 yards. And as I looked, it jumped behind the tree. And when I looked, it was a big, black, tall, hairy, gorilla-looking thing, you know, standing behind a tree, looking at me. And I first thought of somebody in a suit playing jokes on me. So here I am. You know, I'm chewing this thing out. I'm telling her, hey, you know, take your head off. This ain't no joke, you know. I'm sick of it. You know, maybe mad. Get out of here. Well, this thing is just looking at me. You know, as I talk, it's looking up and down and checking me out. And so this goes on total of 15 minutes. And I get to looking at it and the hair is just real shiny, you know. And I'm getting to thinking, man, somebody did a good job on that suit. And then a question started popping through my head. Like, is there a circus in town? Did a gorilla break out? You know, no. How could somebody come from that direction to stick as tight as it is? I couldn't even do it. You know, no. Well, all of a sudden, this thing, I got to noticing its eyes. And its eyes was real, real evil, real sinister looking, you know, the look it was giving me. And I was thinking, how can a human do that? So I took my rifle and it was a three-by-nine scope. I turned it down to three real low because the thing was right on top of me. And I picked my rifle up, I looked down at it, and I looked at its face and I could tell that, hey, this, there's something here. You know, this is a real deal. You know, I've got a count right here. You know, I've got a problem. And when I looked at him through the scope, he growled at me real, real loud. It made him, I mean, the, it went to horrible. He got really, really mad. I mean, he got, he got really antsy, you know, he got, he got froggy on me, you know. And then I got nervous. But when he growled over about a hundred yards away from me, there was a sharp whistle, a real, real shrill whistle. Well, he looked over at that direction and he whistled back the same way he was. The whistle came to him. Well, he looked at me and kind of grinned. But when he did that, I climbed down that 10 foot stand about seven foot more. And at that time I was in pretty good shape. I was 25 years old, about 150 pounds, and I could move. Well, I jumped off that stand, you know, and I took off running. And my legs felt like they weighed 200 pounds apiece. Well, I noticed over to my right, he was flanking me. He was running through the woods. So here I am. I've got a half a mile to get to my truck, but I feel like I'm not going to make it, you know. Well, I'm running hard as I can. He's over there to me about 20 yards running beside me. Well, when I got to thinking, what am I going to do when I get to my truck? How am I going to have time to unlock it without him getting on top of me? Well, when I got up to my truck, I turned to my left where he was coming and I fired up a shot just to try to buy myself some time. And I almost hit him in the head. Almost, I mean, the bullet was about three foot from it hit a tree in front of his head. Well, I got my truck unlocked. I was driving off. I looked in rear view mirror and the other one was coming up behind me on a walking road. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so there's a vocal click at the start of this one. That's that kind of thing that happens. Now, normally I'd be a bit concerned about that, but I think that's just a piece of punctuation. And we don't we don't hear it in many other places. So I'm not worried about that. Let's discount that. I really like when he's talking about that the creature is getting, I think it's antsy and froggy. I like that idea of something getting froggy. And that's great. And there's a shoulder sway of bravado from him. So he's kind of acting out the character. And I think that's not a bad thing, again, because he's he's inhabiting. He's personifying. It's it's really good storytelling and can point to something being quite true and accurate. Here's my problem. When he starts to talk about the chase, there's a massive tempo change. Now, fair enough, he's now into the chase sequence. So the storytelling could be changing because he's now into this this running situation. But but it's too different. It's too different. So I don't think this chase, I'm starting to think this chase bit didn't happen. And there's some logic there that misses. And there's half a mile missing in this story as well, where nothing like what happened in that half mile, just running or did you see other stuff or you're getting exhausted? Were you panicking? What was the feeling? Did you look? Did you get another look at anybody? Like how did you tell you whether it's it's all coming undone now? But Chase, you're optimistic about it. Prove to me otherwise or convince me at least. Sir, I'll give you the truth signals here because I told you I'm biased. You got a little bias going on. So as a quick pro tip when discussing optics, the first number is magnification. The second number is usually the diameter of the objective lens, the front lens. So I think it means three, two, nine, not three by nine, which means adjustable magnification. So he's rocking it down to minimum mag. But when he says, I looked at its face, he makes a very small sneer on his face, indicating that he's witnessing some kind of expression in his mind or that this was his emotional reaction to seeing the face in general. There's something here, this is the real deal. We hear that little thing come out. Eyes are widening. There's a brief expression of an eyebrow flash that's fleeting enough that it wasn't planned. I think this is a genuine feeling and expression so far. The eyebrow flashes are usually fleeting in most cases and there are exceptions to that. But when we hear him say he growled at me, if this was an artificial story, you'd be more likely to hear words of a narrator instead of the first person. Like I heard him growl. Instead, he's looking at the creature so he knows where it's coming from. And this is common and false stories when you hear things like this. Like I realized I wasn't alone in the room. You could just say I wasn't alone in the room or I noticed two men were standing in the doorway. You could say two men were standing in the doorway. So that's narrator versus first person experience. And he says to my right, he was flanking me gestures and he looks to his left. He says to my right and looks to his left. I thought that was unusual there. So that's one big thing I'll call out on that one. Great. What do you got? Yeah, you're dead on that one where he says it was on the right but uses his left hand when he's talking about it and looks over there. Now, maybe the camera is reversed, but if you pay attention later, you'll see that he uses his right hand when he's talking about the right. So we're pretty sure that that's correct. There's a lot of technical details here. A person who's using this level of technical details is using their knowledge of woods lore and that kind of thing so that they have credibility automatically because you're not going to challenge him on that. And he starts talking about gun caliber and he's talking to some Hollywood guy. Pray has no idea what he's talking about. It doesn't really matter when he talks about magnification of scope. That's just a technical thing that he's so comfortable with he can lean on and it's going to give him a space. Now, here's a couple of interesting things. Every hunter I've ever listened to tell stories, even though I didn't want to hear most of them, they would do the same thing. It would take longer for the occurrence to happen in their story than it actually took in real life. That's what we're seeing here. There are a couple of things here. We talk about stories needing a trigger and that trigger then having the need to create or fabricate your story and then be conflicted before you pitch it. We've done most of that and nobody is challenging him. So if he's also doing something that Scott and I've referred to as the romance, or he's paying really close eye contact to you when he's telling you this story, just looking to see if they're buying in. I would lean into him and ask a few questions. Wait a minute. Okay, I understand you were 20, 21. How did you, these guys were right there. You said they were right there by you, close enough that you could, looking through your scope, see their face and see all this stuff. They're whistling, they're growling, they're doing all this stuff. But you couldn't outrun, you could outrun them for a half mile. You, you outran these things that live in the woods that have to catch their own food because they apparently don't have weapons in that. You outran these things. How'd that happen? I would just ask that question and put him on notice that I'm onto his BS. But he's not forced to de-conflict this thing. So he's rattling along, telling the story is if. Couple of, you hit it dead on though Chase. Everything else is pretty smooth until he starts illustrating off here or there. We just let him go and we don't cause him to go into a spiral of the lie. That's part of why he's there. Scott, what do you got? All right. Now we've got a big foot that grins. We've got one that's thinking stuff. And he puts this idea in our head because he wants us to think it's something bad because it's thinking, oh, I got you now. Or what is it thinking? What it's doing that. And it's not good, whatever it is. And it's just like a movie. It's just like something you would watch. Kafka said, every man is necessarily the hero of his own story. And that's what he is. He's the hero of his own story here. And it could be a movie if you think about it. It has action, suspense, danger, guns, monsters, and fast cars. Everything you need for a hit movie. Everything you see at the movies today, that thing has it. He's got that figured out. He knows how to tell the story, how to sell something. And that's what he's doing. Anyway, so I think he's a great storyteller. And that's what we're seeing in here. And he's a great storyteller who's building that picture in your mind. He's doing a dang good job of it. And I'm sure that's why it was so easy to buy because you could tell the story really easily. And he sees himself getting on TV, which is he's starting to here in the Skookum thing. We were talking in between this, we were talking about how Skookum sounds dirty. We don't know what it is, but it doesn't sound right. All right, we good? Yeah. All right. So I took my rifle and it was a three-by-nine scope. I turned it down to three real low because the thing was right on top of me. And I picked my rifle up. I looked down at it and I looked at its face. And I could tell that, hey, there's something here. This is a real deal. I've got a count right here. I've got a problem. And when I looked at him through the scope, he growled at me real, real loud. It made him, I mean, it went to horrible. He got really, really mad. He got real antsy. He got froggy on me. And then I got nervous. But when he growled over about 100 yards away from me, there was a sharp whistle. A real, real shrill whistle. Well, he looked over at that direction and he whistled back the same way the whistle came to him. Well, he looked at me and kind of grinned. But when he did that, I climbed down that 10-foot stand about the 7-foot mark. At that time, I was in pretty good shape. I was 25 years old, about 150 pounds. And I could move. Well, I jumped off that stand, you know. And I took off running. And my legs felt like they weighed 200 pounds apiece. Well, I noticed over to my right, he was flanking me. He was running through the woods. So here I am. I've got a half a mile to get to my truck, but I feel like I'm not going to make it, you know. Well, I'm running hard as I can. He's over there to me about 20 yards, running beside me. Well, when I got to thinking, what am I going to do when I get to my truck? How am I going to have time to unlock it without him getting on top of me? Well, when I got up to my truck, I turned to my left where he was coming and I fired up a shot just to try to buy myself some time. And I almost hit him in the head. Almost, I mean, the bullet was about three foot from it hit a tree in front of his head. Well, I got my truck unlocked. I was driving off. I looked in the rear view mirror and the other one was coming up behind me on a walking road. The partner that I guess he had signaled that there was a situation was trailing me, which I didn't know he was trailing me because I didn't look back. I was looking over to the left. Well, I got him a truck and I mean, I just almost blew the engine up getting out of there. And I was really in a depression for about several years. I went deer hunt and I quit that area and moved over to a new area about seven, eight miles from there. And also over there I had five or six sightings and I saw how they would get under trees under cedar trees and lay on their bellies and they would catch turkeys coming in. I've seen that from my deer stand how they would do turkeys that was roosting. They would wait on them. So I've had quite a bit of experience for these things and it's awesome. Well, that's a great story. What do you got? So here now he is illustrating with his left hand when he's talking about the left, which makes us more suspect of last time when he said he was off to the left and used his right hand. So a little bit weird. He's making hard eye contact now. A lot of eye contact more than he should. We always say that too much eye contact is a bad thing. We're raised in the US to always believe that breaking eye contact is deception. Usually it's the other way and all four of us will tell you too much eye contact makes us uncomfortable. The only eye accessing mess. I see him do it all. Meaning looking around in his head is when he's talking about being depressed for a while. Now, wait a minute. Now he's had five or six sightings. Wait a minute. How did that happen? I thought the one that happened was no there. Now we get this is when you lean on this guy and you start asking him questions. You say wait a minute. You told me earlier the one that happened was this. Now you got five or six and I'm going to call BS on any animal laying on its belly and grabbing a turkey. I'm just going to call BS. I live in the woods. Turkeys are pretty damn smart. Not the domestic kind. Wild turkeys anybody who hunts will tell you there's some of the smartest animals they ever have to deal with. So he knows that he's going to do whatever it takes. I think he's fishing for how far he can go here. That's a pretty bold statement. I've seen a whole bunch of them and I've seen them laying on their belly grabbing turkeys is a little weird. I just that that seems of all the things he said. If he'd stuck with the original story we probably would be okay. And after he says that and he goes to it's awesome. He does a lip withdrawal which we usually associate with someone wanting approval for their message. So I think he's keenly aware that some of what he's saying may be perceived as not as less than true. And he's just going to float it out there and see where it goes. Scott, what do you got? All right. Now this big foot has a partner. So he's seen two big foots, big feet however you say grammatically correct in that world. And even through his depression he was seeing groups of them. Like you're saying Greg hiding and waiting and doing stuff like catching turkeys and things like there's a big herd of them out there near where he lives. But you know what he didn't do? Having said all that and seen all that haven't done all that. The one thing he didn't do ever was take a camera. Didn't take a video camera. Didn't do anything. He could have. They've been really really easy because he's seen so many of them. You think well if I go out today and see one his wife would have said why don't you take your camera with you and next time you're out there you just pull your phone out and take a picture man. Nothing. Nothing. Not once. So that makes me go this guy is just I wish I could be with you on this chase but I just can't do it man. I can't. I'll take it a step further. I know they're not endangered and I got a 270 with me. I might just have to have one of those. There's no limit. Stuff it. It's not regulated. You know I know there's a lot of them. What the hell they won't miss one. Stuff it and put it out in front yard. I'd be the guy who has big foot stuffed at my house. He'd be the guy. Mark what do you got? Yeah look I'm going to say fair play in a video coming up he is going to say that he does have photographs of them and we'll see what happens. We'll see what happens when he says he's got he's got photographs so wait on that one. But but here's what I've got on this. It becomes grandiose almost blew that engine up. It's like a grandiose idea and then a look for approval after that. So he knows it's a it's a big bunch of cards he's just played and he wants the engagement of the of the viewer at that point. The several years of of depression. This isn't terrible if you have have depression and very difficult to be honest about it to say hey I had depression for seven years. I think that's played though because honesty will equal honesty. If he's honest about that then surely he's being honest about everything else especially something which is socially very very sensitive especially at that at that time that he's telling that story to say you've had depression for a long time. If you're honest about that you wouldn't be lying about other stuff. Yeah they've now got friends he's social he's literally setting up social groups. It's going to get even more extreme in in in a moment's time which is great. Listen here's my biggest thing is I've had quite a bit of experience with these things. I've had quite a bit of experience. What do you mean quite a bit? Like how much exactly how much these things what are what things like tell me about describe the tell me about the thing name it give it a name give me give me way more detail on that and his blink rate is right up at that point. So I don't like it. I don't like it. I really liked it at the start. I'd love for this to be true and it's it's going in another direction for me. Maybe he'll turn it around. Chase what do you got there? Yeah so right at the depression for several years there's down left eye accessing and we move our eyes to access our brain in different different ways. And so we associate the down left with internal dialogue. Somebody talking to themselves or rehearsing that even if it's truthful then I would assume this would be him considering how to word this socially for the video. But if it's deceptive this might mean he's running through what's about to be said and how it's going to sound in his head. And as a quick note the word deer hunt is actually used as a verb in the south very regularly. I grew up about two and a half hours from where that guy lives. And it skips all over these other experiences like oh yeah I saw that one thing one time and then I've had several other experiences just skips right over that stuff. But then he details observing how they hunt. I think that's pretty suspicious. As another quick note when he says it's awesome. I think this might be a more religious or church based use of the word he may be referring to how southern churches commonly use this word awesome to describe God creation of life and stuff like that and they are in awe of what's happening. That's all I got. I'm going to go with Mark. Mark's look professional. Because I am a professional. The partner that I guess he had signaled that there was that situation was trailing me which I didn't know he was trailing me because I didn't look back I was looking over to the left. Well I got him a truck. And I mean I just almost blew the engine up getting out of there. And I was really in a depression for about several years. I would I would deer hunt and I quit that area and moved over to a new area about seven eight miles from there. And also over there I had five or six sightings. And I saw how they would get under trees under cedar trees and lay on their bellies. And they would catch turkeys coming in. I've seen that from my deer stand how they would they would do turkeys that was roosted. They would wait on them. So I've had quite a bit of experience with these things. And it's it's it's it's awesome. Well that's a great story. The next question plays into your story so tell us what you think and what is the nature of these creatures. Obviously if they wanted to hurt you they probably could have. Yes. What is the nature of these guys? What's their intentions? I don't I feel like the reason when you hear cases of people being attacked or run out I feel like this is their their home that you're in their home your trespassing. And I feel like I don't think they mean harm to anybody. I think they're kind of like people. You know you have thugs. You have crooks. You have athletes. You have movie stars. You have all kind of different walk people walks alive. And I think their attitudes each animal is got his own attitude. I think the one that got after me and run me off my stand he was probably seven foot tall four fifty five hundred pounds of great shape muscular build. I would say he was in his early 20s. What would you what kind of advice would you give somebody that's in a similar situation to you which rarely happens your situation is is rare. What would you what advice would you give somebody that finds himself face to face with assessments? First off try not to make eye contact. Don't point don't point any weapons at it. The best thing to do is to quietly move away from it. Don't don't make any advances because these animals are awesome. I mean they can they can rip a human in two. As a tiger can rip your face off with one swat. How big would you say the creatures that you saw were? Well I've saw some some some babies. I mean I've I've saw some babies. It's probably four foot tall one hundred fifty two hundred pounds. I've saw some probably bumping eight foot tall probably five five fifty six hundred pounds. All right. Chase what do you got? You want me to cover truth or potential deception? Oh I'd love to hear some truth if you have some me too. I'll cover the potentially truthful point too. I'll do my best. Well that was Chase Hughes. What do you got? There is a shift to internal dialogue at the beginning. So number one that could be I'm rehearsing you know what I've said before which doesn't necessarily indicate a line. Right when they said if they wanted to hurt you they probably could have. There's an immediate shift to down center which we typically associate with self-reflection. So he's pondering the question is he or is he pondering like maybe if one of those varmints existed could they actually whoop my ass maybe he's doing that if they existed who knows everything here might look a little more honest with a few exceptions which I'm sure all what these guys say won't amount to very much his routine shift to internal dialogue is inconsistent with his baseline. So that might be a damning thing but if you consider the individual difference between recalling an event you experienced or believe to have experience that might be the key versus someone asking you a question about your internal thoughts and feelings about that event. You're no longer recalling your processing information because they're asking you to do so. Hopefully that was similar and good Scott. I'll let you have it. Yeah. All right. Well once again he's seen everything from baby big feet to Jim right big feet from killers to teenagers and get a picture. Yeah thugs didn't get a picture not once he's breaking them down into personality types about what they like and they don't like at this point. Now remember we don't nobody has a good picture of one nobody has a video but he's already broken them down personality wise that's what's going on with him. He knows what makes him angry. He knows what makes him what pointing does to him how that makes him mad and how you're in their home and that makes him mad. Now I'm like I'm not going to focus a lot on body language here but if I was this guy here's what I'd do since I'd know so much about him I'd give him hats some little pipes and some little purses and things I'd get him a cat and I'd build him a house and I'd rig it with all these cameras and stuff and I have a subscription on the YouTube channel and it would be called Scott Rouse's Big Foot Reality and then I teach him how to smoke cigarettes and teach him how to cuss and him out there dancing around drinking beer and telling loud nasty jokes and put them on unicycles and then you pay like ten bucks a month to watch this on YouTube live what else happening with him and if you went there you could pay 40 bucks and you can go in and pay ten bucks for a coke to get them like they do those bears out in Gatlinburg where they catch a bear and you feed it a coke for ten bucks that's what I'd be doing at this point but I'm sure they form a union and you know kick me out but at that point I'd have like a monocle and a cane and I'd take on some weird accent and be you know like welcome to you know whatever you know like they they did on that dinosaur show that's what I'd do anyway Greg what do you got no no I know exactly what he should do for a living he should be the guest the weight of the big foot at the Big Foot Fair because he's of dental about every one of those weights I'm gonna use that because it's okay weights and heights he almost smiles here's what I love and Chase you're right there's one place where I see honesty and it's because the questioner just absolutely sucks and the questioner asked him a conjecture question what do you think the nature of the Big Foot is well he has to go internal conversation because he's got to think of well I don't know what do you want me to tell you then we get into the whole science of Big Footery as I said a long time ago every time you talk to these guys there's all kinds of stuff like they communicate with rocks and they whistle and if you watch them on TV people really believe this stuff they've seen them they all believe that that's his baseline when he isn't prepared when he starts going to an internal conversation and he's trying to respond interestingly when he almost smiles you see that almost break of a smile when the guy says this is a great story I love that because I think he's like yep this is a great story I think he knows but then he goes on the trespass when he says trespass there's a pregnant pause there and when a person does that pregnant pause they're waiting for your reaction he says I think it's because of trespassing in my note I said this to you Scott I think here begins the culture of Big Foot we're no longer just talking about we're no longer just talking about them as things we've seen now they're giving him a chance to pontificate on what they must be like so now he doesn't have to lie he can just make up whatever he wants because they're asking his opinion don't point no eye contact for God's sake don't point a weapon at them and do not laugh is what I have in my notes and you might piss them off and there's the inevitable tiger reference Mark there's a tiger reference here we had to have it they'll tear your face off like a tiger I don't know guys this started off being kind of believable because that's what editing does this is getting more and more comical as we go Mark what do you got yeah yeah so number one I think that the Scott Rouse circus side show would be fantastic and and I look forward I look forward to that good old southern entertainment and they'll see how far it is too so if you need some time good old southern entertainment Scott Rouse circus side show Bigfoot Bonanza so coming to a youtube channel near you here's what it but here's here's the the only two things I can add here's what it is Scott it's the Smurfs this is this is basically what the Smurfs was I mean obviously the Smurfs were smaller but they live in a forest and they all have little professions you know and they have argument and they they just have this it's it's like any woodland folk essentially it's it's it's it's fairies it's pixies it's gnomes it's the Smurfs you know and they always and they got little bags and they they do all their little chores and they've got all this family stuff going on and they have little disputes with each other and for an episode and I mean it's it's the beautiful stuff of that and that's what he's inventing why because we love that kind of idea it's a great great idea as the guy says it's this is this is a great story it goes another direction for me when he says they can rip a human into well when did you see that I mean you just conjecturing that like I think I think they could or I saw them rip this thing into a deer into so I reckon they could rip a human being into no he says they can rip a human when did you when did you see that happen to know that to be true it's like nobody asks that nobody asks that oh I'm sorry like now I've just got look I've just got how disappointing how disappointing I'm really because I really wanted I really wanted this to go somewhere and now it's now it's an episode of the Smurfs anyway let's see if it gets any any better that's all I got on that one you know what this is he wants you to be afraid of it but he has a special relationship this is scary in the Henderson's right right right you know the sad part is I when I first watched the first video I was like hey this looks pretty credible yeah I started looking you look at video one it's nothing like you know that first one nothing like this but hang on buckle up it gets a lot better he's going to talk about the one that's an ENTJ nailed it the next question plays into your story so tell us what you think and what is the nature of these creatures actually if they wanted to hurt you they probably could have yes what is the nature of these guys what's their intentions I don't I feel like the reason when you hear cases of people being to act to run out I feel like this is their their home they're you're in their home your trespassing and I feel like I don't think they mean harm to anybody I think they're kind of like people you know you have thugs you have crooks you have athletes you have movie stars you have all kind of different what people walks alive and I think their attitudes each animal is got his own attitude I think the one that got after me and run me off my stand he was probably seven foot tall four fifty five hundred pounds great shape muscular build I would say he was in his early 20s what would you what kind of advice would you give somebody that's in a similar situation to you which rarely happens your situation is rare what would you what advice would you give somebody that finds himself face to face with assessments first off try not to make eye contact don't point don't point any weapons at it the best thing to do is to quietly move away from it don't don't make any advances because these animals are awesome I mean they can they can rip a human in two as a tiger can rip your face off with one swat how big would you say the creatures that you saw were well I've saw some some some babies I mean I've I've saw some babies that's probably four foot tall 150 200 pounds I've saw some probably bumping eight foot tall probably five five fifty six hundred pounds the reason I didn't shoot it is it was just too just too human the face it was a bipedal you know it walked two legs on two legs just like we did but it was just too human the face was too human the eyelashes the teeth the jaw structure the forehead it was a light brown the face was light brown like it had a dark suntan but I couldn't pull the trigger because something told me this ain't right it's not the right thing to do yeah so the reason we plug this one in here is because all that credibility up front is because he's telling a story without anyone challenging he's just been challenged here he's asked why didn't you shoot it well look okay I get why you didn't shoot the first one why wouldn't you shoot some of these later ones the ones that were scaring you and doing that kind of thing but it'll get better let's just hang in there so here what we do he's got way too much eye contact and then he is I think when he's looking off to the to the side there it's because he's looking off at some some part of the crew that's there to film but this is what should have happened earlier and he would not have looked as credible as he did in the very first part of this video chase what you got yeah for some reason I don't feel like talking about deception here I'm just going to talk about something else let's talk about the psychology of this there's a shift to emotional recall actually when he's thinking about why didn't I shoot this thing you could see him go to emotional recall eyes go down and right I think this if this happened this might be logical as he's recalling the feeling of observing a human like creature and in Japanese psychology this is referred to as the uncanny valley where the closer and non-human thing is to a human the more strange and uneasy it automatically makes us feel so the other side of this spectrum is called automatonophobia that's a real word you can look it up which is an excessive fear of human like objects so in general it's really common for people to feel weird or uncomfortable in the presence of human replicas so like if you ever go to a store where there's mannequins and you just try this out get your face close to that mannequin face it will feel strange so while there's a lot of figures like mannequins or robots that resemble humans we inherently have the awareness that they're not real which gives us that feeling of being chilling or unsettling I'll just leave that there Mark, what do you got? Yeah there's going to be a lot of police calls from stores with going we've got somebody in our store who's standing really close to the mannequin they won't move but we were feeling what would be handcuffs right right but they watch the behavior panel ah yeah they do okay that's why there's been a lot of that going on this week okay um look here's what does make sense to his story it does make sense that if he's seeing somewhat of a human face that he may not shoot that we have a wiring a hard wiring and instinct for us to to not shoot other human beings there's quite you know tough training to get people to to shoot at other people they tend to shoot wide if they see the face it's really important if they see those eyes if they see a mouth they'll shoot wide on that it's so so I I get it there's some rationality to to that and then he looks off he I avoids now I get your point Greg that he may be looking at at somebody else but why just then why use why take that distraction yeah I think I think he's come up with something plausible when when put to the wire and questioned he's come up with something in my mind that's plausible but he doesn't quite believe it and he's looking for approval elsewhere is the way I would I would read that Scott what do you got on this one all right you guys covered what a little there is there so he claims to be a big hunter that's his thing that's all he talks about something every time he talks he talks about his hunting and that's where he sees these things and of course the easiest way like you guys were saying to get out of shooting it is to say it looks too human he didn't any details all the things to qualify his answer and you're right Greg this is his first time he's been challenged and in the liar's loop they got five parts you've got the trigger because the guy butts up against him so he's got to add more things gotta start lying so he fabricates the lie then he de-conflicts it then he pitches then he has to defend it he doesn't have a whole lot of time to de-conflict in there that's why it starts sounding weird I think so when he pitches again he comes back and pitches he has to remember everything he's talked about so he can defend it so well defend it well so I think that's that's what we're seeing there so you guys covered everything but I'll tell you one of my red flags there is just everything's too clean and clear as an overall I haven't said that part about the defense part and the de-conflict it's really clean it's really clear so obviously it would be because through the years he's told this story so many times and he's just started adding like I said at the beginning little parts here and there little parts now he's got a culture he's got for him he's got everything you need to have this smirks like Mark was saying have a little town of them you know that's why I need to come and watch my channel Scott Rouse's Big Foot Reality the reason I didn't shoot it is it was just too just too human the face it was a bipedal you know it walked two legs on two legs just like we did but it was just too human the face was too human the eyelashes the teeth the jaw structure the forehead it was light brown the face was light brown like it had a dark sun tan but I couldn't pull the trigger because something told me this ain't right it's not the right thing to do something happened like when was the first time that what how were you before Big Foot before your awareness of Big Foot well I never believed in it because you know I've been in the woods 50 something years in my life I've seen a lot of stuff and a lot of stuff I've seen I wouldn't come back and tell nobody because just to me it was unbelievable you know this plant I worked on I worked on a large factory and I've seen stuff in that plant you know people would just have breakdowns of those in mind stuff like that and all kind of weird stuff would happen and I'd come home and I'd tell my friend and they said no no way that didn't happen you know it was unbelievable in the same way out there and I just you know keep to myself and because you know if a person got to work they was a hunter which is what I did and if they were a liar okay you killed your credibility with me I took that serious if I told you I killed 18-point buck I killed 18-point buck right you know I've got the I've got the racks lined up the house all about the 20s you know big racks that was my thing be yourself and be honest I have walked seven miles I've parked my truck and then way back then we didn't have four-wheelers we didn't have three-wheelers we didn't have none of that and you know I've parked my truck and walked in six, seven miles been stuck before I walked down 10 miles of the door without a flashlight oh right right you know because that's how it goes you know and I bought a new truck one time in 78 and I went hunting it was a really nice truck and I'll never forget when I went in I always checked for tire tracks to see if anybody's in there else yeah yeah well when I got back to my truck it was piled up somebody had piled a bed full of limbs and there was limbs all over the hood and there were no tracks coming in nobody had been in there and and that was the time that that was in 1978 November 78 there was my truck brand new it just bought it and it kind of got me upset you know I'm going to go first on this one I don't think the guy asking questions was prepared I thought I'm going to know what to ask when I go in there because it's Mike Woolley and I know I'll bat big foot because I'm a big foot guy myself that's why the all the questions we're going to see from here on out are oddly delivered as he does that because he really hasn't sat down didn't make a list he wasn't prepared he didn't prep for this he keeps stroking his beard because that's an example of and that's an example of blending cues together where he's being unsure and it's a pacifier at the same time and we call that manipulating he's manipulating his beard he's goofing around with it at the same time it's a repetitive gesture or repetitive cue so that lets us know it's an adapter so it's a blend of those two together and let's pay attention to the interview on the left he's because as the videos go on he becomes more and more uncomfortable as he's realized and this is going way deeper than he thought it was going to be and the was going to get a lot deeper too so watch him become more uncomfortable as things go along and the little one over there with the beard it just keeps getting worse for him because he he he is a true believer he's bought into this thing he's in 100% he's there now when Mike starts talking about liars that other guy's leg starts to stretch out and starts making that little circle his foot starts making that little circle there there so he wants to say something so bad he doesn't want because he's realizing he's going to look goofy on this I think that's the impression I've got and Mike's over there selling it man he's over there not moving anywhere and and on him and he's just leaning into it hard and he's using what I learned from Greg was one time I called Greg and I said I'm dealing with a guy who who I think stolen some money and he's got this weird look on his face and I said I sent Greg a little clip of the video and you remember what you told me Greg? that was his teaching face yeah and I'd never thought about that before but that was perfect and it was and Mike Willie has on his teaching face he's got that head right back and he's telling the way things are and all that and that's what this guy was doing and I didn't it didn't look quite like that in the video I sent Greg but it was the same idea and I was like as brilliant I've never seen that before so he's educating him about the Bigfoot Society that he's created in his head because as the years go on he's added all these things and he's had to sit home and think about that when he's laying up at night going I've got to add this to that I've got to that's how this world this whole Bigfoot world he's created came to be because all these little things he's added to be more of a hero of his own story has created a monster for him and he's got to stay on top of that thing so he's got to be the guy telling you all about it or he wants to be because at this point he is especially in the Bigfoot world I can't believe we're doing this you guys nobody's gonna be watching this far anyway just what he's got I was watching these videos at 5 a.m. in the restaurant in the hotel which is empty this morning and the guy who's making the coffee came by and says oh you're working early he's like what are you doing and I said Bigfoot and he goes oh the first sign of fidgeting or stress here is where he's describing his friends not believing him and I think this is a genuine sign of personal stress the feet go crazy some people who might have just read a book on body language or something see this little toes going up and see oh that's an anti gravity gesture they're like that's celebration feet are going crazy up and down but only for that moment and this is what I meant by change detection we're seeing a change in behavior here and as a quick rule of thumb when we're talking about the feet the further a body part is from the head the harder it is to control during stress or tension or as Mark might say stress and pressure so the second repetition of this is during the tire track statement I think he knows that when he's talking about tire tracks this is partially untruthful this is an even higher spike in the stressful behavior I don't think he always checked I don't think I think at this if this thing actually happened he forgot on this specific trip to the woods when he's saying limbs in bed he speaks about the truck in the same way the bed the hood the bed this sounds and appears semi honest here I can't point to a very direct indicator of deception for that but there's something spiking in the behavior every time he mentions the truck being brand new in this video you can see it in his feet and his hands here and I'm doubtful the truck was brand new but that's totally irrelevant as a detail but relevant as a behavior that you can use to look at some of these videos that are coming up or some of the other interviews of him I wish every video we analyzed on this channel had a full body shot like this where we can see an entire human being with the feet in it and if you want to practice when this video comes back on the screen I want you to try this to train yourself for behavior profiling you can watch his face and let your peripheral vision catch the movement of the feet and the other body parts this is one thing you can totally train your brain to be more conscious of and you can see a lot more than you think in your peripheral vision I think I went a little long there I apologize Greg what do you got? Yeah so let's talk about that deception around the truck I think there is a great indicator he does a pregnant pause right when he says the hood boom he stops people don't do that except for to see what your reaction is going to be and people do that about meeting a celebrity you know I met Dr. Phil and they stop and give a pause so that you respond that's what they're doing it for it's a fishing move he also that thing that you were talking about with his feet instead of it being I agree with you instead of it being gravity-defying I see it as a territory stomp it's ba-boom ba-boom when he does it every time we'll pick it up and you'll be able to see here's for me the interesting piece the guy on the right if you're looking at the two interviewers is enamored of this guy clearly I mean you just can't miss it and he is in his teaching spot or holding court if one of us was sitting talking to people and they're asking us about what we do it's the same effect they're all circling around and listening but the guy on the left gets it because when he says lie you see that foot it's like hmm something's up the other one is okay wait a minute I come here and talk to you about big foot and now are you going to tell me that weird stuff is happening in the plant where you used to work I'm out of here I'm done that's for us over right there I now know you're a ghost story guy and whatever happens we probably were a tenfold hat and I'm going to go after that and you know just say yeah that's that he does a single shoulder shrug at break down and then he goes into this whole qualifying as expertise this is almost like a magic trick almost like slide of hand if I give you enough woods lore that I appear to be Davey Crockett then anything I say about the woods must be true and that's the approach he's taking is he's just spilling all this data about the woods that people may or may not know and that makes it hard to challenge him once he's got this guy once he's gotten them down then he starts telling all kinds of stuff and I think now it's it's an age old once I qualify myself here through my resume statement to use your words chase about all I know about the woods now I you could not have possibly seen what I've seen look even at the plant I saw things that other people didn't see so look I'm the guy this is kind of a chest beating alpha male if you will a big footery mark what do you got yeah the beauty of this for me like you were saying Scott is is watching those guys who are interviewing him and and looking at how different they are in terms of their optimism and skepticism about it I love it when when the guy says be yourself and be honest and there's a big adapter from one of them around that who's who is not quite sure honesty is is really a play here one last thing to say about this just a great example of how not to ask a question because he goes through dual did something like when what how were before before awareness I mean he goes all goes through so many different themes and and options to get to well I don't know what the question is at the end actually and so woolly gets to answer it with with a prepped reflection with a with a prepped idea what could have been actually quite a good reflexive question is just mangled mercilessly at the start if something happened like when was the first time that uh what how were you before bigfoot before your awareness of bigfoot well I never believed in it because you know I've been in the woods 50 something years in my life I've seen a lot of stuff and and and a lot of stuff I've seen I wouldn't come back and tell nobody because it just to me is unbelievable you know this plant I worked I worked through a large factory and I've seen stuff in that plant you know people would just have breakdowns of losing my mind stuff like that all kind of weird stuff would happen and I'd come home and tell my friend this no no way that didn't happen you know it was unbelievable in the same way out there and I just you know keep to myself right and uh uh because you know if a person got to work they was a hunter which is what I did and if they were a liar okay uh you killed your credibility with me I took that serious if I told you I killed 18-point buck I killed 18-point buck right you know uh I've got the I've got the racks lined up the house all about the 20s you know big racks uh that was my thing be just be yourself and be honest I have walked seven miles I've parked my truck and and way back then we didn't have four-wheelers we didn't have three-wheelers we don't have none of that and you know I've parked my truck and uh walked in six seven miles been stuck before and walked down 10 miles in the door without a flashlight oh right right you know because that's how it goes you know and I bought a new truck on time at 78 and I went hunting it was a really nice truck and uh I'll never forget uh when I went in I always check the tire tracks to see if anybody's in there else yeah yeah well when I got back to my truck it was piled up somebody had piled a bed full of uh limbs and there was limbs all over the hood and there were no tracks coming in nobody had been in there and and that was the time that that was in uh 1978 November 78 there was my truck brand new I just bought it and it kind of got me upset you know I know how it feels to walk with a rifle and have that feed you back and kind of bolster you up make you stand tall and if you're very skilled with that rifle you should stand tall how do you feel now about having a rifle and not just because of your own experience but your knowledge of bigfoot these creatures and what does that rifle speak to you now in terms of what confidence that you should hold on I'll give you a good example yes when I was hunting that day I had a 270 correct one of the finest deer rifles around she's a 130-grain bullet which is not a big bullet but it's a good flat shooting bullet kill a lot of deer with it he uh that creature made me uh feel like I had a BB gun well I'm getting ready hopefully near I'm gonna go El Contin start El Contin and I found this rifle down at a dealership in Houston, Texas where they have rifles from boy back when you were a kid kid and they had the gun was brand new and so I bought a 300 magnum I said this time when I go you know it ain't gonna be no little 270s and 30 out of 60s I got a 300 magnum BAR something's you know shooting some pretty good flares but I have to because that's what I happen that day I had a 7 millimeter magnum and it makes that 270 look like a BB gun categorical difference just I mean you know I've said targets a friend one day we were shooting and we were shooting at 100 yards and he shot my 270 at a tree shoot the target and I hear the bullet you know but when he shot that 7 magnum it was just and in power yeah that bullet and it went out the back of the tree the tree was that big around he wasn't that impressed a heck out of me right and and it's always come down to it you know what would I've done if I'd have had that 7 magnum day I don't know if he could have intimidated me as bad you know and so that's why I bought this big caliber right with this 300 magnum and that's what you had now yeah so when I do a well cutting I'll be toting that Mike what do you got yeah I mean there's just one thing on that for me which is the idea of I bought a 300 magnum so it must be true I mean because I went out and purchased this thing obviously it must be true he does he does let go of the idea that he was actually shooting elk and his and his 270 wasn't really adequate for that and so there is an alternative reason for buying a 300 but he's kind of going look obviously I went out and purchased this so must be must be true that's all I got on that one because it for me it just starts to talk talk specific tech that he knows is going to draw draw in those interviewers but if you're not into that tech you're just going what are you talking about why why is this relevant and it and it from a little bit of research it's not really that relevant but Greg tell tell me how well the same thing same thing is it for elk or is it for big foot don't know but you know I mean look if I were that afraid of big foot that I didn't think a 270 would take him out I might not go back in the woods I might stay and as much as he's seeing big foot at the mall and everywhere else I might move to a new state but who knows I think when people see big foot they see big foot I think it's just the way it is the guy on the left does a pride and you go up starts talking to him about giving him the chance to run right back into more wood lore and he goes right in it and then mark I think is just ancillary to the story the firearms just ancillary it puts him back into woods gives him more things to talk about gives him more credibility and the guy on the on the right side is just in data and takes it in there he's still in the hammer chase what do you got uh that I'll just say this from zero behavior perspective at all a 300 magnum will not go through a tree that big period unless the tree is dead the U.S. Navy which I served in for 20 years has a sniper rifle called the mark 13 which I'm very familiar with it will not go through a tree it won't go through a tree that big well about that big not going to happen so uh I'll just call that one on that Scott all right this is what I call he-man talk because when guys get together and start talking about guns and protection and what they do if this happened and I do this if that happened they love to say what happened during that and these these guys sitting on the on the couch are like two little boys watching somebody tell them a story and I know what that looks like because there was when I was little we lived in a town called Louisa Kentucky and the guy that cut my brother's in my hair my hair was a guy named Ronnie Lakin and one time he told this story about the time he took his own tonsils out and it was aimed at us because we were sitting there listening to him and I'm sure everybody was when I think back about it I know that's why he why he did it because I went home my dad was a doctor and I told him the story about how Ronnie took his own tonsils out and we bought it and these guys are buying it they're they're in as hard as they can maybe that one that's closest to us isn't in as deep but that one on the other side with the beard man he's all in and he believes Ronnie Lakin took his own tonsils out so that's what I see do you think anybody's still watching? oh yeah oh yeah I think so too yeah yeah yeah if you're watching hang on it gets better yeah if you're watching comment and hit like I know how it feels to walk with a rifle and have that feed you back and kind of bolster you up make you stand tall and if you're very skilled with that rifle you should stand tall how do you feel now about having a rifle and not just because of your own experience but your knowledge of Bigfoot these creatures and what does that rifle speak to you now in terms of what confidence that you should hold on? I'll give you a good example yes when I was hunting that dad at a 2 7 correct one of the finest gear rifles around she's a 130 grain bullet which is not a big bullet but it's a good flat shooting bullet a lot of deer with it he that creature made me feel like I had a BB gun well I'm getting ready hopefully near I'm going to go El Contin start El Contin and I found his rifle down at a dealership in Houston Texas where they have rifles from boy back when you were a kid kid and they had the gun was brand new and so I bought a 300 magnum I said this time when I go you know yeah it ain't going to be no little 270s and 30 out of 60s I got a 300 magnum BAR something that's you know shooting some pretty good lead if I have to because that's what I have that day I had a 7mm magnum and it makes that 270s look like a BB gun correct categorical difference just I mean I set targets a friend one day we were shooting and we were shooting at 100 yards and he shot my 270 at a tree shoot the target and I hear the bullet you know but when he shot that 7 mag it was just and in power yeah that bullet and it went out the back of the tree the tree was that big around he wasn't not that impressed a heck out of me right and and and it's always come down to it you know what would I have done if I had that 7 mag that day I don't know if he could have intimidating me as bad you know and so that's why I bought this big caliber rock with this 300 magnum and that's what you had now yeah so when I do the well cutting I'll be toting that Mike have you measured or have you been able to keep track of I don't know the frequency or the volume of reports that you've heard have they been increasing over the years or has it given the response steadily increasing steadily increasing yeah why do you think that is I think the populations is growing number one and I think the and you know when a creature you know when he's born and he gets a certain age though the old dude in the group he's going to kick him out correct and then you know especially if you know if he looks at one of the old dudes girls you know you ought to make it out and I think that's where a lot of trouble comes happens or the one that I got into it with he was he was built like a bodybuilder he had no bad on me I mean he was bowed up and I think one of the old dude kicks him out they're mad and I think that's how sometimes you get a rogue male you know he's he's he's on the tear he's mad and he's looking for another clan to get in and the only way he's going to get in that clan he's going to take that old man out yeah and so he's mad okay uh and uh I think that's where a lot of trouble the zero serious encounters happen when you run in you know a cat like that you know yeah wow this is awesome all right Greg what do you got so now by this point if you've watched the behavior panel for going on three years you know why I wanted to do bigfoot because I was pretty sure this is what we would end up with and there's a whole lot of stuff here this guy's a great storyteller look at the guy on the left he's clearly now aware of the camera and he's paying real close attention to it our storyteller has slowed down he's speaking very slowly and he's pontificating at every turn he gives him a chance he's now getting into all kinds of stuff about he's I say now he's Jane Goodall of the bigfoot because he's figured out all their culture how all their stuff works what they're mating rituals and some of them are bowed up and bodybuilding but when he talks about the one being mad he adapts by rubbing his hands on his feet and legs look guys this is we're getting close to just about done here I think with any credibility that he brought in the beginning this is a great example of why you have to be careful what you watch and how edited it is Scott what do you got all right again he he starts talking about bigfoot as a creature he I don't think we've heard him say bigfoot have we have we heard him say bigfoot or he always calls it the creature or these creatures I don't know if some he separates himself from it so we'll say man you're talking about bigfoot no they get offended when you call him bigfoot that's oh they do yeah I'm sure okay because and that's why they're that's what makes it more okay I got it I don't know but throughout all this stuff where he knows about what they do he knows they're he's got the hierarchy figured out he knows they're in they're in packs or groups he knows how the how the the main how the alpha of the bigfoot pack kicks out the one who's like looking at the other the girls big the girl bigfoot's all that stuff but you know what hadn't taken any pictures of him didn't set up any cameras on him not once no pictures does he show we'll get to that in just a minute though so over the years he's told this story like I said earlier so many times he's added so many little things to this he's he has not only you see that he's the bigfoot master he's like the master of the bigfoot world this is the guy this is the main guy who's the UFO guy you were talking about Greg what's his lasar he's the Bob lasar of the bigfoot so he knows everything about him he knows that he knows he knows in depth all the secrets the way they act the way they're raised all these things and it's all coming from what he's heard about big heard about bigfoot pack things heard about wolf packs and dears how they live and what happens with them and gorillas he's heard about I'm sure growing up in school and squirrels and all these how they all act in nature and he's just put that on them is what he's done along with layering over the anthropomorphic side of it where they're they're almost human chase what do you got you want me to be an advocate I'm gonna be an advocate yeah do it man go sure he's gonna just really need some support I'm losing yeah I'm losing so much ground and I'm gonna wait till the very end to say whether or not or what my verdict is I'm gonna wait till the end I can't wait so right here we have good body narration there's a few gaps there is a consistent blink rate throughout the entire video so the whole video consistent blink rate this video as opposed to the other one there's abdominal breathing abdominal when he's usually a chest breather abdominal is suggestive of more relaxation but as a quick devil's advocate when you have two people like that sitting in front of you it can make you relax and become a little bit silly let's just say that but the only stress here is a small bit of fidgeting and some foot movement that we're a little familiar with around his theory about these rogue males but I wouldn't I would say to all you three this isn't deception because it's a theory so there's not much here in terms of potential deception at all because he's discussing a theory so take that Mark we'll take that and we'll run with that because he is discussing the shoddy theory of alpha male behavior which came from monitoring wolves in captivity and then the results of monitoring wolves in captivity being positioned over the top of human society so we get this idea that there is always like one alpha male no not in wolf packs at all at all in fact they'll swap out who's leading between males and females depending on what job needs doing just like human society in fact just like any social mammal society you don't have one entity in charge all the time they take turns depending on what the job is and we now know that in his you know Bigfoot Smurf land people have different jobs and so that's just like our land which means your CEO boss yeah when they go to their club isn't the leader of the club they're they because they don't want to be it's like I'm in charge of that I don't want to be in charge of this they're not alpha all the time is that so all he's done so I know it's bunk because if he'd really watched a social mammal group he wouldn't be seeing any of the stuff that he's talking about he wouldn't be seeing one male that chucks out all the other young males vying for the any social mammal group will be as big as 800 which means as the if you were the male in charge you can't afford to just throw out every male like you can't know you can't reproduce at that level also you'll just get such in breeding everything will die so look it's utter utter bunk and and he hasn't he's just watched too many bad shows with this idea of the of the you know society of the alpha which is utter utter nonsense and and totally inaccurate so there we go was that the kind of response you were looking for chase you and your stupid education exactly well the other thing is we know that they can tear men in half so they could at least tear another big foot's arm off I'm sure totally why send them out just yeah rip them up and then baby we haven't seen we haven't heard and talked about fighting have we no no oh I'm putting a wrestling ring in mind I'm doing BMA big foot Mike have you measured or have you been able to keep track of I don't know the frequency or the volume of reports that you've heard have they been increasing over the years or is it just a response steadily increasing steadily increasing yeah why do you think that is I think the populations is growing number one and I think the and you know when a creature you know when he's born and he gets a certain age though the old dude in the group he's gonna kick him out correct and then you know especially you know if he looks at one of the old dudes girls you know you automatically out and I think that's where a lot of the trouble comes or happens the one that I got into it with he was he was built like a bodybuilder he had no bad on me I mean he was bowed up and I think one of the old dude kicks him out they're mad and I think that's how sometimes you get a rogue male you know he's he's he's on the tear he's mad and he's looking for another clan to get in and the only way he's gonna get that clan and he's gonna take that old man out mm-hmm yeah and so he's mad okay and uh I think that's where a lot of the trouble those real serious encounters happen when you run in you know a cat like that you know matter of fact from my house one morning we were going to the doctor about 10 years ago and uh we were about north of Keatshaw about two miles and there was this property it's open a big old piece of land on the left and uh I saw some crows I looked over my left and I saw some crows about uh 70 80 feet from the fence line and you had some facing each other like that northeast and you had some facing like that you know and so all of a sudden one of them the crow that's on the east side he turns and starts walking real aggressive towards the east and I'm like what the heck well there was a big uh female standing there and that was edge of the woods and she was real nasty and with her hair muddy I'll tell them what it was look look and she said yeah so we went in she told my daughter she said man I saw a big boy today so your wife saw it she saw it well we were coming back through there it was two weeks ago she said look there she is again right two weeks ago yeah from now now so she saw it again yeah and this land uh that these people uh but only it's a lot of land and they're very wealthy people had a big yacht that sell around the world and so I was talking to this lady she wrote books and uh she said you know I don't know believe in big but you know and stuff like that she said I I hear Panthers hollering at night and everything I said man I said they can sound just like a path of crime right I'm taking you down I'm I'm exposing the truth bring it on man let's do this exposure to the truth we have had this much fun since Mark showed it with a colander on his head yeah yeah this is the rum yes yeah I saw that coming I saw you off at the pass there that was fun that was good all right all right here we go all right Mark where do you got look uh the the interviewers are getting restless at this point certainly the one that is that is nearest to us who is not so pro at this point he is now not comfortable there's a real suspension in him he's at times he's he's holding his his breath he's gone for for stillness then there's self soothing there which is repetitive action and adaptions moving of things around in order to make the world more comfortable he is he is not as comfortable with this is this idea as mr chase Hughes who will who will be showing us his comfort with the situation chase why is this why is this a possibility I will continue advocating for this the only thing in this clip is the thing about the panther call and something about him saying this might have made him a little bit uncomfortable but maybe he's just uncomfortable making noises around people it could be it could be you just got you just got to cut it out I'm going to go on deep on this dude wow I'm going to go all the way do it lean in man do it it could be that he was uncomfortable saying this at the time to this woman that he's talking about or that maybe he doubts himself a little bit maybe it doesn't sound exactly like a panther call either way there's not there's not a cluster of behavior here gentlemen there's no cluster keep in mind that we're we're not in control of the questions that the interviewers are asking here so you know maybe some crappy questions so we can only observe these reactions to these two guys who wholeheartedly believe him which lends social comfort to the situation and if he wasn't sure that these two men believed him we might be seeing some different behavior but uh I don't see much I do I see a whole lot so let's start with the guy on the left his BS meter is pegged he's like oh see that foot popping up every time when he starts his next story about seeing Martha the Bigfoot his foot pops up like oh here we have another one here's a really good thing for you we look for word pattern shifts and when something changes we always say why'd they say that when matter of fact rolls out of somebody who you are suspicious of you should be really suspicious matter of fact everything up to now was not a fact but matter of fact it was this then he goes into the foot stamping thing that we saw earlier which was a good indicator of deception and then and then he gives more details about the crows than he does about the creature when he describes the creature just says she's covered in mud well hold on wait how long was it for what else tell me more about her I want to know more about her than I do the crows that you just talked about because that's really easy then he saw that same Bigfoot two weeks ago in the same place he saw it 10 years ago well damn they're pretty boring creatures they're just hanging out on the side of the road looking at crows I guess I don't there's just a logic thing here that makes you want to just jump in there and go wait a minute why do you think that Bigfoot's hanging out there you know all about them why would female Bigfoot's hang out on the side of the road now they sound like Panthers you know what if you ever want to see a really good example of this there's a guy named Henry Lewis who claims to have killed you know I don't know how many at this point hundreds and he is they're giving him cigarettes and coke and that kind of stuff to drink when you're talking to him and he's in prison for his life and he's telling them a story and he says did you ever kill him by in Japan they go yeah he goes yeah of course I kill people in Japan they say how'd you get there and he said I drove of course this is a guy who's just filling in the blanks for the people he's telling the story to it's just Scott what do you got all right like you said he opens up with as a matter of fact he hadn't said that yet he hadn't said that yet and then like you said his feet are pushing down the floor but here's we're starting to see a change he's getting real animated here he's getting a bit louder he says about 10 years ago he doesn't go into specific dates like he's done before he doesn't say what year it is before he was down to the month and we knew how cold it was outside we knew what the weather was all those he doesn't he were not at that point they were not there so he's something's up here and keep in mind while he's driving to the doctor he sees all this stuff and starts making decisions these logical decisions about what's happened as he's driving down the road you know let's say he's going 45 miles an hour and it's a little two-lane road okay doesn't sound very fast but as he's driving by this he sees a big foot he sees a big foot he notices the crows are acting weird crows are acting weird he's paying attention to birds too as he's driving around which means he's got to be doing that the whole time looking for birds and big foots and crows and whatever he's doing and so he notices all this odd behavior what he returns odd behavior in the crows and just a few seconds snaps goes right by this illustrator started getting big again he starts getting in there and he's he starts he gets animated and starts voicing and starts telling these things that animals do and and how they would act and what is normal for that and that little bearded one back there in the back little fat one and he's just eating it all up he can't hardly stand it he's so into it whereas the other one's just going I can't get out of here man this is this is a little bit too much you know he's thinking about what his wife's going to think when this thing comes out and he's thinking how many people going to see this I wonder not very many who's going to pay attention to that Greg Hartley one more now so anyway he just gets starts getting then he starts getting more detailed and then that one the one closest to us I think I think he's getting a little bit more skeptical and his skepticism is showing a little bit more as we go along here so that's all I got matter of fact from my house one morning we were going to the doctor about 10 years ago and we were about north of Keatshaw about two miles and there was this property it's it's open a big old piece of land on the left and I saw some crows I looked over my left I saw some crows about 70 80 feet from the fence line and you had some facing each other like that northeast and you had some facing like that you know and so all of a sudden one of them the crow that's on the east side he turns and starts walking real aggressive towards the east and I'm like what the heck well there was a big female standing there and that was the edge of the woods and she was real nasty I mean I had money I'll tell my wife look look and she said yeah so we went in she told my doctor she said man I saw a big wood today so your wife saw it she saw it we were coming back through there it wasn't two weeks ago she said look there she is again right two weeks ago yeah from now now so she saw it again yeah and this land that these people own it it's a lot of land and they're very wealthy people had a big yacht that sell around the world and so I was talking to this lady she wrote books and she said you know I don't know believe in big foot you know and stuff like that she said I hear panthers hollering at night and everything I said man I said they can sound just like a path of crime I'm gonna keep going you should all right this is it this is the last one guys got it and recorded it for more than just a blank sure right but a nice solid stretch of yeah something you imagine something you as believers you won't you can't help but think of possibly seeing one day whether it's somebody else's footage or not even if you had that they won't believe it I still we still think it ain't worth the crap it ain't worth the crap I don't care I've seen good footage but I've got I've got footage you do in my phone you know and people say you know it's just a joke and some of them are hidden trees and since I know how to look for it I can look and I can show it to you until you show me how to watch and you say you can't tell you well when I started taking she'll point it out to you show you this and this and you say yeah I see it yeah you know you have to be taught we have to be taught and that's where a lot of people say there ain't none in the woods I've been hunting I've got friends and man I've hunted all my life I ain't never seen one yeah because you've never seen one you know I have come up on back when I was squirrel hunting I would hunt down in the creeks and the branches the little branches and you know they were down 20 30 foot down low and the water to be down there the squirrels would come down there you know and I'd pop them you know well one day and before this happened my counter happened must have been two or three years I've come up on some big tracks in the sand and I got to follow it and the next thing I know the tracks were gone you know so they went and then they just gone well I know I'm pretty I'm pretty good tracker you know hunter and on and I knew I said he's here you know whoever made those tracks is here and so I got to looking around and I seen some muddy water coming down my way and I said yeah that's it I know what you did got down the creek trying to you know trying to walk creek though it's just an old trick yeah it's an old Indian tree you know I mean and so I got on up about another 150 yards and there was a round curve you know I got a real bad smell you know and so something just told me I just caught it off went the other way but uh you know you know just stuff like that you know fascinating Mike what do you got well there's only one thing to look at here in my view which is he says uh yeah I got photographs of these things on my phone there's a pregnant pause between the two and at no point does anybody go get out your phone man let's have a look let's go through let's have a look at those photos nothing wouldn't you you would just go you and I would just go and over your phone and let's take a look nothing nothing they don't call him out at all it is just bizarre but big tracks there's the the illustrators are out of sync you know this this is essentially what deception looks like and and especially when you don't get called out on it next time anybody says to you I have pictures of Bigfoot on my phone or UFOs or aliens or any elves anything ghosts anything go brilliant can I have a look do that please Greg what do you go yeah or at least how about you text those over to me whatever I want to know any kind of evidence like that if you get short of a drawing okay that I might not be interested but the guy on the right by now is using the right language he is saying believers believers okay it takes belief I don't have it Chase you may still be trying to hold on to a shred of it for a comedy sake but none of us believe it the guy on the left is now full-blown adapting if you watch him he's doing it touching himself he's trying to figure out where to go next and I think Scott you're right he's thinking people are going to see me on this show and they're going to wonder what the hell I'm thinking most people when they're storytelling try to outdo themselves try to outdo other people's stories not Mike Mike outdoes himself well I got video of it I got pictures of him he's just where do you go from here and I when the guy drops his hands I think he's going to say hold on you got pictures he doesn't there's also a couple of other thing you can see that Mr. Woolley puts his hand in his crotch when he's telling them that story and his toes point in we typically associate toes pointing in with insecurity and then he sets the stage for the squirrel hunt stuff it just look I'm just done he's out of BS steam and I'm out I'm out of it too Chase why don't you defend him for us Greg this has all the hallmarks of a truthful story here and that he it believes happened until you know maybe a point in this clip or something but you know when he gets to the end of the tracking story there's something maybe a little bit off when he tells them that he stopped and went the other way but there's a little bit of hesitancy at the end I think it's just because he's just mustering up the courage to continue the story and these filler words that are increasing at the end I think this is just a desire to shift the topic of discussion because he's bored with telling this because it's so truth you look like you're telling a big foot story actually I have a sketch here right beside me not a photograph or anything but it's just a from the from my experience yeah what's your name guys it's just what's your name wait a minute I got to go now I want to below I'm sorry all right hold on no hang on a second see now the interviewers using words that like you're saying Greg that involve religion and faith faith he calls these people believers that's where it starts getting you you start gathering up this is where you start so I start a cult so he says he has big footage of big foot but we see this is great because we're seeing in real time we're seeing him de-conflict this stuff and come up with the with answers protecting that and defending his his answer that he just gave it's unbelievable it's real it's it's just it's fantastic because we're seeing these things that we're seeing the Liars Loop happen in real time through the most important parts of it and he says he's got big foot pictures in his pocket boy we've been waiting for that never before has he said you know I got pictures of that if he did obviously like we said obviously like we said before you just say shoot him man what's up but he defends that by saying you wouldn't recognize him if I showed him to you you have to know what to look for you know that's why I could step out back and take a picture of the woods and start pointing stuff and you can't see him because now they become damn master of disguise that you know this is and what a movie this is gonna make so not only has he not taken he has taken pictures of him but you can't see him because they're masters of disguise you have to know what to look for to be able to to be able to see him and we also find out big foots use old Indian tricks to hide to hide their tracks when they start going back up the the creek or the river or whatever going back up the water so they're apparently they're brilliant and they're connected to the Indians now another thing when he starts talking about how something stinks as he starts tracking it what stinks is a story that's what stinks that's why he has to stop because he's got nothing else at that point what else can he say I followed it to the to Scott Rouse's big foot reality no like there's a big no I can't do that he's done he's done at that point and recorded it for more than just a blank sure right but a nice solid stretch of yeah something you imagine something you as believers you won't you can't help but think of possibly seeing one day whether it's somebody else's footage or not even if you had that they won't believe it I still we still think it ain't worth the crap it ain't worth the crap I don't care I've seen good footage right I've got I've got footage you do in my phone you know and and people say you know it's just a joke and and some of them are hidden trees and since I know how to look for it I can look and I can show it to you until you show me that squatch and you say you can't tell you well when I started to take it she'll point it out till you show you this and this needs yes you know I see it yeah you know you have to be taught we have to be taught and that's where a lot of people say there ain't nothing in the woods I've been hunting on I've got friends that man I'm hunting on my lap I ain't never seen one yeah because you've never seen one you know I have come up on them back when I was squirrel hunting I would hunt down in the creeks and the branches the little branches and you know they were down 20 30 foot down low and the water to be down there and squirrels would come down there you know and I'd pop them you know well one day and before this happened my counter happened must have been two or three years I've come up on some big tracks in the sand and I got to follow it and the next thing I know the tracks were gone you know so they went and then they just gone well and I'm pretty I'm pretty good tracker you know Hunter Nahn and I knew I said he's here you know whoever made those tracks is here and so I got to looking around and I seen some muddy water coming down my way I said yeah that's it I know what you did got down the creek trying to you know trying to walk a creek which is an old trick yeah it's an old Indian tree you know I mean and so I got on up about another 150 yards and there was a round curve you know I got a real bad smell you know and so someone just told me I just called it off went the other way but uh you know you know just stuff like that you know fascinating let's throw it around the room and talk about what we think we've seen Mark what do you got let's keep it 30 seconds less because my earphone batteries are going out my headset I don't do yeah the idea I you know there's a possibility that there are creatures out there that we have not encountered yet this story is not an example of that in my strong opinion Chase where you go we're none of us are saying that Bigfoot doesn't exist so even if we I am all right I get 12 more seconds of my 30 okay sorry because you did that us telling you he's not lying or lying is different than us telling you he believes or doesn't believe large portions of what he saw and I think he believes one of the encounters the larger encounter that he initially described I think he experienced something similar to that and it might have collected dust through the years in reality but I'm I'm not so sure about the rest of it Bigfoot may exist we're not telling you it doesn't but well this guy is but Greg what do you think yeah so guys first and foremost this is a Maslow's hierarchy story period I mean the rest of it he could have seen a monkey in a tutu and it would have become the same thing what has happened is he's wedged himself into the lore of Bigfoot and now he has to have more and more esteem that's just human nature we all do it and I always say it's just that once you're there you got to know more about Bigfoot than the other guy and the community starts looking up to you and you can see these guys did and they come to talk to him and it just escalates and escalates and escalates do I think there's such a thing as a Bigfoot I'd like to believe not sure I do I've been the woods a lot never seen one maybe I just am not a Bigfoot seer Scott okay yeah I think he's full of it I don't think he I don't think he saw Bigfoot Bigfeet I don't think his wife did either I don't think it's true and I know and there's a lot of people out there people out there that believe in them and don't get after me in the comments send me some pictures I want to see the pictures in video I don't want to see the good stuff because you got a good phone now iPhones come out with some really good cameras on those phones so I want to see a picture don't come at me and say you don't know this you don't know that send me a picture that's all I'm saying you don't have to say anything say what about this what's it up and send me that that's what I want and then I'll and if I see it like I said before I'll start hiring them and I'll build my house and put cameras in the whole thing and we'll both make it fortune so just let me know all right fellas I think this is another good one and we'll see you next time so what do you got