 Right, okay, thank you for joining the average golfer. We're back inside this morning, but we've been out There's plenty of testing been done because I did a video a week ago Which was our strong lofted irons are helped for average golfers And it was a great video in the sense that it brought a lot of people's opinions to the table There's always a split on this debate and what I want to do is take it one step further We're gonna put the two types of irons head to head and we're gonna try and find out are the issues real issues Around game improvement strong lofted irons are are they just myth and sound Yeah, it is very much a split opinion I think I'm not sure it's a 50-50 split and I think it's fair to say that opinions have and are changing but there's still a lot of Throwaway comments that are made that I'm not sure are Are backed up anymore? I'm not sure they're based on fact like I said, I think they're based on not so much myth But I think that's something that comments that have been made for many many years now Against these type of irons, and I think that things have changed. I think irons have changed I do believe technology has changed as you well know and I do think it has changed and Some of the things that are being suggested are maybe maybe Not correct. Anyway, so what did I do? Well, I went down to four golf chester as ever I'm gonna call got in some golf balls and this was a very simple test So we've done sets of numbers up in front of you now Are the two sets of irons and the irons are irrelevant? So I'm gonna drop the kind of like what maker model they are we're gonna keep out the equations that I want to confuse people But basically this is if we look at the lofts of the two You can see we've got what you would consider a traditional loft and strong loft And then what I'm gonna do is we'll get straight into The first issue which and the major issue for most which is the ability this idea that you need to carry five wedges It's a comment that issues quite a lot and I want to see if that is true So let's throw in the numbers first of all and start at the bottom end of the bag and see what happened And what you'll see is we've got numbers for pitching wedge and gap wedge Both only one degree difference so this again sort of this comment sort of battles me a little bit But in the game improvement set of irons, it was 130 carry and 120 carry with the 50 gap And on the week a loft did we got a well? It's only 46 but in the 50 More blade style wedge that we used for the test. It was 122 or more one three This argument kind of ends very very simply because the point is it doesn't matter which way you work this one back Is there is seven yards difference eight yards difference on average on the pitching wedge between the two sets of clubs So for me, we've got well, perhaps one club difference half a club difference even so work that back You go from 50 wherever you want to carry with you on a carrier 54 Maybe even throw in a 58 whatever you like, but we still end up with three wedges Four wedges in both sets It doesn't matter where you finish at one one three or one twenty whatever you decide to go back into I mean for me personally, I'd be at more than happy with a 54 wedging. That's me done I wouldn't be carrying different wedges and I think but with whatever you like Whatever with ever which way you like to build your bag in terms of the wedges You're going to end up with three to four wedges in both sets of clubs So the idea that one differs to the other I can't see that whatsoever and the point being I just want to make one final point On that is a lot of the comments referred to being able to hit full shots Well, look at some point in the game of golf no matter which bag your game in which loss Yeah, I can't hit full shots. There's 40 yard 50 yards 60 yards 70 yards You've got to find the ability to hit half a shot three quarter shot with a wedge of your choice But you will not go around a golf course or a game of golf and not have full shots all the time That is impossible. So for me, do you need any more wedges with one set of the other? No, it is exactly the same situation so It leads me on to a bigger problem and that's at the top end of the bag As you can see you've got the numbers for the seven irons and then we go to four iron And the four iron difference is 190 as opposed to 176 Why is that a problem and why is it a bigger problem than worrying about gapping wedges at the bottom end of the bag? Well, in my opinion, it's this My driver distance is probably a 245 to 250 carry. That's on a good day That's where I'd stick the driver and then you got to work back And I've got to find now a situation by where I can gap between a 194 iron and my driver. I Think it's quite simple I think I've got 10 to 15 your gaps in there where we can throw in some hybrids a five wood Maybe a three wood and we'll bridge that gap quite comfortably Now let's go to additional lofts 176 carry with the four iron You get me that gap in between that and the The 250 carry I've at least got one more club that I've got throw in there But it's difficult to get up to there with I mean 176 carry as you're long this time in the bag We've got we've got we're like I said the minimum we've got is to throw in one more club But what I would say the one more club I'm throwing in is a longer shafted club And what I would ask you is this What would you rather have in your hands or in your bag? Would you rather have more shorter length shaft clubs or longer and I know for me on a personal level if it is a Choice between gaming more wedges or gaming more three irons. It's a very simple Choice for me to make I would always rather be carrying the shorter irons And I spoke to I spoke to David lead better last week in the interview that's coming on the channel And we talked about where with limited time that average golfers have on their hands nowadays Where would the best focus our attention and I think we know the answer and he confirmed that in his opinion It was from a hundred yards in that is where scores are made for Handicap golfers and where we can reduce our shots going on the golf course. I think it I mean I'm a big advocate actually of juniors young players not actually having all these wedges I think they can they learn to control the club face even with about a 52 degrees Witch, you know, I mean we're going back in the day now back to not not quite back to niblix But the fact is they can start to you know, they've got it. I mean look great short game players Exponents have great hands. They're able to sort of do certain things. Yeah, Phil Mickelson. Yeah, yeah or tiger. Yeah, forever And so They are able to do certain things But if you if you just have a club for every for every loft, yeah, sorry a lot for it For every every distance It sort of takes a little bit of the feel and the skill out of what you want to do I mean look we don't although they might look good to you know Average players a blade iron is a complete waste of time because the sweet spots about you know, like a pinhead Yeah, okay, so I mean when perimeter where the club came in years ago I mean it really was a big help and That's the area to me. We've got the shortest length club in your hand. We've got great control We all know the longer the shaft length goes The more difficult to control the more difficult to find the sweet spot. So for me once again Positives and negatives. I'm looking at yes. If I've got the choice. I'll give me more wedges I don't want more longer irons in the bag. I want more wedges. So but to me The situation in reality is your problem is exactly the same. Gapping is gapping. There's no difference whether it's more wedges or more There is nothing that differentiates these two sets of clubs on these numbers We've got seven eight yards down a bottom end gap Or we've got a 14-yard gap when it comes to the top end before we start even talk about both like characteristics And now that 190 carry is gotten to in terms of launch angle in terms of descent angle That's a whole different question. We're gonna go there in this video because it get far too complicated But that's taken all out of the equation We've got a 14-yard gap there at that top end of the bag at 4 iron And I've got to then start bridging those gaps And I think that's a far more difficult thing to do for average golfers than it is to concentrate on the short end of the bag And I've been more wedges it right. We didn't talk about Dispersion dispersion is something that people commented that there are more issues with dispersion with game-improvement irons than that of traditional lofts and again and All I want to say is this There's no right or wrong answers by the way in all this is all about opinion-based and it's only my opinion But I'm trying to give it like I said some broader background to back up some of the argument. I Play seven iron if that's say a roughly 160 carry And if I stand on the team someone says to me I've got 160 carry then yeah, I'll reach for the seven iron And my seven iron will go 160 if everything is you know as I want it to be and I hit a nice shot Put a nice swing on it all things are correct and I hit it nice perfect 160 If I get a little bit excited a bit more swing speed, maybe that'll be a 162 163 If I don't catch it quite right out the middle and maybe a bit of a cut maybe I'll drop it off to 154 155 Maybe some wind and other things will impact on it But the one thing is this The performance of the club had very little to do with dispersion It was the performance of the strike from the individual that had the impact on the dispersion and I would say that to blame a club or a set of clubs a game improvement set of irons have issues with dispersion Again, I find hard to understand because if I then take the stronger lofted set of irons the players set Which it will traditionally be and I put those same three Analogies into place then I think by not finding the sweet spot Which is generally smaller we can all agree on the players type iron I think that's gonna have a far bigger impact on dispersion in a negative way on those irons and on the game improvement So yet again the argument that's thrown up as being a potential negative I see it the complete opposite way round and I don't really again You tell me the other way with which bit am I missing because to me It's been a well-known fact that sweet spot is smaller if I'm not finding the sweet spot then Dispersion I want to see drop offs again fairly well-known that that takes place with these type of irons and The biggest sweet spot on the game improvement irons might Be just a little bit of assistance to avoid a drop off and tighten dispersion not see it getting bigger So for me again It's not an argument that can really buy into with any great confidence We've then got and it's a very quick follow-on from exactly the same situation is Gapping issues because of the gaps in loft on game improvement irons So if you see these up in front of you now again, you'll see eight nine pitching wedge gap wedge five degree differences in terms of the gaps on On that of the game improvement and the four degrees gaps on the traditional set Well, I can say it's very simple again for me this one. It's the same analogy. It's the seven iron analogy Whether be 160 163 or 154 carry with game improvement type I in it's very much down to my Performance my own swing and I'm not when I stand on that scene. I've got 160 I'm not accurate enough to worry about one degree of difference So I can't drop down to us Go up to a six and I can't come down to an eight iron for that one degrees worth of difference because those gaps for me are tight enough and Relevant enough to the swing that I have. There's no What I'm basically saying is I'm not that good I'm not that good to recognize one degree of difference I think it's that simple and a question again How many of us golfers out there at the average level are that good to worry about that one degree gap? Because it's not, you know, it's ten degree gap on a on a perfect day on a perfect day You have ten yard gaps between your clubs That's on a perfect strike But that's not reality. Is it that's not what happens when you go on the golf course So there'll be some play some variables in and around that But if you've got enough to recognize the one degrees worth of difference and it tightens up your grouping Then I think fair play to and I think like I said, this is very much I review these clubs based on a broad spectrum of players That's the mentality I try to have and if you're down that lower end in terms of handicapped low single figures Then maybe that one degrees worth of difference, you know is recognizable Then I don't argue with that whatsoever But I think for the majority What is reality? I think if you can notice one degrees worth of difference then yeah It's I don't think it comes into play for most golfers I'm gonna finish off by just talking quickly about Choice of Club by Lewis Johnson again who plays golf on the channel quite often PJ professionals a very steady player Lewis throw any of you've watched him play golf very steady Doesn't do a great deal wrong and out of interest He's a player plays tailor-made P790 irons again Which would be for I think it's half degree difference in the loft on his irons actually then what we're looking at today And he would not ever go back to playing Players type irons, and I think that's a comment again if you see some of the comments that are coming up for you now there's a lot of golfers who Clearly low handicapped golfers who've seen the benefit of these clubs just as much as Higher handicapped golfers have seen and the point of the video is this is a part two It's a follow and it's trying to address. I tried to reply to comments, but you know it You can only type so much for an answer without going on too much. So it's trying to address some of those Comments in a way that like I said it's got some fat base And it's not to it's not to prove a right or a wrong because there isn't one like I said It's very much down to the individual what I want to do is try and dispel myths and make sure that if you are going to Consider buying a set of irons then don't dismiss certain of irons because of this kind of hearsay of certain sound bites of words Don't do it for that reason Go and try the clubs out and make sure you give yourself the best chance of getting the most enjoyment out of your set of Clubs and based that on your experiences your numbers your data and I know to be fair I mean and I know that's what most people would do anyway But it's it's really that's that's the purpose of the video. I think that there's a lot of reviews out there that I Look at the pro review. The pro review is exactly the reason why You know if they're finding the sweet spot When they're striking the majority of clubs I'm not sure how they can then give an opinion based on what Performance an average golfer might get out of a golf club because the reality is It couldn't be further from what you will experience when you go and try them because as you know as golfers at our level We tend to find quite a bit of that club face So the numbers are generally will be quite a bit different and that's the important bit is that You try the clubs you get your opinions you see if your dispersion varies you try a game improvement Against a player sign and you see whether or not those differences are as sometimes portrayed And I'm not sure that When you weigh up the positives and negatives for me, there are a lot of clubs that are being dismissed for the wrong reasons and Hopefully we've put some Limited facts don't get me wrong. It's not the most scientific. It's very much again all these reviews Don't forget whatever you watch on any channel are on a limited amount of data They're very subjective and But they go some way to try and substantiate certain claims or dismiss certain claims. That's the idea Anyway, as ever, thank you for watching comments down below. I hope you enjoyed a follow-on video We don't normally do this normally a video is ended But certainly I thought scope for a part to this is it There's your bit more backup in terms of numbers and again I welcome the comments down below and let's see if we can keep this conversation going and my hope is that like I said If it's if not, it's not to change opinions of individuals It's just as long as I get golfers question certain things Then that'll do for me and keep the comments nice and civil keep communication nice and civil We'll carry on with this debate moving forward right. Thank you for watching and I'm done. I'll see you soon