 Hi, I'm Rusty Komori, and this is Beyond the Lines on Think Tech Hawaii. I was the head coach for the Punahou Boys varsity tennis team for 22 years, and we're fortunate to win 22 consecutive state championships. My book Beyond the Lines is about leadership, creating a superior culture of excellence, and finding greatness, which is what this show is all about. My special guest today has a legendary TV career. She is the president and CEO of PBS Hawaii, and her name is Leslie Wilcox, and today we are going Beyond Public Broadcasting. Leslie, so great to see you. That's very kind. Thank you so much. I think you're the queen of TV. Oh, hardly, but thank you, thank you. I grew up, honestly, Leslie, I grew up watching you on TV, and so I know you're the queen of TV. So good to have you. I'm sure you've seen all my mistakes. I didn't see any mistakes whatsoever. But I want to know, I know you grew up in Hawaii. Can you tell me about your youth growing up? Sure. I grew up in Kulio O Valley, and then New Valley, when Kulio O was really the last suburban kind of valley, although we had farms and quonset huts too, but Hawaii Kai wasn't built yet, can you imagine? So that's the last valley before Hawaii Kai, and Mauna Loa Bay hadn't been built up, so it meant that when waves were big, they'd wash over the port highway, small little highway, and start up the fish pond, and we could go fishing on the highway for dinner. No way. Hot mullet. It was an intact fish pond. It was terrific. And so I grew up, lots of freedom as a kid, because it was safe, this is old times, and so my brothers and I went hiking and swimming, and remember in the morning we crossed Kulio O Valley Highway as little kids, and we'd go to this little island of Kulio O, where a fisherman would throw Aku heads after catching them, and we'd have Aku sword fights, and of course you would get muddy, and then we'd walk back along the highway, and people would go, are you alright, little girl? Everyone wanted to clean you up and make sure you're okay, but it was just a very family environment, so living in Kulio O. So what schools did you attend? So I started in Holy Nativity in Aina Jaina, but then my family ran out of money. So I was happy to go to Aina Jaina Elementary, New Valley Intermediate, and then Colony High School, lived in that area all my life. What kind of activities or sports did you did you participate in? I ran track, and then I fell in love with surfing, and that neighbor boy made a board that he didn't like and actually gave it to me, and it turns out he gave it to me because it actually kind of leaned right, but still I was thrilled to have it. You walk across the highway, that was our playground, across the highway was the beach and the water, and I did surf, there weren't that many girls surfing at the time, we were kind of novelty items, and I wasn't very good, but I did love it. I love the water, it was always around water. Nice, now. And lots of hiking. It's amazing how, I still go hiking where I used to hike as a kid, I never see anybody anymore. I used to be full of kids making forts and having fun. I love hiking, I want to do hiking more because when I finally hike, I'm thinking, I gotta do this more often. It's so beautiful. So peaceful. Yes. Now what college did you end up going to? So I went to the University of Hawaii, actually got a scholarship to USC, but I did have as many people do, they were family issues. Actually, how I grew up actually helped me as a journalist because what happened was my father was absentee and there was a past little kids in the house and we were, you know, we had to really script and save. So we didn't have hot water for years at a time because of the water bill. And I know I can make a mean meatloaf with very little mean energy. And nobody in the neighborhood knew, the kids, we didn't know what was normal and what wasn't. We just didn't say anything. So when I became a journalist, maybe that's why I became a journalist. I really knew that what things look like wasn't necessarily what they were. And as I look at how many people are struggling to make ends meet here in Hawaii today, I know what it's like to not know if you're going to be able to live in a place. You know, you grew up tomorrow, you're going to might lose your place. So it gives you a sensitivity and an awareness that, you know, look deeper. Well, so your meatloaf had a lot of loaf and less meat. Yes, very, very, lots of bread. So Leslie, I have to ask this. What was the first job that you've ever had? I don't know, as a teenager, we didn't have all these McDonald's and Burger King's and McDonald's was just starting out in Hawaii. I mean, it was really hard for kids to get jobs. So my first job actually turned out to be in Waikiki. I was a hostess and then a waitress at this little snack shop on the grounds of the World Hawaiian Hotel. And that again helped prepare me for journalism because you had to do all kinds of things at once. You had to have a lot of situational awareness and a lot of things on your mind. That's what I did for until I got a job in news. So let's go there now. Let's talk about how your amazing journalism, TV broadcast and career started. How did it all begin? No, very inauspiciously and very fluky at a very young age. What happened is when I was at Kalani High School, there were all these news competitions and I won the writing part of a writing competition. The Honolulu Star Bulletin, which was then the largest newspaper in Hawaii, sent me on my first trip to the mainland to compete in a really prestigious competition for high school juniors, seniors and college freshmen and sophomores. You were there for a week and you had to do everything right. An editorial on deadline, cover a football game on deadline, interview somebody, get an interview and interview somebody and turn it in on deadline. Everything was... Deadlines. Yes, all deadlines. And it was all... I didn't really know how to play football all that well as I had to cover a game. But I was shocked out of my seat when I actually won that. And the Star Bulletin peed my way and I found myself unable to go to college because there were family difficulties. And I applied for a job as a gopher. I said, look, I know I want to do this. I'm not qualified, but can I sweep the floor? What can I do? And the city editor of the time, a very distinguished man named Ed Edwards told me, are you kidding? Go get an education and then come back. And I said, okay, but that's exactly what I'm going to do. And then I also told him, since I get out of this newsroom, I'm going to take off these pantyhose. I'm not worth wearing. I shouldn't have even put them on. And four months later, he called me. I was still waitressing. And he said, okay, I got a gopher job for you. You can do errands at the state capitol bureau for the legislative reporters. And that's how I started when I was 18 years old. Wow, that's amazing. And then when I was barely 19, it's a long story, but one of my colleagues called in sick and he said, go check out these committees. And it turns out in this obscure committee, this major news story broke. And I was the only news related person in the world. In the room, such as I was, I cobbled together a story and it ended up being the banner headline. And so when a reporter went out on maternity leave, they said I could slide in for four months and then don't get comfortable because then you're out of here. And then they just never tapped me on the shoulder and told me to go. I mean, whoever of you can't plan that. I was very grateful. Well, I love, I love hearing your stories and you know, I don't, I don't care if your stories are short or long. I mean, you go Leslie. Now, so what, what TV news organizations were you a part of? Okay, so after the Honolulu Star bulletin. I worked for Bob CV, who was running the, you know, the golden station of Hawaii at the time. I was so proud that he hired me because so many people wanted a job and of course I didn't know anything about TV. And, you know, I learned on the job and he has 75% share of the market which is unheard of, and learn a lot from really good people that he hired all these terrific people and I just soaked it in. I worked there for 15 years and it came up. And my goal was never to become an anchor, but I, along the way they threw me in on a weekend and kept me there. So I kind of moved up in that sense, but I always loved reporting more than anything being out and about and I love the deadlines. Wow, so you're at KGMD for 15 years. 15 and then I was hired by Channel two to start the first extended morning newscast in Hawaii. You know, we, at Channel nine, we only had two newscasts six o'clock and 10 o'clock and it was packed with really good information. Very well staffed and that's when you stations were starting to expand the time and actually make more money on commercials. So with the morning newscast you could expand the number of commercials in half hours and we went from an hour to three and a half hours. I was an executive producer and I had just a great team of people just pounding out work every half hour continuously. So you, I mean, you've done reporting, you've done anchoring, you've done producing, editing, is there anything that you didn't do? Actually, I've done a copy editor, but I've never done video editing. Oh. It was always a union job in those days. I was, you know, executive producer, assistant news director. So I've seen different ends of the business. So in turn, if we go back to Bob Sebe, because I remember growing up and watching Bob Sebe on the news, what, what did you learn from him? And I could never do what he did. And you know, he was a very, he was an amazing guy who could have lived his way through anything. And that's the test of an anchor, right? Things are breaking loose all over, but you don't know that they just have a great demeanor and they make you feel safe. But it was really terrible in television as I watched Bob, because, you know, he came from all this experience and he kind of, in a sense, with all that experience, he kind of talked like I'm all of this and here you go. Not in a, you know, not in a bad way, but that's just the seasoning. And then I realized, and I couldn't do that. I didn't know that much. All I knew was the story I worked on that day. The way I became better at television was I sat at my computer and I wrote, I said in my mind, hey, Auntie, this is what's important that happened today. That was my preface in my head. And then I wrote it in a way that was eye to eye person to person, not, you know, not I'm, here's what, here's what you should know. But here's what, here's what happened. I just want you to know about it. But it felt right to me. Did Bob give you any like unique words of wisdoms when you first started your career? He did. He told me, I knew what I was doing. I could beat the competition on stories, but I needed to, one, get the local inflection out of my voice. And I went, what? What a local inflection. And he said, here's what you do. He says, you don't speak pigeon, but you have a local inflection because when you ask a question, your cadence is this. Da-da-da-da-da. He says, you know, the question goes up at the end, you know that, right? So he told me that. And then I later, I couldn't really, I sounded so sing-songy. I didn't sound natural. So I went to him for advice. I said, what can I do? I mean, you're so natural and all the other people who are just so good. And he said, you know, this is one of those businesses where you, Leslie, and I thought, oh, God, I'm going to get the light. He said, you sink or swim. And I was really worried about that. Well, fortunately, you were swimming ever since that moment. After I realized that my job is not to be like, it was mostly men in the industry who'd been trained on the mainland and the great reps. And I just learned you have to be yourself. Yeah. Well, you are so credible. You're so respected in the TV news industry. And now as the president and CEO of PBS Hawaii, which you became president and CEO in 2007, can you share with me about like the wonderful things that you did since becoming president and CEO? Well, you don't do anything alone. It's a small and dynamic team. And we have faced constant changes, media is like that. And more so in the age of the Internet, obviously, I used to type on a manual computer. But but now, you know, we move from analog transmission to digital transmission. It's required a lot of money to change systems. A high definition was the equivalent of a heart transplant on a person. I mean, we did that. So a lot of the things I went there because I was so interested in providing more local programming. But as soon as I got there, there was a recession in 2000. Oh, yeah. And then we lost our lease of the UH Manoa. So even though I worked very hard on expanding with our team, expanding and improving local programming, we really had to keep our business and our nonprofit moving forwards because you don't get anywhere in media when you're behind. Well, you know, some years ago, you won the whole Kelly Award, which is the top award in nonprofit leadership. How did that make you feel to be finally recognized as one of our state's great leaders? You know, awards, I'm very suspicious of awards and thrilled to get one. But I, you know, I know there are tons of other wonderful people. And, you know, you always feel like, do they really call my name? I think I was, you know, you just have to, you just have to say, that's a, this is a wonderful moment. I always have to prove myself and do a better and better job. Well, the new facility that you guys have at San Island is absolutely beautiful. And I know that you are very instrumental in making all that happen. But can you share more about some of the more recent things that you guys are doing at PBS now? Well, we, we are, we just started something, you know, we're an educational nonprofit. So we do educational media. So we wanted to do a literacy program that was different. And so what we do is we invite people in the community in and they bring their favorite book excerpt or poem or anything that they want to read. And it's different from most literacy programs because normally, you know, read alouds are here, here's a book. You can read this. Yeah. This is they're sharing what they feel is really important to them. And we give it a spin with animation and it's just sharing and people share what's super meaningful to them and we finding them connecting with each other and where you get that book and what part was bad. And it's really been a wonderful interaction doing that. So that's, that's a simple thing we've done recently. We've also done Kako Hawaii's town hall where we got people who are very different and may not even like each other in the same room live to talk about difficult issues and also another forum called what's it going to take based on, you know, these grim statistics that that that research has uncovered and the Hawaii Community Foundation has done a change framework around it, telling us we've got some serious problems and this is the time we need to act. So we're doing a continuing series of programs called what's going to take. Yeah, I love hearing that. And speaking of books Leslie, you know my book beyond the lines, you are someone that definitely go beyond the lines. I want to know what principles stood out in the book for you. I really related to what you did in many ways. You, you were, you were taking outstanding tennis players who were, who were individual standouts and through discipline and teaching them I think humility to somehow I don't really for sure know how you did it because there's a secret sauce. I mean, I love it that their identities became not just, hey, this is me, I'm the best of this. It became, we're a great team. And to do that, you have an outstanding individual has to give opportunities to other people. Yeah, to recognize that somebody else may be better at this than he or she is right now totally you're totally right and making it happen. It's one thing to say that's what you did but I don't know how you did it is very incredible and to do it again and again and again. Boy, that was hard work. I mean, what was the secret sauce. I think it's, you know, my top priority was to develop champion athletes of character first, and then great tennis players second, and every day that's what I wanted to try to do is to make sure that I'm helping them with life's lessons and doing the right thing. There's never a wrong time to do the right thing. And I think that's what you do with PBS in terms of building your team because character is so important. And when I want to visit your PBS studio I mean all of your your team they're so nice they have great character. They do they are the kind of people that if you were in a crazy situation, they would come to they would come and help you and they would do whatever it took and then really resourceful and doing so. Leslie, I love your long story short TV episodes. I mean, can you tell me about how all that started. You know, it wasn't my idea. It was the idea came from Michael Harris, who is a well known director of local television and he approached me while I was a journalist at HR went to and said hey could you come and do a contract a gig over here posting a show. And it'll be about, you know, people's character and what made them the way they are. And I said oh what kind of resources you're putting into and he goes well we can't give you any video but you know about one on one conversation. And I wasn't into that I like visuals I like the video. And so I said oh no I'm good with my job here. And he approached me a couple times. And then I got hired there as president. And you know what, you still have that puka on Tuesday nights we need to fill so let's do it. And that's how it happened. I gave it the name long story short and decided. I wasn't really into talking to picking people on the basis of how successful they were in conventional terms. What I wanted to know was, how did they get to be the way they are, you know what values, what, what, what formative decisions that you make. What did you do when you made a mistake, how did you, what was your trajectory. Because you find out so much about people and it's not what you think. Yeah. Well, I think that you're the master queen TV interviewer. I am so not. You are. My daughter said to me, Mom, did they actually pay you for that show? And I said, Oh, they don't have them. But she said good. And I said, what? She said, because you say things like, and then what happened. And so she said, you know, you don't want this big law or this impressive question. And I said, yeah, because I don't really like them. You're right. I don't. I want to ask you what makes an interview great. You know, I think it's just, there's an understanding that passes between interviewer and interviewer. And one time I was interviewing this boxer who didn't really want to be interviewed. Somebody kind of said, God, go on. And we were, we were having a duel of the eyes minutes. It's like, you know, because I knew he had more to share, but he didn't want to. And I was giving him and he was giving me that. And you can see it on TV. And then he decided, okay, I think I trust her. I'm going to do it. What the heck. And then it became really, you know, when people want to share and they've had an opportunity to think about their lives, it becomes just amazing. And, you know, I really want to give viewers the idea that they're, they're the ones at the table, not me talking to the. Yeah, got it. As CEO, what do you feel the best leaders do? Well, if appropriate, I think the best leaders lead from the back, you know, they basically work with the team to set a vision, and they set the goals and then, and then the trust professionals to forage and find a way. And, you know, obviously checks along the way, but they, I hate the word empower because I mean, it's so over the years, but empower people. Yeah. Now I want to ask you Leslie, why are you successful? Well, I don't know that there's a, I don't know if everyone agrees that I'm successful. I think we all agree. Well, I think, and I say this, I thought about how lucky I am in the sense that all along it's like, I feel like I've surrounded by a village of decent caring people who care about getting things done well. And they've inspired me to be better myself. And they've shown me how far you can go and how failure need not be, you know, you could fail and get might up test yourself off. I mean, I think I've just been very, very fortunate. And I don't know if I could have done what I do in another state that where I wasn't surrounded by people who really care about each other. I know we're, you know, this is a state of great interdependence. We're an island state. And you feel vulnerable, but then you also feel such strength from it. Yeah, I totally get that. Now I want to ask you, every successful person, they deal with certain adversities and challenges along the way. What's one of your biggest challenges or adversities that you have to deal with? Well, maybe because of the field I was in, I was a news anchor much of the time. And, you know, news anchors often are really worried about their popularity because ratings transfer to money and position. And I learned pretty quickly that don't care about what other people think, just do it. You think it's the right thing because chances are those people, you know, forgot what they said right after they said it, or you heard it wrong, or what are you going to do about it anyway. And I've always tried very hard, never to take personal offense. It's really not my business, what other people think of me. And often I find out that I made the wrong conclusion when somebody says something. That takes a lot of the angst out of life. You know, it's like water off a duck's back. Now you've done so many amazing interviews, you've covered so many stories. Is there one interview or one story that kind of stands out among all the other great ones? It's a long involved story has to do with the just an amazing woman I met who had been raped and sodomized and shot in the head by an organized crime guy who got the apartment wrong and just did that to her. But it was a story of how she survived, testified against him, and just, you know, one thing you get to see in a job I have is just incredible personal reserves, people who defy the odds. And they by sheer danger of safe or personal belief or whatever it is that inspires them. You see some amazing people. And she was a seemingly ordinary office worker in Honolulu. Well, and she was just in the wrong room. Yeah, she ended up having to go into witness protection when when he was free putting the contract down on her life and she never back down. I just was so impressed because it wasn't just a brief moment of heroism for her it took years. I mean, I wish I had a shorter example but that makes sense. Wow, that's impactful. Very much so and then but you know you see it all the time where people facing very tough odds. You know, I don't know what prepares them for but they are able to rise above and there are people who don't get headlines. I see that when I covered traffic accidents and shootings and social justice interactions and you see a lot of people who have more than you ever know. And you know that it's so much of their mindset because I find I find that you know when your back is against the wall, you're either going to go one or two ways you're either going to be the victim mindset or you're going to have a victor mindset. Exactly. Exactly. You know, and I think that's when you really know how, you know, how good you really are in terms of your perspective and your, your will. We all had a, we rated people according to what if things got really bad, who would have your back. That's true. Because sometimes you need that. Oh, we do. Now, besides Bob CV, who are some other people that inspire you. Well, today or anytime. The early women in television here, I mean, you know, they, it was a different time and they're still around. They just learned as they went and they, there was some definite chauvinism involved. And so many and people behind the scenes who are in a position to do something brave. Wow. Well, I mean, and you're inspiring tons of people in this generation as well. I know that. I just try to be decent and, and hold everybody to that around me. Yeah, you, because you go beyond the lines. You have that high standard of excellence and everybody sees that lesson. I want to ask one more question. What gives you fulfillment? Good question. You know, in this world, not everyone has the opportunity to be understood and loved and accepted. And I just feel really fortunate. I have a small circle of friends and family who do get me and they like me anyway. You know, that is, you know, you don't, I don't never take that for granted. No, I love hearing that it's all about, I mean, that's, that's the realness. I mean, that's really what keeps us fulfilled. And I often talk with people who they say nobody has ever understood them. Yeah. Leslie, I want to thank you for joining me on the show today. I mean, What a pleasure. Thank you. Sharing your insights. I mean, I learned a lot about you right there. I learned a lot about you. You've got another one coming out. So I'll be watching that. Yeah, it's going to come out shortly. So, but thank you, Leslie. Thank you so much. It was a pleasure being here with you and your guests. And thank you for watching Beyond the Lines on Think Tech Hawaii and a special thank you to my clothing sponsor Ilani Incorporated. For more information, please visit RustyKamori.com and my book is available on Amazon and Barnes & Noble. I hope that Leslie and I will inspire you to create your own superior culture of excellence and to find your greatness and help others find theirs. Aloha.