 We will go ahead and call to order the December 7th 2023 meeting of the historic preservation commission Welcome can we have the role, please? Commissioner Jacobi here commissioner Barnard Thank you. All right. Thank you. We do have a quorum First order of business is approval of the November 2nd 2023 meeting minutes Do any commissioners have any comments or questions concerning those? If no, I would entertain a motion Okay, I have a motion to approve the minutes from Commissioner Fencer and a second from Commissioner Jacobi all those in favor Any opposed none the minutes are approved. Thank you Report from the chair. I don't have anything specific to review So we'll pass that time to communications from HPC staff liaison What do you have for us tonight? Just a couple of things and I think Glenn's gonna tag on with a couple items after I'm finished. So first item is the 554 Collier Street appeal denial of certificate of appropriateness and certificate of hardship I did send an email to the commission out. It has been appealed. So We will be back at city council To discuss this item with that appeal at the December 19th meeting. So that is when that will be on the agenda. So we're getting that package put together right now and the other thing is Really tagging on to and a discuss tagging on to one of our presentations tonight just a sort of a setting the stage The Tower of Compassion. We're starting to talk We're beginning discussion with our parks department staff since it is their asset As far as you know getting that process started since it is you know has been determined to be eligible for land marking Ultimately city council would have to recommend that and be the one the decision maker that we could pursue it So we're basically starting those internal discussions now And then in terms of the survey plan Working with our on-call consultant to finalize that particular scope. They have a Historic preservation Subcontractor they use so we are finalizing the scope of that So we should be in good shape to get moving on that at the beginning of the year great Mr. Chair and HBC members at the last meeting there was a question about The southwest corner of Collier and 3rd Avenue that was there and then it wasn't So we did look into that the applicant Did go through the process that he was supposed to go through or he was asked to go through he submitted his application he paid his fees He worked with utility companies on shutting off the utilities He got his asbestos mitigation taken care of he went to planning staff to talk about the existing trees But it did not proceed to the liaison and our council liaison to give it a look to see if it's Potentially landmark worthy it was built in 1925 It's been there on the corner. It's been surrounded by industrial commercial type uses And I think it was a miss and the staff missed it primarily because we have brand new people in the permit counter And then some a few in the planning department. So when we figured out that it was a miss The other issue we found out was we have a permit system That is kind of our last stop to catch and make sure we do things It's geared for landmarks if there's a potential landmark boom red lights go off, but on the 50 years or older It does not go off. So we've sat down with staff and explained to them This is a particular area when you're looking at the the town site not just the Hanna neighborhood not the west side But it extends further extends south 3rd Avenue and I think in staff's mind They think of the residential areas as the protection zone So anyhow, we've clarified it with staff and we're working to put that stop gap into our Excel a permit system Anything within the original town site gets flagged and it's gonna fall in Jennifer's lap basically to take a look at So and then I mean going forward after we get that fix The survey plan is is a big part of making sure we if there is something that is landmark worthy we identified There's no surveys done on this property. We even checked the state Because it was a state highway So I thought well potentially it got picked up there, but we don't have any kind of Report on it. So I did want to clarify that with you let you know what happened We did look into it and we're taking steps to make sure it doesn't happen again I'd be happy to answer any questions, you know, the commissioners might have Thanks for that Commissioners any questions or comments? No, all right. Yeah, okay Commissioner Jacobi Commissioner Jacobi there you go. Yeah, as far as the Tower of Compassion I naively suggested making that a landmark at our retreat And in time for the historic preservation month, which was last May Are we going to be able to coordinate that do you think by this May for the historic preservation month? I? Don't know the answer to that question, but it's a Goal, I mean will hopefully have a Better idea of where we are so if it's I mean I don't know that we could meet all the various Public hearing and notice requirements at this point. However We'll certainly try Because there are other departments involved and other moving parts We just need to I can't I can't commit to When we could have it done simply because so much of it's out of my hands sure there's lots of priorities probably more important than Historic preservation month, but I think we should try to keep that in the back of our mind and try to get it By then if we can it's a good call. All right. Thank you Even if it lands on council by that time if it's not executed just be very symbolic Yeah, yeah, it's a couple of other things mr. Chair On Tuesday, we're presenting for the first time council your amended Ordinance so that'll happen and then we hopefully won't get a whole lot of questions a whole lot of changes And we'll proceed to put it on the agenda for adoption And then you have a new council liaison. It will be mayor Peck Going forward in 2024. So that was a committee change Just this week when they had their reorganization or their organization meeting Okay, that's it Regarding the the zero reading will that be at council or in our study session your presentation It will be at the regular meeting, but it will be under general business So it is not on the agenda for first or second reading. This is what we call zero So we'll present it we gave them the draft the red line draft and I'll go through it And hopefully and Jeremy will be there and hopefully we can answer any questions that might come up. Okay let's see Commissioner Jacobi had a question. Yeah, so with the updates on the code Is that going to include the recommendation we made previously about? Let's see. What was it it was for waving the fees for Conservation overlays for designated neighborhood groups that we discussed and we approved as a commission Is that going to be on the list of updates that you're going to present? No, it's just what you've been reviewing for the last Several months. No the amendments actually to this stored preservation code. There's nothing about fees in there I know you asked to amend the land development code right at some point But no, it's not a part of that's not going to be part of the recommended amendments no and That's because why Well, I think when we talked about that that's that has to be a direction from council And I think the council is on brings that forward to council and says or we bring it forward when we get to the budget and say it's now on our work plan, but That direction comes from city council as far as amendments to the code So all those amendments that we reviewed we're already. Yes reviewed. Okay. Yes for all right many years. Yeah, I'm sure years All right. Thank you. You bet Okay, no other questions for staff. Thank you for all of that information We'll now open up the public invited to be heard We don't have any public hearings, so I don't have to tell you that it's not for something that's a Otherwise on the agenda So I do have a list here, and if there's anyone that's not on the list we can accommodate at the end The first speaker I have here is Bob McLaughlin. You would come up you please state your name And address and you'll have three minutes to provide comment Members of the Historic Preservation Commission staff. My name is Bob McLaughlin I live at 6 20 Emery Street And I'm here to speak to you on that behalf of the Historic East Side Neighborhood Association or Hanna Let me first apologize for my speech impediment as a result of a stroke in the spring I'm not sensitive about the issue So please ask me to repeat myself if you don't understand something that I say Hanna is committed to fostering a sense of community in our neighborhood Eastside residents share a connection through the architecture of our properties and the development pattern in the neighborhood as a whole The Eastside has the largest concentration of intact houses from long months early development period From the mid 1980s until the zoning change in 2018 The architecture of the Eastside was protected by its unique RLE Zoning designation those protections disappeared in 2018 Creating a conservation overlay district merely recreates the protections that were part of the RLE zone a CO district allows more flexibility and can apply to a larger area than when qualified for a local historic district At a pre-application conference in April Hanna asked for changes in three requirements of the CO district Number one wave notification to property owners outside the proposed district Creating a CO district will have no effect on the properties outside its boundaries Number two since Hanna is a registered neighborhood group in Longmont wave payment of the more than $2,000 in administrative fees And number three make changes to the section on residential lot coverage However, we have not found a suitable alternative to the lot coverage language So at this time we do not ask for any change in the lot coverage section The conservation overlay district has been the land use code since the 1990s But it had never been used in Longmont. This is not an issue for a single neighborhood We will use this tool now, but it can be useful to several other older neighborhoods in the future I'm here tonight to ask you to take the final action on changes to the language in the land development code Related to the conservation overlay districts. I also want to add something based on the last comment from the staff The city council on September 5th It was moved by Joan Peck and seconded by Sean McCoy to direct the staff to bring back the conservation Overlay is rezoning for the historic east side at a regular meeting after the historic Preservation Commission made its ruling and it was approved 7-0 Allow a few extra seconds. Okay, that's really the end of my comments But it was approved by all council members So I Feel that direction has been given to staff to take on this project I'll Thank you for for the opportunity to speak to you. Thank you Mrs. Clark No, okay Paula Fitzgerald Commission Pleasure to be here tonight. My name is Paula Fitzgerald and I live at 419 Emory Street in the Hanna neighborhood First, thank you for Only at city council I'm good then Okay, well, thank you so I feel like I'm speaking to the choir because I think we both have the same goals Which is historic preservation? For Hanna as as Bob has mentioned we've had some protection or we had some protections starting in the 1980s with the RLE zone and then When we were changed to residential single-family that went away We were insured by staff at that time that they would come back and rectify that situation which is now we're talking about five years and Still yet to be done. So we've decided to move forward on our own so asking for a waiver of fee and notification area I think are our pretty Pretty easy asks Again, we're not a development. So it's not going to Affect anything we're just asking for conservation and preservation of what we have right now So it's not like we're asking for development review or plan review or any of that sort of thing Then the notification area as Bob mentioned It's not going to affect anybody outside of our neighborhood. I don't know how that could possibly happen So I think both of those are pretty simple requests and hopefully you support that in forwarding that information to council So I asked that you recommend approval of these requests for waiver to a city council and we can move forward with this The other thing I wanted to mention is that I worked for the city for 22 years in parks And my last project before I retired was the tower of compassion the improvement there with the change of staff and You know just so many new people There's some historic information there if anyone has any questions on that. I'm more than happy to help you with that It's a near and dear project to me, and I think it totally deserves historic designations. So I support you on that Thanks so much. Thank you. I didn't get her in time to sign up Sharon O'Leary 534 Emory Street Historic preservation your job description on the city website says consider matters relating to protecting and enhancing and preserving properties of historic geographic or architectural significant Significance in the city historic buildings are tangible links to the past Historic Eastside neighborhood is the oldest neighborhood in Longmont Small humble homes close to the railroad as people made their fortune or better fortune Westside larger homes our neighborhood is intact because of our old zoning and on a Promise and commitment with our neighborhood working together with the city We worked on zoning and the ball's been dropped and it's beginning to feel uncomfortable at this point We went for a pre-meeting and the way The need to have the fee waived is important. We're not an HOA So I have done everything as co-chair in the neighborhood by the books. I'm in NGLA I applied for a grant. I had to present my idea to all the other neighborhoods They approved it. They gave us money to continue to do historical surveys They gave us money to do the mailings to contact our neighborhood to inform them about about a conservation overlay zone And then another mailing to go ahead and do the voting We also held our neighborhood picnic and it was received with overwhelming Response we want to preserve our neighborhood So what we're asking is that I Agree with Bob. I think there was discrepancy and information that was given out tonight Mayor peck made a motion to bring it back to HPC and I think it was seconded by Aaron Rodriguez So it's just time to move forward. We need your help So we can finish this process Spend the money we've been given by the city because the citizens of the city thought it was a very good idea so We can't move ahead and tell the code is changed We need to have to have the accommodation Accommodation of the fee waiver and the area that needs to be notified and this isn't just self-centered I think like Paula or Bob mentioned down the line other neighborhoods will want it and NGLA is is the liaison of city to neighborhood and we're playing everything by the rules And we always have and now I'm coming to the next leg of the ladder And that's historic preservation and the balls in your court and you need to direct Back to city council that you approve the changes So I appreciate your time, but let's really let's carry on with preservation every year We lose opportunities. So I think we've been really patient and now we're asking you to move forward Thank you for your time. I really appreciate this commission Thank you. Okay Anyone else? I don't see anybody else from here for public comments. So I'll go ahead and close The public invited to be heard We do not have any items that are public hearings. So we'll move on to Next item of new business, which is our Tower of Compassion Cultural Resource Survey To the Commission so following direction from the Commission about Looking into the possible landmarking of the Tower of Compassion we commissioned call McWilliams to conduct a cultural resources survey of this asset and He is here tonight to share with you his findings about this particular property This particular structure So thought you would be interested in hearing about this in terms of the process for where we are from the city This is because this is a parks Maintain is basically a parks asset because it is in Kanemoto Park We are having discussions internally with Park staff to You know as I mentioned in my staff report determine a path forward for for preservation of this property So with that I am going to invite mr. McWilliams up to the podium to talk about his findings Carl McWilliams with cultural resource historians nice to be here. Thank you for having me and thank you for giving me the opportunity to Research and survey what's one of the most interesting Resources or projects that I really have had the opportunity To do in my mind I kind of like a top five or ten list of the many projects that I've done over the past several years And I'm Kind of have to kind of have moved some property out of that to move this in because it really is a special property It has such a rich rich history I'm sure you're probably all somewhat familiar with the history of the property, but I'll maybe just give a quick overview The story starts with the Garuku Kanemoto Who immigrated from Japan in 1907 by way of Mexico? He was originally planning to go to Canada but he got off the train at Denver is the Union Station when he learned that there might be possibility of a work on a railroad crew that had a Japanese foreman and So that's why he got off the train in Denver in 19 and 20 he or in 1910 he was actually Working as a coal miner in northern New Mexico but by The mid-1910s he'd come back to Colorado was in the Canfield area in south of Longmont here where he is working as a farm labor In 1916 his family in Japan arranged for a young Japanese woman To become his bride in an arranged marriage They gave birth to three children who later adopted the Anglo names of Jimmy Faith and George They farmed in the Canfield area and then moved somewhat closer to Longmont here near the sugar factory by 1930 and they were tenant farmers during that time and But in 1935 a Garuku died in a automobile accident leaving Satsuno and the three teenage children and They persevered they opened up a Kind of I'll kind of show you some of the family here This is the family early 1920s with Garuku and Satsuno and the three children Jimmy's on the left George is in the middle and faith is on the right and This is their marriage certificate, which I thought was really neat and and you know what this There's so many layers to the story and one of the words that keep coming back to me was courage, you know courage of Garuku to come to America to begin with as an immigrant, which was not all that uncommon many people did that at that time, but Satsuno came at the age of 22 as a young woman boarded a Boat a ship to come to a country that she'd never been to didn't speak the language didn't know anybody I to marry a man that she had never met And that after arrival they were married in the Buddhist Church in Seattle he signed the marriage certificate in English and if you can see there in the middle of lower part She signed in in Japanese and so just you know the courage for her to come and do that. I thought it was just You know just amazing. I thought And then after Garuku passed away. They opened a Freshway market on South Main Street in the you know South part of Longmont here where they sold vegetables that they that they grew themselves on the farm there and they actually Had the vegetable business there up until 1968, which was long after they had developed other interests And there's the more extended Kanemoto family in the early 1960s Satsuno the matriarch is on the left George is in the Right on the right in the back there and Jimmy's on the left with their children After their father died in 1935 the three siblings for a time left School to help their mother work on the farm and things but they didn't eventually go back to school and it finished their educations the two brothers Jimmy and George married sisters who are of Japanese the daughters of Japanese immigrants from Lafayette Whose names were Chayo or Chayoko and Jane so the two brothers married the two sisters Which I found interesting because my family my father and mother also had siblings who were That were the same and so I always kind of thought that was kind of interesting But that the two couples really formed You know a partnership between the husbands and wives in between you know that the two couples they really forged a partnership together And and then kind of getting back to the term of courage You know in the 1980 1940s the family who had been Tenant farmers in the area south of Longmore here were offered an opportunity to go into debt to purchase the land Or at least it you know a portion of the land And it was not an easy decision to make but they did make that wise decision But that that took courage as well and then the big part of the story relates to World War two and the internment or Detainment incarceration of Japanese Americans that occurred at that time Due to extreme xenophobia against Japanese poor people that occurred after World War two but in Colorado, you know No persons of Japanese descent were actually incarcerated Because of in large part the attitude of Governor Ralph Carr who was very much opposed to that and in Longmont area The neighbors and community as a whole Really supported the Kanemoto family. They understood that they were being persecuted They gave them support and the Kanemoto family really appreciated that and they never forgot about it So, you know the other aspect of courage is the courage of people like Ralph Carr to stand up in the face of what they knew was wrong and The courage of neighbors of the Kanemoto's to also to offer them the support of to do what was right and to be supportive of them at that time So, you know, they bought the land in the 1940s and continued to farm it until the 1960s when at that time Things were starting to develop in Longmont, especially to the south IBM had come in on the diagonal FAA facility had come and many of the things were happening And so the land, of course became very valuable and ripe for development and they decided to develop it themselves. They also Went into other enterprises including the cane companies they patented farming type of irrigation machinery In the later years as you can see in their advertising for the cane companies Which was located exactly the same location as where the Freshway Market had been located that the family had done earlier But they used the Tower of Compassion in their advertising and this advertisement actually was in a Jewish, I'm sorry, Japanese Newspaper that was published in Denver that they advertised in frequently So in early 1970s Jimmy and his wife Choyo went to Japan and visited Pagoda's there and kind of hit on the idea of building a pagoda In Kanamoto Park to honor their father But also as a gift to the city to acknowledge their as an expression of their compassion and appreciation for all the compassion They've been showing them over the years, but especially during World War two The Kanamoto's when they developed the land and the neighborhood They donated the land for Kanamoto Park as well as the land for the Burlington school Which is adjacent there and set that aside and they did many other things in the community in terms of donating and helping and became just really really involved as you know Great community members and the two brothers had such you could tell they had just such a special relationship between themselves As well as between the two couples Jimmy was always the more extrovert outgoing kind of the front person George was the person who took care of all the details behind And so it's just kind of interesting to see there how everything worked with the two families and there's the two brothers probably in 1990s Jimmy's on the left. George's is on the right And I guess that's the last side that I had just a few slides. So, you know in terms of the report, you know Great history Nice construction history did some research on the people who are involved in building it I kind of gathered that a lot of their time and effort was donated Or at reduced cost Otherwise, I think you know the Kanamoto family just pretty much took care of everything the tower Compassion was construction was started in May of 1973 and in September of that year. They had a dedication that was attended by the mayor City manager as well as the governor of Colorado many other dignitaries were there and They just you know, the two brothers just were very expressive of the appreciation that they had for the community back to the World War two days and also about But the tower represented in terms of Compassion in terms of findings, you know, I don't think there's any question You know, I certainly evaluated it is eligible for local landmark designation as well as eligible for the state and national register we've had you know informal communication from the state that they also believe it's eligible for the national register and You know, I know you have internal discussions you need to have with parks and things, but if there's interest on the city's part To move forward with that, you know, I'd certainly be open to Becoming involved with helping that process through Any questions? Yeah, perhaps could you explain a little bit about what that process entails to to be The state and national sure First of all, well it requires the preparation and Submittal of a state and or national register nomination anything that's listed on the national register is obviously is Automatically also listed on the state register But it involves a report similar to what we've done here with a little bit more detail and Maybe a little bit more research maybe fleshing out a few things one thing I if I were to get involved that I would want to flesh out I did quite a bit of research on immigration law in the US, especially as it applied to Asian Americans and For a national official level documentation, I'd want to delve into that a little bit deeper or just flesh that out a little bit more so just you know, it's some some modifications or Enhancements to the nomination just to add a little bit more detail The nomination goes to staff there that reviews it and maybe Interacts with the prepare the nomination in terms of suggestions for edits or improvements and then it goes before the state review board for consideration at a meeting the state review board and The nomination preparer owners of the property or people from the city would be welcome to come and speak on behalf They do put out of there's a formal process where there's a notice that goes out if anybody wants to object to the nomination and At that meeting the board makes a recommendation to forward The nomination or not or to return it for corrections or edits but if they approve it they prove it to not to forward it to the I Think it's it's The board of history Colorado, which is part of the Department of Education and that's usually a formality If the state review board approves the nomination It's pretty much guaranteed to go on and then from there goes on to the to Washington to the keeper of the national register Which is part of the National Park Service where they formally Would list it in the National Register of Historic Places the state review board meets three times a year January May and September And then the there's a deadline to have the nomination in For each number for each review board meeting that's maybe about three months prior So for example if the city was interested in Being on the May agenda, which might be pretty ambitious I think that the deadline for that would probably be sometime like coming up in January I don't have the exact dates, but it's usually may be around three months in advance So that's kind of the the process All right. Thank you. Any commissioners have any other questions or comments for Mr. Williams. Yeah Commissioner Barnard. What's that? What about the historic preservation Commission's role in all of this? Well, your commission as I understand it would be to I've made an evaluation that it's eligible for local animals Landmark designation and effectively have a document that's an application for designation So my understanding is that your role at some point and maybe you can listen when that point would be to Make a recommendation to counsel in that regard whether you not you agree with that evaluation or want to move forward With the designation so your role would be at the local landmark level And then just kind of getting back to this to state and national this being listed on the state or national register does not add any or entail any regulatory Restrictions or impose any type of regulatory Aspects to the to the property Follow up Great. Come back to staff then as far as with that how they see this proceeding at the at our level So the first step first of all is continuing our basically Ensuring that the the parks department is is on board Ultimately City Council will have to basically direct staff to pursue Landmark designation since it is a city-owned asset With that if we get that direction Then it would come back before this Commission for Review and recommendation to City Council who are the ultimate decision-maker to Dedicate or to designate the property Thank you. So I'm just trying to understand if I were the mayor City Council person How I'm going to give a direction Without input from somebody So we would basically present The report that the report that mr. McWilliams prepared You know, we would make a presentation to Council say staff recommends this do you wish to have Do you wish to pursue this and Yeah, if so, we will prepare the formal application package and send it through the process as defined in chapter 2.56 So could our direction tonight be a motion to recommend this to Council to Know in other words to not wait around for them to decide to put this on an agenda, but to like make a formal Recommendation that they look at this. I think that would I don't see why not Yeah, I don't see why not okay, all right Commissioner Fenster I Had essentially the same question and that is is there some action? that we Should be taking at this time and does that need to be done in a formal motion and If so, where where does that go next? Just so that we don't have a lot of unnecessary delays Mr. Chairman commissioners The example I'm aware of is the silo and that was brought forward by a Jason neighbor So usually the first part of the application is you want to know to does the owner agree? Which is what I was thinking we would do just out of hand, but if you want to give us direction to do that Please but it will come back before you Because then you will make a recommendation on whether it's a landmark and then we'll bring that ordinance back to Council So it's it's going to bounce back to you anyhow Right, I I mean I feel like the Commission is all in the same pager I think we ought to finish this you know this particular item with a motion to recommend Moving forward to Council With a request to make this a local landmark even if that means asking them to ask us But yeah Yeah Okay, we we have a motion on the floor to recommend That staff take this report to City Council with a request that we start a Local landmark designation for the Kanamoto Tower of Compassion adequately restated So we have a motion by Commissioner Barnard and a second by Commissioner Jacobi any discussion No, all those in favor. I Any opposed none motion carries. All right. Thank you. Thank you Williams for an excellent report And it's just really fascinating all the the additional background. It's thank you all for the opportunity. All right. Thank you Okay Set the second Is there a prospect that this Monument Memorial will become a federal landmark at some point and should that be encouraged or discouraged I think it's a fair question as you know, I think part of that In mr. McWilliams report he's noted that it's eligible or in his opinion at least eligible for all three levels I think that would be part of Staff's feedback, you know introduction to council right whether you'd want to take it it makes sense to take it further, but You know that can be a council discussion. I guess as far as how far it goes Right Okay Okay Our 2024 commission retreat so we have a we have a tentative date for that. Is that correct? Correct, so we have a tentative date subject to approval of this commission this evening of Saturday February 10th Probably similar timeframe that we did the last time so one to four ish We have a room on hold at the Longmont Museum for this date for their larger meeting room So plenty of space is spread out So Maria has been working on on finding a location. So this is I Would anticipate pay. I mean obviously at our January meeting will establish you know the Meeting dates for 2024. I believe I noted last At the last meeting that the regular meeting date for February Conflicts with the saving places conference and I I know quite a few of us will be at that so it seems that the retreat might reasonably take the place of that meeting but that is obviously something for this commission to To make it to decide so basically what we're proposing this evening we staff is Proposing a date of February 10th for the 2024 commission retreat to be held at the Longmont Museum and if we get that direction This evening Maria will confirm the room and we'll call it good and start preparing for it Okay, great commissioners any objections to that date, okay all right, then I'd entertain a motion do we want a motion to move forward with that or is that just adequate direction to We're we're all right. We'll move to accept the the date of February 14th for the February 10th for sorry for every time. I'm looking at yeah, sorry February 10th. Thank you for the correction Yes, right my bad. I'm looking at something else While I was saying that February 10th 2024 for the HBC retreat that's moved by Commissioner Barnard I'm gonna give the second to Commissioner Sibley since I was looking at that direction. All those in favor. Hi. All right. There you have it Okay Now on to our last item for this evening the historic east side conservation overlay update Staff do you Jennifer do you want to I'm gonna give this one to Glenn Oh, okay. Well, I'm gonna give to Rick Chacoby because he has to put this on the agenda So as long as I get a chance to follow up Yeah, okay. Yeah, I'm just getting myself to that point. All right Red and green here. So Well, thank you. Yeah, so Just to back up and give a little history The neighborhood obviously has been pursuing the conservation overlay We've hit they have hit a road bump with regard to expenses We have discussed as a commission before whether we think Any neighborhood group should have to endure the expenses of the planning fee in addition to everything else and we agree that that was not an issue but When the neighborhood group went to City Council to request this they bounced the recommendation out to us So to open this I would like to just make it a formal motion I Move that we recommend City Council direct planning to initiate the conservation overlay process for the historic east side neighborhood while waving the planning fee and To support a waiver for the 1,000 foot peripheral area notification requirement Second We have a motion on the floor by Commissioner Jacobi in a second by Commissioner Barnett. I'd like to have discussion on the motion So do any commissioners have any comments or questions? No, okay. I I have only a Question about where things are in the process so I can understand all this information that we've been provided so it's am I correct in stating that that there has been an initial pre-application conference and What we're talking about doing is is applying the overlay district Rules they're already in the land use code as they are written to The to the east side neighborhood district. That's is that what we're what? I want to understand exactly what it is that We're talking about so sort of okay, so really kind of where we are in the process is a Pre-application meeting has held we was held we've laid out a roadmap for what needs to happen it's not really as simple as This the these rules just this applies to the east side neighborhood and zone at that way There's quite a bit of research and analysis and standard development that needs to be done. So it's You know, I'll I'll like Glenn pipe in but it's it's it's an undertaking and you know part of it There is a lot of work that needs to be done before it gets to the level of going to council I think the fee waivers and The note of the rate notice radius efforts. I'm going to turn it over to Glenn are probably the easy part But I think just just to back up We've been under the impression that an application is going to be made to us and we're going to evaluate it We go to planning and zoning commission. They make a recommendation. It goes to city council So that's when we did the pre-app we did just like any other developer and it might seem unfair Because here's a group of neighbors that want to put a zoning overlay on their property But we gave a couple of first steps one is I think we told them as far as notification from my standpoint We're good on that Because it doesn't really affect adjacent neighborhoods like putting in a Walmart for instance All we know is there I believe that they would like to change the coverage requirements So we did a simple analysis for them But really the first step even before they make an application Would be the neighborhood meeting and we talked through how that happens staff facilitates that And then as what was pointed out council said bring it back to council So they may direct staff to do all the work and I think that's the assumption of the folks behind me is that We're working behind the scenes to put this forward and staff initiate it So Outside of that council directness to do that We are in the mode of waiting for an application that actually lays out what the new Requirements what they'd like them to be there's also a provision for a set of design guidelines I don't know if that's part of their plan either But one thing I just want to point out is it wouldn't come to historic preservation It would be a planning and zoning commission and a city council decision So it's it's a rezoning and you typically wouldn't be part of the rezoning now if they wanted to go forward with a historic district That would be something that the HPC would be involved in so And we talked about this back on April 1st at our last retreat and we went through the differences between CO and putting a historic district in place and CO is zoning which means planning zoning commission makes recommendation city council Adopts it. It's not necessarily historic preservation I could see that it might lead up to it or it could be preserving Certain characteristics, but it's pretty clear in the code that it's it's not historic preservation Okay, thanks, so Basically, what's being asked of us right now is just those simple two things the The waiver of fee for the application and the waiver of the a thousand foot additional buffer Period, that's it. That's all that's being asked of HPC to make a recommendation to council to say Yeah, your fellow commissioners asking you to sit Yeah, I understand this is Under the zoning and so therefore it goes to the PNZ But really that the heart of a conservation overlay is preservation. It's preservation of a neighborhood context And so I think this it even though officially according to code The decision will be made through planning and zoning. I think it's reasonable for us to review this and I think it's reasonable for us to Pursue this as the preservation commission as far I believe Glen use you suggested that they still want to consider development within the properties and and as Bob mentioned, I think that was dropped. It's certainly that the way that the language is written in the The code it is trying to Make any additions to houses as far as size compatible with the rest of the neighborhood Unfortunately, that doesn't work well in our neighborhood that the lot sizes are so variable That the largest lots with the largest homes Because the homes are already larger than neighboring homes They cannot add an accessory dwelling unit even if they have a large lot in the smallest homes on the smallest lots Would qualify from this standpoint at least from the CO guidelines now we For an ADU even though there's almost no space on the lot for them They would have to follow other code guidelines for that But as you know, we've discussed before that the home was at 426 Emery You can fill a lot quite a bit and so the smallest lots would potentially get very filled The largest lots would have empty spaces. This was a problem for the neighborhood and we when I was working with the neighborhood group on this we discussed, you know a certain percentage size of Improvement footprint for each lot and doing it that way and that came up against well How do you measure it and there were two different measurements and it became a hornet's nest and we just said let's drop that for now Again that the point is the neighborhood would like to just move forward with the process by recommending By agreeing to my motion. We are not saying that we want the conservation overlay We are saying let the neighborhood go forward with a process which includes neighborhood meetings and Feedback from neighbors that goes to city council and city council and planning and zoning and they can discuss it and pursue it With their judgment, but right now. We're just trying to remove one roadblock so they can pursue that Great. Thank you. I appreciate the clarification. Any other questions or comments? No In that absence then I will call for a vote all those in favor of the motion as stated please say aye Any opposed none the motion carries unanimously Thank you okay That concludes the business portion of our meeting Any further comments from HPC commissioners Commissioner to Kobe one final comment since sunset has come happy Hanukkah to everybody who celebrates No, I I have one very brief comment, but I wanted to put it on the record I've been thinking a lot about this commission and our The requirements that we have vis-a-vis landmarks right in light of some of these discussions this About saving historic materials and I guess I wanted to It occurred to me that one of the reasons that we have this that this commission exists is that the state has this pool of money that is Can be allocated to citizens of the community that buy Historic homes and want to preserve them right and the way that we allow the citizens of our community to access those funds is By having this commission and upholding the rules that the state has set up for that process so when Some what it's it's even better really than an than an HOA right people buy property to Restrict themselves and their neighbors voluntarily if you buy a local landmark Property you're restricting yourself voluntarily, but you're also part of a community that is able to access Resources that you wouldn't otherwise be able to and I think it's really important to keep that in mind when we're sitting here Talking about these applications and why why we're even here at least specific to you know See a ways and that sort of thing. So I just wanted to throw that out. Thank you. Thank you. All right Seeing no City Council liaison I will accept the motion to adjourn All right. All right. I've got a motion from Commissioner Coby and seconded by Commissioner Barnett all those in favor Hi, we are adjourned. Thank you very much. I wasn't trying to draw it all out, but I really just wanted