 Coming up on DTNS, something that might make foldable screens catch on, the things to know and watch for in Apple's possible fight with the U.S. government over iPhone encryption, and whether Twitter is right to not give us an edit button. This is the Daily Tech News for Wednesday, January 15, 2020, in Los Angeles, I'm Tom Merritt. So, like, Citi has me here, Scott Johnson. And I'm the show's producer, Roger Chang. Sarah Lane produced the show today, she did the rundown, but then her Internet had a problem and she is not with us at recording time. Maybe she'll be joining us later, we hope so, but in the meantime, if you want to hear about Scott Johnson's YouTube travails, and Roger and I argue about the meaning of twang, you can get all of that at Good Day Internet by becoming a member at patreon.com. Let's start with a few tech things you should know. Travel Planning Service, Hip Monk announced it will shut down its app and website January 23. If you have a reservation made through Hip Monk before then, it'll still work, but you'll have to maintain that reservation with the airline or hotel or whatever you're using for that reservation. Hip Monk was acquired by Concur about three and a half years ago. If you've never heard of Hip Monk, join the party. Right. YouTube added filters to the subscriptions tab on iOS, I'd love to check those out. You can choose to view videos from your subscriptions by which you have posted that day, videos you started off but haven't finished, subscriptions you haven't watched at all, live videos or see short posts. All filters include no filter at all, including no filter at all rather, can be sorted in reverse chronological order. The filters are expected to arrive on Android in the future. Microsoft launched its Chromium-based version of the Edge browser Wednesday. It's available for Mac and Windows at Microsoft.com slash Edge. Edge 79 as it's called comes with business-friendly features like Azure Active Directory support, Internet Explorer mode, search in Bing integration that integrates your intranet into Bing. Tracking prevention is on by default and it has three levels of protection just like Firefox. Edge 79 also supports Chrome extensions. You can download Edge now or wait for it to arrive in Windows Update. In both cases, it'll replace your old Edge browser on Windows 10. The new Edge is distinguishable from the old Edge if you're like, wait, did I already get it somehow? Just look for the wave-like circular logo which replaces the variations on an E used by Microsoft's previous browsers. It's almost like a new world for them. By the way, it's really fast. I used it on my Mac today. Yeah, it's super, super speedy. All right. Let's talk a little more about what Google's doing for two-factor authentication. Why not? Google Upstart, excuse me, Google's an Upstart, brand new company, little mom-and-pop operation. No, that's not true. Google updated its smart lock app for iOS to include support for using the phone as a second factor for authentication of Google logins on Chrome. When enabled, this seems pretty cool. Logging. Logging into Google's surface in Chrome will generate a push notification in the smart lock app on iOS that can be tapped to approve the login over Bluetooth. This is more secure than Google Prompt, which worked over the internet, but not as secure as a physical security key. It's an important distinction. The app requires iOS 10 or later because it uses the iPhone Secure Enclave. The feature was available for Android phones already, so that's the thing you're already using. If you're already an iPhone user and you're used to using your phone to do this sort of thing with Apple authentication, whenever that's needed, then this is going to feel very familiar to you for your Google apps and your Google stuff that you use through the Chrome browser. So I think this is going to be great and I will plan on using it. Yeah, bottom line, if you have the ability to turn on two-factor authentication, do it no matter what. It's always better than not having it on. However, if you have the option to use an actual key instead of SMS, the key is better than SMS. And this is another way you can have a key. If you don't actually own a physical key, you could do this. Granted, there are some vulnerabilities in the Bluetooth connection, which is one of the reasons YubaKey doesn't offer that and Google does, but having a second factor with Bluetooth is still more secure than SMS, which is still more secure than not having one at all. This is good because it's another option for people to use and the more options you give them to use, the more likely they are to turn on a second factor, which you should absolutely do. I'm really glad you broke down the hierarchy of this is better than nothing. This is better than that. This is better than that all the way down to sort of the best, because I think people get really gummed up on that and it's easy for them to hear something like, oh, did you hear Bluetooth dangerous now because some vulnerability and they don't realize that even then, if they're at least doing that, they're doing better if they were doing nothing at all. Because a lot of people just throw their hands up and say, well, I guess I just won't do anything if nothing's secure. So that's good to know. Speaking of Google, we'll keep it with them for a minute. Google announced it will acquire AppSheet, a platform for building non-code mobile applications, no code services. Let business units create mobile apps without having to know how to write code. Sounds like my kind of app. AppSheets pull data from spreadsheets, app databases. Databases are forms using the field or column name to build the app. AppSheet is integrated with multiple devices and services like Google Sheets, Office 365, Salesforce, AWS, DynamoDB, Box, and more under Google, it plans to integrate more deeply into the G Suite as one might expect. Yeah. So no code and low code is becoming very prominent in the enterprise. It takes some burden off of central IT. If, say, I don't know, the video department at CNET, like where I used to work, wanted to make an app for scheduling in its department. It wouldn't have to go to IT and say, hey, could you make us an app for scheduling? And they'd say, no, we don't have time for that. You could just use AppSheets to whip together a scheduling app pulling off of a spreadsheet. And that's pretty great. I think the worry here for people who are using AppSheet is like, well, wait a minute, I use it with Office 365 and Excel. Is it still going to work? Now that Google owns it, hard to say. Right now, they're not saying anything about pulling support, but they are saying a lot about integrating into G Suite. So hopefully they continue to support the platforms they have supported up until now, and they just make more features available in G Suite, which is why Google bought them, to kind of sweeten G Suite. Make it more sweet, G Sweeter. G Suite, I like that. It's almost like an artificial sweetener. Anyway, what's it going to say? Oh, in the 90s, we all had, I remember this feels a bit like Microsoft Access did for the desktop back in the day. Access was a database management piece of software based, but it also allowed you to make really quickly put together, thrown together database driven desktop apps in no time at all. So your whole business could run on while we're keeping these, this data, we may as well be able to access it easily and create forms on the front end for our people here. And it wasn't great, but it was kind of cool for what it did. This sounds like that for mobile. And I sound a bit. I mean, it's a little more fully featured than that. Roger was comparing it in our prep meeting to Lotus Notes, where you could do kind of similar things as well. So it's not like the first thing that's ever happened, but it's a little more sophisticated and you can make mobile apps for iOS and Android, which is pretty cool. The New York Times reports its sources say Apple is preparing for a legal battle with the U.S. Department of Justice over possible attempts to force the company to break encryption on two iPhones related to murders at Naval Air Station, Pensacola. We've been following this story in the quick hits at the top of the show. Last week during CES, Apple was asked to do more. Yesterday, we talked about the fact that U.S. Attorney General William Barr claimed Apple had not given any substantive assistance. And then Wednesday, U.S. Secretary of the Treasury, Steve Mnuchin, said it is absolutely critical for our technology companies to cooperate with law enforcement, though he also admitted that he hadn't talked to Apple or anybody about this. He just was expressing his opinion. But there's a full court press from the U.S. government to make Apple look like they're not cooperating. Now, Apple says that they've been turning around data within hours of being requested, that they won't break encryption on their own phones, but they will do everything else they can to help the government. The phones in question are an iPhone 5 and an iPhone 7. Bloomberg spoke to several security experts who say that the technology exists to crack into those kinds of phones without help from Apple. So it does make it seem like the government is using this as an excuse to put pressure on Apple. There are services from Celebrate, services from Grayshift that are cited as examples in the Bloomberg article as existing and able to break into iPhone 5s and iPhone 7s. Although the ease of breaking into a phone depends on how up to date the operating system is on that phone. If it's got an older operating system, it might take less than an hour to break in. If it's up to date, it might take a little longer. There's also a vulnerability they were just talking about on the security bit section of NoCillicast this week called Checkmate. This was released last autumn as a jailbreak. It targets the iOS boot ROM, which cannot be updated. So there's no defense against it. The reason we weren't freaking out about it last autumn is it only works on iPhones from 4s to iPhone 10, but that covers both phones in this case. And it requires physical access to the phone and does not offer persistent access. You'd have to keep plugging it in to keep it jailbroken. But in the case of the FBI, those aren't problems. They have the phone. They have physical access to the phone, although one of them was shot with a bullet, but potentially they're able to, you know, use the drive so that they could mount that and they don't care if they have persistent access. They just want access. So it sounds like they could use Checkmate to get into these phones. We'll continue to follow this story to see what if any action the US Department of Justice takes. But figured that was useful background when you're forming your own opinion about this to know. Yeah, I mean, I know what I want, which is I would I like it when the companies dig in and say we'd like to not break encryption. Thank you. I mean, I think we all want law enforcement to get as much information to stop bad guys as possible, right? Even if it's after the fact to learn what what they could have done to stop it or learn more intelligence, but not at the risk of weakening encryption for everyone, right? Right. And I don't I just don't I don't want them to. I don't want them to do it just simply because this is a truth. I want to be true all the time. I don't want a company to do it simply because a government is asking them to I can't speak for other governments. But I but when it comes to companies here in the US that operate in the US and are doing things under US law as often as possible, I'd like to see that resisted. Even if well, they have to give more and they have to give something up. I would still like to see that resistance where I'm at on it is if it's a if it's a warrant for a thing they can do, then the company should absolutely comply, right? If a judge has looked at it and said, yes, there is a reason to do this. And 99.99% of the cases, I think a company would have to do it. I'm leaving a little room there for extraordinary circumstances, right? But if Apple says, no, we can't do that, or like WhatsApp often says, or they say it would actually be detrimental to everyone, we would harm more people to do that. And also, it's not a warrant at this point. It's it's not even a request so much as it is pressure. Then, yeah, I don't I don't see why Apple should do more, especially given that there are alternatives for the government to pursue here. Yeah, well, we'll see how that all pans out, I guess. See, that's Jessica. Dahlcourt has an interesting article up about some talks she had with people at CES last week about bendable glass, not bendable screens. Dahlcourt points out that bendable screens right now are plastic. They're usually plastic with some kind of covering on them to protect them from being scratched, but they're plastic. So they're scratchable. That's why a lot of them will show creases over time. Bendable screen devices would be improved if there was actual bendable glass because glass is more durable than plastic. Corning, which makes gorilla glass, showed off a version of gorilla glass in development that's thin enough to bend. Now, this is in development. It's not a practical application, but they're showing that at least it's possible that they could make something as tough as gorilla glass, but still thin enough to bend. Dahlcourt also mentions a company called Mirage or a product called Mirage Diamond Glass from a company called Akhan Semiconductor, which is made by spraying nano diamonds, very small diamonds, onto a surface in a layer 100 nanometers thick. That's about one 10 thousandth the thickness of a human hair. This could be coated on plastic or even on bendable glass to make it as hard as a diamond, but maintain its bendability. Now, this sprayable diamond is also hydrophobic, so it's waterproof. It's oleophobic, so you wouldn't have to coat it with an oleophobic coating. Keeps the oil off and it dissipates heat, so it's going to help cool your phone, too. Akhan told CNET it wouldn't charge more for its coating than corning charges for gorilla glass. However, glass is brittle and when it breaks, it shatters. Plastic, on the other hand, may scratch, but it won't break. So there are some downsides here that need to be figured out and diamond glass is not available even for demonstration yet. It doesn't sound cheap either, by the way. It's something that was promised before and they say a manufacturer they were working with fell through. And so now they have to figure out how to do it at scale so they need high orders to make it worthwhile. There's a lot of talk and the earliest we might see it if everything went well was twenty twenty one. So it's possible, but it doesn't appear yet to be practical. It's one of those weird moments in iteration in tech, where because the application isn't 100 percent solidified, like we we really don't know yet what people are going to want foldable glass for. We think it's foldable phones. We think it's a tablet. Sometimes sometimes it's just what if this phone folded out to be a tablet? Like we have a lot of initial ideas how to apply it to usable products, but we're not 100 percent sure. And as a result, trying to get there with better and better techniques, better and better products. There's this weird middle ground where you can't sell enough to justify the manufacturing, but you are testing on a prototype that totally works. But unless we sell a bunch, you're never going to see it come to market. Like that's always a really fascinating place to be. And we've seen a lot of stuff in that place, memory in the early days and like SSD style memory was kind of in that place. We saw that with even glass types like Gorilla Glass. Now they took a while to get there, right, to find the applications, to make it work, to make it price or price possible, I guess. And this feels like one of those. So I hope they work it out. You know, I want to bend things. Bending is cool, Tom. I like bending things. Yeah, you either need the big customer, right, which I think was what Mirage is after. Gorilla Glass has the big customer. They just haven't quite been able to figure out the practicality of it. Or the technology needs to be bought by somebody who will implement it because they have the big customer already, or it just doesn't have all the kinks worked out and it's not practical, which also might be the case. But this at least tells me when you're looking at those bendable screens, keep looking to see if they're plastic. And if somebody starts coming out with a glass one, then we've kind of hit the next stage in that bendable screen market, finally. I agree. Well, speaking of practicality, your pets like music, don't they? Well, Spotify launched pet playlist, lets you answer some questions about your pet's personality traits, like energy level and friendliness. And they combines that with what it knows about you to create a music playlist for you and your pet. All right. So they're not leaving the pet out. He doesn't just not there for the research gets to actually enjoy the results feature, lets you choose whether you're creating the playlist for an iguana, a bird, a cat, a dog, or a hamster. Dribbles are like, what? Anyway, tech crunches. Brian Heeter has also launched an impassioned plea to admit rabbits to the list. That'd be cool. In the meantime, he says he will use the hamster selection as a workaround. This is kind of a silly story. It's definitely a marketing stunt by Spotify and not a bad one. I'll say, because, you know, I looked at it and was like, ah, pet playlist, we should make one for Sawyer. But your dog doesn't care. Do you have a dog? Okay. That's actually where I wanted to get through this. Do you have a kind of music that your dogs get into? No. Okay. I mean, maybe somebody does may feedback. DailyTechDoShow.com if you're like, no, no, no, my dog only loves Mongolian metal, and this will be great to make a playlist that has all the Mongolian metal my dog likes in a way that I'll enjoy. My dog seemed to chill out to a playlist that I can just sort of keep running if we're gone for a little longer than usual and they're in their kennels or something. Yeah, they seem to really like Mumford and Sons. Really? Can't explain it. They just that above any other selection seems to chill them out. That may just be repetition. They've heard it long enough. That brings up a good big question for me, though. What Spotify is doing is saying, well, we know what music you like because you use Spotify so much. So tell us, is your dog energetic? Is your dog friendly? Is he shy? And then we'll come up with a playlist that'll suit your dog and you. But do they really know your dog or your rabbit? Do they really? I mean, you know, your rabbit, you should be able to say my rabbit likes Mumford and Sons. And then Spotify could be like, OK, based on Mumford and Sons, here's some stuff that sounds like Mumford and Sons. And we know you like this kind of Mumford and Sons song yourself. So I mean, I think that would work better than like this kind of generic like, oh, my dog's gentle and energetic, like. And so all gentle energetic dogs like the same music. I don't think so. I think dogs might and maybe cats. I don't know. I don't want to speak for the feline side. But maybe there's a certain cadence or rhythm or something that the animal kingdom can groove to. And I'd love to get closer to it. Will this do it? Probably not. This is also why did they go at Gwana instead of reptile? They left out all the snakes. Yeah. What about my giant? What are they called? Giant? Whatever they are. There's giant, but weird lizards. What about those flying squirrels? How do they rate in here or the war weasels? Do you know? Yeah, people keep ferrets, right? Where ferrets go? I'm with Brian Heater on this. This is too exclusionary. Sugar glider. Sorry, not flying squirrels. I got them mixed up. Folks, if you want to get all the tech headlines each day at about five minutes, be sure to subscribe to DailyTechHeadlines.com. One of the most requested features for Twitter since 2006 before Twitter existed, it seems, has been an edit button. When asked about the edit button during a recent video Q&A with Wired Magazine or Wired.com, rather, Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey said, quote, will probably never do it. Dorsey admitted there are good reasons for having an edit button. He says, look, I know you can fix your typos. You can fix your broken links. But he said it also enables bad behavior like editing content to mislead people. Dorsey has been resistant to an edit button forever. Other people at the company have been less resistant over time and talked about even having it on the road map. Yes, we'd like to get to an edit button someday. Most recently, Kevin Bacbore said, yeah, it's something we should probably do, but it's not in the plans at any time soon. And here's Jack Dorsey coming out saying, nah, we're not going to do it. We're probably not going to do it. Probably saying there's a chance. So, so Scott, that's the first question. Is he just lowering the expectations so that people get very excited when they finally launch it later this year? Or does he mean it? Like I do. He's just a he's just a no edit button kind of guy. And under his watch, he won't let him do it. Well, as I mentioned to you on the tech segment on the morning stream this morning, when you were on, he said things like this before where it sounded like he was pretty resolute. And one of those was we were never going to extend the character limit past 140 characters. And at the time he was saying that was it was because everything was based on SMS originally. And that was the limit back then. And even though it didn't matter now, the whole fun of Twitter or the point of Twitter is the short, concise messages. And then they changed their minds and went to 280. Whether or what is it? Is it 280? Yeah. 280 kind of out of nowhere a little bit. I mean, I remember that was announced and then released. It was very quick process. So I'm not so sure he'll stick to it. And I also think that he's not and not that he's not being honest about it, but they're not really talking about all the different ways that all kinds of services, social networks or otherwise have figured out a way to create edits in a way that people like, whether it's a delayed thing where it's like, oh, you submitted this and you now have 15 seconds to fix your email like Gmail does or the way Facebook does it where you can just edit it or there are other ways where you can put a little timestamp and say this thing was edited at this time of day on this date. Like there are programmatic ways to do it. And they know that. Jack knows that. I'm sure they talk about this stuff all the time. In fact, I'm a hundred percent sure that this topic is is like this perennial thing that never goes away over there at that company. But I think they'll get to it. I think they'll get around to it because it Twitter's no longer just here's my fast quip. Oh, there's typos. No big deal. It's now I have something very important to say. And if I don't have the option to work on it, tweak it, fix a link that wasn't the right paste, whatever it is without having to delete it. And then people cash it in different readers. So some guys see the thing that's already deleted and others don't. It looks like two posts to one guy and no post to somebody else. Like that stuff's bad user experience. And I think if they want to have a more unified experience across the board, this goes nicely with their other changes recently, like decentralizing their service and other things, which I also agree with those things. And this would fit nicely in there. So I'm not so sure Jack couldn't do it. I think he's just having one of those days where he's not ready to commit. Yeah, as Kelly in our discord points out that Anil Dash talked to a developer, former Twitter engineer Leslie Miley on the function podcast about this and talked about the technical issues. And it would be apparently very hard to implement an edit button on Twitter. It doesn't take five minutes to do if you want to do it right. But in response to that, I would say all the things Scott just said, Reddit has it, Facebook has it. And these are big, big platforms with all the same concerns and implementation that Twitter has. So you've got a wealth of ways. You were even in Slack, we were talking, you're like, what if they just did it the way Gmail does it, right? Where you have 15 seconds, just put a delay on it. So there's no shortage of ways to implement an edit button in sensitive situations on the internet. I don't buy that it's like, wow, but if we did it, there'd be all these negative consequences that no one ever thought of. This is one of those examples where it's very well thought out. People have tried it in many situations. They've implemented it and tested it over years. The hard work is done for Twitter. It's a philosophical thing. It's not a practical thing. It's a philosophical thing. Dorsey just is the way I used to be. I mentioned this on TMS this morning too. I used to be someone who's like, no, you shouldn't have an edit button because it will be abused and it'll teach you to compose well from the beginning. And I've changed my mind on that over the years. I'm like, no, I've seen some good edit button implementations that do not lead to misleading information, do not lead to confusion because of the way they're implemented. So we've solved that problem. It's just a matter of whether you wanna do it or not. And if he's really worried about people spreading misinformation or misleading information on Twitter, this is the least of their issues. Like that thing is already the format or is already the platform of the most misleading information. Part of it's just because it's short and quick and people just go, oh, there it isn't going with whatever I've just seen and I'm not gonna double check or do any research. If that's his concern, I don't buy it. They've already got the worst setup as it is for that. So yeah. And Reddit certainly would have come to that as a big problem if they hadn't figured out how to do it in a way that it won't be taken advantage of. So. Totally agree. Speaking of subreddit, we got one. You can submit stories and vote on them at dailytechnewshow.reddit.com. And we've got a Discord, as I just mentioned. Join in our conversations by linking Discord to your Patreon account, Patreon.com slash DTNS. All right. Sarah wanted to read this mail bag today. Tim Deputy says, hi to you guys, a girl and a DTNS place. It seems that all the podcasts I listened to have at one time or another run a foul of wrongful copyright takedowns. It seems like the system is weighted heavily in favor of the complainer. There are very few gates in front of someone reporting a violation and no consequences for being wrong. I wonder if things would get better if there was some kind of penalty or fine if you request a takedown that then gets overturned. That penalty could then be given to the creator to compensate for any loss of revenue they might have experienced. I feel like it would incentivize copyright holders to do more due diligence and reduce the amount of wrongful takedowns. The other side of that coin is that services like YouTube should also offer a better mechanism for reporting than you do. In fact, have rights to the content you're displaying. I'm curious about your thoughts on how the process is currently structured. Well, Tim, quick version for me. The reason it's structured the way it is on YouTube is YouTube was trying to appease the copyright holders who were accusing YouTube of encouraging copyright infringement. So they made it easy for big copyright holders to file. If they hadn't, they wouldn't have been able to grow. They had to make it easy to file. And there is a consequence to filing an incorrect takedown. But the way YouTube does it, they say you can challenge the takedown and then they can file a formal takedown request. And then you can challenge the formal takedown request and the copyright holder would then have to go to court to challenge you at that point. And so you have to decide if you really wanna go to court or if you wanna risk going to court by challenging the formal takedown. That's the way that process works overall. But in practice, Scott, sometimes it just goes all the way to the end without any appeal, doesn't it? Yes, it does. I may have experienced something like this recently myself. I'm still experiencing it, but it's a little bit like a cease and desist. The difference here is that you can't see, I might see it these cease and desist and go, well, this is just some bluster. They're not gonna do anything. And until they subpoena me, I'm gonna ignore this cease and desist. That's an option you have with cease and desist. You can do that yourself. Whatever risk you are taking. Well, I know that what we had on our YouTube ban was not only legal, we actually paid to be able to play it. It's also five years old. And the stuff that went after our three specific videos that had a song in the middle of them and YouTube is all over my case saying that the complainants say that I ripped off their content. Truth is we pay ASCAP fees and we had the rights to do it. So normally if I get a cease and desist or something for something like that, I could say it's fine. We're just gonna keep going. Yeah, I'm gonna call their bluff basically. In this case, they give a cease and desist to YouTube and YouTube says there's no such thing as calling bluff. Everything's shut down. We're shutting it down because a guilty until proven innocent basically is the way they do it. I'm not trying to equate it to government, but it is kind of the opposite of what we try to do with law. And then it's up to me to appeal it. The field process is kind of a nightmare. You're mostly dealing with machines for a while. Eventually you might get people looking at it. On the way to that official copyright takedown notice while you're waiting to go through all those machines, your channel's off. Yeah, yes. That's the guilty and proven innocent. You may end up winning this dispute. You may tell them like, ah, but if you really wanna do an official takedown, you're gonna have to back it up in court and it's illegal to do a bad faith takedown notice. But in the meantime, YouTube has your channel shut down. Right, and you know what? Honestly, here's the truth of it. They could have come to me outside of the channels and said, hey, this song you played back in 2012, we didn't want that on there. And I might have said, well, we pay our ASCAP fees, but I understand if that's a problem, I'll just delete the video. We'd be done. We'd be done. I deleted it, no problem. I wouldn't have fought that, but instead now all my stuff is in YouTube jail, all the art videos I do, which are 100% my content, everything else I've ever done that has nothing to do with this dispute is all up there. And ironically, the dispute itself is actually based on legal acquisition of the music we played. So it really is heavily favored away from me as a creator and toward those who are making the complaints. 100% true. I agree with this email that maybe more could be done on their end to ease that up. Maybe not fines. Maybe this stuff's already a deterrent for them, but just something more so YouTube could say, we're not 100% not with you, dear creator. We'd actually like to see you do well on here as well. We're going to talk more about this on good day internet, but thank you, Scott, for the summary there. Shout out to patrons at our master and grandmaster levels, including Phillip Lass, Friedrich Huebner, James P. Callison. Thank you, Scott Johnson. If people want to find the content that is available from you, where do they go? Well, most of it is still, we keep everything on Twitch as well. So if you want to go see that stuff there, we've got full collections for the different shows I do, although a lot of the archive stuff isn't there because we weren't doing it back then when I was putting it on YouTube. But if YouTube comes back, it'll all be there as well. If they're looking for all of this stuff though, links to everything that we're doing, go to frogpants.com and you'll find it, even some temporary places for videos until this all gets resolved. But the podcasts are all good. Everything's on the up and up there. And if you're looking to just chat with me, I'll be on Twitter, unable to edit my posts over at Scott Johnson on Twitter. Hey, we have new Patreon reward merchandise. I'm using the old six year anniversary logo, DTNs mug right now. Delicious. If you'd like to have one of these, you have to pledge at the right level for three months, but then it's yours at no extra charge. Patreon.com slash DTNs, get the details. Patreon.com slash DTNs slash merch. Our email address is feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. We're live Monday through Friday at 4.30 p.m. Eastern 2130 UTC. Find out more about that at dailytechnewshow.com slash live. We'll be back tomorrow with Justin Robert Young. Talk to you then. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com. I'm in the club, hope you have enjoyed this program. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha