 So, welcome back. It was nice discussing youth and politics with the two comrades. One comrade was Kennedy and the other was Thomas. It was very nice. And now I told you that it's World Population Day, that was yesterday. We celebrate World Population Day in every 11th of July. And now we are here to discuss things, population. And you can't discuss population without mentioning things, family planning. Around the family planning, there is a statistics that say those who practice family planning mostly are ladies. And the family planning is more safer when practiced by men than ladies. That is according to science and statistics. Now I'm here with the men who are going to help us know if or why men are not supporting. If at all because the statistics say that they are not well supporting the family planning initiative, they want ladies to do it. And we are here with the two gentlemen who look very sharp. They are going to introduce himself starting with the person from my far right. So you're going to tell us everything about you, your name, your social media handles, what you do and all that. Welcome. Thank you very much. My name is Simon Masai. I'm a practice in Christian. Practice in Christian, you're going to explain that. I am a computer scientist by profession, but I practice entrepreneurship at the moment. It's the one that is bringing food on the table. Apart from that, I'm a blogger. I do blog and my blog is Timed Life in Cuttingness. And I also do podcast. In Facebook, it's Simon Masai. And in Twitter, it's at Simeon Masai. It's S-I-M-I-O-N Masai. That is on Twitter and also on Instagram is Simo Masai. Simo is S-Y-M-O-R-E. Yes. Oh, that's nice Masai. What did you mean by practicing Christian? Practicing Christian, okay, we have people who confess by just mentioning it, but they are those who make it practical. You leave it out. So that is what I meant. Okay, nice to have you on set. Thank you. You are going to tell us the Christian perspective on this population thing and family planning thing and everything about it. Now that we have a Christian, a faithful on set. Maybe just one more thing or two more things I can say. I also work with Aiman. This is an organization called Fokas Kenya. It's Fellowship of Christian Union. I'm an associate. I do mentorship to student and discipleship. What did you say brings food on your table? Entrepreneurship. You are an entrepreneur. We have shown entrepreneurship every Tuesday. So maybe next time you'll tell us more about how you entrepreneur as I am person. Yeah, the next person is called Frank Kobe. So Kobe, you can tell us more about you, more about you, everything from what you do and everything. So Frank. Santisana. Mine is called Frank Kobe. I work with MC Frank. I work with MC Frank Kobe. I'm a DJ. Apart from being a DJ, I'm an actor. I train, I work with an actor and I'm a scriptwriter. I'm not an entertainer but I'm a co-best. But I'm in business management. What kind of management? Business management. Currently, I'm a student and I'm a journalist. Levolgan. I'm a business manager and I'm a diploma. So I'm a degree but I'm a master. But you mentioned about journalism. Are you a health student studying journalism at which level and where? Niko Kenema Institute. Yes, Lefanya Diploma. Okay. Yes. Let us now get to the business of the day and it's about population. The statistics about, the brief statistics about population in the whole world is that the one population is growing rapidly. Like the population has increased to about 88 million people every year. Like 88 people, 83 million people are born every year. And right now, there are about 7.6 billion people in the world. We are the one population of people, of men and women of humanity. We are 7.6 billion. That means there are over half a billion more people in the world that has reached when it was counted 7 years ago. So it's like a billion people are born as increased from 7 years ago. And if the population continues to increase as they are now, there will be about 10 billion people worldwide. And the three most populous nations in the world are now China and China is number one. India is number two. And then number three is USA currently. But they are saying that it's fast changing. That by 2050 India is projected to overtake China and then Nigeria will come in the mix. Nigeria is Africa and Sub-Saharan Africa. So Nigeria is like will overthrow USA. USA will no longer be there. It's going down. But generally, the African population is growing, growing more than the European population. We are becoming more and more and more. And that is why there is need for us to change or to decrease the population. Now what do you think? Do you think as African we need to be more or we need to control the population? Ok, angali apia na resources manya tu konazo kama wa na damu. Let's go with you first Masai. Ok, first if you look at in Africa we have many countries that are very poor. And unfortunately those countries that are poor they have more people. And so for my opinion will be like we need first we do need to increase numbers. We need to manage what we have. And so that we don't deplete the resources we have by having more people around. So according to you we should control birth. We should do birth control to control the increasing population. Yeah, we manage the number we have. Ok, what do you think? Ah, what was the honey? What was the honey? What was the honey? Ok, kwa baibol kwa genesis ina seme kana, kwa jazid muka jurimeja. Bado kuna space kubo. Kwa baibol kuna space wana. Another thing is they say God himself say ok there is an aspect of wisdom. Ok, the Bible it say ok it's very correct to say and go and play and then we'll zane. But it's an aspect of wisdom and the Bible itself says if you lack wisdom ask God to give you. Ok, my management here managing the population I mean like we increasing the number like we use wisdom. Like for example you are a parent, you unajoma pata yako. You know what you get and you know what you can provide to make sure that what you talk wana grobizuri. We wana wana say I will not want me to be raised the way I was raised. Like I want my children to be better off. Like wana, so you will not just make sure you will not have 100 children and you unama pata kidoga and you want to see. That was my point. You are differing. What was honey? Where you come from let us start with maybe kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol kwa baibol. Kwa ka rizourses, kuna shamba kuna kila kitu eni lisa fanya wa tu wa zahane bili wana? Kokikazi kutu ni, ya kwa mc komofangshshel, ni menda places mingasa na pa., kwa iken�etu. Infact kaw anti zadeh siha hyanda, kuna shamba. Chukiwe injiwa kwen dahi garisa peiki hake, aga kuna shamba iwi. So that is how people can stay in their house? Nini, Egypti nidesat, kwele mani wongo, enda China, most nid places nidesat, enda Israel. Tumituwa kili, tulemiwe tneza, fungo iso, places, zikwe productive. So, where are family planning is now? Ah ah, what was zahane, what was zahane. In fact, nikona buses, nikona buses, zakusapuot what was zahane. Steal them, let's hear them. Maybe they will go to this as we start. Tumituwa, wajani kumaliza hivi, the book of Psalms. One, two, seven, three. In Asema, children have a heritage in it. So, what of kwenwa toto? Uke damele, kunapia bus in Asema, kwa uminyanam toto, ana that happiness. Kunana. So, kwenwa kuna trwegi bus, kuna happiness miki bus. Oh, the mother, they are happy. Okay, let's practically look at that one. Okay, those people, okay. Shitu neshi, like, tumia examples around. Okay, we use the Baibu and then this example around. Like, is it true that those who have many children are happy? Very happy, very happy. Saifon, Saifon is trying to bring it that maybe it depends on the amount of resources you have. But it's paradoxical that the rich, those who have money, the Obamas of this one, the bill gates of this one. And now, those who are in the low class, in the southern part of this axis, now they don't have resources to bring up these children. Tell us why you think this is the case. Okay, the case of those who are richer, they have. Yeah, and they have very few kids. And those who are poor and have many kids and they don't have resources to take care of those kids. Okay, we have those people, like, kuna trwegi. They are those people who say maybe moza atakuwa nini. That's the matrix they use. And so they end up like, let me get more. Maybe one of them atabatikakuwa. But those people who are rich, moana. Like for them, okay, when it comes to family things and like having children, you know the process of having children. It comes when, when you find those who are rich, they tend to be very busy. And so the process of making children for them is not a priority. Moana, like through the intent to to have less children, moana. That is my opinion on that one. Yes. So kaka kwa iyo kwa trwegi. So kaka kwa trmoja. And trmoja labda. But inbaya. Another thing is kukuadakari, it's resources is needed for somebody to become a doctor. For you to become like professionally, like for you to get a profession. Like kuna iyo kuna iyo and find a primary nini. And then, so unfortunately kama if you don't, if you don't have any money. So kisima sumo nibure? Primary? Is it bure? I think it's bure. Sayu na sumu relai kwe umbidi m habilinda shule. Are you reading free? Are you studying free of charge? Me kwa sponsored? So kuna vitu kuna espelli Wa u trokeileh utafutu izu resources. Rekin kusemo jilemi eteti Udashina kunga munga tsam toto saniakhe papu naired. Anyway, moana sewa mkutara kuja na sainiak. Ii niwまあu kua rakuja r국si because she was living the same elsama ahti niya kwa, aw trak chilli –but it was island kunji upotu ku nafa, it Sorry I couldn't know anything but in this country I felt your parents were very responsible –for having this family We decided just to have them and then you find that some of the children outside they are cross-treat, it's not that they are often, but they have a responsible parent. Nikuwa suwani. Apu, makosa yekuza, makosa nimuza zindi akua responsible. Let me give you a good example nani. A kukuda enja. A kutuangapi. Kosa nikuwa nama bibiwe nikuwa. Na ualiza. Na ualiza akua. Na kumbia apu kuna loya. Wali ena shule wote. Akunamu niya agenda shule. So, tu se meti, tu kiza wengia. Kutu responsible. Let's look at a kukuda enja in terms of, was he poor? Pafat is relative by the way. In terms of resources. In terms of resources. Okay, in terms of taking care of all those wives and all those children. Akunamu niya. Akunamu niya. So, he was not very stable financially, but the children caught up and he first struggled to bring them up and then they caught up. They got the many of them, got the professions, they went to school. They are now a bit stable financially, though a kukuim self is not there. But that is an exceptional case. It's not a case with everybody. So, you cannot be reconciled, the two of you. Frank has to this ground that people need to be as many as possible. On the other hand, Simon has insisted that people have to be as few as possible. So, let us go with the... I'm not taking sides, but now Frank, if your wife says you will marry, your wife wants you to have a few kids. If they want you to have a few kids, they are birth controls that ladies use. Many of them, they are pills. They are just many of them. And now they are ones that men use. How do you think you can support your wife to practice this birth control? Just kumotivate her. Edelia tu taizinge ina kufraisha utu miye. Ibu tu watu pesaidi ake. But you know, they have a lot of side effects like the women practicing the safest way, the safest according to statistics, and that is effective 98%, is that they are two ways that men can use to do the birth controls. Two, the third one is being said, I'll tell you shortly about it. The one is using this latex. And the two is vasectomy. The latex works 98% in birth control. The 2% I think is the accident that can happen and maybe that blood breaks and all that. But the vasectomy works 99%. 99% So don't you think we start with Simon? Why don't you think men are not taking these birth controls upon themselves and protect their wives from going through all this risk? Don't you think we are selfish men? First, we are African. There is something about men. Men in Africa, there is something by the fact that we are African, there is an ego that is nurtured in Africa for men. When it comes to, nothing negative comes from a man. Nothing negative comes from a man. It's an ocean, I'm not affirming it. When it comes to family planning, men think that it's not for men to do that, women should do that. So they don't take the responsibility of even going and seeing as a man what can I do to make sure that we have this in control. But you'll find that they always point it to women like go and do your thing but for me I'm okay. That is what Kobi said. Don't you think to you, don't you think that is negative masculinity? Don't you think men should come in? For me, my opinion on that men should come in. From the Bible, in a marriage, the two becomes one. So in anything, they should even plan in terms of how many children are you going to have. It depends, they'll make that decision depending on what they have as a resource and how ready they are to take care of their children. So I think it's the responsibility of both to sit down and say how are you going to do it. So Kobi, I'm finishing with you so that I come back to Kobi on the same point. We have just found out that the first way is vasectomy. Men doing the vasectomy. Do you encourage men to take the vasectomy? For me, vasectomy. No. You don't, you think men should really come in this. Like as a pattern. You are in a big dynamic. In a big dynamic between. Like you talk of another one. Ya, there's another one. It's 98% and this one is 99%. Ok, for me as a person, I'll not prefer vasectomy as a person. Ya, tell us your resource. Tell us your resource for not. Because you sound like you really support women. You really support the support of women. You even quoted the verses that you should help each other. In fact, the woman is written in the Bible as the helpmate. So she should support your helpmate as much as possible. She'll be doing most things she just supports. So why do you find it hard that men should not do vasectomy? From your part as a man? With the line that, you should also support women. Ok. Ya. Like you don't vasectomy. Ok, for me it's, you'll temper with your... Ok, it's cutting. Ya, cutting those pipes that transform... Ya, the fertility. You will temper with the fertility so that they are blocked. They are not channeled. You cannot impregnate because it is separated. So you don't support the cutting. The reason why I'm reluctant a bit, ok, I'm not a medic, but for me the reason why I'm saying that is because should it have health effect? That is why I'm reluctant doing that one because of health effect. Oh, you think there will be... Some complications that may not be necessarily on... Like it may make your body dysfunction. Ok, the aim was to not to, like it stops those pipes as you have called them, but should it have any other effect to the whole body then that's why I'm reluctant. I'll tell you some facts about vasectomy and maybe we'll take it on from there. But now let us come back to my brother, Kobe. Kobe, tell us why you cannot... Oh, let us start with if you can take it. Can you take vasectomy? No. It's a big no for you. No. Give us your reasons. Number one. Atu zika tumurambili. Sika mawana. Ume twili wan itu yu vasectakwanza. Ok. 2k yu kwa zachi. Ok. Number two. So, ujwa, kuna male fluid, kuna male fluid, kuna male fluid, na kwa produced. Na siti yuki kata sasa, inetra vas difference. Yoi o pipe na kata. Inahinda that fluid, itroke kwa penyeiko, na yende kwa pipe, alafu itroke injie. So, the same inetraoka, the fluid, that's the egg, aita pita. So, imagine me katwa, asusa aita flow, itroke injie. Itabaki ukundani. Ibaru zainak producer zengene, zidain da wa pi. To figure to wa putui, zain da wa pi. Zina paile. O kashu kume bust. You are just a pita. Aguna kubust. Aguna kubust. Tima waniangu tu. So, you kubust, is that the only reason? Because I am going to clear you out of that fact. Okay, let me tell you some very few facts about vasectoma. One, is that vasectoma is not painful. It's something that doesn't pain much. It's a minor surgery. That's one. It's a very minor surgery that for around 15 to 20 minutes it's over. It's done and it's over. And I've told you that it's not very painful. And the recovery time is very short. Like you recover very fast. Before you know it, before you know it you have recovered. And during vasectomy, like after you've taken the vasectomy, you can resume your work. Like if you can do it maybe on a Friday. And on Monday you're just back to your things are just okay. And another fact about vasectomy is that it does not affect the performance, the sexual performance. You will just perform in bed the way you do perform. The only thing is that the semen won't reach that destination because there's just disconnect. I know you're going to ask me how but it happens. It happens. There's just a way. There's just somewhere they will go. And the results are not immediate. If you've done the vasectomy you'll have to wait for some time before you start assuming that things are not going to be the way they are. And vasectomy in contrary to what really people believe it can be reversed. It can be reversed. You can get back the connection if you want though it is not very very very assured guaranteed that you can succeed in doing that. And so I'm told it is generally safe and men who get vasectomy say that they feel more free when doing that thing because they don't have to worry about the unplanned pregnancy and getting vasectomy is simple. It's an outpatient procedure like you don't have to be taken to what admitted so that you get that vasectomy. You can walk in and get vasectomy and then go back to your house and approximately half of men get do that in USA. Africa is another whole thing. So vasectomy does not affect that production. The production just go on as it is like there is some fluids that mix with that other one that makes it work so that fluid is what that doesn't get to mix with it. So they become infunctional and it is possible to reverse I've told you they do not affect the eye and all that and the procedure is painless I've told you and they are 99% effective I've also told you that and every year there is a world vasectomy day that is November 22. Men and women celebrate that day. Now with these facts in your hands don't you think let us go to Simon let us start with Simon first because there are a lot of misconceptions about vasectomy and now we have cleared them. Don't you think now it is now just safe for men to just take up this thing. From the research do they very limited I said it is the safest the safest like it's safer than taking the pills it's safer than even using the latex it's safer than everything it is safest so that's why men are high to take it because the side effects are limited and you've also heard that it can be reversed so are you changing your mind? Okay it's convincing but there is something that you've mentioned that for it to be effective it takes away you've mentioned something for that and so if that is the case then you might find yourself like once a doctor has told you you've already done this thing and then ignorantly you go and start practicing making process making yourself like you are in trouble again so okay I'm still not sure like I'm still doubtful about what makes me see was interesting is that you really want to support women but it's a very no and remember it's taken when maybe you've got enough kids you wanted 7 we are coming back to that let us say 3 or let us say what Wakida Obama assopted for both are girls so you've had enough kids that you wanted so you say I want to continue enjoying them this same thing but I don't want more kids so now let me disconnect it how comes you want to really support our ladies in this but you don't want to take this other burden okay you've seen them supporting women my point was are you not supporting women okay that was not the case my point was it's for the two to make a decision the two to tango it's not a one man thing for me it's an agreement of two people and then there is when they sit down and have a discussion about it they look at it in terms of which is the best way for us to do it now Simon I've told you the best is vasectomy so can't you sit the two of you and agree that for us let us choose this first this is vasectomy that's you and your wife can you agree that okay from the facts about vasectomy and with main aim and objective of family planning I think I'll not I'll not I'll be okay with that one you will be okay with vasectomy now you have subdued you have agreed now that you can take it if I have the facts at hand let us come back to this problem again the guy that made me this problem is a typical African man typical African man you have heard the facts the facts now tell me but can you consider the fact that I know you can really love your wife one fact will say it is not 100% it is 99% so to the reason from that 1% may back assume ume enda process ukamaliza then kuru di one is successful I'm a concives in there it's a fracas you can say I don't know why you are thinking from a little you are I don't know you are listening with this 1% why don't you listen with the 99% first ume asana 1 ok ok, here is more here is 1% here is 1% here is 2% here is 2% see here is 3% here is no request if you want to demolish the bridge you can get me the bridge it is mine yes, but I'm painful I'm a kemi so here is 2% here is 2% kwa? kwa kwa? Natani vsira Natani vsira Na kwa? Na kwa? Na nfalle n الثakbre Na nfalle n nmopo Na nfalle nmopo Na kwa? Na nfalle nmopo We have been touched by kwaizubiwe. Kwaizubiwe? Ya, hue na kwaizubiwe. Kwaizubiwe, kwhen we are now in Kwiw Колabda, we have been treated by Sheda. The people who can look for response can go on. We are talking to Sheda, we are talking to Sheda and we want to control it. Kwaizubiwe, kwaizubiwe, we have been treated by Sheda sлюka matoès tu peivi. Tukoמכ tu kuonm virtuhm dAdam cameki. Bel dotato. Na lining udaya maihiwaf. Kutifucom, na kapana, ni建amahe. Na visa tablespoons nica wa kye. Kutifutu получится ni vaρωzi wa kukato. Razuh convenientu na ngaf intrinsic. Yah, hai ni pain less. Eya by the way ni painless. Is the reason why he's painless? Hai na pain, hukia tu nga pain. Iho painu na imaging tu kwa kichu. Uza kuwa. Boza mo na painu. Uza kwa na painu. Boza rinjina kukatohitao. Rinjina kukia. Uza kim자 painu. Uza kimina kikita mo mma kakwa mbiye ni taku piga, ajaku piga rekinini taku piga peki. I want to tell you about ongoing research and I'm going to let another option on the table. So ongoing research projects that are going on now on milk contraception, so the research are optimistic that a safe, effective and diverse method of milk contraception will eventually come to reality, though it's still several years to come and this is called hormonal contraception that where the synthetic or man-made hormones will be used to temporarily stop the development of sperm in you that something will be injected in you that will control, that will bar the manufacture of sperms like now sperms will not be manufactured in you so you will be just there sterile, you are sterile like you are not fertile they are developing it so that it will be reversible so that when you are taking this pill so that injection then they are not produced in you during that time can you now take this, tell us what you think about this first sperm this one, like you know the reason why for ladies they have a lot of side effect it's because what they use for them it goes and it tempers with the hormones and so if this one has that option of tempering with the hormones then for me what comes to my mind is side effects when you are talking about like that is the reason why the options for ladies like for me this one now this one is also not but we said it's reversible so you like it is going to temper with the production of sperms and that production of sperms is related with the hormones these are hormones that are responsible for the production of sperms so tempering with it it means something else that will bring more side effect why do I think? because the ladies think that we are very selfish we don't want to help them in these things now even the another option is coming and you started protesting well let us maybe get the view of the problem in the house the problem in the house there is this one that is like permanent not permanently but temporarily stop the production you are worried about kukatwa and you also worried that this sperms they are produced and they are piling you may bust now they are coming up with a method that is stopping the production altogether what do you think? I think it is a bit positive kidogo but bad only no what is this? what is this? we have to understand that our sisters after kumazaiso, kikilaiso pills one has to change body size and some developments are not affected in their body so we have to understand that we have to understand that we have to understand that the problem with kumazaiso is what is the problem in the house we have to understand that what if there is something positive that may come the side effect will be more brainy we have to understand that don't you think this can also happen because there are also positive effects like kukisema, we have to understand that we have to understand that we have to understand that we have to understand that we have to understand better but we have to understand that but we have to understand that we have to understand that look directly there and tell lady something in 30 seconds and then you tell man something in 30 seconds in light of this population control and birth control and all that we are still in the world population day ladies to say ida netu fanya pati enu, si tu fanya pati etu kama kuenda kwa isopil sama kuwe kwa nasapot laki sisi wanahume boy child to say ida ladies to apeleke wa fanya iso vitu vizuri sana but sisi kazaen tu kuprovetu the family iso zingine lady suafanya Okay, Saifon Masai speak like a Christian now and speak like Masai and marry now these two things you wanting to support women and you wanting to you wanting to support women you being a Christian and you still wanting to be a man mix this thing and in 30 seconds talk to ladies and then in 30 seconds talk to man camera camera okay, let me start by saying this process comes when we are in the marriage and let me speak as a Christian here it's a union between two when it comes to marriage and when it comes to planning for what will happen in the marriage the two should really come together handy so for ladies I want to take the ladies and the man in the house they need to sit down and agree on what to do as far as family planning is concerned like if they agree in terms of is the lady who is going to take the implant let it be so if it's the man who is coming in to help the lady by saying I'm going for vasectomy let it be so but the main goal should be the family planning lady is going to take the implant and say to Frank and then say to Frank and say to Kuf Fina Fina Fina we will tell you somewhat but that was interesting guys we had a good conversation with the two gentlemen the only stalemate is that you are still not agreeing to support this but I can see in you you really need to support it's like you are saying that our hands are tied we really wanted to do this we are very sorry we are very sorry our hands are tied if there is anything you can do to support your lady in what she wants please do it that was very fruitful in France kama kutuma faya kama suji faya it was very interesting thank you for this you've been very supportive in why in the morning you've been with us all through we appreciate we don't take it for granted that you took time to be with us we are very thankful for the technical team the production team that made sure that this is possible the Obama Stella all those who are behind the camera Brenda Paul Jeffrey thank you very much and all of you who are supporting this may God bless you and I'm leaving you with a spotting short that if they sell away you can support your partner and friend please do it we can go on with this conversation because it was posted in all our social media let us go on with this conversation so that at the end of it we at least get a solution for now