 Because there is so much controversy, so much back and forth regarding tongues, we really don't spend a lot of time talking about the gift of interpretation. And so I wanna do a couple of things. One, I wanna show the examples where interpretation is in the Bible. It's gonna surprise you. And then also I wanna tell you the definition. And then I wanna compare using the language. So I want you guys to see what I see because here's the thing. I don't get nor do you get the opportunity, do we have the right to say what something means if we know what it means. If it means X, Y, Z, then we can't turn around and say that know what it really means is this. Or I think it means this. Or to me, it seems like this. We don't get to do that. It's just like if I hurl an insult at you and then you get upset. But I said, hey, no, I didn't do anything, but you gave an insult at me. And I said, no, that's not what that word means. Well, words have meaning. Same thing here. And so I want you all to see. We're gonna just take a little time. Won't be too long. I don't think it's gonna be too long, but I do want to look at this and see. Because truth be told, it should not be that big of a controversy. I think what happens a lot of times is that as we go, maybe we don't know what some of these words mean, what the writer is trying to say. And yet we do leave it up to our own interpretation. But sometimes if we just see what a word means or what the words that we're using mean, it takes away from our own interpretation. And so that being stated, I want to go to where we see this term, this gift of interpretation we're gonna go to, obviously 1 Corinthians chapter 12, starting in verse 10. And it says to another, the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another, the ability to distinguish between the spirits, to another various kinds of tongues. And this word is, Gene Loson, another, and here it is to another, the interpretation of tongues. The interpretation of tongues. Now, it's gonna come as a shock to some people, maybe not, maybe, maybe not to you guys because you all are smart Christians. Do you know how many times or how many examples in the Bible do we actually see this gift being used? It may come as a shock. We only see this one time in the Bible where this gift is used. Not the mentioning of the gift, but there's only one time, one time in scripture, where we see interpretation actually taking place. We're told that we're supposed to have interpretation, but we only see it once. And so that also might help the understanding of what this other gift is because the two are necessarily combined. The two are associated, the two go hand in hand. But now what I wanna do is I wanna deal with first what the definition of the word is. Let's pull it back on the screen. And so this interpretation, this word comes from this hernia, which is where we get the word, hermies, the Greek God of speaking. It's not about a Greek God or any sort of Greek mythology, but the word is to speak or to tell or something like that. And so I wanna give the definition, the word that we use there in the Greek is this word, dia, the Eremenuo, which is this word means to translate from one language to another to clarify, to explain, to make understandable, to interpret. In regards to this gifting, this spiritual moving of interpretation, then what it really is, is kind of in translation, as I'm giving a translation, it is to make something understood, to clarify something, that there be an explanation of what's being said. Are you with me? You might get the picture of, let's say someone in the UN, someone is speaking in one language and there is an interpreter, an interpreter who is translating what's being said. That's not quite the way it really is. It really is just that there'd be some sort of understanding. You need to understand what's being said. There needs to be understanding by the body. Remember, and I wanna pull this up because this is also vitally important because this didn't just show up. He says something before he goes to verse 10. Let's go back to it and let's move ourselves up a few passages to verse seven. Remember, this is what Paul is saying. All the giftings, all the spiritual things have to be under. He says that to each one is given the manifestation of the spirit forward. Here it is for the common good, for the common good. Therefore, it must be for the benefit of others. As a matter of fact, Peter says the same thing in first Peter chapter four, verse 10. He says as each one has received a special gift, employ it in serving one another as good stewards of the manifold grace of God. So before we go any further, we should understand two things. One, what the definition of the word is, we don't come up with our own definition. To me, I think this means this or I believe it, no. We know what the definition of it is. Now, to back this up, if you wanna go and look it up, you can pull up and make it mounts the Greek dictionary or the definition that I got it from was also from the BDAC, which is kind of the standard for Greek lexicons. So one, we know what the definition of the word is two, we know that because it is a spiritual thing, it's part of the numitikon. It's this gifting from the Holy Spirit. We know that it is necessarily, it necessarily has to involve others. It is for the benefit of others. And since it is for explanation, for edifying, let's put it back on the screen. It is to translate from one language to another that is with in mind others being edified to clarify for others to explain for others to make understandable or to interpret for others. You cannot get past that, okay? So that needs to be understood. Sometimes you'll see someone get up and say something and the person who says it, then someone else is gonna give some sort of interpretation of what was said. You see that more and more today because people are saying, wait a second, if you speak in these tongues, well then someone, there should be some sort of interpretation. Well, here's a fact. Even the person who is speaking has to understand it. It's not as though the person who's saying something doesn't know, that's never the case. We're gonna look at that as well. And so the interpretation, the understanding, the explanation, the translation is for the person who's saying it, for the person who's hearing it. And if there happens to be more than one person there who is not the target of the conversation, there needs to be interpretation for the audience. So that being stated, let's go to a couple of places in the Bible and as a matter of fact, before I even go there, I just so that you all can kind of get an understanding of this word as well. Let me pull up a couple of examples of this word used elsewhere. Let's go to Luke chapter 24 verse 27. Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets he explained to them the things concerning himself and all the scriptures. Well, where's the word interpret? Or where's the word interpretation? Well, it's there in this word explained. The word for explain is there, look to the right-hand side in the Greek. It is the word, excuse me, dhir me nuusin. That word is the exact same word for look at the bottom left-hand corner where we have it has, and again, it's made of two words, dhia, which is through hermenuo, which is, what we have the word hermeneutics, hermenuo, which is to speak, to explain. And so it is to explain and to interpret. So we see that word there. Of course, we just say our translation has to explain, which means the same thing. Then if we look at another example, we see in Acts chapter nine verse 36. Now in Joppa, there was a disciple named Tabitha. Here it is, which translated in Greek is called Dorcas. And what do we see over in the right-hand side? That same word in Greek, which is dhia menuo, which is to interpret, to translate. Are you with me? So those are two examples. So by seeing those other two examples that have nothing to do with speaking in tongues or the gift of tongues, just the word gives us understanding that that is the true definition. We see how the word is used. Are you with me? So what I wanna do now is I wanna go to the very first time, as a matter of fact, the only time in scripture where we actually see this interpretation being used. I'm not saying that this is the only time that it's explained, no, but this is the only time in scripture, the only time where the gift of interpretation, we have an example of it. So let's go to Acts chapter two. This is, let's start in verse three. And there appeared to them tongues as a fire, distributing themselves, and they rested on each one of them, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit was giving them utterances. Now, we've covered this before, we won't spend too much time on this, although we'll deal with something in the language because I want to point something out because someone's gonna say, well, no, we're talking about two different things, Corey. And I'm gonna show that we're not talking about two different things. We're talking about the same thing, the same gift, but the word for tongues, the word for language or the word is the word languages, this is not someone who's making up something, the word for tongues is literally the word language is glossize. That's what it's always, it's, well, I'll take it back, it means two things. The word glossize means or glow say, means, and when I say these different ways of saying it, it's either because I'm saying it in the singular or I'm saying it in the plural, or there are times in Greek where you may have different endings to a word. That didn't really change the word, just like we have a and an, if I say a car versus an apple, the word a, the indefinite article, a has an end on it, doesn't change anything as far as a meaning. Or sometimes you'll see in English, you might have a different suffix, that didn't change the meaning of the word, it might change the tense of it, but you'll see some of that in Greek. I don't wanna go too far with that, but sometimes you'll see the root word with a different ending or different prefix. Don't let that throw you off, we wanna stick with what the word actually means. And so when we say tongues, we mean languages, which makes sense. So now there ought to be some sort of interpretation, some sort of translation, some sort of explanation, where it's understandable to the person that's speaking, to the person that's hearing, the intended object of the speaker, as well as the audience around that. Remember that, three things that you may, or you're gonna see at least two, obviously. There necessarily has to be two for this gift. But you may also see three. What's the two? The one is the person speaking it himself. The second is the person that's being spoken to. And then the third, sometimes, sometimes not, is an audience that is around. You have that here in Acts chapter two. Again, this is the only time in scripture where we actually see the gift of interpretation or where we see interpretation actually used here. So let's continue. Verse five, now there were Jews living in Jerusalem, devout men from every nation under heaven. And when this sound occurred, the crowd came together and they were bewildered because each one of them was hearing them speak in his own language. So we have the people that are saying it and then we have the crowd, those who are receiving it, those who are hearing it. Cephas Rock says, so basically the gift of interpretation is meant to dissuade false teachers that pretend to speak in tongues. That is one thing that it should do. Unfortunately, it doesn't. It should, because Paul does bring this up, we'll cover this when we get to 1 Corinthians 14 where he says that if there is no interpretation, then he says be silent, hush up, silence. No more, don't say anything. You would think so, but that's not quite the way it's happening. We're seeing people too, because the truth is anybody can abuse something. Anyone can do something in a faulty fashion. Someone can do it intentionally. Someone can do it unintentionally, but it does happen. So that being stated, we've got someone saying something in a different language and we've got people that are hearing it in a different language. Are you with me? But then the third element shows up, someone who is not speaking, someone who is not hearing, who the tongues, the languages are not geared towards. There's another group of people that are there hearing it and they have no idea. Remember what he says that there's this bewilderment? He says verse six, and with the sound of a curd, the crowd came together and were bewildered. Each one of them was hearing them speak in his own language. So they were hearing it. They were all amazed when it started saying, why are not all these who are speaking Galileans and how is it that we hear, each hear them in our own languages to which we were born? Parthians and Medes and Elimites and so forth. So I won't go through that entire list, but these people in these different areas and these different dialects, these different languages, these different regions are hearing them speak to them in their own native language. And then verse 12 says, and they all continued in amazement and great perplexity saying to one another, what does this mean? There it is. What does this mean? So others will say, hey, what's happening here? Now you've got two group of people that are wondering what's happening. You got those that are hearing it wondering, hey, what is all this about? But then you've got the other people who have no idea what's being said. That happens. And then you have like any other time when an actual move of the spirit happens, what's gonna happen? Mockers, scoffers are going to show up. So he says, but verse 13, but others were mocking and saying, they are full of sweet wine. So here we have people that are gonna show up and say they are full of wine. Well, some might say, well, wait a second, why would you say that they are full of wine, that they are drunk? I've heard different languages and when I hear languages, it doesn't sound like they're drunk, it's sounding like they're language. But first of all, because we're in the society that we're in, we're used to hearing different languages all the time and so we can recognize it. But there are some languages that if you heard right now, you would wonder what is being said. However, we don't have to worry about if they had a legitimate or sincere desire to know what was being said. They were mockers. They were mocking. So their intention of the heart is told there. Now, Peter, these 12 apostles have been filled with the Holy Spirit and they're speaking. And so Peter stands up and he says, stand up with the 11, raise his voice and declare to them men of Judea and all of you who are in Jerusalem, let this be known to you and give heed to my words for these men are not drunk as you suppose for it is only the third hour of the day. But this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel. And so what Peter is doing, he's explaining them, remember you Jews, the prophet Joel tells us that this is going to happen. And then look what Peter says in verse 22, he says, men of Israel, listen to these words. Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and signs, I mean wonders and signs which God performed through him in your midst just as you yourselves know this man delivered over by the predetermined plan and for knowledge of God, you nailed to a cross. Now I won't go through all this, but what is Peter doing? Anybody have any idea what Peter is doing? Peter is doing what the gift calls for. He's interpreting, he's explaining, he's translating, he's saying, this is what is happening. The people that are hearing it aren't necessarily doing it. I imagine they could, but someone needs to give an understanding as to what's happening. So that let's say this group that are hearing from, let's say the Parthenes, they hear it but they don't understand what these other groups said. And so now it's being told to them that all of these different languages that you're hearing, you're hearing the same thing, you're hearing God being glorified. Remember Jesus had just told them, Jesus just told them in chapter one that when you receive the Holy Spirit, he also says this in John 15, when you receive the Holy Spirit, you'll do what? Be my witnesses of me. That's what happens. And now Peter is explaining to them this witness about Christ to everyone who did know what was going on, even to the mockers. What's happening? So revelation is occurring even to the non-believers as well as the believers alike. Are you with me? So now that's the only example in scripture where we see the actual use of interpretation. Remember we only actually see tongues or languages being spoken in one chapter. I mean in one book. There's only one book where we actually see languages, the languages being utilized. We don't see it. Some may wanna point to Mark, but Mark is not showing us any example of someone speaking these languages. And then we go to 1 Corinthians 12, 13, 14, we don't actually see anyone speaking in these languages there. It's talked about. So the only time that we, the only book that we see languages happening, the languages happening is in the book of Acts. And the only time that we see interpretation of that is in Acts chapter two. Let's go to Acts 10. And let's, by the way, there are a couple of times there's Acts two. We see languages. There's Acts 10. We see languages. There's Acts 19. We see languages. We will also say that, or we know we don't have an example of it, but we know that the languages were spoken in Acts eight at the Samaritans. We know that because the sorcerer, Simon, sees this after the Holy Spirit has come upon them and he wants that gifting. He wants the ability to bestow this power onto people. And so what did he see? Well, the only thing he could have seen or heard was them speaking in these languages. He was Marvel. And we know that people marvel at other groups, other people groups receiving the Holy Spirit and speaking in these languages. Like we see in John, I mean, John in Acts chapter 10. Let's start in verse 44. While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message. All the circumcised believers, that is the Jews, who came with Peter were amazed because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been pulled out on the Gentiles also, for they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God, then Peter answered. So now, when they hear them, what are they doing? Now the Bible, every time we don't get a full detailed account of what's happening, what they're saying. But at least in 10, it tells us, just like in Acts 2, tells us that they are exalting Christ. They're talking about Jesus Christ. They are literally hearing the gospel and these people, they were hearing them speaking with these languages and exalting God, which also goes to what he covers in 1 Corinthians 14.1. And five, these gifts, the purpose of tongues is to one, give validation that other people groups have received the Holy Spirit. So the Jews won't think it's just them, but that also they use it to proclaim, to prophesy, not the foretelling predicted prophecy, but to give a revelation. Guess what they're doing when they hear these tongues? They are giving a revelation. The next time we see an actual people group receiving tongues or speaking these tongues is Acts chapter 19, verse six. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them and they began speaking with tongues and what prophesying? They were in all about 12 men. This is the John's disciples. And so what do we have them doing? They are speaking these languages, prophesying. They are speaking these languages, giving this revelation. So that goes along with, that goes along with what the definition of the purpose of this is. However, what we don't see is we don't see interpretation there. Now, it's not to say that there were no interpretation. We can't say that nor can we say the same thing about Tim. All I'm saying is the only time that we see an example of that gifting or someone giving an interpretation is Acts chapter two. Now, I wanna go to Mark 16 and there's a reason why I wanna point something out. As a matter of fact, before I do that, let's go back to Acts chapter two and I want to, let's see, I wanna show something in the Greek and I want you all to see the same form of the words being used. Acts chapter two, let's go to verse, there it is. Verse four, I want you all to see something. There's, you're gonna see these words put together. You're gonna see the word laleo and you're gonna see the word glow size. If you look at the right hand side, I don't know why this is highlighted over here, you're gonna see the word laleo or in this case, lalein and then glow size. You're gonna keep seeing these words every time it shows up. If we go to Acts chapter 10, verse 46, same thing, you're gonna see, in this case, laluton, which is also derived from laleo and then glow size. If we go to Acts chapter 19, you're gonna see again lalun, which is from laleo and then glow size. So the point I want you to see is that lalun or laleo or laleo, the speaking and then glow size, that's what we're talking about. We're talking about interpreting the speaking in tongues because, and the reason why I'm going over this because someone is gonna wanna say that speaking in tongues and the gift of tongues are two different things. No, they are not. How do we know so? Whether we wanna think so or not, the language, the Greek language verifies that we're talking about the same thing. Even when we go to Mark chapter 16, look what it says, and these signs will accompany those who have believed. In my name, they will cast out demons and then right here in verse six, I mean, the end of this, it says, and they will speak with new tongues. Look over to the right-hand side, lalucicin, which is laleo, and then tongues, the word is glow size. And so we have still those two words that show up. So we're talking about speaking in languages. Then if we go to 1 Corinthians, you don't want, let me go back to 1 Corinthians 12 because I wanna also pull this up, going back this interpretation before I finish in 1 Corinthians 14. If we go back to 10, he says to another, the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another, the ability to distinguish between spirits, to another, various kinds of tongues. And then we have to another, the interpretation of tongues. And so here's that word, hermenea, which is this interpretation, this translation of the tongues. Let's drop down to verse 30 because we're gonna see something here to make sure that we understand, by the way guys, if someone is going to tell you and stop letting people tell you, there's a side note, stop letting people tell you that we all should speak in tongues. Stop, if they say that, then what they have just done was literally given a contradiction. Why do I say that? Well, first of all, let's talk about what a contradiction is. A contradiction isn't, if I say one person was speaking, then I go on and say two people were speaking. That's not a contradiction. A contradiction would be one person was speaking and then I turn around and say only, if I say only one person was speaking, then I say two people were speaking, well, that's a contradiction. If I say we're going this way and then another verse says, we're not going this way, well, now we have a contradiction. We have a contrasting of passages. And so if someone says that we are supposed to speak in tongues, like in Mark 16, Mark 16, let's go back to it, says that they will, they will, verse 17, speak with tongues. They will, and the word for speaking, la lae susan, which is the future active indicative plural, they will speak in, so it's using the same words, glossize. But then when we go to 1 Corinthians, chapter 12, and we go to verse 30, look at what it says. Now, the English might say, do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Look at this phrase right here, do all speak with tongues? Let's go over to the right, may pantes, may pantes means not all. So not all, look what it says, not all glossize la lucan, not all, and they use the plural present active. So guess what? Not all will be speaking in tongues. Well, if we're supposed to take that Mark 16, 17 means that we all will, well now we've got a contradiction. If someone tells you that we all will speak in tongues, we have the exact same phrase with a negation, we all will not. It literally means we all will not be speaking in tongues. If Mark 16 means that we all will speak in tongues, well now that is the very, and a classic definition of, or classic example of a contradiction. How many of you all believe the Bible contradicts itself? I do not. The Bible does not contradict itself. And so we are not all going to speak in these languages. Now, if you're one who believes that Mark 16, the latter portion of Mark 16 verses nine through 20 belong, the only way, the only way you can take Mark 16 verses nine through 20 and say that it is applicable is if, especially with these gifts, if only it's talking about the apostles. That's because guess what? We see them actually doing that. We don't see all the believers doing that, but we see all the apostles, or we see the apostles, let's just say all because we don't even hear from, excuse me. Let me drink some water. We don't hear from Bartholomew. No, we don't hear from Badaus. We don't hear from Thomas. We hear from the main ones. Are you with me? So that's the only way that Mark 16 can be applicable if only it applies to the apostles, are you with me? Otherwise, we have a clear example of a contradiction. We do not have contradictions in the Bible because it's using literally the exact same term, the exact same phrase, do all speak in tongues, not all speak in tongues. Are you with me? And so, and there's a reason why I'm using this phrase, the analogy, the reason why I'm pointing out this laleo and this glow size, because we see it all so here. Let's put it back on the screen again. We see laleo, or in this case, the plural present active form of it, which is laleo, which is in this case lalucine, and then we have glow size there for languages. Are you with me? If we were to go over to chapter 14, starting in verse, let's go to verse two, whereas do I have it on here? Do I have it separately? Okay, let's go up to the top, let's go to verse two. We're gonna see the same phrase here. For one who speaks in a tongue, we have laleo, which is laleo, and then tongue, in this case, glow size. Now, the only difference that we're gonna see is if it's singular or plural when it comes to tongues. This case is a singular, which means this we believe he's speaking of gibberish, that he's speaking, you guys just saying something, but it's not true. The reason why you guys have no idea what you're saying, because the gift of the gifting is that not only does a hear know what you're saying, but you also yourself know what you're saying. Remember, the whole point is there needs to be understanding. If there is no understanding, well then the person is hearing, the crowd and yourself, you are a foreigner to your own self. You are a foreigner to what's being said. You have no idea what's being said. And since you have no idea of what's being said, you don't even know why what's being said. So as we go all throughout 1 Corinthians, even 14, we're gonna keep seeing this same phrase being used, laleo, some variation of it, laleo, and then glow size. Go down to verse 13. Here we have this gift of tongues. I mean, this gift of interpretation. Again, he says, therefore, let one who speaks in a tongue, and here's the word speaks, laleo, again, laleo, and then tongues, lose. He says, let that person who does so let him interpret. Let him pray that he may interpret. Well, what does that mean? If he says that let him pray that he may interpret. What that is telling us is that the interpretation doesn't have to necessarily come from an outside party. In this case, it seems to be indicating from Paul that the person that is saying it should also have understanding. If the word interpret means translate to understand to be explained, well, then guess what? You're supposed to understand as well. The only other example that we have, the only example that we have of someone giving interpretation, Acts two, they certainly knew what they were saying. Jesus told them what they were gonna say, and Peter reiterates to them what's being said. They didn't, Peter didn't get up and say, nor did the apostles say, we don't know what we just said. We have no clue what we just said. Do you, what we need is someone else to come and tell us, I need someone else to come tell me what I just said. No, that is not how that works. We're giving a language and we are prophesying not foretelling, we're giving a foretelling an indicative revelation of the Lord. In this case, Jesus. That's why Paul says in verse one and five, I want you to speak in these languages in order that you give a revelation. That's not what my verse says, well, that's what it says in the Greek. My law on the hand of the prophet 20, I keep saying this over and over again because I want you all to even go back, check my word, go back and look it up and see if that indeed is what it says. I want you to speak in these languages in order to give a revelation. Well, why? Because there are people all over the globe, especially at this time who don't know the gospel which you need to go and speak to and let them know what has been done. Why is that important? Well, because they're taking the gospel from this little region and they're going North to Rome. They're going Northeast into Asia, Asia Minor. They're going South and Southwest into Africa, into Egypt, into other parts. And so we see all these apostles, Thomas and some of these guys brought them to all of these guys moving to different regions of the world. Well, what necessarily must they have if they're gonna go to a place to give the gospel and they don't know the language? They're gonna need the gift of that language. Are you with me? And so that's the whole point of it. Now, I wanna put something on the screen. Remember, we saw this, let's put it back on the screen again. This word, their manuo, which is to translate, that's the word for interpret. It is to translate from one language to another to clarify, to explain, to make understandable, to interpret. Now, out of the way, I wanna go to the examples that we covered and I want you to see, again, right beside each other, actually on top of each other, the different examples of interpret, oh, now interpretation of speaking these languages. And I'll tell you why I'm saying that in a second. So we have in Mark 16, 17, what does it say? They will speak with new languages and the word is glosus, lelusus, which is, they will speak in these languages, acts two and four, where it says that they will, they speak with other languages. It says le lame, heterize glosus, so we see la leo and glosus, same thing in acts 10, 44. We see la lungton, glosus, which is speaking with tongues. In acts 19, six, we see al alone, take glosus, so we see la leo, glosus there. In acts 12, 30, where it says, do all speak in tongues, says, not all, may pantes, glosus, la lucin, which is, we have those two words there again, which is la leo and glosus, first Corinthians 14 and two, la lung, glosus. Now, in first Corinthians 14, every time that we see this speaking in these tongues, it's always the tongues, glosus, or glosus is always gonna be with the word la leo, every time. Again, I'm sorry. Again, verse six says speaking in tongues, it's glosus, la lung, and then verse 13 speaks in a tongue, pray that he may interpret this, halalon, glosus, and so we see prosukhaste, I'm sorry, prosukhesto, henai, and then we say in order that they may interpret, there's that word again, the ermineo. I'm sorry, my voice is really the ermineo, which is to interpret. Every time that the person is speaking in these languages, what necessarily has to accompany them, at least when we see the word interpretation, is tongues. They go side by side. The point is, there needs to be an understanding by not just the speaker, but also from the hearer and also the crowd. Now, how do I know so? Let's drop down to verse, say in chapter 14, let's go to 26. Verse 26 says, what is the outcome then, brethren? When you assemble, each one has a psalm, has a teaching, has a revelation, has a tongue, has interpretation, let all things be done for advocation. If anyone, if a certain person, whoever speaks in a language, it should be done by two or at the most three and each in turn and one must interpret. Well, who's the one? It doesn't say. It doesn't say who the one is. Somebody must interpret. That opens it up and leaves it so that anybody, either the speaker, like Peter did, or maybe the hearer, it doesn't preclude the hearer from also interpreting, nor does it, it certainly doesn't preclude the person who says so. Now, see if it's asked earlier, should this deter false preachers, teachers, whoever from using this gift or from faking this, it should, because what does it say? Let two or three prophets speak at the same time that the others pass judgment, but if a revelation is made to another who is seated, the first one must keep silent. If there is verse, I'm sorry, let's go back up to 26. If there is no interpretation, verse 28, I'm sorry, but if there is no interpreter, he must keep silent in the church. Well, who's the he that must keep silent? Now, notice what it says that he must keep silent and let him speak to himself and God. Now, it doesn't say let him speak in tongues, it let him speak to God. Who must keep silent? The person that's spoken these languages, that's the person has to be quiet. Now, these are the rules that are given. And so when someone wants to speak in a language, there should be a deterrent for them to not just make it up because there necessarily has to be interpretation. Now, what has happened is that we've seen people get up and they'll speak in tongues and then, and it doesn't sound like a language and we know it's not an actual language even though the word tongues is an actual language, we'll see them interpret on their own because I don't want to get up there and speak in tongues and then have to be quiet, myself especially if I'm a preacher. And so what will happen is they will give an interpretation and they'll tell you what they said in English, but what they just said, it was an unknown, no one knows what was just said. Well, the question then is, why in the world did you have to speak in a language that no one knew even though we all spoke in English? When the goal in the first place is that there'd be explanation, that there'd be interpretation. Why? There is absolutely no need for you to get up and speak in some sort of gibberish, some sort of ecstatic language that no one knows, then turn around and speak in English. Well, we could have bypassed that in the first place. So he says, how come every time you come together you all have a tongue? You all got interpret, you all got a rebel, you all have this. Why not, why not just give the word? Why not let your plain old basic English be what it is and let the power of God come through your word because what you're doing is you're actually giving the actual word of God. Unfortunately, people don't want the word of God to take center stage, they want them and their supposed giftings. Remember, the purpose of these gifts are for the edification of the body, not for yourself. And the purpose of them is as Paul says in verse one and five for prophecy, for proclamation, for revelation. That's what this word means, not the foretelling. Now, if you give tongues and you're actually giving a future telling prophecy, amen, it better come to pass or else now you are abusing one gift of tongues and then also abusing prophecy as well. And we see those things happening all the time. I've always wondered why can't we just say what as some of these folks who claim to say they love the Lord why can't we just say as some of you King James version people say, why can't we just say what the say at the Lord is? Why can't that be enough? Because if that's enough, then we don't need to add anything to it, we don't have to put ourselves into it. But now I wanna go back to verse 13. So I wanna show you again that this is what the whole point of any sort of gifting is from. He says verse 13, he says, therefore let the one who speaks in a tongue pray that he may interpret. Now, it can be he or it may be interpreted either way. Either way is fine, but he must pray that there be some interpretation. In other words, he must pray that there be understanding. So when you pray or you speak in this language, if there is no explanation, if there, let's go back to definition, if there is no explanation, no clarity, if that understood, then we are wrong. Paul has a remedy for that. He says verse 14, if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. My mind doesn't know. Well, again, the point is, is to have understanding. So what does he say? Verse 15 is the solution. What is the outcome then? What then? I will pray with the spirit. Didn't say pray in tongue. And I will pray with my mind. This word, no A is understanding. So I will pray also with my mind for understanding. Also, that's the whole goal of any gift, especially this one. I saw someone ask a question. D'Angelo, which part were you saying? Can I explain that part again about being silent? Okay, would they know this beforehand? Or are they to not continue to speak when there is no interpretation? Well, this is what it's supposed to be. If it's an actual movement, listen, if God is actually moving, then move. If this is what Paul is saying in Romans 12, whatever the gift that you've been given, according to the spirit, then do it. You know, the old saying, smoke them if you got them. If you're old enough, you might remember that phrase. So whatever your gifting is, however God is moving on, you fine. Do it. If you feel like the Lord has given you the ability to heal someone by laying hands on them, well then get to healing. If he's given you the ability to prophesy, tell them the future, prophesy away. If he's given you the ability to speak in these languages, these tongues, well then get to speaking in tongues. However, and I can't tell you if you have it or not. That's not up for me or anyone else too. But you better make sure that you're not forcing it. The point that Paul is writing about in chapter 12, 13 and 14, because he's writing concerning the whole unity of the body. That's the whole point of 1 Corinthians 12. I mean, 1 Corinthians. The letter is that there'd be no division that would be unified. And so what's happening is, as he says in verse 12, chapter 12, concerning these spiritual gifts, these spiritual things, people are choosing what they think are the more honorable gifts. That's the word that he used, more honorable gifts, and thinking that certain gifts or certain parts of the body are dishonorable. That I prefer this gift over that gift. This is the better gift I have. This is the gift that I wanna have. Now, there's two things about that. One, you may legitimately desire that. Or two, you might just wonder because you think that's something special and you might wanna do so to be seen as something special. Both of those happen, okay? Now, let's say if you legitimately desire to be used by God. Hey man, well then when the spirit moves on you and I think if you have a humble heart and you are really in tune with the Lord, I think he'll move however he wants to move. And then you don't have to worry about, you don't have to worry about someone else giving interpretation because God will take care of that. However, if you do so and then he does it, well then, your life's not over. You don't have to die. It's not the unforgivable sin. If you speak in a tongue and they're in a language, again, it's gotta be a language, guys. But if there is no interpretation, then he just simply says, be silent, be silent. Oh, you know what? I messed up. It happens. We all mess up. We all do some things like I really thought the Lord was leaving me. I've done it. I have thought that the Lord led me this way or that way and I've said some things thinking that I was being moved by God to say this and I was wrong. It happens to everybody. And so just because you put some Akinabashota on it doesn't mean that it doesn't happen. It happened. It's one of the most abused, if anyone can do it, especially if you do it around people who are not discerning, they'll think that, wow, you've really done something. Listen, ooh, he is so spiritual. She's so spiritual. The Holy Spirit is all over this person. What'd they say? We don't know. And so that's the issue. And so the whole point of this particular gifting is to bring clarification, is to bring understanding. And so if you are speaking in tongues and you don't know what you're saying, one, you're in violation, two, everyone else should know as well. Again, why? Because the whole point, the whole purpose of this gift is so that everyone will know and you translate, there should be some translation for the benefit of understanding, for edification. Why? The entire body, as Paul says, as Peter says, the body should be who and what is edified. Are you with me? So now if someone comes back and says, well, no, again, what about in your private, in your private prayer life? Because that's the question that's gonna come up. If in your private prayer life, does there have to be interpretation in my private prayer life? Well, find me any example in Scripture where it is this private prayer life. If you can find me an example in Scripture where there's this private prayer life, just one time and I'll yield. But we don't have any time in Scripture for this private prayer life. You know why I say that? This is why I put this up. This right here, where we see every time that we see speaking in tongues in the Bible, it has that same pattern. It has those same two words that are there. Every time we see Laleo and Glossis, every time. And so when someone says, well, see, no, what this pastor's talking about in chapter 14 is a private tongues, no, is using the exact same phrase for everyone else who's doing it in public. So you would use something different to signify it's a private or public. All we have is the exact same one. We have this exact same, this public speaking, speaking in these languages. Are you with me? So again, if someone wants to say differently, that's fine, couldn't be wrong. All you gotta do is show us. But the point of all of these giftings are for the edification of the body, not for you, not for you. And again, we're not gonna even deal with it tonight with Jew 20, because it's not saying that you edify yourself and pray in the spirit. It does not, we've covered that ad nauseum. So we won't cover that again tonight, but I just wanted to put that out there so everyone can see. I wanna do this in a kind of in an edited upload video, but I knew it was gonna take a little bit longer to kind of go through all of those. Let's see. Have I ever felt the presence of the Holy Spirit on someone? There have been times where I felt it, but let's be honest, again, there have been times where I thought I was being led by the spirit. There have been times where I thought this other person's been led by the spirit. Do you all notice that every time in the Bible that when the spirit of God moves, all of the Christians were like, amen. Everybody was like in agreement. There was not a lot of, I'm not sure. Peter didn't do something and then the rest of the guy said, I'm not really sure, I'm not too sure about that. Thanks, Abernain. I'm not too sure about that. I'm not with you. Typically when we see a move of God, the body is amen, amen. Latoya, she says, please explain 1 Corinthians 14 verses 18 through 19. Sure thing. Oh, we're in 14, you said 18 through 19. Let's put it on the screen. I thank God I speak in tongues more than all of you. However, in the church, if I, in the church, I desire to speak five words with my mind so that I may instruct others also rather than 10,000 words in a tongue. Here's the point. What do we know Paul did? Paul spoke in languages. Okay, let's assume that my understanding of the word glow size is accurate and that the word glow size means languages, but not some, when I say ecstatic, folks will say, what do you mean by ecstatic? Ecstatic is what others call gibberish, babbling. And so does Paul mean an ecstatic language, unknown, or does Paul mean an actual language? Well, I believe he means an actual language. And so he says, I would rather, back to verse 18, I thank God that I speak in all these languages more than all of you, which is true. Paul is a learned man. Paul is a well-traveled man in different regions who they all don't speak the same thing. And so he says, I thank God that I speak in these languages more than all of you. However, in the church, I desire to, matter of fact, and look at, again here, excuse me. What do we see? The word lalo, or la-la-lay-oh, and then the word glow size for tongues. So again, even here we see those same two words that keep showing up. I thank God that I speak in all these languages more than all of you, all of you folks in this region of Corinth. I speak in more languages than all of you. But he says, in the church, I desire to speak five words with my mind, meaning I desire to speak with understanding of my mind so that I may do what, instruct others also, rather than 10,000 words in a language. And notice, he doesn't use that phrase, speaking in tongues here, but 10,000 words in a language. I want to bring some sort of understanding. So do not try to impress anyone with the way that you can just rattle it off and speak in tongues and amen, amen, amen, no. What you ought to do the very next time that someone goes speaking in tongues in public, do this. And just wait, what's the translation? Make them, because listen, if the spirit is actually moving, then someone's gonna give interpretation. I better understand what you're saying. And if you're gonna go eat kind of by host side about whatever you wanna say, and then turn around and give it to me in English, and we both are from Chicago, we're both from Texas, we're both from United States, we both speak English, why didn't you just tell me that in the first place? He said, no, his point is that I would rather, not that I, Paul can speak in these different languages and understand it, but if you guys, not you guys, but them speaking in these different languages and you don't understand, what's the point? All you've done was shown that it's about you. All you did was maybe edify yourself. And Paul says, I know that you are zealous for these giftings, you are zealous to do this, but why don't you strive for the edification of the body? Instead of just edifying yourself and you don't even know what you just said because Paul, we know that you don't understand what you said, because Paul says you're just speaking into the air. No one, only God knows what you said. You don't even know what you said, only God knows what you said. Do you think the translators use the word tongue instead? I'm sorry, do you, why do you think the translators use the word tongue or language, tongue rather than language? I mentioned this before, that oftentimes the translators will get stuck in a habit of doing something out of tradition. For example, we covered this a few days ago on John 316, the whosoever and the word whosoever is not actually there. Because language has changed, there was a time where whosoever meant what we believe as whoever or whoever is believing. It used to mean that, but since language has changed, we did not update our English translations to kind of go with our morphing of the language. But out of tradition, we'll keep saying whosoever. And by the way, there is a Greek word for whosoever. It's just not there in John 316. So a lot of times out of tradition, we'll see that word show up. Here's another word that shows up in the Bible out of only, listen guys, only tradition is the reason why this word shows up. The word church, the word church. Well, no, even in Tyndale, who was giving us, trying to give us the English version, give us the Bible in our own language or in English, he did everything he could to try to get that word taken out. He's translating it, but they were so used to the word church. And the reason why they wanted to keep the word church in is because who is pushing this? Remember, Tyndale was burned at the stake for trying to translate this into, and from Hebrew and Greek into English. The powers that be, the Catholic church and so forth, their big issue was we want the church, the central location, the body, the organization to be the most important thing. They wanted it to be at the forefront. Even finally, if we were to eventually allow you to go ahead and put this into English, they wanted that word church to be there. The true word, the word at Glacier means gathering or congregation. Now, depending on how you look at the word church, you might say, that means the same thing, but not then, back then the word church was the focus on the organization. And even today, we still fight with ourselves about what this word actually means. Tyndale wanted to have the word gathering or assembly or congregation. And that's the whole point. When we come together in these gatherings or these assembly, whether we're outside or in a building, whether over here or over there, that was his point. But out of tradition, and guess what? For the last 400 years, we've kept that word there and we fought with what does that word mean? We're the real church. Well, the word is gathering. And how much easier, how much less confusion if we went with the actual original word definition of gathering or assembly would it have been? That would have been a whole lot easier. We wouldn't even be thinking of some big cathedral, 4,000 seat, no, we would think of us together, we're the body, are you with me? And so we had this happen a lot. And that's why the word, the word tongue is one of those words, the word whosoever, the word church, there are many words that we have that honestly, if we went with the actual translation, prior to English, there was not this big a problem. Prior to the English translations, we really didn't have this bigger issue with some of the other bodies before the English translation, before the Catholic church or outside of the Catholic church, we act sometimes at the Catholic church, the only church, there were other churches around of the Catholic church, they were just the more dominant church. But that's just one of those words. And so if we wanna get an understanding of what the word means, let's try to, if we can move past what the English says, especially guys, if we've got one of these, if we got a phone or if we got a computer, we can just type in the word, look it up. Oh, this word means that, and let's see if we can understand that. Sometimes a Greek word or Hebrew word might have different meanings. And so depending upon what case the word is in or maybe the word before that or after that might change what the word means, that's fine also. And by the way, you guys can figure this out. When we have a word and it says, well, if this word is preceded by the genitive, it means this, what does the genitive mean? You don't have to know what that is. Cause you can pull it up and see, okay, this word before that is in the genitive. So this word means that, according to this definition. It might take, the problem is, the problem is it might take a little bit of extra effort for what else you have to do at your time. Learn the word, grow in the grace and the knowledge of the Lord. And so spend a little bit of extra time figuring out what this stuff says, laboring amongst yourselves, amongst others, getting other folks' definition. Because the funny thing is, and I think this is a problem, I think this is a real problem. The people that would advocate or would have a different take than I have, tend to be the folks with the least amount of study time. And I'm not trying to be mean or put them down, but the facts are the facts. We were listening to John MacArthur read a quote from Gordon Fee, who's a Pentecostal himself and says that exegesis and hermeneutics is not a thing in the Pentecostal church. I know for a fact it's not. When I was in the Pentecostal Charismatic Church, that was not a thing. It was more experience and feeling. Well, the word of God overrides all of our feelings, all of our experiences. Are you with me? What does the word dialect mean? The same thing, pretty much the same way. Gene or other different dialects. And so it depends on how it's used. A dialect can be, if it's in the same language, just variations like how we have a different dialect in English. If you are from Boston, or you're from Chicago, or if you're from New Orleans, if you're from California, you're from Minnesota, you hear the different dialects of English. But then also it also refers to different languages as well. Different, or Gene, different types. Are you with me? Have I read the Bible in another language? No, no, just English. No, I'm struggling up with English and with trying to get the Hebrew in Greek. Michael Chambers, what is it? You Cowboys fans see this? You Cowboys fans see this? This guy has the unmitigated God, the audacity to have a San Francisco 49er logo as his avatar. He says, can you explain First Corinthians 13, 8 through 10? I sure can. For you, my friend, anything. Let's go to First Corinthians 13. And this is a controversial passage, it shouldn't be, but he says, love never fails. But if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away with. If there are tongues, they will cease. Where there is knowledge, it will be done away with. For we know in part and we prophesied in part, but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away with. There are people who believe that all the gifts have ceased or certain gifts have ceased and they pointed to that. I don't, I don't, as a matter of fact. I don't even think it's necessary even to say the gifts have ceased. Matter of fact, I think it causes more confusion to say the gifts have ceased. So what I am, if you all have heard me before, I am a new, or you know what, I'm not even new. I am a continuationist. I am a continuationist. Why am I a continuationist? Because I believe if we were to see the gifts of the spirit, such as tongues, prophecy, they would continue exactly like we saw it in the Bible. Today's continuationists are really cessationists. Today's continuationists, their gifts have ceased to be like what the Bible is and they're something different. Are you with me? Now I've got this, this guy, no, you're not. Okay, well, I'm sorry. By the way, hello. Curious, so I tried to hit another person. This guy, but he says, no, I'm not. Tell me how I'm not. Tell me how I'm not a continuationist. I believe, I've never said, by the way, have any of you guys heard me say that I am a cessationist? I've never said the gifts have ceased. Matter of fact, Mike, so since you're not listening, let me go ahead and explain it to you again. What I'm saying is this. When he says, and I don't use this passage, I would tell anyone, as a matter of fact, I've talked to when I've talked with Justin Peters. I said, I don't use this, I don't see this as saying that gifts have ceased. What I'll say is this, because what we'll notice is there's three things that are here in this passage. Notice what he says, love never fails, but if or where there are gifts of prophecy, speaks of tongues and of knowledge. And all of these will either cease to be done away with. Well, what does prophecy, tongues and knowledge have in common? They're coming out of here, right? And this is what I said. If tongues means languages, certainly that has continued. If prophecy is more of, by the way, the majority of prophecy in the Bible is not a foretelling of future predictive prophecy. The majority of prophecy in the Bible is right now revelation from whatever God has said or stated. And so if that's the case, and by the way, all of these are done to bring about revelation to God, look at it again. Prophecy brings about, if it's the fourth, especially it brings up a revelation of God. If it's languages, it brings a revelation of God and then knowledge certainly brings revelation of God. All three of these are tied together. So there's no reason basis to believe that two are gone, but knowledge stays. No, they are all, as a matter of fact, they're literally, I get it, that verses were added later, but they're still part of the exact same sentence. The beginning of the thought starts in verse eight and ends in verse nine. There's actual period there. And so we see this thought, those three are tied together. Well, we can't say two are gone in one stays. It's the one that we like, the two that we see abused need to go away. Cause what would we do sometimes? We see someone abuse something and we overcompensate, no, that can't be, no. And so when I say I'm a continuationist, I say, yeah, there's languages, there's prophecy and there's knowledge and true continuations will say that it must continue exactly like the Bible has it. We're not gonna make up something as we go. That's what these newfangled prophecy people, these newfangled demon slayers, that's what they do. They have a way that looks nothing like what we saw in the Bible. DB Miami, thank you so much for the super chat. I appreciate that. So, Mike, boy, I wish, I wish. And someone lay hands on the screen and prophesy, speak in tongues, do whatever over the screen to Mike. Mike, pay attention to what I say. Pay attention to what I say. I speak against a deliverance ministry that is not like what we see in the Bible. That's why all your friends do not wanna talk. And I saw you, let me just say this. I happen to see the message that you said today about talk to Greg Lott. Guess who I reached out to? Greg Lott. Greg Lott put out the challenge for someone to come speak to him. I hope he accepts my invitation. I hope he does. And I'm gonna ask him what I've asked. I say, Sal DeVar, Pagani, Daniel Adams, Marcus Wright, all of them, Vlad, Mike Signor. I'm gonna ask what I've asked all of them. Give me your scriptures. Give me your scriptures. And you know what he's gonna do, Mike? He's gonna fail unless he comes up with a new Bible. So you need to start paying attention. Stop hearing what you wanna hear that guy's against what I believe. No, listen to the words I'm actually bringing out. I am for deliverance. If it's done correctly, I gave you an example when there was a person who when I was in prison, this guy was, listen, he's not one of these guys that you see in church who goes to screaming. He's there in church the whole time, drives himself to a conference. Here's the word of God. Praise, clap, sing, dance, cries, and so forth. And then at the very end, when it's time for the show to start, he starts manifesting on command. No, no, no. See, I knew a guy who he said he had a demon. How do we know so? Because he was cutting himself with his fingernails and with razor. Hey man, why are you doing that? I've got demons in me. I'm trying to let him out. Well, you know what? If there's ever anybody that had a demon, it's this guy. Corey, what are you gonna do with this guy? Let me pull this guy to the side. You know what we didn't do? Make a spectacle out of it. We went to the back. He says he wants to get the demons out. So I asked him, do you wanna be made whole? Like Jesus would say, we'll about be made whole. You like that, Mike, don't you? We'll about be made whole. Do you wanna be made whole? So you know what I did for him? You know what we did? We gave him the gospel. Showed him how he can have peace. You know what he did? He placed his faith in Christ. You know what he stopped doing? Cutting himself, tearing his hair out, using a razor, started showing up in church. Now, was that legitimate? I have no idea. All I do know is that the activity that he was engaging in, it stopped. You know what he didn't do? He didn't fall out. He didn't go to coughing. Yeah, that's deliverance, Mike. And that's why I've asked every last one of the people that you support, I've asked them to come and walk the streets of Dallas, South Dallas with me. Let's go to these guys with guns and a holster, with drugs in their system, with anger in their heart. Let's go to them and let's see what true deliverance looks like. Mike, if you want to, you can come down here as well. That's what we, that's true deliverance. True deliverance isn't some show that you see. When someone needs to be deliverance, well, listen, I don't know if you support them or not. I do know you don't support me. I do know you speak against me and you want me to go talk to them. They ignore me. I've reached out to all of those people and they have gone running, blocked me, avoided me. That's fine. They're gonna give account to God, not to me. I tell you what, Mike, I tell you what. Send me an email. Send me an email, smart Christian channel at Gmail. Let's have it right now. You can play the part of all of these guys, Mike. Send me an email and I'll bring you on. Let's go ahead and pull this up right now. I didn't intend on doing this, but you know what? Let's go ahead and make a show out of it. How about that? Let me go ahead and pull this up. All right, where is that? What do I do with it? There it is. Let me pull up over here. I gotta do a few things. Let's pull up over here, Mike, send me an email. I'll put, you can come on right now. You can come on right now. Let me go ahead and make sure that's that. All right, so, Mike, if you wanna come on right now, here's your opportunity. Now, I cannot wait all day. I cannot, I don't have all day, so do you want to come on right now? Because you imply that I'm running. I don't think I'm running from anybody. I don't think, but I wanna hear your arguments. I wanna see if you got something that goes against the different scriptures that I use. And if you can point out something that I have missed, that I have negated, that I have overlooked, hey, man, I have no problem with being wrong, and I have no problem with being wrong in front of everybody else. No problem whatsoever. So, Mike, send me your email so I can send you the link, and you can go ahead and come on. You can just use your phone. No problem, we can do this really, really briefly. I'm not even prepared. Wasn't prepared to talk about delivers, but I can. But I can. I need you to hear me send this email because we don't have, Mike, I almost wanna go, almost wanna do what did Paul say? If you don't have, if there's no interpreter, then be quiet, be silent. I'm almost ready to say, Mike. Okay, he said I sent it, all righty. I don't see it. Let me refresh it. SmartChristianChannel at gmail.com. I'll give it a few more seconds to kind of refresh itself. Uh-oh, I just hit a button. And then we'll wait on you to show up. Move this out of the way. SmartChristianChannel at gmail. SmartChristianChannel at gmail. Uh-oh, all righty, I see you. All right, I'm sending you the link now, sir. All righty, I will see you in a minute. Let's see if there are any more questions. What we'll do, we'll take about 15, 20 minutes and cover this. My hope was to actually be out of here with less than an hour, but. So I just ordered Burger King for this. All right, let me pull you up right here. Let's see in the meantime. I said, I'm serious about eyebrows raised. Were my eyebrows really raised? All right, here we go. We got a mic right here. All righty, all right, Mike. Can you hear me? How you doing? I'm doing well. How about you? All right. What you got? What questions you got? I don't have any questions. You're the one that would refute me. So tell me, I'll ask you this question then. They'll tell us, so I like to know where you stand on this. They'll tell us that deliverance is for Christians that Christians can be possessed. Do you all agree with that with them? And if so, do you have an example in the Bible of any Christian, even one with the Holy Spirit being possessed or oppressed or demonized? See, okay, so let's qualify your state. So you're saying a Christian being filled with the Holy Spirit being possessed of a demon. You have to qualify. You can't be Christian, right? No, you can't. Okay. So if you go back in the scriptures, what did Jesus tell Nicodemus? What did he tell him? You have to believe and be born again. And then the only qualifying thing to be a believer was to believe in Jesus and you'll have eternal life. Nowhere in scripture does it say you have to be filled with the Holy Spirit to be able to have eternal life and go to heaven. So once you find that, you tell me that. No, my question is, can a believer who has the Holy Spirit and you cannot be a believer without the Holy Spirit can a believer? Yes, you can. Yes, you can. You can be a Christian. You can be saved without the Holy Spirit. You can be a believer and be saved without the Holy Spirit. All right, so let's see. Let's go. What Bible are you reading? I'm reading this one. 1 Corinthians chapter 12 verse 13. For by one spirit, we were all, that's all Pontus baptized into one body whether Jew or Greek, whether slave or free and we were all made to drink with the Spirit. So you have to be born, I'm sorry I pushed the wrong button, you all have to be born of the Spirit. There is no salvation unless a person is born of the Spirit according to John 3. Correct? Okay. So unless you're born of the Spirit. Huh? Who wrote John? John did. Okay, so I can do this without a Bible in front of me. You might want to get a Bible. Nope, I can do it without it. You're good. So here's the thing that I notice and I'm gonna be real respectful but here's what I noticed. You elevate John, Peter and Paul probably about five or six times more than what Jesus said. So every example you give to refute deliverance ministry every example you give that refutes speaking in tongues you use Peter and Paul and their stuff more than you use Jesus' own words. Okay, first of all, when we talk about tongues, Peter and Paul are the main culprits whereby we get this issue of tongues, right? When we see tongues in it, it's Peter and Paul. When we see Paul talk about in 1 Corinthians is Paul. So who else were gonna get it from? Okay, so we could do this. I know you love Paul, but you have to really look at everything. I love, listen, I don't love Paul any more than I love Bartholomew or Thaddeus. We don't have a scripture by them, but I love them just as much as I love Mark or Luke or John or Jude. All the scriptures have been given to us by the Holy Spirit, all of it. And so they're all in the exact, on the exact plane. Okay, so now- The scripture, but what you have to do is give me a scripture that tells me that being a Christian, you can, that you'll have a demon. Give me a scripture. Listen, okay, so what you gotta do is take the word Christian off. Or believer. Why? Wait, why Christian? What's wrong with that? Okay, because a lot of times we associate, okay, you're a language scholar. I'll give you that credit. A lot of times we associate Christian with being filled with the Holy Spirit. Would you agree with that? I see what you're saying. A professed Christian versus an actual authentic Christian. Okay, fine, an actual believer then. Where is an actual believer in the Bible? Is the word- I'm sorry? Where in the Bible does the word Christian mentioned as far as followers of Christ or believing in Jesus? Verse Peter chapter four, we just talked about. Matter of fact, let's start in verse 12. Beloved- I joined your video late. I'm sorry, go ahead. It's okay, it's okay. But the question that you asked was where do we find that? So first Peter chapter four, this is Peter who was the first among equals amongst apostles. Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal among you which comes upon you for your testing, speaking about Christians being persecuted as though some strange thing were happening to you. But to the degree that you share in the sufferings of Christ, keep on rejoicing so that also at the revelation of his glory, you may rejoice with exaltation. If you are reviled for the name of Christ, you are blessed because the spirit of glory of God rests on you. Because Christians, as believers, make sure that none of you suffers as a murderer or a thief or a evil doer or a troublesome meddler. But if anyone suffers, here it is, as a Christian, he is not to be ashamed, but is to glorify God in this name. Are you with me? So here we have a clear indication where Peter calls us Christians and it's okay. As a matter of fact, we will suffer as Christians. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah, we're Christians. Okay, that's fine. I just wanted to be able to point it out. So what does the word Christian mean? Those that follow Christ, of Christ. Okay, thank you. Thank you. So, and we know Christ, I don't know if you've taught this, I haven't seen all your videos, but we're gonna get on the topic though. Where is a believer, so he has a spirit in him, where do we have an example of this believer having a demon, oppressed by a demon, tormented, possessed, whatever you wanna call it, demonized, do we have a scripture of a Christian, a believer, what have you wanna call it, do we have an example of that in the Bible? Yes. Where? You're not gonna wanna hear it because you've already tried to dispute it and I will use, I'll use some scriptures different than other people who have already been on your channel tried to use. Okay. So, number one, the one thing that Jesus actually did more than anything else in his ministry was cast out demons. Did he? Yes. How many times did he cast out demons? You search out, you search out Jesus casting out demons, he did it more than anything else he did in his ministry that was recorded. Matter of fact, he spoke on hell more than he spoke on heaven. Okay, that's another thing Christians don't know. Okay, now. Now, when you say he did it more than anything else, are you saying, are you combining all the times that Matthew, Mark, Luke and John bring it up because in many cases they're talking about the same incense, but that being stated, that being stated. But there are different, there are different. I know your question. So my question is, where is an example of a believer, someone with the Holy Spirit, having a demon cast out? The first time he cast out a demon? No, no, no, no. Was in a synagogue? No, where's the one time? One time. But you're cutting me off. You're not following through my question. Was in a synagogue. What's a synagogue, Corey? It was a church. A place where Jesus met. Don't do that. Who in the synagogue? Who in the synagogue? It was a church. It was a church, or a temple. It was a temple, or a church. Mike, Mike. Were they a body of believers? Mike, who in the synagogue was a follower of Christ? He went into the synagogue and cast out demons. Out of people who were in the synagogue? Mike, were any of those people in the synagogue that he casted demon out of, were they a follower of Christ? Were they a believer of his? They were believers. Of who? They were in there getting teaching. Of who? They were getting teaching. Who were they following? What is, Corey, come on now. You're playing semantics now. I'm not playing semantics, Mike. No, listen. Let's back up. Let's back up. There are Jews. There were people in the synagogues who were not Christian, who did not follow him. Remember, the Bible says that he came to his own and his own did not receive them. He go, the very same synagogue that he goes to run people out. That synagogue, there were people, there were even men there. So tell me the person who had a demon cast out of him that was a believer. Who's the person in the synagogue that had a demon cast out of them? That was a believer. Please tell me. There was a demon possessed man in there. There was also a woman in there with the, was it the infirmity or the issue of blood where they said, why are you doing this on the Sabbath? So he's doing in the synagogue, not the woman with the issue of blood. It was the one like 12 years. The Syrophoenician woman. He turned to them and said, he turned to them and said, no, no, no, not the Syrophoenician woman. He was at someone's house. Okay. Who is the person? And he turned to them. Mike, Mike, what you're doing is you're assuming that because a person showed up at a synagogue, because they were Jewish, which guess what? Not one of them had the Holy Spirit in them. Not one of them was a father of Christ. None of them. There are no... That was a requirement to be a believer. The Holy Spirit is not a requirement to be a believer. Where did you get that from? Where did you get that from, Mike? Where did it, look, look, you show me the scripture where the, where Jesus said, in order to actually be saved and have eternal life, that you have to have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. Even Paul said, believe on his name and believe that he is, and you will be saved and your whole household. Mike. Never once did he mention the Holy Spirit. Mike, Mike, first of all, Jesus says so in order to, in order to be saved, in order to be saved, the first thing that must have to happen is you must be born of the Spirit. Did he not say that? So who is he talking to? Huh? Who is he talking to? Bring the scripture up. Who's he talking to? John 3.3. Jesus says, truly truly I say to you unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Born, stop right there. Born again. He was talking to Nicodemus. He said, born again. He didn't say born of the Spirit. Let's go back and read again. Verse four. Nicodemus said, how can a man be born when he is old? By the way, I thought you told me, you told me that you've listened to me. And so if you've heard this, you've heard me cover. There are three ways that he says the same thing. In John 3, he says, born again, born of water and Spirit and born of Spirit. Unless you are born, and they all mean the same thing. To be born again. No, they didn't. Wait, let me finish. To be born. Okay, go ahead. When I say this, you tell me if you disagree and where you disagree with. John 3.3. John 3.3, he says, unless one is born again, the word born again is the word ganete anothem, which means be born from above. It can also mean born a second time. Nicodemus thought it was a second time. Jesus corrects him. No, it's not born a second time. It's born from above. He says the same thing again, born of water and Spirit. Then he says, unless you are born of Spirit. So it is of everyone who is born of the Spirit. We hear that in Jeremiah. We hear that in Ezekiel. We also hear it in John 1. Unless you are born of the Spirit, born of the will of God, born by the Spirit, or Titus says born again, born of the Spirit, or Peter says being caused to be born again, you cannot be saved. That part is irrefutable. And everybody who is in Christ has been baptized into all. That means if you've been a Christian for one day, one minute, one hour, one week, one year, all have been baptized, have been put into the Holy Spirit. You cannot. If you have the Spirit, all those that have the Spirit are or have the right to be called the sons of God. Without it, you cannot be. So listen. So I can explain the three different times Jesus said it. Okay, so here's the problem. It's actually like a prophetic thing for the trinity. Okay, Mike, here's a problem. And I'm gonna have to let you go. Here's why I'm gonna have to let you go. Because you are lacking in faith. This is what you do when people, no, when people bring actual sounds spiritual, Holy Holy Spirit. You didn't bring any sound. I just gave you. I just gave you the passages. Are you telling me that we don't have to be born of the Spirit? Because you're talking, because you're talking over me. I'm trying to teach and share spiritual stuff with you and revelation about things of Jesus and His ministry and how people like you don't agree with are saying they're doing everything wrong outside of the word of God when they're not. And you don't wanna listen to any of it. I can't tell you the amount of people that have come on your channel and tried to show you things and you totally have refuted them. Our chance. The other guy. I totally have refuted them. Yeah, yep, yep. The other guy that called you a wolf, I can't remember his name, so I apologize for that. The one that said you were a wolf in sheep clothing and you had them on and you guys talked and then that kind of patched over pretty good. But at the same time, there've been many people who have tried to come on and tell you things or at least expound on what they believe the Holy Spirit is teaching them and what the Bible was showing them through Jesus's ministry and you just totally shut it down. Like you're not open or receptive to anything. Mike, I am open. If someone tells me that you don't have to have the Holy Spirit to be safe. Now, all the people that you spoke of, including Greg Lott, they differ. They'll tell you that you have that Holy Spirit. And so my whole point is on deliverance that anyone that has the Holy Spirit who has been set free, whom the Son sets free is free indeed. I do not believe that you can be set free by Jesus but then also chained or bound by a demonic spirit. But then you say that a Christian does not have to have the Holy Spirit. So there's where we part. Listen, I'm sorry my friend, but I am not getting ready to accept. I am never going to accept that a Christian does not have to have the Holy Spirit. I'm sorry. Listen, we are baptized into the spirit. All of us. Okay, but Jesus, when he told Nicodemus, he said you must be born again. And then you said later on, he said you must be born of water, right? There's two different things. What was the third thing? Born of water and spirit, born of the spirit and born again. Right. Are you saying those are three different things? Yes. Those are three different things. So born of the spirit, listen. It's almost like a prophetic, like I heard you do a video, I don't know how long ago it was, probably within the past few months, where you talked about the Trinity and also how someone asked you a question of us as people, are we a like tribe part being? And you said, well, we're spirit, you know, Holy Spirit and we live in a body and you really didn't expound on and if you had another video explaining it more in detail, I will say I did not watch it and I apologize, but you were a little confusing on whether our soul is the same as the spirit or is it separate? I said, on that particular, I say it all the time, I said that this issue of trichotomy and dichotomy, it can go both ways because there are passages on both sides, neither those points are a reason for us to diverge if we're believers, if you believe that we're a body, soul and spirit, or if you believe the soul and spirit are one, that'd make a bit of difference. The Bible says that even his word can cut between the two if it can be cut, but the point is this, because we're getting off topic, Jesus makes a statement, let me put on the screen, he says that truly, truly, unless the first thing has to happen before you see the kingdom of God is you must be born again. What does word born again mean? Born of the spirit, Genethianothen. Then he says, how can this be? Jesus says, he says the exact same thing again, truly, truly, unless one is born of water and spirit. Notice he doesn't say born again, he says born of water and spirit. Then he goes on to say verse six, that which is born of flesh is flesh and that which is born of spirit is spirit. So he says born of the spirit. Then he says in verse seven, he says it again, born again, then at the end of verse eight, he says everyone is born of the spirit. He's saying the same thing, he's just saying it differently. So born again, born of water and spirit and born of the spirit are the same thing. He's speaking of one coherent thought. You're saying he's talking about two or three different things, he's not. And for that reason, listen, with all due respect, there really is no need to continue because you stated that a Christian does not have to have the Holy Spirit. Brother, we're not gonna hash this out tonight. I listen, I'm gonna go ahead and let you go out. I don't wanna be rude, but I've gotta let you go. And so we're just gonna have this conversation. It makes no sense for someone to think that you can be a Christian. You can be a believer and not have the Holy Spirit. That goes against all rational biblical thought. That's why you have a problem with what I'm saying because not with me, you simply do not understand the scripture. The Bible says, Paul says, all of us who are in Christ have been baptized into the Holy Spirit. All of us, every single person, that means there's nobody, Mike or anyone else that can be a Christian without being baptized. That's why John makes a comparison, the contrast between him baptizing in water versus Jesus is gonna baptize us in the Holy Spirit. The fundamental problem with what we have here in America or in churches all over is a lack of understanding with the scriptures. It's not that difficult. It just is not. And so what you said, listen, we don't have enough time, enough minutes, enough days or hours to get this right. I pray that you just keep, keep reading. Let the Holy Spirit, because maybe what it is is you don't have the Holy Spirit. Clearly that sounds like what it is. You don't have the Holy Spirit. Therefore you're saying we don't have to have, but yeah, Leslie, it's a no-brainer. It's an absolute no-brainer. The identifying mark of the body is the Holy Spirit. That's why it acts. We see it happening in stages. Why? Because we see the Jews first getting the Holy Spirit. That makes sense. God has been dealing with them for the longest. The Jews get the Holy Spirit. But then the Jews probably don't think that anyone else can get it. They can believe, but not unless they become Jews. But then we see the Samaritans receive the Holy Spirit. The Jews are amazed, but you know what? Hey, there are Jewish half cousins, fine. But then they marvel at the Gentiles receiving the Holy Spirit. And then the last people group to receive the Holy Spirit were John's disciples. These are folks who were listening to him say, repent and be baptized, John's baptism. And so they were being faithful. And so now they're waiting for the next stage. Yeah, this Jesus Christ, who John was the forerunner of, he has died, he is resurrected in the Senate. And so now we can receive the Holy Spirit. They did after that, nobody. After that guys, nobody. Ask Greg Logg, ask Isaiah, ask him. No one had a demonic possession whereby they needed a demon to be cast out. Not one time in the scripture after that. After that, even when we see the sons of sea, we don't see that demon being cast out. We never find a person with the Holy Spirit having a demon and then having it need to be cast out. So guys, we took a little diversion turn there, but I just happened to see his comments earlier today on the, in the comments section. I'm thinking, who is this guy? And I see him again. So come on board. And the reason why I said come on board because the others won't. Although, although, although I'm, I'm trying, I'm gonna try to get, to get Greg to come on. I'm, I'm gonna try my best to get Greg Glock to come on. He may or may not be. Now he, he was pretty boastful and bragged ocean and saying, I challenge any one of you to come on and to refute. Okay, fine. I'm, I'm looking for, what did the guy say in tombstone? I'm your Huckleberry. I would love to have a conversation with Greg Glock. Be it, I would love to have it on camera. I would certainly love to have it on camera because I think that he does harm to the body. And I think people need to see that he has no control of the scripture. As a matter of fact, when he made this challenge, he says, I don't know the whole Bible. I don't know what, now no one does. But the way he said, like, yeah, I'm, I'm still learning this thing is what he said. I would love to show him what he doesn't know, how he's harming people. I would, again, this person who, who, who tends to be pretty unrepentant in his own sin. That's a whole other subject, but even on his, just as doctrine. So we'll see. I won't hold my breath because he is, he said, what's his address? I'll email him a Bible. He is friends with, with Isaiah and for God and the rest of those guys. And so I don't know that they might say, hey, don't talk to this guy. If I were him, I would listen. I wouldn't, I wouldn't talk to me. Do I believe that it's truly impossible for a person to understand the scriptures and let's say, no, no, knowing Hebrew and Greek does not get you to understand the Bible. Listen, if all you have is English, you're fine. You're fine. The point of the Hebrew and Greek is this, ladies and gentlemen, and we'll go ahead and dismiss. But the point of the Hebrew and Greek is this. When we have these differences on some of the scriptures or I think this, I see it that way, the Hebrew and Greek can just shed light. I think the English is fine. I don't care if it's the King James Version, the New King James Version, ESV and ESV, the NIV, NLT. I think they all present the message properly. I do. In English or in Spanish or in French or in German or in Mandarin or Swahili, doesn't matter. I think the Bible is clear in all the languages. Not the Passion Bible though. What does the Hebrew and Greek do? It helps us see a little bit more clearly in things that we might differ on. Because again, if we get the definition and the tense of the verb, the case of the noun and so forth, then it becomes hard. What you don't want to do though, if you are a mature Christian, is you don't want to discount or negate the Hebrew and Greek. You don't have to know it, no. Now I'm not saying you, but a lot of folks who get on me or have a problem with me using Hebrew and Greek, they use it themselves, except when I use it. But no, so let me just say it clearly. You do not have to know Hebrew and Greek to know the Word of God and to know it perfectly. You do not. It does help though. It does help. Again, that's where we get our English from. That's where we get our Spanish version from, our German version from, our Latin version from. So, yeah, the God doesn't need his Bible. That was, have you all ever, I'll never forget, I'm sorry, Mike. I'm picking on you now, Mike, but I got in a fight when I was in high school one time. And I thought it was gonna be something. I was thoroughly disappointed in my opponent. I was thoroughly disappointed in him. I thought I was gonna get a bigger fight. Mike, there was nothing to fight about because you have no idea what the Bible is saying. You have thoroughly misunderstood salvation. So, yeah, you can't teach the Bible without a Bible. What did he say? I don't need the Bible. Well, there was a red flag right there, huh? You remember the guy that came on and I had to block him? What was his name? Harrison something, something Harrison, who was trying to say I was wrong but didn't need the scriptures. He said, you don't need the scriptures. Okay, I'm not trying to not, no, listen, Cephas, hold on, wait a second. It's not that I, and I get what you're saying. I get what you're saying. Cephas, you are, you are just too nice and you should be, but he needs to be shown how utterly ridiculous it is to not yield or lean to the scriptures. He does. Everyone should be put to shame if they are going to contend with the scriptures and not use the Bible. Listen, I don't know your heart. I just know your head, Mike. You're right, I don't know your heart. I just know your head. I know what came out of your mouth. And you, so again, this clearly isn't the channel for you or maybe it is. Maybe it is. So, but I thought that we would be able to go through the scriptures. We couldn't even get to the point that we wanted to get to because guess what? No one had even been given the Holy Spirit at the time that Christ was even in the synagogue. And clearly these were not believers, clearly. So anyway, guys, I wanna thank you so much. I look forward to seeing you guys tomorrow. We are working on some guests coming in over the next month. And so anyway, oh, the software this is, I use, well, I use two softwares. I use on here, I use Accordance Bible software. I also use that, but also use Logos as well. But this that you see on the screen, this is Accordance Bible software. Which is actually, you know what? I'm finding out more and more about this little thing. I can click on this and it brings all this different stuff. I've got all this stuff over here. I love this software. I need to learn more about it. Same thing with Logos. I need to spend more time in learning both of them more. But that's the one that's Accordance Bible software. You can kind of put together your own little package of what you want to have in there, different books that you would order. You can pay it all up front at once or you can pay for it monthly. So, so anyway, guys, I wanna thank you guys. I'm gonna get off my baby, my youngest child. She made chicken and dumplings. I have no idea what dumplings are. Maybe someone can translate, interpret that. Interpret dumplings. I had, what are dumplings? I would, before I go, I would love to know what dumplings are. My daughter made them. I tasted them early today. They were delicious. My baby knows how to cook. I need to make her cook more. But they were, they were good. The chicken was perfect. The little sauce or whatever you call it, little stuff. It's just, that's all it is just dough, huh? Just dough. I'm sitting there eating dough. I'm putting dough in my body, you know? Okay, amen, amen. It was good. It was, it was good. I'm gonna get some more flour. That's all it is, huh? I think that doesn't sound too healthy. But it's good. Thank you guys for the gift of interpretation of dumplings. So I will see you all tomorrow. God bless you all.