 Good evening, and welcome to episode 333 of the Private Property Podcast. I'm your host, Uzaman Dongwa, Kumalo. It's a Friday edition of the Private Property Podcast. If you're joining us for the first time, welcome to the only daily property podcast in South Africa, helping you on all your property needs. Doesn't matter whether you're a first-time home buyer, you're looking to buy, to rent, to sell, or to build. We're certainly here to help you along the way. And all our regular viewers of Facebook and Instagram as well as on YouTube. Welcome back. You know how we do fan every single weekday. You and I have an appointment at 7 p.m. where we always tackle a hot property topic and certainly helps us make better property decisions. And talking about making better property decisions, you know that you can also catch amazing shows across private properties, social-needed platforms every single weekday at 8 p.m. As it is a Friday, you can catch Chad and the Home Shoppers show. And that also comes to your screens every single Monday at the same time. We always give us an amazing tour of exquisite properties that you can find on www.privateproperty.co.za. And if it Tuesdays and Thursdays, you can catch award-winning farmer Mbalinoa got on the farm in podcast talking all things agriculture. So if you've got an interest in agriculture, you've got green fingers, then that is a show that you do not want to miss out on. And of course, every Wednesdays, we don't leave you alone. Esti Klaasen brings you the first time home by show where she's always in conversation with people who've not only walked that first time home by journey, but of course gone on to grow their property portfolios from strength to strength. Well, that's a great lineup that you can look forward to every single weekday at 8 p.m. So to make sure that you set your alarms and of course, do tune in. I'm already seeing all the love on our Facebook page. Gletsha Rindha saying that she is watching. Moana Eva saying good evening. Farana Siddiqui saying those green hearts of Kosovo from Luz also live in tune in. Vanessa, now I see you. Michelle Vomaranz, I also see you. A new person I'm seeing is Fabrice Lydesique. First time I am seeing you. Welcome to the family. And of course, do share the live with your friends and family on your Facebook page so we can make the property circle bigger and talking about our Facebook page. As you know, we're running a great competition on Facebook where we're giving away 500 grand's cash every single evening. And all you have to do to stand a chance of walking away with it is to engage the post that we have pinned on our Facebook. Now, the first goal that we had was we wanted to reach one million followers on our Facebook page and we've already reached that. Of course, thanks to all of you at home. And we also wanted to have 10,000 comments on that post, as well as 10,000 shares. We're nearly there, we're nearly nearly there, but do keep engaging with it. And of course, you stand a chance of walking away with 500 grand's in cash if your name gets called out. Yesterday, the winner was announced and were able to claim their prize. And so this evening, the money bag is at 500 grand's. And so halfway through the show, we'll see who is potentially going to be walking away with that 500 grand's. And remember, you have to be watching us live in order to claim your prize and drop us a text to claim that amount. So I am crossing fingers. I think it's going to be a nice way to end off with that extra 500 grand's if you are the one who is going to walk away with it. Well, that's something that you can look forward to. Do keep that love coming on social media, especially this Friday evening. I am very excited about our conversation this evening. This evening, we're going to be looking at community-based rebuilding of small businesses and in conversation with Azul Khusal, who's the CTO and co-founder at kandua.com. And Azul, good evening and thank you so much for joining us on the show. Thank you, Zamaq. Great to be here. And I hear you have a lot of really engaged, cool listeners and viewers. So I'm keen to connect with them too. Yeah, and I think one of the things about the very engaged listeners is that they've, you know, increasingly grown to know a bit about the work that kandua.com is and the work that you do. But for purposes of those at home who probably, you know, have not caught some of the other episodes that we've had with some of your colleagues, perhaps first just give us a breakdown of what kandua.com is in the work that you do. Well, sure, yeah, that sounds useful. So what kandua is, is it's a marketplace for home services, right? So you can think of it a little like what Uber does, but if you want to find a carpenter, a plumber, a boulder, a painter for whatever kind of property work you need done. And yeah, so we're the biggest, we're the biggest of that type in the country. And yeah, we make it super easy for people to find those services and to power your finding of those services. We have a network of around 30,000 independent contractors who are throughout the country of all shapes and sizes. I mean, there's over 150 services in all the major cities. And so yeah, these people are the ones who will fulfill your work and we vet them all. And that's basically the service we provide in a nutshell. And one of the great things about that particular service, Andrew, is that so many times and I even hear it from a lot of our viewers is that we tend to struggle to find quality contractors for different work that we have in our respective homes. And a lot of people who watch the show are even property investors themselves. And more often than not, you go to your friend or your family to find out, you know, do you know a carpenter? Do you know a plumber or an electrician? And on some occasions, you'll be lucky that somebody knows somebody that they can recommend. But of course, then trying to find somebody online does become quite a difficult process and trying to verify if they are who they say they are. Their craftsmanship is what it is. So I think one of the really great perks that I've certainly picked up with can do is that you're also able to read the reviews of the different pros that are on the system and even see the work that they've done for other customers and almost gauge for yourself if you're happy to then get their services. So it cuts some of the admin, especially for many people who don't want to have to pre-interview different service providers for a very small task. Because I think a lot of us, you know, we're not building something or building a new structure in our home. Sometimes you just literally want, you know, plumbing to be fixed or perhaps your electricity being fixed. Zama, I think you are much better at explaining what we do than I am. You know, and it's a combination of having spoken to some of your colleagues but also actually having used your service. So one of the things that I do very well is we, you know, we have a whole host of different guests on the show. And I also make it a priority to use some of the service providers so that by the time we have them on the show, I'm actually, you know, I understand what they're doing and what works, what doesn't work and what they're doing. So I have used the service. So I'm actually quite clear on how it works and even some of the the advantages that I kind of liked with using it and being contacted by the pros directly. So I quite like that quite a bit. So then when we then talk about community-based rebuilding of small businesses, I think one of the big things, of course, is that we know that a few weeks back there was quite a lot of destruction in particularly in Haudenay and in parts of KZN and the cost of that destruction is in the millions. I think when we kind of how do we wrap our head around the rebuilding part because we also know that the hardest hit, you know, people or a segment were, of course, small businesses. How do they, firstly, without even looking at the logistics, of course, and having to claim from insurance, just at a high level, how do we then look at rebuilding, especially just given the extent of some of the destruction? And when some people were saying, look, some of these places will have to be closed for 18 up to two years, 18 months up to two years, which is just mind-boggling for many of us, because, of course, it means people aren't going to have jobs because those were places of work for so many people. And so I think at a high level, how do we even come to terms with the extent of the building that needs to be done? And then, of course, to logistically working through how to go about it. Yeah, I think it's, you know, I think we were all struck by the sheer magnitude of the damage that was done. And if you look up the number of malls that were that had damage to them, it's in the thousands, you know, I mean, that's that is extensive damage. And yeah, it's hard to really wrap our heads around the scale of the damage. But I think even people are beginning to realize now as time has gone on that something that's almost equally a staggering is the tenacity of small businesses. And as South Africans, just, you know, we used to things going wrong and we used to, you know, marking a plan and that's astonishing, you know, and equally astonishing and, you know, in the opposite direction, of course. So I think, you know, we will rebuild, we must rebuild, we know we must rebuild the small and small businesses, you know, they've come through COVID. We've seen how, you know, we find a way. Obviously, you know, some, unfortunately, don't make it. But, you know, that that that almost clears the space for others to make it. And it's I mean, really, we are incredibly, incredibly resilient people. And so when I mean, we kind of noticed this, we kind of noticed this organic inclination to rebuild and to support each other through this time, because, you know, as much as and that was another really, you know, cool thing to observe is as much as, you know, the damaging of and looting of property. Communicated to us as Africans that, you know, people don't care about us and people are coming to get our things and people are so irreverent and, you know, whatever other nasty things, which are, you know, it's fair to draw from this kind of thing. Again, on the other side, you can, you know, you witness the altruism of so many people who have banded together, putting whatever resources they have to, you know, to, you know, to whether it's time, whether it's money, whether it's supporting any kind of form to repairing the damage and seeing how people have come together organically to do that is, you know, as, you know, a commensurate of a force as the incredible destruction that came before it. So it's been very, it's been very inspiring to witness that. And yeah, I mean, I'm going a bit off topic of your question, but I guess this is what we're here to talk about. And when we noticed that thing happening itself, it was so inspiring, you know, it was so, so awesome. And it sort of, especially at the time when it was at it was there was so much negativity out there, right? We were all feeling so helpless, so, so attacked, even if it wasn't us, it was our cousins and it was our, you know, our, and people we knew and and the content and the places we visited. And yeah, it was it was pretty traumatic and and and pretty scary. And instead of dwelling there, what we saw it as ourselves was like, hey, you know, what can we do? What next? You know, like how we like, what can we actually do about this? And for us, the answer was pretty clear. And we're going to look at what that answer was, right? When you talk about that, the answer was pretty clear, certainly from a conduer perspective, we're going to get a sense of what that answer was and the role that can do it is certainly going to be playing in the rebuilding project, because we're very clear that we we're not going to stay down. We're very invested in, you know, working towards rebuilding, making sure that the various properties that have been destroyed are returned to what they previously were even better. Because I think one of the things that we realize is perhaps some of them may may have been up for a little upgrade. So when we work towards them now, we're actually in a better position to do just that. I see some of the love that we're getting on our Facebook page with many of you watching and, of course, also anticipating the announcement of that father-in-law grand winner, Bengani Queen P Mabunda, saying roll over so that the winner can get one K on Monday. So people are already wanting a roll over and we haven't even announced who the lucky winner this evening is. Quinta Koseni, those green hearts and she is watching. I saw Pallisa earlier, also calling for a roll over. But let's see. Let's see who the potential lucky winner is. I hope that they're watching so that they can claim their prize and it doesn't roll over to Monday. Let's see who the lucky winner of the 500 grand's cash is going to be. I'm excited. And the winner there is Kulume Lentanzi. Kulume Lentanzi, you are the potential lucky winner of the 500 grand's in cash. Kulume Lentanzi, I do hope that you're watching. If you're watching, then do drop us a message down here below to claim your 500 grand's and otherwise it's going to roll over. There are already people in the comments section or calling for it to roll over and they're calling for it so soon. I think people now want the money to just keep piling on and really get to a higher amount before somebody is able to win it. I saw one of the previous winners saying Imnandi Lemali. So definitely Kulume Lentanzi, you want to make sure that you claim that prize. If you are just joining us this evening, I'm in conversation with Angel Kussel, who's a CTO and co-founder at kandua.com. We're talking about community-based rebuilding of small businesses. And this is following, of course, the destruction of property and that we saw a few weeks ago in many parts of Khaoteng as well as in Kezeden and really looking at the role that different sectors are now playing in the rebuilding project. We're very clear that we cannot let things go. We cannot, you know, not rebuild, especially when you look at some of the malls and even other kinds of property. It's so important that we rebuild so people can have their homes again and be able to have access, of course, to the services that they had in those respective properties. I want to find out from your home, you know, if you live in an area where some of this destruction happened and perhaps you now no longer have access to a particular mall, for instance. I know, you know, it's a way to a lot of people saying that there's certain more, the one really more that I think is so much of that still standing, if I'm not mistaken, is Ima Ponyamon for the most part, whereas Ichabilani Mall, for example, and even Kotea Gardens Mall, are not operating the way that they were operating before. So do share with us down here below if you are living in an area where, you know, there was destruction of property and you now no longer have access to it. How are you even navigating that? Because I think that's also another thing that we haven't slowly unpacked, you know, the fact that especially in these townships, people were able to just walk to a mall and do their groceries. And now some of the malls no longer being there. It effectively means that they need to get onto one, two, sometimes three taxis in order to be able to access, you know, being able to buy groceries, for instance. But Adju, you know, we were saying before the break that you certainly, as Kandoor, wanted to be able to play a role and you couldn't, of course, just sit back, especially given the unique position that you find yourselves in and the work that you do, what for you then was the, I'll say, the solve or the role that you saw Kandoor playing when it comes to rebuilding? Yeah, so, you know, rebuilding is such a pervasive process. It's not just, it's not just literal rebuilding. It's all kinds of rebuilding, right? It's the rebuilding of confidence, you know, in both local and overseas people and in our economy. It's rebuilding the inventories that were lost. But then we thought, you know, there is obviously the very literal need for rebuilding all the buildings that were torched, broken into, burnt. And so we thought, you know, obviously that's the place to start. It was the most visceral, the most immediate consequence of all the, you know, unrest that happened. And so we thought we are actually uniquely positioned to be able to facilitate that rebuilding. We have service providers throughout the country who are vested in him and can do this work. And so, and we are in a position to coordinate this work really efficiently and really easily. And we have, yeah, all of that machinery just waiting in place. The only thing we need, we thought to ourselves, is we need, you know, these are independent contractors on our platform. They're not people who we employ. These are small businesses. And so they need to be paid for the work that they do for this rebuilding that needs to happen. And of course the scale of the rebuilding is, you know, incredible. I don't think there's anyone in this country who can afford to pay to rebuild this whole thing. So we said, you know what? We've got to come together. And people are keen. I mean, you know, it was, every single person I spoke to was thinking, you know, how can I help? How can, what can I do? What can we do? You know, do I need to go and pick up some of the debris that was debris that was littering everywhere? You know, people were looking for a way to help. So what we thought is let's give people an easy way. We have a way to help. We have a huge way of helping, you know. And so let's give people the mechanism and let's make it easy for people to help who want to help. And so, you know, as we do it can do, we just facilitate. So we thought we'll facilitate that. And, you know, in literally one night, our engineering team pulled together and we stayed up till the wee hours of the morning building this crowdfunding platform that allowed people to donate very easily and literally two clicks to donate. And we then used our fulfillment team and our fulfillment platform to carry out the repairs. And yeah, I can also, I guess, tell you a little bit about how we chose businesses to repair because obviously there's so many, right? So how do we approach that? And of course, before we get to even the selection process, I'm already loving some of the comments that are coming through from, you know, our viewers at home with many. Firstly, just calling on O'Kuluman and Danzi to raise their hand as the potential winner of that 500 rands in cash. And of course, I asked you earlier on if you live in an area that was affected by the destruction of property that we saw a few weeks ago in parts of Kizidin and Khaldi and how your day-to-day has effectively been affected by that. And I see here, Salani Pilesi, and I feel like I'm having a conversation with myself here. And of course, asking the many people in the chat box because they love keeping the conversation down there. Ulindisi Chabela saying our Baramur office hasn't been operational since the looting. We are badly affected. And I think this is one of those things that we're already seeing with different people who live in different parts of, you know, especially Khaldi in Kizidin where the destruction of property happened is we're slowly seeing the effects. Now that the new headlines have turned away as they typically do, the work of rebuilding does become quite silent, right? And we think when we look at the days and even a few weeks after the destruction of property, it was of course still in the headlines, it was quite a big thing. The president came out to speak. And now we're living with the reality of the magnitude of the damage, but also how do we actively go about actually fixing it because people's lives have essentially been affected and many people's lives have also been destabilized. I mean, the instances of, you know, people having lost their jobs because that really was the only form of income. Now, as you were saying earlier, that, you know, you'd like to share a bit about how then some of the service providers who are going to play the very active role of, you know, rebuilding what chosen by Kandua, especially after the, of course, the cart funding that you're able to do, so what was that criteria like? Cause as we're saying, I think you said you had over 30,000 service providers on your platform. So we had, we had, we had over 30,000 service providers and a lot of them are really good. So I guess selecting them was not as hard. Selecting people to prepare the work was not as hard. What we tried to do is we tried to select people who were close by and part of the communities that they were rebuilding. Cause that's the whole spirit of it, right? It's people rebuilding their own communities, people banding together. And we thought that would be the most natural way of going about doing it. But the trickier thing was from all the applications that we received to sift through them. And you know, like this person who was saying now that the office is, you know, badly affected, how do we, how do we choose where to target the funds that we are receiving for this thing? Which continue, which continue, by the way, to trickle in and, you know, whichever side of the coin you're at, whether you're someone who wants to help or whether you're someone who needs help, we welcome your engagement, of course. That's why, one of the reasons why it was great to come on the show to try and amplify that impact. But the trickier thing to find was the people who needed help, so, or not to find, but to choose. And so we applied a couple of criteria. So first we thought to ourselves, the most, let's direct our effort to the businesses in the community or the properties in the community that were most central to the functioning of that community, right? So if you're providing some essential kind of service that people's lives depend on, that caught you off the list. And then the second thing we looked at was how readily could the business rebuild themselves? You know, if the business was able to rebuild themselves, then maybe there's others in need who are more, you know, damaged and in a more critical condition who really need the help. And so that's where we tried to direct our rebuilding efforts. We are taking more of your questions and comments at home this evening as we look at community-based rebuilding of small businesses. I'm in conversation with Angel Kusso, who's a CTO and co-founder at kandua.com. Now, Angel, I think what would you say is, or what can other businesses, and particularly smaller businesses, because I think all of us would probably have an opinion around what big business can do and even make assertions that big business, for the most part, can afford to wait for the claims, for example, but we also know that in a lot of these molds, there weren't only the big anchor tenants, right? There were also small tenants. What can other small businesses who perhaps were not in those particular properties that were affected, how can they assist and even help, I'll say they are fellow entrepreneurs or small business owners? Because as you were saying, the work of rebuilding is not going to only come from one person, it really is about communities coming together and different people in the communities doing so. Yeah, so I think the obvious answer is if you have finances to spare, you can come through and go to rebuild.kendua.com, which is where our whole crowdfunding initiative is hosted, and very simply, you can pledge some of your support financially to the cause in that way. That's the obvious answer. Then we've had other people coming forward and saying, you know what, I want to help, but actually what I want to use is my time. Actually, I can do some of the rebuilding. We had Leroy Malin, for example, coming forward and saying, we've got materials and we would love to make some of these materials available to this really noble cause. So what we want to do as a platform and as a connector, which is what we are, come to us and give us your ideas, tell us how you want to help, and if you can help, we will do what is in our power to facilitate that and to be the conduit that you need. And so yeah, we would really encourage anyone who needs that help to email us. You can email me personally, that's a-r-j-u-n, at kendua.com, email me and tell me how you would like to help and we'll make a plan. So really open-minded and keen to explore whatever people have in mind in that way. And I think that's actually such a great note to leave it at that. If you want to play an active role in the rebuilding, this is certainly one of the channels that you're able to access. And I love that Andrew has even made himself personally available, so you're able to drop him in line. But of course, for those who want to go and perhaps pitch some money in the card funding initiative that has been set up, it's rebuild.kendua.com. And that's where you'll be able to, also just put in your bits. Perhaps even if it's 100 rands, I think everybody's rands and things certainly go a long way, especially when we look at the extent to which the destruction is. And also there's just amount of work that still needs to be done. Andrew, I think that's where we're going to leave it at this evening. Thank you so much for joining us on the show. Cool, thank you, Zamaq. Great to chat to you and by extension, all of your audience members. And yeah, have a good evening. Thank you very much. And that's Andrew Kassoul, who's the CTO and co-founder of kandua.com. Wrapping up the Friday edition of the Private Property Podcast with myself, Ozamantouma Kumalo. I see the engagement on our Facebook page, many people saying that we're going to have a rollover and that is indeed true. Unfortunately, Ukulele and Anzi did not claim the 500 rands that is up for grabs this evening. So it rolls over. So we're going to have 1,000 rands in the money bag. Of course, that is tomorrow or that is on Monday rather. So thank you very much for tuning in this evening. And of course, I'll be back on your screens on a Monday evening at 7 PM. But you can look forward to the Home Shopper Show with chat at 8 PM. I do hope you're all going to have a great weekend. And as usual, I hope you'll be staying home and staying safe.