 And the YouTube live stream page just went live. If you do want to keep an eye on that, again, some people sometimes ask questions on the chat on that page as well, so feel free. I'll keep an eye on that too and bring over quite any questions. So maybe we give it one or two more minutes. I still see a couple of people who have just recently joined. So thanks everybody for your patience. We'll start, how about we just start at two minutes past. And Vipin, when we start in a minute, do you want to do a quick introduction to the telecom SIG for people who are new to the group and then we can hand off to the presentation? Oh, sorry, David, can you repeat? Like your voice is breaking. Oh, sorry, I was saying, do you want to do an intro to the telecom SIG before we start the presentation just for people who are new to the group? Yeah, I can do that, sure. Great. Well, why don't we kick it off for two minutes past if you want to start. Vipin, did you want to start it off? Yeah, yeah. Hi guys, my name is Vipin Dottie and I'm a chairperson for Hyperledger Telecom SIG. And the focus of this SIG is to discuss the technical and business level of conversations and use cases for blockchain and telecom industry. And last year, if I am not wrong, we did a lot of things. For example, we have a lot of talk, a lot of talk from different company people as well. For example, Rajesh from Telco, from TechMindra, and this year, we also have a vice chair as well. So we have, like for example, we have other talks, for example, of 5G marketplace from Neema. And we also completed one white paper, which most probably we will release soon. And yeah, that's a quick introduction. This is all like, we have bi-weekly calls. And yeah, thanks Madhu Sankar for today's lecture. We have this lecture series, we started this like every month, we have someone from industry or academia to discuss more on this blockchain use cases. Thanks Madhu Sankar for accepting our questions. Vipin, one quick note just to add, if anybody is interested in joining the discussions on the telecom specialist group, I just pointed to the group's mailing list. It's an open list, you're welcome to subscribe and post any questions, comments or suggestions there. So. Okay. Yeah, we can start. Okay, thanks Vipin and also thanks David. So, providing this opportunity for me to present in this Hyperledge telecom scene. So, I am Madhu Sankar here again. So, I'm an assistant professor at University College, Dublin, Ireland. And also, I have an agent professor with the University of Wolff-Inlet. Today, I'm going to talk about the role of blockchain in private 5G operator realization. Okay, so 5G is like the latest mobile generation that we are currently experiencing. So, like, oh, we are about to experience in near future. So, over the last 40 years, the telecommunication industry has evolved through four different generations. Now we are experiencing this latest generation, which is 5G. So, 5G is not just a mobile network like a pre-5G network. So, it is a complex ecosystem. Why I'm saying it is a complex ecosystem? One of the main goal of 5G is to interconnect IoT devices. So, that means it will be enabling many services or many applications supported by IoT devices, like these autonomous driving cars, drone or UAE-based communication or the services, remote surgery, augmented reality or multi-mix reality application, industrial internet application, wearable devices. So, there are many different IoT-based services will be integrated with 5G along with that, along with this application. So, many different type of verticals will also interconnected. So, for example, smart grid will get communication services from 5G. So, the transportation industry, healthcare industry. So, smart city, smart parking. So, we can see like almost all the aspect of the human life will be interconnected with 5G. So, it is not just a network which is connecting the mobile devices, but different aspect of the human life will be interconnected with 5G. So, that's why I'm saying 5G is a complex ecosystem compared to the previous mobile generation. So, how we can enable these services? So, in order to enable these services, so 5G has to satisfy different requirements. So, basically 5G has to go beyond the capabilities of existing mobile network like 4G and it has to extend capabilities in different dimensions. So, we should have higher data rate, low latency, energy efficiency, spectrum efficiency, high bandwidth, high density capability. So, different areas has to be improved in 5G in order to provide these applications and the services. So, how we can achieve these things? So, usually if the 5G is a wireless communication technology, so everyone is thinking, okay, the wireless, the radio technologies has to be improved, but the reality, not only the radio technologies, but also the core network of this 5G network is also needed to be upgraded. So, what is the main development or the main or radical change happening in 5G core network sites? So, when we look at the pre-5G networks like 4G or 3G or whatever, so these networks were developed, the core network of these networks were developed by using the proprietary hardware appliances with software. So, basically, there are dedicated hardware devices which can do certain controlling functions and you have to buy these dedicated hardware devices, place them in the network, and then you have to hardware the network, then only you can have the core network. So, that is the structure we had in the pre-5G network. But having these kind of distributed hardware network with proprietary hardware is not going to work for 5G because they don't support the flexibility to scale up with the 5G requirements and also it doesn't support this on-demand response to the dynamic traffic needs, also it is in the innovation of this new development. So, that's why the 5G is trying to move away with this proprietary hardware-based system. So, we are moving to a virtualized network concept instead of having a dedicated hardware. So, we have a hardware pooled in 5G and all the control elements will be deployed as a virtual network function in the cloud or virtual environment. So, this virtual network function use this common hardware pool and create the virtual resources in order to run this virtual network function. So, this concept is called as a network function virtualization. So, what is the biggest advantage of this kind of network? The virtualized network is, we don't need dedicated hardware, we don't need expensive hardware to deploy the core network. So, even all the control function, now you can deploy in one single computer or one single hardware resources. So, that's lead us, so we can have a very flexible 5G network, even this 5G network or the core network can be deployed in a single machine. Even in Raspberry Pi, you can deploy some of these virtual network functions. So, this concept, so get rid of this expensive hardware, it's also enabling a new concept called private 5G network or local 5G network concept. So, what is a private 5G network or local 5G network means? So, it is a small scale mobile network. So, you can think it as the similar to Wi-Fi network. So, usually it is operate in a confined area and in many cases it is operating in the indoor environment with small cell communication. And this network offers local content related services. So, usually this network is highly optimized to the context of the environment or the local figures or the local connectivity. And also, it will be designed to serve like various vertical sector specific needs. So, it will be highly customized and consider the use case this network is used and it is optimized to support the services for that particular use case. And this local 5G operator networks use in many locations like smart cities we can use, inside the factories we can use, the hospitals or airports or universities. So, any of these confined areas which has certain coverage, so we can use this local 5G operator network. So, this become possible because of this network softwareization because we can deploy this 5G code at birth with minimum cost. So, what is the different between the main, different between this local 5G operators and also the mobile network operator? As I mentioned, they are restricted to a local area and they have highly customized for the case to the use case we are using. And usually they are deployed in the small sales deployment, local small sales deployment. And most of these local 5G operators doesn't have the full-fledged 5G connector. So, you can have a part of the 5G network will be deployed there because you don't need the full-fledged 5G connector to operate the local 5G operator network. And also to design these kind of network is the other cost of deploying this network is cheaper, it's a lot cheaper than mobile network operator. And but they don't have like all the infrastructure they need. So, some of the infrastructure they can obtain from the other mobile network operators. For example, Spectrum, they can lease it from the mobile network operator. So, these are the key features of local 5G operators. And you can see it is like clearly different from the mobile network operators who provide the coverage for the wide area network, wide area. So, let's look at what are the challenges in this private 5G network. So, when we look at the, this private 5G network ecosystem, we can identify different problems, Spectrum sharing, how we can do the roaming and off-loading, infrastructure sharing, subscription management, obtaining services from third party service providers, and how we can handle these IoT data. So, the first problem is the Spectrum sharing. So, if you look at the Wi-Fi network, we have a dedicated spectrum assigned for the Wi-Fi network. So, anyone who built the Wi-Fi network, they can use this Wi-Fi network, Wi-Fi allocated frequency to build the Wi-Fi network. But for the local 5G operators, we don't have the dedicated administrative spectrum allocation. That means the local 5G operators has to buy the expensive spectrum bands from the regulator body. But unfortunately, these local network operators are small-scale operators. They cannot buy this kind of a speculative spectrum. So, only possibilities, they have to lease it from the MNOs for a certain time. But leasing also, we cannot go for static leasing because it will not work very well. It seems something similar to this cooperative ratio concept. So, it is better if you can go for the dynamic leasing concept. So, that will be very advantageous. So, this is like the one of the challenge we are facing, like how we can achieve the spectrum sharing. And the next challenge is related to the roaming and off-loading. Because usually, the roaming event happens whenever the user is moving from one country to another country. But with the local 5G operators, we can have islands inside the same country because of this local 5G operator network. So, then the mobile network, the normal mobile network operators can offload or enable the roaming instance with this local 5G operator. And there will be like thousands of local 5G operators deployed inside the country. Then there will be a frequent roaming incident will be happened between these network. So, handling this kind of roaming event, it has to be managed efficiently. And usually when we think about the roaming or off-loading mechanism available today, they are usually static roaming agreement. For example, the home network operator already have a agreement with the visitor network operator. Even though you have the multiple network between you, you will be always connected with the whoever, the network which has the static agreement. But this network might not have the best connectivity for the certain area because you don't have the opportunity to select the best network available in the area because of this static agreement. So that is like one issue. And along with that related to this roaming and off-loading there are some other issues like how we can select the best roaming network and which user has to be offloaded to this local 5G operator network. How we can prevent the roaming frauds. How we can do the billing for the services they are using. So all of these problems associated with the roaming and off-loading issue that we need to address. The third challenge is the infrastructure sharing. So the local 5G operator has some infrastructure and they can leave this infrastructure to the mobile operator to provide the connectivity for their users. But the problem with these local 5G operators are not reputed as the MNOs. So they can be anyone who can deploy this local 5G network. So then how MNOs can trust these local 5G operators and how they can trust these network before off-loading or using the services from this particular local 5G operator. And also like whenever they have some kind of agreement for example service level agreement these service level agreement has to be monitored. Dispute has to be resolved. So then the third parties has to be involved so that there are some problem. Challenges associated with the spectrum share so infrastructure sharing. And also as a local 5G operator so they have to have a marketplace to share their resources because going after each and every MNO every time and establishing a static agreement is not going to work. That is the third challenge. And the fourth challenge is the subscription management system because every MNO or every local 5G operator able to subscribe to users for their network. But the subscription management in MNO is usually a good method they have. They have a secure method but they cannot trust how the subscription management is done in the local 5G operator because local 5G operators might not have the full-fledged 5G network and their subscription management is not so reliable. So then how can we trust these subscribers who are coming from local 5G operators and how we can provide the services for these users? So that's why we need to have some kind of universal subscription management system we can share the subscription information between different stakeholders in the same local 5G operator network. And this user subscription it can go beyond only for the users not only for the users but also for the different services or it can be going for these VNF service providers cloud services providers or IoT sellers, IoT data providers so IoT tenants so all of these have to be subscribed or their subscription has to be managed in the proper way in this local 5G operator network. And the fifth challenge obtaining the services from the third-party service provider so in order to run a local 5G operator network they have to obtain the services from different vendors for example the VNF to build their own network they have to buy it from the VNF provider or cloud services store the data they have to use the cloud service provider information so then services so then the problem is like how we can establish trust between them and how we can identify the reliable services as a local 5G operator and also at the same time from the service provider side how they can measure the reliability of the local 5G operator whether they are whether they are trustworthy local 5G operator so we need to have a mechanism to establish the trust between these two parties and also how we can handle the payments and how we can measure the service quality monitor the service quality measure how the service level agreements are violated or not so that is also important challenge to be addressed so the sixth challenge related to the IoT data management so if you look at this local 5G operator deployment they are highly associated with the IoT tenant for example let's think about this industrial IoT or industrial factory so there are a lot of industrial IoT devices connected and local 5G operators are deployed to manage this IoT device and think about the hospitals in the hospitals we can deploy a local 5G operator and it is provided the connectivity for a lot of medical IoT devices the same way so usually it is associated with a lot of IoT based system so then this IoT based system is collected in a lot of IoT data and it will be important for the other party to take some decisions, analyze the data and this IoT data is very valuable and then the problem is like the one problem is like how this IoT tenant although its local 5G operators can sell their data to a certain party and how they can protect the privacy of the data and how they can keep the control of data for example if you sell the data that data shouldn't be sell by that party to third party so that is its violation of your agreement so how you can track these so that is related to the IoT data management and also from the other side whoever buy this data they have to make sure whatever the data has been collected or genuine data integrity of the data has been protected so we can see there are different challenges associated with this local 5G operator network ecosystem and we have to find the solutions in order to have a reliable and more efficient local 5G operator ecosystem so what is the solution? so there can be like multiple okay so there are some questions so probably I can answer the question at the end of the presentation right so what is the solution here? so there can be like multiple solution but one solution I am proposing here is the blockchain with smart contract so the blockchain with smart contract can provide the solution for this scenario and here I am not going to explain what is blockchain and smart contract I think I assume like you already have experience with blockchain and smart contract so I am directly going to the solution so one solution I am proposing here is the blockchain as a service platform for blockchain as a service architecture so here the blockchain as a service platform actually we are proposing a blockchain layer which is established as an OLA entity so we can spread across a local 5G operator ecosystem so it is a blockchain layer which can be accessed by all the stakeholders in this local 5G operator network and on top of this blockchain network we are proposing to have modularised architecture that compromise several blockchain based functions so we are proposing modularised functions or functional modules that can provide some kind of functions and these functions can be merged together to implement various services so here we are going for modularised architecture because these functions which we are deploying on top of the blockchain can be added and removed according to the requirement of that particular ecosystem and also you can update these modules one by one according to your requirement so here I am mentioning some of these key functions which we can deploy on top of this proposed blockchain as a service architecture so one of these function is called as a subscription management function so the key idea here is to of the subscription management function is to manage the registration of the stakeholder and the service application so the subscription management function can create a universal wallet and also it can assign the unique ID for each stakeholder and also whatever the spectrum, the subscription data which is collected from the subscription management function will be shared with all the stakeholders in the network so that is the main role of this spectrum management function and here when you come to the subscription management so it can be different stakeholders can be registered under this management function so it can be users who are actually using these services or it can be other stakeholders like local mobile network operators, mobile network operators or even VNF providers, cloud service providers IoT tenants, IoT data buyers so anyone who is using these services in local 5G operator ecosystem has to be registered with subscription management function and then I am proposing this marketplace function I think there are like many different lectures already or talks already on these marketplaces so this marketplace function can deploy a marketplace so where you can buy or sell different services so that is handling, buying and selling of services these services can go in the different areas it can be spectrum or it can be VNF it can be IoT data or according to the service we are selling this marketplace function will be customer and then we have the reputation management function the main goal of this reputation management function is to maintain the service quality of the system by keeping a rating score so every seller, every buyer, every local operator every MNO has a reputation score we are defining a reputation score for each and every stakeholder so based on the functionalities they are providing for the other party so this reputation management function is very important to track the operation of each stakeholder and to see whether they are performing expected level and then we have this selection function so selection function is executing the selection strategies for different stakeholders for example, if you want to select the optimal local 5G operator network for the roaming and offloading domain so this selection function can be called and if a MNO want to select which sub-cyber has to be offloaded this selection function can be called and if local 5G operators want to select which VNS provider to select that selection function can be called and this selection function can be customized according to the use case we are applying and then we have this fraud prevention function so that can ensure to avoid any kind of fraud happening in the network and then we have the data management function it can handle the data storage and access related issues and last function is the agreement establishment and payment handling function so that is basically facilitates the dynamic agreement negotiation and allow the secure transferring of the money between different entities so we can see these are like the key functions we are proposing which can be deployed in this blockchain as a service architecture and these functions can be combined together to deploy different services so I am not going to discuss each and every function like how it is working because of the time limitation but I can share the paper which is explaining these things in detail so if you are interested like how these functions are deployed in the blockchain architecture and now we have a set of functions which have been deployed in the blockchain network and these functions can be customized and combined together in order to enable some kind of services for example if you want to do a ROM in service or if you want to implement a ROM in service you have to combine some of the module functions for example first you have to register the users because the registration modules have to combine then if you want to select the network then you have to call the selection function then if you want to do the ROM in so maybe the offloading function so there are like multiple functions have to be combined together in order to implement one of these services so we are giving a set of functions actually using these functions you can deploy different different type of services on top of this local 5G operator ecosystem so here I have mentioned some of the functions which we think important in here so like the ROM in service function offloading service function identity management service spectrum share in service VAT management service IOT data share in service so any of these services actually deployed by combining different modular functions which we have expressed before and then the question is like how we can mitigate these issues in private 5G network ecosystem because I have explained some of these issues in the previous case now let's look at like how we can address these issues using blockchain based solution so the first one is the spectrum share in so one of the biggest problem like we have is the lack of transparency because we don't know how much we are paying how much we have to pay and which operator we have to select which one has the lowest cost so those things are not so transparent if you have the static agreement but in here we are proposing decentralized marketplace now everything is transparent so you can always select the best option and also the static agreement so static agreement means every time you have to go and establish the agreement with the MNOS and local 5G operator but that kind of agreement process is not going to work when number of operators are growing so we are replacing it with the smart contract based dynamic agreement and the next section is violation of pre-established static agreement that means if somebody is violating the spectrum share in the MNOS spectrum sharing agreement for example MNOS is not providing the enough spectrum for the local 5G operator or that spectrum is overloaded so those kind of issues can be arrived so we have to resolve these issues and we are using this rating system so using this rating system or the reputation system we can blacklist the stakeholder and this system can be further extended a little bit so we can pay for the MNOS or whoever sharing the spectrum according to the reputation scope if they have a lowest reputation scope they will get paid less if they have higher reputation scope they will pay a high amount so because of that everyone is naturally going towards the higher reputation scope that means they will provide better services and another thing is that roaming and offloading I have explained the problem of the static agreement so static agreements in the roaming scenarios can be easily solved using smart contracts with dynamic agreement and when we think about the roaming we have the presence of these data clearance houses having this third party DCH will increase the delay of roaming process and also increase the cost because of the commission that will be using the blockchain base solution will be eliminating this third party DCH so we can have faster and local roaming instance and another thing when you have the roaming offloading agreement so we have to make sure this pre-established service level agreement has been satisfied so we are using this rating scheme or the reputation scheme so in that way we can blacklist stakeholders we are not whoever not satisfied the SLA agreement so when their reputation score is getting lower they will not get selected by the other parties and also the problem of having the multiple identities I have discussed because the local 5G operators will not will not transfer it to provide the legitimate ID so we are going for the universal ID scheme and this universal IDs will be shared with all the stakeholders in the ecosystem and the roaming frauds most of the cases roaming frauds has to mean somebody overutilizing your account so we are using a universal wallet and whatever the amount in that wallet will be visible for all the users including the visitor network so the visitor network can automatically stop after a certain usage limit so they will be not overcharged in that sense and another area is the spectrum infrastructure they are in so whenever you buy the infrastructure probably delivery of this infrastructure will be lower quality so again we can use this reputation and rating scheme to blacklist these kind of service providers and again spectrum management so the problem of having the multiple ID so we are avoiding this having multiple IDs providing universal ID and this ID and the subscriber information can be shared with the blockchain based system and so the VNF management again whenever local 5G operators buy a VNF so you have to have a certain level of service level agreement so the service level agreement can be performed via this rating based system and usually if there is a dispute between these two different parties we need third party service level monitoring entity to resolve this dispute but we can eliminate this third party service level monitoring entities because it can be replaced with the blockchain so with IOT management the biggest issue is how we can ensure the integrity of IOT data so we can enforce this immutable decentralized transaction lobes so in that way we can ensure the integrity of IOT devices and also another problem with the static contract with the data sellers so whether how we can find the data sellers with the static contract establishing the contract will be problematic so we are going to have a marketplace established with the dynamic contract with the smart contract so that will resolve these problems so we can see most of the issues which I have pointed out related to this local 5G operator I think I lost for a while so can you hear me yeah we can hear you yeah sorry about that so I think no worries so I was talking about simulation test bed so we have done some experiment to see how this system is performing and see whether this kind of blockchain based architecture is profitable or interesting so we have analyzed the roaming cost and in this case we have considered data session only and the simulation result revealed that this kind of system is profitable when you have longer session duration and also we have measured what is the impact of error probabilities like for example if you provide some service and if you have some kind of errors in your system and what is the impact of that so we are proposing to have in our system we consider this VNF selling process if that particular VNF has error so the reputations score will be deducted and we are paying for that particular VNF service provider according to the reputations score so here you can see if there is an error and the error is propagating so the actual service charge VNF provider will be get will be reduced because the reputation will be reduced according to the errors happening in the network and so we can see we don't have to pay a lot of money enough service quality can you please mute the mic so I can see the background thank you so here we can see the advantage of having this reputation system and pay the service provider according to the reputation score and we have done many different simulation to study this kind of possibility I am not going to go through all of these things because of the time limitation but now we can see this local 5G operator system is very interesting and the blockchain can solve all the issues but unfortunately not like that there are some issues the challenges we have to solve in order to have this blockchain deployed in this local 5G ecosystem so one of the challenge that we are facing is the scalability because we know the number of local 5G operators are growing rapidly so we are expecting this local 5G operators to look like a Wi-Fi network almost every hospital or every factory every university all of them will be using these local 5G operators in near future so then it will lead to greater number of roaming instances happening and management of this high number of roaming instance via blockchain based system need some planning and it has to be scaled up and also when there were lot of instances or lot of transactions appearing in the blockchain the blockchain size will be validation time will be increased so the computation of power will be high computation of powers are needed so these kind of scalability issues will be addressed so there are some possible solutions like we can go for the sharding kind of solution or we can go for like hierarchical blockchain solution from this angle we can go for addressing the scalability limitation and another problem we are facing is the cost of mining and the processing because we are proposing this blockchain we have to do extra mining and also extra processing for the concession mechanism so if you use like a proof of work kind of concession mechanism so that is not not so not so good because it is a waste of energy so but there are like different characteristics in this local 5G operator network and that can be used to design new concession mechanism for example so the spectrum sensing for example we can use spectrum sensing characteristic to design new concession mechanism and also when we think about the mining equipment so the local 5G operators will not have the same level of mining or processing power so then it will be not capable enough to provide the same level of blockchain not capabilities as M&Os or other powerful stakeholders and the security, security is another issue so there can be like security issues in the blockchain network so so that has to be address, majority attack, double spend in attack or race attack so those kind of blockchain related attack has to be addressed and at the same time the blockchain is connected by a network so this is off-chain connectivity and this off-chain network is also vulnerable to different attack like dust attack, manning the middle attack so to as a result we have to go for better encryption mechanism or enable off-chain security solution to ensure the security and the last problem is the privacy so because blockchain transparency compromise the data privacy for certain extent so we have to have better privacy protection mechanism integrated with the solution like privacy by design or use homomorphic signature so these kind of information have to be integrated in order to provide the privacy so so that's it from my side so I'm happy to answer any questions you have for me unfortunately unfortunately all the tech messages were deleted when I disconnected so please send your messages again so I can answer your question Thanks Madhu Sankar I can read these questions for you and first of all thanks for such a nice presentation and overview of these local 5G network stuff so Madhu Sankar we have first question from Dharmine he's asking can local 5G network share the bandwidth or spectrum from multiple MNO networks well yes so actually they can share the bandwidth so so as I mentioned this local 5G operators it is it is very unlikely for them to buy their own bandit because we know unless this regulator bodies assign a spectrum bandwidth or spectrum allocation specifically used for the local 5G operators they have to get or they have to lease the spectrum from this MNO so we can think about these operational modules we have in this cognitive radio or even this pro primary concept so this kind of concept can be adapted in this local 5G operator network because whenever MNOs are not using certain bandwidth they can lease that bandwidth for the local 5G so they can use it so that's why I am saying static agreement is not going to be a viable option because if you have a static agreement then MNOs have to lease that particular bandwidth for that a certain period or let's say but the 5G it's very dynamic environment we cannot predict with time your network will be ideal or with time the MNOs bandwidth will become free so that's why instead of going for static agreement going for dynamic agreement is interesting so always the spectrum has to be shared shared actually the local 5G operator has to lease this network from somebody so one example like in the university of all we have a local 5G operator network up and running and we lease the spectrum from the ELISA one of the MNO in Finland can we say that is it a kind of network slice we are getting from different MNOs no actually it is different from the network slice actually the thing is like the local 5G operator is itself a separate network so on top of this local 5G operator you can make the slice so you have to think this local 5G operator is it's a it's like a MNO like a mobile operator but it's a small scale confined for a certain environment so but it is not a slice of a main operator so it is it is a network which has the physical resources aspect we have yes okay I can see some questions any specific concession algorithm in mind yeah actually so we can think the when we are developing like a concession algorithm so what we have to do is we have to consider some of the features in that particular application so using that that that features we can define a concession algorithm for the use case for example it is not only for like 5G or local 5G operator so any telecommunication network of 5G there are like different characteristics we can use especially when we think about this wireless or radio networks or physical layer characteristics there are many uncertainties so we can be used to decide some kind of concession mechanism for example like spectrum sensing can be used or noise random noises appear in there so these can be things can be converted as a concession algorithm so I don't have like specific concession algorithm in my mind which one to use because for this particular exercise we have used the proof of work but it is not good because we are spending a lot of money on the proof of work spending a lot of processing power that is not fruitful so if you can during the mining process if you can collect some information which is useful at the end that kind of concession algorithm we need so the rate in services not respectable to favor in any specific entities on the network well we in general like what we have done was so in our rating algorithm we have considered the error probability if there is a violation or if there is an error in the service level like women so according to the error probability or according to the violation duration the duration of that violation happens we define then the rating algorithm so in that way we are not giving any favor to anyone but whoever has the higher number of errors whoever has longest SLA violation will have the lowest reputation so that's how it is working but I am not going to say our reputation scheme is the best one but of course there are lot of research available here to find out what is the best reputation solution here the reputation algorithm okay there is another question could you please more specific for the security and privacy policy parts for in terms specific use cases yeah well the security and privacy is the things that I have mentioned because again the problem is coming with these local 5G operators because these local 5G operators we consider them as MNO because if you consider MNO in a country they have full set 5G network implemented and they have all the security features implemented and they have separate security staff to maintain the security so they have special action takers to ensure the security and the privacy of the user but if you go for local 5G operators they don't have any of these things so they have they might not have a security staff they might not have a security function deployed because I have mentioned when you are developing the local 5G operator you don't have to use the full like full core network of the 5G so you can use the part of the 5G network maybe security related function or virtual network function these local 5G operators will not deploy so that's why the security itself it's a problem for the local 5G network so whatever they do cannot be trusted so that's like one problem we are facing and at other time they will not have enough resources to deploy the miners probably their miner equipment will be vulnerable for the attack so somebody can get the physical access or somebody can hack into their miner equipment then they can access the important information in the blockchain network so these kind of issues arise with the local 5G operators I hope I answered the question any other questions? I have one question so can these private 5G operators can talk to these public 5G operators and if yes then what do you think how much interpretable these kind of solutions in the future will be? Actually that's a very good question actually I have talked about the standalone local 5G operators so I said like a whole network like the core network infrastructure everything is done by these local 5G operators but in reality in other use cases we can have different operational modes these local 5G operators can be deployed for example we can have a hybrid architecture that means only the part of these local 5G operator functions will be deployed by the local 5G operator itself and part of the core network function they can rent it from the MNO so then there will be a direct connection at the core network level between the local 5G operator and then this public network and the third use case is like local 5G operators have only the infrastructure but the core network is fully rely on the MNO in that case that we can use a network size for example to manage this local 5G operator so these are like the three different type of implementation so if you go for like non-standalone versions like this hybrid version or this fully MNO dependent local 5G deployment then there will be a strong connection between the local private network and also the public network yeah thanks thank you we have two more questions okay do you have any challenges in building this ecosystem on blockchain getting all the stakeholders to activate this network will also enter the other yeah I think the challenge is also there I mean it is not only for like this particular case I mean if you want to have like a corporate or consortium kind of blockchain system we need the cooperation between the different stakeholders I think that problem is always there for any any application like how we can put together all the stakeholders into one blockchain platform or one system so that is actually one of the challenge we see I mean because as a competitor MNO or this local 5G operator sometime they might present want to join the ecosystem so those issues already they are actually but we have to I mean this is like the case of this blockchain as a service we have to give some kind of incentives for this stakeholders so they have to join this system for example if you think about the spectrum in model if the regulation body is using the blockchain spectrum they are in model or they are pushing this blockchain based spectrum they are in model that means like all the MNOs and local 5G operators has to join this ecosystem so we have to have some kind of incentives for them to join into this ecosystem that is also like one of the challenge actually I forgot to add this so it's a very good question so how to make this all the stakeholders on board is the one of the challenges that we face how do you see the integration of the unique identifier so actually having this unique identifier is very interesting I think it is not only for this local 5G operation but even without that if we can use the same SIM card for like all the operators or even like according to the network if we can register with the network using the same SIM card very interesting approach so instead of having like multiple SIM card for multiple network if we can have like a single identity or single SIM card to interconnect these things that will be interesting so one I mean from the SIM card side or the technology side I am not the expert like to know like how this thing can be possible and how we can implement in the mobile phone that is I am not sure but from the data handling side we can use the blockchain to share the information because one of the biggest problem we are facing multiple mobile network operators doesn't want to share this customer information because they are not trusting each other but we can use the blockchain as a platform to establish the trust and we can have the like universal identity management system so it doesn't matter the subscriber gets registered all the information will be shared with other MNOS in the system so that is the idea I want to have Thanks Madhu Sankar for answering all the questions and I hope every question is answered very nicely and very insight as well and thanks Neema for inviting such a good speaker in this sake so Madhu Sankar I hope you enjoyed this session and we hope that you will come again and give more such presentations definitely thank you very much for the invitation so I am happy to get involved with the Hyperledger telecom seek whenever possible so thanks again for the opportunity I am happy to thank you too thank you and in terms of getting involved if anybody is interested in doing that I am going to drop the link to the telecom 6 mailing list it's an open list everybody is welcome to join that and continue the discussion about this presentation or about anything else related to blockchain and telecom that people are interested in and I know we are at the top of the hour and if people want to drop off that's fine but Neema and Gordon if we want to stay on if you are able to stay on we can talk through the IOT paper if people want to stay on to wrap that up we certainly can I am going to stay on now sure I will too thanks Gordon thank you thank you thank you can you stop YouTube streaming David yeah just give me one second I am doing that