 Hello everybody! If it's Wednesday, it's Warhammer, and that must mean it's time for another episode of Warhammer Weekly. Joining me, as always, is my co-host Tom. What's up, brother? How you doing? Hello, friends. The man crusher to my mega-gargant, always here with me, ready to chuck some rocks. Tonight we are going to be engaging in one of the silliest things we've ever done on this show, which is to rewrite a book. I picked the lowest-hanging fruit, the Sons of Babmon book, because it's only like seven pages for all the rules, so easy there. So we're going to bust into that, but of course, first, the news. Man, it's been kind of a full week. Everybody's got to keep hitting like to make sure we always go, by the way, in multiples of 13, just so we stay in the Skaven thing to celebrate the pre-order. So hit all those like buttons. Let's get to 26, then 39, just multiples of 13. Okay, keep going. That checks out. So let's do the rumor engine first. Our fern. Between two ferns. What do you think this is, Vince? A hat. It's a hat. You really think so? Yeah. This is a fern. I agree. What's that, Tom? You're talking about the feather on the left. I'm talking about the feather on the left. Yeah. That's a feather, my friend. I wanted you to look at the fern and go like catichon or serifon and not notice that feather, and this is just like the fanciest hat ever. It's a hat, not only with a feather, but also a fern, might you say? Yes, correct. That's right. So is this new models for Living City who wear fern threats? I wish. It'd be my greatest dream ever. That'd be amazing. Okay, in my wildest dreams, when they release, this is a bit of a non sequitur, but it'll come back around, I promise. So you know, Tom, how they release the horse hairs. Are you familiar with this? You heard about this? Yeah. So all the marines that are in that box, the base box, they're just sort of generic marines. They're all stock marines. Yeah, you can make them any legion, right? But then what they also did is they released these upgrade boxes, these little plastic sprue kits that are like, here's the Imperial Fist heads and stuff like that. See, you were going more recent. I was going to go way deep with mine. I was going to say, do you remember at the launch of AOS, where they had upgrade packs for Stormcast, where you could upgrade their shields and shoulder pads, based on their storm hose? Man, how amazing, because that's where we're going with this. I already know. It is. How amazing if they had that for like living cities in Tempestai, and you're like, like the entire head swap. Like with the, but the point is we know they're redesigning the Mortal Cities range. So I hope that that actually comes as part of it, because I just believe they, when they released those Stormcast things at the time, the game wasn't big enough to support that. There's one Stormcast book, right? Right. Not 17. Yeah. It was like you, me and 12 other people playing. Right. I mean, it just wasn't, wasn't enough of a market there. Right. Um, but I think now it would be a completely different story. And I think for stuff like a human upgrade kit that would make you living cities or Tempestai or stuff like that, it would be amazing. So anyways, it's probably some silly war cry model. That's, that's what I'm going to vote. Either that or it's like a super boring 40k cat action thing. It's like a, some dude hiding behind a fern with a bird in it or something. I don't know. I mean, it looks very like a, it could be a goblin hat. Sure. Sure. Goblins wear funny hats. That is true. They do. They do. I mean, it could be the fern, the return of the force goblin. You, you, you dream too big now, Tom. You know that's not going to happen. I know, I know that, but I don't know that. Hmm. Hmm. What else we got? Yeah. So, uh, a lot is going on pre-order this week. Yeah. Well, like, Well, first talk about the contrast thing. Cause that's my new, that's my next news. Those, those are, I know it's your next news on it, but that's not really news. They're just changing the names on the entire paint line. That's not what's happening. I mean, they say that's not what's happening. So there are a bunch of new contrast paints and washes. That's what it is. Here I have pictures of it. Sure. Yes. Uh, that's what it is. Okay. All right. It's, uh, I am actually quite excited for this. I think the new range of colors are really good. I think they're going to introduce a bunch of single pigment colors, which is really nice. Those are, that means they'll be much more intense and bright when you want bright colored things, which is where the old paints kind of fell down. So, um, anyways, it's good. Okay. Now Tom, you can, now that we got your little picture, now we got the picture of the contrast people out of the way. Go right ahead. Okay. Yeah. With different pigments. Okay. Pre-order stuff. Uh, cool. Cool. Cool. Cool. Um, yeah. So GHB, Sylvan S, Gaven, they really couldn't fit enough in. We have Vanguard boxes for like all the books that have released in the last, I don't know how long coming. We have single heroes in all the dual boxes recently. Um, I mean, aggressive. That's what we're going to, that's what we're going to identify here. Yeah. Like, is this the biggest AOS launch weekend? Weekend since, like, first edition AOS? Well, certainly since the pandemic. We can say that with complete assurity. Um, yeah, I mean, like, let's go through it. So we've got the three books, GHB and two army books, all really pre-ordering on next, on Saturday. Okay. Um, we're not going to talk about that. They did some rules previews of stuff. We're not really going to talk about it today. There's been leaks and stuff, whatever, whatever. We'll, we'll dive into all of those once we have the picture and the next three weeks of shows will be those three books. Just so everybody here. We'll hit GHB first and then we'll do, um, one of either Silvaneth and Orskaven. Okay. Because that'll be me and you probably, and then, uh, and then Tyler, yeah, to do Silvaneth with you. That's right. Yeah. So that's your next three weeks of Warhammer Weekly there. Tuck in. Those are going to be some, some intense shows. We'll be all three of us, I believe, me, Vince and Tyler potentially. Yeah. That's the hope to break into the GHB. Yeah. Because boy, oh boy, is that GHB meaty. Um, it looks like we have, uh, Would you say it's like a taco, Tom? Is it now meatier? Our tacos are now meatier indeed. Um, yeah, I mean it to it, this could be the biggest non-core rules release ever in the GHB, just as how this new GHB is going to upend the game. I'm excited. I'm so excited. Sure. You just can't find it. So those will be the next three weeks. And then in addition, as you mentioned, so there's also Vanguard boxes for Doc, which is 10 witches, five snakey snake ladies and five Doomfire warlocks. We're going to move these Doomfire warlocks, Tom, one way or another. I love them laying around here. Every single box that they ever do that has Doc in it, it's going to have five Doomfire warlocks. We got to move some product here. Okay. Can't get rid of these things any other way. I mean, you know what they need to do is in cities, they need to make Dark Riders good. Yeah. That's the key. Yes, absolutely. That'll move them kids. So then we've got the Skaven box, which is three storm fiends. The Warplighting Cannon. Obviously the Warplighting Cannon could also be built as a plague claw. Clan Rats and then the Grey Seer on foot. Again, just can't, just always, it's always time for 20 more Clan Rats. When you buy them in min 20, you know, like why not? I just stumbled upon 60 I have in my house now. Sure. I can't get back. I think I have 80 to be clear. I think I because I have 60 from the new boxes. And then I just, I think I had 20 laying around. So like it sounds like I have a Skaven army. If you find Aklan right in your house, there's at least 20 more somewhere. That's, that's, that's how that works. It's an investigation. Yeah, absolutely. And then of course the Night Haunt, the Night Haunt Vanguard, which is like 20 chain rasps, 10 Grimgas Reversed, three Spirit Hosts and the Night of Shrouds on foot. Yeah. And those could be blade guys too. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right on. So the, so three good vanguards, I assume they'll all be priced at the standard like 100, 110, whatever they are now around that place. Yeah. Um, and then there's also like the War Scroll cards, the dice. And then in addition to all of that, yes, as you mentioned, we're now getting the, the most recent slate of single heroes that had been in the dual boxes are all coming out. Like the, the IDK one, the Fire Slayer one, which is the, the Flame Keeper and the Thrall Master, the Mortar Scripter, which who cares, because he's terrible. And the, oh, and the High Gladiatorix, which is obviously amazing. So I'm actually super glad with how quick they're really, at least the dock and Night Haunt ones are coming out pretty fast on the heels of the, of the box. Still not as fast as I would like. I would prefer it if it was like two weeks after the box, you could just buy the individual hero, but still better. Did we get a, uh, did we get clarification that we're going to have, uh, the War Scroll cards this week? Yeah, it's in the article. Okay. Okay. I must have missed that. Uh, fantastic. I mean, there's 80 things in that article that are going on pre-order. I should have announced that this is also the weekend for the, I mean, this isn't necessarily, but it's also the 40K. Uh, their GHB sort of equivalent, their next like Warzone or whatever is also happening. Oh my gosh. This weekend. So it's just like, just stuff everywhere, just, just throwing stuff. Did, did like a ship get unstuck from the Suez Canal or something two weeks ago? Like, man, just, it's a heck of a week. Uh, so there we go. And, uh, unfortunately there's going to be a glut of script or mortises on the market now. Still a cool model. But yeah, he's not good. He's fine. He's fine. It's fine. The model's fine. They're not the rules. I'm not going to even pretend there. That, there's like a bunch of really good heroes in Night Haunt and that guy's not clear in the bar. He wouldn't be my 10th pick, let alone my top six. So there you go. No, seriously. I'm trying to fit Karen Ratheson now with the new, uh, the new Horde meta. I mean, hey, you know, you know what, you know what I need? Stop that. You know what I need? Role, uh, uh, measuring two inches from a 32 millimeter base with rerollable hints and wounds. That's what I need. I'm sure. Yeah. That's nobody needs it. Uh, so at any rate, a lot of stuff this weekend, big weekend, big weekend for sure. Um, so yeah, good stuff. Like I said, look for the next three weeks of shows to be, uh, to be all of those books in order. We will deep dive on all of them. Obviously there may be members of this particular show that are extremely hyped about some of those books. I mean, uh, you are very excited. I am super excited. Uh, I am very excited to have a new painting commission. Sure. I have, I have, uh, all the Sylvaneth that we're made. So if you're looking for any, they're here in my house, uh, for this commission. And, um, I'm going to be painting trees for the next couple months. That's for sure. Sure. Yes. Well, as well as obviously also the new Sylvaneth kits come out because as previously mentioned, we do in fact live in the worst of all possible worlds. Uh, where Sylvaneth, a beautiful new line that's basically cut from whole cloth in 2016 or something, gets four additional kits or whatever it boils down to, four War Scrolls, three kits, however you want to think of it, I don't know. And Skaven with the two oldest models in the entire range of AOS. Not just in Skaven. I mean the two oldest models in the game. Older, older by a good deal than I would really be willing to bet many of our viewers. Uh, so there's a likelihood that those models are older than many of you watching. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yes. The oldest is 92. 92, 93 and then 93. So basically they're, they're either are or about to celebrate their 30th anniversary. Or they have their 30th birthday, however you want to think of it. Oh, amazing. Amazing. Happy birthday, Acolytes. Indeed. So anyways, yeah, there we go. But a lot of stuff. A lot of stuff. What else do we have? Is that, is that, is there anything else? We covered a bunch of stuff. And then obviously Rules Previews a bunch of stuff dropped. A bunch of stuff with, yeah, well, and we'll cover all that in the next couple of weeks. We're excited. Everybody's excited. We're going to have videos out from content producers in the next week starting on Saturday. Oh, and so it's going to be a hot time. Yep. Yep. Okay. So, uh, look forward all of that. It's going to be a jam packed three weeks. I will tell you right now, GHB Review next week will be in the middle of the day like noon eastern UK friendly time Europe friendly time it will be lunch break friendly time. Yeah, lunch break time. That's when it will be happening. So there you go. Look for it then. Okay. With that let's turn to some pick of the week. Tom, what would you like to share with everybody? I mentioned kind of in passing the content producers. I know that a bunch of folks are going to have videos coming up two plus stuff for example and a number of other individuals. So come check them out. All that Man Reads book should be out this Saturday as well. Yep. Lots of stuff that's coming so take it out and check it out. There you go. And so I've linked some of those down below as well. My pick of the week is for something that's near and dear to my heart speaking of old stuff. Not as old as those Skaven models but old. That is the game Mordheim or our good buddy friend of the show Squid Mar Emile just released a new video about why Mordheim was the best game ever. A video I've made a very, very, very, very long ago in the deep, deep history of this channel. I also made a video on that same topic and Emile We agree. Mordheim is fantastic and amazing game. I love it to death. I recorded some stuff for him as did other content creators. He also interviewed one of the creators of the game. Real good guy. Just super cool. Go check it out. It's linked below. Not that Squid Mar probably needs my help to boost the signal but I love the video and I love the game. Dip your toes in the sweet waters of nostalgia for a legitimately great game. Okay. Yes. Alright. With that let's turn to some hobby time. Tom, you kind of mentioned it already but what's on your desk, man? What you've been working on? Is it all trees all the way down for you right now? Oh my God. That's so many trees. Like I I made a mistake. I agreed to this and you shipped me like just all the trees. And so I finished my last commission earlier today. Getting ready to ship that out tomorrow. And this one popped up. And so getting ready to start on that. I put together my Incarnate. Got that one all based in Prime. Are you using the real model? Yeah, I am. I had a really neat idea with how I wanted to visualize it. And so that's why I actually wanted to use the real model. So on my boat man that I did for my Night Haunt Army I extended the swirling energy onto the base out of an energy out of an energy pool. And I did something similar with the Liquitex the swirl onto the base out of the dirt. And so I extended the swirl into a much larger pattern than just than just what the actual creature is. And so it ended up coming out nice and looking forward to painting that. I don't know that I'm ever going to use it. But it was a fun project for me to work on. I was at ACO this last weekend and that went really well. I went three and two had two really close losses. One in Round 3. Apparently the person, the Warhammer Weekly Destroyer, he's got to beat Tyler Round 5. He could just clean the clock of this entire show. So you're talking about Anthony Trinelli. Yeah, Trinelli. He was just a wonderful player, played his Skaven in Round 5 lost nearly lost that game. He had three models on the table. But apparently that's what matters at the end of the game is who has more models. And I played I lost to Jeremy Misery and Captain for Team USA in Round 3. So I just had a bunch of great games all weekend. It was a wonderful event. Martin Orlando did an excellent job pulling things together. Yeah, and I ended up taking home a little bit of hardware for painting. So yeah, it went well. Very nice. Very nice. Well, congratulations. It sounds like a fun time. I'm sorry I missed out, but at the same time, there's no way I was ever going to get to that. So that was all right. Not because I don't want because the summer months are absolutely jam-packed insane for me. For myself, my hobby time I finished up my fabulous Pride Marine here for Pride Month. There'll be a video coming out all about non-metallic pink and stuff like that doing non-metallic and interesting colors. So this is cool. This is part of Zambies Decays over on Twitch. Zambies has a project called Fabulous Marines, which is all about Pride Marines, and then we auction these off and the money goes to the Trevor Project. It's like an eBay auction for charity, so super cool. You can look for that coming soon. And then I'm also working on another accidental Soblight Gravelords model because they just keep happening. So this is Vampire Lord with Wingy Wings. You have so many of those models. Of St. Celestine? No, I'm just saying of the army. What is your points up to now? I don't know. Probably a thousand points. Something around there. Outlandish. Yes, gen S it is. So, the accidental army continues. Yeah. I don't know. I'm just going to keep doing it. As long as these figs keep showing up in the house, I'm going to keep painting them, so we'll see what happens. At some point in the future, at some point they'll do some kind of box or something that will be like a Vanguard box and it'll be like an obvious buy. I'll just pick that up and finish the army. That'll be how it'll die. That was the Soblight Ladder Force Box. There's too much. I don't want that. What I'm saying is it has to be something like the size of a Vanguard. That's the right amount. Because I don't want the battle. The battle force is too much. I don't like it when that kind of stuff drops on my plate. Probably like four or five units. Yeah, it's too much. It's seven thousand points. I have one under my bed if you want one. I appreciate it. I'm good. Thank you, though. It's very nice of you. So yeah, some cool fun projects there. Smaller things before I start on a really, really, really big project. That's going to take me a long time. Is it for Nova? Or can you talk about it? Oh, no, I can talk about it. I just don't like to talk about things before I start them. Because then you get the dopamine hit of doing hard work by saying you're doing it and that de-incentivizes you from doing it. But at any rate, I'm going to work on my next big robot. That's what it moves down to. Excellent. There you go. At any rate, yeah, so fun times, lay ahead. Well, Tom, look at that record time we've gotten through all this preamble. Are you now ready to engage in this little adventure we call rewriting a book? Always. Always. So, I will take the blame for this. For us doing this. Vince wanted to do this and I said, Sure. I mentioned it offhand, like five people said they wanted me to do it. And so I was like, yep, okay, that's all I needed. People were about it, so we're going to rewrite Sons of Emma, folks. A couple of people did say you should rewrite Slenesh. I hear that. I'm not going to write a book, especially a book as off-kilter as Slenesh is I would want to I would need to like strip it to the studs and start over. And I'd have to rewrite almost every war scroll. And it's just such a that would be a way bigger project, right? Like I could do it in a sort of slap-dash fashion, but I want to take this kind of seriously. Yeah, well in Slenesh, like it takes more than just like there are fundamental challenges there that run even deeper than Sons. And Sons only have like five war scrolls. Yeah, sure. Four, yes. I mean, you could count like all the mercenaries, I guess, as one extra, but sure. Right. At any rate, I'm not going to touch the mercs that just assume that happens. I'm not even getting into all that. We're just going to talk about the book as the book, right? I'm not, I don't care what they're doing in other books. So let's start this off here. Why are we rewriting this book? Well, because it's fun. That's number one. Number one thing. It's fun and it's funny to do. And fun is okay sometimes, folks. That's that's the bottom line. Let's have some fun with this. As well, I think the Sons of Bama book has largely proven kind of a not winner. And I don't mean that by it's tournament rankings or anything like that. Sure. I mean by the way people have received it. The idea of an army of giants is one of the coolest things you could imagine in my estimation. And yet no, like the way the book played was generally not fun if you were piloting it. And the way the book played was often terrible to play against. They ran slip shot when they first came out over everybody by being a giant DPS check who just stands there and holds objectives. And once people unlock the tech and the damage enablement of 3.0 became real then they just started getting stomped left and right by the armies that could do that. Meanwhile, a lot of people down at the bottom who couldn't present massive amounts of hammer damage. Right, which is one of the reasons they're down at the bottom of the current meta. Just still struggled against them and had a completely unfun game. That's not great. Okay. The question. Can you kill two giants a turn? Right, right. Like in your turn two. That's the question. Right. So I wanted to take a crack at redesigning this book. Now I'm aware that I'm probably too late. This book is probably already rewritten. If it's coming out sometime next year it's probably already rewritten now because they work like a year and a half ahead. So that's too bad, but too bad so sad. You never know. It could be a testing. Sure. Maybe so. Maybe we'll get lucky. I'm not doing it because I hoped to influence them. I'm doing it because I want to show the kinds of things that I think make an army book interesting or good. Especially for this book, which is like the most, in my opinion, it should be the most super Timmy book in the meta. And that's very much where I live. I mean I even wore my shirt today for it. I wore my Attack of the 50 Foot Woman shirt, so I'm ready to go. Very I'm on brand for fun giant action. Ultimately one of my problems with the book is that it has too many rules that do too little and it presents a huge pseudo-narrative dissonance. These giants are supposed to be these catastrophes that run around and smash things and aren't afraid of anything. And they're not that. They're not that at all. Their damage is like okay. Gatecrashers can be pretty good. Sure. The Gatebreaker can do damage, but yeah. The other two are basically worthless in combat. And even the Gatebreaker, if put under sufficient penalty, will still fall apart, right? Yeah, it's amazing how little that does against Nighthaunt with a appreciator at their back. Obviously. I mean, Suns are just terrible against Nighthaunt. Yes. That's the new Nighthaunt book has got to be Sun's worst match out of a host of bad matches. Yeah. You overpay for all the rend everywhere. You get damage sapped out of you. And by the way, your base is how big? How many models can I fit? How many units can I charge? Yeah, it's 100 or no rounds so you can charge everything and give every penalty. I think I tackle some of that, but not all of that. I mean, we want them to still have some harder or softer counters. Now, despite my actual inclinations, I'm going to stay within the general design frame that they laid out. Sure. Like in their world giants are these big dumb monsters. They're not cool like most other giants silly fairy tale giants of England. Hey, people in England. Look, I love you guys. You're great. You do realize that nobody else likes the way you consider giants. Your silly Fififo Fum beanstalk crap can take a hike. Everybody else in the world has cool giants. Okay. Like whether it be frost giants or D&D giants or like the really scary like horror giants coming out of the east like the Philippines and several other Southeast Asian countries. There are some really amazing conceptions of what giants are like. None of them are dumb. Her, her, Fififo Fum, I get drunk giants. It's the worst concept. Think outside your comfort zone slightly. So that's just a general thing. But the sculpts are the sculpts. So we'll get to that in a second, right? And the goal is to create a more active play style and melee force limited by the fact that they're walking monsters with a limited board presence and no chaff. That will always be their restriction, right? It's four units. That's what you got on the board, basically. Okay. Oh, yeah. Thank you. Chris mentioning Attack on Titan giants. Sure. Another like absolute horror show that's way more interesting. Yes, thank you. Okay, great. I mean, there's so many cool giants out there that aren't that aren't this. But anyways, assumptions, guiding principles. Tom, I want to know if you disagree with any of these. Here we go. Ready? Yep. I'm going to mostly assume the same models are available mostly. IE, I'd love to completely rewrite these things and assume I just like didn't have to care about the fact that the sculpts exist as the sculpts do, but they do. There are simply the models that we have. I can't like write a giant that is just completely orthogonal and has completely different weapon kit outs and is expected to be doing something insane. Yeah. I want to create new options of additional play styles or at least paths to victory. There are limitations here but we can push because obviously it is just dudes. It's four units of guys, like one guy or three guys. So there's not a lot we can do. The models will all remain around 500 points. Like I'm not actually going to actively point these things because I don't it doesn't actually matter. You know, you're going to put some a little below 500, a sum a little above 500 so that you can't have too many of a certain type in an army. And that's it. But you've got four units. Regardless, you have four units. You're going to balance it so you can do four units. That's what this comes down to. And this will be a lower synergy army. We can't afford to make the models worth too much more than what's on their war scroll because they're already so big and so powerful theoretically. We can't also do synergies ramping them up. They need to be very sort of solo kind of operators, minor synergies, but nothing more. All right. How do you feel about my assumptions here? No, I think they're good. Like so one thing about the synergies traditionally you do synergies because you need to in order to make it them worth more than the sum of their parts because you worry about some of those parts being taken into other things for allying well in general you don't have that here. Right. And so I just want to kind of put a pin on that that like the lower synergy nature of it has to do with the very character of how these things are pointed and how large they are. Yep. Yep. Exactly. What's the thing you feel like I missed? Uh... Yeah. Okay. What'd I miss? It needs to be fun. Oh sure. No, it's a good one. I mean, yeah, I said it's fun on the last page, but you're right. That's absolutely that's a great assumption. What we're doing is fun, but when I see giants like it needs to the play style needs to feel like playing with monster trucks. And other big, you know, big toys. Like it needs to feel like big stompy and they're just so that as you said this should be the most timmy of armies. Yep. That's what this should be doing. Right. It's a race of can I can I move my big toy and take off more of your little toys before you take off my big toy. Yep. Agreed. And that like to me that has to be felt in the actual play of the game of the army itself. Cool. Cool. I count as 30 models so I'm going to stand here. Right. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely correct. Yeah. The incentive shouldn't be to stand still and not fight. Your giants. Get out there. Get swinging. Right. Okay. Let's get right into it. Here we go, Tom. Alright. We're going to start off with the rewritten allegiance abilities. Okay. Yep. Alright. Just making my notes time stamps. Cool. Conquerors. Let's first of all I'm changing the name mightier makes rightier or whatever that stupid name is because it's dumb. It's a dumb name. You can call it something else besides conquerors. I don't care but but this is my word. It's just it's not going to be called mightier makes rightier anymore. Stupid. And I'm very angry about it. Okay. I mean it's like you know noobs mentioned the whimsy of the army. Like I like the whimsy of that name. You can have some silliness going on that emerges but like when it's might makes right on the ogres I get it mightier makes rightier what are they like does every giant have to be a complete moron they're just giant humans. Why when humans get big would they get stupid. Cloud giants are brilliant storm giants are brilliant fire giants are industrious you know things frost giants from from traditional like Norse mythology are schemers and brilliant like all of these things aren't dumb okay sorry I just their brains are bigger. Sure I mean which doesn't doesn't necessarily translate to anything but yes it's not about the size of the meat it's about the number of neural pathways but and the various and sundry components that you have in there at any rate I would accept large and in charge by the way Brian sure absolutely or takers also fine we could we could call it anything but just and I say that just simply because like that's a lot of what the lore is about right like they're often like taking stuff and stuffing in bags and kicking objectives and all that other BS and so there's this yeah yeah some of that's going away but yes I know okay I understand the hence why the name is appropriate here right uh so the number of this is sort of the most important thing I wanted to do and and here's how I decided to do this now I think when they rewrite this they're just going to do the wrong thing okay they will get this wrong and I know they will get this wrong because they got this wrong on Cragnos and I think that's that he's a preview of what we're going to you're saying the scaling the scaling the value of the of the yeah yep they'll put the amount you count as on the wound chart which which I understand it seems like the most logical thing to do okay yeah but that's the smooth brain uh not considering secondary incentives version yes yeah okay yeah because that makes the incentive not to fight even worse yeah because knowing the more I get wounded the more the less I count as means now I want to retreat from every fight I want to avoid every fight I never want like I'm never going to charge you if I don't have to because why would I why would I risk taking wounds right right right unless unless you know you're going to lift their unit unless I know I can just lift you yes exactly yeah like fight only in the most minimal risk situations yes bad incentives okay that's what that scaling down chart creates if you want to see Giants fight even less and stand even more put the put that put their model objective counting on their wound chart okay which is what they will probably do and it will be wrong and I will say it's wrong when it happens yep but here we are agreed mine is sons of bad about units count as double their base number their monster so they count as five like it doesn't matter like I they count as 10 if they successfully come I'm not writing this all in like rules text by the way this would take an entire development passive rules text I'm writing this for ideas yes if they successfully completed a charge that turn they count as triple so 15 if they destroyed an enemy unit in combat so if you're not charging and not destroying units you can easily be outnumbered on an objective right you're five right you're just right right so that very heavily incentivizes you to get in the mix right it also to do work what I also like about it is how it interplays with enemy chaff because a lot of times because this army doesn't have chaff right and so incentive might be to chaff them to protect your your good units right but now by throwing up chaff in front of them you actually feed them and let them like pick up your chaff and immediately go to 15 right right it would be it would be in it's it's not applying through any turn it's in that turn like when you like when you come to check objectives Brian s you would look at these two gates and say did you complete either of these these turn now obviously you're not charging in off turn and you know barring some very unusual situation so the charging could only happen in your turn well and what you would destroy your turn what that says is that in your off turn it's easy to steal objectives from you yeah sure which is not treat away from you which is not surprising right like because that's like defending defending points on the battlefield not a giant specialty right but taking them is right right exactly like people could retreat away from you and sap your ability to contest yeah but even like in this framework even in your in their turns if they're standing there fighting you you're down to five immediately yeah sure unless you lift their yes unless you lift their unit sure that's right yeah because you can obviously lift their unit in their turn but it but like we've seen in the night hot book where it's like very strong on its turn but can have some bad punchback off turn you know and several other books it makes it so the game feels this like push back and forth go so they're really good at taking objectives right because you bring like two giants in you lift a unit or something boom right yeah suddenly you've got 30 on an objective you probably hold it right you're quite strong at taking yeah but holding you're much weaker against right they can people can come in on you and swarm you or surround or just you know whatever whatever but by doing so they're bringing other units into range for you to then go charge and fight and start counting as more so we get this natural tempo to the game that the rule is encouraging like this rule is the most important rule in the book because everything flows from this right uh like the more you're an active player you know participating in the back and forth play of the game giving a good game yes the stronger you are rules wise that's you want to see those incentives align yeah right is you want to push people you want people to feel incentivized to do the thing you want them to do right right yeah the worst armies are those that like where all the incentives are to not fight to not engage just like do dumb crap yeah okay it's why I like I understand why and there's by the way there is some section of psychographic profile of Johnny that loves just futzing with people the whole game and never actually playing yeah playing denial I saw one of our fun legion of the first Prince players in here recently and you know that's that play style and that's fine I'm not saying like that that play style shouldn't exist I get it why it does it should be sequestered and whatever whatever it's it's fine as it exists and shot in the head but a lot of people don't really love it playing against it it's frustrating it's not well so so here's the deal what we're talking about is for those that are familiar with magic it's like blue counterspell right the difference is this in magic you're gonna sit down and play maybe a 20 minute game of do nothing in war hammer you're gonna sit down for a three hour game of do nothing of do nothing of I play roll dice yeah that's that's not acceptable right um and so that's why I think it's a problematic play style in general yep alright next up speaker of behemoth uh you may choose a single mega gargant in your army that is not your general this model gains the priest keyword okay uh uh so flaming pole like I said yes they they often will want to get away from you just return to this real quick but that's okay them running away from you right if they don't think they can kill you is reasonable people already have incentive to retreat their units if they don't think they can kill you like well not if you aren't retreating from something you think you're gonna die to I don't know what you're doing but but but not only that like it's like it's in like the versimilitude aligns there's a right you're retreating from this terrible monster yeah right absolutely and the game is incentivizing them to engage and attack the objectives right so even if they're afraid of the monster like the game itself in order to win the incentive is for them to engage the game because they won't win if they just run away yes and so you know there you go okay so speaker bammott you can turn a mega gargantt into a priest I feel like this is just a needed thing um priests are cool uh I didn't create a priest prayer lore for this intentionally um I feel like the universal prayers like you'll get a universal they're basic yeah they're basic they're just priests like they don't need their own special prayer lore or prayer whatever they're called um they've got the two they'd have blessed and smite and then the choice out of the universals fine sure great cool like it's something it opens up some other doors right it's interesting it has you doing something in the hero phase one of my what are the one of the most odd things about playing this army is that you do basically nothing in the hero phase you know you like you could have an arcane tome you pick your sure you pick your battle attack like it sort of if you don't have an arcane tome you pick your battle tactic you do a heroic action and then you go and then you move right like you just there's just nothing going on and I'm not looking for a zinch like hero phase here or or somewhere you know lumineath hero phase I don't want that that's too that's bad in the other direction but let's give them a little something yeah let's let's let's let's let's let's let them roll a die and have a thing happen wouldn't that be neat yeah it's also fun because they're like not an army that is primed to take advantage of curse right right right so they can do a little with curse softly like if they run babies then curse can be a fun prayer because babies swing with 10 club attacks each so you got 30 club attacks which is like pretty decent going into a cursed unit um and they there's no like nonbow there which is a soft incentive over to babies given how good curses right which is something else we want to see in the army more of just like not all megas please right so this encourages a little bit more of a mixed force and I have that kind of spread around as well yeah soft incentives soft incentives right yeah absolutely uh confidence in triumph there's a really good story in the sun's book about how the sun's about that explains how night haunt work I don't know if you've ever read this but it's a cool story I haven't so like how does your ethereal why can like in D&D if you swing a weapon at a ghost nothing happens unless that weapon is magical right indeed yep okay that's not the case in the mortal realms alright yeah because isn't it like confidence or certitude or like yes exactly yes everybody's like gladiator the X-men yeah like you're like willing willing the you know the the things slaying happen yes correct if you believe you can kill these things you can right and in the story the giants are just like routing these ghosts they're just smashing them time and time again because they're not scary to them they're like oh these little tiny little tiny wispy wispy ethereal things are no different to them than tiny solid things right like they're just tiny things yeah it's like attacking the the ocean like the waves the swarm just parts before you yeah and so until lady olander shows up like get so enraged with this that her forces are getting decimated yeah that she shows up and terrifies one of the mega gargants to death basically like stares it down okay and once that stomp loses and has the fear put in them that they can be beaten yeah okay then it spreads like wildfire through all the other stomps right and they aren't as successful against night haunt until they regain their confidence there's like a there's a fighting montage basically and then they regain their confidence but anyways so I mean I mean that is that's how night haunt works too because if you didn't know like you just have to believe in your dice if you believe in your dice you'll roll your ethereal safe right like that should that's how it works yeah I mean it's just science folks there we go so I thought playing on that confidence would be fun like they're sure they're going to win because they're giant their giants they believe they're better than everybody else or whatever right right that they're the alpha predator so sons of them up may always use their selected triumph regardless of the points differential of the armies if additional triumphs are selected enhancement they must be lower points to use them as normal so basically when you pick your triumph you always get to use your triumph yeah that's neat I just thought it was a fun little thing right to represent their their sort of confidence in their in their abilities and then finally a new heroic action a hero may use this heroic action instead of any other blah blah blah like all like all normal heroic actions it's basically choose a single unit of man crusher gargants within some range I'm not sure what that range would be but you know some some range right they may retreat in charge until the end of this turn yeah I mean so I like I see this heroic action and that's nice that's fine I'm gonna take the mic from me for a moment though go for it I I actually am of the mindset and you might hate this is that I think that they should always be able to retreat this is for the babies well to the big ones I rewrote them so they can the little ones can't though because I think that makes sense that's just the little ones that's fair okay yes just as I they should just be able to walk away from non big things which is how I rewrote that ability to work yes we'll get there but yes correct because you're absolutely right they should act like imperial knights and just leave yes because what are you going to do yeah right walk away so this allows you to apply a little bit of that ability to your man crushers to get them out of the fight they don't want to be in right in a similar fashion effectively like I picture it as the the mega gargant like bellowing at the unit and throwing them off for a second so that the man crushers can walk away and go fight something else right something like that yeah um and so yeah this is giving a little bit more maneuverability interest to the army to let them kind of be a little more responsive rather than just like I walk forward if I stand yeah okay cool so those are your new allegiance abilities there we go in my estimation those seem better are they the best possible version of this no I'm sure that I could do better if you gave me more weeks and Tom and I put our heads together for you know that time and Tyler and other big sons of ammo players but but I feel like this is definitely a this would produce an interesting selection of options sure and we can already see how I'm trying to open up new place it's a nice toolbox yeah yeah yeah absolutely but not too synergistic yes okay uh yes it's a heroic action you use that's correct uh alright so here we go uh sub factions guess what I'm completely destroying I am demolishing like a gargant smashing a building I am demolishing the uh the entire way that the current book is built I hate it stupid I'm throwing in the trash alright no more like if your stompa is a general it's if you're in stompa tribe and we need three different lists of command traits and three different lists of items and different abilities and wacky stuff the war stomper with six useless stupid command abilities and no no no no no taker tribe suddenly counting as 30 all of that no no silly fierce low things all of that's in the bin just throw it in the sun into the sea with you okay it's all gone the hero or a hero uses it so the babies can't be heroes would be one of the megas commanding them uh so instead we're just going to do sub factions folks this is a perfectly fine technology there's no reason not to use it it works let's just do this we've got 3.0 sub factions let's just put them to work okay it's more fun because then we can actually have cool stomps by the way the name of these sub factions is not stomps the name of these sub factions are what everybody else calls them okay which is catastrophes in the lore that's what you call a gathering of of gargants the stomp is what they call themselves because they're too stupid to pronounce multisyllabic words get out of here with that it's ridiculous catastrophes now we're talking which catastrophe are you playing sounds amazing so Thandia's terror I figured there's a lot of mega-gargants hanging out in Thandia it's one of the places they do in Gur let's just use some of the lore here this is your monster killer one because that's what Thandia is all about so mega-gargants gain plus one to wound versus enemy monsters and are immune to monsters rampages nice Tom yeah it's simple and straightforward which is exactly what a sub faction should be right now this is what I like about this is it's not always immediately putting you like some of the wounds for mega-gargants especially are already on twos so it's just acting as a penalty to wound or sorry a counter a buffer sometimes it is making a difference this one is the only one that's sort of only mega-gargant incentive because I feel like that should still be a way to play it just needs to be like not the way to play we want incentives the other direction so that's that one kill fun monsters cool stuff death eaters this comes out of the lore as well there's a really fun story about gargants who live in Shai-ish and I just really liked it and the image of them they're surrounded by spooky spooky ghosts and stuff yep and eating corpses yeah yeah sure so whenever a death eater unit destroys an enemy destroys an enemy unit they may heal d3 wounds if the enemy unit destroyed was a monster or had 10 or more models instead heal d3 plus 2 wounds again you got to get in the fight right stacks well onto the the basic how you actually take control of objectives encourages you to keep fighting gives you a little bit of healing there you go sky titans huh yeah calling back to old warhammer fantasy days I assume these are the smart ones because the canon that the ogres drive around they stole that technology from because ogres are apparently far too dumb to make a canon like it's the most complicated technology in the world they stole all that from sky titans because apparently I don't know what this weird human supremacy is that as soon as you get taller than 6 feet you become a moron yep but here we are anyways increase the range of all missile weapons used by sky titan gargants so megas and babies by 6 inches in addition all such models gain plus 1 to hit with missile weapons so let's say you want to go with a little bit more of a a little bit more of a ranged play shooting army let's not be crazy here but it opens the door to have a little bit more action on your ranged play cool thoughts I mean this is obviously fully dependent upon how you would change the profiles well we'll see I did okay and then finally madrog's mob which might be an existing character name or not I just made it up but I think it might be a person that exists I don't know I wanted this to be about babies this is your baby faction friendly man crusher gargant units always count as being within 12 inches of a mega gargant for the purposes of keep up that's the thing that lets them run in charge yep as long as at least one mega gargant is alive on the battlefield okay so as long as you got one like so this is the army where it's the more pressure focused ones as long as one mega is alive all your little babies can run in charge in addition man crusher gargants gain plus one two attack plus one attack that should say not two attack plus one attack with the ed butt and mighty kick attacks which are the things they currently only have one of yeah right so it gives them two attacks just still not like incredible but it's something on their neat higher rend higher damage attacks your clubs are normally just a bunch of swings for one damage so and there you go those are my four things a mega incentive one a baby incentive one a momentum one and a ranged one place house I don't know what to say I mean that's pretty good for the range we have and this is my point you can actually develop different incentives and play styles even with only four models right like it's not we're not this isn't rocket science okay again are these perfect no of course not they would need development work and all of that but do they seem more interesting I think so yeah yeah because like you could you're developing your type of army then not just because my general happens to be this thing this is apparently how I play now and and it's derivative at best okay alright cool you ready for some command traits Tom you excited about command traits always always okay one list Tom we have one list okay that's it keep it tight one list one less six command traits one list of six artifacts uh so let's talk about those monstrously tough we'll keep it I don't hate it it's fun it's the plus five wounds thing sure cute it's fine in any other book it'd be amazing in giants you're like okay it's fine it does what it says on the tin right um tower of intimidation is a slightly altered version of one that exists but effectively enemy units that are within three inches are neg one to hit in melee sure sure I mean if we can give stupid mount traits out that are like neg one to hit on a on a mount I feel like we can do this as a general command trait even since it's like the although all the didn't didn't I don't get a neg one to wound to units when they're within three inches I believe they have an item and they have they have an item that does that yeah and then one of the units does a base yeah the executioner yeah spoilers putting it on a hero or on an artifact is better than being on a command trait is in general you don't want your general state having this have to stand there right uh eager for the fight is another one that I borrowed from the um from the existing book charge three six inches and declare charges of the inches this is a war stomper command trait people probably don't know that because whoever plays war stomper other than me um but I think it's awesome I love the idea of being able to have a fast giant fun stuff okay so yes that is correct uh a Johnny Andrew Johnny is somebody who wants to express something namely often their intelligence or who likes lists and combos and stuff like that uh Timmy wants to experience something and usually likes like big monsters and big experiences and big dice uh Johnny wants to express something intelligence or cleverness or a cool list or an unusual you know making an unusual unit good and spike wants to win win that's that is a bit unfair to spike but that's the simplest way to say it okay alright number four civilizations end when attacking a unit that is garrisoned this general gains plus one to damage and may ignore the neg one to hit in addition garrisoned models attacked do not gain the benefit of cover also you may re-roll the dice for the smash to rubble monsters rampage I love this one I just love it like when I conceptually think about what's happening here it's amazing mm-hmm like the flavor and what is um in the versimilitude of what's being expressed like this one by far is my favorite good I'm glad that's awesome to hear yeah I had to layer on the stuff to make it worth it right because because people can just not garrison right right you know right and so like you want to make it bad enough that you strip that ability away from them right right right you know so like KO and their boats just won't want to get in their boats because the boat offers no protection anymore right right and in fact it's worse it's just flat worse right because when a giant club hits a boat the boat crumbles right so um so yeah that's what that one's doing uh wall of flesh this model counts as obscuring terrain but any line drawn to the model when determining the line of sight only needs to pass across the base instead of through three inches of the base effectively that what your general blocks line of sight he's just a giant thing so other things can stand behind him and he blocks line of sight I just thought it was a neat concept like of course he would he's a giant like how are you shooting a thing on the other side of him he's huge right so I just thought that one was fun uh and then big bellower this general is immune to the roar uh monsters rampage and may issue a command once per battle round without a command point being spent so easy simple yep yep cool there you go one of the things I thought this will let me open up a slight conversation about something that I kind of I'm exploring a little bit in here is since I can't synergistically buff them because they um because they'll get too strong like instantaneously if they get more buffs beyond sort of what the basic things on offer are in the game so those are very limited and controlled right like you're you can pop your triumph you can auto attack like that standard stuff there's not a lot of generic ways you're getting big buffs here and so I thought the more interesting way to explore was having resistance was opening up the door for resistance to other people's debuffs okay um where they right and it also makes sense like they're so big they're so strong they're so tough the normal things that would give like minus one to hit and wound or something or slow their movement it's just not going to work against these guys right like it's not there's not enough there there's not enough magic to make that happen to something of this size yeah right that was the general concept and I'm exploring that a little here like becoming immune to roar that kind of stuff yeah yeah all right uh so two items I kept the crack and eater sandals and the club of the first oak so that everybody remembers the crack and eater sandals are the things that make your like stompy stomps on the crack and eater pretty good because they go to like ren 3 and damage 3 and stuff like that so they're good they're perfectly fine like offensive weapon they have a decent impact on a decent attack on that model so that's other cool and obviously they'd be crack and eater only club of the first oak is the fun wacky when tom where like when you suffer your last wound you can roll a die and on a four up you don't die you have you stay at one wound super fun it's a complete like it is a very timmy artifact for the time you roll it it's very not spike but you gotta have those fun artifacts in there too totally yep uh the excelsis excelsis however you say it gate flail so this is the upgrade for the gate breaker after the results of bellicor where giants invaded and attached attacked excelsis I thought it'd be cool to have a magical artifact one of them one of them got the gate yeah one of them got the gate and tied it under the end of a chain right and that's now his weapon I just thought that was a cool idea and because because the walls of uh excelsis excelsis had been warded like remember against enemy magics and that was part of bellicor's whole plan blah blah blah blah whatever I thought it'd be neat if basically this model cannot suffer penalties to hit or wound right so that ward that anti-magic ward is still there and now protecting the giant that was a neat sort of narrative hook to what happened in bellicor yeah I could see it okay uh alright um the god slayer shard it just sounds like a super cool thing I suppose uh choose a single weapon on this model's profile once per game at the start of the combat phase you may activate this weapon if you do so that weapon has a rend of neg five for that combat phase let's just go all the way let's get nuts let's get super nuts uh in addition during that combat phase any rule of six to wound deals a mortal wound in addition to normal damage so um kind of that kind of like the same design space as the destroyer yep right like we kept making a fun once per game artifact when you want to have a big turn yeah okay uh siege armor this model is neg one to be hit by missa weapons in addition this model is immune to any ability that triggers on a six to hit from a missa weapon so effectively just like the um uh the armor that the idk boss gets right turns off but this is just for missa weapons so you can't mortal wound them ironically uh I'm pretty sure that sentinels would still get around this since they're triggered on five yeah since they could trigger on fives yep so that it just means that uh it just means that when they re-roll they're fishing for fives instead of sixes now right exactly um but it would stop obviously like you know salamander mortal wounds and um uh what I want to say um long strikes and and jucators and stuff like that right so cool seemed like a fun thing to put on one to put on one guy uh oh yeah yeah also called suck it cruel boys and realm lords yes indeed um and then finally wind boots I needed another name but I was like whatever they're wind boots I couldn't think of another fun name but this model gains plus three inches to its move characteristic in addition when this model runs the minimum distance it runs is four inches yeah wind boots is a terrible name um I don't it needs to be something like uh uh well this is an artifact I think I came up with three pretty good names I got to the fourth one and I was like nah I'm out clip 50 um it should be something like uh uh no so so my gut was to call back to do you remember how like giants used to keep herds of squigs okay like do you remember squigs yeah or something doing something tying to the like uh uh nope nope Michael Coase got it sorry he's got it Michael quick stomp us that's what it there we go there it is we'll do we'll do the there it is nailed it nailed it Michael you got it thank you crowd crowdsource that one but that was good okay fun um that that one might need a little more like on development you're probably like that's not one's quite as good as the rest of them but it's okay sure it's fun I'm I like I'm sensitive to how much we play with movement in this army I want to have some I want to have play with movement as a potential like path you can go down but I don't want them to be just like zipping around the board part of their limitation again is that so there's like nothing in here that would make them fly never sure right you don't sure that's not that's not appropriate I also didn't carry over things like the little necklace that but the little earring or whatever that makes you a wizard because you can just take the arcane tone for that there's no reason for that thing we don't need multiple paths to wizard them right and you're already getting a priest so there you go like I don't want them flying um so because it's it's like they already can step over most things yeah right yeah um so yeah fly like actually making them flying which is make them too powerful okay but there's probably another little little judge we could give that right um like maybe it also lets you re-roll the damage if you use the stomp monstrous uh rampage or something like that all right we ready for war scrolls okay I'm ready for this silliness these are these are uh pre tom development war scrolls normally when I design these things tom has to go back in and like do development to rain me in but there's no raining me in today baby what you may end up seeing is some of this development process on air as I as I engage his uh his silliness and I welcome that I welcome because this is meant to be a design draft this isn't meant to be final right you would never you don't write a book in one shot you go through a formal process right and by the way audience I certainly welcome any thoughts or feedback you have there's been some great ideas so far in the in the chat so awesome stuff okay let's see your development pass here we go the boom new model new new war scroll that's right king now we can call this whatever I just gave him the generic name I don't care this is the generic version of the the hero let me explain why I created this thing one because it should exist just let's just start there and two because this army is lacking a level explain time in a normal army you've got sort of like dumb dumps you've got elite dudes of which like foot heroes are a part of so just kind of your elite infantry and foot heroes and your five to six wound elite or three to seven wound sort of infantry mounted calf stuff right and then you've got big heroes right these are like your dudes on monsters or something like that right yep this army doesn't have that it's only got two levels yep so by the way this guy would not have any ability to become battle like like the other megas sure sure sure okay so at any rate king gargant so this dude 35 wounds four up save nine bravery let me talk about some generic things I did to the scroll I upped the entire army's bravery one point I hate that megas are bravery seven it drives me completely insane they're in the stories they're supposed to be supremely confident of their abilities because they're these giant unstoppable monsters called catastrophes and here they are basically with the same bravery as a human with a flag okay yep yep unacceptable they should be bravery eight base the king is bravery nine okay cool sure I did not mess with any of their wounds or their armor save nobody in this army will ever have a three up save we cannot let anybody in this army go to a three up save base as a characteristic that is just that would just be awful just awful awful to play against I also moved them all to the four step wound chart as opposed to the five step chart let's talk about the generic abilities that are going to see repeated and that I did here before we get into this guy specific stuff crushing charge I kept exactly the same perfectly fine rule long shanks when this model makes a normal move it can ignore models that do not have the monster keyword even when within three inches of such models such a move does not count as a retreat it cannot finish the move on top of another model or within three inches of an enemy model they can just walk out of combat effectively like like Titans or like the writers of ruin the blood type ability right it's not a retreat and so importantly things that stop retreats don't shut this off yeah right so if you don't allow retreats the giant doesn't care you can just walk away like you're not stopping him from walking away right yeah just walk away okay so that's how I changed that but I also cut out the terrain ignoring thing yeah and that was purposeful because I actually don't love the ability of them just like stepping over terrain that's on the board it's weird and it causes a lot of problems into balancing the model and whatever whatever part of the pushback I'm going to create with this army here is making them play the board they're people who walk around on foot right so if there's impassable if there's big terrain yeah you got to go around it that's part of the drawback to the army yeah and like from a versimilitude standpoint like when you watch movies what gets the giant every time is running in the little corridor right every time terrain is what's every time yeah because like they like reach in right like that's like aesthetically like that's part of what dealing with giants is is using terrain to run away yep every time every time so yes terrain will stop them and it makes terrain impactful on the game it makes it so they do have to pay attention to you know to to to alleys of availability and stuff like that how do gargants become playable with tables choked with tons of terrain I honestly I'm not worried about that world elect man I've never seen such a table like I would love to see the table that looks like that but every tournament even like even ACO ACO had some pretty full tables but what eight nine pieces probably yeah not nine pieces per table yeah perfectly fine and they were not small pieces either you can easily walk around there and still have fights right like don't want to incentivize them to stop on train sure those problems like there was a moment where I was pretty sure in order for the like bone tied nexus to go down like we just had to straight remove pieces because there was there was too much train on the table which is a great feeling yeah I mean you know if it turned out to be some massive problem because there's like so much terrain that they can't even fight anyone which I like objectives shouldn't be on terrain in a standard map so they can always go on the objectives so I'm not sure like where the concern is like people fight over objectives which aren't on terrain which is where the giant wants to go to fight you so yeah seems fine son of a mod I kept the same it's just like they can't be slain outright they just take d6 stuff like that I made a small change to timber I wanted to make it so when the giant falls you just get to do the wins I wanted to do that Tom okay her sure but I restrained myself okay yeah and and instead the controller of the slain model wins ties sure it makes because currently right now if you tie you didn't win so you don't get to decide yeah which is awful and dumb because the odds are actually against you to get to decide where your stupid giant falls it's your model you should get to decide right the odds should at least be in your favor to have fun with your toys right all right so that's that those are those are the generic changes I made across the army all right his specific rules is biggest boss friendly man crush a gargantz man crush a gargantz whatever yeah within 12 inches of this model have a bravery characteristic of nine such a minor thing but I'm doing it for a reason I'm doing it so the pack of three no longer has if they're near him they don't actually flee from battle shock yes which can actually happen right now right or at least under normal circumstances assuming no massive bravery penalties right yeah makes sense because they're around the king so of course they're not going to run yeah I don't love the idea of giants running due to battle shock ever but this is that and then catastrophe walking this model may never have its move characteristic reduced by any command ability spell prayer and the spell invocation or similar ability he gets to go where he wants yeah I would just change that to effect but I understand that sure that's fine it's like ability or yeah mm-hmm yeah because what they're gonna I mean so either say ability yeah like it's just weirdly redundant but I understand what you're getting at here yeah I'm just trying to say like none of it stop it he gets to move his move right because again he's the how how about you just say may never have the move characteristic reduced yeah sure that would be probably the easiest way to go about it yet because there is I did think of a reason why that would become extremely problematic oh the wound table well sure then I would need to write the exception then that like as per the wound characteristic on the wound table may never be reduced yes yes yeah yeah so anyways yes you're right that's the better way to write that and then finally this guy has a command ability the one command ability army because that's what we do now we write one command ability right you get an army you get one command ability great here we go rampage you may use this command ability at the end of the charge phase all gargant models on the battlefield that have successfully completed a charge this turn may utilize any monstrous rampage even if another model has already used that monstrous rampage this does not allow one model to complete a monstrous rampage more than once so so everybody can who charged you had to have completed the charge right you can't sure combat you can stop you can roar you can smash a rubble you know knowing the rest of your design seeing this one I think there's a missed opportunity somebody made a comment in the comments you know ten to two minutes ago and I want to tease that out I think there's a missed opportunity here what I would have done differently is I would love to see each war scroll have a unique monstrous action okay each of these war scrolls kind of bring their own flavor in the monstrous action like phase like they can do the other things right sure but I would be awesome if they could also do their own special like maybe that's one way that you tease out the flavor and so a great a great for the king gargant would be like his his what's the ability the and um his roar right affects an area like booming voice or something like that right or yeah yeah or so when he roars he shuts off the ability for units within nine to use a command ability or something you can affect multiple units of the roar or something yeah you can just do like every unit within three of them instead of just one sure and so the whole point being that he is the your commander right and so he's like like so talking about rather than doing synergy what you're doing is you're flipping it on its head and you're reducing synergy from enemies I like that it's a good idea Tom so that's a really good idea okay cool I dig that um Brian said oh and he should be called the Emperor Titan because it'd be funny that is very funny uh Electman said two questions first how many points I don't know around 500 is the answer probably on the probably on the upper side like of the whole thing again everybody's around 500 515 you know everybody's around 500 you get four units that's what it comes down to everybody's just around 500 points right yep yep um so you know he's something like that he has a good ranged attack decent enough at least you know like four attacks three threes neg two three damage sure fun ranged attack it's fine yep um and then he has his stomp he has his death grip uh a quality of life change I made here in general this is across all the giants um and yes he's not he's not battling um the like all the other Megas would retain their battling but he would not have that he would just be leader of the he myth yeah yep um all mighty stomp is now just flat two damage not D3 and death grip is D3 plus three not sit not D6 these are just quality of life changes to flatten out the damage on this stuff yeah I think you have him currently at just a D3 rather than D3 plus three you're you're I think you're looking at the first version I updated it because the war scroll builder doesn't let it doesn't let you do plus yeah yeah in it like I typed that in the little boxes and then when it generated the scroll it wouldn't let me do it so I had to put it on in I realized after that it didn't copy it over and so I had to like go back in with power point make tiny little plus threes or plus ones or whatever ridiculous and then he has a giant sword that six attacks threes twos neg three four if that sounds familiar to you it's cragnosis big attack yep see exact same stats his average damage is is pretty high you know it's not nothing it should be yeah this is the um oh how does he fit into the mercenary rules he wouldn't this guy doesn't mercenary he's the king of gargants the king is not a mercenary he does not go out and that's for the other guys right but like I said I don't you could we could literally take those mercenary rules and jettison them in the sun for all I care like that those mercenary rules are an attempt to sell more giant kits to other to other people because they weren't sure this army would have legs yep that's that's what those were okay so that's that guy alright next up crack and eater uh alright here's where we come to the next quality of life change as I mentioned they're all bravery eight other than that the sort of base stats the same um the they all have the same move Tom did you know that mega gargants have different move speeds for no reasons I do I do actually know that it's just like completely insane to me that I have to like remember which one's 12 which one's 11 and which one's 10 it's the stupidest thing funny story in uh they all have the exact same legs in night hot there are three different units riding ghost horses and all of them have different moves sure well no no no we went from 10 so we have 12 and 14 so we have 12 and 14 because of reason well the hero can move faster than the unit I'll buy that right because there's no you got a unit no no no no no it's a difference between one hero and another hero oh okay got it all right it's really that bad yeah thank you coach coach says yes and I hate it why does it exist coach I don't know I don't know coach it's stupid so I fixed it everybody now moves 12 11 10 8 there you go done done and dusted that's the move in the standards of modern AOS that's not even that fast okay it like it's it's fine it's fine okay here's the next thing I did the next thing I did other than all these guys have again the same changes cascading through with like long shanks and timber and all that is I you now have two attack profiles with your main weapon this again is not hidden technology I did not come up with this this originally existed other units do this yes well the fourth edition empire book for warhammer fantasy battles in which you could find the rules for sigmar to actually play him as a character on the table and I did I ran sigmar every game of course I did um he he had an option he could either like make a bunch of attacks with his giant club or he could do a single big smash there was like strength 10 and did multi damage right yep yep so guess what I I went ahead and went back to the the deep recesses of fourth edition or also by the way like almost every 40k melee weapon has this kind of an option for the for these big monsters or big big robots and stuff like that or as you mentioned yes plenty of like bladed lords have this you know this again this isn't me radically inventing new technology you can either smash or sweep everybody has either a smash or a sweep cool okay so uh when you smash uh you get much less attacks of four attacks threes twos neg three four damage or you can sweep where you get 10 attacks at threes threes neg two two damage so it's either power attack or cleave great exactly correct and I did run the damage calcs by the way on all of these as I was writing them to see how they would sort of stack and compare and it the numbers feel big the average damage for most of these it varies like obviously the higher rendwin with less attacks the way it averages out is better against lower damage or sorry lower save stuff right if that makes sense of course whereas the sweep is better against does more damage against worse higher yeah higher base I don't know whatever fours five sixes as opposed to threes and twos yeah save characteristics right and whenever you attack you choose one of the two profiles to attack yep yep tada checks out like there it is real tough there real tough okay I also changed get off me land on his in the enemy hero phase you may select a single unit that does not have the monster keyword that is within three inches of this model that unit must retreat if possible in the following movement phase in its next movement phase yeah it's next sorry yes I yes again I didn't write all these imperfect rules language but yes yep in its next movement phase more proper it actually isn't super great but it's tactically interesting um if you need somebody to retreat you can force them to retreat that kind of thing so like cool story man right yeah exactly like a lot of people want to end up retreating anyways but it's a thing you can do and it doesn't have like honestly I wanted to get rid of the objective kicking there's gonna be sure hate me for that but I like weird individualistic unique rules and it's fine the objective kicking in the end isn't the end of the world it's just weird I don't know what is being kicked there I don't know why any other monster in the game can't pick up the thing and fly away with it or whatever I don't know why this one giant has some weird ability to interact with the imaginary thing that we're fighting over okay and it just creates so many rules problems when you write battle plans because then you have to account for like what if this thing moves and what if I want to do this and like it just creates a cascade it's like so in the vice something that's being kicked where is that being moved exactly when it moves the next time yeah it's annoying to like it confuses people it's annoying to measure it causes like challenges to battle plan design it's just it's honestly a third rail we shouldn't be moving objectives around like that unless the battles plan specifically says to do so in which case it's going to give you an exact measurement on the board of where it then goes so yeah then we don't have to worry about like oh accidentally an objective was worth two points and now it's worth four points is that how it works you know just because of random kicking and just nonsense and I agree a Lechman you could totally like in Tom's idea you could totally rework that into an interesting monstrous rampage or something right if we went the right way yep oh small other change on him stuff him in Minet went from D3 enemy models to just three it's just three you already got to roll a die and get double their wound characteristic how about we just give him three months why am I rolling dice to roll dice let's just cut that kind of crap yeah okay yeah all right war stomper something that people normally don't play I do because I love him but anyways here we are again so the war stomper does not is the only one that doesn't have a range attack still I preserve that because I thought that was an interesting piece of design to have one without a range attack yeah yep and the what we added to so him his titanic boulder club has two different settings but his is much better against the big hordes so you can make three attacks at threes twos neg three five damage or 12 attacks at threes threes neg one two damage yeah so he's like clearly your guy meant for sweeping away low armor hordes yep right he still has hurled body that whole thing but I made it easier once you effectively kill the thing like once you've slain the model no more four up to throw it and deal the mortal wounds to up sure we already passed the hard gate let's not then put another 50 50 gate in there if I'm going to roll dice to roll dice let's at least make it you know more likely okay yep and then he's a stomping specialist as you might imagine because it says war stomper right there if this model uses the stomp monster rampage it deals d3 plus two mortal wounds instead of d3 it should be a d3 plus three but yeah I tried to restrain myself Tom because I knew I wouldn't have one of your development passes yeah a d3 plus three cool that's making more stompy yeah yeah so there you go like he's the good stomper guy no range attack wants to be in melee wants to be sweeping up hordes wants to be stomping on him so that's where your body's back into yeah fun magma dross get away with the same thing of d3 plus three good call so yeah that's him they all oh by the way another thing that's odd that I also changed that I should talk about for like quality of life stuff right now the giants for some reason have different numbers of stomps they all have two feet some move those feet better than others yes so I just gave them all the same number of stomps and it's all on the same wound chart and it all goes down the same weird again just like trying to make it easier to play like user friends gate breaker okay this is still your damage guy so the gate breaker is because he's your damage guy he doesn't have really much else in the way of special abilities he still can hurl the big boulder for four damage because I think it's super fun and like it's fun to throw that four damage rock any single ranged attack is basically worthless but it's still fun to throw a single giant four damage rock it's neat I would up that to five damage well I don't want to that was intentional about it okay okay I didn't do it because I don't want you to be able to whack five wound heroes in one hit see that's exactly where I disagree because I want this guy to ace a five wound hero I want to be like mmm that guy I get it I just think people would feel bad about it it's kind of like it just feels bad to me when it's like one ranged attack I hit I wound you failure save he's dead like on a hero I don't tend to love that experience on my side there's an amulet of destiny if you want to prevent it sure you get five dice sure people didn't love the catapult when it came out and did that I understand I mean I do I do I'm just saying like because it sets him apart from the other guys because I mean like kraken eater can basically do that with his three attacks or the king the king gargant could and in fact so like I don't know but when it's multiple attacks you feel like you're really multiple saves blah blah blah blah none of them have the rend he does either sure sure let's probably get minus one to hit so sure sure yeah that's all true that's all true I could see it going either way I kept it for see I feel like I was trying to be responsible here I mean again like this is a Timmy army man you gotta feel it you gotta feel it in your jibblies I feel it like their melee damage which is where you want them to ostensibly be mostly like I put in the range thing keep mind you got you do have the range option where you can you know be throwing these rocks a pretty good distance and getting plus one to hit and stuff like that so there's there's there's play there right counter out that look out sir if you're in sky titans yep so okay this this guy's got the big attacks so four crush a flail three attacks threes twos neg three six damage yeah it's just like big spiky damage but very spiky or the sweep which is 12 attacks four threes neg two d three plus one there you go sure sure and he has rubble maker when this model utilize utilize the smash to rubble monsters rampage they may re-roll the dice to determine if the train feature is demolished I guess I was kind of playing with the monstrous rampages you are you are it's funny it's I would love to see at least one or two unique ones but I think that I think that there's gas here in the way that you kind of teased you've explored incentivize each war scroll to want to do something different with their monster share pages yep okay and that's basically his only special ability because he's he's just a damage for sure right like that's what he's there for uh man crush a gargance as current plus rock throwing all the time I didn't even bother he write them they're fine they're fine like they die pretty easy because they're on a five up save their 36 wounds in a unit but they're on a five up save um so it's not hard to chop them down but they're also pretty damaging like they can do if they if they're sort of if they're unmolested if they're able to charge into a unit do like three times two up d three mortals and grab three people and stuff them in their bags and and then swing all their attacks like they they can do damage you know so like they're fine it's just let's not the rock throwing is completely insane that I have to have like a guy around who can be like hey throw rocks just like no giants throw rocks that's what giants do there you go yep it's just that's it that's literally the only change we need they now have the rock throwing profile integrated into their profile as shooting that's it there you go uh that's a good change as well coach I'm gonna go ahead and put that in I like that uh and three inch coherency boy is that a quality of life change just because my job all giants are like this like the model their arms are way out it's almost impossible to stack those guys next to each other yeah maybe two inch coherency I don't know something um they don't need extra bravery on their scroll that's why I put in the king to give them the extra bravery for there like if they're just running around alone fine they can sometimes be susceptible to battle shock all accept it but if you take the king they they don't they they go bravery nine and good stuff so there we go easy easy livin tom I've saved a fun thing for last okay I already paid it but go ahead named king if we're gonna have this new king gargantt we gotta have a named one we gotta have a unique character every other army gets unique characters I disagree I don't think it needs to be a king that's fine what is it I think it needs to be a named priest oh okay a named priest yeah yeah okay chat so let's leave it up to the chat we're gonna we're gonna all write this together folks here's what we're doing we're gonna do this last one together as a fun little as a fun little exercise because I want to talk through how this is done because yeah I think that there's a strong case for playing it because we've already teased the priest in the in the speaker of Bahama right king brood is just a normal giant so he's not big enough yeah why not both you can taco girl it be a priest king oh that's okay okay yeah I see where we're going here alright yeah are we taco girling this are we just making it both is that our first decision I don't see any reason why not to because again speaker of Bahama is the like what gives a model the priest keyword and so you can play with the voice the voice theme in the actual design of the war scroll um yeah priest with totem with the totem keyword that's that I would definitely start there and you can talk about uh uh there's so many different ways you go from a design standpoint all right let's do this let's do it let's call it named priest king okay we're gonna we're gonna do that we're gonna do this together here we go okay obviously this is just gonna be scratch rules like I'm not I'm not writing these out you know I'm not gonna make a war scroll okay sure yep okay um so obviously let's just get down the basics he's unique yep okay um he is a priest totem right and then all the other keywords as normal good uh Sean there is a priest base you get to nominate one mega who's not your general in the rewritten rules that I did to become a priest keyword so this would be like uh this would be basically allowing you to to lean into the priest theme in a bigger way okay yep so let's so let's talk about the basics do we need to change this guy's wheel at all off of the is he still 35 wounds same move same save yep yep same is he is he eight or nine bravery is he nine like the king okay he's nine he's nine yeah okay yeah 35 wounds same move uh four plus save and nine bravery okay cool got that bravery all right got it cool let's do that let's talk about this guy's attacks let's get this some simple stuff out of the way here what's this guy look like in melee roughly I um I like this so let's let's I like some of the things that are being bandied around so we'll give him like name we have to come up with this cool name name uh let's call him first son of behemoth cool that's a cool title for him okay keep going I mean I agree that he should definitely I think his his attack profile should be worse than everybody else's that feels right he should have like a kind of the low end attack profile yeah right yep not not like terrible it's just worse than the other giants yeah yeah he's not like here because he's the fighter he's here because of his voice he's here because he's the speaker right so then what does his quote unquote voice do is it associated with the um so it should induce terror like I think his booming voice should induce terror uh the king if you let's assume okay I assume we're building this out of the normal kit which I gave a sword that's why I said I mostly stuck to the kits I'm just assuming we're gonna find a giant sword somewhere and stick it on this guy basically like a bloodthirster action something like that so so this dude would also have to be the same thing he'd have like a cool sword or whatever the some weapon that's in that this kid I said I mostly stuck to the kids I cheated a little sure sure okay so keep going Tom I'm sorry what are his events so I think that he should have so we already have him as a totem um I think that he should have we played with command abilities that affect enemy units yet in third edition uh I feel like there's gotta be something out there but I it's challenging because that like like of the race you're making them receive something yeah yeah that's not good uh I think it I think you should have a debuffing a debuffing aura you said yes yeah and so and within X range maybe a variable uh it uh so here are some ideas I'm gonna pitch out some ideas brainstorm a little here we go let's chat pitch out some brainstorm ideas too I see some good things floating up here so what we could do in this in this uh booming voice right is you could do penalties like obviously there's some the standard stuff you could do uh you could you could prevent the receiving of command abilities sure you could prevent battle shock immunity as a whole sure uh you could reduce bravery in the in the aura as well so there are a lot of different options that uh that could um could work here as Brian has said you can make this aura by the way contingent upon a successful prayer sure that's I was just gonna go there I was just gonna go there right like that's exactly what I was thinking don't have this aura on all the time if he successfully prays then until your next hero phase like something like like let's say uh echoes of behemoth because it's because he's after praying the echoes that thunder uh thunder echoes of behemoth or something like that right it reverberates and it has a it has a supplemental effect beyond the prayer what's that whatever the wording is on the I would use the wording that's on the charnel throne since we put this contingent on a prayer so like units cannot benefit from anything that ignores battle shock or whatever you know whatever the again I'm not trying to write proper rules language yep yep uh within like 12 inches something like that feels reasonable yeah so he basically he can pitch out that charnel throne thing if he successfully prays that aura turns on as his booming voice echoes now does he have a unique prayer I think so I think he should I think this should be actually the dude with the unique prayer because you know you're not going to ever have like this is your way to get it you take this model right right right so what does that prayer do it's a great question okay well he's the big he's like this he's like the the first son the speaker we should call this like first son daughter sure sure why not um okay that coach says what about the yohan kit why aren't we getting to use that as a war scroller ability that's the real question it's a great call coach we can return to that alright so the the prayer um the uh what what what does his prayer do so the normal way we would you often try to structure prayers right is as a synergistic bonus you know you think of like the prayers people like to use catechism murder stuff like that we don't want to do that right because that that goes against the whole synergy thing okay yeah it so it needs to affect your enemy troops and hinder their capabilities sure or would protect you from negatives that would be another way to go okay where it's not a direct buff it's a it's a hedge against negatives like that could that could be the case as well right um I have one okay go for it pitch me your prayer just brian s said uh a damaged prayer like just just a straight up like he shouts and cracks the earth okay cool that's a cool idea uh so this so uh what about a prayer that shuts off now this is super gamey and I need to think about what what this is actually communicating but that shuts off word saves for enemy units within nine it's so funny because I was thinking kind of the same thing I was going to make it bigger and say reduce yeah word saves by one like nope nope to no I would say nope just penetrate like penetrating uh penetrating whispers or something like that and uh yeah just enemy enemies within nine inches of the speaker cannot cannot make word saves it's cool it is very gamey I'm not sure what's happening there is my biggest problem you know I honestly don't or or what about catastrophe realized okay here we go all right we're getting somewhere yeah uh catastrophe given voice or something like that right where you're talking about just the raw power of that and I realized like it's breaking things around it yeah yeah I'm liking where this is going okay um yeah so so what if it was something like this okay so because I don't want I don't want it to be something that he's good in every army I understand right like to me he needs to have a function like this guy is a meta response in list building you put him in because because something else needs to be countered okay yeah he needs to not be your always go to you uh well we could go a couple different directions right yeah um like his prayer could be something like if it was just a catastrophe catastrophic prayer like catastrophe realized or something like that it could be something on the order of like every unit within 12 inches roll a die on something up four up three up somewhere in that range they take d3 mortal wounds in addition every terrain piece within that range is affected by the smash to rubble monsters rampage role is normal okay so he just like in an aura bursts bones and crushes buildings right like that would be the way to kind of to kind of do that right so then like area smash to rubble slash cause a bunch of damage so that is one possibility I like that so and maybe maybe you do two prayers on the war scroll like you could right because this is a name guy the other one that I would do like what I'm thinking about corner case things so one is ignoring word saves another interesting one is like power uh irresistible or something okay and you make it so that uh the damage of your of megas within uh holy within 12 inches of this guy can't be reduced in any way say that one more time that the damage of mega is holy within X number of inches of this guy can not be reduced yes now we're getting somewhere power is a bowl yeah I like this right uh okay okay alright uh cool yeah king brood I believe is dead but he's he was just a normal named regular giant he wasn't like a mega abroad whatever have he say his name okay let's let's do two prayers here yeah I don't know if he'd actually have two prayers survive development but let's let's do it so let's call this the catastrophes call and let's call it all units within 12 inches roll a dice 3 plus d3 mortal wounds in addition all terrain within 12 inches smashed to rubble okay cool and then next prayer I have to make this text smaller because we're going off the screen excuse me while we shrink some text here there we go okay prayer uh so we'll call it like yes there we go prayer not the real name simply irresistible shout out to uh to Manny in the chat there but no it would be called like you know voice of myth or something like that right harkening back to the fact that he's a he's a you know one of these like harkening back to just channeling the voice of these ancient god beasts right from the age of myth and uh damage caused by this would need to be worded properly so like word still work and stuff like that but yes word save still work we're just stopping things like the night cruciator or uh coalesce ability or something like that like the damage uh value or whatever of uh attacks by gargants within holy within 15 inches sure why not 15 inches uh cannot be reduced cool so that gets to your anti debuffing yep and then this then becomes a response to um the meta if some things are yeah like so that like you include this guy if there's a need for him in the meta oh I have a fun addition to the other prayer if the unit is on terrain that is uh smashed you know I'm just wondering just destroyed ruined rubble eyes demolished there's the word yes demolished uh they suffer mortal wound on a 2 plus right basically like if they're amidst the falling rocks they get wounded more easily yeah okay cool now this guy is doing some neat stuff right he's he's shutting down some battle shock he wants to prayer we could make these prayers like one on a three one on a four something like that right yeah so they're like the you know so they're they're harder they could both be on threes I don't know like three is a pretty high chance of spell failure as a matter of fact and you can't give him plus one or rerollable so correct um correct because because he's unique can't take like high priest or anything like that so we don't have to worry about that nonsense so these could both just be answer value three uh there you go cool yeah he's interesting he's engaging he has a purpose and he still does like all the base giant stuff I'll write that up here just so we're clear right yeah has like um base mega abilities so like sun timber yep yep yep you know charge all of that at all right yep uh oh interesting this unit should have the war master ability what is war master actually doing let me ask that making you a general if you're not a general okay so that just means so that means that you have 18 inch command abilities which you already have with totem right correct well it also makes it so if you lose your other general you still get a command point at the start of every turn and you can now get additional command points on two up like it's not nothing yeah I could see it big name special characters often have war master sure I mean that is just true so I'm just gonna write war master question mark yeah maybe yeah probably yeah there you go yeah I mean so it's not it's not really adding any to the range but it is keeping it is keeping your command point situation in better regard totally yeah cool there you go we wrote a new guy this would be the special character version of this obviously again no ability to be battle line yes he would of course be unique all that kind of stuff so can't take items or anything like that right yep so yeah cool that seems like a fun giant I don't think he needs a command ability Brian S because he's the priest he's not like he's not the warrior guy who gets a command ability right he's already a totem he already has an 18 inch range for all the he already has an 18 inch range for all of the his abilities so yeah that's fine the hero said we need to give him a pet maybe a gorg ranta sure the kit will come with with some fun thing on that you put on the base that's his little pet it doesn't actually attack it just follows him around although you could give him a pet that could actually be he could have a pet on the base that has an attack profile and that's why um that that could that that might be part of why his attacks worse because like he doesn't do one of the other things he instead swaps one of his other attacks for his pet attack that could be just a fun thing um I'm gonna write pet um way to weaken his attacks lose death grip because he's got his totem in his hand right so he's not he's not like gripping people as much he can still just stomp and swing his totem around yep lose death grip gain weaker pet attacks yeah that could be fun why not have a cool pet that'd be fun let's have a cool pet on there a yak is a great pet I agree I mean I I for one cannot wait to see our LRL yak overlords um but yes uh there we go it feels like a good named priest king and there we go that's the book rewritten to me this feels like a much more engaging book so so chat what I want to know is did we get there okay is this gonna be more fun to play against they can't just stand around and count as a million people anymore we've tackled that problem they gotta be out there they gotta be fighting right we didn't we didn't really like we we got rid of some synergy honestly because you know some of the floating like plus ones and re-rolls that are in the base book okay but we have some constrained play styles that are interesting like you can lean a little bit into range you can lean a little bit into movement right or some movie based tricks again you're not night hawn or daughter's a cane like right treating your whole army out and doing wacky stuff in six inch cheater pylons and whatever right that's not what's happening right but there's some movement play there right we've added priests so you actually have something to do in your hero phase you can pray a little bit but no prayer lore so you're relying on sort of the basics and universals which we've pushed a little more toward some soft incentives to use babies in more way we have opened up an interesting like healing path as well Tom like a healing path because you could play like the death eaters or whatever and then have somebody take the arcane tome and take life swarm or something maybe depending on how the points worked out or you know if you took some of the cheaper giants so you weren't right at 2000 you could fit like a life swarm in or something and then once they did clarify that apparently you are allowed to do that even though you shouldn't be allowed to do that but apparently I can now so that's cool um you know it's this feels like a good first draft to me it obviously needs a full development pass I'm positive there are things that could be better that are wrong but this just feels more engaging to me right like the giants have purpose they play with the monstrous rampages in interesting ways like that the tools that's already there in 3.0 for monsters to do they do all that stuff better like they can capture better as monsters if they're acting like monsters being scary not just standing around being a tower right so that kind of stuff yeah so there you go I hope everybody enjoyed this I hope everybody thought this was lots of fun um I know this is a weird show to just sit here and rewrite a book in a way that will never get rewritten and and now and probably this isn't how the uh will I be disappointed by whatever the book comes out probably but that's alright but I'll go to the TR and ask to use my tome can I use my sons of fam on tome instead it's but it's perfect in our heart that's there you go there you go alright folks there you go that's that's uh that's oh yo Han alright Tom he has a coach is asking about yo Han okay oh I got it oh oh oh I got it um yo Han is a uh a invocation okay because every army has a priest yeah sure I'm with you or could right yes theoretically could build one without like that is to say if you took one mega nine babies that's the only time you wouldn't have a priest but yes why is you get to choose your one mega would be general he'd have to be and the priest can't be your general oh your priest can't be a general okay let's start so yo Han becomes an actual invocation so you base him on like a 50 mil round right okay yeah and it generates uh because he's running like fleeing in fear from the giant it creates a morale debuff around him bubble around it yes okay so you get an invocation called the fear of yo Han right yeah or spreading panic no spreading panic yeah yo Han's spreading panic there we go yes and it runs out and causes a bravery yeah and so it's 50 points to include in your army and it's an invocation that basically moves six inches uh at the end of each of your hero phases and uh all units within 12 inches that do not have the gargant key word have minus two to bravery love it love it it's great done probably needs a little shush but there's there's yo Han I love it that's great and he's not an endless fell because they don't have magic so it has to be an invocation he's an invocation yes yeah yes yo Han runs away great we did it all there it is all right everybody hit like if you thought this was a fun time don't forget the next three weeks tune in and we will be doing all of the GHB battle tones it's gonna be GHB next week scaven the week after that sylvaneth the week after that three big weeks next week show will be at noon eastern set your clocks or times or reminders accordingly early early show I'm telling you now uh so the uh we will be doing it in the middle of the day in Europe friendly times sorry people in Australia I apologize I think that's when you're all asleep um but uh there we go uh don't forget to hit like subscribe do all that fun stuff uh there is a patreon down below focused on hobby review and feedback you can always check that out if you want to take your next step on your hobby journey the merch stores down there don't forget you can cast your vote by picking up team Tyler or team Tom merchandise to say which co-host you think is best uh but as always everyone thank you so much this was a lot of fun it was fun to indulge I like writing books I like writing rules uh so it was a really fun little little project um so thank you everyone for watching I hope you enjoyed it as always