 This is the last session of the day, I think it is, right? So hopefully it didn't get you too tired. I asked to get this mic so I can move around, right? So I'm not in like a Zoom call that I don't have to move, like the calls that I do every day. And I can move around and hopefully get you to participate and learn a few things about what we found out about basically the state of open source, right? We ask, there's a survey that we do every year together with OSI. And we ask about the use of open source in organizations. So the key difference here is not asking you what open source software you use in your own projects on the weekend at home, more about the use of open source software in organizations. That's the focus on the entire survey and every question refers to organization. Of course, there's sometimes people responding just from personal knowledge. But with over 1,000 respondents, I think it was good to get that information. And from that, we learn a lot about what they're doing, some lessons, some trends. And I think you're going to see a few surprises there in the data. Are we set up? If not, that's OK. So I click. Did not like it. Let me stop sharing. And that's right. Sorry, guys, just all right. Well, I didn't even test this. All right. So here's my contact detail. Happy to engage with you via Twitter, LinkedIn. Should I say X? I like to say Twitter. There's my website that I try to keep track of the different talks and webinars and actively, constantly doing either webinars or a podcast or interviews or publishing blog posts or articles. So pretty much everything I do is related to open source software, sometimes a little bit more focused on some technologies than others. But I'm happy to engage on that conversation. So half of my role is as an open source advocate, evangelist. The other half is to run product management for the open logic brand part of Perforce. And that's as much as I want to say about open logic and Perforce. I'm just going to talk about the industry, not a product presentation. So I was trying to think on an analogy. And I like to start when I write or present, sometimes to go with an analogy, to get your attention and to kind of relate. So I was thinking, what would be a good analogy of building all these open source software that we have? This week, we hear about a lot of open source software, some of the most successful projects, but there's so many more. So I said, well, maybe how about the construction of a city and building houses and buildings might relate to open source software. So this is Dubai in basically 20 years. Pretty amazing. Now, if you're thinking on the open source project or library that you're using, it might be looking still old or with a lot of work to do versus the new and shiny stuff. But then I said, well, not everything was like from nothing to buildings. A lot of the open source that we use, it's been around for many years, multiple major versions. So I said, maybe it looks like this. Like London, over 100 years, it was already populated and still already populated, but maybe some more modern buildings, more modern infrastructure. And the London Bridge is still there. So open source will be what? The Linux kernel that's still around, or Apache HTTP still around with a few improvements. So I think that analogy is better than from nothing to a big city. And of course, since we are in Bilbao, I had to show a picture there of how it looked before the Guggenheim Museum and the whole development there. So pretty, pretty nice. So this is a nicer picture. I lost my animation there. The background somewhere there. Now it doesn't look here with the lighting, but it's the Guggenheim Museum behind. That's my background. So I just talked about this analogy, and those are the numbers to prove it, right? Or actually just some of the numbers to prove it. If you go to NPM, if you go to Maven, if you go to Nugget, Nugget actually has grown a lot. I've been keeping a version of this slide for a few years now. I updated this just about a month ago. And there is August 17, and it keeps growing, right? Amazingly, Nugget has been growing really, really. Of those six ruby gems, probably the one that has the slowest pace, but it keeps growing. Now, I know all of you are open source experts, and I've got to tell me, well, if that library doesn't have a license file, it's not an open source, right? Well, that's correct. It's free, but not open source, right? Good reminders to everyone. But the numbers that you see at the bottom, packages per day, it's actually new packages per day. That's pretty amazing. I took this from modulescounts.com. You can go to there, and they keep APIs, so they keep the numbers up to date on the number of packages on those repositories and those registries. So pretty amazing numbers. Now, let's focus now more on the larger projects, the open source that most organizations are using today. And the Linux Foundation has more than 850 projects. The top of within the Linux Foundation, probably the, well, not probably, the Cloud Linux, the CNCF, it's the one that has the most projects. And actually, I should update that. It's about 170 now. I was just having a conversation that told me 172. So it keeps growing, right? The bottom line here is that everything is growing, and I don't even counting the ones from, well, it's part of the more than 800, including OpenSSF and all the other affiliated foundations. So those are the projects that you're probably gonna hear more or probably the projects that you use in your organizations the most, right? The ones that are there. But again, just keep in mind that there are hundreds, not hundreds, thousands, millions of libraries out there with the numbers that I gave you before that. So it just makes sense to kind of go and start asking those questions. And as I said, we collaborate with OSI and distribute this survey every year. In fact, this is gonna be my last presentation about this set of data. I've been doing different versions of this since March, and we're getting ready for the new survey. Late October, November, we're gonna make available the survey. I invite everyone to join and your colleagues to making a better one. Actually, the part that I enjoy the most is to put together the survey, right? Writing a 70-page report out of all of this, it's a lot of work. So I enjoy that not as much as putting together the survey and thinking the stuff that we're missing, the feedback that we get, there's always the question on others or type your information, and we get some really good feedback on that. So let's start with the first question, and I like this question. We ask, over the last year, have you increased the use of open source software in your organization? I'd read it the other way around. So over the last year, in your organization, have you increased the use of open source software? And 80% say yes. The year before was 77%. And the year before, the yes was more than yes significantly. And we actually left the option yes significantly. So whatever your definition of significantly is, that's what it is. So again, I think, do I have to prove more than open source is live? And there's no, you heard on the keynote this morning, Jim saying, you don't have to worry about these things, right? There's always news that people get all, something wrong with open source, it's not. 100% agree with Jim this morning. Absolutely not, this keeps growing. We're always gonna have some news here and there. I'm not worried at all, at all. So very interesting numbers, by the way, the 1.4% there, it's reduction in the use of some of the open source technologies, doesn't mean that they don't use open source, right? So things like, and I'll talk about that later, things that go in of life, the baby big one, no longer using Sentos because it went in of life, so that means that they check the box there for reduced. But I mean, it's minimum, right? It's almost laughable. Just 1% of the survey, more than about 1,000 people say, they're not reducing the use of open source. So some interesting numbers. Why would you use open source software? And I don't have to ask, I don't have to, no one here probably questions that, right? But what I'm finding interesting is, overall in the survey, the number one reason, and this has been the same over the last three, four years, the number one reason is to get access to access the latest technologies, access to innovation and the latest technologies. Funny fact here, number nine, not making it here to the survey, number nine was cost reduction because it's free. Now, this is interesting because in Europe, and I'll show you a chart in just a second, we have different results, all right? I actually have a few more data here for you, just specific to Europe, everything's in the report, but I'm gonna show you some differences there. Number two, development velocity, meaning you don't have to start from scratch, you reuse, of course, that makes sense, and the long term support offered, right? In case you have forgotten this, one of the, if not the top reason for open source to be so successful in adoption is because the communities, the projects, have committed to provide long term support, committed to provide updates, right? For some of their versions of their software. Linux is the prime example, right? The fact that you had long term supports of 10 years, that provides kind of confidence to the organization to go and adopt open source. Now, there's another issue here, the fact that everything is moving so fast and everyone is, yeah, most people are automating continuous integration, continuous delivery, tooling, so they're releasing more often, which means it's harder to support all their versions, right? So across the board and all, I would say most open source projects, now that long term support is getting shorter and shorter and shorter. So something very important to keep an eye, and that's a major lesson here to keep an eye on that, right? Check the software that you're using, check if you're in a really, really old version. And when I say really, really old version, it could be just a 12 month old version, right? That's what happens. So here's the number for Europe and number one was cost reduction, all right? That's still the case. We took UK out of this survey, okay? Well, there's a different category because of Brexit, that doesn't count the UK. And you see number two and number three, they're different as well, right? The vendor lock-in, important, right? For Europe and again, development velocity, right? Don't start from scratch. So another interesting question here, and by the way, every slide here, I can talk for half an hour about it on every slide, so happy to continue the conversation. But so we ask, not what do you use because we know that everyone uses everything, all different types of technologies. What's more, where are you investing the most? Like in terms of resources, human resources, monetary budgets, time, effort, and the ones at the top, no surprising, right? Tooling, software development lifecycle tooling, all everything around containers, everything around cloud native and Kubernetes environments, and data technologies. When I say data technologies, I'm referring to databases and more, right? Streaming related to big data, or everything that relates to data. Those are the top three in terms of the ones that receive the most investment, but you see the others, right? Now to contrast to that, which are not in the top 10 of investment, and I was a bit surprised here, observability. All right? There's a lot of talks about observability here. Yes, it's popular, perhaps no one is spending any money choosing the open source version, and everyone does their little quick charts and that's enough, all right? Middleware, I think middleware has to do more with naming, or maybe organizations using less Java stacks, so they don't use Apache Tomcat or ActiveMQ, maybe they're using more streaming technologies, Lafkavka. Blockchain, I think it's still small, right? I think there's no surprise there, and then the other surprise in security tools. I started, I tried to ask more, I tried to ask some people that responded to the survey to get more information, and I have the indication that yes, security is important, and they are going for commercial software as opposed to open source tooling. So for next year's survey, I have a multiple option there with all the, or most of the, or many of the open source security tools out there, and see what happens, right? See which one is the most used, if it's the, I'm not gonna buy your answers there, I'm not gonna mention names for now. The next one is, we asked about the support challenges, and I think this is one of the most important ones. You heard, if you were here on the previous talk, obviously challenges with OSPOS, and with what projects to invest, and not, number one challenge in terms of support for open source software is, well actually, let me take it back. I just talked about security tools, right, and not necessarily investing. On every survey, test it yourself. On every survey, if an option is security, everyone is gonna say yes, that's number one, right? It's just human nature. Once you ask them, what are you doing about security? That's what they, but if you ask, is security important, everyone is gonna say yes, right? So we said, well, let's qualify the option here a little bit more, and we said, maintaining security policies and compliance, right? So that's a little bit more than just security is important. Still was number one. And then we asked how many of you are doing security scans, right? To identify vulnerabilities, and it's 49%. Well, that's pretty good. Hopefully next year we'll see more than 49%. Lack of skills, experience, and proficiency, more important, proficiency, that's obviously a challenge, right? So many new technologies. The large companies, they don't have the, they have people, they have the personnel, but they don't have the expertise, right? So we had another option there for not having enough personnel, and that's not the issue. It's more of the expertise. And you're here at the part of the Linux Foundation all the efforts around training and certifications and all that. I'm gonna tell you what I say every time. It's a great time to be an open source, great time to be an engineer. If you know these skills, there are plenty of opportunities out there, right? And plenty of opportunities for business as well when you have the skills, when you have the experience. And then number three, keeping up with updates, right? And then it's going back to security. If you don't keep up with the latest updates, then you might have some issues. Not only security, it could be also functionality, box or new functionality. I mentioned there, do you see the logos there? You'd recognize some of those are related to external compliance. That's now another driver for organizations. So there's the whole, well, not the whole list, but the top support challenges. You already mentioned the security policies number one and the fact that, ah, my bad. I said 49, it's 46 doing security scans. Hopefully it will pass the 50%. I think there's more awareness. I mean, you're here, I've been in a few of the sessions and people talk about security, so that's a good thing, right? There's more awareness, there's gonna be, they're gonna be doing more about it. So those support challenges, when you compare that with Europe, so just data from Europe, you see some differences there, right? Number one is different, right? It's keeping up with updates and batches. Number two, lack of skills, experience and proficiency. So the same, and then you see some differences there. Well, maybe for Q and A, I would love to hear your reaction on that, but you see the, obviously there's difference globally versus just Europe. We ask about what's the most business critical open source software in your organization? And we didn't provide any options, so people have to type exactly what. And I was a bit surprised that, I mean, I just copy-pasted the part of the Linux foundation landscape. There are more seats over here if you wanna sit on this side. But the important ones, or the eight boxes, that's those were the top eight. I was a bit surprised with PHP and WordPress, WordPress is based on PHP. So that means websites are very important for organizations. PHP-based websites are very, very, and WordPress-based websites are very, very important for organizations. So if something happens, a big zero-day vulnerability on those technologies, yeah, that's a problem, right? And I know they open SSF, it's taking actions, they're multiple initiatives to look at the most use open source software and keep an eye on that and address vulnerabilities but it was an interesting number there. Jenkins, I was a bit surprised, because I'll show you another chart. Jenkins is not the top CI CD tool anymore, right? It's been a few years, but looks like people are using it and find it very, very important to develop on lifecycle. Contributions, obviously everyone here is a contributor, right? I'm not talking about code, I'm talking about contributions, right, you're here, actually you're paying money to be here, right? That helps the communities, that helps with contributions. I think 37% is not bad, it was a 5% increase over a year, hopefully next one, it's gonna be more than 40%. And again, it's not necessarily code, right? It's not necessarily having all those contributions on your GitHub. Obviously a lot of talk about software bill of materials. Have you heard enough about software bill of materials, S-bombs? There's even a company that says, has some smart marketing there about the use of word for S-bombs. Some of you know what I'm talking about? Like if you don't want to have an F-bomb, use an S-bomb or generate an S-bomb. Anyway, the point here is, organizations are more aware, there are more tools, there are plenty of open source tools, I have a blog post where I list short evaluation of many open source tools or completely free open source tools for you to run S-bombs or generate S-bombs, identify vulnerabilities, things like that. 25% in more regulated industries, there's more S-bomb generation, makes sense, right? In the US government, there's been enough initiatives now to force or mandate the different government agencies to generate S-bombs. There's not enough enforcement just yet, but at least government agencies know that they have to do it. And I think there are initiatives here in the European Union and others, so hopefully we'll see those numbers increase. And if you're in the financial services industries and banking makes sense, security is very important, right? So very run your S-bombs. Another important thing here, and some of the sessions here have talked about this, but maybe in a different format. I think all of you will agree that there are different steps in terms of the maturity in the use of open source in your organization. Okay, starting with just a consumer, right? You just use open source to be active, to contribute, to set up a strategy, generate, put in together a NOSPO or having inner source projects. So we listed some of the, what we consider some of the steps and it's what you see there on the chart. And then people kind of voted for or selected what they're doing. And you see in the sending order, excuse me, the one that was at perform security scans, that was the number one. And as I said, 46%. And then that was the number one in Europe as well and you can see the differences there. Interesting one, this one, not that much per region, but per company size. So the very large enterprises obviously have different responses, right? Because they are bigger enterprises, for example, having their security compliance as important, that's established, that's part of their policies. And then having a legal team that is familiar with open source licenses is also important. So good to see that. And then for smaller organizations or small organizations, it's different. Good to see that number two there, it's contributing to open source projects and organizations. So just really quick, checking here on time, I have a thing about 15 minutes. I'm gonna go now category by category and some of you might find some very interesting points here. So let's start with the Linux distributions. Probably no surprise there with Ubuntu, the most used globally. And then you can see the other ones, right? Obviously not listed all the Linux distributions. This one, we included some commercial versions of open source, so not technically open source, but that's what people are using. They were not in the top, for sure. Oracle Linux, considering the open source version or Oracle Linux with some of you know, happens to be derivative of RHEL, right? And that's been on the news significantly. I've been writing, I've been doing blog posts working closely with, or at least collaborating with Rocky Linux Foundation, Rocky Linux with the Alma School Alma OS Foundation. They're doing things in different ways. The different changes, you heard the news on, well first it's the end of life for Sentos, then the news about Red Hat restricting access to the source code of RHEL. That created a lot of news, a lot of criticism, but for me, the bottom line is that makes it harder for the likes of Oracle Linux, Rocky Linux, Alma Linux to get the code, right? And they have announced different ways that they're gonna do it. Some of them, they're gonna take, they're gonna copy it, they're gonna take it from maybe developer license or from a cloud image. Some of them are gonna, Alma Linux is gonna work more with the Sentos Stream. The bottom line for me, just a quick summary for you. We have to keep an eye, we have to wait and keep an eye on version nine three. So the next version nine three, so we're nine two of RHEL, Rocky Linux, Alma Linux, Oracle Linux. Nine three is the one that we have to check. How different is from RHEL, how different those, if it's true that it's gonna continue, they're gonna continue to be both for both compatible or just focusing on trying to have the applications compatible. And just to clarify for everyone, the bottom line here is if you have an application, any application running on Sentos or running on RHEL, the idea is that you take exactly that and then put it on top of Rocky Linux and Alma Linux and everything's gonna work just the same way. That's a big challenge, right? And that's a big test. That's what they mean with both for both compatible or application compatible. So things are gonna change on this Sentos Stream, it's up there, right? People are using Sentos Stream, maybe not for production environments, but they're using it. Web infrastructure technology and kind of a list of infrastructure and this is debatable, right? What's infrastructure? What's not infrastructure? Those are the top kind of opens or software you're familiar with most of them. Still obviously a lot of Java stacks, right? So that means they're Tomcat, Tommy, ActiveMQ. But as I was saying, like middleware is kind of less, less people using middleware. I know Red Hat doesn't use the word middleware anymore. They call it run times and all the things, right? So maybe a terminology thing, maybe more of a legacy technologies here, but very much live and active, right? You have Apache HTTP or NGINX, all right? I have friends with NGINX, so we've done a lot of collaboration, great team. So cloud native technologies, you see the ones on the top, the most used. I mean, obviously Docker, Podman was somewhere there. I was a bit surprised to see Kubernetes and OKD, basically with the same number. And Rancher is somewhere there as well. Those are the top cloud native technologies and you can see some of the others that were mentioned there. You can read that, right? Container D, Quarkus, OpenStack. OpenStack is the only one of this list that actually had decreased in usage over the last two, three years. But in some industries, like Telcos is still very much in use, OpenStack. And I know for a fact, I know people that have moved over the years from being OpenStack contributors to now being Kubernetes contributors. Can't make sense. So that's the situation quickly, so the situation with cloud native. Programming languages probably no surprise there. JavaScript, Python, Node.js. Oracle is split under different runtime, so OpenJDK, Oracle Java, OpenJ9, so that's kind of split, so otherwise Java will be probably top or top two. Yeah, and obviously there are a lot more programming languages. People don't talk about programming language that very much, right? Did you just go with one and just start coding on one? I have some good stories where organizations move from basically one day to another, to another language. And they said, look, we're working on Kubernetes, we have to code them, we have to use Go. Oh, but we don't have anyone with experience with Learn, right? And, you know, that's a good challenge. If you're an engineer, you want to learn stuff, right? So why not start doing it in Go? Now, that's just one example. Yeah, obviously a lot of use of Python everything related to AI, machine learning, to learning. Top CI CD tools, we, here specifically, we did not include, everything is open source, right? So we didn't include some of the commercial options because otherwise I think GitHub Labs, GitHub Actions is number one. That was last year, we took it out and we got Travis CI, but we know that Travis CI has decreased in usage. Many of the open source communities have moved away because they've been changing a few things and the rules and the credits and so on. But the highlight for me is that you see more of the cloud native tooling out there and growing like Jenkins X, now more popular than Jenkins. Jenkins X is the one that is Kubernetes native and the same goes for Tecton and Spinnaker. Not using any, sorry, just come back quickly, not using any, it's at 7%, that's pretty healthy I think, right? That means, like if you're not doing CI CD, it's probably because you just have one app or maybe just one developer doing everything. Automation configuration, part of DevOps. You see the different players. You'll be also, I was surprised to see up there the Kubernetes natives, the Kubernetes native tooling, right? That's the direction of what organizations are doing. Definitely that's what organizations are moving in that direction. You wanna guess data technologies? Come on. Most used open source database, data technology? My SQL, Postgres. That's what you're using, right? Yes. Actually, the top three have switched around over the last three years. Postgres was actually number three, I went to number two when I was number one. But if you see the percentages, they're similar, right? So actually, I would say the percentages are not important here. What counts here is that everyone is using everything. Right? That's a good thing, that's a good thing. If they are robust, reliable technologies with active communities, why not, right? Probably, I was a bit surprised with Kafka, where's Kafka? Kafka, up there, Kafka, I hear a lot, at least with our customers, they're using Kafka. They need, maybe it's the lack of expertise because they're calling us with asking for help. And there's a whole ecosystem around Kafka, just like there's an ecosystem around Hadoop and around my SQL and all the others, right? So, important, important there. The number one challenge, the number one support challenge, as I said, is personal experience and proficiency. And then just to finalize here, the talk, obviously very, very important to contribute, to be part of this, not just as a consumer. You see the points, you read the points about the maturity and the use of open source in your organization. I think one of the benefits of being on an event like this is you learn a few things and then you go back and try to implement or, you know, go and tell your colleagues and this is important, right? The Linux Foundation, in the largest organization with all these other affiliated foundations gets the most support, but there are others and this number has increased, by the way, which is good, every year. And I invite everyone to also participate. Doesn't have to be money, could be part of your time. Engineers learn, or anyone learns, but one thing that I like to tell organizations is if your engineers get involved on open source projects, they learn. If they become contributors, they become experts on that technology, right? So that's the best way to make sure that you are covered, that you have the necessarily support, getting involved and that's how you learn. Or getting your engineers or your team involved, that's what you learn. I think that's, I don't think people are gonna disagree with that, the more time you invest with it, the more you're gonna learn, the more of an expert you become. And sometimes, by the way, that's for all of you, sometimes we don't realize how much we know about this stuff, right? Because we just talk about it and then when you talk with someone that is not familiar with this, they don't understand a word. Just talking about all these tools and containers and pots and clusters and all these things. And it's because we learn so much, just being part of these communities. So just before I go to Q&A, this is the report that I'm gonna provide the QR code you can download it for free. As I said, in the next month, we're gonna launch the new survey. We work with OSI, by the way OSI is downstairs there, my friend Steph is there. We work very closely with OSI. If you are interested on participating, we're happy to kind of bring more organizations, preferably vendor-natural organizations to be part of this survey, right? So let us know, let me know. Trying to reach out, here's my same QR code and my contact details. So we have time. If you have any questions, let me know. Sure, there's one for Valer. Why is thingy, what was the question? It was a multiple choice and it's considered separate product, separate projects, right? It's the cloud version, the cloud native version. It's not as early as before, but it's another project. Yeah? Okay. Because then Mike, just a second. Yeah, thank you for the talk from my side as well. So Javier, we talked already yesterday about the operating system. Now my continuation question. So what do you think from the big hardware guys like Dell, HP, NVIDIA, et cetera, so what will be the next operating system with the output that we are testing with? Usually it used to be at hell. It used to be Ubuntu, send us. What's gonna be the list after one year or something? Yeah, so interesting point there. I'm all enough to remember the Unix days, some of you, are all enough as well, right? That they were all flavors of Unix. HP UX, IBM, AIX, some Solaris. I remember that. I haven't thought about this in a long time. So there were some multiple flavors of Unix and then Linux came, right? And now, where are we? Multiple flavors of Linux. I mean, it's been around for many years. Actually, what was it, Linux kernel? Just, it's 30 years, 31 years since 1991. No one thought about this. I wrote about this. No one thought that 2023 was gonna be the year of talking about Linux distributions, right? The war, the Linux wars. And I put together a blog post basically comparing this in a kind of a humoristic way to Game of Thrones, right? That's the Game of Thrones for Linux. Who's gonna be the leader on Linux distributions? The bottom line is what you said. The bottom line is whatever hardware or even the large enterprise software certifies, that's what is gonna get the most traction, right? So if a lot of the hardware or vendors or, let's say SAP, keep a one big software example are certifying on Rocky Linux or Alma Linux, people are gonna use that. I had this conversation, I think I mentioned to you yesterday, had a conversation with a customer that said, we decided to go with Alma Linux but then our software has been certified on Rocky Linux or we're gonna go with Rocky Linux. And I'm sure it's gonna happen the other way around. People are going there. Both, in these two examples, what distributions have grown enough in terms of users in terms of sponsors to their respective foundations? By the way, OpenLogic by Perforce sponsors both Rocky, as I said, Rocky and Alma. In some cases, they're a startup, right? The company behind Rocky Linux is a startup with funding, I think $9 million in funding. So they're gonna be around at least for the next year, a couple of years. So that's another question that I get, right? Should we go up at all these changes and all these news about Red Hat? I think going back to what I said earlier, the key here is to make sure that you guys keep an eye on the next version, 9.3. And see how much distributions are gonna change. If that's something that is important, right? The other way is just to go to a completely different distribution like Ubuntu or OpenSUSE. When you change to a completely different distribution, that means different packages, right? I think Ubuntu has something like 6,000, 10,000 packages in the Ubuntu distribution. Ubuntu has focused a lot on AI, so they provide a lot of the AI machine learning libraries, a lot of the Python libraries. So again, if the application is using some of the low-level functions, some of the packages from the operating system, and then you change Linux, that's gonna affect your app. And then the test has to be at all layers, right? So those are the challenges, and many companies are already focusing on that, right? Remember, CentOS is the end of life. CentOS version six and eight are already end of life. CentOS seven is gonna be end of life on June 30th, 2024, so in less than a year. And it's not that easy to migrate, or not that easy to move your apps to another environment, right? The Linux installation, the recommendation, our architect says, don't try to upgrade it, have a fresh installation, and then move everything. But once you move, you have to test. So anyway, that lot of challenges there. Any other questions? Yeah, Cyber Residency Act? Yes, yes, everyone in the open source space has mentioned that, that they're concerned, right? If you're not familiar, it's good that there are some regulations in the European Union around security, and forcing organizations, for example, to generate S-bombs, and to apply patches, and to fix vulnerabilities, and to disclose when they have a breach. That's very important, by the way, right? That's how we learn. If we know what happened, then someone else can go and learn, or probably experience it again. So the disclosure is very, very important. So at a high level, that's what the Cyber Residency Act, the concern, I'm gonna do it at a very high level, right? The number one concern for the open source industry is liability. So there's some language there that we don't like, and you can ask the guys from OSI, you can ask the guys from Open Chain. I mean, everyone in this, all the Linux foundations, all the Linux Foundation foundations have expressed their concerns. Liability is the number one issue here. So if the European Union wants to make the software vendors liable because of a security breach, I think that's one thing, there is a business. If the individual developer open source contributor becomes liable because his or her library got hacked or exploited, that affects completely the way we do open source, right? So that's number one issue. I know the team from Open, what's the name? Open Chain? No, it's not Open Chain. One of the organizations is leading the draft of the new language that are proposing back to the European Union. Gets to a point right now that they bought it and now they're delivering the details. So they bought it, yes, there's gonna be a Cyber Resilience Act. Now they're working on the details and we as an industry, we are providing our feedback and saying, I'll change the language here. I mean, we know it's important. There was one detail in the, I went into one of the meetings and there was one detail where they say, if we make an exception, you probably hear in the news, people talk about exceptions for open source. That's not the right word. But if we're talking about exceptions, imagine that could be an exception for AWS or for Google, you know? And that's not what the European Union wants to do, right? Like they want the vendors to be liable. So a lot of details there. I am one of those that I'm bringing everything on the news and I tried to, you know, also write on my blog post my interpretation, but I just give you a quick summary. Yeah, other questions? No, well, thank you. Appreciate it.